Slashdot Mirror
FB Reveals Woeful Diversity Numbers
theodp writes: There's more work to do," said Facebook's Global Director of Diversity Maxine Williams, who issued a straight-out-of-How-to-Lie-With-Statistics diversity update on Thursday that essentially consisted of a handful of bar charts labeled with only percentages for select measures of the social networking giant's current demographics. In search of real numbers, the Guardian turned to Facebook's most recent Equal Employment Opportunity report filing, which showed that the ranks of black employees swelled by a grand total of seven (7) (1 woman) in the year covered by the filing, during which time Facebook saw an overall headcount increase of 1,231. Comparing Facebook's new bar charts of US tech employees to those issued last year shows the proportion of Hispanic and Black employees remained flat at 3% and 1% respectively, while a decline in the proportion of white employees from 53% to 51% was offset by an increase in the proportion of Asian employees from 41% to 43%.
I wonder what the demographic breakdown of people who actually apply for jobs at FB looks like? Comparing the two would be a more valid way of looking at it.
Watch that show Silicon Valley and see how many black people are in there. I wonder if the creators of the show do that on purpose or if it's unconscious?
So under-representation of BMEs and women in large tech company is the symptom. What we need to understand is the cause. Encouraging companies like FaceBook to address the issue is one approach and given their resources one that might bring about change. Perhaps Facebook could target bright kids in certain communities with fellowships and the like - try and encourage more to engage in a tech career?
Yes, there's too many of those pesky white workers. Need to get rid of some in the name of "diversity". White genocide extends to the workplace apparently, not just the broader community.
And WTH is a " Global Director of Diversity" ??!! It's most ridiculous title I've ever heard of.
How is being able to turn your profile picture into a rainbow NOT diverse???
Free, as in your money being freed from the confines of your account.
Asians make up less than 6% of the population according to Google, whereas blacks are 13%. Yet the former are over 40% of the company at Facebook. If Facebook were to be made to "look like America" then a significant percentage of its labor force would have to be laid off.
There's nothing "woeful" about these numbers. They tell us nothing about qualified black and Hispanic candidates not getting jobs. Given the interest in diversity, it's perfectly reasonable to rule out the probability that there were any because the interest in diversity would have almost invariably lead to them being given hiring priority if they applied.
Identity Politics is a cancer and it is eating this industry, this site, and entire geekdoms from the inside.
We have to start imposing minimal conditions for entry. Performing long multiplication or knowing how to read off resistor values. This madness has to end before we are all consumed.
Heavens forbid that the best candidates are picked! Oh the horror!
And of course if there's a vastly smaller pool of minority and women applicants, that's the employer's fault as well! Maybe we could force them to pay to educate then train minority/women parolees and force them to hire them! That will assure private data stays private! /s*
Strat
*I find it rather tragic that Western culture and society has devolved so far into reactionary mob-rule that a 'sarc' tag is necessary. We used to have these things called Rule of Law and individual liberty coupled with individual responsibility. No more, apparently.
Progressivism (aka US 'Liberalism'): Ideas so good they need a police/surveillance-state to enforce.
Apparently, Facebook outsources a lot of its moderation tasks, via a Mechanical Turk like system, to whatever grim hellhole is cheapest; but still has internet access.
I suspect that they could...impressively boost...their diversity numbers if they were just able to find a way of counting those as 'employees' without actually paying them more. The effect would probably be even stronger than any benefit Apple gets from including their retail sales/support minions in the numbers.
Anyone arguing that a quotia is needed for equality dislikes freedom.
The company is 51% white, barely over half. They are making progressat a rate of 2% per year, if the goal is to be "less white" . How fast can a company change with Facebook's attrition and growth rate? 49% asian includes a several ethnic phenotype. Grouping them together makes it look like a monolithic block when in fact it probably means large pools of Indian or Chinese ancestor employees. Would facebook look more diverse with a finer breakdown?
:-(
Certain groups, who are under represented in engineering colleges, are also underrepresented in their employee pool. Facebook could do "fake" diversity like a lot of companies where HR, facilities and non-tech jobs are disproportionately black and Hispanic. It would help them make their public numbers without actually creating oportunities
I think the question is not 'is there a problem?' but 'is it Facebook's problem, or is something else picking them off earlier in the production chain such that Facebook's hiring is simply an accurate representation of the candidates it has to work with?'
