Slashdot Mirror
Ask Slashdot: How To Add New Tech To Old Van?
First time accepted submitter Dslice_allstar writes "I have a '77 GMC Van that I would like to take into the 21st century with some good tech. I have several large LCD monitors, and I want to hook at least one up for watching movies and doing some mild PC gaming. I am concerned about power, i.e. using an inverter and not frying the computer every time the van starts/stops, and I'm worried about whether the alternator will support a computer/monitor setup as well as LEDs and the like. Would a UPC backup be a good idea? I would also like to be able to play music over the sound system, preferably off the computer. Should I be thinking mini ITX HTPC, or would a netbook better serve my purposes? How would you all pimp out an old conversion van?"
Adding new tech to a van is OK, if you're into that kind of thing. (Which I am.) But of far more importance is what kind of art you put on your van. Be it a wizard summoning a space unicorn to be ridden by a hot babe, a barbarian protecting hot babes, or an interstellar wizard summoning hot babes for nefarious purposes, van art is what takes your van and gives it that certain je ne sais pas which says, "I am awesome."
In this case, I think you need to consider the technological contents of your van and create a motif based around that. For example, you can have a wizard summoning hot technological Linux cyborg babes. That would be cool. And when you drove down the street, people would be like, "that's cool." And isn't that the real purpose of owning a van?
Hoist Number One and Number Six.
Until you have a read stripe
First, forget about connecting anything to the engine electrical subsystem. You've already identified the issue there, that being the risk of surging the equipment to death.
I would go with an isolated battery stack, a couple low-profile wind turbines and employing a substantial amount of roof area in collecting PV. This would easily accommodate the power requirements of a modern laptop (my Toshiba L755D draws less than 40W under load) and a late-model LCD panel (HP W1907v for example has a max load of 49W). Plenty of power there for an onboard computer, not including the sound system.
Operation Guillotine is in effect.
You should look how amateur radio operators and/or people with RV are setting up thei systems. I think you should stay with a 12V power supply system, an inverter is a more complex system rather than a lead acid battery, and yu'll need a DC/DC inverter for the sound system amplifiers. A mini ITX pc with a 12 power supply it's not a big deal, so a satellite receiver. If you want to be sure to not fry your electronics, use a dual battery setup with a contactor that disconnects the secondary battery from the main circuit when the engine is not running, like RV pepole sometimes are doing, and remenber to flip on the switch when needed, or use an automatic system. If a dual battery system is too much take the supply from the electronics directly from the battery poles, with a suitable fuse on both poles. Put some L-C filters and a big diode in antiparallel to the supply.
Concerning the HTPC/netbook/..., check Zotac (zotac.com). Very small but surprisingly interesting mini PCs.
Do some reading on the 12v systems of blue water sailboats. You'll find that they have a separate circuit for their running system/lights vs their navigational electronics/radar etc.
Generally they run the engine to charge the battery, and when that isn't possible, shore power or wind/solar. They will run the system/nav lights off of one 100ah (50ah real world use) deep cycle battery, and the other system will run off of 1-3 100ah deep cycle batteries, depending on size/budget. This is generally topped off by 1-2 400w solar panels (taking up the space of about a 4x8' sheet of plywood) and/or wind power. Wind power might be an issue in your mom's driveway though.
Also consider upgrading your alternator. Conversion vans typically come with a much higher rated alternator to deal with the additional loads the experience. Tapping in to the existing 12v system is asking for trouble, it's not designed for what you're going to ask of it.
moox. for a new generation.
A while ago Tom's hardware did a series in a solar powered PC... many of the power saving decisions sound relevant to your requirements. The article is still available at http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/hardware-components,1685.html
Forget technology for now.
With an old vehicle, first and foremost it needs to be well looked-after. A well looked after vehicle - even if it's getting on in age - commands respect. A clapped-out rusty biscuit tin on wheels commands scorn, no matter how much technology it may have inside.
Fit bars to the front if it doesn't already have them. You don't want some idiot reversing into you and destroying the grille; I can't imagine parts will be too easy to find for a vehicle that age. Roo bars (the type that don't curve around the side) will probably look best.
Sort out any rust or dents it may have, then give it a nice shiny new paint job. I'm thinking something along the lines of a red stripe starting at the top rear and going diagonally to finish at about the level of the door handle, whereupon the red stripe goes horizontally along the door.
Paint it black below the red stripe, and grey above it.
Fit some lights to the roof just above the windscreen.
A spolier on top and red wheels complete the look.
The Raspberry Pi http://www.raspberrypi.org/faqs would seem to be a good match as it's tiny, is portable, has very low power requirements, dissipates very little heat, costs next to nothing, and is powerful enough to run full-HD video!
Take out the shag carpet and mirrors.
Imagine a parking lot full of vans filled with Raspberry Pi as a ...
Why is Snark Required?
