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Cringely's Lost Jobs Interview: Coming To a Theater Near You

A few weeks ago, Robert X. Cringely revealed that a long-lost, hour-long interview he conducted of Steve Jobs in 1995 had been found. Now, it seems the lost tape has found its calling: the movies. Says the linked Economic Times story: "The interview will be shown at Landmark theaters in 19 cities around the country beginning Nov 16."

141 of 206 comments (clear)

  1. Boring. by Dondoet · · Score: 2, Insightful

    All this news about Steve Jobs is getting rather boring and repetitive.

    1. Re:Boring. by tsa · · Score: 1, Informative

      Yes, especially since there is no news about him anymore since he died. Even when he was alive we already knew he was a righteous asshole with a vision for shiny and user-friendly things who had great success in transforming the music- and mobile phone industry. I didn't buy the book because I thought the juicy details would be public in no time, and I was right. I don't need to see any documentary or read any book about SJ ever again. Everything is out in the open already.

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    2. Re:Boring. by gutnor · · Score: 2

      Milking the death. Everytime there is somebody famous (as in fox news famous, not lisp inventor famous) we need to get through the same repetitive shit. At least we won't have to suffer post death album.

    3. Re:Boring. by Gaygirlie · · Score: 3, Funny

      At least we won't have to suffer post death album.

      Oh, you just wait.

    4. Re:Boring. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      It's probably a typo. "Cringely's Lost Job Interviews" - just as boring, but new!

    5. Re:Boring. by mwvdlee · · Score: 1

      Why wait? Isn't this interview like the post death album of a non-artist?

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    6. Re:Boring. by arielsom · · Score: 4, Funny

      Noooo! I'm going to get in line 2 days ahead so I can be the first in the theater!

    7. Re:Boring. by syousef · · Score: 2, Interesting

      All this news about Steve Jobs is getting rather boring and repetitive.

      I turned to the discovery channel today and they had a special on Steve Jobs. They credited him with making Pixar the great success it was even though he did non of the technical work. They credited him with single handedly forcing the music industry to adopt $1/song pricing. They stopped just short of crediting him with inventing the mp3 player. I'm surprised at that restraint - I thought they were going to credit him for inventing oxygen and water! Mikio Kaku, both the Mythbusters, and lots of other guests who may or may not have met jobs crediting him with genius, while all the people that did the actual innovation don't get a mention. It's sickening to anyone with a modicum of respect for the truth and credit where it's due.

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    8. Re:Boring. by Threni · · Score: 1

      Eh? But he sold loads of appliances! And that makes him really interesting.

    9. Re:Boring. by Gaygirlie · · Score: 2

      Why wait? Isn't this interview like the post death album of a non-artist?

      Well... in a way he is sort of an artist: https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=steve+jobs+remix&aq=f :D

    10. Re:Boring. by jellomizer · · Score: 1

      And all the news either portrait him as a saint or a villin. Like all people he was both.

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    11. Re:Boring. by mutube · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I think you mean 'neither'.

      Most people are just not that interesting.

    12. Re:Boring. by CrackedButter · · Score: 1

      I have the book and not all the details have made it online. I'd buy it for the quieter, more intimate and subtle stuff.

    13. Re:Boring. by Cobalt+Jacket · · Score: 1

      Why not? Lasseter (who DID the technical work) credited him with making Pixar what it was. Without Jobs, they'd still be doing contract work and/or shorts. In fact, Jobs was the one who said it was OK to produce shorts. More than likely, they would have been out of business.

    14. Re:Boring. by theolein · · Score: 1

      And unhealthily close to the obsession of a cult as well.

    15. Re:Boring. by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 1, Insightful

      All this news about Steve Jobs is getting rather boring and repetitive.

      • California Declares Today "Steve Jobs Day": 333 Comments
      • Jobs Wanted To Destroy Android: 333 Comments
      • Lost Hour-Long Jobs Interview Found: 120 Comments
      • How Steve Jobs Solved the Innovator's Dilemma: 424 Comments
      • Steve Jobs' Missing License Plate: 579 Comments

      Yeah, you guys are really bored with talking about Steve Jobs.

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    16. Re:Boring. by UnknowingFool · · Score: 2

      As for Pixar, he didn't draw or render a single frame. However as CEO he hired the best people and put them in charge, Catmull and Lassetter. At first it sold hardware before changing directions and becoming an animation company. During the first 10 years, it lost money but Steve Jobs kept it open with his own money. Steve was not involved with the daily operations of Pixar but he was in charge of larger focus like what the company ultimately became and the deals with Disney.

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    17. Re:Boring. by stms · · Score: 1

      Yeah but just think how awesome this would be in 3D and they could charge you an extra $3-$4 bucks.

    18. Re:Boring. by digitalaudiorock · · Score: 2

      All this news about Steve Jobs is getting rather boring and repetitive.

      Better than the way I mistakenly read the subject line at first...as "Cringely's lost job interview"...not that would have been boring.

    19. Re:Boring. by derGoldstein · · Score: 1

      Did you read through those threads? They were comprised primarily of trolling, troll-feeding, and bad jokes. A thread can have an immense amount of posts and still be completely boring and content-free.

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    20. Re:Boring. by CrackedButter · · Score: 1

      The whole book literally yes, I was referring to a journalistic analysis, sorry.

