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Apple Gets the Importance of Packaging; Why Doesn't Google?

Hugh Pickens writes "Rebecca Greenfield writes that Google's Nexus tablet with its taped sides and fussy plastic takes effort to open, eliciting what some would call 'wrap rage,' the linguist-approved word for the anger associated with opening a factory sealed product, and as a montage of frustrated Google Nexus 7 owners struggling to open their new tablets' packaging proves there is at least one thing Apple gets that Google does not: boxes. In comparison to the minutes-long process that it takes to get to Google's well-reviewed tablet, opening an iPad takes a simple slide of a cover — a lid that 'comes off easily, but not too easily,' as Random Tech's Anthony Kay puts it. Apple boxes aren't beloved by accident. The company thinks about the way a box informs a product and takes boxing seriously for a reason. 'Not only does the box give people warm and fuzzy associations with the product from the get-go, but also, people form emotional attachments to the actual pieces of cardboard. Instead of tossing them like the trash that they are, people have been known to keep their iBoxes,' writes Greenfield. 'Instead of forgotten in a dump or recycling facility, the boxes sit on shelves serving as a constant reminder of the beauty within.'"

639 comments

  1. Wrap rage...? by serviscope_minor · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Well, of all the things that qualify as first world problems...

    And really? People keep i* packaging? That's kinda weird and squirrelly.

    Oh, also with respect to unwrapping, please PLEASE peel off those annoying bits of protective clear plastic. They look terrible after they'be been on a few months and have bubbled and got bits of dirt under them. And they make me twitch in an OCD kind of way.

    --
    SJW n. One who posts facts.
    1. Re:Wrap rage...? by HarrySquatter · · Score: 4, Insightful

      People keep the packaging for returns and because selling your mint condition iDevice with mint condition packaging means you get higher resell value on eBay.

    2. Re:Wrap rage...? by jeffmeden · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Well, of all the things that qualify as first world problems...

      And really? People keep i* packaging? That's kinda weird and squirrelly.

      Exactly... The story about "packaging fetishists" is just as much about doing something wrong as it is about doing it right. Why not just make packaging that is easy to open and recycle, and let the consumer enjoy just the product instead of worrying about the box? Or, at least, make the box in a form factor that is easy to actually reuse instead of inspiring Apple fans to collect shelves and shelves of meaningless cardboard. I mean, at least pewter figurines or tea sets or pictures of old people has some prolonged sentimental value. With an iPad, are you really going to give two shits about it after you get the next generation version?

      Thanks, Apple, for putting time into thinking about how to get me to hang on to MORE shit I don't need.

    3. Re:Wrap rage...? by TheCarp · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Actually, this is nothing new, nor specific to apple. A lot of people keep the boxes that products come in, especially if the product has enough value to be worth repackaging in its box for resale or storage later.

      For example, I had some pots that came in boxes. I tossed the boxes, as I have a place to store pots and use them frequently.

      I have a rice cooker. Kept the box. Keep it in the box. On the rare occasion that I use it, it comes out of the box, and goes back in. If I get around to having a yard sale, I will put it out, in its box.

      Likewise, I have the boxes for xbox360 and my wife's PS3. Why? because they might need to be sent out for repair someday, or I might want to sell them.

      The only thing special here is that apple is actually still using boxes, whereas other products have moved to clamshells, which are more frustrating to open if you don't have a good pair of sciscors handy at the moment... and don't give you a package that you can easly repackage the product in.... which brings up another nice thing about boxes....

      when I open a product in a box, and its already broken, I have a convienet vessel in which to transmit the product back to the store from whence it came to exchange it.

      Nothing new, or particularly interesting here.

      --
      "I opened my eyes, and everything went dark again"
    4. Re:Wrap rage...? by xaxa · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Why not just make packaging that is easy to open and recycle, and let the consumer enjoy just the product instead of worrying about the box?

      Indeed, I tend to be more impressed with the company if the product arrives in a plain cardboard box, printed with vegetable-based inks, and no plastic packaging waste.

      I can then more easily reuse it (e.g. to post something I've sold on eBay, or wrap a fragile gift) or recycle it.

    5. Re:Wrap rage...? by Hatta · · Score: 2

      People keep all sorts of packaging. I collect vintage computers. A lot of them still come with their original boxes. Some people really like that, and it boosts the price people can get for the computer. Personally, I can't program or play games on a box, so I'm happier paying less for a computer.

      But sometimes I get a cheap computer that still has its box. What do you do with a box you dont' want? After all these years, it seems a shame to trash it. So I've been hanging on to them. I might one day want to sell my Apple IIgs, and the original boxes will probably add 50% to the price I can get for it. So a stack of empty boxes occupies the corner of my basement.

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    6. Re:Wrap rage...? by Megane · · Score: 1

      I still have a Mac 128K box somewhere up in the attic. The idea was to have something to ship it in if I ever needed to, but, you know...

      --
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    7. Re:Wrap rage...? by k(wi)r(kipedia) · · Score: 4, Funny

      selling your mint condition iDevice with mint condition packaging means you get higher resell value on eBay.

      Ah, the joy of reselling a product that's never been used.

    8. Re:Wrap rage...? by MightyYar · · Score: 4, Interesting

      The Apple packaging is nice enough to warrant a spot in the basement. People seem to appreciate it when they get my hand-me-downs and it comes with all of the original packaging/disks/etc.

      --
      W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
    9. Re:Wrap rage...? by JohnnyMindcrime · · Score: 0

      Wow! I think those same people need to go get some interesting stuff to fill all that spare time they clearly have.

      --
      Windows 10 is great - I used it to download Linux.
    10. Re:Wrap rage...? by DogDude · · Score: 1

      Nothing new, or particularly interesting here.

      On the contrary, I think that's pretty fucking bizarre. Storing packaging on the off chance that you might want to re-use it one day? Really? That ain't normal, dude.

      --
      I don't respond to AC's.
    11. Re:Wrap rage...? by Hentes · · Score: 5, Funny

      But the main main reason many people buy an iPad is so they can make unwrapping videos for Youtube. The tablet is just a bonus.

    12. Re:Wrap rage...? by mwvdlee · · Score: 5, Funny

      The point of owning an iDevice is to show it off. Nonchalantly displaying the box on a shelf fits into this lifestyle perfectly.

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    13. Re:Wrap rage...? by MisterSquid · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The story about "packaging fetishists" is just as much about doing something wrong as it is about doing it right. Why not just make packaging that is easy to open and recycle, and let the consumer enjoy just the product instead of worrying about the box? Or, at least, make the box in a form factor that is easy to actually reuse instead of inspiring Apple fans to collect shelves and shelves of meaningless cardboard.

      Many people don't understand packaging is very important and your post, unfortunately, is no exception.

      In the case of tablets and phones, packaging is the first personal encounter with what is intended to be a personal device. Getting this step right is crucial to shaping how a consumer perceives the product and too many companies neglect this simple but ineluctable point.

      It's not fetishism to want a consumer's experience of "getting at the device" to be quick, obvious, and easy. Furthermore, packaging that is easily opened and which is not damaged upon opening makes that packaging reusable.

      Apple's packaging of phones and tables is exemplary in this regard. The only thing that must be permanently damaged in the unboxing process is the shrink wrap, and even that can be preserved so that it can be reused. This means that when I upgrade my tablet I can sell the old device on eBay in its original packaging and allow my buyers to have a very-close-to-new out-of-box experience. I've sold quite a few phones, tablets, and laptops on eBay and people really appreciate the out-of-box experience, so much so that I mention that the item has all the original packaging intact.

      Style, simplicity, and reusability are not shallow but deep. It's the failure to appreciate the work that goes into making something simple that is shallow.

      --
      blog
    14. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I keep nice boxes. My MacBook box served as a safe way to transport my computer until I found a case I liked. Unlike most boxes, it was study and didn't get destroyed opening it.

    15. Re:Wrap rage...? by mwvdlee · · Score: 2

      Indeed, I tend to be more impressed with the company if the product arrives in a plain cardboard box, printed with vegetable-based inks, and no plastic packaging waste.

      I can then more easily reuse it (e.g. to post something I've sold on eBay, or wrap a fragile gift) or recycle it.

      Never really thought about it that much but you are right. Whenever I recieve a clean box or envelope with removable/coverable branding, I tend to keep it around for when I need to send a package. Might be good marketing if those companies mentioned this explicitely somewhere in the instruction manual.

      --
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    16. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I see no problem with any of that. Soon Samsung will have the same packaging and they will claim that's the only way to do it. The judge will believe them and Apple will be forced to apologize to Samsung, the court, slashdot, me, you, and everyone else on this planet for thinking their packaging is special.

    17. Re:Wrap rage...? by smooth+wombat · · Score: 2

      That ain't normal, dude.

      Yes, it is. When I purchased my Calphalon One cookware, I kept all the boxes (except for the ones I got at discount stores which didn't have boxes) so when/if I move, I can slide them back into their protective packaging for transport. I don't have to figure out how to wrap them to protect them, or find an odd-sized box for them to fit in. They go back into the original boxes which stack nicely.

      Like the OP, I also store my rice cooker and scale in their original boxes. It helps keep everything together and the boxes store more neatly than having everything lying around with cords hanging loose.
      Considering what I paid for my stuff, taking this one extra step to keep things neat, orderly and protected is an extremely minor issue to deal with.

      --
      We will bankrupt ourselves in the vain search for absolute security. -- Dwight D. Eisenhower
    18. Re:Wrap rage...? by j2.718ff · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I save the packaging for any products I might eventually return/sell. This has nothing to do with Apple. (I also have enough space in the basement that a few extra boxes won't get in the way of anything else.)

    19. Re:Wrap rage...? by DerekLyons · · Score: 1

      The only thing special here is that apple is actually still using boxes, whereas other products have moved to clamshells

      Um, no. Apple using boxes is nothing special at all. For the most part, outside of inexpensive products meant to hang on hooks, most products/companies still use boxes.

    20. Re:Wrap rage...? by cpu6502 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Ouch.
      I resell stuff on ebay, and yes it's been used, but you will get a lot more money if you can advertise it as "new" in appearance. I've received a lot of + feedbacks and 5 stars, because people said "It looks like you never even used it." I did but was just very careful not to scratch the DVD, unit, et cetera.

      Also saving the box means you don't have to pay UPS or the post office ~$20 to buy a new box to pack your computer, DVR, whatever.

      --
      My AC stalker: " I personally agree with your posts most of the time, but that won't keep me from modding you troll"
    21. Re:Wrap rage...? by serviscope_minor · · Score: 0

      Many people don't understand packaging is very important and your post, unfortunately, is no exception.

      As is yours. The trouble is not everyone has the same opinion.

      Last laptop I got came in a pretty standard cardboard box, which didn't require damaging to open. After determining it worked, I folded up the box and chucked it in the recycling bin. The procedure was simple, quick, easy and I could recycle it, which is even better.

      I find excessive, non-recyclable packaging really annoying, especially when it requires effort to pack down well (note that distbin lorries do not come that often in many parts of the UK).

      To me, having excessively fancy pacakging makes me feel I'm paying more for something not only useless but that also wastes my time, too.

      --
      SJW n. One who posts facts.
    22. Re:Wrap rage...? by VGPowerlord · · Score: 1

      I see no problem with any of that. Soon Samsung will have the same packaging and they will claim that's the only way to do it. The judge will believe them and Apple will be forced to apologize to Samsung, the court, slashdot, me, you, and everyone else on this planet for thinking their packaging is special.

      Samsung already has the same kind of packaging. This was used as one of the complaints by Apple during the lawsuit.

      --
      GLaDOS for President 2016! "Well here we are again. It's always such a pleasure." -- GLaDOS, 2011
    23. Re:Wrap rage...? by Bigbutt · · Score: 1

      Maybe we need a poll for this to see how normal it actually is. Because I have my packaging for those sorts of things; steamer, blender, etc plus I have my game packaging sitting on a shelf even though I have the CDs and DVDs in a big CD notebook and the game codes in my password keeper.

      Now I don't mount the iPad packaging on the wall or sit it on the mantle but it is sitting on a bookshelf in my Man Cave.

      [John]

      --
      Shit better not happen!
    24. Re:Wrap rage...? by serviscope_minor · · Score: 1

      Yes, it is.

      No it isn't.

      Do you move house often enough that keeping toe packaging to help moving actually makes a difference?

      Also if you have to faff with taking the rice cooker out of its box before using it, you're destroying pretty much the entore point of a rice cooker, namely efficiency and convenience. If you're giving up that you may as well use a saucepan.

      --
      SJW n. One who posts facts.
    25. Re:Wrap rage...? by cpu6502 · · Score: 2

      I still have my Mac box..... it was big and bulky and hard to carry: filled with a lot of empty space. But yes it was beautifully designed.

      In contrast my PC came in a plain cardboard box, sealed with tape that I had to use my car key to cut. Not easy to open. But it also cost half as much. I'll take the 50% savings and forego the pretty.

      --
      My AC stalker: " I personally agree with your posts most of the time, but that won't keep me from modding you troll"
    26. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh, hello. Marketing's next door.

    27. Re:Wrap rage...? by peragrin · · Score: 1

      Exactly I save all packaging for one year. After that the warranty is probably shot anyways.

      --
      i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
    28. Re:Wrap rage...? by Dog-Cow · · Score: 4, Insightful

      And why in the world would you think that Apple's packaging is not recyclable?

      You should be applauding Apple's approach because you and MisterSquid get what they want out of it.

    29. Re:Wrap rage...? by Dog-Cow · · Score: 1

      Written like one who lives with his parents and/or legal guardian.

    30. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I generally hang on to the boxes at least for a few months (or until I remember to throw them away). Has served me well for example when I needed to ship my 26" monitor. Would have been pain in the ass to package without the original box and styrofoam pieces to hold the monitor in place.

    31. Re:Wrap rage...? by Joce640k · · Score: 5, Informative

      People keep the packaging for returns and because selling your mint condition iDevice with mint condition packaging means you get higher resell value on eBay.

      Ah, the joys of owning an iDevice. You have to constantly plan ahead financially for when the next version comes out.

      --
      No sig today...
    32. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, of all the things that qualify as first world problems...

      Where's my moderation button on the article? Why can't I rate it -1 Raving Fanboi?

      Desperate Apple Fanboi is desperate. And a fanboi. And also a troll, though you wouldn't think it from the title.

    33. Re:Wrap rage...? by Mister+Whirly · · Score: 1, Interesting

      Also saving the box means you don't have to pay UPS or the post office ~$20 to buy a new box to pack your computer, DVR, whatever.

      Sure you do, otherwise you risk getting a scratch on your precious original packaging. Everyone knows an iDevice with a slight scratch on the original packaging brings the price way down!

      --
      "But this one goes to 11!"
    34. Re:Wrap rage...? by Johann+Lau · · Score: 3, Insightful

      http://fadeyev.net/2012/06/19/moral-design/

      Life is the ultimate aim of moral design, which it must protect, advance, ennoble and enrich. Immoral design, which is also bad design, is the opposite. It takes life by stealing time; it impoverishes by pretending to be more than it is; it does not last; it deceives, harms, enrages and degrades. The difference between the two lies at the origin of the work, when the designer first establishes their true goals and decides whether it is to satisfy their destructively selfish aims, or it is to be something higher, something that respects and elevates peopleâ(TM)s lives, something that they are not ashamed to put out into this world because they know that their heart lies in the right place; and if they fail to achieve what they set out to do, it will be but an error of affection, not ill work laden with guilt.

      By that standard, Apple suddenly doesn't look sexy at all. Nor do other corps.

      out-of-box experience

      not shallow but deep

      `
      Bullshit. That's as shallow as you can get.

      It's the failure to appreciate the work that goes into making something simple that is shallow.

      Something can be a lot of work and still be shallow, nobody is claiming the don't waste a lot of time and money and resources on their packaging, so that's both a strawman and a false dichotomy.

    35. Re:Wrap rage...? by idji · · Score: 1

      I throw all packaging away and am NOT a squirrel, but I kep my i-Box, because it was instantly and obviously a consumate piece of design.

    36. Re:Wrap rage...? by Johann+Lau · · Score: 1

      uhm sorry, should have previewed.. "It's the failure to appreciate the work that goes into making something simple that is shallow." was supposed to be a quote, too.

    37. Re:Wrap rage...? by Johann+Lau · · Score: 1

      Considering what I paid for my stuff, taking this one extra step

      "The cost of a thing is the amount of what I will call life, which is required to be exchanged for it, immediately or in the long run."

      -- Henry David Thoreau :P

    38. Re:Wrap rage...? by Joce640k · · Score: 1

      Really? That ain't normal, dude.

      Lots of stuff is delicate and/or weird shaped. When you need to move house (or whatever) you need something to put it in for safe transportation. If you've got space for 'em, you keep the original boxes.

      --
      No sig today...
    39. Re:Wrap rage...? by medcalf · · Score: 2

      We do. We have moved on average every three years for some time. Saving boxes for things that otherwise don't pack easily or that are fragile is very important in those cases.

      --
      -- Two men say they're Jesus. One of them must be wrong. - Dire Straits
    40. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Zen bullshit like "simple is deep" counts as insightful, and we wonder why America is going down the shitter...

    41. Re:Wrap rage...? by PerfectionLost · · Score: 1

      You say that... but read the article, and watch the video. That was fucking hilarious. One guy tried to cut tape with the shim from his collared shirt.

    42. Re:Wrap rage...? by danomac · · Score: 5, Informative

      I have the Nexus 7.

      First of all, the unboxing wasn't that bad. The box was taped, yes, but once I sliced it the box slid apart with no issues. The wrap around the Nexus 7 was not that hard to remove. The only way you can bugger that up is to not notice the directions. There's arrows, move this, then that, and it slides out. When I unpacked some iPads for work they were basically similar in their unpacking.

      However, the part that got me about the packing is the sleeve. The box itself was fine. The box slid into a sleeve that had the artwork.

      I was about ready to throw the goddamned thing against the wall. The sleeve was pressure fit so tightly that Hercu-Thumbs couldn't even slide it out. After fussing with it for a few minutes I went into a rage and tore that sonovabitch up. If I had to do it again I wouldn't even bother with sliding it off, I'd get a letter opener or something like it to take apart the sleeve at its seam.

      Whoever thought of that packing design should be dragged out to the street and SHOT.

    43. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's some nice words, and a confident attitude, but it doesn't really prove anything without evidence to back it up. Does nice packaging lead to higher sales? How good does it really have to be? Nobody likes the hermetically sealed hard plastic that you need scissors to get apart. But does Apple's super-duper job really translate into better sales than merely an OK job?

      Frankly I think people forget about the packaging after about 5 minutes. The packaging is maybe 1% of the experience. In the end, it doesn't matter. Without any data to back you up, your opinion is as good as mine.

    44. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're an idiot.

    45. Re:Wrap rage...? by tepples · · Score: 1

      Personally, I can't program or play games on a box

      Nor can you program on an iDevice, really. But back to the topic: I keep boxes until the warranty runs out.

    46. Re:Wrap rage...? by citizenr · · Score: 5, Funny

      Ouch.
      I resell stuff on ebay, and yes it's been used, but you will get a lot more money if you can advertise it as "new" in appearance. I've received a lot of + feedbacks and 5 stars, because people said "It looks like you never even used it." I did but was just very careful not to scratch the DVD, unit, et cetera.

      Also saving the box means you don't have to pay UPS or the post office ~$20 to buy a new box to pack your computer, DVR, whatever.

      Hey I know you. You are that guy with bubble wrapped couch and plastic bag over TV remote.

      --
      Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
    47. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The story about "packaging fetishists" is just as much about doing something wrong as it is about doing it right. Why not just make packaging that is easy to open and recycle, and let the consumer enjoy just the product instead of worrying about the box? Or, at least, make the box in a form factor that is easy to actually reuse instead of inspiring Apple fans to collect shelves and shelves of meaningless cardboard.

      Many people don't understand packaging is very important and your post, unfortunately, is no exception.

      In the case of tablets and phones, packaging is the first personal encounter with what is intended to be a personal device. Getting this step right is crucial to shaping how a consumer perceives the product and too many companies neglect this simple but ineluctable point.

      It's not fetishism to want a consumer's experience of "getting at the device" to be quick, obvious, and easy. Furthermore, packaging that is easily opened and which is not damaged upon opening makes that packaging reusable.

      Apple's packaging of phones and tables is exemplary in this regard. The only thing that must be permanently damaged in the unboxing process is the shrink wrap, and even that can be preserved so that it can be reused. This means that when I upgrade my tablet I can sell the old device on eBay in its original packaging and allow my buyers to have a very-close-to-new out-of-box experience. I've sold quite a few phones, tablets, and laptops on eBay and people really appreciate the out-of-box experience, so much so that I mention that the item has all the original packaging intact.

      Style, simplicity, and reusability are not shallow but deep. It's the failure to appreciate the work that goes into making something simple that is shallow.

      OMFG.

      This means that when I upgrade my tablet I can sell the old device on eBay in its original packaging and allow my buyers to have a very-close-to-new out-of-box experience

      ROFL

    48. Re:Wrap rage...? by sexconker · · Score: 0

      We do. We have moved on average every three years for some time. Saving boxes for things that otherwise don't pack easily or that are fragile is very important in those cases.

      Moving once every 3 years is not normal, and nothing you do to facilitate that will be considered normal.
      You are not normal. Stop arguing as if saving boxes for shit is normal.

      Normal behavior is to keep the box until you verify that the thing works, then you chuck the box.

    49. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's amusing to me but typical of slashdot that people here are focused on the utility of quality packaging. While that's a value I doubt that's Apple's reason.

      As much as everyone around here hates marketers the reality is that human beings make snap judgements literally within the first few seconds of experiencing something new. Any good marketing company knows this, and Apple is first and foremost a marketing company, not a technology company. A good marketer knows that opening a product, especially one that is highly anticipated like a new iPad or a new iPhone, the customer is having an experience, and they aim to make that experience as awesome as possible. Crappy packaging will only diminish that experience, whereas quality, robust, yet easy to open packaging enhances that experience. It's subtle, but it does. That starts the consumer off with their product on a high note, which only serves to increase their desire to continue using the product, which serves to increase their brand loyalty (which is why there are so many apple fanboys out there). That higher brand loyalty translates into them selling their product at high volume and high price, increasing profits.

      Google doesn't get this. As far as I'm concerned, Google is a terrible company. It may seem like an awesome place to work for tech guys, but they got lucky and hit a sweet spot with their initial products and have maintained that dominance without having to be competitive. They're one of the few companies where building the better mousetrap actually worked; typically it does no. If they really had to be competitive they would fail as they waste money on all sorts of things. Case in point: this packaging to me looks expensive (too much tape, too many materials) and looks like it was designed by an engineer to be robust and protect the product well; problem is it's protected from the consumer too who's initial first impression of the product is one of frustration. There are likely several ways to maintain the packaging robustness while cutting down on materials costs and still make it easier to open (see Apple), which would A) reduce costs, B) maintain produt integrity in shipping, and C) enhance the consumer's experience. Google is infantile in this aspect of business, which is why their phone failed and many other products failed.

    50. Re:Wrap rage...? by antdude · · Score: 2

      I made a poll about this on pi day of 2012: http://aqfl.net/node/9736 with interesting results.

      I keep most of my boxes too. I know many people do.

      --
      Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
    51. Re:Wrap rage...? by Gilmoure · · Score: 1

      While I no longer move at least once a year (that decade+s sucked) I also keep boxes for major electronics. Shipping is one aspect and returns/repairs are another.

      Still, when you're trying to capture profits, the little extra that Apple puts in packaging makes sense. Helps with branding and may provide some bit of unconscious good feelings down the road Ever bought a new high end car verses a Chevy? The dealerships apply a little more spit and polish when they turn over the car to you. Is just a service thing. Is same reason it's nicer to stay at the Bellagio versus the Holiday Inn.

      --
      I drank what? -- Socrates
    52. Re:Wrap rage...? by TheLongshot · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The referb Kindle I got from Amazon came in a package like this. A zip open cardboard box with a plastic insert to hold the Kindle, all of which was recyclable.

    53. Re:Wrap rage...? by Gilmoure · · Score: 1

      I have an Apple Mac carrying case (heavy duty padded nylon bag with room for old one piece Mac and key board). I use it for my range bag. Can hold a ton of ammo and several guns.

      --
      I drank what? -- Socrates
    54. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Whoever thought of that packing design should be dragged out to the street and SHOT.

      Translation: "It was that bad unboxing the Nexus 7"

    55. Re:Wrap rage...? by shadowrat · · Score: 1

      i confess to keeping my i* packaging. i don't do it out of any kind of cultish devotion to the church of jobs, it's because my hoarder instincts are convinced that i would someday find a use for that box. It IS a nice container, but i honestly resent apple for sticking me with it. Not only do i have this box, but it's full of little screws and whatnot that i also would have thrown out if i hadn't had such a convenient place to store them :(

    56. Re:Wrap rage...? by mjwx · · Score: 1

      Well, of all the things that qualify as first world problems...

      This, the reason Google and other Android manufacturers don't "get" the importance of packaging is that there is no importance of packaging.

      People rip off the plastic then tear open the box with no regard. They do this because they don't give a fat rats clacker about the packaging and just want the shiny thing inside. When a person cares more about flattening the foil than eating the sweet, sweet, chocolate inside we say they have a problem, the same is true for gadgets.

      Few people, even iDevice chumps, Sorry, I mean buyers care about packaging. My housemate cant find the package for her Ipod, none of the drones in sales can find the box for their Iphone (nor an actual sale, but that's besides the point). They all just send it back in a generic box wrapped in bubble wrap (some even wrap the device before packaging) when it eventually needs to be sent back.

      Packaging matters as much as the wrapping on a bag of chips, it's there to hold whatever is inside and protect your hand from oil burns.

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    57. Re:Wrap rage...? by Hatta · · Score: 1

      That's why I don't have one. It's really tempting, considering iOS is the only platform Jeff Minter writes for these days. But I'll have to be satisfied with my C64 copy of Gridrunner, unless he ports his stuff to Android.

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    58. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      That is because you, as with the majority of this site's audience, represent the nerd demographic. Nerds traditionally place value in function, not form, and an extravagant box like Apple's would appear excessive and needless, as you said.

      However nerds are not Apple's target audience. We are barely even on their radar. As I'm sure you know, everyone has different design tastes; even innocuous things like packaging can have a dramatic impact on certain people, even if you couldn't care less about it.

    59. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So how come article isn't titled "Apple and Samsung get the Importans of Packaging! Why doesn't Google?"

    60. Re:Wrap rage...? by Karlt1 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "Ah, the joys of owning an iDevice. You have to constantly plan ahead financially for when the next version comes out."

      So in all of technology, only Apple users ever upgrade?

    61. Re:Wrap rage...? by BronsCon · · Score: 1

      No it isn't.

      Yes, it is. At least during the warranty period, or for fragile or hard to replace items. Having a box with proper padding and compartments for what you're packing can be the difference between keeping your current item or having to buy a new one. What box can you think of that's better suited for this than the one the product shipped in?

      When I moved from Ohio to California, the truck carrying my belongings got rear-ended... by another large truck. Furniture was fine, as it was at the front of the truck, clothing and other soft goods were fine, in the middle of the truck, because they're more resilient. My electronics, dishes, and small appliances all survived, as well, because they were properly packed; in their original boxes. Had they not been, they may have been damaged and the insurance company may have denied the claim due ti inadequate packaging.

      For some items, like flat screen TVs, it simply doesn't make sense to store the box; it's huge, oddly shaped, and you risk damaging the TV just as much repackaging it as you do taping cardboard over the screen. wrapping it in a blanket, and moving it without the box. For most other items, it's trivial to place smaller boxes into larger ones and end up with two or three medium-sized boxes that contain all the boxes for your electronics, small appliances, cookware, and dishes.

      The bit about resale value holds true, as well.

      --
      APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
    62. Re:Wrap rage...? by xs650 · · Score: 0

      Also saving the box means you don't have to pay UPS or the post office ~$20 to buy a new box to pack your computer, DVR, whatever.

      $20? You don't need to buy an iBox to ship it, you can use a regular cardboard shipping box like us non-i peones do.

    63. Re:Wrap rage...? by moderatorrater · · Score: 1

      People keep i* packaging? That's kinda weird and squirrelly.

      My wife and I use our iPad box as a random box for gift giving. It's the perfect size for a lot of our gifts and disguises the size of what's inside. It also gives the recipient a brief "HOLY SHIT!" moment before they realize it's not an iPad, it's something else inside an iPad box.

      Keeping it because it's beautiful is just dumb, though.

    64. Re:Wrap rage...? by BronsCon · · Score: 2

      I might one day want to sell my Apple IIgs

      How's today sound?

      --
      APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
    65. Re:Wrap rage...? by xs650 · · Score: 0

      selling your mint condition iDevice with mint condition packaging means you get higher resell value on eBay.