Laptop or netbook because of internal battary. Run the computer's charger and the external video display off of the inverter, then if the van's battary dies or a fuse blows or the inverter kicks out or something the computer won't crash. You can always hot-key over to the computer's built-in screen (fn-F5 or whatever) to get control back and see what you're doing to finish or exit when the external components die for whatever reason. You're going to want a 12-volt deep-cycle battary connected through a battary isolator for charging it off of the van's electrical system and protecting the van's starter battary from drain. Forget the UPS, they're not meant to be used for a continuous supply from their internal "emergency" battaries and anyway, the conversion losses for all that mess would be rediculous: 12-volt van, to AC inverter, to UPS, to components' power supplies, means many watts consumption for substantially less power actually in use by the gear.
I picked up a refurbed ACER Aspire One D257-1907 netbook with a dual-core processor and I'm TOTALLY satisfied with it's processing power for multimedia. I'm not a gamer so I can't address THAT issue. A 6-cell battary keeps it going independantly for hours. If it's trickled by plugging it into an inverter then it's always ready to go when the rest of the system gets shut off or dies.
Security. 1977? You could open car locks with a bent pin. Central locking and immobilisers were probably a decade away in luxury models. Okay, maybe a van has better security in case it had a valuable cargo. But anyway, don't put 10k of tech in a vehicle that can be stolen with a bent wire coat hanger.
You could put "Free Candy" on the side with LEDs. Also, you could put a good wifi antenna on it so when you are down by the river, you still have internet to stalk with.
All joking aside, go with a deep cycle marine battery array with it's own alternator. I worked in a surveillance van for a P.I. company back in the early 90s. That was back when video cameras were huge like boom boxes and recorded onto magnetic cassette tapes. It provided enough power to run the cameras and a little fan to blow on me while I cooked in the oven-like heat. Consider that marine tech, because I'm sure it's advanced, people far out in the water don't like to fuck around. Think about it.
Do the world a favor and keep all the distracting gizmos away from the driver seat area. We have enough retards on the road already without someone in a monster derelict van, like a douche-nozzle watching TV while driving. Both hands at 10 and 2, with eyes roving the road and mirrors please.
Take the Red Pill.
Just get a decent stereo with bluetooth then run sound from a netbook/ultrabook through that.
A very simple system is to put in a higher rated marine alternator, already available for conversion kits for marinising many older engines, and something like a Sterling ABY130 (I think) which is an intelligent charger with 2 outputs, one for the starter battery and one for the domestic battery bank. The Sterling device not only splits the load, it has all sorts of intelligence built in to provide anti-sulfating and to prioritise the starter battery. It charges the domestic battery to full charge, which most rigs simply do not do. It also waits till the engine is at speed before putting a load on the alternator, protecting the drive belt. Make sure there is plenty of space around it for the fan to circulate air. I ran one for years without problems. Get your 110V from a good quality inverter, put a 32W solar panel on the roof as a booster for your starter battery, put in a couple of leisure 110AH batteries as your domestic bank (100A traction fuses in the leads to each, min cross-section 25mm squared supply cable) , make sure you have a 2kg powder fire extinguisher on board, and you should be happy.
From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
It hasn't been said yet, but make sure to secure everything as strongly as possible. An amplifier or speakers in the back of your vehicle can quickly turn into a head-crushing projectile in the event of an accident if not properly secured.
Random Thoughts From A Diseased Mind (Not For Dummies)
...and stop wasting your time and money on this shit.
First is to do the math. Just like a bank account, there needs to be a balance. Just like the bank, you can store some savings.
Batteries are sized in Amp Hours when buying deep cycle batteries. Batteries that list cold cranking power are lower capacity and built for a momentary high current load. They are not designed for deep cycle use.
Look at your supply side. If you turn off the headlights, wipers, heater fan, defroster, air conditioner, all those unused loads are excess generation capacity for use, but there is a catch, while the engine is running and not at just an idle. Alternator capacity is reduced at an idle. Headlights are about 60 watts each. The heater fan is about 200 Watts, Rear Window Defogger, 60 Watts.
Volts X Amps in DC = Watts.
Shutting off the headlights is enough capacity to run a typical larger flatscreen monitor. Shutting off the AC/Heater fan is enough to run a PC, etc.
A larger inverter is quite efficient so don't assume a 1KW inverter will draw 80 Amps all the time. Advice is go larger on the inverter to deal with startup current many devices use. Forget the 75-300 Watt sizes and start with a 1KW or larger. Follow the installation instructions on wire size and length.
I have done two inverter installs in vehicles of mine. Both are 1KW in size. My Prius has a trunk mounted inverter that is used in place of a portable gas generator for many odd jobs including camping. I use LED and or CFL lamps (120V is much easier to find than 12 V) Laptop computers, musical instruments and PA amplifiers, flatscreen TV, and a vacuum cleaner. 12 volt car vacs just don't work nearly as well as a dirt devil hand vac.