    21. Re:Boring. by hondo77 · · Score: 1

      Exactly. Without Steve Jobs keeping it afloat, Pixar would have gone out of business.

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    22. Re:Boring. by hitmark · · Score: 1

      I checked the program out, and to me it was 25 mins of apple product ads with 5 mins of ranting against "pirates", or something in that ballpark...

      Hell, Hyneman seemed like he wanted to be anywhere but in front of the camera.

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    23. Re:Boring. by Machtyn · · Score: 2

      Well, you do have it a bit backwards; but, yes, Jobs did keep Pixar afloat long enough to create a great movie (Toy Story). Lassitter, et al. had founded Pixar long before, and were under the umbrella of LucasArts. LucasArts was getting tired of Pixar as it didn't fit in their model of business. If Jobs hadn't stepped in with funding, Pixar would have gone nowhere.

    24. Re:Boring. by Machtyn · · Score: 1

      What other influence forced the music industry to make and keep $0.99 songs? They were trying to push individual songs up to $2.99. Jobs put his foot down on the price. It was either that, or the pirates would run loose again.

    25. Re:Boring. by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      And without the employees doing the work it would have gone out of business too.

    26. Re:Boring. by syousef · · Score: 1

      Exactly. Without Steve Jobs keeping it afloat, Pixar would have gone out of business.

      I'm pretty sure those employees wouldn't have just all suddenly become manual labourers. That talent would have gone elsewhere. Would it have pooled? Perhaps. Or perhaps a different company would have come along a little later with different ideas as the computing power became available. I don't think there would have been a computer animation vacuum for long at all.

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    27. Re:Boring. by syousef · · Score: 1

      What other influence forced the music industry to make and keep $0.99 songs? They were trying to push individual songs up to $2.99. Jobs put his foot down on the price. It was either that, or the pirates would run loose again.

      ...which would have forced the price down. Ultimately the threat of piracy is what is keeping the price reasonable...assuming you even agree that $1/song is reasonable.

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    28. Re:Boring. by UnknowingFool · · Score: 1

      Pixar was also a hardware company making the Pixar computer. When the hardware division was sold off under Jobs, a number of of employees were transferred. Catmull remained at Pixar. Lasseter at the time was head of the animation department and was promoted to President when the company's focus became animation. While I'm sure Jobs didn't concern himself with all personnel decisions, he did have a role in selecting higher positions. I don't know if he promoted Lasseter but he certainly didn't oppose him. It could have been much different.

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    29. Re:Boring. by syousef · · Score: 1

      Why not? Lasseter (who DID the technical work) credited him with making Pixar what it was. Without Jobs, they'd still be doing contract work and/or shorts. In fact, Jobs was the one who said it was OK to produce shorts. More than likely, they would have been out of business.

      It's called blowing smoke up your bosses arse. Telling your boss he's irrelevant is not a good idea. Biting the hand that feeds etc. If he hadn't done it another company would have taken off with computer animation, perhaps even with some of the same employees. At the very worst it would have taken a few years more. People were never going to stop animating because Jobs wasn't around with a pay cheque.

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    30. Re:Boring. by mattack2 · · Score: 1

      I'm not going to pay to see this 'lost' interview in a theatre, but I did watch "Steve Jobs: One Last Thing" (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2096615/) over the weekend, and it covered areas I hadn't seen mentioned before over the years, such as the guy who introduced the two Steves, and had a bit more with the third co-founder, among other things. It'll be rerun on PBS some more.

  2. New idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    Apple stores show it in solo booths with tissue dispensers

    1. Re:New idea by syousef · · Score: 4, Funny

      Apple stores show it in solo booths with tissue dispensers

      The tissues have rounded corners and cost $2 each.

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    2. Re:New idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Yes.

    3. Re:New idea by mortonda · · Score: 1

      but they are glossy, the matt finish is extra

  3. Confusing by zAPPzAPP · · Score: 1

    At first I thought, that this Cringely guy was applying for a job at 1995, but lost.
    Then the Job was named Steve, so maybe Steve Jobs was applying for a job with Cringely. Or the other way around. That would have been fun. But why would someone tape that?
    In the end I guess it is just a plain old normal Interview... zzzZZzzz

  4. Re:Cringely making money of Jobs death? by me+at+werk · · Score: 2

    If you read the posts about it, apparently he wants money to put his kids through college. Maybe he missed the part about how Steve Jobs didn't finish college?

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  5. Please by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Just let the guy rest in peace. Everyone needs to move on.

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    1. Re:Please by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      "rest in peace"... Why do people keep saying that? Are the dead really disturbed when the living discuss them? Is this how the zombie apocalypse starts, when the deceased decide that they've had enough of being disturbed and rise up just to shut us all up?

    2. Re:Please by jimshatt · · Score: 1

      Yeah, it *is* really silly. We all know that Steve Jobs will get rest nor peace in the Underground Freezer of Doom!
      Ramen.

  6. Re:Cringely making money of Jobs death? by siddesu · · Score: 2, Insightful

    What's wrong with making money off Jobs' death? Apple made a ton, and so did his biographer. Apple even timed the release of the iPhone to it to maximize exposure (and profits).

  7. You came so close to being rational ... by drnb · · Score: 1, Insightful

    What's wrong with making money off Jobs' death? Apple made a ton, and so did his biographer. Apple even timed the release of the iPhone to it to maximize exposure (and profits).

