Slashdot Mirror
With $8.6M In Kickstarter Funds, Ouya Opens Console Pre-Orders
Chameleon Man writes with an excerpt from PC Mag: "Early this morning, the Android-based Ouya console ended its run on Kickstarter with nearly $8.6 million in user donations. In recent weeks, the company has secured a number of content partners for the device, but now it's time to see if Ouya can really deliver. Interested buyers can now pre-order an Ouya on the company's website. In the U.S., one console and one controller will cost $109, one console plus two controllers will be $139, and one console and four controllers will be $199. All orders include a $10 shipping charge."
Adds Chameleon Man: "Here's to hoping that an open-source console can gain a foothold in an already competitive market."
I don't think the date has been pushed back. The March delivery date was for the kickstarter folks, first come first serve. It would make sense, then, that subsequent orders placed would come after that initial batch.
I'm hoping its something that can beat the Wii at its own low-end game. A cheap console with cheapish games without Nanny Nintendo watching all of the games that get released on it to make sure they're fit for our eyes would be fantastic.
not a bad start at all.
Why doesn't the text talking about preordering actually link to the preorder page rather than to a blog to drive up their page hits? Lame blog spam is lame.
will it replace my apple tv (with Plex, which is my only use for TV these days)
But the Wii has the fun movement controller.
I'm hoping its something that can beat the Wii at its own low-end game.
And by "Wii" you also mean the WiiU, which is due out before the Ouya, right?
GLaDOS for President 2016! "Well here we are again. It's always such a pleasure." -- GLaDOS, 2011
I got one!
Pics or it didn't happen.
Are these going to have open GPU drivers or not?
Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
I asked developers whether Ouya will run games sold outside the official store (without having to root the device, like with to Android's "unknown sources"), but they never replied. Until they do, I don't consider this a particularly open console.
Have we reached an era when even those who advertise openness won't release commercial platforms that aren't like walled gardens?
"In prison you just have to shut your eyes and take it. Here you have to shut your eyes and give it."
Me too. Thank god someone is finally making a piracy-friendly console platform.
I suspect that you saw the potential BECAUSE you're not a gamer. All I hear from gamers is how underpowered the Ouya is and how no one's going to want it because the games will suck (not unlike the Wii arguments, before everyone's grandma went out and bought one). To me, that lack of power is a VERY good thing because it means the developers will be forced to make their games fun rather than pretty.
Also, XBMC is great, and a ~$100 media center? Sign me up!
Show me a physical prototype, running actual software, connected to an actual TV (in HD), and then we'll talk.
It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
- E. Debs
To me, that lack of power is a VERY good thing because it means the developers will be forced to make their games fun rather than pretty.
Or just like with most third party Wii titles, they'll be both ugly and unfun.
I'm not a gamer, but even I saw the potential in this.
I'm a gamer and I don't get how this is any diffrent from a Roku or any other set top box with apps.
On the Oregon Cost born and raised, On the beach is where I spent most of my days
I have to admit, I'm probably going to get one of these eventually, if everything goes right.
But that's the key - it has to work. It has to have at least two games I want to play that I can't play elsewhere, it has to function as a half-decent media player, it has to, you know, actually exist as a physical thing.
Right now, there's just too much a chance of this never even being released for me to pre-order. And even if it does come out, there's a large chance that it won't have any good, interesting games come out.
Now, if it does come out and live up to its promises, I'll buy one. No problem there. But I'm just still too apprehensive about it to commit to it until it's solid.
Only reason I buy a console is so I can play games like Final Fantasy and RPGs in general. Also nintendo games (they usually produce masterpieces). The open console won't have FF, N, or other exclusives so it will be a bit like owning a modern PowerPC Amiga*. Great hardware..... little software to support it.
Ultimately it's the software that makes the difference. I never owned Colecovision or Intellivision, because the Atari had all the great games. In the 3D era, I picked the inferior PS2 because it had the huge library of PS1 and 2 games while the Cube had little going for it. (Though I did get a cube once the price dropped to $50.) It's the software that is most important to me.
*
*I almost said Mac but decided my karma doesn't need the -2 hit. Besides the Mac does have a lot of software available for it.
My AC stalker: " I personally agree with your posts most of the time, but that won't keep me from modding you troll"
o me, that lack of power is a VERY good thing because it means the developers will be forced to make their games fun rather than pretty.
And who is going to bother to make games for it when they can just continue to make games for platforms that sell far more (iOS?)
