The Future of Shopping

Hugh Pickens writes "The WSJ reports that a new device, now in use at about half of Ahold USA's Stop & Shop and Giant supermarkets in the Northeast, is making supermarket shoppers — and stores — happier. Looking like a smartphone, perched on the handle of your shopping cart, it scans grocery items as you add them to your cart. And while shoppers like it because it helps avoid an interminable wait at the cashier, retailers like it because the device encourages shoppers to buy more, probably because of targeted coupons and the control felt by consumers while using the device. Retail experts predict that before long most of these mobile shopping gadgets will be supplanted by customers' own smartphones. As more customers load their smartphones with debit, credit and loyalty card information, more stores will adopt streamlined checkout technology."

Comments

I always liked this concept

[QuoteMstr]

IBM createda commercial that explored what a grocery store without checkout lines. I'd love to live in a world in which I could optionally make all my purchases that way.

Re:I always liked this concept

[QuoteMstr]

Goddamn comment ate my anchor tag. The commercial.

Re:I always liked this concept

[toastyman]

AT&T's commercials that ran in 1993 (skip to about 2:00 to see) had something similar, too. But both of these seem more like what we'd use RFID for than scanning items one at a time.

Re:I always liked this concept

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, it's the computer's fault.

Re:I always liked this concept

[daem0n1x]

Stores assume people will buy more, which won't happen, because people have no money and are avoiding spending as much as possible. I did my job, I cut all my expenses really hard, every time I go to a supermarket, I take a shopping list that I follow strictly. I only buy what I really need, and always buy the cheapest products that don't suck.

Funny, because here in my country the big retail tycoons are the most vocal about reducing wages and social benefits. They forget that people without money can't buy the fancy shit they sell.

Re:I always liked this concept

[Anonymous Coward]

First off, retail sales are UP right now. Second, they already showed when using the ScanIt device that customers spent 10% more on their final bill. So, what you talking bout willis?

Re:I always liked this concept

[xaxa]

In the UK, Waitrose have had this system since about 1995 (according to some kid's coursework, but it sounds about right).

Re:I always liked this concept

[mgkimsal2]

Was going to mention this as well - I remember seeing a system like this in the UK in 1997, and it was pretty impressive. I think it may have been Tesco or Sainsbury's, but same idea. Not sure why it's taken 15 years to get this to America.

Re:I always liked this concept

[Kamiza Ikioi]

It still saves stores money. The cost of a device is far less than the cost of a cashier, and far less than a self-checkout line. The problem will come with easier shop lifting and scanning lower priced items and putting higher priced items in the cart.

And before you say, "Yeah, but they probably check the weight," remember, 2 similar bottles of shampoo weigh close enough to the same that someone can walk out with a $40 bottle of shampoo, but only pay $10 for a bottle of Suave. Yes, they can trace inventory. But attaching missing inventory to a specific credit card purchase is impossible in a busy big box store. Every advance in convenience works for the convenience of theives.

Stores know this, though, and factor it in as "Inventory Shrinkage" or something similar. At the end of the day, "most" people are honest, and the heavy shop lifters do get caught, usually by good old fashion cameras watching people stuff items into their coats. Security already knows which areas to watch... nobody really steals cereal boxes, but plenty steal meat.

Re:I always liked this concept

[ncc74656]

The problem will come with easier shop lifting and scanning lower priced items and putting higher priced items in the cart.

TFA addressed this and other possible forms of shrink. Occasional spot checks of customers' purchases didn't turn up significant amounts of "five-finger discounts." They had more losses from their cashiers fat-fingering quantities and prices at the registers.

I've used them

[Wannabe Code Monkey]

I've used them and I like them. It's nice to just bring your own bags to the store, and just scan and bag all your items while you shop. Then when you get to the check out counter (either the self checkout or regular lane). You don't have to unload all your stuff just to scan and then bag it again.

My only issue is that Stop and Shop is more expensive than other stores in the area.

Re:I've used them

[coldfarnorth]

One of the store chains in my area ran a test with them too. Unfortunately, they were discontinued. I'm not privy to the real reasons, but I suspect that there was a lot of theft. The store had to trust that you had actually scanned all the items in your cart. The other problem from my perspective was that the little kiosks that let you price produce (they gave you a barcoded sticker to scan) kept breaking.

Re:I've used them

[cpu6502]

Yeah but what is there to prevent shoplifting? Those automated checkouts are fairly easy to "trick" and get 1 or 2 free products.

Example: About two months ago, a scanner subtracted an item after it had already rolled to the end of the belt. I could have bagged it easily w/o anyone noticing. With this "automated cart" I imagine it would be even easier.

Re:I've used them

[TeethWhitener]

Random audits at checkout. About every 10th time or so that I used the U-Scan at my local Stop & Shop, I was randomly selected to have 5 random items in my cart checked out by a clerk to make sure that I had scanned them. Takes about 30 seconds total, and not having to wait in line at checkout easily saved me at least 20 minutes at the grocery store per visit.

Re:I've used them

[corbettw]

Wouldn't weight sensors in the cart handle the problem of people not scanning items? The sensor detects a change in weight, yet there's no corresponding scanned item, so a servo is activated which locks the wheels until you scan the item in question. Doesn't seem that difficult to do.

Re:I've used them

[Eivind]

Yeah. Random audits. Check that 5 randomly picked articles are scanned for every tenth shopper or something.

If you discover that one or more isn't scanned, check the rest and respond apropriately. (if someone has 137 articles, one of which isn't scanned, they -probably- forgot it, if they've got 137 articles, none of which are scanned, they're a thief)

One problem is people in the "nothing-to-lose" category. You've got a 90% chance of wheeling a cartful of high-value groceries out unhindered. For most people, the 10% chance of being stopped, will be a deterrent. For the desperate junkie, it probably will not be a sufficient deterrent. (but a high fraction of them are spottable, offcourse)

Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

We've had these for years in the UK

Mixed bag

[mr1911]

I'm all for spending less time in the store, especially in a checkout line. I do not welcome stores further tracking my buying habits by requiring an app that ties my shopping list to a loyalty card and my debit card.