      Ah, the joy of reselling a product that's never been used.

      Welcome to the world of the iPeople.

    66. Re:Wrap rage...? by BronsCon · · Score: 1

      I forgot to add the following bit to my post:

      Having the original box is also wonderful if you're going to pass something along to a friend or family member. I gifted my well-cared-for netbook to my younger sister for Christmas last year. The only way she knew it wasn't brand new was that I told our mother, who then told her. She didn't care, it came with everything, including the box, and looked and functioned like it was brand new, she had the full experience of opening a brand new item, so she didn't care that it was used. Had I not had the box, her reaction may have been something akin to "oh, great, your old, crappy netbook, gee, thanks."

      --
      APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
    67. Re:Wrap rage...? by Rotag_FU · · Score: 2

      So I just received my Nexus 7 last night and am surprised by the reactions that I've seen. I watched the unboxing compilation while I was eagerly awaiting delivery and was expecting the worst. The only thing that I experienced as potentially problematic was the two tape tabs. They would not be easy to peel without damaging the box, so cutting really is your best option. However, everything else, including sliding the sleeve off the box, was very easy and simple. I honestly didn't even notice that there were arrows directing me what to do and still found it quite intuitive.

      I wonder if there are just some manufacturing tolerance issues or some automated packaging assembly issues that are causing the packaging to be more tedious for some than for others.

      The bottom line is that this is just about the silliest thing to complain about. Asus/Google's packaging was perfectly fine and far and above what you would see on the vast majority of consumer products. It may be inferior to Apple's (can't say since I don't have an iPad), but who really cares. I want to use the tablet, not marvel at the box.

    68. Re:Wrap rage...? by DNS-and-BIND · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Oh, fuck that noise. Apple makes luxury products, they can afford fancy packaging. Any product that sells on price gets whatever packaging the factory can make that won't damage the product during transit, and whatever is cheap. A lot of times that unfortunately means the clamshell packaging. I work with goddamn Chinese factories, I know this. Apparently you don't. "Out of the box experience" what the fuck?!? You exist at such a high, luxury level of consumerism that you have no idea why anyone would do anything differently, eh? When you have fucking 50%+ margins like Apple does, you can do things like make the packaging nice-nice.

      People care about the product. If you're so far gone that you fetishize the packaging...well dude you're way out there. Honestly, I envy you and wish that I had more money than brains. Unfortunately, I'm on the short side of that ratio.

      --
      Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
    69. Re:Wrap rage...? by xs650 · · Score: 1

      The parent is some of the best humor I have seen on /. Why is it rated insightful?

    70. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Indeed, I tend to be more impressed with the company if the product arrives in a plain cardboard box, printed with vegetable-based inks, and no plastic packaging waste.

      Yeah, I love Apple's packaging too.

    71. Re:Wrap rage...? by Chirs · · Score: 1

      Do you move house often enough that keeping toe packaging to help moving actually makes a difference?

      I once moved six times in four years. At that point it *absolutely* paid off to keep the packaging around. Now that I've bought a house the packaging for almost everything has been chucked.

    72. Re:Wrap rage...? by filthpickle · · Score: 1

      I save the box/packaging for any medium/large electronic device I buy. Or usually any expensive ones also. However, I probably move more than most people.

      I know I kept the box for the ipad, but I couldn't tell you where it was. I would guess inside the box for my TV, with all the other smaller boxes. The people posting that this isn't "normal" are just being assholes. You don't get to decide what is normal and what isn't on things like this that don't matter and don't affect anyone else. And don't give me any bullshit about recycling cardboard....if it is sitting in my empty closet then it isn't sitting in a landfill.

    73. Re:Wrap rage...? by cellocgw · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Moving once every 3 years is not normal, and nothing you do to facilitate that will be considered normal.
      Never heard of the Armed Forces, have you?

      --
      https://app.box.com/WitthoftResume Code: https://github.com/cellocgw
    74. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wait, you don't recycle the plastic?

      And you are all for killing trees?

      And you didn't know that you can get the manual online as a PDF?

      And UPS has boxes to ship returns in?

      Hmmmm...

    75. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well put. This is a ridiculous article. Now we love apple because of their packaging too? And really it takes minutes to open your new tablet package? Did the author lose their thumbs? Can we whine about something else, how about the quality of the cardboard apple uses for its boxes- surely it's better too, and that means they care more about my unboxing experience...

    76. Re:Wrap rage...? by Hatta · · Score: 1

      It's currently enjoying a place of honor between my SE/30 and Amiga 500. Outfitted it with a CFFA 3000 which emulates Disk II floppies and smart port hard drives, and I added a 4mb RAM card. All it needs now is an accelerator. Really sweet little system, I don't think I could part with it unless I had to.

      I do have an Apple IIe I'm looking to get rid of. Two Disk II drives, Apple Monitor III, Super Serial Card, and System Saver. I can provide a full ADT Pro setup with it. No boxes on this one though.

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    77. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      CONFORM DEVIANT!

      Abnormal behavior is prohibited!

    78. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >distbin lorries

      That sounds so much nicer than "garbage trucks."

    79. Re:Wrap rage...? by ifiwereasculptor · · Score: 5, Funny

      So in all of technology, only Apple users ever upgrade?

      Only Apple suckers ever need to! Go on, iSheeple, buy your fancy, expensive new iGadgets, while I have access to the same functionality with my non-Apple PC from the 90s. It has about as much processing power as an iPhone 4S, also runs apps, plays games and I can use its modem to make phone calls by attaching it to a landline. Some faggy Apple shills will claim it's not as portable, but it's mounted on a fucking wheelbarrel.

    80. Re:Wrap rage...? by cvtan · · Score: 1

      I agree about peeling off the protective films. I have seen quite a few items that have had the films left on for long periods (HP DVMs etc.). Eventually the film refuses to come off. For some reason people refuse to believe the film is there only to protect the shiny bits during manufacture and shipping; they are AFRAID to remove it. This reminds me of the 1950-60's habit of putting clear plastic covers on living room furniture and car seats. Looks nice, but you never enjoy the feel of the seat as it was intended.

      --
      Sorry, but gray text on gray background is making my eyes bleed.
    81. Re:Wrap rage...? by TheP4st · · Score: 1

      Normal behavior is to keep the box until you verify that the thing works, then you chuck the box.

      Defining what is normal is in many cases far from a clear cut line. In some instances I too keep boxes. I buy plenty of camera gear at the higher end of the price scale, and I likewise sell gear regularly. To be able to sell a +1000 euro lens with the box adds another 50 or so in its second hand value, that is 50 euros easily earned by keeping the box stashed away, money which I can spend on some little nice extra gadget or on a treat for my wife. Granted that having a wife to spend money on may not be considered a normal thing here on /. but in the rest of the world it is quite normal.

      --
      "I have downloaded hundreds and hundreds of records, why would I care if somebody downloads ours?" Robin Pecknold
    82. Re:Wrap rage...? by v1 · · Score: 1

      Yes, people keep Apple product packaging. Part of the reason I keep mine is my gear always has a good resale value several years from now when it's time to upgrade. (one of the often overlooked benefits of buying Apple) And people will pay more for a gadget that comes with all the original accessories and the box in good condition. Buyers picture you as someone that has taken good care of the gadget and will prefer your listing over similarly priced listings that lack accessories and box.

      It also means when I ship it to the seller, it will be safe even from the UPS gorillas because it's in packaging specifically designed to protect it from rough handling. Instead of mummifying it in bubble wrap and then boxing it, I put the original box IN a box of peanuts. And it arrives perfect every time. Even that time they punched a softball-size hole in the box.

      Apple improves their packaging every few years also. The packages get smaller, have less unrecyclable materials in them, and continue to provide the same level of protection. They've even made the size of their service parts boxes smaller, a little feature few see.

      --
      I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
    83. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Just like Apple referbs?

    84. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      He's saying that it's expensive.

      And yes, they're pretty guilty of forced upgrades for features everyone already has (i.e. sticking with 320x480 for almost 4 years is embarrassing for any other company)

    85. Re:Wrap rage...? by Mithent · · Score: 5, Informative

      I was going to point out Amazon's Kindle packaging, yes. It's understated in a different way to Apple's, and feels more utilitarian, but it has its own distinctive style, is extremely easy to open, and uses little plastic.

    86. Re:Wrap rage...? by JazzLad · · Score: 1

      "Apple, Samsung and Amazon get it, why doesn't Google?"

      Heck, I bet there are a lot of companies in both camps, but it wouldn't be /. without a Apple vs Google story.

      --
      "If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear." - Every fascist, ever
    87. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Everyone upgrades when they need to. Apple products encourage people to just buy the newest version all the time so you can be seen with the newest version, similar to how car manufacturers in the 50s tried to create new styles every year. Nobody wants to be perceived as the pathetically poor consumer who's still stuck with a 3-year-old version.

    88. Re:Wrap rage...? by Pieroxy · · Score: 2

      Moving once every 3 years is not normal, and nothing you do to facilitate that will be considered normal.
      You are not normal. Stop arguing as if saving boxes for shit is normal.

      Normal behavior is to keep the box until you verify that the thing works, then you chuck the box.

      What is this normal behavior you're trying to tell us about? Your way of living?

      Hint: We don't give a fuck how you live.
      Hint2: You shouldn't give a fuck how we live, unless we're pissing on your front yard.

      Have a good day.

    89. Re:Wrap rage...? by Mithent · · Score: 1

      I've seen that - a relative of mine refused to take any of the film off her new laptop. And some people use that plastic film on touchscreen devices as a "screen protector" (here, for example). Utility of protecting a toughened glass screen with less-scratch-resistant plastic aside (I guess it works as long as you replace the protector sometimes, but I haven't found the need for one since we moved away from resistive touchscreens), it's designed to come off easily, not to be optically clear, an appropriate texture or to be permanently attached.

    90. Re:Wrap rage...? by farble1670 · · Score: 1

      right. add 20% to the resale value for having the original materials. i* boxes are usually minimal and don't take up a lot of space either.

    91. Re:Wrap rage...? by Pieroxy · · Score: 0

      I might one day want to sell my Apple IIgs

      How's today sound?

      Sounds like you're stupid.

    92. Re:Wrap rage...? by fatphil · · Score: 1

      Not just iPhonies doing it. I'm sure the iPads or whatever do get used a little (but probably they're cosmetic accessories as much as anything else). In contrast, there are some people who have no interest in making use of the thing they buy, they just want to acquire it so that they can trade it on again - in the field of "craft beer". This sums it up nicely: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bbvO5eB1wI

      --
      Also FatPhil on SoylentNews, id 863
    93. Re:Wrap rage...? by BronsCon · · Score: 1

      Looks like you forgot to check the "Post Anonymously" box.

      --
      APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
    94. Re:Wrap rage...? by thetoadwarrior · · Score: 1

      You mean like all the dorks crying that they're not getting their nexus 7 yet while people are walking into shops and picking on up? Yes, it is first world problem shit but first world people shit can make people change their mind on what to buy and when you fuck up something so basic it really makes it look like you don't care so why should I believe the hardware is high quality?

    95. Re:Wrap rage...? by ne0n · · Score: 1

      I'm actually looking forward to the day those weaklings susceptible to wrap rage are going to be part of the zombie horde.

      Just me and my shotgun, baby. Weeding out the unfit as Darwin intended. Might open up a N7 in front of them just to make it interesting.

      --
      $ :(){ :|:& };:
    96. Re:Wrap rage...? by fatphil · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Mostly agree, but I wouldn't have thought "nonchalently" was the best adverb. "Narcissistically" seems to be closer.

      --
      Also FatPhil on SoylentNews, id 863
    97. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No they are the ones who most need to plan ahead financially...

    98. Re:Wrap rage...? by Pieroxy · · Score: 2

      Looks like you forgot to check the "Post Anonymously" box.

      What for?

    99. Re:Wrap rage...? by Jesus_666 · · Score: 3, Funny

      iPads come with a tablet? Wow. I guess I'll have to keep that stuff they fill the box with the next time I buy one.

      --
      USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
    100. Re:Wrap rage...? by mrchaotica · · Score: 1

      Tape is a non-issue; you have to slit the tape on the external shipping box anyway (same as if you had an Apple tablet delivered by mail, by the way).

      I have a Nexus 7 too, and I didn't find the sleeve to be too tight.

      --

      "[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz

    101. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      We never have to plan ahead financially for the next iDevice. There's lots of cash in the trust fund. :-)

    102. Re:Wrap rage...? by BronsCon · · Score: 3, Informative

      To not be a dick quite so openly?

      --
      APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
    103. Re:Wrap rage...? by DogDude · · Score: 0

      What you're describing is an unhealthy obsession with stuff. I don't care what brand of pots you have, and neither should you, unless you're a chef. And, why would it matter if "cookware" gets dinged up in a move? Might want to think about what you're saying here, dude.

      --
      I don't respond to AC's.
    104. Re:Wrap rage...? by DogDude · · Score: 1

      Written like somebody who doesn't have an unhealthy obsession with stuff.

      --
      I don't respond to AC's.
    105. Re:Wrap rage...? by tibman · · Score: 1

      Yeah, what was up with that? They need to make sharper collar stays for situations just like this.

      --
      http://soylentnews.org/~tibman
    106. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm sorry, this is horseshit. Packaging is only important to those who form incorrect ideas about things based on their packaging. "OMG the box is so awesome, what's inside must be the pinnacle of technology." When in fact, it has no bearing really on the tech inside, and your argument does nothing but support exactly how shallow the customers you are aiming for are.

      I understand the whole resale argument, and that applies to a perfectly good prodcut that came in shitty packaging that was deftly opened without destruction.
      Case in point, I just purchased a pair of headphones in "like new" condition off eBay...and while I was glad to see the packaging was in retail condition, it didn't stop me from recycling it as fast as I could. See, I worried about how this package would affect my environment, and that of those to come. None of what you support seems to fall in line with that, so yeah, fucking shallow as previously noted.

    107. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Lovely, he points out the initial waste by Apple, and all you can do is pat them on the back. And all this not too long after serious backlash forced Apple to retry to make their stuff meet EPEAT standards.

    108. Re:Wrap rage...? by Politburo · · Score: 1

      Some ~10% of the population is in the Armed Forces. I've never heard of 10% of a population being used to define "normal", have you?

    109. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I didn't have that problem because my sleeve was dented. I guess the vacuum seal escaped. :-}

    110. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Interestingly, I just finished reading the Hunger Games trilogy, where a main premise is that folks who live in a gleaming and wealthy Capitol can't understand anyone else's concerns but their own (despite the fact that most of the rest of their country is starving), so they occupy their time with trivial and bizarre fashions while enjoying the entertainment of having children from the poor Districts compete in a gladiator-esque fight to the death.

      Compared to 95% of the world's population I understand that the vast majority of American concerns can be considered "first world problems", but I agree - wrap rage?! It kinda makes me want to dump anyone who has ever seriously felt "wrap rage" into an arena with some axes and knives and see who comes out alive.

    111. Re:Wrap rage...? by Pieroxy · · Score: 1

      I am who I am. Why hide? You surely didn't in your comment either...

    112. Re:Wrap rage...? by mathfeel · · Score: 1

      I have the Nexus 7.

      First of all, the unboxing wasn't that bad. The box was taped, yes, but once I sliced it the box slid apart with no issues. The wrap around the Nexus 7 was not that hard to remove. The only way you can bugger that up is to not notice the directions. There's arrows, move this, then that, and it slides out. When I unpacked some iPads for work they were basically similar in their unpacking.

      However, the part that got me about the packing is the sleeve. The box itself was fine. The box slid into a sleeve that had the artwork.

      I was about ready to throw the goddamned thing against the wall. The sleeve was pressure fit so tightly that Hercu-Thumbs couldn't even slide it out. After fussing with it for a few minutes I went into a rage and tore that sonovabitch up. If I had to do it again I wouldn't even bother with sliding it off, I'd get a letter opener or something like it to take apart the sleeve at its seam.

      Whoever thought of that packing design should be dragged out to the street and SHOT.

      I did not find putting the box back to the sleeve too hard. Maybe every box is different?

      --
      The only possible interpretation of any research whatever in the 'social sciences' is: some do, some don't
    113. Re:Wrap rage...? by XahXhaX · · Score: 1

      There are other good reasons. I personally would not buy an electronic device over a site like Craigslist without some sort of packaging and/or paperwork. Too many encounters with obviously stolen merchandise.

    114. Re:Wrap rage...? by nabsltd · · Score: 1

      I resell stuff on ebay, and yes it's been used, but you will get a lot more money if you can advertise it as "new" in appearance.

      Not really, since the only effective difference between "Like New" and "Very Good" on eBay's grading scale is that "Like New" must include everything that came with the item when it was purchased. The actual condition of the item in both cases needs to be identical, even though the description for "Very Good" is much more long-winded. Basically, if you have a "scuff, scratch, hole or crack" on the exterior of an item, it technically doesn't even qualify as "Very Good", yet nobody will care about most pieces of electronics having a scuff, especially if it is hidden from view during normal use.

      I've got a lot of historical auction data that my sniping program keeps, and it shows that even "brand new" doesn't give you much of a boost over "very good", unless the new item has a valid warranty of decent length. For items like optical disks that are at least "Good", the only thing that really matters is the current retail availability and price. Except for the fact that I don't have every bit that came with all my DVDs and Blu-Rays (those advertising inserts get recycled), every on of them would qualify as "Like New", since they've only been "played" once (to rip to my media server). I'm not alone in this, so it's not hard to find "Like New" DVDs.

    115. Re:Wrap rage...? by PerfectionLost · · Score: 1

      Or they need to make more intelligent people that wear collared shirts...

    116. Re:Wrap rage...? by schlachter · · Score: 1

      keep that wrap range under wraps...will ya?

      --
      My God can beat up your God. Just kidding...don't take offense. I know there's no God.
    117. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Look at that, a first post defending bad design and expecting people to adapt to our tools instead of making the tools adapt to people.

    118. Re:Wrap rage...? by BronsCon · · Score: 1

      Mine was provoked, whereas yours was not. Besides, much like you probably do, I've got karma to burn.

      --
      APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
    119. Re:Wrap rage...? by smooth+wombat · · Score: 1

      don't care what brand of pots you have, and neither should you,

      Yes, one should care about the type, not necessarily the brand, of cookware they have. The better quality ones will last a lifetime under normal usage and can most likely be passed on (if you have progeny). The flimsy, thin crap one gets at WalMart or elsewhere doesn't cook as well, wears out in a few years and you end up paying more for it than had you spent the money in the first place. I had the cheap stuff. There is no comparison.

      As to why it matters if it gets dinged, I care. I paid for it. It's mine. I take care of things which are mine. Not OCD take care of, but in the general sense of why beat it up?

      My last car I had for almost 13 years. I had to take a co-worker to pick up his car after work and he couldn't believe it was that old. Sure, some things here and there showed their age, but otherwise, it was kept clean. Why? Because if I'm going to spend that kind of money for something, I'm going to take care of it so it lasts.

      Might want to think about what you're saying here, dude.

      Apparently you're like so many others who keep spending money to replace things they broke because they didn't care about taking care of them or who buy the cheapest crap they can find. If you don't care about your things, that's your right. Just because I choose to take care of what I have doesn't make me the oddball. Maybe you're the one who might want to think about what they're saying.

      --
      We will bankrupt ourselves in the vain search for absolute security. -- Dwight D. Eisenhower
    120. Re:Wrap rage...? by desdinova+216 · · Score: 1

      I don't know about you but I find the box and tape you mentioned to be a lot easier than the plastic clamshell packaging that some companies use

    121. Re:Wrap rage...? by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

      The sleeve was pressure fit so tightly that Hercu-Thumbs couldn't even slide it out.

      Hmm, I didn't have any trouble with it. Just held the box by the sides and pushed with my thumbs. I do recall thinking it's a little tight. But you know, eh, I like tight.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    122. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You should be applauding Apple's approach because you and MisterSquid get what they want out of it.

      Why should he applaud anyone, he paid for the damn thing, that's all the thanks they deserve.

    123. Re:Wrap rage...? by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

      Asus/Google's packaging was perfectly fine and far and above what you would see on the vast majority of consumer products. It may be inferior to Apple's (can't say since I don't have an iPad), but who really cares.

      I don't know about typical Apple buyers, but I for one tend to be impressed more by the simple, understated look. With decent industrial design of course, but I really really don't want to be in my face. Like the box for the most recent graphics card, which has a big breasted Tinkerbell kind of thing on it. Ookkkay.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    124. Re:Wrap rage...? by DogDude · · Score: 0

      There's a difference between buying decent stuff that lasts and obsessing over it. You sound seriously OCD to me...

      --
      I don't respond to AC's.
    125. Re:Wrap rage...? by jayesel · · Score: 1

      Yes, I do, especially of an Apple product. Everything else is just useless mindless crap that clutters.

    126. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      As a neutral judge in this contest, I find both of your penises to be the same size. It's a tie. Now stop waving them around and put them back where no one else has to look at them.

    127. Re:Wrap rage...? by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

      Packaging matters as much as the wrapping on a bag of chips, it's there to hold whatever is inside and protect your hand from oil burns.

      What makes you think iFans don't save their chip bags?

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    128. Re:Wrap rage...? by cpu6502 · · Score: 1

      Yeah like I care. What are they going to do? Complain to ebay? "They got a scratch on the Apple Mac cardbaord box!!!" Ebay would just laugh at them.

      --
      My AC stalker: " I personally agree with your posts most of the time, but that won't keep me from modding you troll"
    129. Re:Wrap rage...? by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

      my gear always has a good resale value several years from now when it's time to upgrade.

      Well, in simple terms Google just effectively cut the price of tablets in half. Prices for used iPad 1 and 2 are sure to do likewise. If you're hoping for that resale value thing you probably better ebay it, like, tomorrow.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    130. Re:Wrap rage...? by datavirtue · · Score: 1

      Man, opening clam-shells with scissors is dangerous--potentially damaging the scissors. I would suggest kitchen shears at the very least, and a blowtorch.

      --
      I object to power without constructive purpose. --Spock
    131. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      10% is fairly significant when taken as the totality of the population. While not "average" it certainly isn't abnormal.

      You'd also need to include the population that moves for jobs as contractors on a frequent basis, or other ancillary support to the armed forces (civilian and contract personnel) ... they move fairly frequently as well.

    132. Re:Wrap rage...? by datavirtue · · Score: 1

      I kept my LCD TV box (44") and it has become a real pain in the ass. I don't want to get rid of it though.

      --
      I object to power without constructive purpose. --Spock
    133. Re:Wrap rage...? by Cute+Fuzzy+Bunny · · Score: 1

      Not only the weakest whine in the world, but I actually get pissed when I see a company spent an extra $5 to $10 (or more) on packaging I'm going to throw away.

      Fitbit and Ooma join Apple in this. I think I paid as much for their boxes and packaging as the product assembly cost.

    134. Re:Wrap rage...? by Cute+Fuzzy+Bunny · · Score: 1

      I think they should just be kept in their boxes on the shelf, original shrink wrap intact. Forever.

    135. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Some cookware (Calphalon One being the example) is infused adonized aluminum & scratches do a wonder on the anti-stick properties.

    136. Re:Wrap rage...? by sexconker · · Score: 0

      Normal has a definition, despite what what the liberals like to claim.

      Normal - adjective
      1 - usual: conforming to the usual standard, type, or custom

      Hint: Keeping boxes for years is not normal.
      Hint 2: I don't give a shit what he does - I give a shit at him claiming his behavior is normal when it isn't.

      Have a bad day.

    137. Re:Wrap rage...? by BronsCon · · Score: 1

      I kept my LCD TV box (44")

      You've got some kind of complex, I'm afraid.

      --
      APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
    138. Re:Wrap rage...? by v1 · · Score: 1

      yes that probably won't apply well to tablets, not now anyway. I was referring more to laptop computers. I get a new machine on the average every 3 years. I get from $800-1500 for them depending on age. Try selling a 3 yr old (anything but Apple) laptop for anywhere near that price.

      Tablets are still in price freefall because there are so many new players running onto the field, it's a madhouse. I can't be on the internet for more than a few minutes before I'm advertised by someone selling a tablet. We won't see price stability until the market calms down and most of the "hey I think I can make a better selling tablet than the other 200 out there already!" have flamed out.

      But it shouldn't be long now. Microsoft makes an excellent barometer for this sort of thing, they're usually the last major player to enter a given market. Look at MP3 players. About the time the Zune came out, the portable music market was settled. And the surface isn't far from release, so tablets should be approaching a settling point here real soon.

      --
      I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
    139. Re:Wrap rage...? by Scragglykat · · Score: 1

      You may have seen these people on the popular reality television show, iHoarder.

    140. Re:Wrap rage...? by mosb1000 · · Score: 1

      Unfortunately, this is normal. That's why so many Americans have garages filled with junk that belongs in a landfill and end up on the show "Hoarders."

    141. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah like I care. What are they going to do? Complain to ebay?

      Interesting. So it's ok for you to sell to others a "damaged product" as "like new", but it isn't ok for others to do the same to you.

      Ebay would just laugh at them.

      Why? Regardless of the product, the box can be a valuable part of what you are buying. And whether it is for a Mac, or a video game, or a DVD, or whatever, if your auction claimed that the box was in "like new" condition, then selling a damaged box is fraud, and you should be dealt with in the same way you deal with receiving deceptively-described items. Truly it would be delicious irony to see the buyer of your auction keep both your Mac and the $1,000 they paid for it because you lied about the freaking box.

      Note, all of this is irrelevant if your auction made no claims regarding the state of the box.

    142. Re:Wrap rage...? by Algae_94 · · Score: 1

      It's good you keep those boxes. You're going to have to move soon to a bigger place so you have room for all of your boxes.

      I've known many people that keep the boxes, I don't. I'd rather not spend time unpacking and repacking rarely used items like that. If I don't use something enough to justify keeping it out of its packaging. I don't need that item.

    143. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Some would say being in the Armed Forces is not normal.

    144. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And you sound like a really spiteful little boy that enjoys hurting other people.

    145. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      WTF are you buying, porn?

    146. Re:Wrap rage...? by dargaud · · Score: 1

      Moving once every 3 years is not normal

      I don't know about the US, but in France people living in apartments move every 3 years on average. It's longer for people in houses. And I moved 19 times between the age of 18 and 40. Just couldn't get a long term job.

      --
      Non-Linux Penguins ?
    147. Re:Wrap rage...? by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      The article seems inherently biased towards Apple. The phrases used are not neutral. No attempt is made to justify the other side of the issue and it assumes that more expensive packaging is preferrable by all readers.

    148. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yep, it's just PC shills that are trying to make their boxes sound better.

      Watch one of the PC shills try and debate it!

      (sound familiar in reverse? Seems how most people talk here.)

    149. Re:Wrap rage...? by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      It's just a phone, tablet, or mp3 player. "Personal device" is a bit over the top. You use the devices, you don't "experience" them.

    150. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Many people don't understand packaging is very important and your post, unfortunately, is no exception.

      In the case of tablets and phones, packaging is the first personal encounter with what is intended to be a personal device. Getting this step right is crucial to shaping how a consumer perceives the product and too many companies neglect this simple but ineluctable point.

      Citation needed.

      I assert that 99% of the people don't give a hoot about packaging. I have as much proof as you do, but at least I have common sense on my side and don't sound like a marketing suit.

    151. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's normal when you buy something that holds it's value.

    152. Re:Wrap rage...? by danomac · · Score: 1

      I did not find putting the box back to the sleeve too hard. Maybe every box is different?

      I wasn't trying to put the box back into the sleeve, I couldn't get the box out of the sleeve.

      It wasn't just me: I had a defect and so I called Google and they told me it was defective and to go exchange it as I only had it for 3 days. I found a replacement the next town over, so I drove there to exchange it.

      The manager and I figured we should check the replacement, and guess what. He couldn't slide the box out either after multiple attempts and wasting about five minutes, he used a box cutter to get the sleeve off. I even held it with both hands on the counter while he tried to push the box out and it was a no-go.

    153. Re:Wrap rage...? by Pascal+Sartoretti · · Score: 1

      Ah, the joys of owning an iDevice. You have to constantly plan ahead financially for when the next version comes out.

      Yes, but Apple customers are usually happy to do it, and look forward to replace their current iDevice.

      In contrast, the typical Microsoft customers are companies who buys new licenses because they can't avoid it.

    154. Re:Wrap rage...? by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

      not shallow but deep

      Bullshit. That's as shallow as you can get. It's the failure to appreciate the work that goes into making something simple that is shallow. Something can be a lot of work and still be shallow, nobody is claiming the don't waste a lot of time and money and resources on their packaging, so that's both a strawman and a false dichotomy.