I don't mean to rain on this parade because I think efforts like this are fantastic generally, but I have serious reservations about this being able to go anywhere...
One last issue is how will Ouya address Android piracy? If developers are experiencing high piracy rates on Android already, how will this diminish in an Android based console? That question alone is vital to address to get strong and sustained support for the platform.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
The price is right and it offer something. Guess one could hook up a HDD and use it as a NAS. Maybe. Or install something else on it. So maybe I should had got one.
But it seems a little useless. Why not just make a bluetooth controller which can be used with any Android phone?
You can hook up say a Galaxy S III with similar hardware to your TV with MHL and then hook up your controller in whatever way, but I guess bluetooth make sense. And well, then you don't have to buy this console. And it will be upgraded the whole time (by new phones) and the same applications will run on most Android devices (maybe this one isn't supposed to use Android market?)
I hope my version can work together with it to.
You mean that stupid tablet?
The video on their website is pretty cool. It shows them making the controllers by hand, out of wood. Talk about craftsmanship.
It will also be one great emulator box.
The Zeitgeist Movement
As long as they give me points for clicking buttons, who cares?
Okay, I'm failing at funny here, mainly because with all those zynga games it's pretty much proven that this is exactly the level most "casual gamers" are on. They don't care, as long as they get points for clicking a button. They might even pay for said points, just make sure they go "kaching!" when they arrive. After clicking the button.
The button is important.
The Wii actually has a pretty weak processor.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadway_(microprocessor)
To me, that lack of power is a VERY good thing because it means the developers will be forced to make their games fun rather than pretty.
I -know- there are some people on here who remember that there were games before ansiotropic filtered bump mapped motion blured LOD textured polygons.
I even seem to remember enjoying a few of them. Super metroid anyone? Final Fantasy II and III (4j and 6j)? mario kart, ice hockey, bubble bobble, zelda(s), sonic(s), punch out, tecmo bowl, come on how long do I have to go?
there are a ton of good 2d sprite games on the android market. 2d doesn't -need- to be dead.
Not to mention that "underpowered" is relative. This thing is roughly as powerful, give or take, as the original xbox or ps2, and I'm pretty sure there were some good enjoyable 3D games for them as well.
more open on hardware/software... hacker-friendly...
Michael J. Ryan - tracker1.info
galaxy s3 = $599
ouya = $109
Check out Cow Clicker. http://www.wired.com/magazine/2011/12/ff_cowclicker/all/
If it had access to Google Play Store *AND* another market for even more souped-up games (or even some exclusive stuff) it would be irresistible. But from everything I have seen/heard so far, it will probably be limited to some proprietary marketplace with much less selection and potentially much higher priced stuff.
You might ask what is the point for full Google Play Store access? These:
1) There are countless thousands of games, right off the bat
2) There are countless thousands of LOW PRICED games
3) There are many thousands of FREE games
4) Anything YOU ALREADY PAID FOR on Play will run on the Ouya too
5) You might want access to some apps that are not games
6) You might want to do all this in the comfort of your chair, using a great controller, a great sound system, and a great display
Without full Google Play Store (or maybe even Amazon Marketplace) support, I don't expect this thing to be anywhere NEAR as attractive as it would be with it.
Also quite possible it won't have analog sound out, making it not possible (or difficult and expensive) to connect many people's audio/visual systems.
You forgot MONKEY ISLAND, never forget MONKEY island.
ScummVM already runs on Android so this console should be perfect for this.
At first I misread, didn't notice the second C, and I was all over that idea. Then I realized it said clicking, and that just seems unrealistic.
Not good enuf! Wanna see it on a newspaper with today's date and you holding up three fingers (no, not one).
Also, XBMC is great, and a ~$100 media center? Sign me up!
Exactly. Also because it's Android based, I can program for it myself.
Anyone else notice the odd markup on the extra controllers? It's $20 per controller when you go from one to two controllers, but $30 per controller when going from one to four. Are they going to sell controllers separately or if you buy the 1 or 2 controller box, that's it, no adding on?
Don't just game, Dungeoneer
Nethack
Nethack OpenGL Elite Version
OpenPac-Man, when you eat a power pill it takes the user to a console to configure IPtables to keep the ghosts out
Bejewelled
Doom v1
GIMP
Wearing pants should always be optional.
I'm not a gamer, but even I saw the potential in this.