They already know I buy a lot of tinfoil. They still do not know I make hats out of it. Dammit, I just told them.

Re:Mixed bag

[geekoid]

becasue if the know your buying habits they will....? what exactly?

Re:Mixed bag

[icebraining]

"The real danger is the gradual erosion of individual liberties through the automation, integration, and interconnection of many small, separate record-keeping systems, each of which alone may seem innocuous, even benevolent, and wholly justifiable."

          â" U.S. Privacy Protection Study Commission, 1977

Re:Mixed bag

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm all for spending less time in the store, especially in a checkout line. I do not welcome stores further tracking my buying habits by requiring an app that ties my shopping list to a loyalty card and my debit card.

They already know I buy a lot of tinfoil. They still do not know I make hats out of it. Dammit, I just told them.

If you already have a loyalty card with a store then they are already able to track your buying habits. Connecting this with a smartphone app doesn't make any difference as every time you use the loyalty card they know who you are and exactly what you purchased.

Re:Mixed bag

[xaxa]

Even if you don't have a loyalty card, if you pay with a card your purchases will be tied to that card. Note that the card includes your name as well as a number.

I can see an upside...

[mandelbr0t]

...it would give asshole customers less time to mock the poor wage slaves

Really like these devices

[deacent]

Been using this in our local Stop & Shop for the last year and it really does make the trip easier. You're allowed to use the express lane no matter how much you're buying if you use the hand-held scanner. The only pain is occassionally they do a random audit which requires a cashier to come over and scan 7 random items in your bags. The cool part is you can bag as you add to your cart and keep track of how much you're spending.

Re:Really like these devices

[LunaticTippy]

I like the idea. How does your store handle produce and bulk items? I typically buy a lot of items that are priced by weight. I suppose there could be networked scales in the produce section.

Re:Really like these devices

[ClioCJS]

and how do you do produce where you weigh it? Yeah, i put mine down on a shelf within 5 minutes of picking it up and never used it again. This is why i usually get groceries delivered..

Re:Really like these devices

[coldfarnorth]

A local store that was running a test project using these things had kiosks with a scale and a printer. You put the item on it and touched the picture of the item you were buying (or entered the PLU code) and it printed a barcode that you could scan.

Re:Really like these devices

[ClioCJS]

That's very interesting. Not sure how I feel about that. When the cashier slowly figures it out, I can talk to my wife during that time so it's not as much of a total waste. Hmm..... Thanks for the info!

America

[Bergs007]

Brittney Watters, who had arrived at the store at 3 a.m. and had two GPS devices and several toys in her cart, appreciated the speed. "It works well," she said. But there can be hiccups: The scanning gun sometimes stopped scanning, slowing the process down.

America: We can't buy shit fast enough!

Re:America

[geekoid]

The faster I buy my shit at the store, the faster I am home with my family enjoying our shit.

Free time. Life is about free time.

Won't work

[DogDude]

The amount that's going to be stolen from any store that uses this is going to be prohibitive. Any store that is going to use a system like this will have to greatly increase price to offset the theft. It's much cheaper to use even well-paid cashiers to check people out.

Re:Won't work

[zonky]

This has been used in the UK since around 1996/7. You get a random 'audit' every N visits.

Re:Won't work

[shutdown -p now]

Yeah. I've heard of a similar, albeit more primitive, concept called "self-checkout lane" - that never took off, either.

You might as well dream of communism. ~

Re:Won't work

[mooingyak]

Yeah. I've heard of a similar, albeit more primitive, concept called "self-checkout lane" - that never took off, either.

I'm assuming that was sarcastic. If not, the rest of this doesn't make as much sense.

Self checkout lanes still typically have a person at the end monitoring a few lanes, and some scales you have to put everything on after you scan it.

As I understand, these still require a random audit, which isn't too hard to defeat still. For one, it's unlikely to require audits close together, so just keep an eye on things and then jump on the line that just had an audit. Alternately you can bury the thing you want to steal underneath a bunch of other stuff in the cart. Avoid a line that has the rare diligent auditor. Lastly if you get caught just watch the process and as they go to scan a stolen item say something like "Wait, that's not supposed to be in there. I thought I put that back on the shelf."

OTOH, that doesn't make this a show stopper. With higher custom satisfaction (which hopefully translates to a higher repeat sale rate) and reduced total cashier payroll this can still work to a net profit if the additional shrink isn't too severe.

Re:Won't work

[peragrin]

actually the self checkout lanes are often empty, as most people don't like them.

I know I always go for a cashier over the self checkout lane, I can't tell you how much I have accidently stolen because the scanner didn't work, or only caught one of the two items of the same kind I was buying. Not to mention they are actually slower than a cashier. the scanner is less sensitive, and you have to wade through the menus for payment, taking twice the time a cashier could do the same thing.

Re:Won't work

[0123456]

Self checkout lanes still typically have a person at the end monitoring a few lanes, and some scales you have to put everything on after you scan it.

They have to have people there because the machines are so incredibly unreliable. 'Put the item in the bag'.. 'I already put the item in the bag you moron'... 'Put the item in the bag'... takes item out of bag.. 'Return the item to the bag'... puts it back in the bag... 'Please wait for an assistant'.

Most times I could get through the checkout faster if they just had a human doing it for me.

Re:Won't work

[marnues]

I use a self-checkout lane at my local albertson's and (sometimes sadly) walmart. My preferred stop (the local co-op) does not have these, but then I like talking to the cashiers there. This all in Billings, MT a bastion of old-timey, small-town, luddite nonsense.

Re:Won't work

[0123456]

Not to mention they are actually slower than a cashier. the scanner is less sensitive, and you have to wade through the menus for payment, taking twice the time a cashier could do the same thing.