My second install is in a 29 foot motorhome. I found the AC outlets are on 2 breakers. The driver side includes the kitchen and bathroom. I left that on the generator or shore power for use with hair dryers, coffee makers, waffle irons, and other power hogs. The other side of the motorhome is all on the inverter. This powers LED desk lamps, the flatscreen TV, and outlets for cell phone chargers, laptops, DVD player, etc. I put a 19 inch flat screen TV up front in place of the original tube set, this doubles as a rear view mirror with a backup camera. A flatscreen TV eliminates the need for a DTV converter box. It only draws 40 Watts.
On the energy side, the original motohome lights were power hogs. The 1187 bulbs draw 2.1 Amps each or about 25 watts. Using the inverter, I use 1.5 to 7 Watt LED lamps instead. The main dining area ceiling light has 2 bulbs, so the TV actually draws less than the original "Dome Light". With one or two LED lights on, I can run the TV all night on battery on the 2 deep cycle RV batteries. This saves lots of gas as I don't need a generator running burning 1/2 gallon of gas an hour just to run the TV and a few lights.
As mentioned in another post, a separate cabin battery is highly recommended. After running the PC and monitor all night, you will want a way to start the engine. Use a battery isolator so you charge both sets of batteries.
The truth shall set you free!
Alvin Nathaniel Joiner, he knows how to update cars and vans apparently.
It starts with fuel injection. Get rid of that restricted, poor-performing engine (if it's from the 70's, there's all sorts of useless crap on the engine done for smog reasons that, 35 years later, probably don't work anymore and are robbing your engine of efficiency). Find a drop-in turnkey crate engine with fuel-injection and you will move up to the latter half of the 20th century, tech-wise. You will likely get better fuel-efficiency (measured by both MPG, and wasted fuel out the exhaust), better performance, a warranty on the engine, and you'll never have to deal with the peculiarities of a carburetor again. The other big thing, you will get a better alternator, from which you can power the devices you want to add on.
Put a new engine in the vehicle and then come back. Until then, your van is a 600 lb obese guy, trying to lose weight by doing crunches.
If you're looking for a reliable power source the following might be a good choice for you. I have used products from this company for previous auto-pc builds and have been quite happy. Includes intelligent shutdown control, no need to shut down the pc manually when you turn off your car.
http://www.mini-box.com/M4-ATX
Specs are:
- 250 Watts (300 Watts peak)
- 20/24 pin ATX, 6-30V wide input
- Programmable timing settings via USB
- Intelligent shutdown controller
- ON/OFF motherboard control
- Survives vehicle engine cranks
- Battery deep discharge prevention
- High efficiency, 250 watts output
- "Anti-Thump" Amplifier remote control
- 1.5mA standby current
- VIA, Intel, AMD CPU support
- OSCON / POSCAP (solid polymer) capacitors, Japan
I used the next one down in my build (M3-atx), but was only running a micro-atx via based system that only needed a smaller supply, but you mentioned gaming, this one should put out enough juice for gaming if you don't go to crazy on your video card and processor choice.
I'm planning on adding some more tech to my car, and I figured the easiest way to go would be to use my old laptop. Already get a battery backup, already designed to be low power, and you can buy a car charger for $20 online so you don't have to mess with inverters or anything. Then I figure I'll just separate the screen from the body, maybe wire up some one-click shortcut buttons into the keyboard, and it'll be done. Not going to help you use your existing monitors, but if you've got any kind of laptop laying around it'll probably be a lot cheaper than messing with inverters and batteries.
You can also buy LCD monitors designed to be mounted in cars (for example, check the 'car audio' section of partsexpress.com) which shouldn't need inverters either, and they're in the $100-$200 range. Of course, none of the ones I've seen take VGA input, so you'd probably need a laptop with S-Video or perhaps HDMI output. But if you've got that, set it up for separate X sessions for each screen and you should be good to go.
Check out your local high end car stereo shop. There are off the shelf products that will resolve all your issues; battery isolators, second alternator, inverters, regulators, etc. They'll be able to give you good advice on wiring paths and proper mounting of your equipment as well so its solid.
If you're gonna be gaming there, you need to live in your van's basement. Since it probably doesn't have one yet, it stands to reason that this is your new #1 priority.
Also, it will lower your center of gravity and will therefore improve handling.
First thing I would do is realize that fuel economy doesn't exist on a '77 GMC van. You can drive one of those down the highway and watch the fuel gauge creep towards empty at an alarming rate.
If you're going to "modernize" it with electrics, you may as well go all the way... install a proper electric battery system and an electric motor/drive system to replace the combustion engine. This will also give you a stable power supply from which you can run the other electronics you want to have. You can also outfit it with a generator and/or solar panels to use when it's parked, if you want to be able to recharge the batteries even partially while away from a charging plug.
