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Project Natal Pricing and Release Date Revealed
tekgoblin writes "According to Edge-online.com, their source says that we can expect Microsoft's Project Natal to cost around $149. 'The figure for the standalone unit is significantly higher than a previous sub-£50 estimate, but less than pricing recently suggested by European retailers. It’s also more expensive than Sony’s Natal rival, Move, which will be available later this year with a game for less than $100.'"
not (as it might have been, for all I knew) a new compiler, for example.
Slashdot summaries have this annoying habbit of assuming that because the author is thoroughly familiar with the technology, everyone else is too and you can just reel of project names with no further explaination.
Quattuor res in hoc mundo sanctae sunt: libri, liberi, libertas et liberalitas.
50 British pounds = 72.41500 U.S. dollars (I got mine from Google, instead.)
So, you're saying that $149 isn't significantly higher than $72? Or you're saying that you thought the GBP was a lot higher in value?
I'll admit, I think it was 1.81:1 last time I checked... But that's still nowhere close to the 3:1 it would take to get 50GBP close to 150USD.
"If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you." - DM
This pretty much sums it up:
http://www.xbox.com/en-us/live/projectnatal/
Basically body mapping with face recognition. Quite sweet, but the devil is going to be in the software written for it and unlike the Wii, it isn't part of the 'base' system, so software that is written for Natal will have a smaller user base and will probably cost more.
xbox - $199
xbox-live - $50
game - $60
game-pack - $15
controller - $50
(pre)natal - $150
This is why I only play chess. Chess is always the latest version, and you can't get fucked pricing. There use to be a time where almost every game was amazing( Think Dreamcast. Powerstone 2 anyone? ) and it wouldn't hurt your wallet too much if the damn thing were to stop working.
The Xbox 360 Arcade is $199 with two games.
This is the same source that (accurately) tipped them off about Gears of War 3. Edge has a history of only running very robust leaks. They broke news of a clamshell, rechargable, light-up GBA several months before the GBA SP was revealed.
No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
The leak is regarding the US launch price.
No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
A camera? In your house? Connected to a computer not controlled by the owner? That can do individual facial recognition? No fucking way.
This is going to be a massive hit with the "privacy, that's for squares who don't use facebook" crowd, though.
Car analogies break down.
From the article regarding the European retailers' rumoured price tag:
At least three Swedish retailers – including Game - have attached a 1,499 Swedish Kronor ($197 / £133) price tag to the standalone version of the Xbox 360 product, reports Kotaku.
With the current follow up from TFA:
The figure for the standalone unit is significantly higher than a previous sub-£50 estimate, but less than pricing recently suggested by European retailers.
So, I'm gonna throw it out there and suggest that none of these people are close to journalists. If they were, they would know that these products are often a lot more price-y in Europe than in the United States. Add to that, Scandinavia has the highest cost of living in the world on average. So that would make sense for the Natal to cost $197 in Sweden.
So how in the hell did anyone think that the price tag of this product in Sweden would have anything to do with its price tag in say... the United States? If this is the journalism rising in the place of newspapers, then I want print back!
Clicked pie.
Microsoft's law pricing is back in play. This law describes how Microsoft prices their XBox accessories. In short, take an accessory and come up with your own reasonable price. For instance, I'd pay twenty five dollars for a new controller. Now double it and you have Microsoft's price. Hence, the controller is fifty bucks. This camera thing would be reasonable if it were the cost of a new game or even slightly above in price. Instead, you get a piece of hardware that is way over priced and lacks any killer apps for it. I can't wait to read the inevitable post mortem on this disaster. I'm guessing the failure will be blamed on piracy.
I'll wait for the second or third iteration. Never buy a Microsoft product at version 1, nobody here could probably forgotten that, right?
Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
The previously-leaked pricing has nothing to do with the estimate they're reporting. They're mentioning it because it's background for the article. Journalists often report the background on a story when writing an article to provide context for the particular news item they are reporting. While this may be a mind-blowing novelty for you, it's actually a component of the journalistic style which has been around for quite some time.
Edge is a print magazine which has been running since the early 1990s.
No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
I can't wait to see what launch titles they have with this. I hope it brings over some wii exclusives. I'm super pumped for this, and can't wait to see it stomp Sony into the ground.
If it costs $149 in the U.S., it's going to cost £140-£160 in the U.K.
-- 'The' Lord and Master Bitman On High, Master Of All
What are you on about?
None of the high end games to be released for it have been announced yet, they're waiting for E3 for that so how can you know there'll be no killer apps for it at release?