      He meant "deep for an Apple fan". If you just keep that in perspective, it all makes sense.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    155. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Let's see, how do I explain this to a person who is familiar with eBay. See if a person doesn't like your product or the transaction, they rate you down. Getting rated down lowers your overall rating which is what people use to decide whether or not you are trustworthy. Not caring if people are unhappy about your transaction will lead to you not selling things on eBay much longer. Got it now? The buyers on eBay have all the power. eBay does not simply "laugh at people" when they have a complaint. They take things seriously - and in a debate will almost always side with the seller. If you have never run into problems as a seller on eBay you have obviously not sold very many items there.

    156. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So, that's why it costs so much more for an I-Pad, it's the pretty packaging that is costing more. For an inexpensive tablet, who the hell cares about the packaging. Maybe Google should have had a $199 unit with current packaging and a $300 unit for simple to open and pretty packaging. Then maybe there wouldn't have been so 'much ado about nothing'.

    157. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, of all the things that qualify as first world problems...

      And really? People keep i* packaging? That's kinda weird and squirrelly.

      Exactly... The story about "packaging fetishists" is just as much about doing something wrong as it is about doing it right. Why not just make packaging that is easy to open and recycle, and let the consumer enjoy just the product instead of worrying about the box? Or, at least, make the box in a form factor that is easy to actually reuse instead of inspiring Apple fans to collect shelves and shelves of meaningless cardboard. I mean, at least pewter figurines or tea sets or pictures of old people has some prolonged sentimental value. With an iPad, are you really going to give two shits about it after you get the next generation version?

      Thanks, Apple, for putting time into thinking about how to get me to hang on to MORE shit I don't need.

      I would point at the packaging on the Kindle Fire as an excellent example of this. Elegant, simple and pretty much all recyclable.

    158. Re:Wrap rage...? by Pieroxy · · Score: 1

      Maybe I'm just having a bad day after all. And if you don't burn your karma, what is it good for?

    159. Re:Wrap rage...? by Pieroxy · · Score: 1

      Normal has a definition, despite what what the liberals like to claim.

      Normal - adjective
      1 - usual: conforming to the usual standard, type, or custom

      Hint: Keeping boxes for years is not normal.

      And you are the judge of normality? Who the heck do you think you are? How do you know "the usual standard, type, or custom"?

      Hint 2: I don't give a shit what he does - I give a shit at him claiming his behavior is normal when it isn't.

      Have a bad day.

    160. Re:Wrap rage...? by BronsCon · · Score: 1

      I'm with ya on that last bit. I prefer not to burn it for the sake of burning it, though; I tend to use it as an insurance policy for my soap box.

      --
      APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
    161. Re:Wrap rage...? by Mr+Z · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You're confusing "normal" with "majority" or maybe "common." Something can be perfectly normal without the majority of people doing it or it even being particularly common. For example, it's perfectly normal to have a pet bird, although it's fairly uncommon: only 4% of households have a pet bird.

    162. Re:Wrap rage...? by Mr+Z · · Score: 1

      You're confusing "normal" with "majority" or maybe "common." Something can be perfectly normal without the majority of people doing it or it even being particularly common. For example, it's perfectly normal to have a pet bird, although it's fairly uncommon: only 4% of households have a pet bird.

      WTF does "liberal" have to do with it? Now, persecution complexes: Those aren't normal, although they're fairly common amongst a certain sort...

    163. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And to me you sound like a consumer fetishist and part of the reason why garbage has to be shipped to other countries to deal with. The modern american, disposable life.

    164. Re:Wrap rage...? by Karlt1 · · Score: 1

      "And yes, they're pretty guilty of forced upgrades for features everyone already has"

      Because Android manufacturers are well known for timely upgrades for phones and they never ship new phones with older versions of the OS.....

    165. Re:Wrap rage...? by epine · · Score: 1

      So in all of technology, only Apple users ever upgrade?

      The magic of compound interest. Those of us who didn't buy any overpriced OS 8 or earlier Macs can upgrade our PCs for the rest of our days on compound interest alone. Interest rates have fallen, but my average purchase is less than 1/3 as much and the obsolescence curve is graceful, so I can pick my spots. Unfortunately, my Linux loyalties haven't worked out half so well. The African Queen mutated into an ayeSauron.

      Of course, there must be a few old-timey Apple owners out there who purchased an early Mac as an inexpensive downgrade from a Sun Workstation, and who can therefore write-off future upgrades on the perpetual interest stream accruing to outrageous expense averted. And to think that people once complained about the New Math.

    166. Re:Wrap rage...? by Karlt1 · · Score: 1

      "Everyone upgrades when they need to. Apple products encourage people to just buy the newest version all the time so you can be seen with the newest version,"

      So other manufacturers discourage customers from buying their products?

    167. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      wheelbarrel

      One day, heathen, you will know the joys of the iBarrow.

    168. Re:Wrap rage...? by Antarell · · Score: 1

      It's brilliant. I was surprised to see that nearly all the packaging from my Kindle went in the recycle bin. All tech companies need to take note of this.

    169. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Disks? In the internet age?

    170. Re:Wrap rage...? by yurtinus · · Score: 1

      After spending a long time cooking with cheap pans, I have to disagree. The brand doesn't really matter much - but there is definitely something to be said for reasonably good cookware. Consistent heat spread, solid handles that don't get loose, *and* the floors of my pans aren't going to deform and need to be tossed out. Also, I would not be pleased if the cooking surface got dinged up - makes things stick that otherwise wouldn't.

      All that said, I didn't hang on to the packaging - that's just weird.

      --
      +1 Disagree
    171. Re:Wrap rage...? by yurtinus · · Score: 1

      It's cool, he's only a dick on the internet.

      --
      +1 Disagree
    172. Re:Wrap rage...? by yurtinus · · Score: 1

      I'm with you mostly - but for one glaring exception: the god damned blister pack. Few people care about the packaging until it gets in the way of enjoying their purchase. If I need to get my tin snips out to get at my purchase, somebody (probably more than one somebody...) is doing something wrong.

      --
      +1 Disagree
    173. Re:Wrap rage...? by yurtinus · · Score: 1

      Yeah, thanks for getting my hopes up. No really, I *wanted* another scarf this year instead of an iPad. Jerks.

      --
      +1 Disagree
    174. Re:Wrap rage...? by Lunix+Nutcase · · Score: 1

      (i.e. sticking with 320x480 for almost 4 years is embarrassing for any other company)

      You mean like this phone from Samsung? Oh and it is only about a month old at this point.

    175. Re:Wrap rage...? by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      People care about the product. If you're so far gone that you fetishize the packaging...well dude you're way out there. Honestly, I envy you and wish that I had more money than brains. Unfortunately, I'm on the short side of that ratio.

      It can be a simple observation that the Apple packaging is nicer. Doesn't have to be a fetish.

      Also the concept that Apple wastes money because it can on the packaging just doesn't ring true. The packaging might give a person an idea of the care that went into the actual product.

      Even then, yeah, some of us actually like "luxury" products. I spent enough years in the Yugo/Trabant world of cheap as possible PC's to appreciate the Apple world. It isn't for everyone, because people have the right to demand the lowest price on everything. But in a world where I watched two people nearly come to violence on a 5 cent difference on the price of RAM, 9and that's hardly the only example) I'll spend a few extra bucks on a better product. And if it has nice packaging? Not a problem.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    176. Re:Wrap rage...? by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      Actually, this is nothing new, nor specific to apple. A lot of people keep the boxes that products come in, especially if the product has enough value to be worth repackaging in its box for resale or storage later

      And some people just keep boxes. My Father passed away last week, and as executor of the estate, I'm finding out that he saved the box of everything he bought for the last 25 years. Weren't any Apple product boxes though.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    177. Re:Wrap rage...? by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      Maybe we need a poll for this to see how normal it actually is.

      People who post on Slashdot talking about what's normal and what isn't! Oy!

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    178. Re:Wrap rage...? by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      Keeping it because it's beautiful is just dumb, though.

      Well, there are issues of Communication Arts that deal with packaging, with examples and discussion, and as a person who worked in Graphic Arts for a long time, I can tell you that if people are keeping the packaging, it is an unqualified success.

      Despite what a lot of Slashdotters think, Packaging is very important. Packaging might speak to quality, lifestyle, approach to resources, and other aspects.

      An Apple product can usually be identified by the packaging, long before you read the package to see what is in it.

      A rock bottom price electronic device is also identifiable by the packaging it uses. It's a sort of lack of design, design.

      It's one step above the generic food or my favorite - Beer designs that have nothing other than the word and the legal requirements - black lettering on a white background. But the design does tell us about the product, and to some extent about ourselves. And it is not surprising that people who dislike Apple dislike and ridicule their packaging, because it stands for something that they don't care for. And vice versa.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    179. Re:Wrap rage...? by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      I actually get pissed when I see a company spent an extra $5 to $10 (or more) on packaging I'm going to throw away.

      I'll bet you drink that generic beer that comes in cans that only say BEER.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    180. Re:Wrap rage...? by Johann+Lau · · Score: 1

      All fans are kind of fucked in the head. Or let me be more fair: we all fucking suck whenever we are infected with and acting as an agent of fandom. There's appreciating something, even deeply so; and then there's "identifying with an idea" and other such crap. It's a sickness.

      I guess the banal truth is that people not only pay a heavy markup on the hardware, but also on the design (design costs + markup = price) of the fucking handbags or whatever that crap comes in. So they have to keep them, since selling stuff on Ebay in the original package is worth more, if ever so slightly, than selling the exact same functional items in a cardboard box.

      Since that is so terribly sad and lame, it gets plastered over with euphemisms like "out-of-box experience". It kinda, uhm, figures. (get it? haha)

    181. Re:Wrap rage...? by socceroos · · Score: 1

      Homosexuals. ;)

    182. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Only Apple suckers ever need to! Go on, iSheeple, buy your fancy, expensive new iGadgets, while I have access to the same functionality with my non-Apple PC from the 90s. It has about as much processing power as an iPhone 4S....

      So you're the one that can run Crysis maxed!

      PS. When you do upgrade, can I please have your "old" computer? It appears to be lightyears ahead of any tech I can buy.

    183. Re:Wrap rage...? by quacking+duck · · Score: 1

      People keep the packaging for returns and because selling your mint condition iDevice with mint condition packaging means you get higher resell value on eBay.

      Ah, the joys of owning an iDevice. You have to constantly plan ahead financially for when the next version comes out.

      So, the takeaway is, what? Only iDevice/Apple owners plan ahead financially for stuff?

      I guess this explains a) the housing and economic crisis the last few years, and b) why Apple stuff has been utterly recession-proof so far, despite not playing in the cheap, low-margin space of any product category.

    184. Re:Wrap rage...? by quacking+duck · · Score: 1

      You've hit the distinction though--"if the product arrives in..."

      You've already ordered it, based on whatever research you've done (or not done). At that point you don't care what the packaging looks like when it's delivered to you.

      Mass-consumer goods sitting on store shelves or behind security glass, on the other hand, *haven't* been bought yet, and it's competing with other products for your attention.

      Of course, this means any shiny packaging on expensive goods (especially Apple gear) must themselves be put into plain shipping boxes if they're actually delivered to you, lest they attract the attention of thieves.

      Don't get me wrong, I fully agree with what you say, I keep and reuse lots of stuff myself. But, I also acknowledge the unfortunate reality that visual presentation and impression is the very first thing people notice, and marketing people exploit this as much as possible.

    185. Re:Wrap rage...? by caitsith01 · · Score: 1

      Agreed - it's brilliant. Arrives safely, can't come open accidentally, yet when you want to open it you have a Kindle in your hands in about 4 seconds and a small amount of cardboard to throw away.

      This should be the gold standard for all tech companies.

      --
      Read Pynchon.
    186. Re:Wrap rage...? by caitsith01 · · Score: 1

      Many people don't understand packaging is very important and your post, unfortunately, is no exception.

      In the case of tablets and phones, packaging is the first personal encounter with what is intended to be a personal device. Getting this step right is crucial to shaping how a consumer perceives the product and too many companies neglect this simple but ineluctable point.

      Underlying your post is an assumption that the person buying this device is sufficiently shallow, stupid, and lacking in perception that the way it is packaged actually alters their subsequent experience with it. Which might be true for people who buy phones etc. on the basis of image or "lifestyle" factors, but doesn't matter to people who buy things on the basis of what they actually do.

      I had a Motorola phone which came in an amazing box - a crazy extruded metal lid which slid off to reveal the phone etc seated in a sort of display cabinet. The phone was still a piece of shit. OTOH I have a Sony phone now which came in a very boring white box, but the phone is a joy to use.

      Or maybe the people you're talking about are the same ones who when given presents for Christmas as kids would play with the box and not the present?

      As a few people have noted, the Kindle comes in amazingly simple, instantly disposable packaging. I don't think less of my Kindle because it didn't come in some kind of Russian doll box folded by ninjas like an ipad does. In fact it just confirms to me that what matters is what it does, not the box it came in.

      --
      Read Pynchon.
    187. Re:Wrap rage...? by mjwx · · Score: 1

      I'm with you mostly - but for one glaring exception: the god damned blister pack. Few people care about the packaging until it gets in the way of enjoying their purchase. If I need to get my tin snips out to get at my purchase, somebody (probably more than one somebody...) is doing something wrong.

      Yep, I agree but companies know the blister pack is a royal pain in the arse, they're just cheap (although I'm buying mice for $10 in a cardboard box these days so someone's catching on).

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    188. Re:Wrap rage...? by rsborg · · Score: 1

      iPads come with a tablet? Wow. I guess I'll have to keep that stuff they fill the box with the next time I buy one.

      These iPad boxes came with REAL tablets - like the millenia-old original issue types. Even Microsoft was late to that game.

      --
      Make sure everyone's vote counts: Verified Voting
    189. Re:Wrap rage...? by slack_justyb · · Score: 1

      I'm actually shocked that no one has posted this, but keeping the boxes to high dollar items is a very good idea. High dollar stuff tends to vanish or worst yet, gets taken by bashing your back door in while you're at work. Boxes have serial numbers on them and they serve as proof of purchase when you go to the insurance company. Most states have pawn registries that allow the police to put a watch out at all certified pawn stores for your stolen goods, however, you have to have the serial number for that to work.

      I thought I would give it some time for someone to chime in here, but apparently no one even came close to thinking about it. If you have insurance, you owe it to yourself to save the boxes for your high dollar items. It makes dealing with insurance companies a whole hell of a lot easier.

    190. Re:Wrap rage...? by dwater · · Score: 2

      It's thoughtless of Apple not to provide boxes for their boxes.

      --
      Max.
    191. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "In the case of tablets and phones, packaging is the first personal encounter with what is intended to be a personal device. Getting this step right is crucial to shaping how a consumer perceives the product and too many companies neglect this simple but ineluctable point."

      Bwahahaha. You're actually fucking serious aren't you?

      This is precisely why people laugh at Apple fanboys. Because you come up with such complete and utter absurd bullshit to defend your pet brand, it makes you look like the same type of gullable muppet that would pay half a million for a painting by a 5 year old if you were told it was instead by a famous artist and in fact "modern art". This is typical of the sort of argument from the Apple defence force, you have to actually go to the extreme of simply making shit up to try and justify your irrational defence of the company and it's products.

      I cannot remember a single unpacking experience for any phone I've ever had, yet I've liked all the phones I've had. This is probably because I made the right choice when I bought them in the shop. All that's ever mattered is the device, the packing/unpacking experience has never had any relevance to that whatsoever.

      Selling the device on in it's original packaging is a fair point, if you want to commit fraud and pretend something is new that isn't for example I guess. But other than that, people just do not care about packaging - the only time they would is if the packaging is so stupidly designed that you damage the product when opening it, but that's not what we're talking about here.

    192. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Apple fans do. That's why they so vehemently defend the firm and it's products. They actually have relationships with the devices.

    193. Re:Wrap rage...? by Joce640k · · Score: 1

      "Ah, the joys of owning an iDevice. You have to constantly plan ahead financially for when the next version comes out."

      So in all of technology, only Apple users ever upgrade?

      Statistics don't lie.

      The average PC owner upgrades every four years.

      All Apple has to do is invent a new marketing phrase like "retina display" and suddenly iDevice owners are divided into two groups. The "haves" and the "have nots".

      We've all seen The Sad in the eyes of the Apple have nots. This comic captures it.

      --
      No sig today...
    194. Re:Wrap rage...? by Karlt1 · · Score: 0

      But there are a few problems with your assertion......

      1. You didn't post any statistics.
      2. Unless you thought they were referring to "iMacs" when they were referring to "iDevices", the discussion was about phones, tablets, or possible iPods. So are you saying that the average non Apple phone buyer, tablet buyer, or MP3 buyer is walking around with a 2008 Android G1, a bulky tablet running Windows XP tablet edition, or whatever non IPod mp3 player that was out in 2008?

    195. Re:Wrap rage...? by cpu6502 · · Score: 2

      >>>Interesting. So it's ok for you to sell to others a "damaged product" as "like new", but it isn't ok for others to do the same to you.

      The Apple Mac box is a SHIPPING BOX. Nobody expects it to arrive in perfect-mint condition (and if they do, then they should tell me in advance, and give me an extra $10, in order to fulfill their special needs).

      --
      My AC stalker: " I personally agree with your posts most of the time, but that won't keep me from modding you troll"
    196. Re:Wrap rage...? by B33RM17 · · Score: 1

      Normal is not normal.

      --
      My blood hurts...
    197. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      but it's mounted on a fucking wheelbarrel

      WTF is is wheelbarrel?

    198. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Mostly agree, but I wouldn't have thought "nonchalently" was the best adverb. "Narcissistically" seems to be closer.

      sure, if you've got a picture of yourself on the box...

    199. Re:Wrap rage...? by Phoghat · · Score: 1

      Pickens writes "Rebecca Greenfield writes that Google's Nexus tablet with its taped sides and fussy plastic takes effort to open, eliciting what some would call 'wrap rage,'

      Wait, are you farking kidding me? This is an issue? Something of importance that someone named "Hugh Pickens" thought notrable enough that we all should take notice??

      Jesus wept

      --
      Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.
    200. Re:Wrap rage...? by Joce640k · · Score: 1

      But there are a few problems with your assertion......

      1. You didn't post any statistics.

      "The average PC owner upgrades every four years." isn't a statistic?

      2. Unless you thought they were referring to "iMacs" when they were referring to "iDevices", the discussion was about phones, tablets, or possible iPods. So are you saying that the average non Apple phone buyer, tablet buyer, or MP3 buyer is walking around with a 2008 Android G1, a bulky tablet running Windows XP tablet edition, or whatever non IPod mp3 player that was out in 2008?

      Alright mister pedant.

      Most people I know upgrade their phones when they break or when there's a particular thing they want (eg. GPS), not before. ...except the iDevice owners. Is there really a difference in functionality between iPad2 and iPad3? What's the difference apart from the screen? Explain to me why so many people upgraded? Will you be betting that they won't do the same for iPad4? Tell me that's not some sort of mass hysteria.

      --
      No sig today...
    201. Re:Wrap rage...? by dogbowl · · Score: 1

      Same here.

      I just receive a Galaxy Nexus this week. Wasn't aware of the tape seal in the one corner, so at first I could get the box open!

      then, once I cut the tape, I finally pulled the top off only to then have the phone tumble out of the box and fall to the ground.

      Wasn't a great "first" experience.

      --

      These pretzels are making me thirsty.
    202. Re:Wrap rage...? by Karlt1 · · Score: 1

      So now your whole sample size is"people you know".

      So you really think the average person is walking around with a 4 year old phone or tablet?

    203. Re:Wrap rage...? by Zencyde · · Score: 1

      But, but. The protective cover keeps it shiny!
      No, seriously. I hate people that do this so much. I have to take the protective covers off any item that's actually being used and not intended to be resold.

      --
      What day is it? Could you please tell me?
    204. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Let me guess, you didn't read my entire post, including the important "Note, all of this is irrelevant if your auction made no claims regarding the state of the box."? Because you're acting awfully defensive for someone whom my accusation doesn't actually apply to...

      That said, we are apparently talking about two different boxes. I didn't know you were talking about the outer, brown, fugly shipping box. I thought you were talking about the inner, white box, with the giant picture of the product on it. You know, the box that would be the equivalent to the flimsy cardboard box that SNES games came in, or the flimsy cardboard box that a VHS tape would come in.

      Do try and express your point more clearly in the future, and learn to accept that you may have not properly expressed your point. It only makes you look like a 2 year old when you act like an asshole because you thought you said one thing, but everyone else took it to mean something different.

    205. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I know this is sarcasm and all, but I feel like processors in PCs in the 90s were much closer to a cheap still-image digital camera in 2012 than an iPhone 4S.

    206. Re:Wrap rage...? by Cute+Fuzzy+Bunny · · Score: 1

      I actually get pissed when I see a company spent an extra $5 to $10 (or more) on packaging I'm going to throw away.

      I'll bet you drink that generic beer that comes in cans that only say BEER.

      Fark no! I get the ones that say "GOOD BEER",

    207. Re:Wrap rage...? by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      Fark no! I get the ones that say "GOOD BEER",

      Well played sir, well played!

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    208. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I was going to point out Amazon's Kindle packaging, yes. It's understated in a different way to Apple's, and feels more utilitarian, but it has its own distinctive style, is extremely easy to open, and uses little plastic.

      Years ago Jeff Bezos got a complaint from a customer that his mother loved Amazon, but that he had to keep going to her house to open the packaging for her. He then mandated that all packaging be as easy to open as possible, as a way to enhance customer satisfaction. A lot of little things like that make a difference.

    209. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Narcissistically" would be placing the iDevice box on a pedestal surrounded by subtly lighted mirrors.

    210. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If this comment was :s/Jeff Bezos/Steve Jobs/ there would now be a plague of fat basement dwelling cunts mocking it, missing the point that it's actually important.

    211. Re:Wrap rage...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you replace "don't care for" with "can't afford because they've bought their sixth shitty android tablet this year in the vain hope that this one will work" then yes.

    212. Re:Wrap rage...? by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      If you replace "don't care for" with "can't afford because they've bought their sixth shitty android tablet this year in the vain hope that this one will work" then yes.

      You hit upon the other side of that marketing coin. The race to the bottom approach taken by the "I'm not paying for pretty packaging and Marketing" folks ends up making for really interesting products. When the person with the crappiest and cheapest product somehow wins.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
  2. Different Markets by Hnice · · Score: 2, Informative

    Ummmmm, because Google's not a toy company?

    --

    god is just pretend.

    1. Re:Different Markets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Troll

      Quite right, my boy. Google just shits in the box anyway, so the packaging is unimportant.

    2. Re:Different Markets by jd2112 · · Score: 5, Funny

      If Google were a Roy company there would be about 20 feet of tape, 35 twist ties, 14 molded pieces of clear plastic, and 55 plastic retainers to keep you from pulling the previously mentioned twist ties through the cardboard.
      Yes, I have children, how did you guess.?

      --
      Any insufficiently advanced magic is indistinguishable from technology.
    3. Re:Different Markets by Thuktun · · Score: 2

      Thanks for the debilitating flashbacks. *twitch*

    4. Re:Different Markets by RobertLTux · · Score: 1

      and thats why you need to have a good pair of pliers and a decent sharp bladed boxcutter to deal with such things

      wireties=use the pliers
      tape= use the boxcutter
      plastic widgets= use the box cutter

      a good pair of pliers a box cutter and a like 20 dollar set of bits (with driver) can get you a long way

      --
      Any person using FTFY or editing my postings agrees to a US$50.00 charge
    5. Re:Different Markets by Joce640k · · Score: 2

      Roy packaging has to be designed so that children can't get the stuff out of the boxes in the stores.

      If you've ever seen a child in a roy store you'll understand why the packaging needs to kevlar/half inch plexiglass.

      --
      No sig today...
    6. Re:Different Markets by oldmac31310 · · Score: 1

      Toy? Roy? Wha?

      --
      http://www.acetonestudio.com
    7. Re:Different Markets by Gr8Apes · · Score: 1

      Simple enough to solve - have employees in the store, child picks up a package and opens it, parent gets to buy it.

      Parents need to be more mindful of their children.

      --
      The cesspool just got a check and balance.
    8. Re:Different Markets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And you forgot about that little bit tha actually requires a phillips screwdriver to get off the card.

      A screwdriver? Really? And than I throw that bit away? I have got some words for those StrawberryShortcake people.

    9. Re:Different Markets by BronsCon · · Score: 1

      First, yes... ^-- this.

      Second:

      Any person using FTFY or editing my postings agrees to receive a US$50,000.00 payment

      FTFY.

      --
      APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
    10. Re:Different Markets by emag · · Score: 1

      So you're saying that when I'm a parent, I should keep my dikes handy?

      --
      "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." --H.L. Mencken
    11. Re:Different Markets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      A bit condescending but basically yes.

      Google is an advertising company. Their profit center is selling adds (targeted and un-targeted). Whereas Apple is a consumer electronics company. Their profit center is selling gadgets. As such Apple puts more effort into designing good packaging for their gadgets the same way Google puts effort into making people want to use their search engine.

      As a secondary consideration, Google tends to treat new products as an engineering challenge (can we make it work?), whereas Apple tends to treat them as a marketing challenge (can we make people want to own one?).

    12. Re:Different Markets by Kugrian · · Score: 1

      Plus Apple's been selling hardware for over 35 years. Google's experience has been web apps, and that's been for less than 15 years.

    13. Re:Different Markets by SuricouRaven · · Score: 1

      I tend to clamshell packaging with a blowtorch. It's the universal opening tool. It cuts through packaging like, appropriatly, a hot flame through plastic.

    14. Re:Different Markets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As described by the GP, Roy apparently has some... very interesting requirements if you want to hire his services.

      I suggest you don't ask what his services are.

    15. Re:Different Markets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hahahahaha you're so original and clever I get it, you don't like Apple products. But seriously I use a Macbook for all my recording work. I could use a windows computer, I prefer the Macbook. It's just a computer not everyone has to share your preferences that's the whole point of a preference. Grow up.

    16. Re:Different Markets by BeanThere · · Score: 1

      The real reason is that Apple has at least 7 patents on 'an easy to open box', and Google couldn't risk more product bans.

    17. Re:Different Markets by Creepy · · Score: 1

      If they still include a line-in jack, that alone might be worth a mac for recording to avoid the frustrations I've had. I've been trying to record on my laptop and, while I can record directly through a hardware for instruments like electric guitar and passive mics, I need phantom power for my condenser mics and therefore have to send them through my mixing console. Then I hit the problem. Instrument and Microphone pickups are too low of line-level. Headphone and Speaker out are too high of line-level.

        Yes, I know the solution is a very simple circuit, but I haven't found anything pre-built, so I need to do something I haven't done since college - build it myself. I may build a slightly more complex version with a -10dBu (consumer audio) and +4dBu (pro audio) because my mixing board supports either. My main worry is that it will lose fidelity and sound like crap.

    18. Re:Different Markets by Mr+Z · · Score: 1

      And it would come without batteries.

    19. Re:Different Markets by jd2112 · · Score: 1

      Simple enough to solve - have employees in the store, child picks up a package and opens it, parent gets to buy it.

      Parents need to be more mindful of their children.

      Doesn't work so well for gifts or mail order.

      --
      Any insufficiently advanced magic is indistinguishable from technology.
    20. Re:Different Markets by yurtinus · · Score: 1

      Breath deep while you do it.

      --
      +1 Disagree
    21. Re:Different Markets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If people are to dumb to realize that investing into a pair of Kitchen grade Scissors (or shears) is worth a few bucks to simply and quickly open a plastic sealed coffin then this only shows how stupid the people who buy these are, and if the phones were smart they should be able to figure out how to convey a simple technic for opening the package.

    22. Re:Different Markets by Gr8Apes · · Score: 1

      Don't think either of those matter to the store.

      --
      The cesspool just got a check and balance.
  3. what the? by MickyTheIdiot · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Ok.. I don't get it. I got my Nexus 7 preorder on Monday and did not have *one* problem with packaging. As a matter of fact I have liked the packaging of every Nexus product I have bought as well as even thought the graphic design was good. I had no problems breaking the seals and opening the box.

    I am much more concerned about the fact that the unit will not charge and the fact that so many people at places like at xda-developers are seeing the same defect time after time and the fact that I am having such a hard time getting an RMA.

    1. Re:what the? by alen · · Score: 4, Funny

      all you have to do is post a message on one of google's forums about your hardware issue and wait a few days for someone to respond

    2. Re:what the? by MickyTheIdiot · · Score: 1

      The defect I was referring to is the side of the screen lifting and/or a gap. My problem with charging (the included charger and cable is good and works with my phone) seems to be your normal luck-of-the-draw factory line defect.

    3. Re:what the? by alen · · Score: 4, Interesting

      if you have a hardware issue just take it back to the store and have them replace it. that's what i did with my iphone 3gs a few years back. took 20 minutes at the genius bar including the waiting

      oh wait......