Facebook is large enough that it has probably outgrown the most blatant 'Our hiring process is that you were the CEO's frat bro at Stanford, bro.' school of startup HR; but the question remains whether they've gone slightly more subtle, or whether they are even-handedly hiring from a field that, for reasons not under their control, has basically nothing to choose from if you are looking for a 'diversity' hire.
Either way there arguably exists a problem; but assuming that it's all facebook's fault is way easier than addressing the fact that, with rare exceptions, there's a pretty yawning gulf between a good American education and a lousy one.
You are kidding right? Do you really question if it might be true that only 1 in 1,231 candidates would be qualified women? Seriously?
Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
I generally dismiss this kind of demographics because we know that in generally certain races have more opportunity in certain fields of employment then others.
You can talk all day long about equal diversity but you have to have qualified candidates for jobs. If those people you lack in diversity don't obtain the needed job skills. They won't be able to apply for a job. This is what is wrong with America, we focus too much on the wrongs things. Education is NOT diverse in the least. In plays favorites and especially in high technology fields where poor Black schools have much less technology then wealthy. We have a Black President but he is not the norm and he has done nothing but give inspiring speeches to gain votes from the Black community. He has done nothing for American equalization of our schools no matter where they are. Forcing things like standardized curriculum like common core does little to affect diversity I technology. The you have people like Zuckerburg who spend little to help this but wants to focus on education outside of the US. Facebook is another liberal hypocrite.
Facebook offices are located in the area populated by mostly white or asian residents. If you look at census data for San Mateo county it will not be hard to see that facebook diversity number closely follow demographics of college graduates for that live in that area.
Look: I graduated from high school in 1985- far before the intarwebs were cool. I was a geek because I *wanted* to be, societal pressures notwithstanding.
I was bullied on a daily basis. The source of the majority of this bullying was blacks. An Asian friend of mine, years later- in college- mused about his similar experience.
I guess this can go two ways:
1. Black culture can finally start to view academic accomplishment as "cool".
Or:
2. Black culture can realize that the smart kids are in charge, and they'd better adapt or learn to enjoy life in the hip-hop ghetto they've made.
Sorry. Not my monkeys, not my circus, not my problem.
This is what white privilege and racism look like in America at all tech companies.
At a time when affirmative action has been shot down by white crying about anti white discrimination.
The USA is a country that wants it both ways, to be both deeply racially biased and yet be able to blithely refuse to hire minority candidates.
Oh, wait, that is just one-way.
2. Black culture can realize that the smart kids are in charge, and they'd better adapt or learn to enjoy life in the hip-hop ghetto they've made.
Black culture is largely a deliberately created phenomenon. Much of what you think of as modern black culture was actually guided and shaped by whites. While there are many black labels now, what music was produced was formerly controlled by whites. Which movies get made is still largely controlled by whites. The laws regarding private prisons are largely written and passed by whites. You want to blame everything wrong with black culture on the blacks but forgetting about slavery and ongoing, deliberate oppression which continues to this day is more than a bit disingenuous, isn't it? It's ignorant at best, and more than a little racist.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Couldn't really be much more on topic than discussing how we got here. Obviously some racist cowards don't want to take responsibility for their share of how the world turned out. They think you can just shit on people forever and there won't be any shit on them.
God damn this site is broken by design.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
I would find it extremely surprising, though more extremely surprising for some areas of their workforce than for others. However, the 1 woman figure is among new black employees only(of which there were only 7); not new employees workforce wide, for which TFA doesn't give a number; but provides some percentages indicating a modest increase in proportion of female workforce.
My suspicion is that facebook is doing some "good cultural fit" selection; but 1 black woman, of 7 black hires, is much more plausible than 1 woman, of 1,231 hires.
They have way too many black men in there, it's time we send more white women to jail.
If there's some Great White Conspiracy to keep the black man down, neither I nor anyone I know are part of it. Indeed, all my cohorts (including the black ones) say the same thing- something along the lines of, "Shut up, raise your kids well, buy your beer, and don't annoy your neighbors". I don't know what's so groundbreaking about that.
I also notice that you've focussed on my second point, while ignoring the first. Care to comment? I have intimate experience, as well as reading about it all over the place- it's not a melanin thing. Black people come to the US from all over the world and do well. It's US black culture that is to blame.
Furthermore, you whipped out the "racist" card, so here we go: shut up and behave. This may take a while to result in change... but isn't this what everyone should be doing anyway?