Also, as this isn't a simple camera, and is in fact an IR camera with depth sensing technology in it, that builds in hardware a 3D map of the environment, and can track actors in that environment, then what exactly is overpriced about it? It seems quite reasonable regardless for the level of technology in it.
You really expect that kind of technology for just the price of a new game?
Microsoft took the worst "motion controller" concept and priced it outrageously. This thing is going to bomb. I don't know a single gamer who's excited about it. How can you play shooters without triggers?
Hmmm.. did i waste a perfectly good rant?
oh well, felt good to get some of that bile out..
Sounds about right.
Wanna buy a shirt?
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None of the high end games to be released for it have been announced yet, they're waiting for E3 for that so how can you know there'll be no killer apps for it at release?
The leak says the focus is "casual gamers", which in itself shows they don't understand the market they're targeting. So far, only Nintendo managed to make killer apps for the audience targeted by Natal, and every single time the entire industry laughed at Nintendo for these "poor games" before these games just exploded in sales. So an educated guess would be that MS has no killer app for this thing. We can't be sure of it, but it's likely.
The last foray of MS into this trying to sell games to "casual gamers" was in holidays 2008 IIRC, and it was such a huge failure everybody in the game industry just do as if it never happened.
Also, as this isn't a simple camera, and is in fact an IR camera with depth sensing technology in it, that builds in hardware a 3D map of the environment, and can track actors in that environment, then what exactly is overpriced about it? It seems quite reasonable regardless for the level of technology in it.
You really expect that kind of technology for just the price of a new game?
The big problem is right there. It's overpriced means the price is too high compared to its value. In the entertainment industry, people don't care that the technology is higher grade, as what people give value to, is not technology (as in technology industry), but entertainment, the industry consoles are in. The consumer for entertainment doesn't care about technology, as long as it's good enough.
For this not to be seen as overpriced, the thing need to come with at least 2 perceived killer app games. Technologists and early adopters will flock to it, but the mainstream sales they seem to want for Natal won't come from these people.
A killer app like Wii Fit isn't even at 50 % of Wii sold, and it's already selling at amazing levels. That's the apps Natal needs to succeed, not just say "it has this and that and can do that".
Is that the $149 will be good for all users of natal's functionalty WHile multiple players for the wii or the ps3 move may require multiple hardware purchases. Once you start pricing out 2-4 players playing simultaneously, then the prices aren't that different.
"The last foray of MS into this trying to sell games to "casual gamers" was in holidays 2008 IIRC, and it was such a huge failure everybody in the game industry just do as if it never happened."
What exactly are you referring too here? About the only real serious foray into casual gaming Microsoft has made so far with the XBox was with the 1 vs 100 release which was a resounding success with millions of unique players having played and over 100,000 people in a single game. There have been a few casual games released, but they were never done as part of any full blown casual gaming strategy. The major interface change the console saw might be seen as a step towards the casual market I suppose, but again it only ever seemed intended to lay the groundwork for future attempts at pulling in casuals (i.e. 1 vs 100).
"A killer app like Wii Fit isn't even at 50 % of Wii sold, and it's already selling at amazing levels. That's the apps Natal needs to succeed, not just say "it has this and that and can do that"."
Yet your entire argument is based on mere speculation that Microsoft doesn't have any such killer app.
The fact is, anything regarding what will/wont be a success with regards to Natal is mere speculation right now and nothing more. Again, E3 in a few weeks will be the real test for MS to show whether they actually do have something people will want or not. It's only after that point any serious discussion can be had about how worthwhile and succesful Natal may or may not be. Of course, even then the real test wont come until the post release sales figures start rolling in.
A rant about Microsoft is never a wasted rant.
No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
Why is the parent post flamebait? It's a very well known phenomenon that when US products go on sale in the UK, the exchange rate may as well be 1:1.
unlike the Wii, it isn't part of the 'base' system, so software that is written for Natal will have a smaller user base and will probably cost more.
Microsoft will make Xbox 360 + Natal bundles available, so yes, there will be a base system that includes Natal. But unlike from GameCube to Wii, Microsoft will make available a comparatively cheap upgrade path from Xbox 360 to Xbox 360 + Natal.
Chess is always the latest version
Not necessarily. Have you upgraded to Chessbox 960 yet? It even has expansions for it.