I'm a gamer and I don't get how this is any diffrent from a Roku
roku uses exact same chip as Rasppi, anemic cpu + strong (but closed) gpu.
Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
Do you play angry birds with the Roku remote? Have you tried that IR remote? It's barely responsive enough to browse channels.
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
So you don't understand what kickstarter is? Or are you having difficulty wrapping your brain around the idea of a pre-order?
It's fine if you don't want to be an early adopter. But acting like you have the superior position seems ludicrous.
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
Is anyone else not psyched about this?
I mean, I really don't know which way this project will go - it could take off like the Wii did, or it could flounder around after it launches - but am I the only one not caught up in the hype?
We saw, after a month of *very* aggressive advertising - mostly through paid-for sites like Tech Crunch - a console that has "sold" about 58k units (tracking only the customers that contributed money for the minimum to get an Ouya console). This is in an industry where we constantly see simple handhelds push 200k+ units per week in one region, let alone the world.
Where's the uniqueness of this that makes this a kill "must have" item for everyone (not just geeks like me)? This plays Android games. So does the majority of smart phones around the world, and some tablets. Where's the "killer app" here that is locked into the Ouya? What's going to be the driving force behind continual sales? What's going to push this console to selling millions of units around the world per month?
Congratulations to the crowd that managed to fund this to $8m, but until I start seeing more of a demand for this - this thing got exposure from the likes of Tech Crunch (multiple times), Kotaku, IGN, G4, and even coverage on CNN - I really have to consider this to be a niche device, competing in the Android market and not competing in the console market. After all of that coverage, and hype, I expected to see *millions* of people funding this device. Instead I saw 58k.
Sure, 58k funders is far more than I could achieve, but at 200k+ units per week for something like the 3DS in just Japan alone turns Ouya, in my eyes, from a game-changing console, into a niche device that will make its audience happy.
You sadly perverted Cowophile !
Jehovah be praised, Oracle was not selected
Only if they can put out the same quality First Party development that Nintendo does. Which is no. They lack the quantity and quality of tallent to pull that off. They might be able to squeeze out of it just enough to justify a second run. Otherwise they'll just be like the Sega Master System or Turbo Graphics 16.
To me, that lack of power is a VERY good thing because it means the developers will be forced to make their games fun rather than pretty.
Or just like with most third party Wii titles, they'll be both ugly and unfun.
Well, on a positive note, it'll run all the emulators just fine....
If you examine the datastream from a wiimote, it is actually pretty well pre-crunched by the controller.
There are a few pairing-related oddities(bluetooth can be a bit eccentric on its good days, and Nintendo didn't excatly feel a strong pressure to be helpful to random 3rd party bluetooth devices); but you get all the accelerometer data, and the IR dot following, handled for you in hardware and sent, along with button states, as relatively trivial output data. There are a few other oddities with the onboard speaker and similar bits; but it isn't a computationally expensive peripheral to deal with.
We've all seen patents being thrown around too much recently and stifling companies. I've got a suspicion that most controller technology and design is now covered by patents. They're going to have to be very careful to avoid getting caught by any of these.
Looking at this I'd love for it to succeed, but as a geek in their target market I'm unlikely to be buying one. I've already got a media-pc and an android tablet, and why would I want one of these when the Xbox720 and (presumably) a PS4 are due in a year or 2,
I'm not a gamer, but even I saw the potential in this.
I'm a gamer and I don't get how this is any diffrent from a Roku or any other set top box with apps.
Maybe that it can already run a wealth of Android software, but isn't locked down by the telcos? That, and the built-in support for gaming input devices.
However, I hope they signed up some good talent for the flagship games -- that's what Nintendo has always needed to do to shift their hardware.
It's still more powerful than the Wii, which has no problem dealing with the Wii-motes.
Mada mada dane.
Remember that the idea is to give the organization the startup funds to do what they are trying to do. You get rewards, but funding them is the goal. As such generally the higher the tier, the less you get for your money. After all it wouldn't do much good to collect $5000 for a project, but give out $6000 in stuff, you are in the hole there.
So as you move up it is usually more about giving them more because you want to see the project succeed, and getting some small things as a thank you, then getting "your money's worth."
In addition, the store won't work if you have your console rooted
Your link didn't say that, it just said you wouldn't have any extra access from being rooted. So you can still root the console (I think).
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Make an Ouya game that links up over ad-hoc Wi-Fi with a client on a Nexus 7 tablet. Instant Ouya U.