    Wow, you came so close to making a somewhat rational post ... then you had to toss it all away with the Apple timed the release of the iPhone thing.

    1. Re:You came so close to being rational ... by siddesu · · Score: 1

      Well, scratch it then, and say it was a magic, or a miracle. I don't care either way.

    2. Re:You came so close to being rational ... by mwvdlee · · Score: 1

      I wouldn't put it past Jobs to let the iPhone release be delayed to coincide, if he knew his death was near.

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  8. iZombie apocalypse by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    "rest in peace"... Why do people keep saying that? Are the dead really disturbed when the living discuss them? Is this how the zombie apocalypse starts, when the deceased decide that they've had enough of being disturbed and rise up just to shut us all up?

    Sort of. When the number of [name redacted for soon to be obvious reasons] articles/posts exceed the number of iDevices in the world he will rise. So we can either (1) leave him alone or (2) buy more iDevices. Your choice.

  9. Restored VHS—for real?! by neoguri · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Any cinema of repute would refuse to show material sourced from a VHS.

    1. Re:Restored VHS—for real?! by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 1

      Any cinema of repute would refuse to show material sourced from a VHS.

      I used to be of this 'THX' mindset, but now I see it as folly to deny content over technical concerns. These theatres apparently agree - the content must be compelling enough that people will pay good money to see it, and the quality sufficient to not get in the way of the content.

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    2. Re:Restored VHS—for real?! by illumnatLA · · Score: 1

      Any cinema of repute would refuse to show material sourced from a VHS.

      I used to be of this 'THX' mindset, but now I see it as folly to deny content over technical concerns. These theatres apparently agree - the content must be compelling enough that people will pay good money to see it, and the quality sufficient to not get in the way of the content.

      Yep... also, Landmark theaters are an "art house" chain so they are quite used to a wide range of technical quality... some intentionally rough, some not.

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    3. Re:Restored VHS—for real?! by Kunedog · · Score: 1

      Don't worry, they will "shaky-cam" the footage in post and overlay the letters REC with a blinking red dot. This will override the audience's minimum quality threshold, replacing it with an appreciation for (literally) gritty realism.

  10. Turd Sandwich vs Giant Douche by Rogerborg · · Score: 2

    Now, why does that South Park episode suddenly spring to mind?

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  11. Innovation in perspective by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I just wish there were stories that put his innovation into perspective: he didn't do anything other than latch onto others creations and sell it.

    Steve Jobs was nothing more than a salesmen. A very good salesmen, but a salesmen never the less. True innovators usually go unnoticed because they're not good at self promotion and sales - usually.

    If he were to have settled somewhere else other than Silicon Valley, he would probably have a successful used car dealership or would have been a mortgage broker that contributed to this past real estate meltdown. Or maybe a timeshare salesmen. You know he could have sold ski resort timeshares in the South West desert.

    1. Re:Innovation in perspective by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Jobs wasn't a designer. All of Apple's designs were done by others. He just chose the ones he liked.

      The Mac didn't get market share because of several market factors: the Mac was relatively expensive, the Intel PC was cloned and subsequently the hardware became a commodity, it had more business applications, and eventually the price difference between the Mac and Wintel became so large that the Mac was priced out of most markets, and later on, Apple's management totally screwed up until Jobs took over again and was able to change the direction of Apple towards a consumer device company. He really took advantage of the cult of the Mac/Apple to sell things to individuals.

    2. Re:Innovation in perspective by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I don't happen to own any Apple products myself, but even still I have to admit that in terms of brand presence Jobs was an absolutely brilliant marketer. So much so that people STILL attribute the creations of their design and engineering teams to him and him alone.

      I despise marketing in the main but you gotta admit that the mere fact that people STILL credit him for all of apples success, since returning from his drug binges, is a sign of remarkable skill.

    3. Re:Innovation in perspective by tsa · · Score: 1, Informative

      I don't entirely agree. Jobs hasn't invented much himself, true, but he was very good at combining other people's ideas and making something unique out of it.

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    4. Re:Innovation in perspective by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Jonathan Ive would like to have a word with you... Jobs didn't "design" a fucking thing.

    5. Re:Innovation in perspective by DarkOx · · Score: 1

      I think that is sorta the point about why everyone is so fascinated in a sense. Steve was pretty much just a salesman, but he might well be the best one since Carnegie, who was a great deal more than just a salesman.

      What is really driving everyone crazy is most people don't think qualities like, demanding, exacting, difficult to work with, are commonly associated with salesmen. He certainly had some qualities like intensity and passion that are but Steve did it different. I have no personal love for the man or Apple but I am still interested.

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    6. Re:Innovation in perspective by CrackedButter · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Even really good salesmen can't redesign a user interface for iDVD over a room full of designers and technicians.

      http://lunchpail.knotice.com/2011/10/07/paying-tribute-to-steve-jobs/

      He was more than what you're trying to reduce him down to.

    7. Re:Innovation in perspective by Swampash · · Score: 2

      Steve Jobs isn't very good at selling - just consider the failure of the original Mac vs. PC.

      Looked at PC sales figures lately? I think we can call that battle for Apple now.

    8. Re:Innovation in perspective by kiddygrinder · · Score: 2

      i'd almost say doom was the reason the home computer tended to be a pc imho.