Oh yeah, if you're buying fifteen types of fresh food, you're probably fscked. Someone who does checkout all day probably knows the code for the most common items whereas the rest of us are stuck with hunting through menus trying to figure out what we're actually holding in our hands and which of the icons is actually the correct one ('Is this bunch of tomatoes, large, or bunch of tomatoes, kind of medium sized?')
.

Re:Won't work

[An Anonymous Coward]

Yeah. I've heard of a similar, albeit more primitive, concept called "self-checkout lane" - that never took off, either.

I'm assuming that was sarcastic. If not, the rest of this doesn't make as much sense.

Self checkout lanes still typically have a person at the end monitoring a few lanes, and some scales you have to put everything on after you scan it.

As I understand, these still require a random audit, which isn't too hard to defeat still. For one, it's unlikely to require audits close together, so just keep an eye on things and then jump on the line that just had an audit.

Assuming the audit system is actually random, there's no way you can guarantee that two audits won't come up back-to-back either. Are you really willing to take that chance?

Alternately you can bury the thing you want to steal underneath a bunch of other stuff in the cart.

Now you're assuming they haven't been trained to pull items from random depths in the cart, as much of a pain as that might sometimes be.

Avoid a line that has the rare diligent auditor.

Self-checkout lanes where I live tend to be the cashiers that are more observant and reliable than the average cashier. I'd assume with a system like this, they'd tend to be even more so.

Lastly if you get caught just watch the process and as they go to scan a stolen item say something like "Wait, that's not supposed to be in there. I thought I put that back on the shelf."

Yeah, I'm sure he's heard that one before too. The guys manning these stations aren't likely to be that naive.

OTOH, that doesn't make this a show stopper. With higher custom satisfaction (which hopefully translates to a higher repeat sale rate) and reduced total cashier payroll this can still work to a net profit if the additional shrink isn't too severe.

People actually determined to shoplift are still more likely to just stuff the item in their jacket, where the auditor is unlikely to check anyway.

Re:Won't work

[Balthisar]

So is it random, or every N visits?

Re:Won't work

[Balthisar]

If I have produce (for the reasons you mentioned) or alcohol (for the age verification delay) then I avoid the self-checkout completely. It's quicker to wait in line with the check-writing, silver-haired, old ladies.

Re:Won't work

[mooingyak]

Assuming the audit system is actually random, there's no way you can guarantee that two audits won't come up back-to-back either. Are you really willing to take that chance?

I'm assuming that consecutive audits are more likely to irritate customers and that there is a likelihood of a minimum value of checkouts between audits. If I'm wrong, scratch it off the list.

Lastly if you get caught just watch the process and as they go to scan a stolen item say something like "Wait, that's not supposed to be in there. I thought I put that back on the shelf."

Yeah, I'm sure he's heard that one before too. The guys manning these stations aren't likely to be that naive.

So what if they've heard it before? I'd bet it's actually true more often than it isn't. And the repercussions for a false accusation are so high that anything less than concrete proof won't be used. The thief would have to put the item back, but that's not such a big deal for them. And for the ones who make a genuine mistake and aren't audited, it still amounts to shrink if not actual theft.

People actually determined to shoplift are still more likely to just stuff the item in their jacket, where the auditor is unlikely to check anyway.

They might. It depends on how easy it is to beat the system without doing that.

Re:Won't work

[Maximum Prophet]

Most times I could get through the checkout faster if they just had a human doing it for me.

Of course a professional checker who's do this for awhile could be faster than Joe Random shopper. The point isn't speed, it's not having to pay a skilled worker bee.


Tidbit: You have a few items to buy. The express lane is open, and a regular checker is open, and the people waiting seem to have the same number of items. Which checker do you choose?

Always choose the regular checker if there's not too much stuff in the carts of the people ahead of you. Store managers always put their slowest checkers on the express lanes. (Think about it: Which customer is more important to you, the guy who is buying one pack of gum, or the housewife with $200 worth of groceries in her cart?)

Re:Won't work

[Nyder]

Self checkout lanes still typically have a person at the end monitoring a few lanes, and some scales you have to put everything on after you scan it.

They have to have people there because the machines are so incredibly unreliable. 'Put the item in the bag'.. 'I already put the item in the bag you moron'... 'Put the item in the bag'... takes item out of bag.. 'Return the item to the bag'... puts it back in the bag... 'Please wait for an assistant'.

Most times I could get through the checkout faster if they just had a human doing it for me.

Maybe you should try not to confuse the machine. I find self check out easy to use, and faster then live people.

It's a machine, so you have to be smart about it. Don't do shit super fast, make sure stuff you are scanning isn't crumpled at the scanning bar thingys. Also, check to make sure the glass that house the laser & the mirror thingy aren't all smudged up.

Move item across the scanner, when you here the beep, drop it in the bag.

Not rocket science. Just plain old simple common sense, and not getting frustrated because you don't have common sense.

You are really going to hate the light bulbs with the IP address in them, i think...

Re:Won't work

[bjb]

Actually, at a stop-and-shop near where I live, the self checkout is not the kind where you need to put things in the bag. You scan it and then put it on a belt that zips it down to where you can bag it. The belt seems to have sensors that detect if something went by and doesn't care how you want to bag or not (reusable bags, anyone?). I've never had to wait for an assistant with this system. Shame I've not seen it anywhere else!

All's well until . . . .

[reboot246]

There's always one freaking item that won't scan no matter what you do, and you're left with keying in a number that's a mile long, or you have to call for help. The self-checkout at Wally World moves slower than the other checkout that have live human beings.

Would these scanners be better and more reliable?

Re:All's well until . . . .

[shutdown -p now]

The advantage here is that you're scanning right at the shelf. So if the item has unreadable barcode, you just put it back on the shelf and take another one.

Re:All's well until . . . .

[makomk]

Unless that particular thing refuses to scan no matter which of them you pick off the shelf. I think that does happen sometimes already - the barcode on one item is badly positioned, or badly sized, or has been printed in a bad choice of colour and it consistently won't scan.