It rather about the most stupid thing you can do, because it may obscure problems, making them _harder_ to see and solve. That is if there actually is a problem. Fixing the statistic may well cause problems where there were none before.
This is an instance of the classical cause-end-effect reversal mistake that stupid people are so likely to do. It requires intelligence low enough to not understand the difference between an implication and an equivalence. Correlation is not causation, and it is _never_ causation if it is correlation with a statistic, because a statistic is _always_ derived and the correlation is a pure result of that. Fixing the statistic fixes nothing.
Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
Ellis Cashmore, is that you?
http://www.amazon.com/Black-Cu...
Diversity metrics are bullshit anyways. The people that I know who were hired by Facebook were Jewish, a group that, while having white-ish skin, is just as discriminated against as blacks are.
But is that taken into consideration? Humankind isn't divided into white, asian, hispanic, and black.
while(1) attack(People.Sandy);
Robert Louis Stevenson describes the White attitude towards Asians in his book "Across the Plains", his account of a train journey in America. Based on his telling, I expect that vigorous affirmative action is needed to uplift such a downtrodden ethic group.
"Despised Races
Of all stupid ill-feelings, the sentiment of my fellow Caucasians towards our companions in the Chinese car was the most stupid and the worst. They seemed never to have looked at them, listened to them, or thought of them, but hated them a priori. The Mongols were their enemies in that cruel and treacherous battle-field of money. They could work better and cheaper in half a hundred industries, and hence there was no calumny too idle for the Caucasians to repeat, and even to believe. They declared them hideous vermin, and affected a kind of choking in the throat when they beheld them. Now, as a matter of fact, the young Chinese man is so like a large class of European women, that on raising my head and suddenly catching sight of one at a considerable distance, I have for an instant been deceived by the resemblance. I do not say it is the most attractive class of our women, but for all that many a man’s wife is less pleasantly favoured. Again, my emigrants declared that the Chinese were dirty. I cannot say they were clean, for that was impossible upon the journey; but in their efforts after cleanliness they put the rest of us to shame. We all pigged and stewed in one infamy, wet our hands and faces for half a minute daily on the platform, and were unashamed. But the Chinese never lost an opportunity, and you would see them washing their feet—an act not dreamed of among ourselves—and going as far as decency permitted to wash their whole bodies. I may remark by the way that the dirtier people are in their persons the more delicate is their sense of modesty. A clean man strips in a crowded boathouse; but he who is unwashed slinks in and out of bed without uncovering an inch of skin. Lastly, these very foul and malodorous Caucasians entertained the surprising illusion that it was the Chinese waggon, and that alone, which stank. I have said already that it was the exceptions and notably the freshest of the three.
These judgments are typical of the feeling in all Western America. The Chinese are considered stupid, because they are imperfectly acquainted with English. They are held to be base, because their dexterity and frugality enable them to underbid the lazy, luxurious Caucasian. They are said to be thieves; I am sure they have no monopoly of that. They are called cruel; the Anglo-Saxon and the cheerful Irishman may each reflect before he bears the accusation. I am told, again, that they are of the race of river pirates, and belong to the most despised and dangerous class in the Celestial Empire. But if this be so, what remarkable pirates have we here! and what must be the virtues, the industry, the education, and the intelligence of their superiors at home!"
Prove anything by multiplying Huge Number times Tiny Number
For a public traded company management has a responsibility to maximize shareholder value, nothing more.
Look: I graduated from high school in 1985- far before the intarwebs were cool. I was a geek because I *wanted* to be, societal pressures notwithstanding.
I was bullied on a daily basis. The source of the majority of this bullying was blacks. An Asian friend of mine, years later- in college- mused about his similar experience.
And there is the problem: Quite a few blacks are racist as hell and think they are somehow superior to other races. As a result, they refuse to participate in "white" culture and that gives a significant educational disadvantage. This is of course an idea that is utterly politically incorrect, but a look at the actual facts is quite revealing. I seriously doubt there is any hiring bias, also because the snubbed candidates would sue the pants of the companies doing that. I do not see that happening at all. Hence it must be that the qualified black candidates are not there.
A similar thing is happening with women in tech. Quite revealing, there is a lot of open sexism in that "discussion". As it is misandrism (hate of men), it is somehow acceptable. But give even a hint of potential misogynism and get crucified.