Nowhere did I say I was writing about bluewater cruising sailboats. Their needs are quite different and they don't normally marinise production engines, but use small dedicated auxiliaries like Yanmars, Buchs and Listers, along with dedicated packaged generators which are quieter because there is no sound output from the hood via the shaft.. I was describing what is done with a whole lot of small powerboats including inshore and river cruisers in Europe, where not enough sun is available and one is frequently moored sheltered from wind.
Normally I can't be arsed to respond to ACs, especially when there is no possible issue of confidentiality of information being conveyed, but if you are going to warn someone off using this approach you need to spell out the errors. So what are they, so I can respond to them?
From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
If you want it to be functional tech:
Buy a non-budget (!) asian or european car, and you are pretty much done. There is no point mounting a touchscreen on your bbs terminal.
If this is a DIY project so you have the best wifi/tv on your favorite camping site, bolt your the (G3 WAN) wifi and tv on and voila done.
Did you mean UPS (not UPC) - Uninterruptible power supply? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uninterruptible_power_supply
Go to http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/
These folks can really help you.
How about swapping in an LS engine out of a newish GM. You get an all aluminum block, and kick ass fuel injection. Some suspension and brake upgraded would also be nice, again off a newish GM truck.
You are going to want to protect all the equipment that is in the van, you could shell out some money for a good security system or simply put Rape Van on the side of it. Nobody will want to break into a rape van.
Knowledge = Power
P= W/t
t=Money
Money = Work/Knowledge so the less you know the more you make
Go out and buy it and install it. http://dakotadigital.com/ has all you need for the high tech dash. Add in a nice double din navigation unit or two. Fiberglass in a 15" outdoor transreflective touchscreen monitor and hook up a PC, You can make a custom fiberglass dashboard based off the old one quite easily once you learn fiberglass.
http://www.garbled.net/tim/fiberglass.html
This is done every day, just check out the custom car shows to find old 1950's trucks with a full digital dash, I saw an awesome slammed, shaved, and chopped 1962 mustang that had all dakoda digital dash and a really cool 15" touchscreen built into the dash.
Or do you mean, "how cant I build a high tech van for little to no money." That I cant help you with. What you want to do will cost several thousand dollars to do it right no matter what direction you choose.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
I have been living in my truck for most of my life. What works for me may not be what works for you, but I'll describe my setup. I use 2 - 6 volt golf cart batteries wired in series to function as a 12 volt battery. Golf cart batteries are designed to put out steady power over a long time, more so than marine batteries. I have an Intelli-Power PD9245C 45 Amp RV Converter/Charger that I use to charge my batteries when I'm parked by my friend's houses. It makes sense to take full advantage of grid AC power to charge batteries when it is available. I also can charge my batteries using my truck alternator, or using a portable solar panel which I have, but mostly I just charge my batteries at my friend's houses. I use an Asus 1000HE netbook for most of my computing, because it only uses 11-12 watts. I also have an IPad 2 which only uses 3.5 watts with the screen at half brightness, and 4.5 watts with the screen at full brightness. I extensively tested both the IPad and the Asus netbook using a Kill-a-watt meter. Testing power usage of my devices has been important to me because my path has been to lower my power usage rather than to try to have a lot of generating capacity. For lighting at night, I use a 12v LED bulb.
Couple of options here... you can go with the cassette player, or the new "Compact Disks".
Gently reply
I have done a similar project before. From my experience a very good resource for information is Mp3Car. There are a lot of projects with pictures. People over there is very helpful on this matter.
There are many solutions to powering your computers I have used DC-DC power adapter that transforms 12v to ATX compatible power (M4-ATX). It take of engine cranks and any voltage variation. A good place to buy parts is Mini Box they have a car computing section.
Shag carpet, 8 track tape player, disco ball, CB radio, inexplicable ladder on back door (never understood that). What the first guy said about van art of course. Maybe these people can help http://www.nooneridesforfree.com/
The difference between a bunch of electronics bundled together and a gadget that everybody wants to use is the design.
http://www.twitpic.com/a1t93e. ;-)
Lisias@Earth.SolarSystem.OrionArm.MilkyWay.Local.Virgo.Universe.org
Back in 77, several of my friends had vans. They had a sound system, and a bed in the back. I would say that is about right for an old van.
You might want to have a magnetic sign to put on the back that says either 'taken' or 'if the van is a rockin, don't come knockin'. Or simply hang a tie.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
Alternative could be supercooled LNG storage in the back
The Russians have won. They have made the world a cesspool of distrust, greed, fear and hate.
Use a 2nd battery to run the auxiliary equipment,making sure to have a battery isolator to keep the starting battery separate.
Change the stock 80 amp alternator to a 120 amp or better alternator.You will have to use an external regulator on it.\
I did such customizations to a 1990 and 1992 Ford Aerostar van.Worked out great
Geek Hillbilly
...and whoever tagged this article with "Krieger" knows his stuff. Good work.
Never underestimate the potential of Human stupidity. -Heinlein
solved long ago.