Instead of concentrating on the next generation of consoles, MS and Sony are foolishly breaking the traditional 5-year console lifespan rule (sacrosanct since the Atari days) and have instead decided to go chase after the Wii motion controllers fad. Now, even as the Wii fad fades, they're stuck with controllers that no one is particularly excited by (everyone who wanted them already bought a Wii, and most have long since become bored with them). Meanwhile, they've got no next generation consoles in the pipeline, even as consoles show their age more and more every day and hit the very real limits of their 5-year-old technology. Tthe 360 is already having to release games like Mass Effect 2 on multiple discs because they can't support blu-ray discs. And neither console is likely to be able to fully support the rapidly approaching 3-D fad, or MMORPG's, or full 1080p content (most games have to be covertly downsized to 720 to make up for limitations in the 360's and PS3's old CPU/GPU). This may prove a blessing for PC gaming, but is a mess for the console makers.
They should have respected the 5-year rule. It stood even through previous recessions and the console collapse of the early 80's.
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
At that kind of striking distance, I can see the possibility of a Wii price drop to $150 for epic marketing potential. Why pay $150 for just the motion controller when you can get a whole motion-controlled console for the same price?
I'm not saying Nintendo will necessarily drop the price in response to Natal, or even if it should. But the price will come down eventually -console prices always do- and when that happens, expect marketing like this.
The more serious gamers who play 360 and PS3 dont give much of a damn about motion sensing gimmicks. Hell, I was unmoved when they added DualShock to the PS3 pads, just a waste of battey.
The more casual gamers who would get the "Wow!" factor probably already own a Wii by now.
The problem Natal has (and Sony's Move) is that the vast majority of 360 and PS3 owners will not have it. It didn't come with the system originally and many aren't going to be willing to pay $100 or $150 to add it. As a result the market, already smaller then the Wii, is going to be infinitesimal. Sure, 3rd parties often produce crap for the Wii, but if you think it's bad there, just wait for the 3rd party games for Natal and Move. Only the most foolhardy of game developers will put any substantial amount of money toward Natal or Move games. These add-ons shouldn't have been add-ons, rather they should start shipping all 360's and PS3s with the respective technology. You shouldn't be able to buy one without Natal/Move. Then at least all new buyers would have it. As it is, they might as well give up now.
--- What?
Not shipping with the system from the start = fail
Just like the Wii Fit and the MotionPlus.
So the Natal itself is $150, not counting the system. The Wii, on the other hand, is a full system that costs $200 new. Is this seriously how they plan to start pulling away part of the Wii userbase?
Libertarians somehow believe that private businesses should be stronger than governments but weaker than individuals.
I find it amusing how those who like to bash the Wii tend to automatically take the position of being a more "serious" or "hardcore" gamer, and dismiss the Wii as just casual gaming.
Sure, the Wii has a lot of appeal to casual gamers (and that's not a bad thing), but it has a lot of appeal to old school gamers, gaming aficionado, and gamers that recognize that you can have great games without headshots and teabagging your opponent in 1080p resolution.
I also acknowledge that there is a lot of shovelware, but every generation the best selling console is the one that gets the most shovelware. It's certainly not unique or new to this system.
There are a quite a few really great titles on the Wii (with and without wag), and if you think that there are no good third party titles then you aren't paying attention.
I have my criticisms of the Wii as well (and all the systems), but people who come off as being too "serious" of a gamer for the Wii make me roll my eyes.
For the record, I own a Wii, a 360, and a fairly beefy gaming PC. Good games are good games, regardless of what system they are on, how old or new they are, how much wag they have or don't have, or what resolution they are at.
True "serious" and "hardcore" gamers know that.
Things aren't a lot more pricey in Europe. It's because prices in the US don't include sales tax, while prices in Europe have to (well, there's an untaxed price for tax-exempt entities, but I digress).
That would translate to a roughly 33% total tax load in Sweden (import taxes plus VAT and others added together could easily amount to 30-odd percent).
Maybe people should start realizing this and that Europe isn't necessarily more expensive because it's fun to ripoff EU countries, but that you're comparing prices with tax vs. prices without tax.
Cheaper to buy natal than the wii for xbox 360 owners who don't want to change their library up. Not only that, but how many "gamers" don't already have the wii if not all 3 platforms? sort of a moot argument to make. Gamers will buy it if it is anything like the hype.
Either way, it's still not too bad a price.
When you consider the move will be around the $100 mark with a game, maybe $50 solo, you need at least 2 for a lot of the games that seem to have been used as demos - and that's just single player.
If you want to play their flagship MMA title with a friend that's at least $200 worth of controllers, and the camera.
OK it is quite clear now that this will fail hard at that price point. I think they are just trying to get the pieces in place for the next gen where it will be integrated and are pushing this out the door to take the attention off the fact that we are overdue for some next gen hardware talk.