    4. Re:what the? by MickyTheIdiot · · Score: 2

      A few days? Sorry... that isn't good enough. Anyway, right now the problem is that people on 1st level phone support at Google are not authorized to do RMAs and it has to go to 2nd tier.

      Their phone support is jammed, and their 2nd tier must be doubly so.

    5. Re:what the? by Zuriel · · Score: 1

      As a matter of fact I have liked the packaging of every Nexus product I have bought as well as even thought the graphic design was good.

      I came to the comments to say just that. My Nexus One and Galaxy Nexus both had nice, simple packaging, so making this out to be a Google-wide problem is a bit much.

    6. Re:what the? by Daetrin · · Score: 2

      It took me 5-10 seconds of trying to slide the outer cover off before i realized it really wanted to slide in the other direction, and then another 5-10 seconds to wedge the lid off the box (after cutting the tape of course.) Is it slightly harder to open than some packaging i've seen? Yes. Is it in any way comparable to clamshell packaging? Not even close. Is this whole thing being blown way out of proportion? Definitely

      --
      This Space Intentionally Left Blank
    7. Re:what the? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I am more concerned that my 7 andoird clock apps on my home screen all show different times

    8. Re:what the? by ahabswhale · · Score: 1

      I got a Nexus 7 as well. I had a little trouble extracting the box from it's sleeve. The tolerances are very tight there and could be loosened a hair and all would be well. The tape was trivial to deal with because anyone with a knife or box cutter will get through it in two seconds. All in all, it took me about a minute to get to the device, with the vast majority of that time spent dealing with the sleeve.

      And mine charges up just fine.

      --
      Are agnostics skeptical of unicorns too?
    9. Re:what the? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Agreed - I had 0 issues with the packaging and found it close enough to Apple's to be a non-factor. Same for the Kindle Fire. Packaging is not an important differentiating factor. I think they should spend the money developing things that matter or including small accessories.

      I really think that the 1280X800 resolution is a big problem though - it should have a minimum of 1024 in the smallest dimesion to minimize scrolling on most of today's websites,

    10. Re:what the? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      if you have a hardware issue just take it back to the store and have them replace it. that's what i did with my iphone 3gs a few years back. took 20 minutes at the genius bar including the waiting

      oh wait......

      Have you been to the Genius Bar lately? The last time I visited the Genius Bar, the wait was over an hour just to be seen.

    11. Re:what the? by tepples · · Score: 2

      took 20 minutes at the genius bar including the waiting

      Including the 90 mile drive to the closest Apple Retail Store and the 90 mile drive back?

    12. Re:what the? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ya me too, i had no issues with the box, i seen the unboxing video though, honestly one of the guy was trying to open with some little cheap peice of plastic, i used a knife, cut right through the tape, had no other issue, i also have not had any charging or the screen lift issue, but i seen the fixit video for the screen lift issue, looked pretty easy to fix, and at least you can fix it yourself if you want.

    13. Re:what the? by KingSkippus · · Score: 2

      I have to admit, I was laughing so hard at the video that I was crying. I swear, that was me last night. "What the--!!? I don't see any tape, but I can't get the box out. Am I missing something? Crap!..."

      Still, now that I've got it out of the box, I'm gleeful. It's a nice tablet.

    14. Re:what the? by poetmatt · · Score: 1

      There was a youtube video that went viral showing a bunch of incompetent people trying to open a box. That was it, literally.
      Equally anecdotally I don't know anyone who has had difficulty opening the nexus 7 box.

    15. Re:what the? by Shadow99_1 · · Score: 2

      It's nice you live close to an apple store... My closest apple store is over 2 hours away. It may still be worth it to drive 2 hours both ways to get a problem fixed in a timely manner, but not usually...

      --
      we are all invisible unless we choose otherwise
    16. Re:what the? by busyqth · · Score: 1

      About a month after purchase, my wife's iPhone 4S decided that something was permanently plugged into the dock port so it refused to make any audible sound.

      I took it to the Apple store and was told to come back at a certain time (about an hour later). So I went and had lunch and then came back at the appointed time. About 5 minutes later my name was called. The genius bar guy spent about 10 minutes fiddling with the phone and then went to the back and came back with a new on. He wanted me to setup the new phone and sync contacts, etc in the store so he could make sure everything was ok. That took about 15 minutes. Then I went home with a new phone.

      It was pretty much painless.

    17. Re:what the? by Glarimore · · Score: 1

      if you have a hardware issue just take it back to the store and have them replace it. that's what i did with my iphone 3gs a few years back. took 20 minutes at the genius bar including the waiting

      oh wait......

      If you have a battery issue, just order a replacement off the Internet and replace it yourself. That's what I did with my Droid X a year ago. Took 5 minutes of searching online and only cost ten dollars.

      Oh wait...

    18. Re:what the? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      As a matter of fact I have liked the packaging of every Nexus product I have bought as well as even thought the graphic design was good.

      I came to the comments to say just that. My Nexus One and Galaxy Nexus both had nice, simple packaging, so making this out to be a Google-wide problem is a bit much.

      You're missing the point of this article. Demand for the Nexus 7 is crazy high right now. Google beat Apple to the non-shitty non-titanic sized tablet market. Despite the earnings call statement to the contrary, Apple is worried the lustre is wearing off the iBrand, hence the onslaught of FUD and nonsense articles to try to persuade people to wait until the iPad mini or, rather, dissuade them from looking at anything outside the Apple garden.

    19. Re:what the? by BronsCon · · Score: 1

      I'm pretty sure 6 of those might be malware.

      --
      APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
    20. Re:what the? by danomac · · Score: 1

      Damn, I just exchanged mine but it wasn't a battery issue. Mine was cosmetic issue (the screen would pop out of the case.)

      The replacement I have now is fine so far...

      I had no issues with Google's phone support. I put in a request, they called me back less than 5 minutes later.

    21. Re:what the? by shugah · · Score: 1

      There is actually a good business reason for NOT having reusable packaging. A robust secondary eBay resale market can undermine the primary channel sales.

      --
      If you aren't part of the solution, then there is good money to be made prolonging the problem
    22. Re:what the? by NixieBunny · · Score: 1

      I found myself reaching into my pocket for my Swiss Army knife while watching all those non-engineers struggle with the tape on the sides of the box. Geez! don't they ever open boxes?

      I then found myself walking to the shelf where all our family's iPhone boxes sit, lovingly displayed, to get one down. I dusted it off and opened it a few times to enjoy just how precisely made it is, and how it opens with a just-ever-so amount of friction caused by the air escaping past the sides of the box.

      Every time I do that, I can feel Steve Jobs' presence.

      --
      The determined Real Programmer can write Fortran programs in any language.
    23. Re:what the? by slimjim8094 · · Score: 1

      Same here, did that with my iPhone 4 a few weeks ago. It's several years old and the battery life is down to two days, so it was time. Took 5 minutes of searching online and cost only $5, with free shipping. Two screws, a slide-off cover, and a plug later, you're done. I don't know why people seem to think the iDevice batteries are hard to replace; they need tools to remove but it means you can have a bigger battery that goes longer before a replacement is needed so it seems like a worthwhile tradeoff.

      --
      I have developed a truly marvelous proof of this comment, which this signature is too narrow to contain.
    24. Re:what the? by Pieroxy · · Score: 1

      Ok.. I don't get it. I got my Nexus 7 preorder on Monday and did not have *one* problem with packaging. As a matter of fact I have liked the packaging of every Nexus product I have bought as well as even thought the graphic design was good. I had no problems breaking the seals and opening the box.

      I am much more concerned about the fact that the unit will not charge and the fact that so many people at places like at xda-developers are seeing the same defect time after time and the fact that I am having such a hard time getting an RMA.

      Be glad you didn't buy an Apple product. They are so inferior ;-)

    25. Re:what the? by Pieroxy · · Score: 1

      took 20 minutes at the genius bar including the waiting

      Including the 90 mile drive to the closest Apple Retail Store and the 90 mile drive back?

      Yup. Got a private Jet. Easy as pie.

    26. Re:what the? by scot4875 · · Score: 1

      So, in other words, the wait was about an hour -- but fortunately for you, there was something else nearby to occupy your time with so it wasn't completely wasted.

      --Jeremy

      --
      Jesus was a liberal
    27. Re:what the? by devleopard · · Score: 1

      FTFY

      "Took 5 minutes of searching online and 3-7 business days to receive in the mail"

      --
      The best thing about a boolean is even if you are wrong, you are only off by a bit.
    28. Re:what the? by devleopard · · Score: 1

      Still beats the 2 weeks it'll take to get an RMA product shipped out and returned. (If you're lucky, you can cut that time in half assuming the company offers quality customer service and ships you a new product before you ship yours out)

      --
      The best thing about a boolean is even if you are wrong, you are only off by a bit.
    29. Re:what the? by c++0xFF · · Score: 1

      I don't know why people seem to think the iDevice batteries are hard to replace

      History. ifixit's instructions for the original iPhone are illustrative: "Getting the iPhone open is a challenging feat, so don't get discouraged. Take a deep breath and make sure you have plenty of time to get the job done." The competition required just sliding a cover and pulling out the battery, which takes five seconds, tops.

      But, it's gotten easier. Three or four screws (two on the outside, one or two on the inside) and you're done. Of course, they now use "penalobe" screws, which you usually have to replace because they strip so easily.

      The point remains that Apple actively tries to prevent users from replacing the battery. This has nothing to do with making the battery bigger (which, at best, is a pleasant side effect).

    30. Re:what the? by rtfa-troll · · Score: 1

      Including the 90 mile drive to the closest Apple Retail Store and the 90 mile drive back?

      Clearly you have your priorities wrong. You should move your home least 87 miles. No true Apple fan would even consider living in such a godforsaken hellhole as the one you obviously live in.

      --
      =~ s,(.*),<sarcasm>$1</sarcasm>,g if any_point_you_wish();
    31. Re:what the? by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      It's nice you live close to an apple store... My closest apple store is over 2 hours away. It may still be worth it to drive 2 hours both ways to get a problem fixed in a timely manner, but not usually...

      My Magic mouse went dead at around 5 p.m. I called up Apple, as it was under warranty. After convincing them that it wasn't a bad battery, they told me they were shipping a new one to me

      Next morning, my new magic Mouse was delivered in (guess what) a neat little box. With instructions to tear the shipping label off. Underneath was a return label back to them. Placed the dead mouse in it, and it was picked up the next day. From one side of the country to the other, overnight, and as painless as I could imagine. They emailed me to tell me that the old mouse was indeed bad.

      Which reminds me of when my Son's Toshiba laptop had a problem soon after we bought it. I went to the service counter at Circuit City where we bought it, told the guy the problem, and he gives me a Xerox copy with an address on it. "What's this?" I ask. "Send your laptop to this address.". That was the extent of the warranty service. Good thing I kept the box!

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    32. Re:what the? by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      If you have a battery issue, just order a replacement off the Internet and replace it yourself. That's what I did with my Droid X a year ago. Took 5 minutes of searching online and only cost ten dollars.

      Oh wait...

      I love stories like that. Just like when My iPhone got DroidDream.

      Oh wait.....

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    33. Re:what the? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I like having to wait a few days for a reply. If you get a nice quick turn around, it feels too much like you're dealing with "The Man" aka Apple.

    34. Re:what the? by Osgeld · · Score: 1

      "I had no problems breaking the seals and opening the box."

      That is because you are not retarded ... however apple knows their customers very well

  4. Huh? by PhrostyMcByte · · Score: 4, Informative

    My Nexus 7 arrived on Tuesday, and I opened it just fine. The tape used to keep the box closed was a little interesting, looked almost like it had been melted on, but nothing anyone with a pair of scissors or box cutters should have trouble with.

    1. Re:Huh? by Korin43 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Yeah this story confuses me.

      Step 1: Push box out of sleeve
      Step 2: Cut two pieces of tape
      Step 3: Open box
      Step 4: Profit

      There's not even a ??? step. Is cutting tape really that difficult?

    2. Re:Huh? by jeffmeden · · Score: 1

      My Nexus 7 arrived on Tuesday, and I opened it just fine. The tape used to keep the box closed was a little interesting, looked almost like it had been melted on, but nothing anyone with a pair of scissors or box cutters should have trouble with.

      Google would like to make it at least mildly challenging to buy a product, swap the product with modelling clay, and return the box for full retail value. Apple puts aesthetics first. Good for them, but really we are getting pretty high and mighty when we think a little bit of tape is going to induce wrap-rage. I bought a pair of scissors from home depot the other day that required, you guessed it, another pair of (heavy duty) scissors just to cut the plastic fused clamshell open. If you can open a box with a slightly pointy fingernail, or a key, or a ballpoint pen, then guess what it's NOT THAT HARD.

    3. Re:Huh? by miltonw · · Score: 4, Funny

      Alternate title for the video: "People who can't cut tape try to open a taped package."

    4. Re:Huh? by Anubis+IV · · Score: 3, Informative

      Is cutting tape really that difficult?

      Is having to reboot your computer when something goes wrong really that difficult? Not really, but when you have to do that it worsens your experience with the product. Any packaging that requires the use of tools to open is not good, user-oriented packaging. You can make packaging tamper-evident without requiring the customer to locate sharp objects.

      There's a reason Amazon has been placing so much effort into making "hassle-free" packaging and coercing manufacturers to do the same (going so far as to send their own packaging designers to the manufacturers in order to consult on how to make their packaging better). Apple was one of the earliest on this boat, but they're not the only one. That Google missed the boat actually surprises me a bit.

    5. Re:Huh? by bigdanmoody · · Score: 1

      Pretty much this. I received my preordered Nexus 7 on Tuesday and found it no more difficult to open than my original Asus Transformer tablet. The top and bottom of the box fit together very snugly, as in I could feel the low air pressure inside making the box more difficult to open, but didn't provide and particular challenge. Perhaps people should try poking an air hole in their box if they are really having that much trouble.

      I had supper with my brother Tuesday night, and he asked me if I'd had any trouble opening the Nexus 7 box; he'd apparently seen the videos referenced in TFA. I showed him the box and he wasn't sure how anyone had trouble opening it either.

    6. Re:Huh? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      without requiring the customer to locate sharp objects.

      I have never met tape that requires anything sharper than a housekey to remove. If you can't locate your keys, you've got bigger issues than failure to open a toy.

    7. Re:Huh? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Some people don't carry pocketknives. These people baffle me; it's not the pre-Neolithic anymore. Use a tool, like a human being; don't just claw and rip the cardboard apart like a lower primate.

    8. Re:Huh? by Talennor · · Score: 4, Funny

      Is cutting tape really that difficult?

      Well, I watched the video, and it's apparently quite difficult if you try to cut it with your shirt.

      --

      //TODO: signature
    9. Re:Huh? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Do you open Nexus 7's everyday or what? Actually, the frustration you experience while opening the package helps you building anticipation to get the tab running. I am pretty sure it does us much more good than bad overall.

    10. Re:Huh? by eam · · Score: 1

      I bought one of these openers years ago:

      http://www.myopenx.com/home.htm

      We keep it in the gadget drawer in the kitchen. Makes opening clamshell packaging real easy.

    11. Re:Huh? by Enry · · Score: 1

      If this is the same video floating about elsewhere, I saw one person with a large bread knife, and another person using his collar stay.

      It's not really rocket science to open these things up, and any idiot who does this often should at least have a pair of scissors (or a leatherman) on hand in case they need it.

      I've seen all sorts of packaging, and if slicing through two pieces of tape is the hardest time they've had, they probably shouldn't be in the business of reviewing packages. Open it off camera, then review it.

    12. Re:Huh? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Is cutting tape really that difficult?

      The author of the article chose, at some point in his life, to become an obvious frothing Apple shill, so yes, it most likely is, since he probably isn't trusted to hold scissors or anything sharp. And even if he was, his indoctrination has also conditioned him to be unable to touch anything without rounded edges for fear of tainting the purity of his soul in the Disapproving Glare of The Almighty Ascended Jobs.

    13. Re:Huh? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      or the plastic things that come in the collar of shirts, sheesh. I have had zero issue with my N7 from unboxing to unlocking-rooting.

    14. Re:Huh? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Is having to reboot your computer when something goes wrong really that difficult? Not really, but when you have to do that it worsens your experience with the product.

      Uh, no. If you have to do it daily or weekly, yes. But once in the life of the product? Not so much.

    15. Re:Huh? by Gilmoure · · Score: 1

      You're going to hold up Amazon as someone who knows anything about customer satisfaction in shopping? Might as well say Apple is well loved by the average consumer who's too stupid to know they should be getting their opinions off of slasgdot!

      --
      I drank what? -- Socrates
    16. Re:Huh? by Anubis+IV · · Score: 1

      In this area, yes, I will hold up Amazon. Just because they behind in other areas doesn't mean that they get everything wrong. In the case of their packaging, they've generally gotten it very right in the last few years. Refusing to acknowledge that is just silly, since it's obvious to anyone who is at all familiar with packaging and how rapidly it has changed in the last few years.

    17. Re:Huh? by xs650 · · Score: 1

      Yeah this story confuses me.

      .... Step 4: Profit

      There's not even a ??? step. Is cutting tape really that difficult?

      Evidently it is for an iSheep.

    18. Re:Huh? by petermgreen · · Score: 1

      I showed him the box and he wasn't sure how anyone had trouble opening it either.

      Maybe it was a case of the boxes being made to an insufficiently tight tolerance. It can only take a tiny difference in dimensions to make the difference between a cover that slides off easily and one that is virtually stuck

      --
      note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
    19. Re:Huh? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      An overpriced letter-opener?

    20. Re:Huh? by Pieroxy · · Score: 1

      Is cutting tape really that difficult?

      With my fingers, yes it is.

    21. Re:Huh? by scot4875 · · Score: 1

      Unboxing is an event that happens once. Computer reboots (might) happen frequently. The two things are not even remotely comparable.

      --Jeremy

      --
      Jesus was a liberal
    22. Re:Huh? by Anubis+IV · · Score: 1

      One is certainly worse than the either, I'll admit, but the point I was making - that a simple nuisance can worsen the experience with the product - is still valid. They are indeed comparable, though they are not on par with one another.

    23. Re:Huh? by Speare · · Score: 1

      For me, the sleeve posed no problems. It was tight, but not overly so. It may have to do with humidity levels or temperatures too.

      The tape was one of those patterned-adhesive jobs, but the glue was too strong. The first 10mm started to peel up and give an embossed pattern, much like those "WARRANTY VOID" patterns. The underlying black pasteboard failed, though, so the rest of the tape length was just pulling up the top layer of pasteboard.

      Similarly, the ends of the USB cable had tiny transparent plastic protectors that would not come off easily. Apple protectors usually slid off much easier.

      That said, the unboxing for me was just fine. It's a slick device and I'm enjoying it.

      --
      [ .sig file not found ]
    24. Re:Huh? by AaronLS · · Score: 1

      Even apes know how to use tools.

    25. Re:Huh? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There's not even a ??? step. Is cutting tape really that difficult?

      apple users aren't allowed to handle scissors
      there' too sharp. apple haven't created a rounded pair of scissors safe enough yet

    26. Re:Huh? by kqs · · Score: 1

      Doesn't surprise me at all. Google is phenomenal at the backend stuff (the OS, their services, etc). User experience stuff, not so much. Kinda the anti-Apple.

    27. Re:Huh? by Pieroxy · · Score: 1

      The question is: Why does Google makes me grab my tools for something that should not need any?

    28. Re:Huh? by wfolta · · Score: 1

      Spoken exactly like the Apple competitors who can never seem to get that iPad-killer (or iWhatever-killer) to market. User experience matters.

      It doesn't matter to, say, Android, since Google's Android customers are manufacturers and carriers. It does matter to Apple, since Apple's customers are, well, users. Apple has taken the entire user experience seriously: product packaging, product physical design, system design, user interface design, etc, etc. Google has not.

      The example at hand, packaging, may seem small in the grand scheme of things, but it illustrates each company's view of who their customer is and how important that customer's experience is.

    29. Re:Huh? by bigstrat2003 · · Score: 1

      If anyone cares to any significant extent about the 10 seconds it takes to find a knife/scissors/pair of keys/anything really, then open the tape, they have their priorities incredibly wrong. Packaging simply doesn't matter like this article claims. You get your device out of the packaging, and you're done with it (hopefully) forever, so why on God's green earth would you give any weight to the packaging against any of the numerous pros and cons about the device itself?

      After reading this article I'm going to go drink bleach, so I can forget about how damn petty people are.

      --
      "16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
    30. Re:Huh? by bigstrat2003 · · Score: 1

      No, the real question is: how out of whack do one's priorities have to be that they actually care about this? I have never heard of something more petty to complain about.

      --
      "16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
    31. Re:Huh? by Grudge2012 · · Score: 0

      My Nexus 7 arrived on Tuesday, and I opened it just fine. The tape used to keep the box closed was a little interesting, looked almost like it had been melted on, but nothing anyone with a pair of scissors or box cutters should have trouble with.

      Google would like to make it at least mildly challenging to buy a product, swap the product with modelling clay, and return the box for full retail value.

      So Google is expecting so many returns that they can't check for fake returns.

    32. Re:Huh? by Korin43 · · Score: 1

      With my fingers, yes it is.

      Did you try to cut the packing tape on the UPS box with your fingers too?

    33. Re:Huh? by Korin43 · · Score: 1

      Any packaging that requires the use of tools to open is not good, user-oriented packaging. You can make packaging tamper-evident without requiring the customer to locate sharp objects.

      Except that even if there was no tape on the Nexus 7's box, the cardboard box it shipped in is still sealed with packing tape, so you need a sharp object (like your keys) either way. And no, I don't think we should stop sealing cardboard boxes before shipping them.

    34. Re:Huh? by Anubis+IV · · Score: 1

      You can buy them at brick-and-mortar retailers, which negates your entire premise. And even if you couldn't, there are ways around that problem as well. To reference Amazon again, their packing tape has been backed by paper in recent years instead of plastic, making it relatively trivial to tear with bare hands even without sharp fingernails.

      This all boils down to how they want to treat their customers. Companies that make the unboxing experience a pleasurable one are telling their customers that they care about the whole experience, and there's a decent chance that they've made an effort to consider every detail. Companies who don't are saying that they are willing to let some of the details slide in order to focus on other areas more, but if they were willing to compromise on this, one must ask what else they chose to compromise on or failed to consider.

    35. Re:Huh? by Coren22 · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I hate it when I have to reboot people's Macs for them, it is just sad that Apple can't fix those issues. Oh wait, everyone has those issues.

      --
      APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
    36. Re:Huh? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What pissed me off was the shrink-wrap around each end of the laughably short USB lead, plus the shrink-wrap around it.

      But it has an Asus logo on the plug. Couldn't see it before the shrink-wrap came off.

      I wouldn't know if I just plugged it into the charger. Those things don't heat up. Plastic fires are cool.

  5. Ouch by bhagwad · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I think I'm gonna be sick.

    I mean I know people worship Apple and all. But...come on guys.

    1. Re:Ouch by buback · · Score: 3, Funny

      Well I don't see what's so weird about displaying them on a bookshelf or table. Maybe with a nice tablecloth on top, and some candles and incense.

      It's also a good place for me to put my sacrifices and to focus my prayers

    2. Re:Ouch by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Apple may not have copied Samsung, but LOOK HOW MUCH BETTER OUR PACKAGE IS (pun intended)

    3. Re:Ouch by Anrego · · Score: 1

      I have no love for apple and agree the bit about keeping the boxes was pretty nuts.. but I do agree on the packaging bit.

      I've bought enough tech that I'm used to the standard level of effort required to get at stuff. I only really notice when it's really bad or better than usual. In the case of the former, it does indeed put me in a bad mood right from the get go.. in the case of the later, I agree that it does get you into a positive frame of mind.

      I'm used to clamshell at this point .. but the stuff that's really bad is when they have the product folded through multiple layers of plastic and cardboard.. especially if wires are involved. Logitech seems to love doing this..

      Corsair seems to be pretty good when it comes to their higher end PSUs. They include a velcro bag with the cables and the PSU itself is in like a velvet bag dealie (which I don't get.. like they expect me to hold onto it on the off chance I pull out my PSU and need to store it for a while?) .. and the whole thing is well protected in a foam shell that just comes apart when you slide it out of the box..

    4. Re:Ouch by mjwx · · Score: 1

      Well I don't see what's so weird about displaying them on a bookshelf or table. Maybe with a nice tablecloth on top, and some candles and incense.

      It's also a good place for me to put my sacrifices and to focus my prayers

      You have a box holding up the altar of darkness too.

      Try using phone books. Not only are they free they are also more solid.

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    5. Re:Ouch by scot4875 · · Score: 1

      The fact that, so far, this non-issue appears to be the biggest gripe with the Nexus 7 is bad news for Apple. Got mine last night and at no point did I think there was anything unusually difficult or unreasonable about getting the box open.

      --Jeremy

      --
      Jesus was a liberal
    6. Re:Ouch by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      yeah I got my graphic card box, its all red and pretty with Radeon and 1gb and turbo written on it, gives me a nerd buzz every time I see it, but if packagings hard or plane, rip bust tear all the way

  6. Re:Because by alen · · Score: 5, Insightful

    yes, because my iCrap is going to be worth something in a few years and selling my used iCrap with the original box in good condition will increase its value

  7. Nexus One by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Their packaging for the Nexus One was beautifully done and I don't recall having any kind of frustration opening it. I kept all of it as well. I'll have to ask my brother if he had any rage while opening the 7 since he just received one. ;)

  8. Superficiality carried to its extreme by Angst+Badger · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Seriously? There was nothing more important or interesting going on than some nebbish mumbling about the importance of packaging? Even for Apple fanboyism, this reaches new depths. "The boxes sit on shelves serving as a constant reminder of the beauty within." I wish there was a more appropriate and genteel response to that than, "Get a life!", but there you are.

    --
    Proud member of the Weirdo-American community.
    1. Re:Superficiality carried to its extreme by Quiet_Desperation · · Score: 0

      Proud member of the Weirdo-American community.

      Huh. Kinda thought you'd embrace Greenfield as one of your own. Must be a schism of some kind.

      I wish there was a more appropriate and genteel response to that than, "Get a life!", but there you are.

      How about "Splitter!"

    2. Re:Superficiality carried to its extreme by MightyYar · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I agree that the gushing is... weird. But the Apple packaging is nice, and people do notice it when they purchase Apple products. It's all part of their branding, which is very well managed. Other companies with crappy or hard-to-open packaging risk their branding just a tiny bit.

      --
      W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
    3. Re:Superficiality carried to its extreme by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, this is a good sign. If this is what people have to find to bitch and moan about then things are good. If you are only left to compare the "unwrapping experience" then that is a good day for google.

    4. Re:Superficiality carried to its extreme by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Apple cares about opening the package.
      Google cares about opening the source.

    5. Re:Superficiality carried to its extreme by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This just proves that Apple products are inferior, if all their fanboys can rave about is that Apple has better packaging.

    6. Re:Superficiality carried to its extreme by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      When I saw some consumer apple packaging first time and opened it up my thoughts were "well that's wierd".

    7. Re:Superficiality carried to its extreme by mu51c10rd · · Score: 1

      Last time I worked for a company that shipped physical product...there were packaging engineers that would do nothing more than design and contract out packaging to ship products in. Yes, packaging is important, and anyone with young kids will tell you...bad packaging will create bad memories of the product from the start (anyone try opening a large modern toy these days from the box?)

    8. Re:Superficiality carried to its extreme by Truedat · · Score: 1

      Don't have a go at the story it was exactly the right thing to post - 500 comments and counting, including yours, prove it. The best way to bury a story is for people to ignore it, but some people just can't get their head around that simple fact.

  9. Nokia has great packaging too! by dwater · · Score: 2

    My point being...perhaps the packaging doesn't have much difference to the success of the company as you think...

    --
    Max.
    1. Re:Nokia has great packaging too! by INeededALogin · · Score: 1

      My point being...perhaps the packaging doesn't have much difference to the success of the company as you think...

      It is part of the total package was the point of the article and it worked for me. When I bought my first iPod back in 2002, I had never seen a product packaged in such a pretty way. A company that cares about that much detail amazed me. First impressions are a mighty thing.

    2. Re:Nokia has great packaging too! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      True, the package of the ipod was very nice. However I can't say it made me feel any better or worse about the product. The thing worked and worked well, I was reasonably happy. The fact that the package was nice didn't matter much. If the unit sucked, I wouldn't somehow say "yes, but the packaging was pretty nice". Nah, I would say the thing sucks. If the thing is wonderful, nice, the package is well made as well, but apart from those initial 30 seconds, I really don't care.
      One of the best packages I have ever had were packages for a hard drive, they were very plain, easy to open and were ready to sort and throw away at once. As long as its non of that clamshell packaging, the package isn't worth mentioning as bad. For the ipod its worth mentioning as very well designed, for that hard drive its worth mentioning as very ecological and for clamshell its worth mentioning as pretty bad. But apart from that, its the thing you throw away 30 seconds after having had the product. There is no need to care about it. And from seeing the video, the people that can't open it are idiots.