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    9. Re:Innovation in perspective by gl4ss · · Score: 1

      Steve Jobs isn't very good at selling - just consider the failure of the original Mac vs. PC.

      Looked at PC sales figures lately? I think we can call that battle for Apple now.

      yes, mac sales are something like 6% of pc sales.
      mostly for good reasons too. mostly apple wanting more money for the same thing or just plain selling you less of a thing.

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    10. Re:Innovation in perspective by flosofl · · Score: 1

      So... you compare one company against the collective sales of *all* PC companies? How about at least making it a fair fight. I think you'd be surprised.

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    11. Re:Innovation in perspective by derGoldstein · · Score: 1

      Exactly how is this a counter-argument to the statement that Jobs wasn't a designer?

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    12. Re:Innovation in perspective by derGoldstein · · Score: 2

      I often wondered how he (Ive) felt about this "arrangement". Jobs kept getting the praise though it was known that Ive was the one behind the overall product design direction. He was in charge of hardware design, specifically, but that's exactly the part which the competition is trying hardest to copy.

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    13. Re:Innovation in perspective by derGoldstein · · Score: 2

      Ok, surprise me. Compare Mac market share to Dell, HP, or Lenovo. You can get the figures of the PC companies here.

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    14. Re:Innovation in perspective by tibit · · Score: 3, Informative

      I think this is selling him short a bit. His contribution was entirely in what to sell, his insight was about why the products should be designed in a certain way. Yes, Apple got ideas from Xerox about basics of the GUI, but Xerox did not manage to fully realize the potential of the technology they had. Xerox's products were a flop, because they didn't understand what was it about them that could make them good, and thus never took advantage of their own innovation. It's no good if you have figured out something cool if you have no clue how to actually use it in a product.

      Never mind that Apple pretty much reimplemented all of Xerox's ideas from scratch. It's not like they went to Xerox, ripped some code, then tweaked it and sold it on. The original Mac and Apple II were quite revolutionary products. There was nothing quite like them on the market. Of course there were other "similar" products, but nothing that was designed with similar attention to detail and usability. Even "silly" stuff like Apple II's switching power supply was quite a breakthrough in an age where most computers had a transfomer, rectifier, and a linear regulator that ran pretty hot.

      Of course both Tek and HP sold oscilloscopes with such power supplies at the time, and probably some workstations and mainframes had switching supplies, but no consumer/hobbyist products at the time had that. Look, for example, at ABC-80, circa 1978. See the black radiator in the back? That's what the linear regulators were bolted to. It added to the cost and made for an unwieldy-looking thing. Perhaps in Swedish climate it made sense, though :)

      All those "little" things count, and that's why "quite like it" doesn't count.

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    15. Re:Innovation in perspective by dskzero · · Score: 2

      Yeah, I don't get where this misconception that word processors and all that boring, practival stuff was the reason the PC was more successful. It was obviously Doom.

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    16. Re:Innovation in perspective by wdef · · Score: 1

      You fail to grasp that Jobs' rare combination of virtuoso entrepreneurship, drive and sheer smarts did indeed change technology. Both he and Gates had the gifts to create the future. It's not just hype. That's not to say that there aren't thousands of unsung talented people who also made this future we are now in.

    17. Re:Innovation in perspective by Toonol · · Score: 1

      Looked at PC sales figures lately? I think we can call that battle for Apple now.

      You obviously don't even know the correct figure to one order of magnitude,

    18. Re:Innovation in perspective by Gilmoure · · Score: 1

      Nope, he was an editor. And a really difficult one to work with from sound of it.

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    19. Re:Innovation in perspective by tehcyder · · Score: 1

      He did create the personal computer industry, after all.

      No, he really didn't.

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    20. Re:Innovation in perspective by spire3661 · · Score: 1

      Just like everyone credits only Edison for the light-bulb and his other inventions, when in fact he had a team of 'engineers' too. People need a figurehead to focus on.

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    21. Re:Innovation in perspective by schnell · · Score: 4, Interesting

      he was very good at combining other people's ideas and making something unique out of it.

      That's partly true but misses the big picture. If you read the biography - and I strongly recommend you do, it isn't just "Jobs is an a**hole" anecdotes, there's some really fascinating stuff in there - you see that Isaacson portrays Jobs as having two key strengths.

      The first was that Jobs had a strong intuition about what people wanted (e.g. a mass-market GUI computer with the Mac or a fully licensed, easy-to-use music download store with iTunes, etc.) so he pushed for Apple to build those things where they previously didn't exist. That's why he's cited as "innovative" even though other people did the actual work. The second was that he was a perfectionist - to the point of near-insanity actually - so he pushed people really hard to build stuff that it was so good that people didn't just like it, (some) people LOVED it... hence the Cult of Mac, etc. Very few if any big companies these days have perfectionists at the helm who insist they make things "insanely great" or don't make them at all, and that's why he was unique.

      The flipside to this is that, as Isaacson repeatedly shows, Jobs was more or less a complete fail as a human being. The book is pretty clear that his infantile and sociopathic behavior was tolerated throughout his life precisely because he was so good at the other two things, and it built his legacy at the expense of his ever "growing up" into a decent person. So it's a really nuanced picture of the guy and very very much worth a read if you're interested in a more sophisticated view of Jobs than "he didn't do anything but market shiny things and yell at people."

