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Letter to "Extended Family" Assures That NSA Will "Weather This Storm"
An anonymous reader writes "The National Security Agency sent a letter to its employees, affiliates and contractors to reassure them that the NSA is not really an abusive and unchecked spying agency engaged in illegal activity." Whatever you think of the commentary, you can read the original, attached to the linked story.
Seriously, though, just because you say it doesn't make it true.
Actions speak much, much louder.
I guess that makes them Big Brother in law.
Brought to you by Carl's Junior.
Not surprised. Not surprised at all.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
Acknowledging the problem doesn't exist, it most certainly does.
>>> It was intended to reassure them that the NSA is not really the abusive and unchecked spying agency engaged in illegal activity that someone reading former NSA contractor Edward Snowdenâ(TM)s disclosures might think...
Uhh what? Snowden just released existing documents, he didn't create them.
It stands to reason that the NSA should be judged exactly by their actions, i.e. the content of the documents they themselves created.
Of course they're not "engaged in illegal activity". They control the law.
I am sure that the NSA sees itself as the good guy, and I am sure it does serve some useful, protective services. However, if those services come at the expense of civil liberties then the price is too high. And if it comes at a small cost to civil liberty, then it won't be too much longer until the bureaucracy feeds on itself until the small infractions become large ones.
Of course the NSA will weather it, will continue to exist and will continue to spy. For them it's a (short) embarrassing time after which the news media will forget them and all will be the same for them again.
The ones who pay for this are the US IT companies which will be distrusted world wide and the US government (politicians, diplomats, secretary of state, etc) who will be distrusted even by their closest allies. US companies will notice it in the long term bottom line e.g. when big foreign companies won't outsource to a US company. The public will forget the scandal soon like they forgot Echelon, the big companies who have actual trade secrets however won't, and if they do they will probably regret it soon when their secrets aren't secret anymore and their US competitors magically know everything they do. These losses are however far in the future: more than a quarter away so they will be denied, at least publically and especially by the ones responsible: the politicians.
The politicians will have a lot less trust and goodwill from their foreign counterparts, even and especially from allied countries.
We're already getting molested at airports, among other things. People might (temporarily, and in small numbers) complain about it, but it seems unlikely that much will change.
Da derp dee derp da teedly derpee derpee dum. Rated PG-13.
I had not heard about this new style sheet standard. Do I need to start to use it on my web sites ? Does it protect my sensitive information from the commies/taliban/mafia/... ? Which browsers support it ?
Gee, I wonder why NSA employees are handing out printed copies of the letter instead of just emailing (or Facebook sharing) it to their family members?
(There might be a lesson there for the rest of us.....)
I can't believe that Americans, the worlds greatest talkers of democracy, will tolerate such an uttlerly despicible act of totalitarianism, within their own country.
Well, sure, in theory the people won't stand for this egregious violation of our rights, and come November, you can bet that... Omigawd, did you see what Miley did at the VMAs? And that new video of hers - That girl seems headed for trouble, mark my words! Hey, can you stop and McD's on the way over and get me two Big Macs, a large fry, and a large strawberry shake? No, wait... I need to lose a few pounds, make it a small fry. So, who do you think will win the big game tonight?
"In the coming weeks and months more stories will appear"
In other words there's shit storm that's about to rain down on the NSA that will shake the organization to it's knees. And they know it.
Weather this storm indeed.
To paraphrase the letter:
We're family, we love you, so you should love us. Everything said in the media (except for a few pundits who we are paying off) is lies, the leaks didn't really say what they said. Everything we do is legal because we have the power to define the meaning of legal as anything we do.
Has anybody verified this letter is real? I smell a hoax.
It's not about hundreds of honest agents and managers doing the right thing. It's about creating an apparatus where a rogue agent at the behest of some powerful politician can get lost among the many and spy on opponent politicians and their supporters.
With easy to defeat or ignore technological barriers and just "you should go get approval first before you listen in", i.e. relying on agent honesty to Do The Right Thing, we've already lost. I keep bringing up the Watergate people -- these thugs, most of which would have been agents or that level of clearance, wouldn't think twice about doing this.
(-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
Nope. It is a thinly veiled threat. You, dear family member, could be number 172 ... on second thought make that 173; we'll get Snowden first!"
Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
Easy.
The NSA have got files on everyone.
Which politician is going to take them on and see all their dirty laundry thrown to the media?
Sounds like the NSA has a quitting problem they are trying to abate.
