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SystemD Gains New Networking Features
jones_supa writes A lot of development work is happening on systemd with just the recent couple of weeks seeing over 200 commits. With the most recent work that has landed, the networkd component has been improved with new features. Among the additions are IP forwarding and masquerading support (patch). This is the minimal support needed and these settings get turned on by default for container network interfaces. Also added was minimal firewall manipulation helpers for systemd's networkd. The firewall manipulation helpers (patch) are used for establishing NAT rules. This support in systemd is provided by libiptc, the library used for communicating with the Linux kernel's Netfilter and changing iptables firewall rulesets. Those wishing to follow systemd development on a daily basis and see what is actually happening under the hood, can keep tabs via the systemd Git viewer.
Christ almighty, this beast is a fucking monster. What's next, a shell and a userland?
Glad I'm heading to FreeBSD. Linux is going down the tubes.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
IP forwarding and masquerading in the init process?
WHAT.
THE.
FUCK!!!!
http://youtu.be/VSbNumR9Z8k
I have no idea what is the set of features they are trying to implement. Not entirely certain it's a finite set.
I remember when people made jokes about SystemD supporting networking. But SystemD wasn't joking.
It still works well enough for me, but I'm really wondering where this is all going.
and have poetterix be its own thing, far away from linux and everything POSIX.
Turn back now. Nothing good can come of this.
I mean come the fuck on, system d. Sheesh.
Back then it was lean and mean, you had to specially compile it for your hardware and make sure it was small enough but once you did it then it was done. This is how I still run LINUX, with specially-built version 1 kernel. You just need to insert the cheap byte CD and type "make xconfigure."
This system D thing? Sorry but this has Obama's fingerprints all over it, no way I will use that. Compile your own kernel and stay away from loadable modules and from System D, it will load a lot faster and you will be pleasant with the results. I still do it that way and there is no looking back.
... piece of crap !
Votez ecolo : Chiez dans l'urne !
systemd seems dead set on becoming an alternative operative system.
Which wouldn't be a bad thing if it wasn't ruining perfectly good operating systems like Debian while it grows.
I've stuck with Debian for a pretty long time (since around 2000) mostly because I know how everything works. But in the last year running testing, more and more frequently I'll find that something has been yanked out and replaced by something harder to use and understand. Maybe it's finally time to switch to BSD instead.
How can we continue to believe in a just universe and freedom to eat crackers if we have no ale?
That must be what they mean, because for the init process have its own personal firewall/router/NAT is just insane.
Right?
Guys?
Why are you looking at me like that?
Y'know, for all it's flaws, warts, and Dice-y-ness, I think it's a good sign that the clickbait here is stuff about systemd.
Seriously - on other websites they'll drive up pageviews by posting something like "This just in: politicians you disagree with are EVIL!! EEEEEEVIIIIIL!".
What whips up the /. crowd into a frothy frenzy? :)
Systemd
Samsung is coming out with a new line of phones that run SystemD instead of Android.
I'm sticking with OpenBSD. At least with that OS, features are well thought out and not jammed into every release because "it's teh l337!"
Trolling is a art,
What the hell is happening to the Linux ecosystem?
I've been a user of it for a couple of decades now. Although it wasn't perfect, for years it provided a better environment for me than Windows or even OS X could provide.
But that's really started to change maybe within the past 5 years. The first major debacle I can think of is GNOME 3. They went out of their way to ignore everything good about GNOME 2, and instead forced all sorts of stupid ideas upon us.
Firefox is the next debacle I can think of. It's a lot like GNOME 3 in many ways. There was a good, reliable, usable browser in Firefox 3.5. Then it all went to hell in Firefox 4 and beyond.
Now we have systemd, which is obviously dumb in pretty much all respects. It just doesn't fit within the Linux ecosystem at all. That's probably why it's so disruptive.
What makes systemd worse, though, is the impact it has had on pretty much all of the major Linux distros. Pretty much all of the most usable and useful ones (sorry, Slackware, this excludes you) have switched to it, with horrible results.
The stability of my Debian testing system has gone down the shitter since they switched to systemd some time ago. I've had more problems properly booting my system in the past six months than I had in the 15 years prior to systemd getting installed.