Get yourself some regulated 12V buck-boost supplies. I use a Logic Supply Intelligent DC-DC Converter; good for 10 amps. Then get some 5 VDC regulators from mouser; a Texas Instruments PT78HT205V works nicely.
Now you're ready to rock. Plug a Roku into the 5VDC regulator, a TV into the Roku, and you're almost there.
Get an OpenWRT compatible wifi access point. A Buffalo WZR-HP-AG300HR has more horsepower than you need. Plug a hard drive into it, set it up. Install lighttpd and roconnect, install the ro-cnnect channel on the roku, and you're good to go for movies.
Now install some of the other channels; you can play movies from a usb stick, and there are some music channels.
Set up the wifi access point to serve up the movies and music; now you can stream from your van to your iPod or whatever.
And the whole thing draws about 3 amps, not enough to worry about.
I've done a lot of stuff like this. So here's my advice:
1. your van likely got 12mpg city when it was brand new... What it gets now is probably a lot worse... so keep that in mind.
2. The alternator is likely already beefy. I'm not sure about your particular model but there are likely even higher amperage alternatives you can get. This will, of course, hurt your millage even further. The key here is to get the power consumed lower than the power produced by the alternator AT IDLE. You can literally drain your batter dead while idling in a parking lot otherwise.
3. for extended life while the engine in off, simply get more batteries. Preferably deep cycle. Get a HIGH amperage relay and put it in-between your primary (starter) battery and your extra batteries then hook the relay on-terminal to the "ON" part of your starter switch. The premise here is that when you start the van. All the batteries are in parralel, but when in ACC mode your equipment is only hooked up to the extra batteries. If you drain them dead, that's fine because the starter battery isn't connected.
4. There are 12volt power supplies (regulators) for computers made for cars. You do not need an inverter and I'd highly recommend against them as they are very inefficient.
5. Laptop diskdrives are designed to take shocks. When choosing drives, laptop drives are your first choice.
6. Por15 and Hurculiner are your best friend on old vehicles. Rip out the carpet, coat it in one or the other and put the carpet back in.
7. Metal vans are bad for wifi... you'll need an external antenna.
8. Don't over-do your stereo. It's dempting but really anything over 200 watts (even the sub) is just to annoy people outside the car.
9. When running your cable for power from your extra batteries, etc... Make sure you put fuses as close to the batteries as possible. If one of your cables rubs and contacts metal, your vans going to go up in flames if it's not properly fused.
10. The cables you use should be bought from a farm implement supplier. (Farm and Fleet, Fleet Farm, etc...) You can get rolls of battery cable the thickness of your index finger, for very cheap. The ridiculous stuff they sell like monster cable, etc... is totally worthless and costs a fortune.
Good luck!
Naw, man. It's a '77 van, he's got to go all original.
He's got to install a PDP-11 with a tape drive.
He can call the van the "Q-Bus". Now, how cool would that be?
You are welcome on my lawn.
When all the answers have been on ./ in the last 2 days: a radar that can see individual raindrops and a lightning bolt weapen!
10 ?"Hello World" life was simple then
First off I would upgrade the factory alternator wiring. Just hook a heavy gauge wire from the B+ post on the alternator and run that strait to the "+" terminal on the battery. This by passes the undersized factory wiring and stock alternator gauge. Install an after market volt gauge in the van so you can keep an eye on the voltage level when parked.
Second I would install at least a 2nd battery(deepcycle marine) with a battery isolator. If your going to put them inside the van and not under the hood make sure you install them in a sealed and outside vented battery box. Batteries give off explosive gases and thats not something you want in your van.
Third, make sure you size your inverters correctly. They are most efficient near their rated capacity. Running a 200watt load on a 5K watt inverter is a total waste because most of the power is going to be used powering the electronics inside the inverter. Only buy inverters you can find the efficiency charts for. You may be better off running a few smaller ones that you could switch on as power is needed rather then running one big 5,000 watt inverter just to run a playstation and small TV.
And fuses.. Fuses everywhere. Would suck to have your ride go up in flames.
I have to return some videotapes...
...to look around at is logisysus.com. They specialize in mobile PC setups, and have been around at least 6-7 years now...
...Looking recently, I find the monitors to be shockingly expensive (considering you can get portable DVD players for $100) but then most of them are touch-screens I suppose. A keyboard's not real handy rolling down the road, even for passengers...
Though most are not hardly 'gaming' rigs, they will surf, play movies and music just fine. They are micro-form-factor and they can run straight off of 12V systems as well.
Dude, just drive the thing. Stop trying to turn it into a geeks paradise. It's cheesy and the fact that you felt the need to ask the question at all shows how shallow you are.
If you have a PTO (power take-off) on the transmission, look into these:
http://www.cumminsonan.com/cm/products/pto
Downside is you are using transport fuel for running equipment. Upside is you get more use out of what you already have, weighs almost nothing (compared to batteries) and takes up no space in the living area. Great option if you can swap out for a diesel powertrain.
