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Another Raspberry Pi? $49 ARM Single-Board Computer With Android
n7ytd writes "Announced today and running on an 800 MHz VIA core, the 170 x 85mm 'APC' is expected to ship this July. It has 2GB of flash storage and 512MB of DDR3 memory. 'A modified version of Google Android 2.3 uses up most of that 2GB of flash storage, but there are external storage options. On the back I/O is a microSD slot, and of course you could hook in an external USB 2.0 drive. VIA spent a lot of time customizing Android to enable keyboard and mouse support which natively it does not support. ... On the I/O panel you get VGA output, HDMI output (up to 720p playback with hardware acceleration), four USB 2.0 ports, gigabit LAN and audio out and microphone in.' With a 'Neo ITX' form factor, VIA touts the single-board computer as a 'bicycle for your mind.'"
Can't run Qt? Can't be a Pi.
VIA spent a lot of time customizing Android to enable keyboard and mouse support which natively it does not support.
Uhm, I'm no expert, but I've plugged a USB keyboard and mouse into my Android 2.3 phone and both were recognized and usable instantly.
Kinda wierd to be releasing a product in 2012 that won't play 1080 video. I certainly wouldn't like a desktop on a 1280x720 display.
Some sites say the chip can do 1080, others only claim 720p. And if they are putting it on a *-ITX form factor would a SATA port have killed em to add? Any existing case will have this little guy rattling around in it, might as well have the option to put a small drive in. Sure Android probably won't use it but how many hours does anyone think it will take to get a more normal Linux distro on it?
Democrat delenda est
'A computer is a bicycle for your mind' was his line circa 1981. Don't know who he stole it from, but I'm sure he did.
John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
but I assume "PC" and VIA mean x86?
Supplies!
Step one: Locate a version of Windows that runs on ARM processors.
Step two: Locate a version of Crysis that runs on an ARM processor.
No need for a step three until you finish the first two steps.
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Except twice the size, more expensive, and runs an outdated operating system with no room for internal storage, that doesn't yet support a mouse or keyboard. Also, it requires a proprietary power supply. But otherwise, just like it.
-Arthur
Cave ne ante ullas catapultas ambules
An 800MHz cpu and 512MB of ram? Why these days, I have more processing power than that in my phone... Oh, wait.
This sounds nice for a subcompact PC but with the advent of apps on Blu Ray players and embedded in TVs and everywhere else (including phones) with the same or better features, what is the real application for this? I doubt many of the existing Android apps will be a whole lot of fun on this thing. Is there a real market to have for $49 what you could build for $149 and have 3-5x the cpu? The only unique thing is the OS, but even that is hard to make a lot out of unless there are desktop Android apps out there. Are you going to sit and code apps for a $49 widget?
While not as small as the Rasp Pi, it seems pretty cool. Old School VGA connector.
Of course, you need a real OS on it.
Decently cheap, I like the direction this is going.
Be seeing you...
Raspberry Pi is first and foremost meant for hardware hacking which is quite obvious from the generous amounts of GPIO, I2C et. al. connectors on it. This thing lacks all that and is apparently aimed more at half-assed HTPC-tasks.
Even on the hardware-side this one is quite lacking. Yes, 4 USB2.0 - ports and a Gigabit ethernet are good features to have, but then they're paired with a measly 720p video output? What do you need all that bandwidth for if you can't even do full 1080p? In theory it could be used for data-processing or such, but then again, the thing would need more RAM and faster CPU for that. Well, it will make for a quite useable small box for running emulators and watching low-quality media, like e.g. YouTube videos.
Whatever. I can see myself replacing $300 wyse terminals with these.
There's only one who will dare give the raspberry...
In case of fire, do not use elevator. Use water!
Do you have any idea how much that would increase the cost of this device?
This device is not getting talked about because it is a great computer substitute, but because it is cheap. Take away cheap and this has no market.