I'm torn at this point. I'm probably going to buy a Mac and move to OS X for my personal system, while moving all of my servers over to FreeBSD as soon as I can. I'm pretty sure that I'm done with Linux at this point. I just don't think the ecosystem can be salvaged. So much good software has been ruined.
Linux is clearly missing this! Why arent the systemd developers doing something about it?
When the only tool you have is a hammer, every problem is a nail.
Noob coders who simply throw more and more code and "problems" are a perfect example. They don't know when to stop coding up solutions in search of problems.
Systemd devs are a perfect example.
That's what the world is waiting for, a half-assed SMTP server that ships as part of an init system that isn't an init system.
IMAP too!
I'm sure they'll get around to adding Emacs and NetHack functionality to it sooner or later...
I thought lindows was a thing of the past?
Linux is Red Hat's playground. No bucks, no buck rodgers. And the bucks are all coming from Red Hat and companies of that caliber.
They are calling and shots and don't give a rat's ass about computer users. It's all about big computing. You want a real personal computer OS, it's going to have to be either Windows or OSX. For all the crap (most of it deserved) thrown on Microsoft and Apple they are the only 2 companies that tailor their software and OS around users needs. Red Hat doesn't. Suse Enterprise doesn't. Linux in a big way simply doesn't.
Systemd is truly the best thing that has ever happened to the BSD community.
Systemd alone is making Linux totally unsuitable for serious use. So what are people doing when a formerly-stable distro like Debian adopts systemd and becomes a disaster? They're moving to FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD, Dragonfly BSD and PC-BSD.
Just today we find out that DigitalOcean now supports FreeBSD. There's clearly a very bright future ahead for the BSDs.
And it's clear now that Linux is on its way out. While Linux and Linux systems will still be around for some time, of course, everyone important who made Linux great in the past is fleeing from it. We're moving to BSD, because unlike the Linux community, the BSD community does things right. Something like systemd would never be taken seriously by them.
SystemD will be the singularity. Bye Linux, hello *BSDs, since you care about things like real filesystems and proper W^X handling, and don't dick around.
For the love of god, this is insanity. This isn't an init system. This is a secondary kernel. The big danger here is, as functionality is rolled into SystemD, the independent non-SystemD versions stop getting maintained, meaning that SystemD becomes a requirement for everyone.
In Soviet Russia, systemd runs you!
Why do you think this stuff is happening in the init process?
systemd team has interesting ideas about new features and performance improvements that can be achieved with legacy-free and tightly integrated code base for standard UNIX daemons. Once the benefits are proven, it would be easy to pick and choose between simplicity/modularity and performance and some features can be ported to shell-based init. I don't see systemd developers forcing anyone to use the project.
I asked a few months back now, about the possibility of BSD on Digital Ocean due to all of the SystemD shenanigans of late. Got an email notification today that FreeBSD droplets are now available on Digital Ocean. It will be interesting to see if other VPS/Linux providers follow suit.
CB.
Where do you get that idea? There's no IP forwarding and masquerading in the init process. That all happens in the networkd process.
/vmlinuz /boot/bzImage /sbin/systemd /usr/bin/emacs -> /sbin/systemd
You think I'm kidding... Here, in Lennart's own words:
http://0pointer.net/blog/revis...
Actually, as frightening as your summary is, what is described in that post is even more hellish.
It basically goes down the rabbit hole designing around the expectation that a desktop system *should* have a hugely varied set of distribution bits that should be mixed and matched in weird and arbitrary ways that cannot possibly be reasonably maintained. That degree of complexity is completely out of line to try to help a realistically extremely niche use case of massive multiboot.
An argument can be made for increasingly complex stacks of software being somewhat aided, but the docker approach pretty well already has that covered (though a project *really* should carefully consider if they've done something such that a huge mass of independent projects need to work in concert just-so in an unusual combination...). Docker approach already complicates updates to the point of updating the SSL library in an image to be considered an 'anti-pattern' rather than waiting for the image publisher to dish out a whole new image and rebase (I'm pretty sure because the alternative is to admit that docker greatly complicates certain types of updates). This exacerbates that difficult situation many times over for approximately zero incremental benefit...
