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Iran Claims New Cyber Attack On Its Nuclear Plants, Blames US and Allies
judgecorp writes "Iran has reported that its nuclear facilities are under a sustained cyber attack which it blames on the U.S., UK and Israel. America and Israel created Stuxnet, and have been accused of starting the Flame worm." And once a country admits that it's created such software, publicly deflecting such blame gets a lot harder.
I'm pretty sure you've figured out by now that the U.S. and Israel are trying to sabotage your nuclear program. If the numerous targeted computer viruses didn't clue you in, you must have at least noticed the dead bodies of your nuclear scientists starting to pile up.
Don't you know there's a war on, son?
What political party do you join when you don't like Bible-thumpers *or* hippies?
No one "officially" has admitted to Flames, Stuxnet, or otherwise. It's always some anonymous source, or former (apparently the current ones are too busy to give interviews) official.
Nuclear reactors should be secure through not using Windows and not connecting to the Internet. Anything short of that is doing it wrong.
Case in point, the CANDU reactors in Canada run QNX4 (QNX2?) for their control systems are are not Internet-connected, so there's really nothing to hack.
Your nuclear weapons program for enriching uranium was fucked up because of a computer virus.
You know what DOESN'T need highly enriched uranium? CANDU and Throrium reactors. Gee, I wonder why Iran isn't interested in those, the only difference is that they can't be used to make nuclear weapons...
Where has once have the government admit they created it? Both links are just basically from David Sanger and his book where the first link is an article by him and the 2nd link an adaptation of the story-line from his book (which they state at the very bottom of the article).
I'd hardly call that the government admitting it when it's more like an accusation from someone with possible inside sources. Nowhere in any of these articles has there even been a comment made by the US government. If you are gonna report on something, at least put the correct viewpoint on it. All these "confirmation" articles are just articles respinning the story made by Sanger.
As for it's validity, could be true, could be false. But i definitely don't like the way it's being told. It's more akin to being told a fantasy novel then an actual news report. They don't even have quotes from their sources stated specifically. The entire story is told in a mix of imagination and (possible) facts which aren't clear.
Iran is such a great country, I love how they act like my country is still important.
Isn't kind of a bad idea to deliberately mess up controlling computers in a nuclear plant?
I get that Iran has a deserved reputation for abusing their neighbors, but if the US causes a meltdown, then we're in the wrong.
Always going forward, 'cause we can't find reverse.
Of course, the easiest way to disrupt our network communications is still a well placed physical disruption.
It's called a Slashdotting. Pioneered it, back in the day.
Shai Schticks:"You don't make peace with friends, you make peace with enemies"
Israel spies on the US a hell of a lot. So on one hand it seems like a Faustian bargain for the NSA or CIA to get in bed with Mossad.
[Sir Garlon] is the marvellest knight that is now living, for he destroyeth many good knights, for he goeth invisible.
Bottom line is, it isn't the way to go in war. Fair war, is to offer an ultimatum (IE stop develoment of nukes or we will take action). Send in drones or whatever etc... Claiming we are at peace, then sending in random cyber attacks on nuklear systems, which for all we know could backfire and say... set off a nuclear reaction killing who knows how many scientists and civilians. Really if we do it the backdoor way, how is that tactic any more moral than say, flying a plane into a large populated building? The methods matter, especially when we are talking countries in which the public is brainwashed, and the governments are looking for any form of propoganda to convince them that america is evil. When we give them solid evidence we are evil, we are essentially creating terrorists on their side.
Nukes! Especially crazy psychotic dumbasses building them like North Korea and Iran.
Crazy Psychotic dumbasses building them like USA, UK, France, India, pakistan, Russia, China - If you are responsible for builiding them, then you're a crazy psychotic dumbass regardless of your Country of Origin, citizenship, gender or political beleifs.
(On the other hand, in Iran's eyes, they may think the US has declared war.)
Think about it. Iranian govt coddles you and makes a national hero out of you. Unlimited clandestine budget. Bask in glory if things go well. When things go bad you have a ready made credible scape goat available.
sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
I don't even grasp why you'd do that.
That said, I believe the first wave of worms were spread around locally... That is, someone physically connected to machines inside their operations and intentionally spread the infection. There are more then a few Iranians that don't want the Ayatollah to have a bomb.