These diversity number concerns are political correct nonsense and truly irrelevant. FB and any business should hire based on ability, not race, religion, sex or other nonsense.
Lol [citation needed]
If we're going to strike a pose of moral outrage when a company's employee demographics don't match closely enough the general population demographics, are we going to cry 'injustice' if their numbers climb too high? Ie if African-Americans are 16% of the population, will we complain if they reach 24% of the Facebook employee roster?
Why do we care?
In 2015 do we really believe that some Snidely-Whiplash HR person is rubbing their hands together and cackling while they shred all the valid applications from blacks and other minorities?
-Styopa
Given that Zuck is constantly begging for most H1Bs, I strongly suspect that this is a ploy to open the "expendable imported labor" tap a little wider.
"Oh me! Oh my! My company lacks diversity! If only there were a place with millions and millions of 'minority' developers that we could hire (at below-market wages and working conditions, teehee) to balance things out!"
What I can't figure out is why MBA types assume software developers are too stupid to see right through bullshit like this. Just because we don't like to play the ass-kissing, office-politicking game doesn't mean we don't recognize all the moves...
An honest question: Is there anybody out there who reads this, of any race, who sees:
FB Reveals Woeful Diversity Numbers
And thinks, "Gosh! They're missing out on all the benefits of diversity! Poor Facebook!"
Or do they think, "They are being racist and need to do more."
Which is not what diversity is about. That's what Equal Opportunity and Affirmative Action are about.
(-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
FB is a pile of manure anyway.
Some professions attract certain kinds of people. Where I used to live almost all restaurants were run by Greek men. Where I now live, all donut shops are run by Cambodians and the taco shops are run by hispanics. The hospitals here vary- some have mostly black staffs, some mostly Filipino and all mostly female. In Los Angeles, I'm told, the garbage industry is monopolized by Armenians. When I worked for Volkswagen in Chicago, over 90% of the technical employees were German, the rest were Austrian (not one female employee). The sales staff were all American.
Should we force all these industries to diversify? They are that way because people made individual choices that created the flavor of each industry. If those choices lead to business success and employee bliss, so be it. I'd say that they are proof that the US is the most diversified nation on earth.
...omphaloskepsis often...
If there's some Great White Conspiracy to keep the black man down, neither I nor anyone I know are part of it.
There isn't, the problems are more subtle than that. It's been discussed a hundred times here, can we please move on from having to repeat the basics every single time?
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
Anecdotal, but interesting to note your examples are from other countries, both of which don't have much opportunity. Recognizing that and coming to the US was seen as "the land of opportunity" for them, yet many here don't see it that way. Why is that?
This issue is a bit more complicated than you think.
So a bunch of mostly white guys was the group that was interested in making Facebook. Their product is used by people world wide and they work to make the product not discriminate. I wonder how many women and minority applications they get vs how many of those application do not qualify. I'm not seeing the problem.
And how do we measure the definition of minority? In Los Angeles, as a white guy, I'm a minority.
Equal numbers of other people do not have the skills.
really, if you idiots don't stop harping on this issue, the only way they're going to improve those numbers is by replacing half their employees with Indians. There you go... company is now full of brown people. Happy now? Because now no one has a job.
Look, you can't compare straight population numbers with how many people are hired in given professions. You have to consider graduates from the colleges that have the required degrees or get some sort of baseline as to what portion of the population would be qualified to do the work.
THEN you can compare the numbers.
Simply taking the general census data and then comparing the numbers is what someone that doesn't understand statistics would do. And reporting the study without irony merely means everyone that took the study seriously doesn't understand how statistics work.
I've decided to stop wasting my time responding to AC trolls/sockpuppets... so if you want a response from me... login.
that diversity isn't all that out masters would have it to be?
We have an every other hire must not be a white male [policy?]
Wow, so it's a good thing that in today's PC society, I can "identify" as a 28 year old female of color, with 30 years of industry experience the next time I apply for a job. That will increase my chances, because, as a 50 something year old white guy, I am screwed.
This issue is a bit more complicated than you think.
A few years back there was a similar topic, except they had some numbers, I'm going to use 10% to represent whatever number it was.
Facebook only had 10% of its workforce as women. Facebook primarily hires people with CS backgrounds. Only 10% of graduates with a CS background are women, only 10% of people applying for CS are women.