Re:All's well until . . . .

[geekoid]

OK, you win. Lets not adopt technology because occasional it won't have maximum efficiency.

Re:All's well until . . . .

[ShanghaiBill]

I don't get a discount for doing what they already pay someone $7+ an hour to do.

Yes you do. The store saves money, and retailing groceries is a very competitive business, so much of those savings go toward lower prices.

Re:All's well until . . . .

[crossmr]

The problem is is that if it's not as convenient as what we have now..why use it?
The cashier can override and just punch in the price if they need to.

Re:All's well until . . . .

[misexistentialist]

Normally the cashier looks at the shelf tag and enters the price manually, so if you are your own cashier...

Re:All's well until . . . .

[corbettw]

Then either pick a competing product, or scan the bar code on the front of the shelf. Doesn't seem that difficult either way.

Re:All's well until . . . .

[jfengel]

They may not be better or more reliable, but they're cheaper. That means that you're not standing in line behind everybody else with their one item that doesn't scan. That could be a huge time savings. Checking out should be an "embarrassingly parallel" problem.

as long as is works better then self-checkouts

[Joe The Dragon]

as long as is works better then self-checkouts also what happens if the list gets messed up while you are shopping?
Is there a do over?
a way to do a full reset?
How easy will it be to cheat the system?

Sounds a bit complicated...

[CannonballHead]

they simply select "Remove" from the menu option, scan the item again, and it is removed from the cart. The total is updated.

Simply? It's a lot easier to just put it back on the shelf...

I like cool gadgets... but when it takes longer ans is more finicky than the "old" way, I dunno. I guess it depends on the customer. I'd probably try it just for fun, but it seems like this is kinda destined for the same problem as self-checkout stands; replaces employees but break down a lot and you end up having to wait a while, since there's only one employee "manning" all four stations...

Re:Sounds a bit complicated...

[Eivind]

It doesn't take longer. To the contrary, you save the time you currently spend waiting for the checkout, and packing your goods.

Instead you bring your own crate, and put it in the cart. Scan goods and put them in the crate. Then when done, wheel the entire thing directly to your car and lift the crate over into your trunk. Simple, quick.

Today ?

Put things in cart. Wait in line. Take things -out- of cart to have them scanned. Put things -back- in cart, bring to car.

Todays pack-wait-unpack-pack-go cycle is a lot more cumbersome than scan-pack-go

They had this for years at ICA Maxi in Sweden

[hpj]

Don't live there anymore but I know I saw this at least 2 or 3 years ago when I was visiting then.

It always struck me as really clever and very convenient from the shopping perspective.

We have these here

[Kindgott]

I've never used 'em. I don't use the self checkout unless I'm only getting a couple items, either, and god help you if you want to get beer. Honestly, the checkout lines are never a problem at our Stop and Shop so there's no real added convenience to using it for me.

Been around for ages in the UK

[aembleton]

I first used these in the UK in Safeway back in the late 90s. Now that they've been takenover by Morrisons I don't think they have them anymore.

Waitrose still have them though. You just swipe your credit card and it tells you which handset to pick up, and then you do your shopping. Article from 1997: http://www.thegrocer.co.uk/articles.aspx?page=articles&ID=33232

Is this really a new thing in the US?

Re:Been around for ages in the UK

[sdjimmy]

Sainsbury's have them in a few stores as well. The ones I know of are one in Edinburgh and another in Hedge End, Southampton. You're randomly selected for a price rescan and if the scanned items match, it's longer until the next rescan. I used it flawlessly for about 3 months. Much faster, especially at busy times.

This isn't about customer experience

[ClioCJS]

Like self check-out, this is about increasing profits by replacing human employees with machines.

First section in the store is produce. "How do you weigh this?" "I don't know." Left the device on a shelf... Back to Peapod delivery for me.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[cos(0)]

replacing human employees with machines.

You make this sound like it's a bad thing.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[ClioCJS]

I just doubt the extra profits would be passed on to me.

Also, I'm not willing to do self-checkout anywhere where it is offered. In fact - it's such bullshit in person that i always order mine online. I can't be trifled with running through all their annoying hoops. I thought self-checkout was bad enough, but this is even worse.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[geekoid]

Of course they will, as other stores use them.

Yes, we Get it. Self check out is too fucking complex for you to do. I'm sure there will always be a service for the mentally handicapped, so you do not need to keep posting how check out is too difficult for you to do without someone holding your hand.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[ClioCJS]

Ah yes, another geek who insults someone who has a different opinion as them. That's why your crowd is renowned for its popularity.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[damiangerous]

So you choose to get the lowest quality produce at incredibly high prices because the concept of a scale didn't occur to you?

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[ClioCJS]

The quality of my produce is quite good, and I've comp'ed the prices before. Lemme know when you are capable of answering my original question - how do these things work with produce? There's not even a bar code. It often takes the cashier a full minute to figure out how to ring up things like bok choi.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[Attila Dimedici]

That is related to part of the reason I rarely use self checkout even when I am only buying one or two items. When the two major grocery store chains near me introduced self checkout, they kept making an announcement over the instore PA something like this, "Now for your convenience, we have self checkout." Well, I knew full well that they did not institute self checkout for the shoppers' convenience, they introduced self checkout to save money on cashiers. I would not mind that, but I did mind them repeatedly lying to me every time I went into the store.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[Buelldozer]

He's replying to an aristocrat who can't be bothered to obtain their own FOOD.

If the friendly guy bringing your groceries doesn't show up for long enough you'll die.

That's the epitome of a lazy first worlder. When even the things necessary for life are too irritating for you to manage yourself so you outsource them.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[misexistentialist]

You weigh the item and the scale prints out the bar code after you input what you bought. Scanning produce is a weakness of the cashier system, not of self-scanning, since you know what you are buying.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[ClioCJS]

Let's see - grocery shopping as a 2 person job still takes me and my wife 2-3 hours. Delivery is $10 and for every $100 spent you get $0.10/G off your next gas purchase, so if we get $500 groceries in one order, we can fill both our cars up for $3.50/G instead of $4G. Is your money really that important to you?