If you don't have a PTO, look for a good quality inverter and battery system:
http://www.xantrex.com/
Another poster mentioned using golf car batteries. Cheap, easily available and (if maintained) will last a very long time. Downside is they are large and heavy, and outgas H2 when charging (so don't put them in the actual van). Maybe build them into something like this: http://www.stowaway2.com/hitch-cargo-carriers.aspx
"Well, good luck finding a judge that doesn't run a bestiality site."
I used these guys as a source when upgrading my '77 Jeep Wagoneer. That was about ten years ago, so I don't know what they are like now, but I was really happy with them back then. I was able to get factory style connectors that let me make my own custom wiring harness, but still be plug compatible with the various factory components. I also got some heavy duty fuses and a circuit breaker that I used to protect the cabin wiring and electronics.
http://www.wranglerpower.com/
I have a '77 GMC Van that I would like to take into the 21st century with some good tech.
I'd recommend airbags, anti-lock brakes, crumple zones, a reinforced passenger compartment, and a fuel-efficient engine.
You forgot to post anon, you hate-filled bigot.
If i was going to Pimp My GeekMobile then
1 put the van into the shop for some wrench time (tune the engine and beef up the battery)
2 put a moderate sound system in and have a "patch panel" on the outside to hook up extra speakers
3 setup the back end with a projector (think driveUP theater)
4 Use small or racked computer systems (Your Mobile Command Center doesn't need to control The SuperDome)
5 put a cell waveguide/repeater on the roof (need a Net Connect)
6 setup things so you can have a "WorkStation" in the van
Your power concerns should be mostly solved during your ShopTime.
with this setup all you would need is a DJ and a Light colored Wall somewhere and
ITS PARTY TIME
Any person using FTFY or editing my postings agrees to a US$50.00 charge
You can't go back in time.
Get tattoos all over your body. Be very cool/hip/whatever and make uncontrolled movements as to emphasise the coolness. Get your "buddy" from some shop you plug to do the hard work -which may well consist in distinguishing red, blue and black wires- for you. Wear crap clothes and be original with one item. Wearing the cap sideways will earn you max. brownie points for originality! Feel as if it is your god sent right to be very lazy in your truck and to automate anything you can. Be "trash" or "chav".
Consider a family row to add a human touch to the whole experience. Reconcile every now and then and then recommence animosities. Be a friggin' sissy about everything.
Now you got the base covered. You should proceed and add as much weight to the car as you can. The crappier the car handles, the better.
Or, you could take the unconventional and unamerican way of doing it and "add lightness" to your truck by removing stuff you don't absolutely need. Improve steering and suspension and make the truck able to actually take corners.
I hadn't the slightest objection to his spending his time planning massacres for the bourgeoisie... (P.G. Wodehouse)
You are taking dc from the battery and inverting it already. Rather than dumping money into a UPS why not dump the money into some big deep cycle 12V batteries to go in parallell with the original battery? You could get really fancy and automatically disconnect auxilliary batteries so you don't run the engine compartment battery down. (Geesh, just go and look at how some motorhomes are configured... maybe you can find a used electrical control panel cheap. )
I would look into old Motorola emergency equipment sold as surplus now (on the cheap). A MW800 unit could support the uses you might be looking for and has custom mounting hardware / high nit touchscreen etc. This equipment is designed for a car environment (cold / hot / shock) and optionally comes with some neat features like GPS, Camera inputs etc.
Just call Xzibit at West Coast Customs. Should solve all your problems, and you might be on TV. And have a pink van with flames on the side.
I'd watch Archer and take a close look at Krieger's different vans for some good ideas of what modifications to make.
Also the equipment just needs DC direct hookup and has power-on auto start and other features.
www.mp3car.com don't know if anyone pointed you to them, but that is all what the site does, computers in cars. awesome site. I myself am installing a computer in my 78 GMC C25 :)
I was seriously surprised when document text searches for "Xhibit" and "Pimp my Ride" came up short. I would like to read something about the calls for black-hats to go after so-called converted white-hats who work for dubious white-hat companies supposedly trustworthy to handle cyber security.
"There are some people that if they don't know, you can't tell them." ~ Louis Armstrong
In addition to the entertainment / navigation toys, you should check out something far, far cooler -- Megasquirt. It's an open-source engine control unit. WARNING: If you don't take the time to learn its proper use, you WILL damage your engine. BUT ... for those wiling to learn, Megasquirt is awesome. I use it to control my modified and turbocharged Japanese sports car, for a fraction of the cost of commercial aftermarket ECUs.
Whatever you do, keep the driver accessible controls dead simple. Put the full feature touchscreen/keyboard/jeejaw/whatever in front of the passenger seat.
Not all jurisdictions have a distracted driving law, but they should.