It seems obvious to me that if only 10% of people who qualify are women, then 10% is an expected value. I assume similar things with minorities in general.
I like how Asians are simply assigned Honorary White People status when they don't fit the narrative.
If there's some Great White Conspiracy to keep the black man down, neither I nor anyone I know are part of it.
First, I didn't allege any such conspiracy, so you're attacking a straw man. Second, if were such a conspiracy, you'd be doing a fine job of helping it along even without knowledge.
Indeed, all my cohorts (including the black ones)
Ah, the appeal to authority, and it's false authority as well.
Black people come to the US from all over the world and do well. It's US black culture that is to blame.
You want me to address your comment while ignoring mine? That's still a created situation. What you say here does not detract from my point in the least. That's why I didn't mention it; it's not relevant.
Furthermore, you whipped out the "racist" card, so here we go: shut up and behave.
And I quote: Fuck you, I won't do what you tell me, motherfucker.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Here is what I found on Wikipedia:
"White Americans are the racial majority, with a 77.7% share of the U.S. population. Hispanic and Latino Americans amount to 17.1% of the population, making up the largest minority. African Americans are the largest racial minority, amounting to 13.2% of the population."
So, African-americans are 13.2% of the population.
http://fivethirtyeight.com/fea...
Roughly 39% that go to college, graduate (and this is out of the percentage that actually go in the first place). So it makes sense that Tech companies, no matter how racially diverse, are hiring less African-Americans. Even if 100% went to college, they would still be only a fraction of the workforce, if completely represented.
We need to get to the root of the problem instead of focus on the symptoms. Symptoms have been focused on for many years (affirmative action, etc) and it doesn't seem to be working. What needs to happen is in the home and I don't think the government can really do anything about it.
http://www.politifact.com/trut...
72% of African-american children are born out of wedlock.
"Estimates for the percentage of African-American children growing up in single-parent households are slightly lower, at 67 percent"
I was talking about this to my girlfriend who is a dental assistant and I explained it this way. I first asked her how many male dental assistants she has worked with in her 10 years or so of working in that field. She said two, both gay. I then asked her what she would do if the media / government suddenly insisted that she hates men since there aren't any on the job and that she had better bring that up to a 50% ratio quickly. I asked her what she would do. She said that there wasn't any way, men didn't apply for the job. That made my point. I have another family member who is a speech pathologist, same issue - no men apply. Until these cases are addressed this is just another witch hunt.
but diversity is weakness for Labor. A workplace divided by race and gender cannot unite against management
posting at http://leftistconservative.blogspot.com
I'm black and I don't know a single person that talks like that. Not among my family, friends, or acquaintances. I do encounter this stereotype quite frequently on television, music and on the internet though.
I'm not saying there aren't people who think like that. But that it's not as common way of think as rap videos and off-hand comments would lead you to believe.
E.g. How many of these people you overheard were actually being serious? And not making fun of the stereotype?
There seems to be the belief among many of you that companies hire the best candidates. In turn, when those hired are white males, it seems to reinforce (ridiculous) stereotypes about women and minorities. There is research that demonstrates the biases that exist in hiring and how it affects many different groups, but in particular women, minorities, those from poorer demographic groups, and older workers. For an overview, look at this New York Times opinion piece; following some of the references might be enlightening. Some of you might view the entrance of startups into this area as proof that something is going on.
75% of the country is white. FB is obviously doing a very good job of attracting non-white employees--they are [in fact] over-represented by a significant margin.
Hiring a diverse team is not at odds with hiring the best fit for the job. Your quote assumes that the reason for the lack of black candidates is irrelevant, or at least should not be investigated by by hiring organizations.
No one is suggesting hiring workers who can't do the job. That would be silly. Rather, it's important for us to quantify the lack hires, and investigate the problem in general. This is science after all right?
Oh, should we resign to "it doesn't matter since tech is a perfect meritocracy?"
Include the immigrant dimension in those statistics and it makes a lot more sense. The Asian group includes Indian natives and other immigrant populations that have cultural norms very different then native populations.
Immigrants, regardless of race, have different rates of starting businesses, pursuing higher education and career in general.
For an accurate comparison you may have weed out 1st and 2nd generation immigrants to get a clearer racial comparison.