They lack the quantity and quality of tallent to pull that off.
Quality perhaps initially, but quantity is assured if it's open to the same sorts of developers that populate Google Play Store and Amazon Appstore.
A cheap console with cheapish games without Nanny Nintendo watching all of the games that get released on it to make sure they're fit for our eyes would be fantastic.
The Android developer thinks single player and mobile device.
Family-friendly console gaming --- and social gaming on the big screen TV --- has paid off handsomely for Nintendo.
As of October 18, 2010, Nintendo has sold over 565 million hardware units and 3.4 billion software units.
96.56 million units of the Wii alone. (2012)
Nintendo
That would be something like fifty tines the number of Slashdot accounts.
And who is going to bother to make games for it when they can just continue to make games for platforms that sell far more (iOS?)
People who plan to make games in genres that don't work well on a touch screen. Touch screens are fine for looking at and selecting objects, not so much for having a character run and jump around the screen. Apple made the same mistake that Mattel made when making the Intellivision II's button pad completely flat. On an Ouya controller, unlike on the touch screen built into an iPad, the player can feel where his thumbs are relative to the buttons. This means the player can feel whether his thumb is over the jump button, the button to use the primary tool, or the button to use the secondary tool.
Why not just make a bluetooth controller which can be used with any Android phone?
Because a $62 iControlPad costs almost as much as this whole console.
How much of the household's monthly Internet data transfer allowance does OnLive use per hour? In the United States, even several popular wired broadband providers have a cap.
You mean that stupid tablet?
OK, I'll bite. You do know that WiiU is an entirely new console, right?
Yeah, but they operate with a mindset similar to Disney and try a little too hard, IMHO, to maintain the family friendly image. I understand the value of parent's trust for a brand, but as a company they seem to be leaving a lot of money on the table. Even Disney has subsidiaries that release R rated films for older viewers. Would Nintendo lose their core audience if they had a more "hardcore" brand targeting mature gamers? (OT, but I for one would pay $100 more for a 3DS with decent cameras.)
You could take any Android phone with hdmi out and USB otg
At which point you're out five hundred ninety-nine U.S. dollars like the original announced PS3 price.
Um, developers that aren't interested in supporting clumsy touch screen gaming for one. Developers that make stuff for iOS and Android and who's games with a minimal amount of trouble can be ported to the Ouya who figure "why not?".
But all of those people depend on revenue being there to pay for the effort.
The "clumsy touch screen" guys developed Doodle Jump and countless other games that worked just fine with touch screen controls...
Uh, the main reason iOS doesn't have as much piracy is you have no choice but to either buy from the App store or root with no in-between like real computers have.
Of course.
And the Ouya people haven't said they will allow side-loading
It's on Android. It can be rooted.
they've already said rooted consoles won't be able to access the Ouya market
They said rooted consoles would gain no ADVANTAGE over non-rooted consoles. Which I take with a very big grain of salt indeed.
There is also the option of encrypting downloads with a device specific key like Google put into Jellybean.
So is Ouya using that???
You can't just provide a laundry-list of things they COULD do. What ARE they doing?
The fact is no matter what you do, some people are going to pirate.
Of course, just as there is piracy on iOS. But is the rate on Ouya 9 or 90%? That is the key to understanding if it might become a viable platform.
I have nothing against the platform but I'm smelling a whole lot of if coming off the plan.
Also of course, you have to wonder what happens if Apple opens up the Apple TV to apps.... that seems like it would suck the alternate platform air out of the room pretty quickly. On the other hand it could serve to validate what Ouya is trying to do, and give the platform more games just from iOS / AppleTV ports (since they would also be focused on running on a TV and not on the device directly).
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Google Play Store is only for devices certified by Google to meet the Android Compatibility Definition Document, and I'm not aware of any desktop or set-top profile in the CDD for ICS or Jelly Bean. I'll admit that my information may be out of date, in which case in which version did Google add a set-top spec?
You mean the guys developing apps for the iCade?
If a game can't reasonably be completed without an iCade or iControlPad, does it have a chance of selling in substantial numbers? How many iCade and iControlPad units have been sold compared to Ouya preorders?
As does my laptop.
I'm not convinced that first party development is necessary at all. You can get launch titles to bundle via licensing if that's your thing. A lot of people are still playing the smush and the pc engine, and there were a lot of SMSes around when I was a kid... but not TG16s, because they cost too much. If Ouya makes a major mistake, it will at least be different from the mistake NEC made. And of course, Sega put out several more generations of console before being boned by Sony. Why they chose to help Microsoft gain console experience is beyond me.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
I'm not convinced that first party development is necessary at all.