~signed, a guy who puts 10,000 km on his motorbike in a 6 month riding season.
Said documentary is available for streaming via Netflix and features Danny DeVito. Probably as the narrator or something.
Seth
$5 / month hosted VPS on linux = awesome!
Our company set out to make a station wagon look like a cross between the Back to the Future Delorean and the Ecto 1 from Ghostbuster. We took it down to bare metal, covered it with custom aluminum armor panels, and coated it with an awesome clear finish called Permalac. We then built a custom roof rack that will take a lot of gear and mounted a 24 db gain wifi antenna from Radiolabs. We wired the door to open when we enter a Nintendo cheat code into a controller in a box on the side (thanks Nokes project and Arduino). We replaced all the instruments with a Garmin GPS and a glcd lcd attached to another Arduino for the other instruments. I made a custom dash panel so now it has a glass cockpit like an airplane. The instruments and access control system use their own power supply with a small solar panel to charge it. We also have a battery bank in back for whatever else we want to run at a given time. If you want to run especially LCD's from a battery make sure to get a pure sine wave inverter as other posts have gone over. Make sure if you do attach anything to the main battery that you optoisolate it or use an inverter that has good optoisolation to mitigate the spike from the alternator. There is a picture and some video of it at the Northwest Computer Repair website. If you are actually interested in how we did any of this or picture let me know and I'll post something with more detail. As far as advice for your van goes I always recommend brushed metal and riveted armor plating, as well as a full compliment of communications gear. It's not done until little kids assume it is actually an airplane.
I've done some of this recently. First, I'd start with getting a GOOD inverter, true sine wave. Probably $500ish installed for something close to 1kw. It's a lot, but it's the heart of anything you plug into 110vac in your vehicle and some devices won't run on the cheapo square wave units that are available at wally world. Run some cabling through the walls and mount some 110vac jacks throughout. Once you have this done, you don't really have to make any special power consideration for anything you might use in the van. Even your cell phone could charge with a regular household charger if you so desired.
Second, I would not use the TV's that were mentioned. LCD panels for vehicles are dirt cheap (sub 100 for reasonable sized ones, use google) and they are already wired for 12vdc. Get one or more of those for your display. As for a computer, I'm still on the list for mine but as I understand it, the rasberry pi should make a perfect car pc, with 1080p out, not sure what the audio capabilities are specifically but it should be good. Get a wireless keyboard with touchpad or trackball and use that to control it... OR a touchscreen mounted on the dash.. those can also be had cheap.
Use the 110vac outlets to connect your gaming system if you desire one
An externally mounted 802.11 antenna or portable hotspot permanently mounted in a good location would also be great. If you go the 802.11 route, you can get high power DC 802.11 amplifiers and high gain directional antennas.. although they aren't what I'd all cheap.
If you don't want to do the rasberry pi, another choice is you can get an android phone or tablet device with or without cellular as long as it's got an HDMI output and use that pretty easily. Most devices I've seen with HDMI will output as high as 1080p, and of course they will play just about anything with the right software installed.
My first suggestion would be to remove the 8-track player, disco ball and bright-colored shag carpeting from your interior.
The first thought I had when I saw the title was: how can the mechanics be brought into the 21rst century so you have the cool hippy van but the mechanics will take it on for years. If you address this, taking it from carburetor powered antique power plant to modern, you wouldn't have any problem powering any of the toys you add later. Besides, in a few years if you don't do this, given the efficiency of a 70s era engine, unless you are independently wealthy or win the mega-millions/powerball/etc you will only able to afford enough gas to park it.
Whenever I saw the show Pimp My Ride, I would see this tricked out repainted vehicle at the end, and wonder how far that cool ride will go before a black ball of smoke blows out the back end and it comes to a stop becoming nothing but a large pimped out paper weight. They never tell you if they actually made it safely driveable as well as crammed full of impractical crap.
-- I ignore anonymous replies to my comments and postings.
1) Put a smartphone in your pocket.
2) Get into the van.
Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
Leave it to /. to come up with a bunch of ridiculously overengineered solutions.
Try this DC/DC ATX power supply which is designed for exactly this purpose: http://store.mp3car.com/M4_ATX_250W_Intelligent_DC_DC_PSU_p/pwr-031.htm
Why should you install a battery backup? Your van already has one and it's called a "car battery".
Inverters are horrendous. Why go from DC to AC to DC introducing noise and failure points when a DC/DC supply is cheap and reliable.
Forget the full size computer monitors and get a Lilliput that's designed to run on 12v DC
Build a Mini ITX computer with a fanless mobile Core 2 Duo like this: http://www.stealth.com/littlepc_625_fanless_print.htm
Spend LOTS of time reading the forums at MP3car.com
The key to any carputer installation is simplicity. Failure is garunteed so follow the KISS method to reduce the frequency. Also, feed the sound to a car stereo instead of directly to an amp. When you cross a train track and the carputer dies, you will be happy to be able to tune in the radio instead.
http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Vic-NaviSurfer-II-Ubu3G/
$400 gets you a nice computer with ubuntu, 3g, bluetooth, and like 3 open USB slots so you can add in anything you feel it's lacking. For another $10 you can add a usb SDR device and keep your AM/FM radio and get access to an expanded portion of the spectrum.