Now if someone advocates that firefox/chrome should operate inside a unshared namespace by default to mitigate the risk of vulnerabilities in the ever-more-complex web browser code execution ecosystem, then I could get behind that. I think docker can be a convenient approach to prototyping or even production use in very select cases. This post is just an abomination that really by all rights should have people severely question how much influence he should have over a wider portion of a linux distribution.
I really wonder what Bennett Haselton thinks of this.
login to my windowing environment. I can't wait until systemd has its own graphical window manager,etc.
This /is/ under the Purdue of systemd... ha know, because it's all about starting system services. And stuff.
That's the kind of clickbait subjects/headlines Slashdot needs to start using in addition to clickbait topics...
It seems every time I turn around there is yet another system process overwriting my iptables configuration.
These arseholes want a fully backdoored system like their fucking windows shithole cunts.
SystemD is not replacing iptables, all they have done is integrate with iptables. Systemd's approach to configuring init "scripts" is superior (no really, it is) but it means that you can't just issue a straight "iptables -t nat..." command and instead have to call it via IPForwarding=yes and IPMasquerade=yes - unless of course you want to start a script with a unit file but then are you sure that iptables is up? Is the filesystem for the script up?
I don't know why I even bother reading the Slashdot comments about SystemD as they always lack critical thinking and instead prefer to cite hyperbole and FUD.
It annoys me that someone like Poettering, who only had PulseAudio come into use because of the ability distributions had to easily change core operating system components (and wouldn't have had the existing audio-subsystem been entrenched), would then proceed to develop something specifically intended to lock down its own existence and prevent its replacement by something else. It's hypocritical.
While I totally understand why he did it -- nobody wants to put a great amount of time into something only to have it superseded -- it flies in the face of open source in general, where you contribute to an evolving 'thing', and that while your specific contribution may not exist in the future, you can be happy that you took part in the evolution of the whole, and not feel the need to stamp your face on it for perpetuity.
It also sets a dangerous precedent. What's going to be locked down next, in the name of stability, or speed, or whatever else (when it's really about someone trying to 'make their mark'?) Do we lock down the file system? Only one file system for Linux, full stop? Do we lock down the network transports? The window manager? The terminal? The command-line applications?
Then what? Do we then create a global committee, made up of people who maintain the existing components (of course), to make decisions about those components and whatever's left into the future?
I mean, yes, I agree in that case something else will surely (and quickly) rise in Linux's place (I mean, who wants to put in the time to help projects who only exist to serve their creator's vanity) but it seems a shame that Linux should end this way.
> There's no IP forwarding and masquerading in the init process
Not yet.
And never will be. These features will always exist in networkd, not init.
The lead for this was Fedora. RHEL's cycle of 'slurp up fedora' just landed on it lately. This stems from RH erroneously thinking what doesn't miserably fail in Fedora is ok to base their entire enterprise offering around. Ignoring that Fedora's share is shrinking, and RH enterprise base is pretty much the exact opposite of a Fedora user...
Seriously, Redhat, you need to reel your fucking "developer" in.
Divert him to other projects. Fire him. Whatever. But this bullshit needs to stop, and stop NOW.
What the fuck? systemd contains a networkd now? What about NetworkManager (another steaming pile of shit)?
systemd was proposed as a sysvinit replacement. Since then it has gained so much functionality, most of it has not been properly designed nor tested. Nor warranted. Where's the use case for embedding a fucking operating system inside the init system? Who actually wants this shit? And so many changes, for exactly zero net benefit. systemctl has auto completion? Who gives a FUCK when it also shows all of my hardware "units" in the same mother fucking list? Seriously?
Why the FUCK would an init system need a dhcp client? a dns resolver? a network "d" whatever the fuck that means?
Seriously, redhat, you are killing Linux. Everyone is lapping up systemd, and it's a utter fucking disgrace from a bunch of people who should know better.
One thing that has become obvious. Many linux "developers" have throbbing hard ons for their apple hardware and software. They *think* Mac OS X is the be all and end all of unix operating systems.
While stroking their throbbing cocks, they code up shit like gnome 3, systemd, pulseaudio, sssd, and network manager. These fuckers obviously don't use Linux for anything other than a development target, because they clearly don't rely on any linux system to do actual work. For that, they rely on their Apple hardware running the oh-so-lovely OS X. Even sssd is a stupidly designed monolithic piece of puss that has no place on Linux. Nice idea, sure, but nss-pam-ldapd already beat you there, and do it better, and more lightweight.