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    22. Re:Innovation in perspective by tsa · · Score: 1

      You almost convinced me to buy the book! Good work, thank you!

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    23. Re:Innovation in perspective by Machtyn · · Score: 1

      I don't like Steve Jobs and the way he ran his company and treated his employees/customers. Having said that, I wouldn't simplify SJobs down to a salesman. He was a great motivator. He was able to move entire industries. And Silicon Valley remained where it is as a tech giant city due, in part, to Steve Jobs and Apple. If he had been anywhere else, that anywhere else would be like Seattle, WA - which is no slouch in the tech world.

    24. Re:Innovation in perspective by hitmark · · Score: 1

      Redesign? Reads to me like drag and drop, something that has been with mouse based GUI since day one. Hell, how long have Apple used dragging and dropping the optical media icon to the trash bin as the eject media action? Reads to me like he is just reminding them about KISS. Thing is that when it comes to Apple, KISS ends up meaning that all users are locked out of tweaking the options. The proverbial hood is welded shut...

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    25. Re:Innovation in perspective by hitmark · · Score: 1

      The Parc people knew what they had, but the Xerox board on the other hand...

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    26. Re:Innovation in perspective by evilpenguin · · Score: 1

      Yes, but he also wasn't Jonas Salk or Ghandi or Pasteur or Einstein or Justus von Liebig or any of a thousand others who had far greater impact of human life and culture and health. He had a brilliant design sense and he was a brilliant marketer but this whole "He changed the WORLD!" thing is more than a little overblown.

      He made better gadgets and made a metric crapload of money doing it. More power to him, but his contributions are incremental and not terribly important.

    27. Re:Innovation in perspective by SlippyToad · · Score: 1

      Jobs wasn't a designer. All of Apple's designs were done by others. He just chose the ones he liked.

      All of these analyses fail because they try to label Jobs as some kind of worker. He wasn't. Jobs didn't DO anything. He WAS the leader of what amounts to a very strange technology cult. A cult of personality that accepted the very bad design flaws and hysterical screw-ups that epitomized Apple products.

      I remember about 1995 or so working as an office temp and finding that my Mac that they made me work on kept crashing after I'd used it for awhile. I was told, literally, that I wasn't working correctly. For some stupid reason, if I wanted to launch an app I went to the shortcut on the desktop where it was meant to be launched from. Apparently unlike a well-behaved Windows app, (even then) a Mac would keep launching instances of the app until it flat-out ran out of memory.

      Whenever I have to listen to tiresome Apple propaganda about how much better it is, I remember that.

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    28. Re:Innovation in perspective by SvnLyrBrto · · Score: 1

      Jobs was not taking all the credit for Ive's work. If you'd actually watch Jobs' keynotes, or even look at Apple's various design-related press materials, you'd see the prodigious amount of praise and credit that Apple in general, and Jobs in particular, regularly would heap upon Ive.

      Of course that would require you to set aside the "Apple is evil and Steve Jobs is satan" mantra and sully your eyes and ears by actually going over to apple.com and watching some of the videos there. So I guess we'll just have to say that Ives, the completely unsung and unrecognized by anyone hero, was placated by the huge salary and stock grants that go along with his position.

      --
      Imagine all the people...
    29. Re:Innovation in perspective by tibit · · Score: 1

      I think that, given the number of imitators, what he did was in fact technology-world changing in a way. Not new-science world-changing of way, but design- and usability-changing. Whatever you may say about something as "simple" as Time Machine, even that is probably the first time ever you had such functionality available, in a user-accessible way. With all the backups indexed, no less. I'm no stranger to setting up backups on various breeds of machines, and of course know about rsync --link-dest, but Time Machine presents it in such a way that I don't have to cringe when using it. Not having to worry about the most mundane things has its pluses, you know.

      That includes my pet peeve: sleep-on-lid-close on laptops. Every year around Christmas I do a survey of a nearby MicroCenter and Best-Buy, and it's not very reassuring to say the least. The trend points upwards -- more and more machines are doing the right thing by default, but it's still not what you would expect: that every damn laptop out there goes to sleep and resumes without you having endure beeps, having to press something (what?), etc.

      There is something to be said for attention to detail in usability, and I think that Apple has been doing more than OK in that department while Jobs was in charge. It's still not an everyday thing, you know, even though it SHOULD BE.

      --
      A successful API design takes a mixture of software design and pedagogy.
    30. Re:Innovation in perspective by epyT-R · · Score: 1

      steve jobs didn't create the personal computer industry. give me a break. however the design over functionality thing he had down pat.

    31. Re:Innovation in perspective by epyT-R · · Score: 1

      doom was ported to the mac a bit later.. it didn't help apple much.

    32. Re:Innovation in perspective by epyT-R · · Score: 1

      of course.. he's not comparing the sales of individual vendors. he's comparing the sales of two differentiated products.. one is a computer running windows (or other), and the other, OSX, sitting in a shiny white case.

    33. Re:Innovation in perspective by epyT-R · · Score: 1

      1. engineers designed apple products too.
      2. 'human connection' = emotional special pleading

      his design over function mentality may appeal to people who want single use baubles, but they are derivative baubles at best. he was not this insane innovator these types of customers say he was.