I've decided to stop wasting my time responding to AC trolls/sockpuppets... so if you want a response from me... login.
Step 1: Reintroduce the draft & begin mandatory mil service for persons aged 18-50.
Step 2: Train...
Step 3: Invade Iran & North Korea simultaneously
Step 4: Once both nations have been acquired, fly our flag over each and begin the process of transforming both nations into a larger America, like we should've done with Iraq instead of any pull out.
What is this, the third time now? Usually you institute rules like "No browsing porn on the centrifuge control computers" after the first time. Maybe your scientists realize that if they start producing anything bomb-worthy, Israel will come in and flatten their facility, likely killing them all in the process. So maybe they just tell you "Oh! Those filthy Americans infected our computers again!" and go back to playing Tetris for another couple of years.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
The beauty of these software attacks is that the Iranians cannot trust most of the numbers the computers are showing. Not just on the control side of things but also the specialized equipment that assays, say, the purity of the uranium isotopes. So they would have to go back and redo the assay with equipment that they really can't be sure is accurate.
The USA hasn't built a new warhead since the Cold War ended, and its current arsenal is about 25% of its peak size.
Gamingmuseum.com: Give your 3D accelerator a rest.
+1 It's sad how effective social engineering is. I wouldn't put it past psyops to do something similar.
And once a country admits that it's created such software, publicly deflecting such blame gets a lot harder.
The link leads to another /. article, which leads to another, etc, until it eventually lands at this NY Times article.
This article is not an admission by anyone regarding Stuxnet, Flame, or anything else. It just allegedly quotes a bunch of anonymous sources about supposed top secret information.
I promise I don't work for the federal government.
A recently drafted cyber strategy formulated by the U.S. Department of Defense (DoD) classifies digital sabotage as an act of war.
Here's a fact: The U.S. and Israel have started war against Iran. I don't remember congress ever approving this war, I don't remember the public ever being notified that our country is now at war with yet another country, despite being unable to pay for the half dozen other wars we're currently engaged in. This is completely unacceptable.
Imagine the number of "click here to remove your virus" programs Iran has downloaded trying to remove Stuxnet/Flame before they knew what it was. They've probably got so many backdoors on their network now they'll never get it totally clean.
Join the Slashcott! Feb 10 thru Feb 17!
Quickest way to tuff guy status? take Credit for someone else work. Guy drops dead all of a suddent take credit for his death, even if you had nothing to do with it. The US and Isreal are riding this wave that now everytime something in the cyber world drops dead its because they did it, no matter what happens, even if they are just as suprised as everyone else. This plays well into the Iranians need to blame their inability to produce anything in their nuclear program on someone else. We would have had a Bomb if it was not for those medling kids!
I can say without a doubt that their is no Goverment Service worker that could have produced Stuxnet or Flame. I doubt it was a US contractor. They would have worked on it for sure, but they would have never delivered a final product and had that gravy train dry up.
I have a strong feeling that all this "accidental" leaking is just a way to take credit without actually claiming you took credit.
So when the iranians claim another attack I take it with a grain of salt. To many people have to much at stake claiming that something happend. Having something actually happen is besides the point.
Papa Legba come and open the gate
With every news flash about yet another cyber attack on their nuclear facilities I wonder why they are plugged to the Internet in the first place. They are few, they are located nearby, and their research is of the highest priority for Iran. Is it so costy for them to create a single-purpose government-maintained isolated local network that would solve all their problems?
Don't think they are motivated by patriotism, so it just makes the Game more interesting.
The CIA and NSA have been in bed with Mossad for decades. This is hardly something new.
What political party do you join when you don't like Bible-thumpers *or* hippies?
It just allegedly quotes a bunch of anonymous sources about supposed top secret information.
So did Woodward and Bernstein when they wrote about Watergate. You think Nixon issued a press release saying "Yeah, we did break-in."?
What political party do you join when you don't like Bible-thumpers *or* hippies?
Imagine America's reaction had the reverse happened. We'd be bombing Iran back to the stone-age for cyberterrorism.
Considering this insult, Iran has class.