Nevermind that this is essentially a personal attack from you because someone doesn't do things your way. Classy.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[ClioCJS]

Thank you for actually answering the question after 5 other people just engaged in personal attacks. Glad to see civility is not completely dead on the internet.

When I tried it out this way, the device offered none of the helpful info that you just offered. I don't remember seeing printers attached to the scales at my local Giant - but maybe I just assumed the scales were as they always were and didn't look hard enough.

Still though - while quantitatively superior, I may qualitatively prefer to flirt with my wife for the 1 minute the cashier takes to do something I could do in 20 seconds. I dunno. I like being served. I worked in a grocery store in high school so I kinda hate doing that stuff myself nowadays :)

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[corbettw]

Someone already answered this upthread: http://news.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2167426&cid=36172204

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[ClioCJS]

Thanks, I wouldn't have seen that!

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[damiangerous]

I did answer your question. You use a scale. They are placed obviously around the produce section with large signs indicating they are for use with the self scanner.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[jfengel]

It doesn't have to save me money. It saves me time, which is even more valuable. In a store with self-checkout machines there are often twice as many lanes open, and I'm not stuck behind somebody with two carts full or arguing over a three-cent different on a box of Life cereal.

I would pay extra for the privilege of not having to deal with that.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[ClioCJS]

That is definitely a valid consideration. But what saves me the most time is ordering online. For $10 I never have to go there in the first place. It's at my front door. Takes 20 minutes with my wife to get $500 of groceries in. Saves us 2+ hrs each, as we go together.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[ClioCJS]

Maybe in your store. When my wife & I went, we looked around at length for an explanation and found none. I even stood within 2 feet of a scale while doing this....

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[drsquare]

How the hell do you eat $500 worth of food before it goes off?

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[ClioCJS]

Most of it doesn't... But you do need to make some quick stops occasionally for milk & fruit.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[pankajmay]

Fine. Hide your paranoia by feigning to be insulted by the commenter, while you blatantly berate a technology without ever giving it a proper chance. This is /. you know -- we geeks always defend technology and take an unfair assessment of one personally.

Now lets address your points --

• Produce

• : Every Stop and Shop; Shaws; Dave's; around here is sprinkled with weigh scales for produce that instantly spit out a bar code print label. You should try one of these. Hopefully a big colorful touch screen with pictures of produce buttons on it is not too much to handle.

• Human Employees with Machines

• : People who use this reasoning miss the entire point about technology. The whole point is to replace mindless tasks with machines, so humans could be better augmented and utilized at tasks that machines are not good at. You think the person mindlessly checking out is building their skill set? In fact, I would say that they are better off -- perhaps it will force them to acquire new skills that can be effectively leveraged. I find this American attitude of lamenting the loss of low skilled jobs particularly amusing. What did you think? The burger flipping job you got of high school should be enough to last you a lifetime. That is not a mark of nation with leadership, but rather a signal of stagnation. Change is eternal. Change is good. Americans should be at the forefront of this, and thankfully due to many geeks, nerds -- we have been until now. While I concede there is a lack of human interaction with the checkout person, but then the same technology has now given you ways to connect with people not imaginable even a couple of decades ago.

My sincerest request to you is to give it another chance. Try the self-checkout again --- if not for the reasoning proposed here, then for the sheer sake of challenging your set of beliefs; discovering something new; or perhaps for coming up with a cogent reason rather than the 'bullshit in person' subjective bias.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[AmiMoJo]

I simply object to the whole de-humanisation of shopping. That might sound odd for the type of person who posts to Slashdot and therefore probably does a lot of on-line shopping, but when I go somewhere I really like to interact with the shop staff a bit and feel like I am being treated as a valued customer.

I only started feeling that way after using Japanese shops. They don't seem to have self-service checkouts at all and in busy shops they often have two people on one till, so one can scan and handle the money while the other packs for you. Prices don't seem to be any higher for it and they really make you feel valued, a really positive experience. Shopping is a real pleasure over there, but British people seem to actually prefer self-service. I suppose part of that is because our supermarkets rarely seem to have enough staff on the tills anyway.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[ClioCJS]

Yea, the scales didn't have printers when we tried this out. We stood next to one and looked. And the high unemployment of late is quite the indicator that americans with shitty skills don't just magically get jobs when you replace/outsource/insource them. And there is no "paranoia" or "feigning being insulted" when somebody calls you "mentally handicapped". No need to feign. That is a real insult. If anyone is feigning, you are feigning that I was not insulted. Goodbye.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[ClioCJS]

I hear you. If there's going to be no humans, I may as well order online (which is how I get 99% of my groceries anyway).

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[ZosoZ]

Self check-out just swaps a machine for a human at the end of the process, scanning as you go makes the whole business faster; instead of picking stuff off shelves, putting it in a trolley, taking it to the checkout, taking it out of the trolley, scanning it and putting it back in a bag to take out to the car, you pick something off the shelf, scan it, stick it in a box, take everything to the checkout, give 'em the scanner, pay, stick the box in the car. Sure, online ordering is more convenient still, but at least in person you can rummage through the fresh produce yourself, check "best before" dates, and make your own substitutions rather than suffering: "We did not have any lemons in stock; we have substituted lemon-scented toilet freshener..."

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[ClioCJS]

So it saves the time of taking it out of your cart and putting it back in once. But I have to wonder how much time I lose by being inferior at the process of scanning compared to a paid professional. I guess you get experience points and level up and eventually get better at it after awhile :)

(I don't have problems with produce or substitutions with Peapod delivery, though.) (But they do screw up every order a little bit, so you have to double check it, which arguably takes way more time than scanning, but can be done in the leisure of your own home, with is an issue if your misanthropic :))

Hmmm. I have much to consider.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[abyssalson]

At my stop and shop all you have to do is put the produce in a bag, put it on the scale, select the produce on a touch screen, which prints a label and scan the barcode. takes 30 seconds max

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[Nyder]

Like self check-out, this is about increasing profits by replacing human employees with machines.