Depending on the platform, it can be necessary to make sure that there actually is anything that can push the hardware at all.
The Ouya is *significantly* more powerful than the Wii, both GPU-wise and CPU-wise (and memory-wise, for that matter).
Given what is public of the WiiU and some deductive skills, it seems the Ouya will also beat the WiiU's CPU (which looks like it'll be underpowered), particularly at SIMD/vector processing. It probably won't beat its GPU (AMD R700), but not by too much. Given how mobile GPUs are developing, I'd expect them to catch up pretty soon.
Maybe that it can already run a wealth of Android software, but isn't locked down by the telcos?
Have they actually said they're going to allow sideloading of apps onto this?
In other words, you're asking for the title of a specific application, not a description of a class of applications. Do I understand you correctly?
Scenario - I am an average geek who already owns a Galaxy Tab 2, or a Transformer Prime, or a Galaxy S3, or any other modern Android device that has HDMI out.
Why would I buy this console? There is nothing novel about it. The chipset is not that great - in fact it is the same CPU and GPU that ship on most devices (inferior actually to some). And I don't need their controllers when I can just walk into Gamestop and buy PS3 controllers to use with my games. And the games are just Android games which will in all liklihood be in the main Android market as well (if their publisher wants to make any money anyways). So what is the point?
From what I can see the Ooya is a bit late to the game. If this idea had been fleshed out and released a couple of years ago when Android first came out, they would have something. But, the specs on this box will be eclipsed by bargain-basement phones before it is even manufactured - forget about 1 year down the road! And most people don't want to buy a console that's outdated in a year.
What does an Atom and an Intel IGP have to do with the Wii? IBM made the processor and AMD made the GPU on the Wii.
I've tagged this story "wonderful". This could attract serious gaming investment. I bet it is viable to port the Ouya API to desktop Linux, thus making Linux a viable gaming platform.
This could go a long way in solving the vicious circle - developers don't target Linux because it is a small market, and users don't adopt Linux because it doesn't run the applications they need.
Wonderful.
I pre-ordered an OUYA through Kickstarter (Limited Edition - though I admit I am a little frustrated that the "metal chocolate" LE version requires a $140 commitment and you only get one controller. Really, I think In addition, I expected the kickstarter consoles to be, as most kickstarter software/hardware projects are, significantly cheaper than "normal" preordering, but that isn't the case.), mostly because of its openness. In truth I need a new WDTV/XBMC device for another room so when I saw the OUYA's openness and partnership with XBMC, it seemed a great idea. They have a lot of rhetoric about giving access to the hardware specs, root it if you want and much more, but like a few others have posted here a few recent tweets basically smash that idea to bits.
It appears that the "core experience" is still going to be locked down. "Root it and do what you want" doesn't mean "Root it and put your own apps and software next to ours and stuff you purchase" it seems to mean "Root it and it will be like the former OtherOS PS3 function - nothing 'normal' will work anymore". Sorry, that isn't new. As I just said, the PS3 has already done that and other consoles, if you're willing to give up oh say.. playing games on them, they can be wonderful little boxes to run homebrew and hacked software, off line, to your content. What I wanted to invest in was a console that would allow you to hack around WITHOUT impeding the 'normal' use of the box. After all, even an Android phone or tablet, using rooted variant or even a custom ROM like CyanogenMod, won't preclude you from using all the standard features, including both sideloaded APKs and stuff downloaded from Google Play "officially"! If they've compromised this, then we're looking at a HUGE step back, more akin to that disastrous "OnLive" feces, especially if you need to be online to play official OUYA titles and if content is streamed instead of downloaded.
I hope that it is still early enough in the process that we the community can get in contact with OUYA and ensure that it isn't a DRMed wolf-in-sheep's-clothing. I'm beginning to fear for my pledge.
You do know that there are M rated games on the Wii, right?
Mooh!
"Root it and it will be like the former OtherOS PS3 function - nothing 'normal' will work anymore". Sorry, that isn't new. As I just said, the PS3 has already done that and other consoles,
Having had a PS3 with OtherOS I can tell you that the statement is not quite correct. On the PS3 having OtherOS did not remove it's capability to play regular PS3 games, it worked in a "dual boot" manner. You could boot into either GameOS or OtherOS as you wanted.