    3. Re:Nokia has great packaging too! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Packaging is generally much less important than what's in the package.

      Now if the Nexus 7 were sufficiently superior to it's closest Apple competitor they'd be all set. But generally speaking there's not that decisive an advantage.

      Also consider the effect of "unboxing" videos. If one product's videos are a brief "wow, such pretty packaging! now lets get to the good stuff" followed by 5 minutes of talking about the product, while the other's are 3 minute rants about how crappy the package is followed by 2 minutes about the product, which do you think is going to convert more undecided customers?

    4. Re:Nokia has great packaging too! by chundo · · Score: 2

      On the contrary - it could be argued that Apple's entire success as a company is due to their packaging on all levels - packaging features, packaging software, packaging hardware, packaging services, packaging their brand. Nokia's problem is that their good packaging tends to stop at the box.

      Apple packaged the original iPod by taking mature features that already existed in other music players in the marketplace, and wrapping them together in a more attractive product, with a slick design and lots of storage. They packaged OS X by taking an established operating system (BSD) and throwing some pretty on it, some of which was innovative, but most of which was simply combining existing ideas into an attractive package. The iTunes store was only notable because they negotiated slightly more flexible DRM terms and didn't close down in 2 years leaving its customers in the cold, like so many predecessors. The iPhone packaged the PDA and phone in a smoother and more attractive way than other products had done before, even though there are few truly unique features in it that were not also being implemented in some form by its predecessors and contemporaries (including Android, which also started in 2005.) And throughout all of these product launches, they had the marketing muscle to successfully focus attention onto the shiny and away from the omissions.

      This is not to denigrate Apple's success, because they seized upon a truth that eludes many companies - packaging matters, as much or more than the product itself, and if you can consistently combine great packaging with good products, it doesn't matter where the functional ideas came from originally. Sometimes the packaging is the innovation.

    5. Re:Nokia has great packaging too! by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      The packaging made me think that someone was wasting their time at Apple. It honestly gave me a negative impression because the package was just so strange and clearly more expensive. It reinforced my impression of Apple as a goofy place.

    6. Re:Nokia has great packaging too! by dwater · · Score: 1

      > packaging on all levels

      I stopped reading at that point, since we're not talking on all levels - at least *I'm* not...just the "box it comes in", and Nokia have just as nice packaging (IMO). I'm not saying it makes no difference, just that, to quote myself, "[it] doesn't have much difference to the success of the company as you think"

      Hrm. Is there a name for your argument? Straw man, is it? Pretend I'm making some other argument and argue against that instead? I've always found the science of false arguments to be quite interesting :)

      --
      Max.
  10. Apple gift certificates too ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Recently I bought a "back to school" Mac which came with a gift certificate. And the gift certificate was packaged like a wedding invitation; white, envelope with the flap tucked into a slot on the back (not stuck down, or even tucked fully in), and classily written. And it's not the first Apple product I've seen whose packaging was a minor work of performance art. Perhaps Apple learned this from Japanese custom, but they learned well, and it makes a difference.

  11. Worst wrap-rage of my life: by GameboyRMH · · Score: 1

    A GoPro camera. Took me about 15 minutes to open it, I had to find a tutorial on YouTube to show me how to do it. I could have just slashed away with a knife or tore into it savagely, but I was trying to open it without wrecking anything and there was no remotely intuitive way to do it. A lot of careful cutting and tearing is required.

    --
    "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
  12. Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by ameen.ross · · Score: 5, Funny

    Can the iPad/iPhone/iX be opened without surgically removing key components yet?

    --
    $(echo cm0gLXJmIC8= | base64 --decode)
    1. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by MightyYar · · Score: 1

      It's almost universally a PITA to open an Apple product. Even their laptops and computers seem to be designed with dis-assembly as an afterthought. I had an iBook that required almost total dis-assembly just to replace the hard drive (newer models make it trivial). Replacing the screen on an iPhone 3gs is like rocket surgery.

      Of course, this only effects a small percentage of their users and does not seem to harm their image with the public-at-large - so it is hard to argue with their business/marketing/engineering decisions. Disposable society and all that...

      --
      W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
    2. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by TheSpoom · · Score: 0

      rocket surgery

      Scalpel.

      Scalpel.

      Jet fuel.

      Jet fuel.

      Sandwich.

      Sandwich.

      *grills sandwich with jet fuel*

      Well, that's lunch taken care of. What were we talking about again? Must not have been that important...

      --
      It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
      - E. Debs
    3. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by busyqth · · Score: 1

      I had an iBook that required almost total dis-assembly just to replace the hard drive

      G4 iBook. Been there. Done that.

    4. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by xs650 · · Score: 1

      No, that is why you keep the original packaging. When it quits working because of some tragedy like the glued in battery taking a dump, you are supposed to put it back in it's original packaging and add it to your iShrine.

    5. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I can easily disassemble my 2011 Mac mini. I also took apart my last Mac mini and installed a eSATA port. If replacing the screen on a 3gs is rocket science why do I see college students doing full glass replacements for $50-70? Sure the imac is clusterfuck, but I get why the laptops went the way they did.

    6. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by slimjim8094 · · Score: 1

      Replacing the battery on an iPhone/iTouch is pretty straightforward, as is the dock connector and several other components. Frankly, I wouldn't expect doing the screen to be easy on any device, from your laptop to your TV. It's a pretty key component, and almost always buried under pretty much every other component.

      A car analogy is like changing the oil (easy, nonintrusive maintenance) or putting on a spare tire, being analogous to a pop-off battery cover. Not too difficult, and you don't have to get "into" the car. Apple's batteries are like replacing the radio or getting inside the door panels - still an easy job if you know what you're doing, but it requires some effort. The screen is like the oil pump - crucial, and might need replacement, but I wouldn't do it. I'd send it to a shop that specializes in it, rather than risk irreparably damaging the entire thing by taking it all apart.

      --
      I have developed a truly marvelous proof of this comment, which this signature is too narrow to contain.
    7. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by Jesus_666 · · Score: 1

      They actually got better on this as far as the laptops are concerned. The G4 iBook was horribly designed but the MacBook and MacBookPro were actually built to make the reasonably-serviceable components (HDD and RAM) easy to replace. I've upgraded a mid 2009 MBP's RAM and HDD with no fuss and it seems that my mid 2012 MBP will be no different.

      The batteries on MBPs are somewhat harder to replace but basically amounts to having to use a weird screwdriver bit.


      Of course all bets are off if you try to work with the retina MBP where everything is part of the logic board. I think they would've soldered the AC adapter to the logic board if they thought they could've gotten away with it.

      --
      USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
    8. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by TheSpoom · · Score: 1

      Awww, I pissed off an Apple fanboi with mod points. Woe is me...

      --
      It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
      - E. Debs
    9. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      You don't open Apple products, that's just the wrong way to experience them. You must treat all Apple products like you were a toddler or a cat. That is, you remove the product and put it up on the shelf and then play with the packaging.

    10. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by MightyYar · · Score: 1

      Well, the first-gen iPhone had the battery soldered-in...

      And I'd argue that the most-replaced part of a smartphone is the screen. The 3G/GS screen is really hard to get at. I've done a few iPod screens and they were fairly simple once you learned the tricks.

      On your car analogy, I'd say the screen is more like swapping out the crankshaft. You literally have to disassemble the whole damn thing to get to it on the 3GS.

      --
      W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
    11. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by MightyYar · · Score: 1

      Because a college student thinks $25-35/hour is pretty good money.

      (Yes, I realize that they pay for postage and parts... not in a math mood.)

      In my opinion, any repair that involves softening stuff up with a heat gun is in the "expert" territory.

      --
      W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
    12. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by c++0xFF · · Score: 1

      Apple is certainly making things much easier as it refines the design of its products. On the other hand, they also actively trying to prevent people from opening the things up (with specialized screws). It's an interesting dichotomy.

      The only reasonable explanation I can think of is that they want to make things easier for themselves (refurbishing and repairing is cheaper), but at the same time they want to reduce competition and discourage the DIY crowd so they have to pay Apple for all fixes.

      So, for your car analogy, it's like making everything under the hood easier to work with, but then locking the hood itself.

      Well, at least now it's possible to obtain the key (screwdriver) without too much hassle, but the barrier still exists regardless, and it's the attitude that worries me more.

    13. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by LordLimecat · · Score: 1

      Its almost as if they think their target demographic doesnt care in the LEAST about disassembling computer hardware. What a bunch of maroons!

    14. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by MightyYar · · Score: 1

      LOL... I think you get it :)

      --
      W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
    15. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by Osgeld · · Score: 1

      I think a bigger issue is repair from the fine people AT apple. A coworker last year got a brand spankin new macbook pro with all the trimmings cause his art school teacher located in the strip mall would not allow anything else to run photoshop. So after a large pile of money for a good, but not awesome machine, it up and dies like 2-3 weeks after purchase. He takes it back, has to wait a couple of weeks and gets back a now refurbushed laptop (I would have flipped out on them at that point) and its got new larger body gaps and some faint creaks and groans just using the thing cause they apparently could not take it apart and properly put it back together.

      After noticing this then he flips out, and after an additional week of arguing I can pretty much guess, he didnt give a rats ass how nice the cardboard box was. Anyway after a month he finally had a working 2700$ (with photoshop) computer that ran firefox and photoshop, but no longer was required to have it for that class

    16. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by MightyYar · · Score: 1

      That's a nice data point, but on balance I find Apple's service to be better than most other companies'. Again, that's just a data point.

      Fortunately we have people like Forrester Research, who rank Apple at the top of all the tech companies.

      --
      W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
    17. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by Coren22 · · Score: 1

      The newer mac mini makes adding memory pretty easy, but that is the only thing that is easy...

      --
      APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
    18. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by Osgeld · · Score: 1

      yea thanks for pointing out a 3 year old report that list best buy as having a 82% excellent customer experience (which is higher than apples) to make your case

    19. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by MightyYar · · Score: 1

      Feel free to supply better data...

      --
      W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
    20. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by Osgeld · · Score: 1

      I dont feel like making your point for you, especially if your too lazy to do it yourself

    21. Re:Apple good at making stuff easy to open? by MightyYar · · Score: 1

      Lazy? I'm the one who actually supplied data to support my point. You supplied... a story. You don't like my data, you say it's too old - fair enough. Presumably you believe that the passage of time has eroded Apple's lead. But you've offered nothing to support your point. Here's another blurb from March.

      --
      W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
  13. Re:Because by Mitchell314 · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    Given that cats get free shelter, food, protection, and medical attention in exchange for occasionally giving affection on their own terms, who're the stupid ones in this relationship? :P

    --
    I read TFA and all I got was this lousy cookie
  14. Dumbest. Post. Ever. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Seriously. WTF slashdot.

  15. Apple has it down to an art and a science by XxtraLarGe · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Every time I get a new Apple product, it's a cool experience. The briefcase style MacBook Pro box is very sleek, and everything inside of it has it's own special compartment, it's own special wrapping, etc. Same thing with an iMac or an iPhone. It really makes you feel like you're getting a luxury item.

    --
    Taking guns away from the 99% gives the 1% 100% of the power.
    1. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Every time I get a new Apple product, it's a cool experience ... It really makes you feel like you're getting a luxury item.

      I think this sums up pretty well why people buy Apple products -- the *feeling* that you're buying something "cool."

      Whether that should be why people buy computer products is another issue. This whole fiasco highlights the problems with that mentality--and by "fiasco" I am referring to the preciousness of those complaining about the packaging, not the packaging itself.

    2. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > Every time I get a new Apple product, it's a cool experience.... It really makes you feel like you're getting a luxury item.

      I'd rather have the actual luxury of being able to install the OS of my choice.

    3. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's because it IS a luxury item.

    4. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by XxtraLarGe · · Score: 1

      I'd rather have the actual luxury of being able to install the OS of my choice.

      What's stopping you? Boot camp lets you install whatever OS you'd like. I have Win 7 installed on my MacBook Pro for those rare occasions when I need to do something Windows specific, and I could install any Linux distro I wanted if I was so inclined. Of course, if you're talking about the iPhone, I don't know what the options are. Does your Android phone give you the luxury of being able to install iOS on it?

      --
      Taking guns away from the 99% gives the 1% 100% of the power.
    5. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by XxtraLarGe · · Score: 1

      I've used Macs for over 20 years, along side Windows, Solaris, Red Hat, Ubuntu, etc. I have had a Mac at home because I prefer to not have all the issues I've run across with the other OSes at school or at work, and I've gotten most of my family to buy Macs because I was sick of being the "I.T. support guy" every time somebody's computer crashed or got a virus or their printer stopped working for no apparent reason. Cool has nothing to do with it.

      --
      Taking guns away from the 99% gives the 1% 100% of the power.
    6. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Steauengeglase · · Score: 1

      It also comes in handy when taking it back to the Apple Store for repairs.

    7. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My Panasonic camera was like that. Guess some in the audience don't see that good product design extends to good packaging.

    8. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Hamsterdan · · Score: 1

      Like people have been able to do for the last 6 years?

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boot_Camp_(software)

      --
      I've got better things to do tonight than die.
    9. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Does your Android phone give you the luxury of being able to install iOS on it?

      Even if anyone wanted to downgrade their Android phone to iOS, it's not open source, so...

    10. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      well as an "I.T. support guy" your full of shit, In our business we have every one of the OS's you mentioned and we have all of the same problems with all of them. Yes even the macs, and these are not old there are fairly new imacs, they will pinwheel, or lock up sometimes printing to printers just doesn't work, then works again for no apparent reason, sometimes you have to blow out all the printers just to get one to work, and oh ya, we have even had malware on a couple, maybe not quite as many as a couple of the pcs but pretty close. So spare me the i like macs cause they just work nonsense, they don't just work, unless you don't do anything with them, then they work just fine.

    11. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Glarimore · · Score: 1

      Does your Android phone give you the luxury of being able to install iOS on it?

      It might if iOS were open-source.

    12. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by mjwx · · Score: 1

      Every time I get a new Apple product, it's a cool experience. The briefcase style MacBook Pro box is very sleek, and everything inside of it has it's own special compartment, it's own special wrapping, etc.

      You mean modern Macbook has the same packaging as a Dell I bought in 2005... Will wonders never cease.

      Fsck, remove the word "macbook" and you've described every PC, monitor and Keyboard packaging on the planet. Hell even the cord on my $10 mouse had it's own special compartment and it's own special wrapping in side the box. Fsck me, the cord even had it's own special cable tie I had to undo.

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    13. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It really makes you feel like you're getting a luxury item.

      Almost. What it's really doing is stroking your little ego so you won't mind spending extra on a new upgrade next year. Because buying an Apple product means you're special.

    14. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Congratulations, you'll still be the support guy with the spread malware on that platform now. (Gee, I wonder why anything stopped working properly when they got malware on it!)

      You just made them spend an extra 20-40% on the same hardware they could have gotten elsewhere for a very time limited "protection" -- instead of educating them on installing random crap from the dark depths of the internet.

    15. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, if that OS was ported to the device in question. Practically all companies and devices allow you to install your OS of choice, assuming the company / person that wrote the OS wants to do so. WinMo6 also allows this (the HD2 - http://android.hd2roms.com/ - is still fairly popular in the ROMming community). Not sure of WP7, 8.

      Sony Ericsson, HTC have unlockable bootloaders (all you need to do is hit up their website and say you accept the responsibilities of "going off the reservation"). Google's Nexus devices, Samsung devices (except one on Verizon, but there's an identical version of the phone you can get if this is important to you) do not stop you.

    16. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by slimjim8094 · · Score: 1

      Funnily enough, you can actually install Android on your iPhone without too much trouble. It even works alright, by the sound of it.

      --
      I have developed a truly marvelous proof of this comment, which this signature is too narrow to contain.
    17. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Jesus_666 · · Score: 0

      Oh, come on. Unless your family consists of idiots malware mitigation should make up a negligible amount of tech support work. It's more "Where did my program go?" (Windows decided to clean up the desktop), "What does this dialog box mean?" or "My printer stopped working!". The last one can happen anywhere (printer drivers are universally evil) but the first two happen especially on Windows.

      My mother uses a laptop running Windows 7. My father uses a netbook running Ubuntu. Neither of them are proficient with computers but my father requires vastly less help since making the switch. When I have to help them it's usually because Windows did something incomprehensible (to them) and they need someone to figure it out. Windows may no longer be the only malware-affected OS but it's still the king of random nonsense. It's not that OS X and Linux don't have harmless but annoying behavior; it's just usually harmless but annoying behavior that doesn't scare the hell out of nonproficient users.

      --
      USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
    18. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ...so everyone must hate Razer as well because of their packaging?

    19. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      Careful. You don't want to damage their self esteem.

    20. Re:Apple has it down to an art and a science by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      You just don't understand. Those packages only look superficially similar to a crude layperson. But if you join the Church of Steve you will understand the perfection that comes by adding an Apple logo to the box.

  16. Not Google's Fault by 8Complex · · Score: 1

    I wonder if everyone realizes that it wasn't Google that designed the packaging, but likely they just designed the artwork on the outside.

    As for the box itself, it seems that a packaging engineer just got their fit between the two halves a little too tight... it's not like they put it in heat-welded clamshell packaging!

    1. Re:Not Google's Fault by pohl · · Score: 1

      "First rule of leadership: everything is your fault." - Hopper, A Bug's Life

      --

      The "cue the foo posts in 3, 2, 1..." posts will commence with no subsequent foo posts in 3, 2, 1...

  17. Maybe companies do have personalities. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's hard to justify love of packaging rationally, but it seems like people do care, and it affects their opinions. Therefore Apple puts effort into packaging; Google does not. Just two different takes on what matters and what doesn't.

    1. Re:Maybe companies do have personalities. by couchslug · · Score: 1

      The sack around a Chivas Regal bottle doesn't make the booze taste better, but the CUSTOMER pays for it and is pleasured thereby.

      That sack has sold a lot of booze...

      --
      "This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
    2. Re:Maybe companies do have personalities. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I always thought it was there to vomit in after you drank all the bottle...

  18. Die Hard 2 troll Harder... by mad+flyer · · Score: 4, Funny

    "is at least one thing Apple gets that Google does not"

    Beeeyotch please...

  19. Questioning Importance of the Box by letsief · · Score: 1

    I think the author is vastly overestimating the importance of the box. Sure, I'll grant you that the Apple boxes are nice, but the only people that get that attached to the box are people that are already attached to the device inside. And that's pretty common for iDevices.

    By the way, I didn't have any problems opening the Nexus 7 box. I saw the funny video before I got my device, so I was probably compensating. At least, I had a knife to cut the tape holding the box shut. After that it was smooth sailing. I don't know why the reviewers had such a hard time. Maybe they just had performance anxiety by being on video.

    Again, I'll grant that the de-boxing process wasn't as nice as my iPad's box, but it wasn't unpleasant by any means. On a scale from 1-10, with 10 being an iPad box and 1 being the stupid sealed plastic containers, I'd put it at about a 7. It wasn't particularly memorable, and that's probably fine.

  20. I confess by stuntpope · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I've kept my Apple boxes (Mini, keyboard, MacBook, iPod Touch plastic case, iPad). I don't have them on display nor do I lovingly gaze upon them, they are in my garage. I recognize their superior yet simple functionality and keep them for the day I move and need to pack up the gear. I'd rather use the original packaging since it's obviously designed for its purpose, instead of grabbing some random shoe box. I can't say that for most other product packaging. I especially despise heat-sealed plastic packaging.

    1. Re:I confess by milbournosphere · · Score: 4, Informative

      I, too, keep the boxes from my iThings, but for another reason. I've found that resale goes WAY up when you sell an Apple product on CL with the original boxing material. I have no idea why, but people really do put a value on Apple's packaging. You are correct, from a design standpoint, they do a really good job; but that's where my love of iBoxes ends. It's a nice tradeoff for me, though, so I'm not really complaining about iBox fever.

    2. Re:I confess by nitio · · Score: 1

      Now, let's pick this as a starting point for the spontaneous generation of the "value of the Apple boxes". Most comments are about the fact that there is resale value so the 2nd buyer buys with the box thinking of selling with the box and so on.

      Joking aside- I've kept my MacBook and iMac boxes but not because of the box itself but the padding/packaging INSIDE so that when I move I have something made specifically to hold those two tightly without breaking instead of using blankets, generic styrofoam pieces etc.

      My iPhone(s) and iPad? Pfff tossed right outside the neighbor's trash can. You know, I don't want to make robbers think my house has those items ;)

      --
      http://stoploudness.org/
    3. Re:I confess by Fishchip · · Score: 1

      You pack your laptop and iPod into boxes when you move? Why isn't your laptop at your side in its bag/case and your iPod in your pocket? Do you actually use them?

    4. Re:I confess by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      Other companies have good packaging design too. The world is not split between clamshell plastic and zen like iBoxes. Dell has great packaging, and most people store that away also. But you don't hear them write blogs about how great it is because they're not insane.

    5. Re:I confess by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      This is the P.T. Barnum philosophy of resellling.

      Now if the product inside the box were really great and not purchased only by those concerned with current fashions maybe they wouldn't need to be resold as often.

    6. Re:I confess by milbournosphere · · Score: 1

      When I sold my 2006 macbook pro in 2010, after getting four years of hard use out of it, a fanboi offered to pay $50 extra if I had the box. Not all of us mac users buy them as fashion accessories, but we're more than happy to prey on those who do. :)

    7. Re:I confess by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      When purchasing a second-hand item, the existence of pristine original packaging increases the likelihood that the owner was (a) the original owner, and (b) nitpicky, anal, neat, and obsessive about caring for items in their possession. Without knowing the exact history of the item, it's a way to ballpark its likely condition and functionality.

  21. Apple has their own retail space. by bedroll · · Score: 1

    The simplest answer is that Apple has their own retail space, which is likely the top location for buying their products. They get to dictate that experience and others selling their products must follow. Google has the Play store, but if they ever want the Nexus to be a success it must be displayed at big box retailers where potential buyers can try it out. As it happens, big box retailers like packaging that is difficult to open but attractive otherwise. It's a lousy theft deterrent, but they prefer it to having extra security measures to prevent open box theft. Still, Google should probably have omitted some of the plastic seals for direct sale tablets.

  22. Alternative hypotheses? by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Given that Google has been treading the path of relative minimalism in the packaging for their assorted flagships, I see three basic possibilities:

    1. Cargo-cult: Google's cardboard box guru is smart enough to know that Apple makes good cardboard boxes, and has successfully emulated certain elements of them(lack of tacky carrier branding, minimalist design, though usually on a black field rather than a white one, and so forth); but has failed to understand the entire set of variables that go into making a good package, resulting in a close visual reproduction without the functional qualities.

    2. Somebody fucked up in production. The design that, indeed, worked perfectly in CAD and in low-volume mockups turned out to have somewhat sloppy tolerances that erred on the side of 'too tight' when X thousand of them showed up in the containers from the pacific rim, at which point it was a bit late to do anything about it. This happens regardless of 'understanding' of the importance of packaging. The acrylic crazing/cracking problems of the old G4 cube, for example, were not caused by the fact that somebody half-assed the aesthetics of the unit; but by inadequate production techniques.

    3.(Related to 2) At $200, Google isn't exactly making gigantic margins here, which curtails their ability to do costly things in order to achieve superior results. Preventing #2 type problems can, to a degree, be achieved by throwing more money, scrutiny, and willingness to send it back and have them do it right this time. If one lacks the luxury of money and time, though, one has to accept more limited control and the necessity of sometimes shipping 'good enough' in order to meet deadline. Since irksome packaging isn't a major issue by the standards of what can go wrong with complex electronics, it isn't an unlikely thing to suffer if corners need cutting...

    1. Re:Alternative hypotheses? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If we want to say the comparison is invalid due to the delta in price points (which is fair), then we should compare the Nexus 7 with the way Amazon does the Kindle Fire package.

    2. Re:Alternative hypotheses? by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 1

      My intention was not to say that the comparison is invalid; but to note that if your question is "Does Google understand the importance of packaging" rather than "How good is Google's packaging", you have to take budget into account in order to try to distinguish between bad/inelegant design and adequate or even good design that generates some failures in the field because it depends on tolerances that production cannot always support.

      If, for example, you want some sort of slider mechanism, the difference between a slide that sticks when you try to remove it, and is nearly impossible to shove back into place, and a slide that simply falls out is only a few mm. The greater your ability to breath down your vendor's neck about manufacturing tolerances, the fewer units will end up shipping too tight or too loose. (Of course, some might argue that part of the essence of good design is to create designs that work within the dimensional tolerances that you can reasonably expect to accomplish, not the dimensional tolerances you might want or wish to accomplish at a later time...)

    3. Re:Alternative hypotheses? by mrchaotica · · Score: 1

      Maybe I didn't have a problem with the packaging because I got the $250 (higher margin) version...

      --

      "[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz

  23. Boxes can be complicated by nashv · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Packaging can be weird to understand. Some of the simplest-looking boxes are often hard to manufacture and use to package a product on a assembly line.

    Remember that customer experience while unpacking is perhaps the most transient, short-lived event in the life of a product. Other factors such as safety while transport, shelf-appearance and the quality of the product itself is far far more important. And lets not get started about environmental costs of packaging.

    It is easy to get all of it if you have a profit margin like Apple does - about 50%. The Nexus has a profit margin of barely 5-7%. So yes, they may cut corners on the box.

    But something tells me people who want a Nexus get that the packaging is irrelevant enough as to be worthless within 2 minutes of the customer having finished it. Unboxing is where the function of packaging finishes.

    --
    Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem.
    1. Re:Boxes can be complicated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Remember that customer experience while unpacking is perhaps the most transient, short-lived event in the life of a product.

      The thing is, first impressions matter. People are not rational creatures. Thirty seconds of frustration opening the box can color the entire setup process.

      But something tells me people who want a Nexus get that the packaging is irrelevant enough as to be worthless within 2 minutes of the customer having finished it. Unboxing is where the function of packaging finishes.

      Something tells me that the fact that they put all that thought and money into something as disposable as the box gives a hint to why Apple pockets a 50% profit margin and Google has to settle for 7%.

    2. Re:Boxes can be complicated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm not buying company stock, dude, I'm buying a tablet. Apple pocketing a 50% profit margin is a net negative to me the consumer because it means I'm, effectively, paying extra for nothing. (And a fancy box.)

    3. Re:Boxes can be complicated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm not buying company stock, dude, I'm buying a tablet. Apple pocketing a 50% profit margin is a net negative to me the consumer because it means I'm, effectively, paying extra for nothing. (And a fancy box.)

      I'm not buying either. I don't have a tablet of any kind and don't plan to buy one.

        We're all playing armchair CEO here; the game is to figure out what companies and products are successful and why.To that end, the point that apparently sailed over your head was, if Apple is spending money on getting the box right, they're probably spending money on getting other aspects of the experience right, too. That kind of thing matters to a lot of people. (Not you, of course, but a lot of people.)

      And things that are bought by a lot of people start having influence. For one thing, they attract developers. (That's why Windows is still king on the desktop.) And that kind of thing affects even you.

    4. Re:Boxes can be complicated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So yes, they may cut corners on the box.

      Understood, but they cut the worst possible corners. If you want to cut corners on the box, make it a simple brown box that is easy to open. Make it like the box that Dell ships a monitor in, or like a raisin box: something adequate to protect its contents that is easy to open.

      They cut corners the worse possible way. They wanted to make it shiny and fancy and beyond utilitarian, like an iBox, but then they made it impossible to open, like some $7 Walmart headphones in the heat sealed shrink wrap that is impossible to open.

      Cutting corners is about cutting the right corners.

    5. Re:Boxes can be complicated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "It is easy to get all of it if you have a profit margin like Apple does - about 50% [techspot.com]. The Nexus has a profit margin of barely 5-7% [cnet.com]. So yes, they may cut corners on the box."

      Ahh, so THATS how you open them. Clever girl...

  24. Seriously? The packaging? by sl4shd0rk · · Score: 2

    Must be a great piece of hardware if the only thing she found to bitch about is the packaging.

    --
    Join the Slashcott! Feb 10 thru Feb 17!
  25. you put your weed in there by WillgasM · · Score: 1

    Why? What does everyone else use the box for?

    1. Re:you put your weed in there by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
  26. Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I saw the "Nexus 7 Unboxing Montage" video and was like...oh great. But I just picked mine up from the post office this morning and brought it to work today. Took me all of like 30 seconds to unbox it and turn it on. I actually expected there to be some kind of tape on the outside "sliding cover" but there wasn't (spent more time looking for that than actually opening it). Used my car keys to slice the 2 pieces of tape on the inside and it popped open nicely.