I have many relatives and friends in law enforcement, from local to the federal level. This has been a topic of discussion for 30 years. Many, many minorities apply for law enforcement positions – the problem is passing the background test. The job requires a secret clearance level. Perfect credit, no arrests, college graduate - very few African American’s pass the background check. You can’t even bounce a check once you’re hired. Look at the low rates of graduation and high rates of incarceration for the African American community, it all skews against Federal law enforcement.
The reality is the Feds would love minorities in investigation positions. Street experience and the ability to interact with criminals and/or look the part is critical for sting operations.
There’s also a cultural problem with millennials. I was talking with a recruiter (as a friend, not perspective employment), he’s in his late 40’s and was describing how the millennial attitude makes it difficult for millennials to get hired. Generally speaking, there’s a lack of determination, mental toughness and focus needed for any level of law enforcement that many millennials just don’t have. Even those who get hired have 90% washout rate .
maybe they should consider that the target demographic just doesn't want that kind of work...
nascar tried diversity.. failed.
i see cities trying diversity hiring just to get their numbers. usually fails, while positions go unfilled and plenty of otherwise qualified workers are turned down.
should be best person for the job. period.
Is that Asians are a minority.
Anyone? Anyone?
So if we're saying 43% of Facebooks workforce is a minority (asians) then the problem is because they aren't the 'right' type of minority? Diversity is a misnomer. Just because they list 43% as asians, this would include, chinese, taiwanese, koreans, indians, japanese, pakistanis, thais, singaporeans, malaysians, etc. There is no homogenous 'asian' group so there definitely is diversity, just not official government sanctioned diversity.
From Wikipedia: "the NBA in 2011 was composed of 78 percent black players, 17 percent white players, four percent Latinos (of any race), and one percent Asian."
That doesn't reflect the population levels of the United States. It's pretty clear that the NBA needs to work on its diversity to increase the numbers of Asian, Latino, and White players.
If you bring this up to any of the so-called diversity advocates and they call you a racist or something, know that they are disingenuous little fucks. If they actually cared about diversity, they'd apply it to everything. It's really about helping the groups they think deserve it (and Asians don't count).
Why is it always that race and gender issues get all the "diversity" attention. There are ten other Protected Classes (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protected_class). Why is all the attention always given to just those two favorite classes? What about the rest of us?
The problem with society or government pressuring everything to be equally diverse is that it actually regenerates racism/sexism all over again long term. If a bunch of race X or gender Y lose out on jobs (likely male, whites), and others are cherry picked to get the jobs instead, it creates anger and resentment.
Discrimination whether for good reasons or bad reasons just begets more discrimination. If you exercise a muscle it gets stronger.
If people are actively being oppressed from getting jobs, that's one thing, but that typically isn't the case here. Imagine if every company needed to have exactly equal portions of every race or nationality. "Shit we better up our hiring efforts in Haiti with a $5,000,000 budget 'cause we still can't get one."
It's all stupid and futile, and long term it's going to backfire.
Further, most people that get treated as a charity case resent it too. Do you think the only African American C student that applied would be thrilled to learn that he was only hired because of racial quotas? There creates no loyalty there and it sets the complete opposite precedent. It also harbors resentment.
I'm a white male electrical engineer who has been successful on some major projects with my company.
I was passed up for a promotion to a senior engineering position (not management) so the company could hire a female engineer from outside the company. This new hire was reading 20 as "twenty horseshoe?" and didn't have anything approaching an understanding of electrical engineering principles.
I wonder what the demographic breakdown of people who actually apply for jobs at FB looks like? Comparing the two would be a more valid way of looking at it.
Here's the thing, many companies outsource their applications and screening process to other companies. I see it all the time when I got to BigCorp.com and get sent to some other site to fill out an application. And a few times they wanted information that I couldn't or sometimes wouldn't supply (like date of birth!!) and get rejected from the system.
Or if you are applying for your third job - where you have only two management references - and the application demands three.
And I do not trust the automated application systems because in this day and age, with just your name a SSN, or DOB or address - one can find out just about ANYTHING about someone.
And I like to add that there are some companies that don't outsource their application systems and do similar shit.
So, unless every applicant gets through the automated application and screening system, those numbers will be invalid.
These same so-called diversity advocates will point out by those same metrics that in the NBA there are not enough black coaches (or in the NFL coaches/quarterbacks) while the irony meter explodes in the background.
And the prevailing liberal arts rationalizations have been rebuked every time. Come up with another defense or move on.