    34. Re:Innovation in perspective by CrackedButter · · Score: 1

      Yes, drag and drop and a whole room of designers didn't figure that out. Chillout and enjoy whatever you use that obviously isn't a Mac.

      As a Mac user, there isn't anything I feel locked out of compared to a Windows or Linux user. You should cite examples, you know, to make your argument stronger.

    35. Re:Innovation in perspective by mattack2 · · Score: 1

      Reads to me like drag and drop, something that has been with mouse based GUI since day one.

      Actually, it hasn't been there since day one, and that in fact brings up a useful point for the incorrect belief of "all Apple did was copy Xerox' ideas".

      Apple added the drag & drop metaphor.
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_graphical_user_interface#Apple_Lisa_and_Macintosh_.28and_later.2C_the_Apple_IIgs.29

      However, the Apple work extended PARC's considerably, adding manipulatable icons, a fixed drop-down menu bar and drag&drop manipulation of objects in the file system (see Macintosh Finder) for example.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drag%26drop

    36. Re:Innovation in perspective by Skuld-Chan · · Score: 1

      (speaking from actual experience here) People don't really like Doom slideshows - which is what it was unless you had a $30,000 dollar Mac.

    37. Re:Innovation in perspective by tsa · · Score: 1

      But what always amazes me is how far Jobs and Gates (don't get me started about Ballmer) were apart in the way they looked at technology. Steve tried to use it to make the world a better place and Gates tried to use it to earn money. Seeing Gates go about his business now in fighting malaria and such I wonder sometimes if he really liked doing MS. He seems to be much happier now.

      --

      -- Cheers!

    38. Re:Innovation in perspective by hitmark · · Score: 1

      messenger vs message?

      --
      comment first, facts later. http://chem.tufts.edu/AnswersInScience/RelativityofWrong.htm
    39. Re:Innovation in perspective by dskzero · · Score: 1

      Am I missing a really wonderful joke here?

      --
      Oblivion Awaits
  12. religion by Hazel+Bergeron · · Score: 2, Insightful

    This is how a religion starts.

    1. Re:religion by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      This religion started long before the messiah's death.

    2. Re:religion by Nidi62 · · Score: 2

      Hey, it's still an improvement over scientology.

      --
      The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for it to be pitted against a slightly greater evil
    3. Re:religion by silmarilwest · · Score: 1

      Steve Jobs appeared to me in a dream and told me where to find 3 gold tablets he had buried.

    4. Re:religion by Hazel+Bergeron · · Score: 1

      Clearly I am a favoured acolyte. His words appeared to me in a vintage computing magazine and told me about 10,000 buried Icons of the Daughter of God.

  13. So what ... by slydder · · Score: 1

    ... it's not like it matters now what happens with the 4S. At least not in Germany

    1. Re:So what ... by CheerfulMacFanboy · · Score: 2

      ... it's not like it matters now what happens with the 4S. At least not in Germany

      Bunkum. Apple Germany can still sell phones in Germany - only Apple Inc. can't, but they never did.

      --
      Fandroids hate facts.
    2. Re:So what ... by slydder · · Score: 1

      actually the more interesting part of the deal is that Apple has to pay Moto damages dating back to april 2003. http://www.scribd.com/doc/71622154/11-11-04-Default-Judgment-for-MMI-Against-Apple

    3. Re:So what ... by Asic+Eng · · Score: 1

      Apple Germany can still sell phones in Germany - only Apple Inc. can't, but they never did.

      That's very dubious, but as the article points out: even if Apple's interpretation were to hold up, it should be trivial for Motorola to have the injunction extended to Apple Germany.

    4. Re:So what ... by CheerfulMacFanboy · · Score: 1

      actually the more interesting part of the deal is that Apple has to pay Moto damages dating back to april 2003. http://www.scribd.com/doc/71622154/11-11-04-Default-Judgment-for-MMI-Against-Apple

      Not if the patents belong to the GSM standard, and instead Google gets slapped for patent abuse like Samsung is about to. http://www.google.de/search?q=samsung+eu+patent+abuse&hl=de&client=firefox-a&hs=nrP&rls=org.mozilla:de:official&prmd=imvns&source=lnms&tbm=nws&ei=zNa3Tr0HyYniBM6hpd8D&sa=X&oi=mode_link&ct=mode&cd=5&ved=0CBoQ_AUoBA&biw=1560&bih=1304

      --
      Fandroids hate facts.
    5. Re:So what ... by UnknowingFool · · Score: 1

      Well if you actually read and understood the whole story, Motorola sued both Apple Inc, and it's German subsidiary, Apple Germany. Apple Inc never answered the suit as it does not actually sell products in Germany. Apple Germany does. Thus Apple Inc lost due to summary judgement. The case still goes on with Apple Germany and has not been settled.

      --
      Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
    6. Re:So what ... by CheerfulMacFanboy · · Score: 1

      Apple Germany can still sell phones in Germany - only Apple Inc. can't, but they never did.

      That's very dubious, but as the article points out: even if Apple's interpretation were to hold up, it should be trivial for Motorola to have the injunction extended to Apple Germany.

      Apple's interpretation? Apple wasn't even heard at this hearing. When they are, they will tell the judge about FRAND patents, and Google will get into the same trouble as Samsung is getting right now.