Problem is a low spec PC isn't designed for gaming. Games aren't optimized as well for PCs as they are for consoles.
Feel free to mod me down, just know that unlike some Anonymous Cowards I'm not afraid to express my views as myself.
I should have been more specific - like OtherOS, this proposed path for OUYA will lock out /concurrent/ use of "normal" content and rooted/hacker/homebrew/custom content which is really what brought me to considering the device. This is why I made my Android example; the right choice was made by Google and other content providers with respect to how using custom ROMs software/rooting/repos/manual APKs etc... does not preclude you from accessing your Google Play purchased content, using "official" applications and other things. Nearly all other "consoles" will do so in the fruitless endeavor of trying to squash piracy and make content providers happy, ironically lowering the chance of future software purchase in the process.
I don't want to purchase a "console" that is built on a modified Android platform that is more locked down than Android itself! Having to boot into a special "open" mode , totally segregated from OUYA's "console" experience is absolutely the wrong path to take. Users will not frequently wish to boot back and forth, which will ultimately mean that they'll spend less time in the OUYA ecosystem chatting, playing games, or purchasing content.
I think the vast majority of those who came to OUYA thinking "finally, someone gets it. " will agree this isn't the way to go. Accept that piracy happens, remember the success of Google Play and others on Android despite the lack of user lockdown, and instead try to actually set out to make the open console you sold OUYA as. Anything less than allowing the normal gaming usage to persist concurrently with rooted/custom user content is a failure in this regard. Do not provide a "Free speech zone" and then tell us that is what you meant by "open", expecting to be lauded.
Not really - you can't compare the two. There is a big difference between having to buy a giant, ugly, noisy PC to leave in the living room to play games, and plugging a tiny little cable that is otherwise hidden into the phone you already own.
If you can't see the difference here, then you are not married.
You missed the point though.
Then this is out (when is it out? the S III will be cheaper than what it is now.
Dual-core Samsung Exynos 5 will have four times the graphic performance of their current quad-core Exynos.
The Nexus 7 tablet also got Tegra3 and cost $ 199 I believe.
And is this supposed to be upgraded every now and then? Or is it a fixed spec for a while as consoles usually are? Will the controller also work for a phone if you want it to? Can you still play the game on a phone if you wanted to? Or are they Ouya only?
Because the reason say PCs got shinier graphics than game consoles is because they are upgraded all the time.
And finally people own a phone anyway. The cost for gaming on your phone if you already got one is 0. This cost money. As far as the control cost that would be an additional cost, hence I ask. If made in the amounts of millions and focus for low price it could maybe be made for less than ~ $ 65?
So this ends up being one more gadget. Do you want one more gadget? The Nexus 7 would be a more fair comparison in price and offer the same processor, is a tablet but lacks the controller for 199. The next gen-Samsung phones supposedly already got four times faster graphics, and what about two years from now? Three?
So you don't understand what kickstarter is?
I'm not exactly sure what you're getting at here; we're not talking about their Kickstarter page, we're talking about actual pre-orders. Meaning, I wouldn't be paying for an investment on a speculative basis, I'd be paying for the promise of an actual console at some future date.
Or are you having difficulty wrapping your brain around the idea of a pre-order?
Not at all. I rarely do them, because I tend to prefer my money remaining in my bank account as opposed to the company's, until the exchange of value actually happens. Pre-ordering is essentially the customer granting the company credit. They have not proved their credit-worthiness to me.
It's fine if you don't want to be an early adopter. But acting like you have the superior position seems ludicrous.
In what way did I "act like I had the superior position"? I'm simply unwilling to pre-order something with only a CGI rendering of what they envision. Having a prototype doesn't mean they're ready to launch, but it does mean they're much closer, and at that point I would be willing to reconsider.
It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
- E. Debs
Marvin is that you?
"Brain the size of a planet and they expect me to be excited over a console built with smart phone hardware...."
Georgia Tech, the leader in Chia(tm) technology.
Cool. You can put it on the same shelf with your Indrema.
Awesome! When can I buy your laptop for $109?
put the what in the where?
.apk means the android install files, not apk the poster.
because, seriously, wtf? the grandparent makes an error troll by saying that you would need to root an android device to sideload(common term for installing outside stores) on android devices, and even on a kindle fire you can install apk's from any website, or any file, without rooting the device.
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
is their citation for this, my understanding and reason for ordering was similar to yours...