Really, I'd love to visit fuckers like lennart and kay and see just what the fuck these arse holes use for day to day computing. It's cant be linux, It's not useable for day to day computing tasks - other than to destroy^H^H^H^H^H^H develop Linux.
No, I'm not a anti systemd troll. I am well aware of many problems with Linux. Honestly, Redhat should employ me, pay me the big bucks, and we will turn this shit around. I knew sysvinit was lacking in the 1990s. Sound was lacking with Linux OSS and ALSA to an extend. Networking was pretty good, but could be improved.
- A 19 year veteran of Linux who is dismayed at where linux is heading
captcha: ordinary
That's the kind of clickbait subjects/headlines Slashdot needs to start using in addition to clickbait topics...
"You won't believe these five new functions systemd performs!"
That's the kind of clickbait subjects/headlines Slashdot needs to start using in addition to clickbait topics...
"You won't believe these five new functions systemd performs!"
Sorry, I forgot that listicles usually use digits, so I guess that'd be "You won't believe these 5 new functions systemd performs!".
Wait. What? We were told by reliable sources (internet forums) that the entire 297,192 lines of code all compiled into to one huge binary blob called PID 1.
From the fucking article, fucktard.
for systemd to die. Either systemd will die first, or else it will kill Linux with it.
Why do you think this stuff is happening in the init process?
Because... because... the haters on the interwebs said bleepity-bleep! And haters never lie.
Is there a way to mod an entire article as troll?
TFA is clickbait, you're not supposed to actually read that crap. Where the hell do you think you are? You're going to get eaten by a grue-se.
You might want to read this post from a few years ago when the GNOME and GTK 3.x were replacing thir 2.x branches. Of particular interest is the quotes of Allan Day (GNOME dev and RedHat employee):
So not only is this about enforcing a monoculture, the reason to enforce a monoculture is because the desktop isn't about getting work done. No, the desktop - according to GNOME - is for branding/advertizing.
*sigh*
While we're on the subject, I recommend everybody read this post by the same author. It's speculative, but it does explain a lot of what has been happening to linux over the last few years... and how it may fit into the large picture.
Ce n'est pas une signature automatique.
and my browser is a systemd service
This man found his daughter installing a systemd distro. You won't believe what happened next!
See subject: Worse when disk scattered .ini's especially = more head movement. Registry = an easy front end to use. You're not equating same size files and yes that is moving the goalpost. Text reads have a larger overhead and more complex structure (hence their slowness, which scattering them over the disk will compound, creating even slower reads/writes of them).
From the article:
"With the most recent work that has landed, the networkd component has been improved with new features. "
What are jones_supa amd samzenpus smoking?
See subject: In DOS - Ms had taskswitch via DOSShell. DR-DOS/Novell DOS = cooperative multitasking though. Was better than DOSShell taskswitching. DOS could "mulitask" since the TSR came out for it (Pre-DOS 4.0) per the examples I gave you in print spooling. & yes, TSR's resident + running.
If it ain't pre-emptive, it's not true multi-tasking by BarbaraHudson (3785311) on Wednesday January 14, 2015 @08:08PM (#48815831)
You said if it's not preemptive it's not real? Beg to differ. It is via timeslicing. Still, no preemptive DOS was released to the public (don't need the links to that, it's wrong if it says so) unless it was OS/2's version (a better DOS than DOS and their windows emulation was truly a better windows than windows 3.1). I know this stuff pretty cold. I lived it. Especially the history of it. You have too. You're making mistakes and have forgotten this stuff. You're too quote/source dependent. I'll tear your source up with it if need be since there was no pre-emptively multitasking DOS from MS released to the public. Period.
Christ almighty, this beast is a fucking monster. What's next, a shell and a userland?
No it will expand until it can read mail.
Zawinski's Law of Software Development
“Every program attempts to expand until it can read mail. Those programs which cannot so expand are replaced by ones which can.”
---Saying gnome 3 is better than windows 8 not so much a compliment as it is damning with light praise.