If something is so "subtle" that they are directly immeasurable, perhaps it is time to put that in the bin with the ideas of aether, spirits, and other magic.
Forcing diversity only makes the problem worse. Never mind that the survey also indicated a potential offset of citizens with non-citizens.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
Yes, "black culture" is "largely deliberately created" - that's definitely true.
But if you think it's a great white consipiracy to "keep da niggas in their place", you're not thinking straight. It's about what every other conspiracy in America is about: making money.
You make money by selling shit. You sell shit by persuading people that they need to buy it. And you do that by segregating your potential market so that you can target its component parts more easily and directly. It's really that simple. Music and fashions - to take the most obvious examples - are marketed to black people, not to keep them down, but to sell more music and clothes.
You don't like it? Me either. So don't buy it, and persuade your peers to do likewise. Don't try to make it illegal - that won't work. Make it unprofitable.
If something is so "subtle" that they are directly immeasurable,
There's nothing subtle or immeasurable about blacks being more highly targeted by law enforcement, courts, and the penal system than whites, and this leading to a general downward spiral in their quality of life; or in how blacks were property, and then were effectively prohibited from owning property, for a massive slice of the duration of the history of the nation. (Hence this proclamation of agitation? In b4 masturbation.) This leads to being penalized in any capitalist society. When capital controls the means of production, and whites control the capital, then blacks will suffer and nobody should be surprised. You can follow the money, that's the one good thing about capitalism. You can figure out who to burn and impale on pitchforks.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
They're not prizing education, but the ability to make certain tiers of education. It's a lighter, friendlier, less free system comparable to India's castes - as competence is tertiary to tiering and testing.
On the other hand, the United States allows all and does quite well. If one were to factor that in tests, that would put the US at/near the top. However, don't let a little statistics get in the way of your narrative.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
Public schools, as done in the US, allow a wider amount of individuals to access education in ways not otherwise available.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
There is something that is pretty much axiomatic regarding things of this nature (and this is important, so please listen). Rarely does blaming someone else for your condition result in a change in that condition. Even when it is someone else's fault.
"player 4 hit player 1 with 0 stroms"
But if you think it's a great white consipiracy to "keep da niggas in their place", you're not thinking straight. It's about what every other conspiracy in America is about: making money.
Right, you've almost got it. Very very close.
Music and fashions - to take the most obvious examples - are marketed to black people, not to keep them down, but to sell more music and clothes.
Look, where did hip-hop come from? It came from the music programs getting shut down which affected black students before it affected white ones because there was more money to wring out of parents and communities in white neighborhoods — due to the weight of history, and public policy. So "that's not music!" came from being too cheap to have decent education in the poorest neighborhoods. But moreover, the majority of advertising which is targeted at anyone is designed to make them unhappy. The companies that spend the most to make people feel good are car companies, which also spend a lot of money to make people unhappy — but about half of their advertising actually targets their current customers, and is intended to make them feel good about their past purchases that they're living with today, in the hope of avoiding a negative association.
So yeah, actually, you make money by making people feel bad. By tricking them into buying your shit. Anything they actually need sells itself; these days there's google, these days there's siri, these days there's amazon and ebay and etsy, barring someone trying to trick them into buying something they don't want, they'll find you if you take the least effort to make yourself available. Most advertising is designed to make people feel inadequate if they don't have a product.
When hip-hop was new, they didn't have their own labels. Today a black artist can make music on a black label and sell it to black and white people alike without any trouble; back then, virtually all the labels were owned by old wrinkly white men who pocketed all the money. But moreover, it was these old white guys decided which black artists were going to get a record contract. It wasn't [necessarily] based on what would scientifically sell, it was based on white prejudice — which artists were signed, how much money was spent promoting them. More money was spent promoting gangsta rap than socially conscious music. But that's a relatively minor way in which racial prejudice influenced black culture. The influence of the news media is far larger. And even they had massive influence on black music; do you think there's more evening news eyeballs for KRS-One talking about social progress, or for 2 Live Crew rapping about S&M, and/or eating ass? And do you think the nightly news gives a shit about reporting the spectrum of what is newsworthy, or just about attracting eyeballs?
Luckily, television is fading away, albeit slowwwwwly. We'll be getting more news from the internet, and so there's more chances for less-entrenched media to capture eyeballs as long as people are in the habit of going to search engines for their information. The proliferation of mobile internet use has surely driven this trend forward, through voice interaction going to keyword searches.