Those were all military personal collecting data for the NSA.
They were NOT NSA people.
NSA people sit in their little cubes in the Virginia and Maryland areas. They do NOT risk their lives. That's all bullshit that any of those people lost their lives in the line of duty.
Why the NSA is not writing a letter to the American people to explain themselves?
The reason is that whilst NSA is well protected from normal folk, but they are very scared for more of their employees to leak more information - one more Snowden and the NSA as we know it won't exist.
This rhetoric is no different than the cigarette companies, which pretended to be standing up for "smokers rights." Their leaked documents proved a very different story and motivations.
Except in forests... when occurring to trees.
Writing to employees' families and referring to his organization as a "national treasure" both give off a sense of defensiveness. As another poster said, they will almost certainly weather the political storm and continue doing what they do, but this letter doesn't make them look any better.
"If it's real, then it gets more interesting the closer you examine it. If it's not real, just the opposite is true." -
2. Deny their story
3. ....
4. They win
Just admit that you have no concern for civilian privacy (whether they're American or otherwise), that you have no trepidation when it comes to breaking the rules and inventing your own, that you think you can decide what is right for yourselves when you know very well that it's wrong (and if you don't, that you need to go back to grade school philosophy), that you have no respect for the sovereignty of other groups and nations (many of which want to have nothing to do with you), and that you are a lying, secretive, pragmatic organization with no morals, conscience, values or principles other than feeding your own greed, power and corruption.
Seriously, denial is the first indication that you have a problem. If anything, this idiotic claptrap is indication that the NSA needs more than ever to be dismantled and banished into the annals of corruption autocracies.
I have left slashdot and am now on Soylent News. FUCK YOU DICE.
In 6 months we wont remember who the NSA is or what happened.
Humans today have the attention span of a turnip.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Great example of a false dichotomy!
Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
Obviously all of the rhetoric surrounding our illegal or unconstitutional behavior are extremist lies that jeopardize the safety of your country and families.
THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!!
Donald Trump, on a crusade to make Nixon look respectable
The NSA denied the spying flat out, until they were caught.
The government claimed the court oversight was adequate, until FOI releases proved they're not.
They said they were only using the surveillance data to catch terrorists, until it was revealed that the DEA was getting a feed.
Why should anyone, even an NSA employee, believe anything these idiots have to say any more?
I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
It'll change. The terror may be unimaginable before it changes... but much will change. Who can stand up to the US? It'll take the alliance of China and Russia. We can't stand against their combined force. And so, in a fit of desperation, we'll use the bomb. In a world without humans, there will be peace. Does that mean Obama will deserve the peace prize after all?
"The National Security Agency sent a letter to its employees, affiliates and contractors to reassure them that the NSA is not really an abusive and unchecked spying agency engaged in illegal activity."
We have always been at war with Oceania.
If anyone was thinking of breaking up with the NSA family, the letter states, “We want to put the information you are reading and hearing about in the press into context and reassure you that this Agency and its workforce are deserving and appreciative of your support.”
Family == Mafia [*]
[*] or used to be until the National Stasi Agency sullied the term ...
Like a good neighbor, fsck is there
I hope that there are lots more courageous NSA employees and contractors who will stand up and be whistleblowers.
They're probably our last best hope to turn back this police state.
You are welcome on my lawn.
Is that completely unrelated to this story, or do we expect the US government to prevent similar from happening here on American soil while the NSA and FBI dutifully obey all laws on the books?
The NSA didn't prevent the lunatic from perpetrating the shooting at the Washington Navy Yard.
The NSA didn't stop those idiots from setting off an IED during the Boston Marathon.
The NSA & FBI didn't help with the apprehension of the snipers in the D.C. area a few years back either.
The skippers were caught because they were noticed acting suspiciously in a rest area.
The FBI and NSA didn't prevent the events of September 11, 2001.
I'm afraid you will need a few examples of actual successes in order to make your claims stick, but you are going to have a problem with this, because there are no examples of attacks being prevented.
Oh, and how about that mess in Benghazi ? Yeah, all the NSA spying seems to be really working out
well with respect to keeping Americans safe.
Looks like Muhammad Saeed al-Sahhaf (the Iraqi Information Minister during the second Gulf War) has snagged himself a new contract. WE ARE NOT SPYING ON ANY AMERICANS, AND THERE IS NO FAILURE OF OVERSIGHT.
Working for NSA is like working for SD6 :)
If programs would be read like poetry, most programmers would be Vogons.
There is no legal impediment to the NSA collecting, logging, analyzing, and possibly mischaracterizing *everything* I do online, and sharing the results of that analysis with the relevant local cops. The constitutional protections extended to American citizens do not apply to foreigners, from those living in other Western democracies, to those living in countries controlled by various "our-sonnfabitches" that the USA has supported over the years. It's well documented that the CIA has, on a regular basis, interfered in the domestic politics of other countries around the world, including aiding politically convenient despots in enforcing repression. In the old days, the computational tools to surveil everyone in the world simply didn't exist, so the CIA and NSA were naturally limited in who they could bother. Now, such limits apply to a much lesser extent. In terms of the technical capability (and I'm not implying equality of motives) it's heading in the direction of what the Stasi could do - to every single person on the entire planet. And, sorry, I am *not* happy that the United States government has that kind of reach. And nor should you be.
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo
--Andy Finkel (J. Klass?)
I direct my anger at the incompetent oversight committee -- the US Congress -- and incompetent controls in hiring and protecting information especially among sys admins.
Coldfjord, why don't you go buy a six pack and find yourself a reasonably priced whore for the
night ( or maybe a teenage boy, that's probably more to your taste ) and shut the fuck up.
Most of us here are not going to ever believe your bullshit, and it is way past boring reading
your moronic attempts at persuasion.
.
stays together. Now let's all gather around the fireplace and take turns throwing copies of the Bill of Rights into the fire to stay warm.
worse everyone knows the NSA has a big file on everyone and is willing to display all the details, which means even if they don't have anything on the first politician to speak up they can make shit up and people will buy it.
---Saying gnome 3 is better than windows 8 not so much a compliment as it is damning with light praise.
Yes, Prime Minister
watch it. learn something.
Democracy Now! - uncensored, anti-establishment news
is not a none stater that shuts down the government I mean grown men and spying on citizens and every government on earth. It has all just caused me to go from wrapped in flag the first second I was born veteran to absolutely no faith in my fellow man. And have had to change my life to living it as a everyman for them self deal. Exchanged the new deal for the raw deal so the rich can get richer on Billionaire who dont want to be tax fair share say so. How can one have faith in anything ever again. The only thing that trickled down was food stamps. And even that they are trying to take away. And a few billionaires have sold them this is a good thing. And it would be if trickle down had not failed so badly that it all trickled I mean flowed like the colorado river up.
Someone recently told me that the "capture everything" was done because it's "technically" not a search of everyone's communications on the Internet in human readable form. That is until they use search algorithms to build an "instant dossier" on whoever they don't like from the huge pile of data they've collected.
That... is plausible. It's probably even correct.
--
BMO
Really? A letter.
'Cause, you know, I always figured that people could pretty much see for themselves and make up their own minds...
Blackmail only works on criminals and sleazebags. If you're doing shit so bad that you're willing to sell out your entire country to keep it quiet you deserve to be strung up by an angry mob.
Ordinary people do stupid and embarrassing stuff, but most people don't have histories that they couldn't come clean about if forced to. Only sociopathic assholes whose lives are entirely built on deception (eg politicians) are susceptible to this sort of treatment.
Blackmail is like Danegeld. Only an idiot would choose to play that game and only a criminal would need to.
If you want a vision of the future, imagine a youtube comments section scrolling - forever.
"knee-jerk anti-NSA sentiment"? Global encryption is now junk. The brands that sold it are a joke. The gov workers who tested/passed it are presenting unsafe math. Thats not just "sentiment" or 'sensible priorities"
You dont get to be on an oversight committee without getting a hint of the plain text wonders related to any area of political interest.
Mil, drugs, banking, trade, crime - just enough to keep the laws flexible and internal reviews been all the oversight ever needed.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
The same basic questions about US law would have been placed in the ~1950-60-70-80-90~2000. Any individual would have just been reassured, reassessed and later promoted to a less legally challenging area.
A few generations later the people doing the hiring and been re hired for contracting would have been more understanding of the role of global communications at a domestic level.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
Any issues raised about "passive eavesdropping" by protesters in the real world would be surrounded by police, federal agents and domestic mil support if near a base/camp/fort... :) :)
Long term surveillance and infiltration would blunt the message.
Press can be fired, set up, distracted or ensured fame until stories about "eavesdropping" become a distant memory.
Academics can be ensured fame as they write about other safe topics or are questioned over every 'privacy' 'crypto' or 'rights' paper.
If all that fails just set up well funded front 'foundations' or present other 'academics' to question the role of the Fourth Amendment at a state and federal level until it becomes just another party political mess.
Sockpuppets have a great role to play too
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
Every word they've said After Snowden has been public relations. "Our extended family" "sensationalized the leaks" "wrongly cast doubt" "more of a rogue element than a national treasure"
"Denial, Anger, Acceptance" is the third episode of The Sopranos.
"You must try to forget all you have learned. You must begin to dream." -- Sherwood Anderson
Russia, China, and the US/UK are bickering empires that share a common enemy, their citizens. But they will always work as a team to protect authority.
“He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
I am so reassured now.
The land of the watched, and home of the scared.
Most under-rated post of the thread.
..Mullah or Pope, Preacher or Poet, who was it wrote: "Give any one species too much rope and they'll fuck it up"?
Are all the politicians being blackmailed? Every one? Don't you think they talk to each other on occasion? There are hundreds of them, they work together every day. They go out for drinks. They form friendships, just like any other coworkers. Surely one would mention "Hey Bill, I got this threatening phone call from the NSA..." They could disband the entire organization like flipping a light switch if they all wanted to, and if they all were being blackmailed, they'd certainly want to.
And what would the NSA do? Release documents on every person in Congress? That would just prove them right.
You're suffering from a group delusion. The only way to cure yourself is by trying to apply some logic to the situation. I know it's tough. But set aside your anger, your hate, your fear, and THINK.
To get enough money to get into politics means doing deals with people that are associated with criminals and sleazebags, if not the real deal. A scandal works with Kevin Bacon style weak connections so why not blackmail?
More a return to the 1990's role of the NSA - limited funded and called on only when really needed outside the tasks of setting the codes.
The CIA and mil/contractors will take their lost 'share' back from the NSA that just grew too fast in the past ~10 years.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
Re They aren't going to be impacted by the NSA :)
If their paycheck to paycheck life is stopped by the loss of that vital next paycheck the "people" might become locally politically active.
The telco network/internet is perfect for tracking small trends and grassroots efforts like that
The "abilities for evil" where not an issue when looking at distant nations and other nations mil ranks.
All that skill set is now facing inward ie at the vast majority of people.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
The vast majority of people could care less. They are living paycheck to paycheck.
You want to be kept down that way? Fine. But the people who want to accomplish something beyond that aren't going to put up with a rigged system. And these are the people who build the businesses that provide you with your paycheck. Do you really think they are going to invest intellectual capital in businesses when they learn that their work is being taken and handed to people within the 'good old boy' network?
Have gnu, will travel.
"I am not a crook."
The NSA should take a lesson from Nixon. Save face and step down before your ass has to get dragged through court and embarrass us all.
Have gnu, will travel.
Tell that to Hoover. Or his lieutenant, Mark Felt, Mr. Deep Throat himself.
Blackmail works. It's worked most of the 20th century. It's probably working even now.
"If a nation expects to be ignorant and free in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be."
I'm going to send all my email as Captcha jpgs. To hell with encryption, your recipient has to be savvy enough to install it, and a I can't even figure that out on my end. So let the NSA have it, but I'll make damn sure they can't index it without using human eyeballs. Or at least make them work harder on anti-captcha software first. Most email programs can send jpgs just fine already, and Facebook and Twitter handle them fine, also. I just need to come up with a captcha program that will do an entire paragraph.
If they can withstand the 1970's, the only surprise is the lack of effort given towards bringing Snowden in to face justice in the US.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
Yes, I do! I find it quite amusing that America was schooled by Putin on exceptionalism.
For a country one who claims to boast its own national exceptionalism and moral superiority. Yet, forgets to mention they are the holders of the largest national debt known to man. If you ask me. I find this fact hardly exceptional or superior ... heck it's not even moral!
Getting a job in politics is like winning the lottery. The "winners" stand to make millions off the kickbacks and side deals. And all it takes to lose that lottery ticket is a small scandal that the press can run with right before re-election. The story doesn't even need to be completely true. The very insinuation of wrong-doing can be enough to lose a re-election. This is especially true for a Republican politician.
The American mafia has made money through selling information to foreign countries since 1977.
Without help from the mafia cops, lawyers and hospital workers to allow Americans to be tortured, the Soviet Union would never have had the concept of super-cavitation, the neutron bomb, active stealth or cermet.
While the American mafia allows kids/relatives of parents with access to classified data to be tortured, the American government has had it's hands tied, it's about 30 years past time for some crooked cops and their gang members to meet the waterboard for espionage.
I am the unwilling control for my Origin.
The problem is, what the NSA does ISN'T illegal.
If you understand anything at all about "democracy," you shouldn't be surprised when totalitarianism results.
I don't think they realize that they are not starting a trend of things switching away from the U.S, they are helping to accelerate an already existing one. The U.S. has increasingly been viewed as a rogue state. People in other countries have been expressing less confidence in US leadership for decades.
The dot com boom changed things for a while; but the industries reliance on H-1B increased the switching of tech to outside the US. The dot com bust, followed by 9-11 made the US a much less attractive place. Europeans that came to the US eventually stayed long enough to find out about our healthcare system and ran back home. In my company now has more developers in Europe than in the US.
The data theft by the NSA will accelerate this trend. It is a tipping point. They act like it all started with Snowdon. The competitive situation has changed dramatically. We have been adding one more straw for decades. Is this the straw that breaks the camels back? Probably not, but it is several steps closer to it.
Why are you all pre-supposing that the threat has to be about something you actually did? If $ENEMY calls you with threats to reveal that secret child-pornography studio you have hidden away in your house, it doesn't matter if it isn't actually true - they can still ruin your life with just the accusation. Really, blackmail doesn't rely on you on something you did that you try to hide, but instead preys upon people who have something to lose, such as your family or job.
A traditional way isn't even to go after *YOU*. They just see to it that your parents -or kids start losing their jobs or are subject toother threats. To quote from a particularly well-written reddit post (which everybody should read!)
Ce n'est pas une signature automatique.
What amazes me is that the "line" has been communication between US citizens should be untouched, but anything involving foreigners is fair game. Placing the rights of Americans above the rights of everyone else has created the gap. If you have a system that protects everyone’s privacy. Where any access to information or monitoring must be substantiated and require a warrant or something similar, the system is far less open to abuse. Freedom is lost one piece at a time. The failure to stand up for the rights of others means that you are one step closer to giving up your own. “Give to every other human being every right that you claim for yourself - that is my doctrine.” Thomas Paine
This only really works if the people who are extorting you are the authorities, though. Extortion is illegal and the only thing that keeps the victim from involving the police is their secret coming out. If the secret isn't true then there isn't any leverage to use against the victim. The revealed misinformation can still be damaging, but there is great incentive to out the blackmailer and clear your name. Giving in to them only lends credence to the misinformation and gives them leverage.
[From your example, if some guys threatens to expose your (non-existent) child porn studio if you don't pay him, paying him is the last thing you want to do. There's no assurance that paying will shut him up and if he goes to the press after you've paid him off (maybe more than once), the story is now that you've payed someone to keep quiet about your child porn studio. On the other hand, if you go to the cops, the story is that you were being blackmailed over a child porn studio that the cops verified wasn't real and the blackmailer is being hunted down by law enforcement. True, "child porn studio" and your name still show up together in the news, but this is the best realistic (and controllable) outcome.]
Of course, in your situation, the law is the blackmailer and so it doesn't matter if the "secret" is true or not. There will be no justice.
If you want a vision of the future, imagine a youtube comments section scrolling - forever.
I think you're probably strongly underestimating just how bad the *accusation* of such a charge can be,; especially with how easy it is to plant any sort of incrimnating file. Really, though, America's panic over that entire topic is a topic for another thread.
the story is now that you've payed someone to keep quiet
Of course, THAT obviously-wrong solution to being blackmailed has been know for a long time. As Shakespeare put it:
It may have bad consequences, and it may nto even work, but irunning fighting the blackmailer is still a much, much better option than giving in to what they want, which only invites more of the same.
Ce n'est pas une signature automatique.
ack; in my hates, didn't notice the other author mentioned on wiki. That poem is atributed to Rudyard Kipling, not Shakespeare, though they both speak similarly on the subject.
Ce n'est pas une signature automatique.
Absolutely. I realized shortly after my original post that blackmail seems just like Danegeld because it is (originally) literally the exact same thing as Danegeld!
As to your first point, I realize that the mere accusation of some things can be ridiculously damaging, but by the time you're being extorted you're already in damage control mode. If someone's threatening to release damaging misinformation about you, there's no legal way to keep them quiet without also risking their message getting out. Any extralegal attempt to silence them only risks forcing their hand and in the end paints just as poor a picture of you as paying them off does.
If you want a vision of the future, imagine a youtube comments section scrolling - forever.