"BarbaraHudson" = larger in text vs. binary. EQUAL DATA read, binary wins vs. text every time. You changing data file sizes involved is moving goalposts. Registry like single containers loaded by the OS into memory (for apps too) is part of why OS/2 shifted to so much registry like data vs. .ini files. Single point of initialization into RAM works for apps too vs. .ini files all over the disk, incurring text file load time (binary or text in registry is already in RAM @ OS startup. Apps that write registry data for initialization gain by this also. No load time needed from disk, data's already in memory, in registry).
Here in slashdot land, where the atheists frolic and play, it has been widely established amongst the cognoscenti that being against the religious choices of the masses (Christianity, Judaism, Islam) is indeed supported by a "natural reason".
What's more, I suspect that the Android/Apple/Windows masses have all selected naturally insecure and incomplete systems for their communication needs, and there exists a "natural reason" NOT to use those if you want real security with encryption etc.
So - being against something is NOT needless.
Of course, you're "free" to have your own choice, but don't be so stuck-up as to refute the easy "natural reasons" that people who don't agree with you may have. That could make you look like an arrogant dick, and you don't want that, do you?
I came here expecting several Peter H.S. epistles, and this time it seems that he is only voting the other cult members! What a let down, at least his rants had facts in them and didn't resort to calling all non-believers haters.
It seems Linux is to be the first OS to require two large kernels running in parallel.
45 5F E1 04 22 CA 29 C4 93 3F 95 05 2B 79 2A B2
Since my embedded box switched to Fedora 20 and systemd, its boot started to fail once in a while.
I still have no clue ehy this is happening, or how to circumvent it. Any googling leads to info pre-dating systemd.
If someone could actually quote me one positive thing about systemd (that I understand & agree), I might not be so
put out by it. But in the few years it seems to have been hanging around, I haven't found such a quote.
Funny thing is, reading this page, I just now learned the same guy who wrote systemd wrote pulse audio. No wonder both
suites of tools give me the same feeling of being lost. Guess I just don't like his way of writing software.
I am not sure which is funnier, that the click monster Phoronix puked up another systemd post on /. or that systemd has Borgified another sub-system.
as the linux community tears itself to shreads.
I've been running it for 20 years from laptops all the way up to servers. Ok, so to install stuff there's usually more manual intervention and you might - gasp! - have to use the tar command occasionally, but other than that its stable, it works, and best of all it doesn't come with the latest trendy rubbish such as systemd. Patrick tends to wait things out and see how they fly rather than including something because of the Oooo! Shiny!! mentality that other dists seem to follow.
I'm sorry, your argument doesn't fly.
Any pointers to documentation about setting up a handmade router/firewall/samba server thingy?
Metastasization Continues Unchecked.
You fuckin neckbeards
All that matters to me about SystemD is:
Does it work?
Does it get in the way of anything I'm actually doing on my computer?
Answer 1: Yes
Answer 2: No
Other than that I couldn't give a flying monkey toss what it does or how it does it, or what philosophical problems it may have etc. etc.
What stuns me is that Linus still doesn't seem to give a care, even as the very ground under his feet erodes into thin air.
I wish it never existed because it's causing more friction and trouble in the Linux ecosystem then problem solving. I mean honestly the political bull this project has generated makes me really wonder if it's worth the effort for the problem it's trying to solve while alienating so many people.
And i mean it....
"I tore apart your stupid hosts file crapola." - by BarbaraHudson (3785311) on Tuesday August 19, 2014 @10:46AM (#47703255)
Where? You RAN from trying recently -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... & you're FAIRLY given the opportunity to make good on those words of yours - you downmodded (via your many sockpuppets) & ran, lol, after your wise-ass comment on hosts here JUST before that challenge -> http://tech.slashdot.org/comme... quoted next below:
---
"scans multiple forums repeatedly to troll his crappy HOSTS file " - by BarbaraHudson (3785311) on Sunday January 04, 2015 @11:58AM (#48730581) from http://tech.slashdot.org/comme...
I only post on them where they apply (or confronting naysayers like you). Prove otherwise!
(Oh, that's right - you're NOT BIG ON PROOF, are you? See below next...)