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I don't care about video output, a serial port would be just fine. What I DO care about is D/A-A/D I/O - even a sound subsystem would be fine. The PI is missing this. The VIA board seems to have it, if the color of the ports are any indication of it. More USB is good too. I want a decent SBC for various apps, that has good I/O. A bonus would be lower power consumption, which I imagine this has, but what I probably won't get is extended temperature ranges.
Step four: Profit?
VIA spent a lot of time customizing Android to enable keyboard and mouse support which natively it does not support.
yes, it does.
Naw, step four is laugh when it runs at 1 frame per minute.
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Oh, I'm familiar with the turn-based variant of Crysis.
Now this is how a real board looks. All the outward facing connectors are on one edge. The connectors are of types suitable for external connections, properly mounted hard to the board. The board has mounting holes.
There will probably be additional models. Note that the silk screen shows spaces for two more ICs that aren't populated here.
It's even assembled in Great Britain.
So as long as it has a cool name you'll use it, even if it just plain sucks ass?
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No 1080p hardware decode/encode?
Pi > 'APC'
Dammit, I'm begging you to mod this up! Do it for the tears in my eyes as I struggle to type this laughing out loud...
uhm...
Actually, it isn't all that cheap. It is a motherboard with onboard video. Unlike the multitude of x86 motherboards selling for under $50 every day at a hundred different outlets this one comes with a lowball CPU and half a Gig of RAM soldered down. But on the other hand this product consumes a fraction of the board space, probably only needs at most four layers and skips the expensive ZIF socket and attachment hardware for a processor, the memory sockets, PCI/PCIe sockets, etc.
And Via should be large enough to produce in volume, unlike the charity making the Pi so that excuse vanishes. No, this isn't all that great a bargain. On the other hand if you want an ARM motherboard it isn't like you have many other choices to pick from right now. And if you need low power you can't beat em.
Democrat delenda est
and install BSD+IpCop on it. That would make a killer cheap firewall device.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Without the GNU userland it's a consumer toy.
Even if one accepts it purely as an android box, what would possess them to use 2.3, rather than ICS which isn't a total mess on larger screens?
Chevy sold a car named "doesnt go" car in mexico.
Their fault for calling it a No va!
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
FTFA: "a bicycle for your mind". The tires are huge to support the weight. Overall too heavy to pedal. I need to trailer it everywhere. Due to copyright restrictions, I can only ride^H^H trailer it around Oracle's campus unless I agree to a 5 year license based on the number spokes on the wheels and size of the tires. I can pull off one wheel to save money, but then I need to purchase the 10-year license instead of the 5.
Join the Slashcott! Feb 10 thru Feb 17!
Point me at a X86 Motherboard with processor that runs on 5 watts of power like this does.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
If you're not willing to fork out for a proper NAS or a more expensive board with SATA ports, you can always use dual external drives with USB. Sure there's a speed penalty, but it's certainly functional.
Depends if NOVA or Shadowgun work on ARMv6 devices. If not they'll be filtered out. There are a fair smattering of v6 phones but mostly low spec so I doubt the high performance games bother to target them.
Still sold well in spanish speaking countries.
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> Point me at a X86 Motherboard with processor that runs on 5 watts of power like this does.
This one doesn't either. It can peak out at a little over 13 watts. And I suspect that doesn't include draw on the USB ports. It has four on the rear shield and if that yellow header is for a front mounted pair that brings the power supply needs about thirty watts. Still most excellent but high by phone standards so one has to wonder what is up.
Democrat delenda est
The gertboard for the RPi will have ADC/DAC capability (2 channels, though apparently only up to 12-bit). Alternately, I see USB audio devices starting at $17 or so.
http://pcengines.ch/alix.htm
... of course, it's not going to do what you want, but there you go. :-)
the VIA stuff has RAM (512MB), a small HD/SSD (2GB), and an SD slot. x86 MB+CPU combos usually have neither. so a *working* x86 setup does turn out 2-3 times more expensive, let alone bigger, noisier, and more power-hungry. even the lowliest of x86 will give you a lot more power, I/O, OS choice... though.