First section in the store is produce. "How do you weigh this?" "I don't know." Left the device on a shelf... Back to Peapod delivery for me.

'cept your going to yell at the deliver person to get off your lawn.

Re:This isn't about customer experience

[ClioCJS]

If that was supposed to be an insult that carried any weight, you need more practice at the internet. I get unattended delivery anyway - I don't see the guy. We hear the boxes being loaded while watching TV (cause they always miss their delivery window) and move them to our kitchen in our pajamas and underwear :)

"New" device?!

[megla]

Safeway trialled this in the UK 15 years ago in the mid 90s at several of their largest supermarkets including the one I shopped at. The device itself was a bit more crude (basically a barcode scanner with a memory and 16x2 LCD screen) but the concept was identical. It was also a massive failure, because people would do everything they could to steal things up to and including stealing the scanners. Then, because of the increased shrinkage, the chances of being forced to 'randomly' go back through the normal checkout anyway in order to double check your scanning shot right up, and because of that ("What's the point if I'm just going to have to go through the checkout anyway?") people stopped using them and they were gone in under a year.

It sounds like a nice idea but relies on honesty. You'd be surprised how many petty thieves there are when people think they can get away with it.

Smartphones?

[stms]

So what you're saying is soon some Swedish hacker will get me free groceries.

works great on packaged food...

[jfruhlinger]

...not so well on veggies or other things that don't have barcodes.

Re:works great on packaged food...

[ColdWetDog]

...not so well on veggies or other things that don't have barcodes.

Not to worry. Monsanto is already working on this.

Been there. Done that.

[jedidiah]

It's been done already. This has already been tried with larger "gun" style laser scanners. Apparently it didn't catch on.

Not sure this will fare any better.

This sort of thing seems to go over a lot like 3-D movies.

Re:20th century device

[makomk]

Yeah, the Safeway self-scan system apparently even had random audits where every few visits it sent you to a till to have your items scanned again in order to stop theft. (If you were out by too much, it increased the frequency of the audits.) Don't think it had any kind of targeted coupons feature, though, and I'm not sure it was wireless.

what about bulk items?

[serbanp]

Do they have a built-in scale?

Anyway, shoplifting is going to be a big issue. Maybe a scale will help fixing this problem; the ones used in the bagging section of the self-check-out area are incredibly sensitive and the system continuously matches the estimated weight of the scanned object with the bag's weight increase. If you don't have that built in the shopping cart, the system has no way to know what exactly is in the cart.

You just blew BUSH the Elder's mind!

[Anonymous Coward]

He was freaked out enough by the trained person doing it, now EVERYBODY can? Where will he get a personal shopper that skilled???

I won't do this

[kimvette]

I won't use this for two reasons:

1. It costs Americans jobs.

2. They're not going to pay me to do their work, nor are they going to discount if I use this, or self-checkout, so I've only used self checkout a handful of times.

As time goes on vendors cut services while maintaining high prices. I'll be damned if I'm going to be an enabler encouraging this trend.

Re:I won't do this

[geekoid]

OMG, it's costs jobs. Yeah, so do cars, and buses, and whatever YOU do for a living.

Less costs to the company always reduces prices over all.

Hey, you want to waste your time waiting in line, fine., But don't make shit up to excuse your Luddite behavior.

Re:I won't do this

[misexistentialist]

The incentive for you to use the scanners is a more accurate checkout, not having to waste months of your life being corralled like an animal, and "instant coupons" that might save you money. It's pretty ridiculous having millions of people waving stuff in front of scanners all day for their occupation, but if you really want to save jobs cross out the bar-codes so that the prices have to be entered manually.

Re:I won't do this

[corbettw]

Hey, don't look now, but I think there are some damn kids on your lawn.

Re:I won't do this

[js_sebastian]

OMG, it's costs jobs. Yeah, so do cars, and buses, and whatever YOU do for a living.

Less costs to the company always reduces prices over all.

Hey, you want to waste your time waiting in line, fine., But don't make shit up to excuse your Luddite behavior.

GP Poster's second point is not luddite: if I don't get a discount for using self-checkout, why should I use it?

In Italy, the highway system has toll stations where you pay, and to reduce costs and queues they have introduced a wireless thingy you can use so you don't have to stop at the toll booths, just slow down to a reasonable speed and go through a gate that charges you automatically.

I have nothing against that, it makes perfect sense, but I refuse to have to pay extra (a yearly fee, not just the cost of the device!) to allow them to cut jobs. I should get a discount for helping them reduce their costs.

Smartphone Battery Life

[Zan Lynx]

Yeah, I can just see using my smartphone to scan items as I shop.

So, the phone is running the scan application, keeping the screen and camera live so that it is easy to use. And using CPU to try to locate barcodes in the camera image.

Then, after about 45 minutes of grocery shopping after a full day at work my phone shuts down.

Right. That's going to work really well.

Cool beans

[rsilvergun]

so all that increased productivity will be passed on to the working class, right?

Seriously though, anyone know what we're going to do with all these people we don't need any more. I'll trot out my favorite example, the sleeping bag factory that cranks out 2 MILLION bags/year with a total staff of 500 people (including marketing, sales staff, ceo, cfo, IT support, EVERYONE). So far the only viable option I've heard is a) socialism and b) die in a gutter. There's just not enough work for all these people. The saying goes, the world needs ditch diggers too, but you know what... it doesn't.

Re:Cool beans

[R3d M3rcury]

anyone know what we're going to do with all these people we don't need any more.

Soylent Green.

Use a smartphone?

[sehlat]

To quote from the posting: As more customers load their smartphones with debit, credit and loyalty card information, more stores will adopt streamlined checkout technology.

Does anybody else wonder how all that wonderful identity thief fodder will be protected, either from phone theft or loss, or police sucking all the data out of the phone just for the hell of it?