---
"His only "legend in his own mind" was that he claimed that "his" hosts file could completely secure a windows computer. " - by tomhudson (43916) on Saturday February 12, @11:19AM (#35186644)
Where did I even *once* claim hosts completely secure a computer? Hosts are, however, the BEST single tool for more speed, security, reliability, & more. Prove otherwise.
Putting words in my mouth I never stated != truth, or a good argument on YOUR part. You RAN from that too!
---
"Who has independently vetted it?" - by BarbaraHudson (3785311) on Tuesday August 19, 2014 @10:46AM (#47703255)
You tried to say it's malware/spyware too - guess what:
Answer = The BEST in the security antimalware & antispyware business currently, http://www.av-test.org/en/news... per that VERY recent test's results, who also host & RECOMMEND my program for hosts, is who -> http://hosts-file.net/?s=Downl... (Malwarebytes' hpHosts)
* You've done better? No... lol!
APK
P.S.=> You fail: "Eat your words, Forrest" & you told others to stalk/harass me by ac posts as YOU YOURSELF do, unceasingly, for years http://slashdot.org/comments.p...
... apk
BarbaraHudson stalks me by ac posts & is quoted doing so http://slashdot.org/comments.p... & her "so-called 'point'" vs. hosts = b.s. (in a 'journal' - not publicly since she KNOWS they're bullshit):
"We don't need to use a hosts file to block ads (adblock does it better)" - by BarbaraHudson (3785311) on Sunday September 21, 2014 @02:09PM FROM-> http://slashdot.org/comments.p...
To THAT b.s. I point out how NOT BETTER it is, tearing up 4++gb of RAM & flooring CPU too -> https://blog.mozilla.org/nneth...
+
By default (since advertisers KNOW most folks using "Almost ALL Ads Blocked" won't change that) adblock's PAID OFF NOT TO DO ITS JOB FULLY -> http://techcrunch.com/2013/07/...
ClarityRay's also DESTROYING AdBlock but it's NOT ABLE TO DO THAT to custom hosts files.
---
* BarbaraHudson's *trying* to tell us that Adblock's vastly inferior abilities + chewing up resources LIKE MAD is "superior" to hosts?? Please... lol!
(Hosts do all of what adblock does, + FAR more - with less!)
APK
P.S.=> Facts above vs. BarbaraHudson's fictions & the FACT BarbaraHudson CANNOT DISPROVE that hosts do more w/ LESS, & far, Far, FAR MORE for added speed, security, reliability, + even anonymity (to an extent) vs. adblock
&
That hosts fix DNS security issues in DNS amplification attacks, DNS being downed, DNS being redirect poisoned etc. - et al as well!
Fact: NO SINGLE SOLUTION does more & w/ less, period/fact, for all those points of mine here BarbaraHudson sockpuppet downmodded & RAN from -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... like the troll & multiple account using sockpuppeteer he/she is... apk
1. "What the hell is with these new commands? Great, now I have to learn a whole new way of administration cause people had to change something that was never broken."
2. "Where's all the init files? How am I supposed to configure anything? I don't have time for this..."
3. "Everything is done with service descriptors? Okay..."
4. "So wait, I no longer have to write massive shell scripts that manage the entire process lifecycle, or scour google in the hope that someone else has already written said script so I don't have to?"
5. "Wow, I never realized how much I hated dealing with init scripts until I didn't have to anymore. This is SO much cleaner!"
6. "Whoa, I can monitor and control entire *heirarchies* of dependant services from one command? That's pretty damn slick..."
I still don't completely understand systemd, but now that I'm getting a handle on it, I find it conceptually and functionally cleaner, and more rigorous than the old init system. The downsides are that it's new and therefore has a learning curve, and that it blackboxes the actual service controller which is going to piss off anyone with an ounce of control-freakery in them.
WOW, 400+ comments on this post and only eleven of them show up!!! That must have escalated quickly.
If you want a giant proprietary goo ball that does everything. If you have such deep contempt for POSIX, the UNIX philosophy, and "UNIX grey beards." If you want a system where you will be vendor-locked by one company. Then that is all just fine: go with Microsoft, and be happy. Why are you even tinkering with Linux? Please: go away and leave the real UNIX/Linux people alone.