>80 column hard wrapped e-mail is not a sign of intelligent
>life
I think we can all agree that the US and Israel are behind the nasty bugs going around in Iran's nuclear program. What I'm not seeing people putting together is that there are more than Iranian consequences here. Russia is into building these things for billions of dollars. They have a heavily vested interest here. If you fear the hackers in Iran and our infrastructure, then I suggest you consider for a moment the scope and scale of the Russian cyber hacking skills, which may be for hire, and realize we are yanking a tigers tail here.
Unplug everything critical. If you owe your life to it, it's worth needing to be physically present to make it work rather than risking vulnerability over a network. Then just make sure only people you want have physical access. Electronic warfare is simple to defend against, so far, it just takes a little foresight to realize that being fat, lazy, happy, and dead is worse than being a little busier, happy, and alive.
"...And who wants to make buttprints in the sands of time?" ~Bob Moawad
Talk of causing a "meltdown" is idiotic. Enrichment plants produce fuel, failure means no fuel. Power plants consume fuel (by creating a nuclear reaction), and failure could mean an uncontrolled reaction. What happens at that point depends on reactor design - there are an number of failsafes in modern designs. Presumably the Iranians could build a power plant and ignore the basics of safety, but that seems unlikely too.
Its hard for some computer geeks to imagine, but you can build failsafes in devices that do not have or require an electronics at all. Mechanic components that fail at designed temperatures, changes in mass, etc, and mechanically trip a reactor by moving components, dumping in inhibitors, etc. Computers don't control everything.
What is really stupid, most likely Stuxnet was created by some idiot from Israel, who overstepped the boundaries of a simple sabotage operation by making his software capable of spreading itself. Now both US and Israel are trying to take credit for something they did not consider to be acceptable, and incorporate this idiocy into their plans.
Contrary to the popular belief, there indeed is no God.
What comments do you read here? The US is routinely bashed in the comments section. There is an anti-American post worked in to just about every story here. It's almost to the point of being a meme.
ARRGH I feel so incomplete with your last sentence!!!
The more paranoid the organization, the more likely it is to tear itself apart finding a nonexistent saboteur. Looks like we might be due for another big old storm of chaos. (As a Westerner, I certainly hope so :)
Is that a smiley or a bracket??!!?1!!!
http://xkcd.com/541/
Stuxnet was distibuted by USB sticks, or so the theory goes - that's how you get over the sneakernet link. It is unlikely that the control net is directly (with wires) connected to the internet. But, in a facility that employees idiots (and any large facility inevitably will) there will be some guy that brings pr0n, or games, or whatever in to work to entertain themselves, show off, etc. You want your virus to hitch a ride.
It couldn't possibly be to prevent Iran from detonating the first working nuke they can patch together in Jerusalem
I laugh every single time I hear this line of reasoning.
Iran is run by religious nutjobs. I agree with that.
One thing you seem to forget, though...Jerusalem is their holy land too. While they may be nutjobs, they're still religious nutjobs, and blowing up their own holy land is a great way to piss off every member of the three major religions worldwide. Iran would be crushed in the blink of an eye if they actually launched a nuclear attack. They are simply not that stupid and irrational. It would be like Republicans bombing the White House because Obama won the election.
It couldn't possibly be that Iran would want a nuclear weapon so that they can participate in the joy of Mutually Assured Destruction. It couldn't possibly be that multiple world superpowers who have nuclear weapons rattle the saber at them on a monthly basis and that having a nuke of their own might give them some leverage. (or even giving off the appearance of trying to acquire a nuke - that's why Saddam never debunked rumors that he had WMD, because having your enemies think you have WMD generally makes them less likely to attack you)
It couldn't possibly be that the "wipe off the map" comment (which I assume is what you're alluding to) was a mistranslation, considering that idiom doesn't even exist in the Persian language...it couldn't possibly be that the true meaning was "the Israeli regime will be removed from the pages of history", kinda like how the USSR collapsed after the cold war...
Nah. Couldn't possibly be that...
:(){
There's little point at taking the claims in press release like this at face value, even those of the better-quality reuters article http://uk.reuters.com/article/2012/06/21/uk-iran-cyber-nuclear-idUKBRE85K1EG20120621
About the last thing any government will do is to publicly release accurate details --or even accurate general-but-vague statements-- about an attack on a sensitive/classified program, or their response to such an attack. Going into detail about an attack risks providing useful information to one's opponent about how successful the attack was, and how they might need to modify it to improve the next one. Accurately describing your response to an attack --even if just to say that the attack was unable to defeat the "necessary security measures" you took-- will similarly divulge information about your defensive capabilities.