Bad Economy

[Stregano]

I support the jobs of people there and would rather wait to ensure they have a job, then to use some type of system so that they are not needed

How to prevent theft

[JackCroww]

A lot of comments talk about prohibiting theft. Why not have the carts tagged via RFID and have floor scales at the checkout line and subtract that particular cart's weight subtracted from what the total weight of the loaded cart and compare it to the weight of the scanned items? If the delta is off by x percent (and that x percent can be varied based on the average weight per item), it triggers a human audit of the cart.

Wasting time in small chunks

[iliketrash]

"And while shoppers like it because it helps avoid an interminable wait at the cashier...."

Shoppers will spend more time scanning their items than they would waiting at the cashier. It will only seem like they are saving time because the psychological perception of small amounts of time is different than that of one large chunk of time. In the meantime, the store saves money by getting the shopper to do their work for free.

I actually avoid stores that routinely make you wait at the cashier (Fry's in my town in Arizona) versus those that don't (Safeway).

Re:Wasting time in small chunks

[oh-dark-thirty]

I tried it a few times, and working alone was no time saver. With another person to take the item and bag it after I scanned it, the process went considerably quicker but that defeats the purpose, and I can't always have someone to help me...

Not sure what's so new here...

[.nuno]

While I was living in Brussels, Belgium (circa 99) I was already using a similar device at the local AD Delhaize supermarket... Granted, it was probably bulkier back in those days, but the same principle applied.

Like ideology, it works in theory...

[spiderfarmer]

I don't see it becoming a wide spread use item in most of the US. In affluent, tech savvy populations...significantly more possible than in rural, less affluent areas. For the stores, this is primarily a cost-cutting measure, allowing them to reduce the number of workers on the floor, while shuffling the workload to the consumer without providing the consumer much benefit aside from the mimetic "time saving" of checkout.

For consumers, like the commenter above (and myself at times), who bring their own bags, and have a very zen packing method that means the tomatoes don't end up under the five pound bag of rice, this sort of thing would be a time saver for small trips, but I don't see it providing much benefit on those "stock up the pantry, feeding a house of teenager" shopping trips where you're lucky to get out with one cart.

In addition, I have never been in a store with self-checkout lanes that didn't have at least one very frustrated consumer trying to get the machine to work. I've seen those lines stand empty, while checkout lines with have 10+ carts lined up.

I've used these little cart checkout things in Europe, and they work fine. But the average American consumer is not the average big city European, any more than a farmer in Southern Italy is like a Manhattanite. To expect that technocracy and lack of personal service is going to make inroads in places like the Deep South or the Midwest is to fail to understand the demographic or the culture from which the demographic arises.

Cute, but wrong answer.

[Animats]

Whatever happened to the concept that you'd just push your cart through an RFID portal, everything in your cart would be interrogated, and you'd get an immediate bill? Wal-Mart was behind that. NCR demonstrated it in 2004. That was a more promising idea.

Vision systems for checkout are available. There's LaneHawk, for recognizing big items at the bottom of the cart, and VeggieVision, for recognizing vegetables on a scale pan. Automated checkout is getting better.

The future of retail looks more like WebVan. WebVan was a flop, but not because of customer acceptance. WebVan was popular, but the operating costs were too high. "Soap.com" (acquired by Amazon) is now doing the WebVan thing of delivering routine items. But now, with Kiva robotic order picking, it's profitable. Kiva's system is now doing about 10% of online order picking in the US. Costs are about 1/5 of human picking.

Delivery uses less fuel than driving a ton of car to the store to move a few pounds of merchandise. At $4 per gallon and up, Soap.com's shipping rates (Max of $5, free for orders over $39) look really good.

The future of retail is online ordering and delivery. Been to a record store lately? A video rental store? A bank branch? A travel agency? Look at all the vacant retail space that will never again be occupied.

Re:Cute, but wrong answer.

[EuclideanSilence]

The future of retail is online ordering and delivery. Been to a record store lately? A video rental store? A bank branch? A travel agency? Look at all the vacant retail space that will never again be occupied.

Well, those are examples of stores that sell information. A better example would be a bookstore instead of amazon, but even then very few people buy books very often, and even that is being pressured by digital book sales.

The main reason that the future of grocery won't be delivery though is that it will be used by humans, not robots. Humans need human interaction, and for a large proportion of "stay at home moms" and others, getting out to the grocery store is one of their few weekly chances to see other humans besides their family.

Had this in Sweden for years

[the_arrow]

I have seen it for over six or so years, and been using it for at least four. It is now fully automated: Draw your customer card to get a scanner unit, enter the store and put stuff in your bag while scanning them, put the scanner at its stand, draw customer card and credit card at a touch-screen station.

Simple, quick and no need to stand in a line. :)

I use my own cart

[rossdee]

When I go to the supermarket I take my own cart. I don't drive, so I can't load the groceries into a car. If I was to carry all the items all the way home (15 min walk) my arms would get sore, so I bought a little shopping cart from Amazon a few years ago. Best purchase I ever made.

Re:Sooooo

[xorsyst]

Yeah, I used to do that. Then I got a bike trailer, and used that instead. Awesome system.

And this is news?

[doperative]

And this deemed newsworthy enough for a posting on slashdot?

Re:Its a repackaged Symbol 'Shop and Scan"

[captbob2002]

The "Giant Eagle" chain in Cleveland tried this a couple years back. All the carts with their scanner holders are long gone. Never learned why it didn't work out - perhaps no one in the midwest was interested in scanning as they shopped, I know I wasn't.

Not random

[Maximum Prophet]

At least at Giant, it's not exactly random. But you do get a $2 off coupon if you're audited.

Try this: Pick up an item from the shelf. Look at it. Put it into your bag without scanning. Take it out of the bag and scan it. Put it back in the bag. The scan gun will give you a list of all the things you've bought, so you can verify before you check out.