..wing. Then hire 4 mercenaries and a journalist...oh wait...
I think that's Slashdot's sig facility in operation. The dash-dash separator gives it away.
Though I note that the RFC(section 4.3) specifies (for Usenet posts) dash-dash-space.
Question #1: What are you going to *do* with it? You can't exactly drive around and watch your screens and play your games. So, you'll be parking to use it. Do you want to leave your van idling (loud, very fuel inefficient)? Do you want some auxiliary power supply (costly, more work)? Can you plug into wall power?
Once you get that figured, you can move on to your power budget. Get an approximation of your power draw. Say three LCDs at 50 watts each, a moderately efficient HTPC (50W? 100?), sound system (possibly huge, but I recommend keeping it below 200w), some lighting and overhead for the inverter inefficiency. There is a pretty easy 500 watts. You can put together a much lower power system, but you need to decide what you want out of it and how much you want to spend on it.
So you can upgrade your alternator, run an aux power system, or both. I recommend an auxiliary battery. Starter batteries are designed to give a quick jolt of power for the starter, then get charged back up. DO NOT use a regular computer UPS - they are designed to pull a huge amount of current from your wall outlet which your van simply cannot provide. Use a proper 12v deep cycle battery. A battery isolator should be used to keep your auxiliary batteries from draining your starter battery - while still permitting both to be charged from the alternator.
Now, how long can you run off of battery? Most deep-cycle batteries are rated in amp hours, so that 500 watts is ~41 amps at 12v. That means a battery rated at 41 amp hours will last one hour (deep cycle batteries commonly give 50 amp hours). I would at lea. Also, don't drain them completely dry. They may be deep cycle, but they still don't like it when you do that.
Next, how do you charge your battery? Do you want an auxiliary power source or are you OK with being reliant on the engine alternator (which needs an upgrade in that case). Vans have a wonderful amount of roof space for photovoltaics, but if you're only using your electronics at night you'd need battery capacity to make up for it.
All in all, you need to decide more about what you want. If you're looking at a lot of electronics, you're looking at potentially a lot of power. As they always say, there is more than one way to skin a cat... It also wouldn't hurt to go to an RV supply house and chat with one of the folks there about it.
+1 Disagree
You should go here. These people are all about car computing.. Great advice and project logs so you can get a feel for how the process will go.
www.mp3car.com
If it hasn't been mentioned yet, you'll want a second, deep-cycle battery rigged up in parallel with your regular one, but that cuts the connection when the ignition is off such that you can use the deep-cycle for accessories until it's dead, while not killing the ignition battery.
I've seen the circuit in a few different books; you might want to hunt down a copy of O'Reilly's "Car PC Hacks" or 50 Awesome Auto Projects for the Evil Genius, as I'd imagine they would go into it.
Find out what the local backpackers do to sort their van out. Every backpacker van i ever seen has some kind of 2nd battery, that charges off the main system when the vehicle is moving but works alone when being used to run everything not car related. Mostly i would say backpackers tend to run laptops, and charge them more when the vehicle is running, then use the 2nd battery to charge phones etc. Maybe you won't get the power you need from that, but you could run 2 secondary truck batteries and that should be well enough.
Or caravan batteries.. friend of mine runs dance parties in the park with projectors and big big speakers, and all the mixer, amps & electronics to power them, with a pair of caravan batteries.
In a way this is an easy answer but an old van is super easy to improve with better technology. Modern fuel injection leaps to mind. Electronic pollution and engine control systems are a great way to go. Items as simple as a flex fan for the radiator can make a difference. replacing interior items such as seat belt systems, alarm systems, vehicle rescue communication like On Star, electronic theft protection systems and many more leap to mind. Perhaps some lite weight wheel and brake systems or skid control equipment or even top of the line tires can all make a huge difference. Exhaust systems that function like the Disco Jet systems can add power and lower noise as well and may also eliminate some weight. Or even a modern stainless pipe system with a carbon fibre muffler can make a nice difference. And if you are oozing money you could adapt a more modern transmission to an older engine or even order a more modern and liter engine with better power output is within human reach.
In a way there is no end to this. The hot rod crowd has done this for over a century now. Snares include some bad after market products, bad advice and errors in judgement as one often has to try several times to get things just right. And time is also an enemy. For example if it takes you four years to make a just right build newer tech will be in the air and you will always be playing catch up. It is very much like 1990 when it cost a bundle to build any decent PC and before you got it home it was obsolete. Can you picture a windshield made of this new Gorilla Glass? Glass chips from specks of gravel touching the window would be a thing of the past.