    Hell, the included micro USB cable is wrapped up in tons of plastic to keep it nice and shiny and it could all be removed by just pulling the extended bits (it would unroll off the adhesive).

  27. Apple's packaging is very Apple-ish by GameboyRMH · · Score: 2

    I remember setting up an iPad for my sister, the box wasn't particularly stupid or anything but what I remember is that there was a big void between the packaging where the iPad sits and the back of the box. I had to check to see if anything was back there before throwing it out, but this plastic tray the iPad sits in was glued and snapped into it. I pried it off anyways, took a good bit of force. What was back there? Nothing. It was like a trap for hackers, like leaving a puzzle box with nothing inside to mock our curiosity.

    --
    "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    1. Re:Apple's packaging is very Apple-ish by Chrontius · · Score: 1

      "Whipple shield" - look it up sometime.

  28. Packaging was fine with me by Tr3vin · · Score: 1

    I thought some of the latest devices were packaged just fine. I attended I/O and the packaging for the devices they handed out gave me no troubles. I also thought it was designed fairly well. Maybe that is because I'm not one to watch videos of people opening boxes or to film myself doing the same.

  29. Oh, cheap energy... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    In 50 years, if people still care, and are able to, they'll read things like this and wonder what the hell we were doing with all the oil endowment we burnt through. We could have built a better world, instead we built better toys. Shame.

  30. On The Other Hand... by JohnnyMindcrime · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ...my Google Android phone gets the importance of standard connectors.

    --
    Windows 10 is great - I used it to download Linux.
    1. Re:On The Other Hand... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Since the advent of Android phones, they have used at least 2 different connector types for charging/syncing, and those which provide audio/video output have to do so using a *different* connector. There's no signficant market for Android accessories because there is no consistent connector for them which will provide those facilities without having to have a full-blown computer of at least nearly the same capabilities as the Android device to deal with trying to do those things over raw USB.

      The iPhone has used a single connector type for it's entire existence so far. (The 'dock' connector is nearly 10 years old.) Sure, the (rumored) change of the docking port will be a bit of a pain if it's actually true, what with having to buy a new cable, or an adapter for older iPod/iPhone/iPad accessories, but it's still a better situation than the equivalent Android scenario, where you don't get to have those accessories in the first place.

    2. Re:On The Other Hand... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The iPhone connector is standardized on all iPhones and iPods.

    3. Re:On The Other Hand... by c++0xFF · · Score: 1

      Trust me, vendor lock-in is never good for the consumer.

      Right now, my phone, my wife's phone, my tablet, my e-reader, and more all have the same (micro-USB) connector. Audio output for all is a 3.5mm jack. Video (for those that have it) is HDMI.

      No adapters, no special plugs, no nothing needed.

      When I need to charge on the road, and don't have a cable (happened this month), someone always has a micro-USB.

      And each device comes from a different manufacturer. Beautiful.

  31. Patents by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The fact that the initial product unpacking is such an infinitesimally small and insignificant portion of the ownership experience aside, there is always the fear of the Great Fruit filing yet another frivolous lawsuit based on claims of mimicry. The last thing we want is Apple claiming intellectual domain over cardboard boxes.

    1. Re:Patents by Riceballsan · · Score: 1

      Indeed if the packaging looks too good, it might become "cool enough". which would allow the product to be banned.

  32. Mother of god.... by Quiet_Desperation · · Score: 2

    It's the nerd rage apocalypse post!

  33. Re:Because by fellip_nectar · · Score: 5, Funny

    Cats also get neutered...

    --
    Worst. Signature. Ever.
  34. Are you sure packaging is important? by xxxJonBoyxxx · · Score: 1

    >> Apple Gets the Importance of Packaging; Why Doesn't Google?

    Probably because Google's figured out a way to surpass Apple in the market without farting around with fancy box designs. Seems like packaging isn't that important to gain market share. (Packaging does help artificially inflate the profit on each individual Apple unit; part of the reason I never buy new.)

    1. Re:Are you sure packaging is important? by geek · · Score: 1

      First impressions matter. My fiancee and I just got MacBook Air's a little while ago. The packaging was amazing. You literally just slip it out of the box. I'm not the type to care all that much but she was wowed and that set the tone for the use of the device afterwards.

      It's just like dressing for an interview. Make a first good impression and tiny flaws after the fact become less of a problem.

    2. Re:Are you sure packaging is important? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yep. My first MacBook Pro left me sitting there (mildly) stunned for intervals during the entire first week I owned it. I'd discover some new feature which made it less of a hassle than my old, windows laptops, and I'd just kind of go, "Wow! That's nice! Why the hell isn't anyone *else* doing that?!"

      The back lit keyboard, which automatically adjusted the brightness according to the light level in the room was one such example. Just *having* a back lit keyboard at that point in time was a step above and beyond the general market. Having the computer transparently handle the contrast issues involved was quite the pleasant surprise for someone used to the way Windows laptops generally *almost, but not quite* work the way you want.

    3. Re:Are you sure packaging is important? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wow, your fiancee is easily impressed. Maybe that's why she agreed to marry you. Were you as easy to slip out of your box?

  35. Important things, eh? by hattig · · Score: 1

    So in this "video unwrappings" what we see are people who can't open a box that has a bit of tape on it, presumably because they've set themselves up for the video with themselves, and the box, and nothing else (well, a shirt collar plastic tag in one case).

    In the real world, we've just opened the big cardboard box that the smaller box arrived in, and we have a pair of scissors or a knife in hand to cut through that bit of tape.

    The videos are really "how I can't open a box" videos. Pitiful.

    Admittedly, Apple's packaging is great, but in the end it's packaging, it's opened once and the box ends up in a drawer, on a shelf, in the loft or in the bin. Not a big deal, totally forgotten about once you've got the device in your hands, powered on, browsing your favourite porn^Hweb site.

  36. Excessive packaging by TomC2 · · Score: 1

    A couple of weeks ago I bought an OSX Lion USB stick from Apple online. I was staggered when I received a large-ish (A4-sized) jiffy bag, which when I opened it, contained another jiffy bag, about half the size. Then I opened this up and found my USB stick, attached to a piece of pretty white cardboard with a plastic blister. Yet the USB stick itself is one of the smallest I have ever seen. I wondered if they cut down on this a bit, they could perhaps bring the GBP£55 price down a bit...

  37. HP Touchpad: THE best packaging by David_Hart · · Score: 1

    I've opened many a tech device from various manufacturers, including Apple, and the best quality packaging I have seen has been for the HP Touchpad and accessories. The materials were good quality heavy-weight and well designed. The Touchpad was definitely designed to be a premium product. It's too bad that it was never really given a chance.

    The easiest packaging that I have dealt with is the Amazon frustration free packaging. You just open a box, and there it is...

    Apple packaging is what I would call average. Most manufacturers have below average packaging to save costs. This is what makes Apple packaging look better. If you compared the Apple packaging to the Touchpad packaging you would be amazed at how flimsy the Apple packaging really is, in comparison.

    1. Re:HP Touchpad: THE best packaging by rtfa-troll · · Score: 1

      AAAAAARRRRGGGGHHHH.

      The measurement of packaging quality is not, as HP seems to think, the amount extra that the packaging adds to the weight of the product.

      You know the situation. A delivery guy comes along in a huge huge delivery truck; Out come a team of five lifters and bring a HUGE cardboard box out and drop it next to your desk. Oh; this must be the new database server, you think. You open the first box - it's just filled with boxes. ah; they sent it dissassembled, you think. You start opening boxes. Soon you realise that most of the boxes contain only packaging filler and are there only to hold the other boxes in place. Inside the middle box, however, is a small oblong cardboard box (surrounded by fluffy polystyrene poo shaped package protectors). You open this cardboard box, rip determinedly through the envelope inside. Finally, you find a CD. "HP-UX documentation in Urdu; Supplementary for delivery NN234643; Please store this CD carefully".

      At that point you scream.

      --
      =~ s,(.*),<sarcasm>$1</sarcasm>,g if any_point_you_wish();
  38. First World Problems by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Seriously? Wrap-rage? Only in America can people buy some of the most sophisticated machines in the world and then complain about having to open their packaging with scissors.

    If you think it's hard to open the packaging, imagine how hard it was for the the kids who made it to put it in the packaging in the first place.

    #spoiledbrats

  39. Maybe Apple has a patent on cool boxes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nuff said.

  40. Heat Sealed Packaging and Big Box Store Returns by Fnord666 · · Score: 2

    While I do not enjoy trying to get into the hardened, heat sealed packages that a lot of things come in these days, I do like them. The reason I like them is that they require physical destruction of the package to open. This makes it much harder for certain big box electronics stores to resell used/returned items as new.

    --
    'The tyrant will always find pretext for his tyranny.' - Aesop's Fables
    1. Re:Heat Sealed Packaging and Big Box Store Returns by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      cough -- frys -- cough

      Good point, hadn't thought of that. But still, does it have to be *that* hard?

      Not directly relating to electronics, but my daughter when she was younger was really into Barbie dolls. There was one... was it Roller Skate Barbie, or Snowboard Barbie? I forget. She was displayed in a very active moment, going over a jump or doing a backflip or something, and was held in place with like a million bread ties. Took me most of an hour to get her out of the package. Wife and I called her "BDSM Barbie" after that. Thankfully, the kid never figured it out.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    2. Re:Heat Sealed Packaging and Big Box Store Returns by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sorry, Fnord666... obviously you haven't worked in a big box... those stores have equipment that can reseal packages not badly mangled AND if they have a custom-formed package, there are agreements that allow the outlet to return the non-defective, undamaged item for repackaging. In this day and age of product viability and rapid shipping turnaround, the financial benefit of not having a throw-away is obvious.

  41. Boxes by FadedTimes · · Score: 1

    I do like the Apple boxes more than many other products, but they sit in a dark closet with my comic book boxes. So the effect is really nice at first, but it is forgettable.

  42. Re:Because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    You know the old saying....

    Cats don't have owners... They have personnel.

  43. Error in summary, carefully fixed by Overzeetop · · Score: 1

    'Instead of forgotten in a dump or recycling facility, the boxes sit on shelves serving as a constant reminder that there are hoards of people on eBay willing to pay top dollar for your gently used iDevice when you're done with it, and having that all-important box increases the value of the resale"

    There were two reasons I got an iPhone instead of an Android device when I abandoned WinMo - better apps for musicians (now that is no longer the case) and high resale value. That latter was an important point - if I didn't like my iPhone, I knew I could resell it for at or above(!) what I paid for it. In fact, I bought a 3GS used to try out the device, then two months later sold it for ~$10 less than I paid - net - when the 4 came out. Same thing happened with an iPad - when v2 came out I picked up a used v1, Apple refurb'd wi-fi model. Within two weeks I found that I go a lot of places that don't have wifi, so I boxed it back up and re-sold it for $25 MORE than I paid for it.

    With most iDevices, there is little chance you'll end up with a dud that gets relegated to the bargain bin a month after you bought it. Being able to advertise a lightly used device in the box with all the accessories makes it very, very attractive to buyers.

    --
    Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
    1. Re:Error in summary, carefully fixed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Never understood why that is.

      Why wouldn't someone pony up $10 more dollars to buy new? It's not like the price changes over the year (making the company more and more profit as the year goes on). Instead you take a chance that there's something wrong with it that might not be obvious at first glance (i,e. a friend's home button becomes flakey once in a while), and lose out on your warranty.

  44. Smarter Than by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Umm, should one really be using a technical product if they are not smart enough to open the box? Stupid is as stupid does. I suppose that the theft prevention of a couple strips of tape is working.

  45. Re:Because by GameboyRMH · · Score: 3, Funny

    Hey now, if I lock a cat in a cage with some fun cat toys it won't even look at them, it will cry to be let out.

    --
    "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
  46. Dont get it by tom229 · · Score: 1

    People are strange... packaging is irrelevant.

    --
    If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
  47. Not my biggest worry. by 91degrees · · Score: 1

    You know, while it's quite nice to have a good box, since I'm going to use it once, I can live with this being mildly inconvenient.

    If the recharge socket was in an inconvenient place, or it was easy to accidentally press the power button, I'd see the issue. This will be a problem again and again.

    I'm sure they're great, but I've never head an Apple user wax lyrical about the packaging, and these people not exactly shy about extolling the virtues of their gadgets. they have other things to get excited about.

    The only people who need to unwrap a device of a specific type more than once a year or so are incurable gadget addicts, and reviewers. I'm not one of them.

    1. Re:Not my biggest worry. by White+Flame · · Score: 1

      I'm sure they're great, but I've never head an Apple user wax lyrical about the packaging...

      ...until this thread.

      It's weird. Any time there's any discussion about Apple's anything, people crawl out of the woodwork to report the most minor or dubious rationales for everything as the most important key feature of the "experience", no matter the subject.

  48. Stupid video by blogan · · Score: 1

    The one guy uses his collar thing to try and open it? That's the wrong tool, of course it's going to be hard. I think some Apple people like to focus on something they're better at and give it more weight than it demands. I opened my Nexus 7 and had no issue with it. I'll never open it again.

    On the other hand, if you thought about being able to load apps that aren't approved by the manufacturer, that's a feature you'll want since it's ongoing.

  49. Apple fanboi trolling by spivster · · Score: 1

    You have got to be kidding me. I've never bought an Apple product, so I can't comment on the packaging, but my Nexus 7 arrived a couple of days ago, and I thought it was quite nicely packaged. A couple of scissor snips and the dreaded taped sides were open. This post is Apple fanboi trolling at its finest.

  50. The Rise and Fall of Humankind by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    In the beginning, Humankind had to fight predators, disease, hunger... often meaning certain death. Every day was a hard-fought battle for survival of the tribe.

    In the end, Humankind has to fight a box. It has two plastic stickers. "oh no, we're doomed!"

  51. Frustration-Free Packaging by AlKaMo · · Score: 1

    Personally, I prefer Amazon's take on packaging to Apple's. It may not be as pretty, but it's designed to be easy to ship, open, unpack and recycle. Coincidentally (or not), that happens to be the sequence of events where I will actually interact with the packaging.

    1. Re:Frustration-Free Packaging by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I agree. I do wish though, that more of what they sold actually used the Amazon Certified Frustration-Free Packaging.

      As often as not, I still get stuff ordered through them that comes in a plastic, heat-sealed, clam-shell package.

  52. Only iDiots iCare by DeTech · · Score: 1

    The only people who care about packaging are already apple fan-dweeb.

    IMHO the best packaging is the cheapest package that gets the product to the user safely. period. Anything above that is just art students masturbating on each other.

    1. Re:Only iDiots iCare by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Whatever you need to do to suppress apples superiority..

    2. Re:Only iDiots iCare by Bobartig · · Score: 1

      While I understand that the world *does* revolve around you and your device, once you are shipping more than one or two of them, you have to start considering packaging more carefully. Better packaging allows you to ship more units in less space, reducing cost and carbon footprint. Apple's high-end packaging is not only about protecting the product, but is engineered to work into their supply chain management as well - an area in which Apple is silently a world leader. This efficiency is good for the business and good for the customer. Apple's dedication to over-engineering drives innovation in this space, and motivates improvement among competitors. It's a good thing that Apple isn't as thoughtless as you are about product design, and specifically package design, because it ultimately leads to cost savings, reliable and green shipping, whether or not you buy Apple products.

      --
      This is where I get my recommended daily allowance of "Foot in Mouth."
    3. Re:Only iDiots iCare by DeTech · · Score: 1

      Thanks for the laugh. As a product designer I love seeing those marketing tag lines "Apple's dedication to over-engineering drives innovation in this space ".

      Actually Apple's misguided over engineering only drives up cost. High-end packaging is exactly that, a luxury. And last time I check wallmart was the supply chain world leader, not Apple. Any way you slice it the best packaging is the cheapest that get's the job done, and most of the time that's the greenest solution as well, real efficiency cost less .

    4. Re:Only iDiots iCare by dyingtolive · · Score: 1

      reliable and green shipping, whether or not you buy Apple products.

      But not necessarily green packaging if you buy Apple.

      --
      Support the EFF and Creative Commons. The war is coming, and they're supporting you...
  53. Invasion by Clueless+Nick · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Did Slashdot get invaded by Engadget? Are we already living in the era of idiocracy?

    I find it hard to understand how a difficult to open packaging could lead to comparisons between two major technology companies. Oh, by the way, Motorola sold their phones in smoothly sliding boxes way before the iPhone was launched, so it is not like it is yet another of Apple's 'innovations'.

    To tell you the truth, I find these huge number of insipid 'unboxing videos' and 'reviews' to be an insult to the intelligence of discerning viewers and readers who might be actually looking for useful information about a product.

    --
    Chat with other atheists http://secularchat.org
    1. Re:Invasion by Webz · · Score: 1

      That doesn't discount the contribution of the unboxing experience for the perceived satisfaction of the product. Sure, maybe technical folk who read this site may not be susceptible, but clearly the success of a product is based on more than its technical merit.

      There are non-discerning viewers/customers. They probably outnumber the discerners.

  54. If I'm a fan of anyone's packaging by GameboyRMH · · Score: 2

    It's Nintendo's. Simple, minimalistic, 100% recycled, and humble. No fancy plastic trays, metallic emblems or anything. Just a simple, small, eco-friendly box. Mind you I haven't bought anything from them since the original DS.

    --
    "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    1. Re:If I'm a fan of anyone's packaging by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I was rather pleased with the box my Hakko soldering iron came in. Same sort of thing, just a square box with a couple of molded cardboard inserts to hold everything neatly. Apple computer boxes tend to be similar but with a plastic handle and styrofoam inserts. No more than what's needed to hold the contents tidily and a breeze to open. Never seen an iPad box but they do tend towards fanciful designs for their other small products.

  55. Use the Right Tool, if you can get to it by arthurpaliden · · Score: 1

    Remember those special scissors sold on TV that were designed specifically to open those hard plastic packages. Yes, they were sold in a hard plastic package.

  56. Packaging complaints - one more thing. by 91degrees · · Score: 1

    The only person who has anything worth saying regarding packaging and how difficult it is to open is Jerome K Jerome.

  57. I would much rather... by swan5566 · · Score: 1

    put the $300-some dollars that I saved by going Nexus and put that up on the shelf. I think that would make me happier than any cardboard box. Of course, then I'll eventually spend it... hmmmm...

    --
    In debates about Christianity, there are two groups: those looking for answers, and those looking to just ask questions.
  58. Ars Tech talked about this ages ago by caveat · · Score: 5, Insightful

    John Siracusa wrote a full page on the literal "out of box" experience with the G4 Cube, it seems it's still relevant today:

    Who cares what the packing materials are like? What does this have to do with the quality of the product? Is nice styrofoam supposed to make up for the huge price tag? But step back a minute and consider Apple's motivation here. Like other "boutique" brands (e.g. Bose or Bang & Olufsen), it's important for Apple to provide a uniformly high quality experience with its products. And yes, that certainly includes packaging. In fact, psychologically, packaging may be one of the most important first impressions. The customer needs to be reassured from the very start that their money was well spent. It's not so much that they'll be impressed by the packaging, it's just important to prevent the feeling of "cheapness" that might result if "standard" packaging materials and techniques are used. Welcome to the wonderful world of marketing.

    Love or hate Apple, but they think everything through.

    --

    Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored. - Aldous Huxley
    1. Re:Ars Tech talked about this ages ago by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Love or hate Apple, but they think everything through.

      Except the antennas. :-)

  59. Life immitates Dilbert by Higgs+Bosun · · Score: 1

    Yeah, so what if the box is hard to open? Big deal.

    It made me think of the animated Dilbert episode where he accidentally introduces a marketing departmental to a successful company:

    Marketing: ...and there's a squeaking sound when you take it out of the box.
    Dilbert: You mean the styrofoam?
    Marketing: That's a LOSER sound! It field tested very badly!

  60. faux rage by daninaustin · · Score: 1

    it's not like it was in the impenetrable hard plastic packing that you have to use scissors to open. the device came with the same thin plastic jacket/wrapper around it that apple has used in the past (it's the same as HP used on the touchpad). Maybe it's time to switch to decaf.

  61. Patented already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "... a three-dimensional cardboard construct combining two instances of the Apple iRectangle (cfr. Apple iRectangle patent, figure 2.4) with four smaller Apple iRectangle units (hereafter renamed to Apple iSide, patent pending), forming a revolutionary framework in which a person is not only able to store and transport another device, but where he or she also gains the innovative ability to protect and shield a device contained therein from hazards like moisture, dust and meteor strikes..."

  62. Wow... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    BOO FUCKING HOO ...someone call the WHAAAAAAAAAAAMBULANCE

  63. Rounded Edges by DECula · · Score: 1

    Perhaps the author misses the point - if Google *had* boxed their tablet in any fashion like the iPad(TM)(patents *)
    they would have no doubt been sued and harassed.

    For Deity's Sakes Man - if you want an iPad, get one. If you want a Google experience, get that.
    If your lucky enough to afford both, don't cry about a stinking cardboard box!

    --
    dreaded scurrilous bit-twiddler from Oklahoma
  64. oh god who cares by circletimessquare · · Score: 1

    are we toddlers? we play with the packaging instead of the toy?

    packaging is intended to get an object form point A to point B without damage. everything else is incidental and pointless. we live in a world where people get distracted by this nonsense?
     

    --
    intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
    1. Re:oh god who cares by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      are we toddlers?

      Why else would you buy Apple toys?

  65. Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I don't get what the fuss is about. I had mine open in 20 seconds. Cut two pieces of tape and open the box. It wasn't rocket science.

  66. The End by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Oh my, we have to come to the point where customers can't unpack the products?
    I guess in about 5 years we will see widespread panic in stores because the customers can't open anything.

  67. Apple packaging worth the cost? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Is the fancy packaging on the Apple product worth the extra $200 you pay for it? If you plan on reselling it before you even open it then just leave it in the package and put it in your closet with all your never opened original packaging mint condition collectable star wars figurines. I plan on using my Nexus 7 until it falls apart, then throwing it away and buying another.

  68. Too much free time by DogDude · · Score: 0

    If a person has time to consider the packaging that a gadget comes in, may I suggest that they find a better use for their free time? I can't fucking believe that there are people who are not packaging designers, analyzing how many pieces of tape come on a box.

    Open the fucking thing, take the thing out, throw the packaging in the recycling bin, get on with your fucking life. Jesus Christ, do these same people watch paint dry as a hobby, too?

    --
    I don't respond to AC's.
  69. Samsung lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    i could have sworn that the similarity of packaging was part of the design patent lawsuit(s) that Apple filed against Samsung.

    Never mind that other companies, like say SonyEricsson, had been using the same sort of packaging for at least a decade.

  70. Well, Duh! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If you want to pay an extra $300.00 for the iBox technology, go for it!

    CAPTCHA = awarded (throw your money away to Apple)

  71. Misleading Summary by hexagonc · · Score: 1

    Judging from the title and summary, you'd think that Nexus 7s were sealed in clamshell packaging, where are universally hated. Instead, these people are complaining that the Nexus 7 box is sealed with two pieces of tape and the device itself is in an anti-static bag (which you don't need to cut open). You don't even need a knife to get through the tape -- a simple key will do. This story is much ado about nothing.

    1. Re:Misleading Summary by kelemvor4 · · Score: 1

      Judging from the title and summary, you'd think that Nexus 7s were sealed in clamshell packaging, where are universally hated. Instead, these people are complaining that the Nexus 7 box is sealed with two pieces of tape and the device itself is in an anti-static bag (which you don't need to cut open). You don't even need a knife to get through the tape -- a simple key will do. This story is much ado about nothing.

      Apple didn't make it, so the packaging sucks. It's a universal truth (among apple customers).

    2. Re:Misleading Summary by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Did you see the video? That must be some damned super military top secret terrorist restraining tape straight outta Gitmo! ....or those people were completely dumbfounded by the concept of two pieces of tape holding a box shut.

      Now that I think about it, that Nexus box looked easier to open than, well, lots of things.

  72. Lets forget the kindle box was epic? by djsmiley · · Score: 1

    The kindle box was beautiful. That is all.

    --
    - http://www.milkme.co.uk
  73. I Remember The Day I Discovered Unboxing Videos... by Ziggitz · · Score: 1

    I was youtube surfing and I can across a video called "iMac Unboxing". Not knowing what it was I clicked on thinking "Ok, it'll be cool to see what's in an iMac and how they put them together." I sat and watched the video as the guy showed the computer in its box and started opening it describing all the packaging and over the first 2 minutes of this 8 minute video it slowly dawned on me that all this fucker was doing was taking the god damn computer out of its fucking box and recording every moment of it like anyone else should give a shit. I had never felt such pity for a human being in my life until that moment.

    --
    There is no memory shortage. yes I have heard of XFCE. Go away.
  74. 1) It's Google's first product by walterbyrd · · Score: 1

    2) Who cares?

    3) Do normal really care that much about packaging? Or just apple snobs?

    1. Re:1) It's Google's first product by hexagonc · · Score: 1

      I think normal people do care about packaging when it cuts them or takes a chainsaw to get through like heat-sealed clamshell packaging. However, none of that applies to the Nexus 7 packaging. These people are just whining.

  75. Really? by Grudge2012 · · Score: 0

    And the the fandroids complain that Apple products are hard to repair?

  76. Is this it? by GeXX · · Score: 1

    Should the box come with instructions on how to cut tape? If you need that, then maybe the nexus 7 is to much tablet for you to handle. Or instructions that say if you are a apple user, please call one of your android friends over and they will show you how to use a knife.

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/4spnbno9n7l7kgk/iphoneperceived.jpg -- This article makes this to be true..

    Google made a great product if all apple users have to bitch about is the box being taped.

  77. It's simple by kelemvor4 · · Score: 1

    Apple sells low value high cost products. Google sells high value low cost products.

  78. FIRST WORLD PROBLEMS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    tempest in a teapot if there ever was one

  79. THIS by nitehawk214 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This article is why I hate hipsters and people that moan about their first world problems.

    --
    I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
    1. Re:THIS by Teckla · · Score: 0

      This article is why I hate hipsters and people that moan about their first world problems.

      There are children starving in Africa and people with cancer, so nobody is allowed to discuss anything less important, right?

      By the way, you took time out of your day to whine about the submission. Oh, the irony...

    2. Re:THIS by nitehawk214 · · Score: 1

      I am not saying we should not complain about issues. But packaging? Really?

      Perhaps this is part of the filming unboxing culture that I just don't understand. As long as the item is not in one of those frustrating plastic packages that require the jaws of life to open, or it isn't wasting an obnoxious amount of material; I don't much care about the packaging.

      Also I like your username.

      --
      I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
    3. Re:THIS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "This article is why I hate hipsters and people that moan about their first world problems."

      Says the person complaining about people complaining about product packaging on Slashdot.

    4. Re:THIS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Kids really need to re-evaluate what a hipster is lol

    5. Re:THIS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, absolutely. People in North Korea are being held in prison camps. Somewhere someone is getting executed by a death squad. Some children are lying on a bed dying because they don't have enough food.

      Yet despite all that I don't see you freeing North Koreans, or sniping at death squads, or airlifting food to the rural impoverished poor. Instead you are sitting in your rich country on an expensive PC commenting on Slashdot.

      All your problems are first world problems. How hypocritical.

    6. Re:THIS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I have to agree with many of you on the whining and moaning about packaging that inspires "wrap rage"... wtf? I was worried I was the only one who saw the infantilism of something like getting all freaked over opening a package! Are there so many "adults" out there who have the patience of a 3-yr old at Christmas???

      The packaging serves multiple purposes and in some people's minds (especially Apple's packaging engineers and marketing department), it is the first experience one has with that particular item in which you've invested good money! Remember the old adage: "you only get one chance to make a good first impression?" You open it once and if it's a shitty package that doesn't afford the value that stuntpope and TheCarp describe (re-packaging for moving purposes) or storing an item not in use, it's something that should be recycled (if companies haven't gotten this idea yet, they should be fined!). Others describe the value of selling or gifting a used item in the original box; while I don't agree with the increased financial benefit (although alen may have a different experience), I certainly agree with the increased aesthetic value of giving or receiving something in its original packaging... it says something about how the item was cared for and appreciated, even if it is a piece of crap like a Nexus 7 that you find less than satisfying.

      While some readers have expressed the sentiment that Apple sells overpriced items, I think they are showing the same blindness that seems to have disappeared from the market years ago: it's obvious that Apple's overall quality and satisfaction strategies have proven beneficial to the company. It seems that some /. readers are still in the dark ages as to what's important to the customer IS exactly the point. This is why M$ has posted its first "bad" quarter in its history and HP has restructured many times and even the whizkid Michael Dell's company is not doing as well as Apple. I may be a Machead, but I am for a reason (at least one!) and that's because of the overall experience.

      Get over it!