      --
      Fandroids hate facts.
  14. Promises, promises by Zubinix · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Cringely reached his peak during the making of "Triumph of the Nerds" and the follow up series "Nerds 2.0.1". They were both some of the best historical documentaries ever done on the PC and Internet revolutions. Since then he has failed to deliver on subsequent projects.

    Here's hoping there is one more great documentary series left in the old Cringe!

    1. Re:Promises, promises by Gumbercules!! · · Score: 1

      ...and his name isn't even Robert X Cringley! :-)

      (It's Mark Stevens).

  15. A call to all Slashdotters by martas · · Score: 4, Interesting

    If you are as sick of Apple/Steve Jobs stories as I am, there is only one thing you can do -- vote with your clicks! Resist the temptation to click on the stories and post comments, even if your comment is going to be "I am sick of Apple/Steve Jobs stories." Yes, I know, I'm violating my own advice right now, but I though it was worth it to get this message out. From now on, I will in no way interact with any Slashdot story about Apple or Jobs, unless it is truly interesting.

    1. Re:A call to all Slashdotters by antdude · · Score: 1

      /. needs a up/down votes system for posted (queued) stories.

      --
      Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
    2. Re:A call to all Slashdotters by asylumx · · Score: 1

      Yes! We will follow your lead and not read or comment on Steve Jobs articles, just like you are demonstrating here!

      Actually, I clicked the link thinking "Jobs" as in "Work opportunities" and not as in "Steve" I was quite disappointed when I read the rest of the summary.

  16. What a lucky man. by Elbart · · Score: 1

    He (or his colleague) _just_ found the tape two days after Jobs died.
    What a coincidence! :)

  17. A brick and mortar theater? by paiute · · Score: 3, Funny

    If only we had a way to distribute audiovisual files to people. Oh well, maybe in the 21st century.

    --
    If Slashdot were chemistry it would look like this:Cadaverine
    1. Re:A brick and mortar theater? by hedwards · · Score: 1

      Yeah, well, I think the hold up here was that Steve was concerned that people would have to decide when to hit pause and when to hit play and what on earth they should do with the volume. So, they took those choices away and made folks go to the theater to see it.

  18. I wonder... by gedeco · · Score: 1

    The interview has been missing for years. Nobody even cared about it.

    Follow the money?

  19. Re:Slashdot is rapidly going downhill by delinear · · Score: 1

    He physically hurt no-one.

    Yeah, I heard Chinese sweatshops are actually fun to work in.

  20. Cult by ThatsNotPudding · · Score: 1

    And so it begins: The Cult of Jobs

  21. uhhh by mevets · · Score: 1

    How will you know if its truly interesting?

    1. Re:uhhh by martas · · Score: 1

      I will guess based on summaries, and aim to err on the side of missing interesting stories rather than reading uninteresting ones; revolutionary approach, huh?

    2. Re:uhhh by tomhudson · · Score: 1

      How will you know if it's interesting?

      I will guess based on summaries,

      You MUST be new here ...

  22. Re:Slashdot is rapidly going downhill by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Well don't watch any tv sports then, because with that logic, every athlete who gets sponsored by a sports wear company is aiding Nike, Addidas et al who are famous for their child labour and appalling treatment of staff. Jobs didn't run the factories in China. Nutjob communists do!

  23. Starts? by mevets · · Score: 1

    There is already a book in the old testament about him; I think the religion started quite a bit ago.

    It is an ok read, but doesn't mention Apple, macintosh or iPods explicitly. An earlier book in the series has a bit about apples and the 'tree of knowledge'.

    I don't think it is meant to be taken literally. The whole bit about the righteous suffering is obviously a poke at windows users; and satan is obviously a stand-in for billg. I don't get who God represents - maybe Gerstner?

    Overall, a +1, it certainly isn't as dreary as watching Cringely suck off a dead man.

  24. Lost?? Really?? by ultral0rd · · Score: 1

    So, are we all just meant to believe that this guy lost it back in 1995 and took almost 16 years to find it? (Amazingly just after Job's death?) Not only that, but is also ready for commercial use? (I doubt they are going to play the RAW interview..)

  25. Shares refusal? by yokerbloke · · Score: 1

    Is this the same Cringely guy who turned down the shares at the beginning of Apple starting up? No wonder he's milking this for all it's worth.

    1. Re:Shares refusal? by mzs · · Score: 1

      Yes it's the same guy, but I've only ever heard him tell that story.

  26. Re:Slashdot is rapidly going downhill by m.ducharme · · Score: 1

    Tell you what; how about you go around your home and throw out everything that was made in a sweatshop, Chinese or otherwise. Then come back and tell me what you have left.

    --
    Rule of Slashdot #0: You and people like you are not representative of the larger population. - A.C.
  27. Re:Slashdot is rapidly going downhill by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 1

    Name all the other companies using that factory... without looking it up.

    While you're being silent in an attempt to appear too busy to reply to such a pointless post, pause for a moment to consider that the only reason you latched onto the plight of those overworked people was because it makes Apple look bad.

    --

    "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

  28. Re:Cringely making money of Jobs death? by Asic+Eng · · Score: 1

    Or maybe he thinks Jobs is an exception rather than the rule and would prefer his kids to finish college. Anyway, he is a journalist, he earns money selling interviews amongst other things. Regardless whether you like him or not: why should he give away his work for free?