You don't like it? Me either. So don't buy it, and persuade your peers to do likewise. Don't try to make it illegal - that won't work. Make it unprofitable.
Hey, I'd be happy if you had to report facts in order to be called news.
Anyway, nowhere have I alleged some unified conspiracy to "keep down the darkie", etc. It's just about not enough substantive effort to check the momentum of the past. It's a big job; racism didn't begin in America. Slavery didn't begin in Ameri
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
They'll stop having contractors as cleaning crew and security guards and quickly remedy the female and hispanic numbers.
I'd think the same demographics would apply
Hate to break it to you science-denying Democrat vermin, but there will never be as many women or blacks or anything else in tech as male whites and Jews and Asians because there just aren't enough such people with high IQs. If your IQ were higher, you'd understand what I just said, and you'd realize AGW is a hoax. Instead, you're a bunch of gullible, low-IQ Democrats.
From...
Tech jobs: Minorities have degrees, but don't get hired/a.
Source...
Tech jobs: Minorities have degrees, but don't get hired
They're not prizing education, but the ability to make certain tiers of education
If the German / Asian education systems are flawed, please tell me why they keep on producing innovative young people while America has to rely on immigrants from Germany and Asia to replenish its supply of innovative ideas?
As a Chinese I can tell you that we do prize not only education - but also knowledge and the use of knowledge to bettering the world at large
My primary education was in China. Secondary school and up, I got it in the USA - and the contrast is that in China we actually honor our teacher but in America it's the football stars and/or gangsters who got most admirations
In the secondary school that I went to in the States (near the Boston area) more than 80% were blacks. Decades have passed since I got out of that hellhole and I can tell you that it's the 20%, the non-blacks, who are contributing to the wellbeing of the American society via our taxes, our inventions and our companies that we started which are employing thousands of other Americans
Why can't the blacks do what we the 20%-ers are doing?
It's not that they can't, they do *NOT* want to, because for them, excellence in education isn't their priority --- they do not have to because they got their Jesse Jackson to speak out for them whenever there is/are troubles
As for the 20%-ers, we do not have our 'Jesse Jackson' to speak for us, we have to do it all by ourselves. That is why it is us, the 20%-ers, who are pulling ourselves up by our own bootstraps
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
Just how long do you expect western civilization to tolerate such disorder?
"Shut up and behave" isn't a request. It isn't a demand. It is an offer of mercy.
That was not the original point. The original point was that the problems are so subtle that they can't be directly seen. Whatever you are on about is so far off the point being argued as to be in a land of delusion and smoked fish.
Nevermind that not only were blacks allowed to own property, but they decided to own black slaves instead of letting them go free.
In 1830, the year most carefully studied by Carter G. Woodson, about 13.7 percent (319,599) of the black population was free. Of these, 3,776 free Negroes owned 12,907 slaves
If you want to bring up slavery, nothing is pretty and blacks are just as guilty as those awful white folk. They knew how bad it was and still as soon as they were freed they started buying up slaves and treating them to the same horrors that they endured.
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Rarely does blaming someone else for your condition result in a change in that condition. Even when it is someone else's fault.
There is something that is pretty important for you to understand if you want to criticize my comment: I'm not black. But even if I were, fuck you. The unwillingness to place blame where it lies and then follow up on it is why we can't have nice things. Of course, the general response to my comment details the problem: you morons still think that the fight is between blacks and whites. It's between rich and poor. The blacks just get hit hardest, because they can be, because we let it happen. Are you content to just let it happen? It will happen to you next. Shush, only tears now.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
And the problem is?
Came for the sexism and racism.
Was not disappointed.
TIL deliberate oppresion means having politicians make laws solely for your races' benefit for decades.
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...people for the job! What is so hard about this? To hire based on demographic requirements is EVIL (presuming that is not a job qualification)! Any hiring because of race or demographic is, in itself, discriminatory! I really don't care what the skin count is, as long as the person is the best qualified for the job. If you are a minority, then stop relying on that to get a job! GET EDUCATED! GET QUALIFIED! LEARN OUR LANGUAGE! Stop whining about it. When Lady Liberty says "Give us your tired, your poor...", she did not mean that we will subsidize (or give you special treatment) you when you are able to work! By the same token, if you don't like FB diversity, start your own FB!
Self-importance and self-indulgence is the root of ALL evil.