  80. Scale by Gideon+Wells · · Score: 1

    Apple promotes its tech as high class, well, higher than most tech. Google is more down to Earth in how it presents. Sort of. The difference is serving the same wine in a wine bottle, a box, or a reused bottle of coke.

    --
    by Anonymous Coward: I, for one, welcome the shift from car analogies to pizza analogies. um.. overlords?
  81. Saves on Tech Support by Art+Challenor · · Score: 1

    Quite a saving on tech support, if you're too dumb to open the package, your WAAAYYY to dumb to use the product. Just return it now, please, unopened.

  82. iMilk by Bazman · · Score: 1

    Maybe Apple can design a milk carton that doesn't spoo milk all over your lap when you open it...

  83. Different audience - Apple vs Google by erp_consultant · · Score: 2

    For the Apple buyer packaging is important. They are buying what they feel is a premium product and expect it to be presented that way. I'm generalizing here but I would guess that the Apple customer is more likely to also own designer clothes and accessories that the Google customer. The Google customer is more likely to be a no frills type of person. Less impressed with the packaging and more about what's inside the package and how it works and the technology behind it. Before anyone flames me I'm not saying that one is any better than the other. It's just sort of the engineer view of things (google) vs the architect view of things (apple). Both are important and both are valid they just look at the same thing in a different way.

  84. I opened mine Tuesday by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    UPS delivered the box.
    I took out my pocket knife.
    I opened the outer box.
    I cut the tape on the inner box.
    I put my knife back in my pocket.

    The whole process, including throwing away the garbage, took 20 seconds. How much bitching can you really do about a 20 second process?

    Don't blame google because you aren't civilized. Pocket knives cost anywhere from $5 to $500 and come in all sorts of styles - there is no excuse not to carry one.

  85. because apple patented by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    because apple patented how it wraps it's packages? I know this sound s trollish, but if you saw the story about apple patenting it's scrollbar and 25 other UI 'features' you wouldn't be surprised it they patented this.

  86. Re:Because by Gilmoure · · Score: 4, Funny

    Exactly! Only stupid consumers with too much money and no geek sense like this stupid Apple packaging. And there's so many of them! Why doesn't crApple research users on slasgdot and gear their stuff towards them! Some of the folks here have money to spend as well. Stupid Apple, targeting the majority.

    --
    I drank what? -- Socrates
  87. Re:Because by BronsCon · · Score: 4, Funny

    Hey, now, my cat routinely outsmarts my wife. There was an incident with a chicken nugget that I won't provide details on, but let's just say, the cat was the clear winner, there. My wife, by the way, has been an exclusive Mac user since the days of OS9.

    --
    APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
  88. Re:Because by jellomizer · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This seems like a statement said buy the guy with a collection of toys that are perpetually in their shrink wrapped state.

    Packaging has many uses.
    1. To keep all the parts together in one container.
    2. To Identify the product that it contains.
    3. To try to make the product stand out from the other products.
    4. Portrait your first impressions of the product.

    --
    If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
  89. I had a few Apple boxes by lochnessie · · Score: 1

    sitting in my basement; not the pretty white ones, but the brown ones they send you when you need to send your poorly-produced, unreliable, overpriced, first-generation Macbook Pro back for AppleCare service. I got tired of sending it in, so I had a few extra boxes.

  90. eeeeh by SmallFurryCreature · · Score: 4, Funny

    and thats why you need to have a good pair of pliers and a decent sharp bladed boxcutter to deal with such things

    Bit harsh, I manage to deal with kids quite well with just a hammer.

    --

    MMO Quests are like orgasms:

    You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.

  91. Apple cares by Quila · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Google and others think the user experience of a product is confined only to the actual use of it. But that's only one part pf a user experience, and forgets walking into the store (or using the online store), buying, unboxing, first start and setup, support, and eventual recycling.

    Apple does everything in its power to make all aspects of the user experience perfect. Apple does unboxing tests for products, even did store mock-ups instead of just slapping up the usual crowded aisles. That's their brand strategy, and it's popular with consumers and profitable.

    1. Re:Apple cares by Tharkkun · · Score: 1

      Google and others think the user experience of a product is confined only to the actual use of it. But that's only one part pf a user experience, and forgets walking into the store (or using the online store), buying, unboxing, first start and setup, support, and eventual recycling.

      Apple does everything in its power to make all aspects of the user experience perfect. Apple does unboxing tests for products, even did store mock-ups instead of just slapping up the usual crowded aisles. That's their brand strategy, and it's popular with consumers and profitable.

      If you're buying an Apple product you're probably spoiled anyways so of course you need your phone NOW NOW NOW NOW NOW. Otherwise you might think about why you paid $200 more for the same product offered by Google. Spending an extra minute opening a box could cause your phone to be eaten by a black hole created by the LHC.

    2. Re:Apple cares by madmark1 · · Score: 1

      Including keeping you from installing anything that might interfere with it.

    3. Re:Apple cares by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No.

      The tendency with any apple evangelists is that anything apple does well (packaging, etc.) is assigned a very high value, and anything that apple does poorly (replaceable batteries, standard SSDs, etc.) is assigned a very low value.

      If your iphone drops calls because you hold it the wrong way, it is forgiven. If you have trouble opening a Nexus 7 box, it detracts significantly from the experience.

    4. Re:Apple cares by PapayaSF · · Score: 1

      Exactly. One good term for this is "attention to detail," and it's not merely a brand strategy, it's at the core of Apple's philosophy and success. It can go to seemingly absurd lengths, like Steve Jobs making Sunday phone calls because the second "o" in the Google icon on the iPhone had an incorrect yellow gradient, but the net result is a hugely successful company.

      The average consumer electronics company (including Google in this instance) still does not understand this. Their institutional tendency is to create lots of "good enough" products, cutting every corner they can, then throw it all against the wall and see what sticks. Sure, that's the traditional way, and it can be profitable, but it rarely creates iconic, world-changing products on the level of iPhones and iPads.

      --
      Q: What does the "B." in Benoit B. Mandelbrot stand for? A: Benoit B. Mandelbrot
    5. Re:Apple cares by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, half of the time Google forgets about the user experience as well. Often they just push beta me-too products and see what sticks on the wall. If it doesn't, it gets "spring cleaned". The very few exceptions right now seems to be GMail, Android and Chrome (and of course their core business; Ads). Everything else that doesn't collect user data or show ads I wouldn't bet on seeing another summer.

    6. Re:Apple cares by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      This is just hippie bullshit. Sorry, but sometimes someone has to look at the emperor with no clothes and point and laugh. You pay extra for this "experience" you realize on top of the already expensive base product. If the 10 seconds it takes to unwrap a product gets you excited then this is something you should bring up with your therapist and not slashdot.

    7. Re:Apple cares by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      Apple sells to the few people who care about this. Google wants to sell to people who use products instead of worshipping them. Attention to detail is fine, but if you take this too far it's called Obsessive Compulsive Disorder, with emphasis on the word disorder. Meanwhile Apple completely ignores important issues, like how to hold the phone, how to recycle them cleanly, how to allow the owner to change the battery, and how to make a device that lasts a long time instead of planned obsolescence.

    8. Re:Apple cares by Quila · · Score: 1

      Otherwise you might think about why you paid $200 more for the same product offered by Google

      My iPhone cost the same as the then most-current-generation Androids, and even less than the base RAZR.

    9. Re:Apple cares by Quila · · Score: 1

      The tendency with any apple evangelists is that anything apple does well (packaging, etc.) is assigned a very high value, and anything that apple does poorly (replaceable batteries, standard SSDs, etc.) is assigned a very low value.

      To say that Apple does replaceable batteries or standard SSDs poorly first assumes that those things are a desired trait above the simplification and miniaturization gained by not having them. It is an engineering decision to do it that way, not a flaw in execution. What is gained for the user by Google doing unboxing poorly?

    10. Re:Apple cares by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think one of the earliest examples from when Jobs returned was how easy they made the PowerMacs to service and upgrade. I forget which model it started with, but I know by the time of the blue & white G3s, it was so well-designed that other companies (e.g., Dell) did their best to take after them. Of course, even at that early point in his return, you could tell which models Jobs wanted people to be able to mess with and which ones he didn't. The iMacs were a nightmare just to do a RAM upgrade.

    11. Re:Apple cares by bigstrat2003 · · Score: 1

      Google and others think the user experience of a product is confined only to the actual use of it.

      Probably because it is, to any reasonable person.

      Apple does everything in its power to make all aspects of the user experience perfect.

      That is not in the least true. Easy example: Apple could make a setting buried deep within iOS, or even an official tool of some kind, to enable the install of non-app store apps. This would greatly benefit the user experience of those who currently have to jailbreak their devices, and harm the user experience of no one. But Apple doesn't do it. Regardless of the reasons you ascribe to their action, they clearly do not do everything in their power to make every part of the user experience perfect.

      --
      "16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
    12. Re:Apple cares by Quila · · Score: 1

      Probably because it is, to any reasonable person.

      So you only use electronics? You've never shopped for them, purchased them, unboxed them, set them up, gotten support for them or recycled them? Impressive. You must be rich and have lackeys do all that for you.

      Easy example: Apple could make a setting buried deep within iOS, or even an official tool of some kind, to enable the install of non-app store apps.

      Which would harm the user experience because poorly written or presented apps, apps that use undocumented APIs that may be closed on the next update, deceptive apps, and many more undesirable traits in apps will be installed by users. When they don't work, who will the users blame? Apple, of course. Even if they don't blame Apple, they are still having a bad experience on Apple's platform, something Apple would like to avoid as much as possible.

      You don't like the sandbox, fine, but to say it's an absolute negative is wrong. There are sound usability and engineering reasons behind the decision, even if you disagree with it.

    13. Re:Apple cares by bigstrat2003 · · Score: 1

      So you only use electronics? You've never shopped for them, purchased them, unboxed them, set them up, gotten support for them or recycled them? Impressive. You must be rich and have lackeys do all that for you.

      No, I just don't call those things part of the user experience (although setting up and getting support are fair inclusions). When you have not yet even used the device, you are not a user. You cannot be said to have a user experience. And when you're getting rid of it, you are no longer a user. Same thing applies.

      Which would harm the user experience because poorly written or presented apps, apps that use undocumented APIs that may be closed on the next update, deceptive apps, and many more undesirable traits in apps will be installed by users. When they don't work, who will the users blame? Apple, of course. Even if they don't blame Apple, they are still having a bad experience on Apple's platform, something Apple would like to avoid as much as possible.

      This is not true at all. It is quite possible to have the ability to install non-sanctioned apps buried so deep, or beneath such a technical and arcane process, that it will only be accessed by those who are cognizant of and willing to accept the risks. Again, Apple can absolutely do this. But they refuse, and in doing so pass up a chance to make those users' experience better (while making nobody else's worse).

      --
      "16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
    14. Re:Apple cares by Quila · · Score: 1

      No, I just don't call those things part of the user experience

      They are part of the interaction with the device, they are part of the user experience. I bought a car from a Ford dealer once, basic business transaction, let's do some paperwork, okay, here are your keys. For warranty service I got grumblings about whose responsibility the service was, and I dropped it off and found something to do for that time. I got the car back as I left it, with a bit of extra dirt.

      I bought a car from a somewhat higher-end dealer once, relaxing couch, refreshments and snacks available, personal half-hour tour of and instruction on all the features of my new car, all-around good treatment down to the bouquet of flowers they gave my wife when we left. For warranty service, they'd immediately take it and I'd get a loaner without question. My car would be waiting for me washed and detailed in the end.

      Guess which one I would prefer to go to again? The one that provided me with the best experience.

      It is quite possible to have the ability to install non-sanctioned apps buried so deep, or beneath such a technical and arcane process, that it will only be accessed by those who are cognizant of and willing to accept the risks.

      Then you sell your phone and the person who gets it has these problems. It's not worth the trouble and potential customer dissatisfaction for Apple for the larger population in order to appease a fraction of a percent of them who are geeks. However, I do agree jailbreaking by any means should be 100% legal, but it should invalidate your warranty since you put it into a state that Apple can't plan support for. Conversely, you should be able to sue Apple if they purposely brick your phone on detection of a jailbreak.

    15. Re:Apple cares by bigstrat2003 · · Score: 1

      They are part of the interaction with the device, they are part of the user experience.

      No they aren't. They are by definition not part of the interaction with the device. Furthermore, even if I were to concede the point for sake of argument, you will spend immensely more time using the device than you will unboxing it, purchasing it, etc. Any facet of the device's function, whatsoever, will have a much larger impact on you than those fleeting moments. So even if we set aside the semantic disagreement we have, it's asinine to judge based on those factors unless all else is equal (which it never, ever is). And equally asinine for a manufacturer to spend any real effort on things such as packaging, unless they have perfected the user experience of their product (which is never the case).

      Then you sell your phone and the person who gets it has these problems.

      Anyone who buys a used device which is in poor condition would (probably rightfully) blame the previous owner, not Apple. I'll concede that there is an chance (small, but a non-zero chance) that there are users whose experience could be worsened by what you describe, but that user base is even smaller than the user base who would want to install non-sanctioned apps. So by your own argument, Apple should be preserving the user experience of the larger group.

      And note that Apple could make a process that is essentially the same as what jailbreaking is now (without having to exploit security flaws). This would change nothing about the experience of the users who buy secondhand from an owner who jailbreaks (those users can have a bad experience today, as they could in the future), and nothing about the experience of the users who don't want to go through a complex and arcane process, except possibly for the better since there wouldn't be as many people trying to find and exploit security holes. The outcomes would be the same as today (more or less), except the users who want to jailbreak could have a documented process, which will not be broken by OS updates. This is an objectively better outcome, but Apple refuses to pursue it. Ergo, there are conditions under which Apple will say "Fuck the user experience", and do what they want to do.

      but it should invalidate your warranty since you put it into a state that Apple can't plan support for.

      I don't expect Apple (or any manufacturer) to provide support for a device that is in a state other than that which they can plan for. However, voiding warranties for a software change is too extreme. As long as the phone can be reset to factory condition, the warranty should be in force to cover hardware defects.

      --
      "16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
    16. Re:Apple cares by Quila · · Score: 1

      Any facet of the device's function, whatsoever, will have a much larger impact on you than those fleeting moments.

      Those moments shape the perception of the product and keep people coming back. Good old-fashioned customer service is getting too rare these days. The feeling that the company actually gives a damn about making you happy is worth a lot.

      Apple should be preserving the user experience of the larger group.

      That is exactly what Apple is doing right now. It is not worth it for Apple to support a tiny fringe customer base that could have a negative impact on the larger customer base.

      As long as the phone can be reset to factory condition, the warranty should be in force to cover hardware defects.

      Long ago I remember a computer hoax about a program that could harm your computer. That's not a hoax anymore. You can change the software in a car and blow the engine, and that violates the warranty too. There will always be bickering about whether the unsupported modification caused the hardware failure. The extreme of this is a generic PC, which is reasonable designed to run any PC OS, having its warranty invalidated over installing Linux. That is a stupid extreme. But the iPhone was designed specifically to run iOS in certain supported configurations, so Apple would have more power here.

    17. Re:Apple cares by bigstrat2003 · · Score: 1

      Those moments shape the perception of the product and keep people coming back. Good old-fashioned customer service is getting too rare these days. The feeling that the company actually gives a damn about making you happy is worth a lot.

      It's worth nothing next to the actual experience of using the device. Who cares if the packaging is good, when the device has some user interface flaw that annoys you? You won't remember the packaging then.

      That is exactly what Apple is doing right now. It is not worth it for Apple to support a tiny fringe customer base that could have a negative impact on the larger customer base.

      Except it can't have a negative impact on the larger customer base, no matter how much Apple wishes to claim it. The only possible customers that it could have a negative impact on are those who might buy a used phone from one of the unlockers - which is a group even smaller than the unlockers themselves. Name one negative impact that this could have on the majority of iOS users that is not already present today as a result of jailbreaking. Just one. (Spoiler alert: you won't be able to do it.)

      --
      "16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
    18. Re:Apple cares by Quila · · Score: 1

      It's worth nothing next to the actual experience of using the device. Who cares if the packaging is good, when the device has some user interface flaw that annoys you?

      Something else Apple excels at. They even looked at the original iPhone icons with a loupe to make sure not one pixel was off. Attention to detail, not something Google is noted for. Apple goes further, trying to ensure that apps don't stray too far from reasonable user interfaces, another reason for the app store.

      You still haven't given one good reason why Apple should officially support this jailbreak-equivalent hack you want. Why add the extra headache? Why make any effort to support what could potentially cause even one user to get pissed off at Apple? Doing nothing is better. Right now the jailbreakers will jailbreak, and Apple can wash their hands of them. Start making it official, and Apple goes down the rabbit hole.

    19. Re:Apple cares by bigstrat2003 · · Score: 1

      Something else Apple excels at. They even looked at the original iPhone icons with a loupe to make sure not one pixel was off. Attention to detail, not something Google is noted for. Apple goes further, trying to ensure that apps don't stray too far from reasonable user interfaces, another reason for the app store.

      It is a strength of Apple's. However, they aren't perfect at it (nobody can be, really), and as such should focus their efforts on the area which actually has a significant impact: the device itself.

      You still haven't given one good reason why Apple should officially support this jailbreak-equivalent hack you want.

      I absolutely have. You've just ignored me. If the procedure is exactly the same, nothing changes for anyone except the users who want to jailbreak (or whatever you'd call it if it were officially available). Those users will have a much superior user experience, everyone else will have the exact same user experience they do now. The result is a net positive, which means that Apple (if they truly are concerned with user experience) has a strong reason to implement this as it helps some while hurting nobody.

      --
      "16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
    20. Re:Apple cares by Quila · · Score: 1

      It is a strength of Apple's. However, they aren't perfect at it (nobody can be, really), and as such should focus their efforts on the area which actually has a significant impact: the device itself.

      Remember the loupe? Remember the other poster who mentioned Jobs' Sunday night call because the gradient in an icon of Google's was off? Apple puts an obsessive-compulsive level of effort into the devices themselves. Having done that, they also focus on the entire experience.

      No, Apple isn't always perfect, sometimes misses the mark in design (hockey-puck mouse) and software (Final Cut Pro X released too soon). However, Apple's usual way is to make lots of mistakes in-house, and there's an extremely low bar for what gets called a mistake, downright nit-picky. Apple is willing to dump a project if it isn't up to snuff, where other management often says it has to be released in order to get some revenue to pay for that R&D or hit a quarterly earnings target.

      Basically, Apple doesn't play "good enough" like Google and others. That bar set, there's time to do other things to make the customer happy. Make the customer happy, what a concept!

      (or whatever you'd call it if it were officially available)

      That means extra effort, development and support liability on Apple's part. For what return? Something that only a fraction of a percent wants to do? That's not good business and bypasses Apple's quality controls. Apple wants a consistent experience, always, and has no good reason to to go out of the way to provide a method for some users to achieve an inconsistent experience.

    21. Re:Apple cares by bigstrat2003 · · Score: 1

      That means extra effort, development and support liability on Apple's part. For what return? Something that only a fraction of a percent wants to do?

      So you admit that Apple doesn't always put user experience first. QED.

      --
      "16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
    22. Re:Apple cares by Quila · · Score: 1

      So you admit that Apple doesn't always put user experience first. QED.

      Your desired user expreience and the user experience Apple desires for the other 99.99% of iPhone users to have are in conflict. Therefore, Apple will put them first and ignore you. It makes sense.

    23. Re:Apple cares by bigstrat2003 · · Score: 1

      No. They aren't. I have repeatedly stated why they are not. You're correct that it isn't a very good return on Apple's investment for them to legitimize this usage, but that has nothing to do with user experience. As I have demonstrated, Apple can set things up so that the user experience of the 99.99% (which is an exaggeration, but whatever) is exactly the same as it is today, while simultaneously improving the user experience of the .01%. There is no user experience justification whatsoever for their stance on this topic.

      And that's fine. My point here isn't "Apple should do this thing", my point is to disprove your claim that Apple always puts user experience first.

      --
      "16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
    24. Re:Apple cares by Quila · · Score: 1

      but that has nothing to do with user experience

      You seem to think that fragmenting the user experience is an enhancement to the user experience. I disagree.

      As I have demonstrated, Apple can set things up so that the user experience of the 99.99% (which is an exaggeration, but whatever)

      Apple has sold around 200 million iPhones. That would peg the jailbreaking community at about 20,000 using my SWAG figure. So maybe I revise to 99.9% to be probably far bigger than the community.

      my point is to disprove your claim that Apple always puts user experience first.

      Except that I never said that. I did say they try to make the user experience perfect. Their concept of it has historically meant creating a homogenous environment, not purposely fragmenting it.

    25. Re:Apple cares by bigstrat2003 · · Score: 1

      Except that I never said that.

      Apple does everything in its power to make all aspects of the user experience perfect.

      You did, in fact, say that. The jailbreaking situation is an aspect of the user experience which is less than perfect, and is within Apple's power to change. The only way your statement could hold true is if such change would worsen the user experience for everyone else, which is a problem that is easily avoided. Your original statement is false, which is all I have ever been out to prove.

      --
      "16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
    26. Re:Apple cares by Quila · · Score: 1

      The jailbreaking situation is an aspect of the user experience

      No, it isn't. Jailbreaking is outside of the user experience for which the product was designed. Supercharging your Toyota Prius may be something you want to do, and may even provide better performance, but it's outside of the designed experience, may cause problems that will leave you unsupported, and is not something Toyota should support either officially or by making it easier for users to do.

  92. Speaking of the Nexus 7... by geminidomino · · Score: 1

    (Off-Topic, I know. Just give me a chance to get an answer before you mod me to hell).

    Does anyone have any recent information about the Nexus 10 (or whatever it's going to be called)? I'm trying to decide whether to wait for it or not, but if it's just going to be forever vaporware, I'll break down and blow the extra $100 on a Transformer TF300, but I'd rather have the unlocked hardware if given the choice.

  93. Re:Because by Gr8Apes · · Score: 1

    that's one clever pussy.

    --
    The cesspool just got a check and balance.
  94. Re:Because by BlueStraggler · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Wondered how far I'd have to search for the logic that because Apple puts way more thought into packaging, it is therefore stupid. Slashdot, you never dissapoint.

  95. Uh...unless I'm mistaken, by poison1701 · · Score: 1

    It's a fucking box, who really gives a flying fuck?!?!

  96. What Is She Talking About? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm not going to say anything bad about Apple's packaging, but I think maybe Rebecca and I opened different Nexus 7 boxes. Her's seemed to have "taped sides and fussy plastic." Opening mine took "a simple slide of a cover" and had "a lid that 'comes off easily, but not too easily,'". I also watched that unboxing montage and I only have one question: Are those people functionally retarded?

  97. It's a f*cking box. What's the big deal. by cpotoso · · Score: 2

    You will need to open it exactly 1 time. I couldn't care less. /. is getting saturated with dumb dumb dumb articles.

  98. Packaging is bollocks by tehcyder · · Score: 1

    I'd rather they gave me the thing unwrapped in a carrier bag, less crap to throw away when you get home.

    I don't think I have ever consciously kept any of the packaging for anything I ever bought. (Sometimes if there are alot of fiddly accessories like with a phone I might just to keep the unused car charger, headphones, sat nav holder, AV connector leades, foreign travel plug or whatever together) But a lot of people do, as you can tell when they sell stuff on eBay and apologise if they haven't got the original box.

    --
    To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
  99. It wasn't that easy. by KingSkippus · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Because it's not that simple. I can't explain it, you just have to experience it. You're sitting there thinking, "I don't see any tape or other connection between this box and the sleeve, but when I push here, the box won't slide out." I'm telling you, I laughed the whole way through that video because those people--that was me last night. Every ounce of common sense--and looking and testing--tells you that it shouldn't be that hard, yet in defiance of all logic, it was. I think Asus/Google invented some new force of nature.

    But yeah, there most definitely were two ??? steps: 1.5 and 2.5.

    1. Re:It wasn't that easy. by Pieroxy · · Score: 1

      I recently bought two Samsung SyncMaster 2443 screens. I unwrapped them, plugged them in and wondered where was the "on" button. There was none. I looked into the box for a "quick start guide" of some sort. Nothing there. Looked it up on the internet, nothing.

      Turns out the "interface" is touch based, but there is no indication anywhere of where you should be touching the screen to turn it on. It took me 20 minutes to figure out how to turn the damn screen on.

    2. Re:It wasn't that easy. by Solandri · · Score: 1

      The tape is a tamper-proof measure, so you know that someone else hasn't opened the box and replaced your new Nexus 7 with a broken one or their used one.

      If the iPod packaging in the link is correct and it's just a box where you lift off the lid, then it's not tamper-proof. You have no way to know that your "new" iPod is in fact new, and not one that was already opened and returned. I would consider it functionally inferior packaging (assuming you place a value on new over pre-owned).

    3. Re:It wasn't that easy. by threecolorable · · Score: 1

      undoing accidental mod

    4. Re:It wasn't that easy. by Korin43 · · Score: 1

      Because it's not that simple. I can't explain it, you just have to experience it.

      I did experience it. I bought one. The steps I described are exactly how I opened it.

  100. Re:Because by BronsCon · · Score: 2

    Indeed, she's a fuckin' troll. She'll sneak up behind you, pounce, and knock your ass over as you step into a room if you're not careful.

    --
    APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
  101. The reason is simple by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The reason is simple: Google is a tech company, Apple is a marketing company. Google cares about the device. Apple cares about selling whatever it can at as high of a price as possible. Packaging is a part of marketing, not technology.

  102. And you pay for them by aglider · · Score: 1

    There is at least one thing Apple gets/sells that Google does not: boxes.

    You can bet that you are paying real gold for those pesky boxes. The fancier, the pricier.

    --
    Sent as ripples into the electromagnetic field. No single photon has been harmed in the process.
  103. It is about perspective by Monoman · · Score: 1

    It is a case of Form over function vs. Function over form

    --
    Keep the Classic Slashdot.
    1. Re:It is about perspective by Monoman · · Score: 1

      and first impressions.

      --
      Keep the Classic Slashdot.
  104. Y'know. What we need is a good war by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    WTF is wrong with you people?
     

  105. solution by hackula · · Score: 1

    cardboard box + bubble wrap == perfect user experience

  106. Apple would sue... by tomhath · · Score: 1

    ...if Google used a box with a lid that comes off easily, but not too easily.

  107. The Box by QuickBible · · Score: 1

    Time for a SNL skit about tablets in the box...

    In soviet Russia the box opens you

  108. My Nexus 7 box gave me a feeling of precision. by mark_reh · · Score: 1

    The packaging was simple, artistically adorned, and it fit together tightly. That tells me there was some very precise work done in manufacturing that package- someone cared enough about what they were doing to make the package fit the product well. That's my first impression of the Nexus 7, and after using the device for a couple hours over the last couple days I have to say that first impression was spot-on. The device is well made. Android seems to be a great OS (at least it isn't -ugh- Windows!).

    I've seen all the silly you-tube gadget-pron videos compilations of inept fools struggling with the packaging. I don't know where they found all those dopes but they are definitely not the sort of people whose opinions I trust about tech products. What sort of dope sets up a camera to tape a package opening and doesn't have a knife handy to cut through tape?

  109. Hope in humanity..... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I tend to lose all hope in humanity when a non-issue like this makes the "headlines". Seriously, problem opening a simple package?! Oh oh, careful on sliding doors, might confuse you a bit........

  110. Packaging is misleading but not bad by detain · · Score: 1

    When I first saw the google nexus 7 box, I thought holy shit this tablet must be tiny; but when i opened the box the tablet fills out the entire width/length of the box with no space whatsoever left. This immediately made me feel better as the tablet wasn't small at all, they were just fairly efficient with their packaging and it seemed like they were trying to conserve materials more than just give you a pretty package. That being said the box it came in is still very nice, you just slip the cover back on and it looks like new. I don't know if it was or not, but if it wasn't, then the packaging could have been made with recycled materials. That's really the only improvement id suggest with the packaging. The box is built sturdy and pretty enough that if your the pack-rat type, you would hold onto it and reuse it, so I don't really see why people are complaining about it like its not reusable.

    --
    http://interserver.net/
  111. Re:Because by mrclisdue · · Score: 1

    Enough about your wife - tell us a cat story.

    cheers,

  112. Ultimate example? by Sheik+Yerbouti · · Score: 1

    Of first world problems. I am having difficulty unwrapping my latest consumer electronics gadget which is probably not necessary.

  113. Re:Because by ShieldW0lf · · Score: 0

    +1 Insightful

    --
    -1 Uncomfortable Truth
  114. Sack timothy now. by CountBrass · · Score: 1

    I like my Apple kit and their packaging, but this has got to be a new low for Slashdot.

    Sack Timothy and the average quality of the posts on /. would double overnight.