I'm very absent minded, so this happens to me not infrequently. AFAIK, every time I've done that, I've been audited.

Another interesting tidbit: When they audit, they just rescan a few different items. Their audit makes sure you've scanned at least one of the items you've put in your bag, but it doesn't seem to be able to tell the difference between 4 or 5 of an item.

I'm not sure what they do if the audit doesn't match. It's entirely possible that you try to scan an item, it doesn't take, but you hear a beep from another shopper and think your gun caught it.

Re:cheaters

[Linnen]

The implemented solution is random audits. Your order is flagged at random and the cashier in charge of the area comes over and rescans some or all of your items. I do not know what happens if there is a discrepancy.

Invitation to steal

[ResidentSourcerer]

Unless the carts are very sophisticated, it's an invitation to shop lifting.
Scan one item into your cart, place 6 in your cart. Avoiding this would required that you have a scale in the cart accurate enough to register a single item's difference. If they come up with this, then just add a squirming kid to the basket. (fresh pork...)

Or you scan a can of el-cheapo discount icecream, but place Haagan Das in the cart. Or you fill a bag with cashews at the bulk bins, and tell the machine that it's wheat bran. Scan bananas, load avocadoes.

More from *THEM*

[DrYak]

The purpose of coupons and the like is to bring customers specifically to your store or your products.

They don't necessarily need that you spend more. And, as you point out, during economically unsure time, people do NOT spend more anyway. They only need that you spend your money on their premise.

Imagine that you need to buy milk. You're low on milk in your fridge (or your Internet enabled Fridget tweets you that you should buy milk :-D ), so you add it on grocery list of what you need to buy next saturday, when shopping in the grocery near the place you live.

Now, a specific store sends an SMS to your credit/debit/loyalty-card converged smartphone, to inform you that milk is on sale today afternoon and, as a regular customer, they offer you a 10%-off e-coupon attached to the SMS. Well the store happens to be on your route from your office back to your home. Well, why not stop by on your way home and buy the milk you need anyway ?
And when you arrive there, why not buy a few other stuff that you need anyway ? They do have either the same usual low-cost brands that you use, or similarily low-priced-while-still-decent-enough-quality wares. Also the toilet-paper is on sale. You don't need to buy it this week, but it's always better to buy this kind of home supply when their price is lower as usual. And as you walk around the aisles, this shops sends you a couple more e-coupons SMS.

In the end, you won't spend more (okay, more this day as planned, but that was stuff you planned to buy anyway, so it was on your monthly budget to begin with), in fact you could have even saved a few bucks, thanks to the e-coupons and the gaz saved by stoping on your way home instead of having to drive an extra travel on saturday.

And the shop owner is happy because you spent your budget in their shop instead of the other one near your home.

Nowadays that would require quite a lot of coincidence and luck for it to happen. Better tracking would enable the shop to pull the whole stuff on purpose by knowing your shopping habits and predicting the needs with which they could attract you.

The sheeple are going to love it, because, thanks to the e-coupons, they'll shave a few bucks on the monthly budget.

The /.-paranoids are going to hate it, because it means that the shops can manage to have access to an outrageous amount of personal information, including tracking your moves based on the ID (Wifi mac address) of you phone they might spot inside the shop. (Bonus point it the shop has some way to snoop on the tweeting i-Fridge)

Re:More from *THEM*

[daem0n1x]

I don't have time to be up to date with all the coupons, promotions and all that shit. Shopping the way you describe here is a nightmare of wasted time, and time is also money.

Most of the time I go to a chain that's some 3 Km away from my house. Their slogan is "no discounts, no promotions, we have the lowest prices all year round". And they do.

Tried, had problem once, gave up

[Dr. Gamera]

I tried the hand scanner a few times, but gave up the first time something went wrong and I had to re-scan everything in my cart. It would take a very, very low failure rate for the time saved on each occasion that the hand scanner works to be worth the time wasted on occasions that the hand scanner doesn't work.

That's the whole point of smartphone.

[DrYak]

I don't have time to be up to date with all the coupons, promotions and all that shit. Shopping the way you describe here is a nightmare of wasted time, and time is also money.

That's the whole point of letting the smartphone and no-clerks checkout lines do almost all the work (and clever marketing algorithms to try to attract your attention with the correct e-coupon at the good time).

Currently, you have a hard time keeping track of all coupons. Thus you forget them, don't use them, and are not attracted to go shoping in the shop which issued them. From your point of view, you don't care or even spare time. But from the issuing shop's point of view, they failed to attract you.
(The same way classical "wall of blinking shit" approach to advertisement fails most of the time due to the useful message being buried under tons of crap. Its almost SPAM-level of uselessness)

The idea of marketeers with this kind of technology is only trying to attract you whenever you're the most likely to respond - try to get you to come buy their milk only when you need to buy some. You're much more likely to decide to use a coupon if the shop is on you way and you need to buy the ware anyway. And if the smartphone you're using as a check-out device is able to remind you which one you might use.

Small advantage for the end-user, but massive data-mining and privacy violations.

Re:That's the whole point of smartphone.

[daem0n1x]

That's the whole point of letting the smartphone and no-clerks checkout lines do almost all the work (and clever marketing algorithms to try to attract your attention with the correct e-coupon at the good time).

I could live perfectly without "marketing", clever or not. I guess I would live even better, but hey, that's just me.

Re:cheaters

[daem0n1x]

It's the same, here. I've been checked a few times. I wouldn't dream of trying to game the system, but there should be the occasional idiot who does it. Authentically random flagging above a certain percentage guarantees security. If they pick people by their appearance or whatever, forget it.

I always choose self-service when I'm not buying a lot of stuff. I hate waiting, specially in lines. I find it really strange that most people prefer the regular cashiers. For example, I've used an electronic toll device in my ever since it appeared in the 90's. Toll booths are always full of stopped cars. I just pass by and wave them. I wonder why the poor jerks prefer to waste their time waiting and have to worry about keeping cash, instead of just not even thinking about it, like me.