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Microsoft and Google Challenge US Government Gag Orders
First time accepted submitter ace37 writes "Microsoft says it plans to move ahead with a lawsuit filed against the U.S. government in June to affirm the right of businesses to disclose limited information about government demands for data made under the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA). In separate legal filings, Microsoft and Google challenged the gag order that typically accompanies FISA demands for customer data. The two companies asserted that they have a First Amendment right to publish the total number of FISA requests received and the total number of user accounts covered by such requests."
This type of lawsuit can help regain some of the liberties the government has taken away, or at least some of the transparency. #WishfulThinking
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Particularly Wastebook, stand up and do the same.
Some days it's just not worth
chewing through my restraints.
requested the ability to treat Windows security bug reporters as being in league with terrorists by invoking the Patriot Act.
My head is spinning.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
Why can't MS and Google publish "metadata" on the number of FISA requests and number of accounts requested?
If it is good for the goose, it's good for the gander.
Gee, thanx Microsoft and Google, for doing something..
Where were the Champions of Justice when these requests first started coming to you?
I see. It's different now that you've been exposed to the public as cooperating in all this.
I am not saying that this would not have happened without his revelations, but I suspect that the feelings of antipathy that he has helped to stir up about the NSA & government spying have given companies more courage in pushing harder to challenge these things. Maybe for fear of loosing users if they are seen to cave in too easily, maybe because they really do want to do the right thing and feel that the tide might turn and make the effort worth while.
I can think of more than a few other very large companies, who through the nature of the business they conduct, should be joining Microsoft and Google. This is a good start, but it would be nice to see a whole bunch of companies gang up on the government over this. It might also help the little guys stand up.
Brought to you by Carl's Junior.
Come on government, it's just metadata about your requests, what's the big deal?
Now that the cat is out of the bag anyhow, everyone could be happy about metadata reporting;
Joe User will be happy that "only" x-thousands of users have info turned over out of x-millions of accounts - "what are the odds it's my account?"
Joe G-Man will be happy that "only" x-thousands of users have info turned over out of x-millions of accounts - "See, we are just doing focused investigations."
Joe Jihad will be happy that "only" x-thousands of users have info turned over out of x-millions of accounts - "what are the odds it's my account?"
This issue is a bit more complicated than you think.
but I fully expect their challenge to be sufficiently weak enough to reach a judgment and fail. The US Government needs this challenge and judgment for appearances that everything is legal.
Lest anyone believe the two aforementioned companies are doing this out of the goodness of their heart . . . .
The ONLY reason they're doing it is because they're bleeding customers due to the ever increasing lack of trust.
Commenting in the wrong article again?
They are artificial legal constructs, they have no rights
Didn't Microsoft and Google get the memo? Everything involving FISA is maximum top secret, not even congress is allowed to know what the FISA court does.
I made up the statistic of course, but I wonder how many people the feds are going after. If it is an absurdly high number such as one sixth of Google's userbase, then we should pester our politicians to get this thing changed. If Google is prevented from disclosing the information, then we might as well assume it is at least a number so high that it embarrasses the government du jour.
An alternative solution: first break the gag order, then wait for government attacking in court, and then defend. Attacking for the right to speak seems a looser's position.
on my stay in Room 101.
Get thee glass eyes, and, like a scurvy politician, seem to see things thou dost not.--King Lear
I'd be more impressed if they actually fought the demands for the customer data in the first place rather than wanting to disclose a few non-specific details about how they complied with them.
Call me cynical, but it's worth reminding people:
Skype accesses your /etc/passwd password files if your run it on Linux:
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=548898
(And also your mozilla bookmarks)
Google cloud print receives everything you print to your printer and yet they don't list it in your privacy control panel as things they know about you.
Likewise they know every site you visit if you logged into any Google service, and the site has adsense or Google's stats (that's most sites) and they don't list those sites either.
Neither company can be trusted to tell the whole story here, neither is a beacon of honesty.
Microsoft and the government co-deploy the data centers used to do this. This is a pr move from the ground up.
Beginning January, 2009, the United States Government became fully transparent. They promised!
Or perhaps not. Think about it.
Il n'y a pas de Planet B.
Why can't MS and Google publish "metadata" on the number of FISA requests and number of accounts requested? If it is good for the goose, it's good for the gander.
Agree... You can challenge a gag order by violating it and then if sued or subjected to criminal prosecution argue that the gag order was void.
In any event, Google and Microsoft should have done this before the Snowden revelations if they really wanted any credibility...
The US gov knows what you did last IPO. What was a great moment in capitalism might just get 'reviewed' years later by an understaffed, underfunded, legally powerless gov entity.
For the first time ever they might have amazing funding, smart staff, real subpoenas, global extradition support and strangely US press backing.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
The same people with US trust funds, scholarships, shares, pensions and telco/hardware/software/web 2.0 political connections.
Their parents or they bought into or made millions at a staff or contractor or software level from the big US brands.
They need to believe that the encryption IS safe, the product sold world wide IS safe, the ads ARE lucrative, that the brand, logo and "coded in the USA' IS a global winner.
Not that their pension/shares/job/resume/are contracting for/blog about/sockpuppet for a US gov wired ENIGMA box and the rest of the world just found out.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"