    I'll put a tenner into the pot to pay the bribes necessary to get him sacked; clearly bribes are required or would be long gone.

    --
    Bad analogies are like waxing a monkey with a rainbow.
  115. Apple's packaging is easier? by BronsCon · · Score: 1

    Since when is Apple's packaging easier to open than most? This was not the experience I had with the iPod Touch I bought in April. Of course, that could be because I let my wife open it, for a laugh. She ended up handing it to me, unable to figure out how to get the iPod off of the plastic plank it was wrapped onto. Yes, she felt dumb when I showed her the "Pull" tab. No, it wasn't any easier than any other box I've ever opened.

    --
    APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
  116. Re:Because by xs650 · · Score: 3, Informative

    Relax, we are just having some fun goofing on the iHive mind. Thank you for helping that along.

  117. Re:Because by BronsCon · · Score: 1

    I was, but they'll both do that. Well, my wife only does it to me, while my cat is more of a whore about it.

    --
    APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
  118. Burying the lead by onemorechip · · Score: 1

    'wrap rage,' the linguist-approved word for the anger associated with opening a factory sealed product,

    So now all our words and phrases must be approved by a linguist?

    --
    But, I wanted socialized health insurance!
  119. Google should have a statement/image by future+assassin · · Score: 1

    on the packaging. Take a DEEP breath before unpacking.

    What did these people do from the store to the house? Grind their teeth in anticipation? If you're that retarded you deserve to have a hard time unpacking the product.

    --
    by TheSpoom (715771) Uncaring Linux user here. I have nothing to add to this but please continue. *munches popcorn*
  120. Because they have never actually MADE anything by TheSkepticalOptimist · · Score: 1

    Google's been a software company for 99.99% of its history. Even though it entered the tablet/phone market, it doesn't actually make anything.

    While Google has made some commercial sever products in the past, the Nexus 7 is the first piece of consumer electronic equipment Google has ever made, and so it is obvious they no nothing about packaging.

    What I find absolutely hilarious is that Google measures software performance in terms of people's lifespans. If it takes 2 seconds to access GMail, and a billion people access GMail, they consider that to be X number of lives wasted accessing GMail, so they strive to make accessing GMail faster to "save" lives..

    Seems like all the time Google has saved you with their software just got wasted trying unboxing their hardware.

    Of course, I am sure most of the people in the Nexus unboxing video are tools anyways.

    --
    I haven't thought of anything clever to put here, but then again most of you haven't either.
  121. Its a fucking computer, not an "experience" by LodCrappo · · Score: 1

    When did this ridiculous concept of an "experience" come about? Sometime around the iPhone's near miss at becoming a major player in the cellphone arena I think.

    Believe it or not, for some (many?) people, a gadget's value is derived entirely by what it can do for us. There is no "experience" associated with ownership of the gadget. It is simply a tool.

    We don't record video of the day we purchased a screwdriver, and we don't even notice the box that gadgets, computers, and other TOOLS come in.

    If your life is so dull and pointless that owning a toy or tool has become a significant "experience", please shoot yourself in the head immediately so as to preserve air and other resources for those of us who are actually alive.

    --
    -Lod
  122. Re:Because by ackthpt · · Score: 2

    [any] buyers are like cats, they like the packaging more than the gift, and are just as stupid.

    Ever been a child at Christmas, electic with anticipation to get through that gift wrapping for whatever is inside? The better the paper, the more heightened the anticipation. Wrap it in old newspaper and the kiddies will, evertime, go for the better wrapping. Everything about presentation you need to know is there.

    When I worked in a logistics company I was stunned to learn how much packaging cost - when a box (and presumably packing materials) were damaged by a klutz on a forklift the box was set aside and new packaging was ordered and the contents moved and repacked. The box for a PC could run as high as $40. For some other goods the packaging could run much higher. Manufacturers put a lot of thought and effort into packaging, for presentation because sometimes the box itself drives the decision to buy. That was years before any iAnything came out, Apple is simply one company who takes it very seriously. Google apparently wants to cut corners or simple doesn't care.

    --

    A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
  123. FFS! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Instead of forgotten in a dump or recycling facility, the boxes sit on shelves serving as a constant reminder of the beauty within

  124. Losing Your Apple Virginity by Guppy · · Score: 1

    In the case of tablets and phones, packaging is the first personal encounter with what is intended to be a personal device. Getting this step right is crucial to shaping how a consumer perceives the product and too many companies neglect this simple but ineluctable point.

    It's kind of like losing your virginity. You'll have sex plenty of times in the future (presumably), but the initial experience is very important.

    It's not fetishism to want a consumer's experience of "getting at the device" to be quick, obvious, and easy. Furthermore, packaging that is easily opened and which is not damaged upon opening makes that packaging reusable.

    Ah-yup, that's not exactly what she said though. Regardless, the initial box-opening experience is important.

  125. everything is over packaged by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    just about everything I buy is horribly over packaged - from fruit to computers. from the completely insane HP delivery of a box of ten DAT72 tapes on a pallet to the mildly bewildering... why is my fruit wrapped in plastic, didn't nature give it a protective layer called skin?

    Apple think pretty boxes are important. I, realizing who's money is actually being wasted on this flashy looking over engineered and over designed box, am just infuriated by the waste of time money and resources that have gone into it. I buy a product because I want the product not because I like boxen (I'm old school geek, boxen is the correct plural!) - the packaging should do nothing more than protect my toy until it reaches my grubby little (itching to disassemble) hands. Anything more than a model name and logo (OK you can have stock control barcodes too, but haven't you all shifted to RFID for that?) printed on the box is probably a waste because 1) we've probably bought this online 2) for high value toys like iPad, how many shops actually put the boxen on the shelves that customers can access (I must admit that I've only ever been in the church of apple once and I had to leave quickly as there was far too much smug in the air I felt ill)?... with those points in mind you aren't actually advertising it to me as I've already bought (or decided to buy) by the time I see the box.

    IMHO Apple are just adding to their lack of "green" credentials by OVER packaging their products in this manner - then again they do also OVER price and OVER hype their products. ...bring on the flames ;-)

    1. Re:everything is over packaged by Bobartig · · Score: 1

      Apple engineers their packaging to be recyclable, sturdy, and compact, and are pioneers in minimal packaging. They use more expensive packaging because it lets them use less materials, pack more units per shipping crate, and reduce their carbon footprint. When I see other consumer electronics' companies packaging, I'm astonished by how flimsy, oversized, and non-functional it is compared to Apples, how much space and material is wasted. Apple has done more to move toward your platonic ideal than pretty much any other electronics company to date. It's profoundly telling that you cannot properly recognize the thing that you purportedly want. This isn't a flame, just pointing out how wrong you are.

      --
      This is where I get my recommended daily allowance of "Foot in Mouth."
  126. Packaging is an Engineering and Design Problem by monk · · Score: 1

    That makes it at least somewhat interesting.

    I haven't received my Nexus 7 yet, but it surprises me that it's poorly packaged. My original ASUS eee had a box so nice (a very Apple-like white box with lid inside a slide-off sleeve) I mounted it on the wall and turned it into a cabinet.

    One other player that the summary didn't mention is Amazon. Their packaging for Kindle is awesome.

    For me the packaging says something about the thought that went into the product from the very top down. Sushi wouldn't be nearly as much fun if it were just slopped on a plate with an ice cream scoop.

    --
    [-- Trust the Monkey --]
  127. Chrome Sticker by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I just bought a new Samsung 550 Chromebook - and was surprised to find a chrome logo in the form of a sticker - just like you (used?) to get with apple products.

    Totally pointless for me , I never had any brand loyalty to apple nor will I have with chrome. But I expect someone somewhere will get excited by it.

  128. High on boxes by coldsalmon · · Score: 1

    'Not only does the box give people warm and fuzzy associations with the product from the get-go, but also, people form emotional attachments to the actual pieces of cardboard. Instead of tossing them like the trash that they are, people have been known to keep their iBoxes,' writes Greenfield. 'Instead of forgotten in a dump or recycling facility, the boxes sit on shelves serving as a constant reminder of the beauty within.'

    Is this a joke? Does anyone (besides Apple's accountants) really think it's a good thing for people to fetishize cardboard boxes? I realize that it's good for a business's bottom line if people overpay for useless crap, but by that logic tech companies should start emulating drug dealers. Oh wait, that's exactly what's happening. Now I get it.

  129. first world problems by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    In my head, I read that summary in the voice of one of those blonde bitches from fox news. What the fuck? Just... what the fuck.

  130. There are a lot of things Google doesn't get. by Bobartig · · Score: 1

    Apple has 30+ years in the consumer electronics field, and Google has, what, a phone, a netbook, and now a tablet? They'll learn fast, but they've got three decades of catchup to do before they can hang with the world's undisputed champion of shiny-making and pretty-boxing.

    --
    This is where I get my recommended daily allowance of "Foot in Mouth."
  131. When it sells for Apple charges then fair compare by krelvin · · Score: 1

    I had no real issues getting into a Nexus 7 box. Certainly a lot less of a hassle than a lot of those plastic containers that a lot of products come with that need to be open with a knife and torn apart.

    Saw the unboxing videos and thought it was actually pretty funny.

    I will note however, that opening the Amazon Kindle Fire box was one of the easiest I've ever done though.

  132. Wrap Rage!?!?! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Get off your ass and go outside and meet some people!!!! You have no friends, especially Anthony Kay and when you die your lonely cat will be the only one at your funeral.

  133. Oh give me a break by Dunega · · Score: 1

    Yea the thing took me a whole 15 seconds to open. Then I promptly forgot about the box while actually using the tablet. I'm glad I didn't have to pay R&D costs on a freaking box.

  134. Re:Because by roc97007 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I wouldn't have put it that way, but using your terminology, it's more like iCrap version 1.00003 is coming out in six months and I NEEDS it, YES my PRECIOUS, so I'll need to get rid of this piece of crap that is iCrap version 1.00002, and that's easier with the orginal box.

    And if nobody wants it, I can always throw it away.

    --
    Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
  135. Necessary by ThatsNotPudding · · Score: 1

    They are doing you a favor with all the excess packaging, given they didn't bother tightening the screws holding the screens in place. http://www.theverge.com/2012/7/18/3168065/nexus-7-suffering-screen-separation-untightened-screws

  136. Give me Amazon hassle free packaging any day by operand · · Score: 1

    I will take Amazon hassle free packaging where all I want to do is open up the box and review whatever item that I purchased. I haven't had one damaged item with this minimalist approach. I don't care about the box as I know that if thought went into the box then this more than likely drove up the cost of the item. Somebody has to pay for it and considering the cost of Apple products, I would say this is true.

    --
    string.Empty();
  137. Typical Google by thetoadwarrior · · Score: 1

    Seriously, what has google succeeded in other than writing really smart code? I'd expect the packaging to be a bit of a fuck up give they fail consumers at things like cutomer service. Seriously, I mean like fucking message boards for customer support and pretty much relying on other customers to answer the questions?

    Their api docs are often out of date and they push android devs to stackoverflow to get questions answered.

    I'm not surprised they end up killing off so many services, they can write the code but they lack everything else to make a quality solid over all package.

  138. "keeping boxes" correlates with "careful user" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The box doesn't add any value.

    But if you kept the box, you're probably someone who cares enough to plan (a potential return, easier transportation if you were to move, etc). In the end, there's probably correlation between users who keep their boxes and the fact that the hardware is in better condition.

    Just guessing here. But it wouldn't surprise me at all.

    (Just like people who floss have longer life expectancy... and it's not /because/ they floss!)

  139. I care about what is in the box, not the box... by nighthawk243 · · Score: 1

    Google devices such as the Galaxy Nexus and the Nexus 7 are more developer-oriented systems. Anyways, the "Amount of fucks I give in regard to fancy packaging" was once a variable in a program used on the USS Yorktown. Someone on that ship tried dividing by that variable, causing the propulsion systems to crash.

  140. Why not do it like Amazon? by roc97007 · · Score: 1

    ...ignore the shiny box altogether. I'm just going to toss it anyway, and I'm told that plastic-y cardboard display box material is more difficult to recycle. Give it a plain brown shipping box and be done. If I'm buying a Google slate, I'm probably not an Apple fanboi almost by definition. We don't care about steenking boxes. Moreover, not being part of the Apple Incremental Upgrade Electronics Landfill culture, we're more likely to keep the device until it no longer does the job or can no longer be fixed, so reselling is less likely to be important.

    I often reuse the Amazon shipping boxes. They're nice, if you don't need something that's eggshell white and cool looking. I haven't bought a Google slate yet (still waiting for a particular Adobe tool to be ported to Android) but I'm definitely interested. And I'd rather not have to dissect the packaging with the industrial box cutter.

    --
    Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
  141. Didn't have the issue as a pre-order customer by xrayspx · · Score: 1
    Since Pre-Orders arrived a couple of days after you could buy these in the stores, I had seen the videos of reviewers trying to unbox their tablets. Since I abhor the fetishization of consumer electronics garbage, I intended to make two videos:
    • My wife unboxing hers in the semi-sexual consumer garbage nerd way and having a hard time due to over-tight packaging.
    • Me unboxing mine in a 5 second flash of steel from a boxcutter. I mean, the name kind of gives it away there. Cut. The box.

    I sadly canceled movie time when the outer sleeves of both devices slid cleanly off as soon as we tipped them upright, and the inner box opened just as smoothly. I'm guessing that sometime between shipping devices to Gamestop and Staples, and the time they shipped to pre-order customers, the packaging problem was resolved.

  142. Hipsters by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I guess Apple products have gotten "too popular" for hipsters so they're going after Android products to try and be "cool" and "different." If you want a fashion accessory, buy Apple. If you want to use a device on its technical merits, then don't complain about the fucking "unpacking experience." Jesus Christ.

  143. Re:Because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Well, my wife only does it to me

    Not according to the bathroom wall!

  144. Re:Because by Tough+Love · · Score: 5, Informative

    Well, the first, second and third people I showed the Nexus 7 box to, and what is inside it, headed over to Staples to get one. That was before connecting it to the net, all you got at that point was the Google logo. A beautiful hi res Google logo. And really snappy response. That's all it took: lovely tiny device plus the Google logo. Apple stakeholders should fear.

    The box... I like it. It looks like a hardcover book slipcase. I was careful to cut the seals, not rip them off and the box still looks great. Obviously, I'm keeping the box. On the bookshelf. It looks like it belongs there.

    So far the Nexus 7 has been a real joy. You could say "twice the computer at half the price" compared to the iPad. That's not completely accurate, really it's twice the cores, but it's close enough.

    --
    When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
  145. Re:Because by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

    3. To try to make the product stand out from the other products

    The Nexus packaging does that very nicely by showing that the device is small. In fact, the packaging could be even smaller because there is quite a bit of air space in it, but the way it is, it feels nice in the hand. Interestingly, the Asus logo is more prominently featured on the box than the Google logo. That's a nice touch, and a clear indication that Google plans to get out of the way and let its partners take ownership as soon as the segment is properly bootstraped.

    --
    When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
  146. Who uses a freaking collar stay as a knife? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Someone please put the individual out of their mercy who was trying to cut tape with a flimsy plastic collar stay. While we are at it, let's stop calling the act of opening a package "unboxing". Everyone knows the most frustrating thing in the world to unbox is a banana. You get all that sticky crap on your fingers.

  147. Re:Because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    And if we could do that to Apple fanbois (not all owners, just the rabid fanbois), the world would be a better place.

  148. You haven't opened a Mac Pro then by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's really a little bit beautiful on the inside. They use drives on rails, so no pesky cabling. Memory is on add-on cards. There's plenty of room., too.

  149. Kind of BS by Mike+Buddha · · Score: 1

    I just moved this last few weeks and I went into my closet and pulled out all the iBoxes that I had accrued over the last five years. I also pulled out the XboxBoxes, the PS3Boxes, and the other assorted eBoxen that had managed to hang around. The boxes are difficult to throw away, because they SEEM like they have value. They're heavy cardboard, with plastic and foam glued in place.

    In the end, it took me about 15 minutes to rip them all apart and cram them into a recycling bin. The iBoxes were less recycler-friendly than the the others, because they had plastic parts and foam parts that had to be unceremoniously and satisfyingly ripped out.

    --
    by Mike Buddha -- Someday the mountain might get him, but the law never will.
  150. Nook was the worst by Mike+Buddha · · Score: 1

    My original Nook had the worst packaging. It was a clear plastic case that was inside a paper sleeve. It was nearly impossible to remove the plastic box from the paper sleeve, because of the vacuum that the tight fitting created. Once you got the plastic box out, it was like a japanese puzzle box to figure out it opened. Once it was opened, it looked like it could be useful, but putting the Nook and all the other pieces back into it and closing it was also nearly impossible. It looked great in the recycling bin.

    --
    by Mike Buddha -- Someday the mountain might get him, but the law never will.
  151. Oh please. Have we become THAT delicate? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I only buy tech from Huggxors because they wrap their products in 100% post consumer kitten-print gift wrap. *eye roll*

  152. to spec or not? by sribe · · Score: 1

    You know, I watched the video, and it seems to me that maybe google had put thought into the design of the packaging, and then contracted out to a supplier who did a shoddy job with things not quite to spec--thus the too-tight fit and so on.

  153. All this over a box? To each his own, but for me, as long as the box sufficiently protects my item, I don't give a shit how it's packaged. I don't buy things based on how the packaging looks. All I care about is what's inside, and I wouldn't be buying it if I didn't already want/like it.

  154. Apples packaging sucks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Excuse me, the ipad box barely informs anything. Most people dont know that there are actually 24 different ipad 3's and the only way to tell them apart is to pick it up, and read the size 10 grey words on the white back. Any other product would have the 16/32/64GB and whether its Verizon or Att (now Cellular) on it. Yes the front will show you if its black or white, but in a stack good luck. blank white sides.

    It does really massage the fanboy ego though, apple knows you dont see the box till after you buy most of the time, and then its a present instead of an advertisment.

  155. Re:Because by BronsCon · · Score: 1

    An attentive husband would feel the difference. The bathroom wall lies.

    --
    APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
  156. No... by gabereiser · · Score: 0

    ...the boxes that sit on the shelf do not "constantly remind us of the beauty within"... instead they constantly remind us that in a year, we will need those boxes to sell the apple product on ebay or craigslist in order for us to purchase the next apple product...

  157. Timed myself by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    12 seconds to unbox and unwrap the Nexus 7. I've spent much longer on a pack of batteries.

  158. Please castrate yourself timothy. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Do it now, and stop posting your bs to slashdot. Timothy, you are exactly the garbage because of whom this news aggregator is becoming worthless.

  159. WTF "Wrap rage" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Oh come on now people. It took me all of 10 seconds to get out the letter opener, cut the tape and decant the Nexus 7.

    Get a life.

  160. Re:Because by avandesande · · Score: 2

    More correctly, fancy packaging costs more which is passed on to customers.
    It's not stupid, it's more expensive.

    --
    love is just extroverted narcissism
  161. Macbook Air Box as Laptop Stand by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    At my desk I needed to raise my computer just a little bit, so I put my macbook air on top of the box...works great :)

  162. The difference by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Apple is for stupid people; Google is for smart people. It's a simple as that. If you couldn't figure that out, enjoy your Apple products.

  163. Twitchy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    they make me twitch in an OCD kind of way.That's exactly why I keep that shit on... :)

  164. Re:Because by BlueStraggler · · Score: 1

    It's not an inlaid mahogany chest lined with velvet, mirror balls, and Steve Jobs air fresheners.

    We're talking about a small cardboard box. The lid slides off. There's your gadget. It's the opposite of fancy.

  165. Kids these days by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I remember when people around here used to praise Apple and decry MS. Now, for whatever reason, people hate Apple and love Google. From my point of view, the "trendy" hate diminishes any real concerns about Apple products by way of diluting the issue.

  166. Re:Because by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

    ...an inlaid mahogany chest lined with velvet, mirror balls, and Steve Jobs air fresheners... The lid slides off...

    ...and Steve Jobs gets out! Gah.

    --
    When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
  167. Seriously? by pkinetics · · Score: 1

    Maybe I'm just weird, but I have a small pocket knife that I usually use to open these things. Always be prepared.

    I can understand frustration with plastic clamshells that are sealed all the way around.

    But if a couple of pieces of tape are a frustration / annoyance or impediment to your ability to open a box... well I fear for the future of society...

    1. Re:Seriously? by milkmage · · Score: 1

      http://www.androidauthority.com/nexus-7-unboxing-how-many-people-unbox-google-jelly-bean-tablet-101459/

      little to do with with tape. mostly it's the bottom half of the box being a little too big for the top.

      that said.. I had no problems whatsoever with mine (the tape or the box)

  168. D'oh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There is no "importance of packing", because it's not important. That one minute you spend opening the package is hardly relevant compared to the thousands of hours spent on actually using the device. As long as the device doesn't break inside the package, everything is okay.

  169. You smug pieces of shit by Colin+Smith · · Score: 1
    --
    Deleted
  170. Presentation matters by Dixie_Flatline · · Score: 1

    The best meal can be ruined if it comes to you looking like pig slops. "The first bite is with the eyes," as the saying goes, right?

    But a box can be more than just something that your items come in.

    Consider the boxes that Apple used WAY back, when it was first launching the Mac. The boxes were designed so that one of the first things you took out of the box was the mouse--and this was a time when the mouse was brand new. People didn't know what it was or how it worked. You wanted the mouse to come out first so the user had time to take it out, handle it, and figure it out. It had a button, and a ball on the bottom. The cord obviously plugged into something.

    The Mac was not the first thing you saw because it was important that you kind of grok the mouse, even if you'd never seen one before.

    This isn't just flighty mumbo-jumbo, this stuff makes a big difference to people. If you're in a rage by the time you actually make it to your device, you're associating that bad feeling with the device. Cutting into those sealed plastic packages that some electronics come in makes me insane. I regret ever buying the item. My first experience with whatever I bought is generally kind of terrible.

    Things that are well packaged at the very worst don't alter my mood at all. I can approach them and use them with a clear mind. This isn't just about Apple stuff, it's about anything. The act of unboxing is something that most of us living in the west have grown up enjoying, so it makes sense to leverage that if you're a company that sells things like Apple. It's like Christmas every time you get something new.

    And look! They've got extremely high satisfaction rates, customer retention that most companies would kill for, and fanatics that defend even their most indefensible actions. I see a lot of complaints about the Apple 'sheeple', but the reality is that they've managed to convert a tonne of people in a way that most companies can't even comprehend. So yeah, maybe the box matters. Stop bashing Apple for caring about how they present their products to consumers and try to learn from it.

  171. Thank you... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Apple for getting your packaging right... kudos!
    upset Nexus users for making something as simple as an unboxing your iPad killer seem as complicated as working on an airplane.

    I mean really? I saw it was a thicker plastic tape. I didn't fly into a fury thinking, "Hulk Smash! Rawr!" I opened a knife, cut tape easily, opened up box to shiny new killer toy.

    *sigh* So little to complain about we have to make stuff up.

  172. Re:Because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Give an Apple fan a logo'd piece of dog #### and they'd keep it on their shelf next to their iBoxes.

  173. Re:Because by fferreres · · Score: 1

    This is one of those ideas that seem plausibly correct, to be actually complete wrong. The packaging likely costs Apple $1 or less. and a perfect condition box (original) can sell on ebay for $10 to 30. The box actually make the product cheaper (just sell the box) between $9 to 29.

    --
    unfinished: (adj.)
  174. "get" this by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Well, saying that Apple "gets" it, and Google doesn't is also implying that there is something to "get" - in other words, there is some fact that packing is important. In fact, perhaps it's not that Google doesn't "get it", but that they simply don't agree with it. I have lots of apple stuff, but I have never bought anything because of the box. (Nor have I saved most of the boxes). Given that fancier boxes cost more, and I have to pay more for a box I am not going to keep, I would prefer that:
    1. It's super super fancy (Plastic or metal I will keep and use for other stuff)
    or
    2. It's super super cheap (Cardboard box).

    I did keep the nice plastic box my iPod touch came in, and the box my Jambox came in, because I actually use them.

    Anyway, before claiming a company "gets" something, make sure that everyone would agree that that something is important first. I don't think most people really give a shit about boxes that 90% of them throw away in the first few minutes.

    As for people having problems opening Nexus boxes - really? Are they too retarded to open a box? I have this thing called a "box cutter" at home - it opens about anything I get in the mail just fine.

  175. amazon has a service by davydagger · · Score: 1

    amazon actually has a service were if you buy from them, they will de-box and repackage in a more human friendly manner

  176. Oh dear ... by Lazy+Jones · · Score: 1

    We have really gone a long way towards commoditization of such gadgets if the packaging has been deemed of such importance. Back in the day, we were happy if the assembling instructions were correct and legible ...
    Also, don't put the blame on Google - all Android phones I've seen have ugly, cheap packaging (even those of the korean manufacturer who's tried the hardest to copy Apple).

    --
    "I love my job, but I hate talking to people like you" (Freddie Mercury)
  177. Compaq Packaging by Taco+Cowboy · · Score: 1

    opening an iPad takes a simple slide of a cover â" a lid that 'comes off easily, but not too easily,'

     
    This brings back memory of the very well thought out packaging that comes with compaq computers in yesteryears
     
    It might not be much, but users DO appreciate the extra thoughts that they put on packaging their gadgets nevertheless
     

    --
    Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
  178. Re:Because by galanom · · Score: 1

    I don't know if you intended to troll, but your post should me tagged as "Insightful" not "Troll"
    Apple should become a fashion firm not electronics.
    It sells looks and style, not performance.

  179. Sad by negro_monolito · · Score: 1

    I opened mine by: pushing the paper cover off, using my house keys to rip the two pieces of tape, sliding off the box top, and unwrapping the plastic.

    In all in took 15 seconds sitting on the couch. Though I could have done it in under 10 if I was at my desk with my hobby knife.

    I don't get it, how can people be that stupid? Is it really that hard? Have they lost all hand coordination by using touch screens instead of regular keyboards for far too long? I'm serious, I'm not trying to be funny, but I just don't get how you can have a hard time opening a box like that.

  180. Re:Because by Taco+Cowboy · · Score: 1

    Slashdot, you never dissapoint.

     
    I am disappointed at your "dissapoint"ment
     

    --
    Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
  181. Re:Because by Taco+Cowboy · · Score: 1

    ...an inlaid mahogany chest lined with velvet, mirror balls, and Steve Jobs air fresheners... The lid slides off...

    ...and Steve Jobs gets out! Gah.

     
    Leave \Steave out of it !!
     

    --
    Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
  182. Yawn by DThorne · · Score: 1

    Slow news day? Based on recent drop tests, apple apparently doesn't 'get' selling a reliable product that doesn't break at the first torture test, whereas Google does. Who the hell cares about a bunch of clumsy YouTube un boxers looking like... clumsy YouTube un boxers? This sort of non-news ends up being a chuckle at next year's big Google event as 'oh yeah, we made the box easier to open, too...'

    DT

  183. Rule 44 by Grudge2012 · · Score: 0

    The only possible explanation for the hate of easy-to-open packaging can be a sexual obsession. And the video was already posted.

  184. Money by TonyXL · · Score: 1

    With the harder Google packaging comes hundreds of dollars of savings. Sounds like a win to me.

  185. Re:Because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Ever been a child at Christmas, electic with anticipation to get through that gift wrapping for whatever is inside? The better the paper, the more heightened the anticipation. Wrap it in old newspaper and the kiddies will, evertime, go for the better wrapping. Everything about presentation you need to know is there.

    Really? I tended to go for whatever looked most like it would be what I really wanted, or maybe the biggest one, or from someone who tends to give good presents. I don't remember paying any attention to the how shiny the packaging is, although I may have in absence of the aforementioned factors. But irregardless, the Nexus 7 box is nice, they did put some effort into it, the biggest problem is that the outer sleeve is too tight which makes sliding the box out a bit tricky, after that you just have to cut the stickers (which are presumably an anti-tampering measure) and take the lid off.

  186. Re: Because : ref: Consumer Products Packaging by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Some people feel an urge to write ,whatever the topic . But writing about critisising consumer products packaging when unpacking takes longer than 3 seconds ,goes beyond my comprehension . Have people become that lazy ?

    Many (electronic) products are packaged in a sealed ( including water proofed) hard plastic wrapping and quite rightly so ,because the packaging costs less and the product is fully protected against the elements ...and tempering prior to purchase.
    A pair of scissors will remove this type of packaging within say 10 seconds .............it that really too difficult ?

    Frank in northern Scotland

  187. Packaging vs Cost by HArchH · · Score: 1

    It is a simple trade off. The cost to develop and then carry and charge the per unit cost for a beautiful out of the box (unwrapping) experience flies in the face of delivering a price leading technical product. While Apple seems proud to lead in the high price category and has the margin and market power to get the $10 per unit their packaging might cost, it is a difficult place to accept additional unit costs in a more normally competitive market.