  29. Latex by AtomicDevice · · Score: 1

    All audience members will also be provided with a life-like latex cast of steve's balls to gargle.

    --
    Ze Atomic Device! It iz Ztolen!
  30. Re:...this is by hedwards · · Score: 1

    That would carry somewhat more weight if he hadn't been whoring it out for the better part of 3 decades.

  31. Cringely explains why on his blog by beetle496 · · Score: 2

    Cringely explains why on his blog: Seeking a final resolution

    Also, he talks about technical bits about the digitization.

    --
    I paid the going retail price for a Windows screen reader and got a free Unix computer!
  32. Re:Slashdot is rapidly going downhill by Waffle+Iron · · Score: 1

    Name all the other companies using that factory... without looking it up.

    The difference is that most other companies don't tout that smug, righteous attitude that makes them look like huge hypocrites when they hire sweatshops.

  33. Re:Slashdot is rapidly going downhill by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 1

    That's your justification? "It's terrible that these people are working in such horrible conditions that they kill themselves, but if the company that makes my blinky thing is humble about it they're forgiven."

    Well, I appreciate your honesty at least.

    --

    "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

  34. Re:Slashdot is rapidly going downhill by Waffle+Iron · · Score: 1

    It would appear that a reality distortion field has altered your perception of what I said.

    I didn't say that anything resembling the words you put in my mouth. I'm just pointing out which companies look especially hypocritical, and which don't.

    For the record, I'm an anti "free trade" type, and I would support stiff tariffs on imports to counteract the disadvantages that US companies have paying for decent wages, acceptable working conditions, environmental and safety costs. But since few in this country agree with me, in the meantime at least I can point out turtleneck-wearing hypocrites.

  35. Re:Slashdot is rapidly going downhill by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 1

    It would appear that a reality distortion field has altered your perception of what I said.

    That's interesting because you apparently didn't get my point, either. You're using 'reality distortion' to promote your hate. Which is fine, really, I mean I'm not above that either. You're just nailing one of your feet to the floor and spinning in circles.

    --

    "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

  36. Gag Me by MarkvW · · Score: 1

    Enough Already!

  37. Re:Cringely making money of Jobs death? by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 1

    What's wrong with making money off Jobs' death? Apple made a ton, and so did his biographer.

    Not just his biographer - I'd be stunned if his family wasn't collecting a large percentage of the profits from the biography.

    --
    My God, it's Full of Source!
    OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
  38. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 1

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  39. Re:Slashdot is rapidly going downhill by MikeBabcock · · Score: 1

    *snicker* ... cause I don't have mod points today lol

    --
    - Michael T. Babcock (Yes, I blog)
  40. Nonsense. Read the biography for the big picture by guidryp · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I just wish there were stories that put his innovation into perspective: he didn't do anything other than latch onto others creations and sell it.

    Read the Biography. Jobs was much more than a salesman. He was intimately involved with the design of products from the Mac forward. Starting with the Mac he was constantly insisting on changes to the radius of curves in the plastic, he made so many suggestions about the design of the Mac Calculator that the engineer wrote a Calculator Construction kit, so Jobs could tweak the design until it was just right (which he did and this was the calculator for the next decade).

    These are just a couple of anecdotes, and there are many out there, but it isn't the anecdotes that bring this home. You really need to read the biography to really understand the bigger picture of Steve Jobs.

    Calling him just a salesman, is pure ignorance in action. Jobs was more intimately involved in product design than any CEO of his generation.

  41. Simply rationalizing his money grab. by guidryp · · Score: 1

    Not much why there. It looks more like rationalizing beating this dead horse showing 288 line analog VHS upconvert in a movie theater. Showing it in the theater gets more buzz (witness stories like this) for further monetizing it.

    I find it quite distasteful.

  42. I'll watch it when.. by lizardb0y · · Score: 1

    ..it comes out on DRM-free digital distribution using patent unencumbered codecs.

  43. Especially for audio by swb · · Score: 1

    Some of my all-time favorite music is poor quality live recordings.

    There's a 3 disc Velvet Underground live album (Quine Tapes, volume 1) that is just mind-blowing, despite being some of the worst audio quality I've ever heard on a commercial disc release (IIRC, it was recorded on a stereo reel-reel and transfered to cassette at some point in the 1970s when the original open reel tapes started falling apart).

    I have a couple of other bootlegs that might be worse, but not many. It seems like since the late 1980s that either audience recordings got a lot better or the bootlegs that bubble to the surface are soundboard sourced.

    But even then, the mixes aren't always great for normal stereo reproduction or there's generational loss.

  44. Re:Cringely making money of Jobs death? by siddesu · · Score: 1

    It all depends on how we will share the profits. Drop me a note and we'll figure something out.

  45. Re:Slashdot is rapidly going downhill by epyT-R · · Score: 1

    LEAVE...BRITNEY ALLOOAAANNUH!!!!!!

    offensive? almost everything is offensive to at least one person somewhere.. you aren't suggesting censorship are you? grow a hide, coward. I'm glad some people here aren't weak willed cultists. the guy was a business man sure but there are plenty of those. he was also a grade A asshole to a lot of the people who actually built the products his company sold. that coupled with his design > usefulness mentality are what get him bad raps on tech oriented sites. perhaps it is you who isn't tech oriented.