"Binary is faster." http://stackoverflow.com/quest... than text files (which is an advantage of the registry, storing more than just text data, but all types) and again you have load from disk time with .ini files to even use them. A private ini for an app is not in ram from bootup onward. The registry is. You don't with the registry for the OS and apps that use it. The registry's already in RAM from OS bootup onward, indexed read too (better speed alone right there). You've also got the security of knowing the registry is mirrored during operations (protected by journalling NTFS filesystem too) and during backups (for restorations if need). Those are some spots you've failed in.
Post below explains it well:
From "SystemD Abomination"
Subject Vested interest in control. RedHat and SystemD
Date Mon, 17 Nov 2014 04:40:08 +0100
by beaverdownunder:
It should be obvious to anyone that RedHat has a vested interest in making the vast majority of Linux distributions dependent on technology it controls. Linux is its bread-and-butter.
It appears RedHat has realised that, through systemd, it can readily provide preferential support for its own projects, and place roadblocks up for projects it does not control, thus extending its influence broadly and quickly. By using tenuous dependencies amongst its own projects it can speed adoption even faster.
Once it has significant influence, and the maintainers of competing projects have drifted away either out of frustration or because they are starved of oxygen, RedHat knows that they can effectively take Linux closed-source by restricting access to documentation and fighting changes that are not in their own best interests.
At this point, they can market themselves as the only rational choice for corporate Linux support -- and this would be perfectly reasonable because they would have effective control of the ecosystem.
Linux (as in a full OS implementation) is an extremely complex beast and you can't just "fork it" and start your own 'distro' from scratch anymore -- you would have to leverage a small army to do it, then keep that army to maintain it. It's just not practical.
At the same time, Linux has matured to the point of attaining some measure of corporate credibility, and from RedHat's point of view, it no longer needs its 'open source' roots to remain viable. RedHat also, understandably, fears potential competition.
Through systemd and subsequent takeovers of other ecosystem components, RedHat can leverage its own position while stifling potential competition -- this is a best-case scenario for any corporation. It will have an advantage in the marketplace, potential customers will recognise that advantage, and buy its products and support contracts.
I hope you can understand why many see this as an extremely compelling case. Arguing that RedHat has 'ethics' and would 'never do such a thing' is immature and silly -- RedHat is a corporation, it exists to profit from its opportunities, just like any other company. To attempt to argue that it would not do so is contrary to what we can assume is its default state.
It's no 'conspiracy theory' to assume that a corporation will behave like a corporation; arguing that it is just makes one look like a naive child. systemd is one large step toward RedHat gaining the ability to reap what it has sewn -- for its benefit and not necessarily ours.
To be honest, I appreciate what GNOME set out to accomplish with v3. One of the great things about Linux is we have options for everything (well, soon, everything except the init manager...fuck systemd). So you can choose what window manager you want to use. But why compete for the same user base?
You already have KDE going for the power user who wants complete customization of every little scrap of screen space. And if you want something lightweight there's XFCE. What Linux was lacking is a simple, clean, and consistent interface. What people like about Windows or OSX is that it's all the same. You can sit down at any windows PC (except 8, but we know what a disaster that is) and be able to find your way around if you've ever used another windows PC. If you're trying to actually manifest the Year of the Linux Desktop, you kind of need something like that. And that's what GNOME 3 is. They take away customization to focus on doing the fewer things that they do well and cleanly.
I got both my grandfather and my wife's grandmother on Linux after they got sick of the viruses and malware on Windows. For them I installed Mint with Cinnamon, which is based on GNOME 3. My grandfather is not completely computer literate. My wife's grandmother is a disaster. Both of them were able to navigate their way through Cinnamon just fine. They've been using it for going on 4 months now and I've had exactly 2 tech support calls. GNOME 3 and its derivatives are great for non-savvy users like them, and I thank the devs for delivering a product like that.
Now, I'm in the "optimize every pixel" crowd, so I run KDE. But I'm glad GNOME 3 exists because they serve a different need, and there's room for both.
Systemd on the other hand, is a damn virus that is taking everything over and shoving worthwhile alternatives out. It can burn in hell.
We don't have a state-run media we have a media-run state.
AC wrote: "Just imagine a Beowulf cluster of these :)"
A 21st century issue: the irony of technologies of abundance in the hands of those still thinking in terms of scarcity.