The Cloud - because you don't care if your apps and data are up in the air.
... existing Android apps? That's the only reason I can imagine to put Android on something like this, instead of Minix 3.0, TinyCoreLinux, NanoBSD or something else.
yeah, think of the cost savings... you just need a $250 monitor and keyboard :)
Only if it's delayed until July 2013.
Anyone knows if this thing will be powerful enough to run MAME? Or at least powerful enough for all the 2D games?
let the shill do his job and get his paycheck, for the good of the economy!
Good of the economy?
His Microsoft bosses take over Nokia and the stock price tanks. People lose their money and jobs.
Google take over Motorola Mobility and their stock price lifts.
Who's good for the economy? Not Microsoft, that's for sure.
Linux does run on VIA's nano chips
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
> really dumb lockdown decision by RPi it seems to me
No, the really cheap SoC they got their hands on didn't support it. Beggars can't be choosers. On the other hand, VIA's does, probably because they wanted it to and so they made it that way. But the real win is the VIA has a network port that doesn't appear to be just bolted onto a USB bus through a converter. And four (and perhaps a header for two more) USB ports. But the huge difference is 512MB of RAM vs 256MB; especially since at least 64MB has to come out for video and many sources for the Pi are saying if you plan on actually doing 3d or heavy video you will end up splitting it 128/128. Give this board the same 128M for video and you end up with three times the program space, maybe even enough to run a app or two.
If this board had a few spare GPIO pins brought out to a header there really wouldn't be a reason for Pi to exist at this point. Add in the the hard reality that VIA will probably be able to actually ship product near the announced date in whatever quantity you care to order in and that has to count for some extra points in their favor.
And just wait until Win8 ships, bet we see ARM motherboards then with even better specs, stuff good and hefty enough to run Windows on. Of course we will have to wait a few months beyond that so that the usual suspects can jailbreak them before being able to load up a useful OS.
Democrat delenda est
I was hoping to do the same using the thinstation project. http://thinstation.org/ However there isn't a port planned for the Pi yet.
Or wait until someone ports it.
I'm sure someone could make a MUD from it , and that would probably run fine on Raspberry Pi.
Slipping shoelaces ?
This sounds pretty cool, but unfortunately Via have a long, long history of announcing really cool products that then take years to appear, if they ever appear. This is particularly distressing with the EPIA stuff, where you can wait, literally, years after some cool new technology is announced before it's generally available, if it becomes available at all. Something like a SheevaPlug may cost a bit more, but then it's available right now and has an active dev community going for it.
If you want a good, relatively cheap general purpose computer, get an AMD Zacate system either as a netbook or, a mini-ITX system with some 120€ 1080p display.
That has about nothing to do with his point. Initial cost is not particularly driven by wattage. His point was that ~50 dollar x86 boards exist (though I think he is overly optimistic to say the price can include processor and memory). Even ignoring the cpu and memory, x86 boards incur more than enough complexity to offset the cost-add of an ARM chip and 512MB of memory. To support pci-e slots and a couple of DDR3 sockets, traces get significantly more complicated. To support a pluggable CPU, a much more expensive processor interconnect is used. The memory+cpu is probably cheaper than the average southbridge on a motherboard anyway.
So the question is not of 'value', the question is 'cost'. Lower power consumption adds value, but in this case doesn't really change the cost part of the equation.
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
If this board had a few spare GPIO pins brought out to a header there really wouldn't be a reason for Pi to exist at this point.
Except that it costs twice as much and draws more power, so it you don't need all the extra functionality it's a waste of money and electricity.
Not that I'm saying it's not needed. There probably will be a larger, more expensive version of the Raspberry Pi.
Of all major operating systems, UNIX is the only one originally meant for gaming.
That, and the other pet peeve of mine is that pi isn't really "pie" [pai], as in the bakery product, but "pi" [pi] (modern) or [pei] (ancient Greek). This incredibly lame attempt at humor is obviously lost on most people.