Good-bye
It didn't come with the system originally and many aren't going to be willing to pay $100 or $150 to add it...You shouldn't be able to buy one without Natal/Move. Then at least all new buyers would have it. As it is, they might as well give up now.
As if to say, "no one is going to buy another hard drive with more space" When it originally came out, without/only a 20GB drive, did it really stop anybody from getting a 60GB, 120GB or even 250GB now? I don't understand your sales/marketing logic...
I really don't believe this at all, despite what you all say, as I read in comments from the actual article...it just seems fishy and speculation also seems to confirm that this report might just be a red herring. I had speculated myself that it was probably gonna be around $120, but pleasantly surprised to hear a figure of around $80. Another thing it seems pretty funny to me that no one comprehends when they read "bundled with the Xbox 360 Arcade console for $299." My philosophy is, unless I know first-hand of something's failing points I keep mum, but there is certainly no mistaking a critic's ignorance...Final point, all the preparation and professional research in the world is nothing compared unleashing something into the hands of a few thousand evolved chimps! Time for this damned, dirty ape's lunch...
I see this a lot, but am always amazed.
Why do some people seem to think that "gamers" (whoever they really are) MUST already have all three platforms?
Why?
I've only got one of the three (won't mention which one in this post since its irrelevant for this comment).
I've got access to a larger library of games than I can play regularly and enjoy ALREADY. Yeah, I miss out on some "exclusives" from the other consoles. Oh well, I miss out on some exclusives for the console I own also.
Its the same reason I got rid of cable. Between the Over-The-Air Television, Free (and legal) Internet Options, and the occasional Series on DVD/Blu-Ray, I save 100$ a month and still have more TV than I have time to watch (if I want).
Some Gamers only have 1 console. Wether they made "the right" or "the wrong" choice, its what they've got.
If there is a way to breath new life into it with other options (like Natal and Move), then that is a good thing. In fact they'll likely like that option more because they'll view it as a "value add" for their existing console.
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Shit... I've modded up, ill have to undo my mods on this.
Hello, I am a WiiFit and Wii Motion-Plus buyer (2 motion plus in fact). For me, these two are indeed a fail.
They are only a gimmick and are not entertaining... sure, I do Wii Fit Plus once in a while but meh, it is not entertaining... also Wii Sports Plus (or whatever it is called... currenty gathering dust in my drawer) is also very gimmicky.
IF there are good games (third party usually, or first/second party with good quality) using Natal or Move technologies, it can be the "Nintendo Killer".
But of course, it all depends on THE FUCKING GAMES!!. I am curious how, now that Sony and Microsoft *finally* arrived to the next generation console gaming, how is it going to develop :)
Ubuntu is an African word meaning 'I can't configure Debian'
That's how things used to be. But look around now, the Wii fit didn't come with the Wii, yet many people got it and there are many games. Rock Band and Guitar Hero have no problem moving peripherals. All it needs is a killer app that sparks the imagination of gamers and it will take off. Can they pull it off? Who knows? 10 years ago you would have been saying Rock Band would fail.
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The machine was rather difficult to operate. For years, radios had been operated by means of pressing buttons and turning dials; then, as the technology became more sophisticated, the controls were made touch sensitive ... now all you had to do was wave your hand in the general direction of the components and hope. It saved a lot of muscular expenditure of course, but meant you had to stay infuriatingly still if you wanted to keep listening to the same programme.
D. Adams, The hitch-hikers guide to the galaxy. Ch. 12.
Is this what project natal will give us?
BTW, a envisionment of natal in 1993, with datagloves: Charade, remote control of objects using free hand gestures published in Communications of the ACM.
If this is true, that would mean that Natal's price will contain just as much bloat as Microsoft's operating systems.
Right, but Wii Fit and MotionPlus were made for the #1 game system, only after it was far in the lead. You could have a percentage of Wii owners and still be a substantial market. Also, Nintendo is now shipping all systems with MotionPlus in the box. You can't buy a Wii without getting MotionPlus. That's not going to be the case for Move nor Natal. When you buy a new Xbox, most will not include Natal. In fact the "Premium" systems won't include it, which right there seems to be saying that Natal is not a central focus for Microsoft, that it's likely to languish and end up abandoned. Ditto for Move on the PS3, where no PS3 systems at all will include it.
Of course they could change that, but they also have to deal with being a smaller market then the Wii, thus making their motion peripheral market even smaller, and they are starting off on the wrong foot.
--- What?