These kinds of releases are simply designed to shape public opinion. Any correlation to the reality of a given situation will simply be incidental. You'd be better off basing your purchases solely upon the information you glean from advertisements.
Your definition of "nuclear facilities" is overlarge
Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
This willful ignorance is breathtaking.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dome_of_the_Rock
Sincerely, General Beringer
The U.S. needs to quit trying to dodge stuff like this and just roll with it - like what the UK cyber team did when they replaced the Al-Qaeda bomb recipe with a recipe for cupcakes. You can turn bad PR into something funny. Any government hack should just all out pwn the target. I suggest they leave a message in all hacked computer: "All your base are belong to U.S."
Civilizations follow patterns. China and India have most often been the "invadee". The Greco-Roman-Euro-US and the Persian and the Turkic (and sometimes the Egyptian) cultures have frequently been invaders.
So no, I think the old Persian culture still lurks in Iran, and given the right conditions, this once great nation could again be an aggressor.
This couldn't be happening to a nicer, or more deserving, rouge state than Iran.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
The US says any cyber attack on american systems is considered an act of war, but they believe they can do it to other countries.. What F-ing hypocrites are they, for me the US has done an act of war against Iran.. Yes, I'm not happy with a country like Iran having nuclear capabilities, but if a country like the US has it, then ANY country has just as much right to it, no matter the regime.. Why aren't they going after Israel with their illegal nuclear weapons? Why aren't they clearing their own nuclear weapons and why are they even developing new nuclear weapons.. How can any other country take anything the US says serious if the US keeps bullying other countries.. These cyber attacks are a real serious threat to innocent iraniers, hell maybe even to surrounding nations. So why even tempt with nuclear installations, that just too dangerous...
Interestingly enough, the United States and Russia, along with Britain and France -- maybe China, maybe not -- refined their fissionable material and built their original atomic bombs w/o the assistance of computers at all, let alone anything like the PCs and control systems of today. Iran seems incapable of this level of engineering.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
No country "admits" they made the software. The linked article is to another slashdot article quoting a washington post article with "anonymous" sources. That's pretty far from "a country" admitting they made the software.
Dear Princess Ahmadinejad,
Non-proliferation, "bonus" software, or Tomahawks. Choose no less than one.
Your faithful adversary,
The Non-Jihadist World
Everybody gets what the majority deserves.
Basically the lesson is Windows is for losers.
Monstar L
Sigh, rah rah linux fanboyism will never contribute to Linux' success -- above all when the premise is mistaken. The Siemens SCADA controller software that Stuxnet targets does not exist for Linux so the point is moot. The Iranians used the Siemens SCADA systems because they were cheap & could normally perform the job instead of having to pour major resources into developing their own from scratch. As the same SCADA controllers are commonly used to control the electrical grid & water treatment facilities. So, given that you presumably use use both doesn't that make you a loser too?
Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
The one that top Israeli and American officials say doesn't exist? Other problems with the Iran-as-boogyman storyline:
The U.S. encouraged Iran to develop nuclear energy when the Shah was in power. For the obvious reason that it would leave Iran free to sell more of it's oil. Modern, puppet-government free Iran has the same motivation.
Israel has 200+ nuclear weapons. And unlike Iran, has started wars and launched dozens of first strikes on it's neighbors.
My guess is that Siemens stupidity in not writing drivers for a real OS is going to cost them a lot of business in the coming years. So yeah, losers.
Monstar L
Listen, I'm generally a critic of Microsoft but you have to recognize reality accusing MS of being lax.where they were not & where Linux is no better does not help Linux.
First off, Siemens developed for windows because mos clients specified that the control platform be delivered on Windows & most that didn't specify a choice were happy with windows.
Secondly, you're saying that they should have developed for Linux when it is clear that the crackers had the resources of a state behind them. The only difference it would have made had the control environment been Linux based instead of windows is that it would be Linux in the news with the "bad security" & not Windows. I have no doubt that even FreeBSD, the only OS to have been globally audited searching for security holes would have fallen.
Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue