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City of Turin To Switch From Windows To Linux and Save 6M Euros
jrepin writes: The municipality of Turin in Italy hopes to save 6 million Euro over five years by switching from Windows XP to Ubuntu Linux in all of its offices. The move will mean installing the open source operating system on 8,300 PCs, which will generate an immediate saving of roughly €300 per machine (almost €2.5m altogether, made up from the cost of Windows and Office licences) — a sum that will grow over the years as the need for the renewal of proprietary software licences vanishes, and the employees get used to the new machines.
Well, the MS lock-in may just be starting to fray enough to make a difference.
Makes a lot of sense, but I bet they end up saving way more than 6M euros
... and will switch back again in a few years, at a net cost of E12 million.
http://arstechnica.com/busines...
(Yes, I'm trolling, but desktop experience for the average Joe really is a problem, no matter how many excuses we Linux folks make.)
A entire brand new PC capable of running Linux, LibreOffice, web browser, and typical programs that the average office worker or bureaucrat needs.
Hell, you might even be able to buy a smart-TV for $300 that can run the same items.
Microsoft either better cut their prices or give out free XP upgrades, unless they want to be upgraded out of business.
You didn't do your research, huh? They're not actually going to go back to Wind'ohs.
The Amarri pray for god, the Caldari pray for profit. the Gallente pray for peace, but the Minmatar pray their ships hol
They shouldn't bother with XP upgrades, period. Let the dinosaur die already.
The Amarri pray for god, the Caldari pray for profit. the Gallente pray for peace, but the Minmatar pray their ships hol
Munich may be looking to pick up a bunch of Windows licenses on the cheap...
#DeleteChrome
As a sidenote, a new DebConf 14 Linus Q&A is up.
headline should read "...at least 6 million Euros"
they get their number from the license fees **only**
think about the savings from tech support & maintenance...
then think about how much could've been saved the the US government had done this 10 years ago
then think about how much of our tax dollars have gone to M$ or their subsidiaries just since 2000
Thank you Dave Raggett
Yeah, astronomical.
Supporting linux installs are brain-dead easy.
It is not like the municipal drones are going to need anything more than basic software, regardless of the OS.
Bwahahahaha
but I have to say: "Try A Different Distro"
http://www.debian.org/CD
Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
hopes to save 6 million Euro over five years by switching from Windows XP to Ubuntu Linux in all of its offices. The move will mean installing the open source operating system on 8,300 PCs, which will generate an immediate saving of roughly €300 per machine (almost €2.5m altogether, made up from the cost of Windows and Office licences)
€6,000,000/8,300 = €723 Euro per machine. Subtract 300, up-front (OS/Office) = €85 per year savings, after the licenses.
Let's say the average city employee makes €40,000/year (I have no idea what they make, but assuming one employee per workstation, those workers are about 1/4 of the cities annual budget of €1,266,000,000)
So, the half a day's wage saved (€85) per year isn't a big deal either way - either they are happy with the open source systems and they make out, or they go back to proprietary software and spend a couple of days wages, if needed.
And why does it need to be all or nothing? People should use what makes them most productive... within the support capabilities of the IT staff. Out of 8300 workstations I wouldn't be surprised if a large share of them could get by with basically running a web browser, but for those who need Windows or MacOS to get their work done, so be it.
This issue is a bit more complicated than you think.
Do all 8300 employees need individual desktops? This is not a software development company, and those machines still need to be managed, maintained and replaced. Keep big depos of $250 chromebooks where anyone can get one for temporary or permanent use at office or home. Then return when done, as still working or broken. No IT costs, as data is in the cloud.
For heavier use, provide computer labs with a choice of platforms, so if someone really needs to work on the latest version of Office or Photoshop, they can.
And of course, anyone who is expected to work on computer for hours every day, or handle sensitive data, should get a laptop/desktop of their choice with reasonable price constraints. Savings from all the other use cases will more than pay for the luxury.
From TFA:
... which will feature open source guru Richard Stallman ...
Will he show up?
Cue the fanbois: ....
1) Its too compilcaded
2) It doesn't work with microsoft stuff 100% perfect, even though microsoft goes out of their way to be incompatible with everything (including their own software) so HORROR!
3) Its just a trick to get a better license deal (WINK WINK).
4) The US should bomb Italy or Europe or something for not buying Redmondware and supporting the NSA back doors.
Or, you know, the city of Turin is just fed up with virii, bsod, high license fees, NSA back doors, and found a more robust, cheaper computing experience. I know the city I live in went to Google Docs. Sure they only save about $8 million in the first year, but they are expected to save about $12 million per year after some of the 'locked in' licenses expire.
Europeans seem quite forward thinking when it comes to OSS. I found it interesting that a game I play and run servers for Xonotic has WAY more European based players than North American and they prefer the games because its OSS.
by TheSpoom (715771) Uncaring Linux user here. I have nothing to add to this but please continue. *munches popcorn*
...they'll be back
Replacement memory, batteries, HDD's for the 20% that approach EOL from overuse around this time, plus the labour to clean out all the fans. If they didn't factor this in, half their fleet's going to be dead within 3 years. This can still be a venture of savings, just not what they expect.
I'm sick of stories that say "hope to," and want to read more that say "Did" save money by switching to OSS.
"
While I applaud the switch to OSS, the 6M EUR "savings" is quite a misnomer. Sure, it is possible they would save 6M over retail prices for Windows and Office - but with MS' Volume Licensing, that price goes way, way, way down. I know municipalities in the US get a discount as well, and I'm sure the same applies in the EU, meaning that this figure is quite inflated.
Again, I think it's a great move, and in the end it will save them money. But 6M Euros? Highly unlikely.
Then you've never worked in an enterprise environment that uses it. You'll have a ton of tech support and maintenance costs with Linux. You not only have all the regular user shit, people who can't figure out how to use their computer, administrative stuff, etc. However I've also observed that a good bit of the stuff in Linux requires a lot of sysadmin work, scripting and such. We do Linux and Windows in our environment and we certainly make Linux work on a large enterprise scale, but our Linux lead spends an awful lot of time messing with puppet, shell scripts, and so on to make it all happen. A lot more than we spend with AD and group policy to make similar things happen in Windows.
Licensing savings are certainly something you can talk about savings for, however you aren't getting out of support and maintenance. That is just part of running an enterprise. The question is what would their costs be, compared to Windows? that is likely to vary per environment.
Maybe 6-10 hours of staff time. What I mean is you have to factor what your people cost you. If someone costs $50/hour when you count in salary + ERE (meaning payroll tax, benefits, insurance and all other expenses) then 6 hours of their time costs $300. So, if your transition wastes more than 6 hours of their time, it is a net loss.
You always have to keep that cost in mind when you talk about anything: What does it cost your employees to do? This is the same deal with old hardware. It can actually cost you more money, because it takes more IT time to support. Like if you have an IT guy whose salary + ERE is $30/hour and you have them spend 20 hours a year repairing and maintaining an old P4 system that keeps failing, well that is a huge waste as that $600 could have easily bought a new system that would work better and take up little, if any, of their time.
That is a reason commercial software wins out in some cases. It isn't that you cannot do something without it, just that it saves more staff time than it costs. That's why places will pay for things like iDRAC or other lights-out management, remote KVMs, and so on. They cost a lot but the time they save in maintenance can easily exceed their cost.
Just remember that unless employees are paid very poorly, $300 isn't a lot of time. So you want to analyze how much time your new system will cost (all new systems will cost some time in transition if nothing else) and make sure it is worth it.
Ubuntu Linux, is everywhere government departments quango tax dodging charities and the British government is using it for touchscreen job searches from job centres and work programmes. I've seen it being used in the French republic and Deutschland, and it's also used in Asia East Asia. The administrators use a system called "Landscape" to control all the Ubuntu, systems. This "Landscape" blocks websites and controls all updates and monitors all Ubuntu systems on a usually underpowered network. They tell me all the users complain about Ubuntu, because they want to use Windows instead. The quango administrators like the control they get with "Landscape". Seen it being used in Internet cafés in India, along with Ubuntu, which has just the web browser and LibreOffice.
From the article:
"...and the employees get used to the new machines.
Or rather, to the old ones. Another reason for the switch was that the computers Turin uses are quite old, and installing Windows 8 would have probably been too demanding for them, whereas Linux offers more flexibility with more mature machines."
At one time, Linux was the O.S. for reviving old machines as it seemed to require fewer resources and managed the resources more efficiently. That was then, this is now...
A few years ago, I suggested to a family member that their "internet machine" should be a Linux box instead of a Windows box. Their machine was "Designed for XP" machine that was pretty good for it's time: 3Ghz Pentium, oodles of disk, and a fairly nice graphics card. I started with Ubuntu 8.04 LTS, but quickly upgraded to Ubuntu 9.04 to provide some newer web surfing tools. The 9.04 system was great, it did what they needed, was very responsive, and just worked.
As 9.04 wasn't an LTS release, when 10.04 LTS came out 9.04 fell off the update list. Eventually the websites they visited wanted more up-to-date versions of various web software, so I decided it was time to upgrade to the 10.04 LTS ... big mistake.
While 10.04 LTS installed fine, it was dog slow. It was easy to track down the problem: RAM. The internet machine *only* had 512Mb of RAM; while this is quite comfortable for a machine "Designed for XP," Ubuntu 10.04 just couldn't work with it. So I did a little digging...
Turned out, booting 9.04 just to the user screen consumed a little under 200Mb of RAM - leaving plenty left of the 512Mb to actually do things. In contrast, booting 10.04 to the user screen not only consumed all of the 512Mb of RAM but a small portion of swap space as well - no wonder the machine couldn't do anything (reminds me of the old EMACS joke - Eight Megs and Constantly Swapping).
So in one year, the O.S. gobbled 2-1/2 times as much RAM?!? By the time 12.04 LTS came out the figure was between 1.5Gb and 2.0Gb just to boot to a user screen. What happened to "Linux works well on older machines?"
Now back to the article and my question: "...whereas Linux offers more flexibility with more mature machines."
I can't imagine trying to run any modern Ubuntu distribution on any "Designed for XP" computer without significantly upgrading RAM (I wouldn't run 10.04 without 1Gb of RAM or 12.04 without 4Gb). While 4Gb of RAM is standard for today's low-end machines, it certainly wasn't standard for "Designed for XP" boxes.
So which version of Ubuntu would you run on a "mature machine" that was running Windows XP (and remember 10.04 has all but dropped off the update wheel itself)?
Yeah, managing 8,300 Linux desktops and user accounts requires nothing more than a couple shell scripts...
Ken
I cannot stand any *untu but they're on the rigth track at least.
happy trials
So how much are they paying the Ubuntu people, or the LibreOffice people or any of the other free software organizations for the use of their software? if the answer is "nothing" then this is not a sustainable model. People have to eat. People need places to live. That takes money. If the people putting their time and effort into creating these packages are not being paid then the model cannot be sustained.
Another question is: how many additional IT have been hired to make this transition and maintain it going forward? Who gets the call when something isn't working?
A few sysadmins with ssh plus puppet or one of dozens of other similar system management tools. They don't even have to be paticularly experienced since this is now a very well travelled road.
There's probably a few clusters that big being being managed by single sysadmins. Just because managing that many MS windows hosts with a bastard child of LDAP requires a lot of time doesn't mean it's going to take a long time with other platforms. With enough of a budget and a few recent graduates I could have rolled something like this out in 2004 let alone 2014 - as could have many others.
That's pretty well it with stuff like puppet. Welcome to the 21st century where cluster computing methods have hit the desktop.
Early days and not built for speed - so try something like e17 instead of the newer proof of concept stuff.
We've done everything we can in our Active Directory network to overcome roaming profile issues. Even with folder redirection, you have a huge fat ntuser.dat for prone to corruption. Users' home folders on a server, with discrete text-based configuration files would be a dream.
Did you know that in 2014 you still can't safely put risking profiles on a DFS share?
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
I believe that a lot of Windows users (including administrators) simply don't understand anything beyond the personal computer. They just don't understand a world in which one can sit down at another machine, log in and continue working just like they had sat down at their regular workstation. It's an alien concept to them.
The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
Yes they do, because ergonomics require decent keyboards, screen and mouses. They may not need fat clients and would be off just as well with thin clients, but laptops or that form factor do *not* replace desk top systems since they still need the keyboard, mouse and screen and will essentially be used as a desktop almost all of the time.
They need access to their individual applications and data too. While it may be possible migrate all those to web applications or some client-server model, I doubt Turin has managed to finalize that sort of thing yet. Most EU cities have over a thousand custom applications that often run on antiquated proprietary systems and they will still have a burden of those for a long time.
Getting people the cheapest computer possible sounds like an easy way to save money, but in the end the price of the hardware is only a fraction of the costs and often the extra costs incurred by buying cheaper will make it more expensive. Starting with migrating just the desktops to linux and running the proprietary cruft on things like Citrix servers will save them a lot of money without a significant down side.
Oh, because they're not running windows, they can probably use their older systems a bit longer too, if electricity costs don't make it cheaper to upgrade anyway to more energy efficient devices.
I was promised a flying car. Where is my flying car?
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Honestly at work it is supposed to work like that, but I gave up on it because NFS is still a piece of shit that doesn't work.
Either you run it with per-machine authentication, but then you can't give your software developers root access.
Or you run it with Kerberos. But then it can mount your home only after login. With Ubuntu 14.04 (whether using KDE, XFCE, Unity) that results in your home being mounted too late, so you actually have to log in 6 times before anything actually works.
Of course, most NFS servers are also so crappy implemented and specced that even once it works, the performance is so awful it's like working with an ancient computer.
Interestingly, we had this exact thing working flawlessly with Linux about 10 years ago when you just mounted the home directories via PAM using SMB. No issues, good performance,... I wished they'd just scrap NFS, how many years old now and still the same shitty experience every single time.
MS only supports English properly. Europe has dozens of different languages that are all supported very well by Linux. This is a major item for most people.
Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
Yup. Plus the fact that Linux requires much less support.
Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
The company I work for has a number of workstations close to that of the one represented in TFA, in the 5 digits. Instead of forcing such a radical change down everyone's throat, they went about it step by step, over several years, and it's still ongoing.
They started by gradually replacing several critical programs with web apps or frontends, killing off IE6 with "please use firefox" prompts for good measure. This part was met with only some token resistance by the users, mostly because of a couple of glitches that where promptly fixed. After the first couple of months, general opinion was that the change was very positive, especially because of how cumbersome and hard to use the old apps (some over 10-20 years old) where.
The next phase was replacing Office, and it came with a huge backlash. The chief complaints where not so much about OpenOffice funcionality (along with some "it's *UGLY*!"), but about compatibility with MS generated documents. As of yet, it has been impossible to take MSOffice away from the "higher-ups", as any single minor UI or functionality change is bitched about as if it was a sign of the Apocalypse. Coupled with the long standing tradition of "sending down" 2-slide ppts, it was a huge mess.
It's somewhat better now, as PDF has become the standard for operational documents, and xls or docs are glossed over to make sure nothing's horribly broken.
Some areas (notably, reporting and analysis of KPIs) still rely heavily on excel features. Work is being done on that front, not so much because of the OSS push, but mainly because of the nightmare levels of voodoo in macro and VBA scripting involved. One hears talk of chicken blood and other dark rituals several times a week, which is how frequently something breaks.
There's also a couple of critical windows-specific programs that haven't yet been replaced, but when that's done in another year or so, pretty much any OS is a viable pick. Though definitely not an easy change, it can be done in small steps and with minimal disruption. YMMV, mostly on how dependent you are on MsOffice...
...open source guru Richard Stallman...
I am familiar with free software guru Richard Stallman, but who is this other guy with the same name?
Geology - it's not rocket science; it's rock science
looking at the results of the city of Munich's progress in ditching windows as evidence that
How many Microsoft shills are there who read Slashdot? I ask, because I keep seeing the same tired arguments over and over again that don't seem to make any sense or have already proven wrong. Things like:
Anyway, I just wish the Microsoft Shills would be at least honest enough to publicly admit they're getting paid for their shilling.
I suspect the poster isn't aware that there are good quality Linux management solutions, in the OSS space, which are equivalent in features (still working on maturity) to Active Directory including policies and the like.
Go look at FreeIPA from Redhat.
tora
Munich, Turin --- Linux
Any other cities with a u and i in it? And would it work the other way, with i and u? /Simon
The cost of office per year compared to the cost of employing a single employee is tiny even more so if they are a civil servant with a juicy pension entitlement - when I was in charge of the tech at a small 10 person company I reckoned it cost us less than £50 a year per person for office and xp
I just talked to a guy from Microsoft, and they find this a revolting Turin of events.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
This is probably not the right time. There will be a World Fair Expo in spring 2015 in Milan, concerning sustainable development. Nearby Turin (Torino) is trying to piggyback that event, with the 200th anniversary of Don Bosco, a popular modern saint who worked to deliver education and orderly upbringing to the poor youth of 19th century Europe. They will have a public exhibition of the Shroud of Turin to bolster the event, which will attract millions of people to the city. A premature Linux roll-out and a resulting fiasco during those events next spring would bring a lot of negative publicity for the FOSS movement.
Remember that Pepsi advert, that went "Lipsmacking, thirst quenching, ace tasting, motivating, cool buzzing, high talking, fast living, ever giving, cool fizzing...Pepsi !"
That's what that wall of text reminded me of.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jB8rnZ-0dKw
I live in Valencia, and I never see a public offering for desktop software. Why all our money have to go to microsoft and not to Canonical (I'm not sure another company is offering desktop OS)? As some have noted on their comments, an associated cost for jumping to linux exists, as there are cost associated to any software version upgrade, and also IT administration derived costs, but if the public offices switch for OSS, and the lawmakers force to use it on schools, it will be easier for the next generations. A lot of teachers defend using MS Office "because is what companies use", but why I have to pay for a license for my daughter to do her homework?
funny how the same people who tout how much corporations pay in taxes are the *same* ideological types who say that it's a crime *not* to take advantage of any kind of tax loophole a corporation can find
Thank you Dave Raggett
you can pretend I said anything that makes your point!
no!
never said that!
***comparatively less than M$***
which we all know, M$ products are awful and require constant re-training and bug fixes
Thank you Dave Raggett
I remember when the Redmond faithful used to go on about needing Windows to get "real work" done. My work must not be real because I can do it on Windows, Linux, Mac, Android and iOS. I find myself using my Android tablet more and more for work and all my social media promotions.
The operating system is becoming less relevant every day. People are choosing devices, not operating systems.
That's our life, the big wheel of shit. - The Fat Man, Blue Tango Salvage
American living in Germany here. Europeans are extremely poor. Few of them can afford cars, so they bike/walk everywhere and make use of public transportation. They also can't really afford computers, or food, or anything else. So they obviously embrace "open source software" because it is free (as in free beer).
Most of these peasants are living on the government dole of maybe a thousand bucks a month. It's a truly depressing continent full of childless people in their 50's with the hobbies of teenagers. A continent of man-children who never grew up, and never will. While slowly being conquered by Muslims and their high birth rates.
One of the things that drove me to open source initially was the asinine closed source model which prohibited you from seeing what was running on your computer, and the endless red tape of Microsofts licensing boodoggles which made it even more difficult to maintain the system, such as by using Live CDs and such for recovery, which is much more flexible on Linux as your not bound by so many restrictions on how the US can be used. People deserve the freedom of reading the sources of software they run, and being able to modify them. its the only way to control your computer rather than it control you
Many people bring up the issue of programmer pay. I do want programmers to be paid, the best would be a donations based model where it is open source, and the developers benefit from donations. In addition, the fact is, a lot of the money people spend on Microsofts crap doesnt even go to computer programmers. What is Bill Gates net worth again? Microsoft is still a near monopoly on desktop which allows Microsoft to exploit both programmers and consumers to benefit some elites who quite honesty are not worth more than the people who work at McDonalds, but instead milk the monopoly that was handed to them by IBM and then seek to exploit their workers to grab more of the profits for the elites who are not worth what they are paid.
The fact is that 99.99% of what we use PC's for can be done on Linux, in fact 99% of the server room can run on Linux with out effort. It's time for Microsoft to admit we don't need them.
Well that's the MS side with a bastard child of LDAP and a few issues to work out. Stuff is a bit more mature on other platforms - entire home directories on NFS, let alone profiles, were probably pretty safe in 1990.
I read you are here http://slashdot.org/comments.p... and seeing you keep a TomHudson sockpuppet account http://slashdot.org/~tomhudson... and this other of your many sockpuppets on slashdot too http://slashdot.org/~Barbara%2... also makes me believe you may be. Are you?
I read you are here http://slashdot.org/comments.p... and seeing you keep a TomHudson sockpuppet account http://slashdot.org/~tomhudson... and this other of your many sockpuppets on slashdot too http://slashdot.org/~Barbara%2... also makes me believe you may be. Are you?
I read you are here http://slashdot.org/comments.p... and seeing you keep a TomHudson sockpuppet account http://slashdot.org/~tomhudson... and this other of your many sockpuppets on slashdot too http://slashdot.org/~Barbara%2... also makes me believe you may be. Are you?
I read you are here http://slashdot.org/comments.p... and seeing you keep a TomHudson sockpuppet account http://slashdot.org/~tomhudson... and this other of your many sockpuppets on slashdot too http://slashdot.org/~Barbara%2... also makes me believe you may be. Are you?
From 2009! FFS! I didn't even know Mint was that old! So an experimental thing in a brand new distro had a bug five years ago that others failed to reproduce - you reposting that tells us a shitload more about you than anything else. What motivated such hate of linux that you are willing to embarrass yourself that much to run it down?
Because I come across glitches like that all the time.
Fair enough - why don't you try something worked on more recently than 2009 like e17 and see if you can find some glitches in it instead of in a proof of concept toy composited desktop?
As for your sig, even e16 in 1998 was more "ready for the desktop" than MS Win7 was when it finally came out with some similar features.
The city of Turin became interested in upgrading to a more secure IT infrastructure after they lost 4 million dollars through a traffic jam...
The article says the city of Turin is planning to convert their ageing PC fleet to Linux. Hardware problems will be the inevitable result.
If Microsoft hasn't yet flown any executives in to Turin to try and sweet talk them out of this decision, I'm betting they will soon. Microsoft clearly doesn't get it.
"His only "legend in his own mind" was that he claimed that "his" hosts file could completely secure a windows computer. " - by tomhudson (43916) on Saturday February 12, @11:19AM (#35186644) Homepage Journal FROM -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... in the YEAR 2011 years ago no less
I never claimed a HOSTS file can secure you completely... show me where I have? I want a quote, big talker... you'll never get it, because I never, EVER said that: HOSTS files are, however, a valuable layer of defense for the concept of "layered security".
* You couldn't produce proof THEN, & you certainly can't now (vainly *trying* to put words in my mouth I NEVER ONCE SAID!)
APK
P.S.=> Still @ your LIES, you transsexual weirdo? Ok, asking it again now nearly 5 yrs. later now in response to your bullshit lies again here quoted:
"APK - not only an expert on how the HOSTS file is the best way to secure your computer" - by BarbaraHudson (3785311) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @07:06PM (#47932519) Homepage
Under your NEW sockpuppet account too no less: SEE my challenge to you above - where've I ever said they completely secure you? I never have, liar...
Of course, YOU ARE welcome to disprove my points on them after you said this lately too:
"I tore apart your stupid hosts file crapola." - by BarbaraHudson (3785311) on Tuesday August 19, 2014 @10:46AM (#47703255) Homepage
Oh, really?
Then why'd you run from disproving my points on them giving users added speed, security, reliability & more here too then -> http://tech.slashdot.org/comme... ?
... apk
One of the 1st times "Barb" libeled me stating "APK is a know-nothing that's never worked in the industry" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... in 1 of her numerous sockpuppet fake accounts kept active @ the same time here she uses to upmod herself & downmod opponents she can't get the better of (everyone's onto your games, freak).
Funny part is I've DONE FAR BETTER than ole' "cyclops Frank N. Furter" ever has shown in that exchange too http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , lol!
---
Later, he/she kept a journal on me & libeled me even more but worse -> http://slashdot.org/journal/25...
(Typical b.s. to *try* to 'put down' computer "geeks/nerds" saying "I live in a basement with my mommy" etc. when *ANYTHING BUT THAT* is true, considering I am a taxpaying homeowner!).
---
* From the dates you can SEE she's kept this up unceasingly since early to mid 2010 no less, & that's only scratching the surface (there's far more).
(Even TELLING OTHERS TO HARASS ME BY ANONYMOUS COWARD POSTS, calling me a "pedo" -> http://news.slashdot.org/comme... )
He/She left in May 2012 after being exposed for ALL OF THAT, but came back with this NEW account of hers, & what started up again (I did *NOT* bother "shim" even once before that)?
You guessed it (more harassment) -> http://tech.slashdot.org/comme...
Where I challenged her for her usual CRAP she always runs from (to validly disprove my points on hosts, which she clearly, cannot):
"I tore apart your stupid hosts file crapola." - by BarbaraHudson (3785311) on Tuesday August 19, 2014 @10:46AM (#47703255) Homepage
Oh, really?
Then why'd you run from disproving my points on them giving users added speed, security, reliability & more here too then -> http://tech.slashdot.org/comme...
APK
P.S.=> Barb/Tom (whatever, with multiple sockpuppets too http://slashdot.org/~BarbaraHu... = http://slashdot.org/~tomhudson... + http://slashdot.org/~Barbara%2... ) you've destroyed yourself yet again...
...apk
"His only "legend in his own mind" was that he claimed that "his" hosts file could completely secure a windows computer. " - by tomhudson (43916) on Saturday February 12, @11:19AM (#35186644) Homepage Journal FROM -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... in the YEAR 2011 years ago no less
I never claimed a HOSTS file can secure you completely... show me where I have? I want a quote, big talker... you'll never get it, because I never, EVER said that: HOSTS files are, however, a valuable layer of defense for the concept of "layered security".
* You couldn't produce proof THEN, & you certainly can't now (vainly *trying* to put words in my mouth I NEVER ONCE SAID!)
APK
P.S.=> Still @ your LIES, you transsexual weirdo? Ok, asking it again now nearly 5 yrs. later now in response to your bullshit lies again here quoted:
"APK - not only an expert on how the HOSTS file is the best way to secure your computer" - by BarbaraHudson (3785311) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @07:06PM (#47932519) Homepage
Under your NEW sockpuppet account too no less: SEE my challenge to you above - where've I ever said they completely secure you? I never have, liar...
Of course, YOU ARE welcome to disprove my points on them after you said this lately too:
"I tore apart your stupid hosts file crapola." - by BarbaraHudson (3785311) on Tuesday August 19, 2014 @10:46AM (#47703255) Homepage
Oh, really?
Then why'd you run from disproving my points on them giving users added speed, security, reliability & more here too then -> http://tech.slashdot.org/comme... ?
... apk
One of the 1st times "Barb" libeled me stating "APK is a know-nothing that's never worked in the industry" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... in 1 of her numerous sockpuppet fake accounts kept active @ the same time here she uses to upmod herself & downmod opponents she can't get the better of (everyone's onto your games, freak).
Funny part is I've DONE FAR BETTER than ole' "cyclops Frank N. Furter" ever has shown in that exchange too http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , lol!
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Later, he/she kept a journal on me & libeled me even more but worse -> http://slashdot.org/journal/25...
(Typical b.s. to *try* to 'put down' computer "geeks/nerds" saying "I live in a basement with my mommy" etc. when *ANYTHING BUT THAT* is true, considering I am a taxpaying homeowner!).
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* From the dates you can SEE she's kept this up unceasingly since early to mid 2010 no less, & that's only scratching the surface (there's far more).
(Even TELLING OTHERS TO HARASS ME BY ANONYMOUS COWARD POSTS, calling me a "pedo" -> http://news.slashdot.org/comme... )
He/She left in May 2012 after being exposed for ALL OF THAT, but came back with this NEW account of hers, & what started up again (I did *NOT* bother "shim" even once before that)?
You guessed it (more harassment) -> http://tech.slashdot.org/comme...
Where I challenged her for her usual CRAP she always runs from (to validly disprove my points on hosts, which she clearly, cannot):
"I tore apart your stupid hosts file crapola." - by BarbaraHudson (3785311) on Tuesday August 19, 2014 @10:46AM (#47703255) Homepage
Oh, really?
Then why'd you run from disproving my points on them giving users added speed, security, reliability & more here too then -> http://tech.slashdot.org/comme...
APK
P.S.=> Barb/Tom (whatever, with multiple sockpuppets too http://slashdot.org/~BarbaraHu... = http://slashdot.org/~tomhudson... + http://slashdot.org/~Barbara%2... ) you've destroyed yourself yet again...
...apk