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Forrest Mimms On Modern Air Travel With a Bag Full of Electronics
Evidently even Forrest Mimms isn't famous enough to fly without hassle when carrying a briefcase full of electronics; he writes at Make about his experiences, both before and after 2001. A relevant slice:
After police were called when I was going through security at the San Antonio International Airport and after major problems going through security in Kona, Hawaii, I finally realized the obvious: Most people who don’t make things have no idea how to evaluate homemade equipment. Some are terrified by exposed wires and circuit boards, maybe because of bomb scenes in movies.
So I gave up. Now my carryon bag is only half stuffed with electronics; the rest is shipped ahead via FedEx.
To be fair, I'm a nerd whose been reading Slashdot since 2000, and I have no idea who Forrest Mimms is either.
"Evidently even Forrest Mimms isn't famous enough to fly without hassle when carrying a briefcase full of electronics"
Who?
I looked him up, and have no idea how anyone who isn't really into his books would know who he is (and probably not even then). He's literally not famous at all.
Yes because it is for private citizens to inconvenience themselves for the sake of a useless government bureaucracy that does a great imitation of invasiveness one would normally only find under tyranny. If you don't declare your sinful lack of conformity in advance, it's your fault - you were dre^Wpacking provocatively.
Oh bullshit it's an inconvenience. There've been enough actual bombs that anyone not understanding because they feel themselves 'elite' is trolling for attention or just being pompous. Bag it and notify. Nothing inconvenient about it.
I have traveled numerous times, both domestic and international, carrying all manner of electronic prototypes. Including systems with a 12V lead acid battery, which looks, on the xray, like a dark blob with 2 wires going to it, which has to look as much like a bomb as anything else. Or a backpack with a bunch of boxes, cables, and radios.
I occasionally get a question about "what is it?", and then a "ok, move along". I occasionally (25% of time) have to get it swabbed for the ion-mobility tester.
I have never been "selected for interview" or "taken to another room" or anything remotely like that.
This is over the last 30 years, at least, when I was anywhere from 20s to 50s in age, with a beard and a ponytail.
My two instances of trouble were:
1) I had a roll of electrical tape seized at Heathrow. I wasn't carrying any electronics that time..
2) I had a bundle of AA batteries taped together in checked luggage in China. that's a no-no.
No, it isn't incumbent on *everyone*. However, it is part of the basic job description of a TSA agent to recognize what is a threat and what is not. If you can't recognize basic electronics, maybe this career isn't for you.
In any case - why would it be against any form of regulations to travel on an airplane with a bomb timer? The timer itself is completely harmless; TSA should be looking for explosive substances, not other random components that could possibly be assocated with a bomb. If you watch TV, it seems that most bombs nowadays are triggered by an attached cell phone; is TSA going to be banning anyone with one of those now?
Bombs are made with chemicals. All the electronics in the world won't blow up a toothpick. The sight of wires should alert you to... the presence of electronics.
Which is to say -- a bag full of wires is likely harmless. Something that looks like a birthday cake could probably take down the building you're in.
Forrest Mimms is the man who wrote the book that got me started in electronics.
What a coincidence! Forrest Mims also wrote a book on electronics. Wonder if they're related?
Oh go wet the bed. It's nothing to do with being elite. I worked in central London through the Troubles, and flew regularly with development kit for work and homebrew stuff as a radio amateur. I know what "enough actual bombs" in a First World nation looks like (thank god I'm not living somewhere with a real war), I was twice seconds from being blown up (as were many Londonners two-three decades ago), and there was never the need for this level of government interference.
As a former security officer with relevant training, the chemicals are the thing to look for more than anything else. You usually need several components to have a bomb that works and detonates when you want to, but chemicals are really the common denominator. Even if you're homebrewing on the plane, you still have to have chemicals whereas the rest of it is potentially optional
Most airports I've flown in and out of don't give a shit about wires, but they get really uptight about batteries and unknown liquids. A wire without a battery is completely benign. You're not going to be triggering a bomb with wires that aren't hooked up to a power source. Wires don't work that way otherwise we'd have all the free electricity we wanted.
I completely agree...because I've done exactly what you suggest! I was flying to give a public outreach talk on physics and took some demos with me which included a microwave transmitter and receiver plus other electronics. At check-in I told the person behind the counter that my checked bag contained equipment which might look a bit strange since it was for physics demos for a talk I was giving. She told me that she didn't think it would be a problem but told me I could take it direct to a scanner they had in the check-in hall itself for checked bags. I took it there, explained again, the guy scanned it and said it looked fine and off it went on the conveyor belt.
I did the same on the flight back with the same result. No problems whatsoever and some curiosity as to what the demo was. I expect that if you explain that you have scientific equipment in your bag, why you have that equipment and that it might look a bit strange to the X-ray in advance you'll not have any problems. If you want to use actually a scientific device on the plane then the best thing to do is ask permission beforehand and not just state that you are going to use it to some random check-in person who probably has no technical background whatsoever. If this guy put even the tiniest amount of thought into getting his gear through security and getting permission to use it on a plane then I expect he would not have half the problems he claims to.
Sorry, no. Once the TSA imposed itself on everyone and claimed the purpose was safety, they accepted the responsibility for knowing what is and is not safe. If they're not up to it, they should go home.
The Star Simpson case cited in TFA is a nice illustration of the tyrannical nature of these agencies. Not the fact that a TSA guy got spooked by her electronic ornament, and not even the fact that she was subsequently arrested at gunpoint in the ensuing confusion; those are just regrettable but understandable mistakes. But the fact that this whole messy incident ever made it to court illustrates that. And even when they dropped the "hoax device" charge against her, they still could not bring themselves to let her go scot free and admit their mistake in blowing this thing out of proportion, and forced her into an f-ing plea bargain on a charge of "disorderly conduct" which is something that'll stick nicely to anyone, especially when already having been arrested in chains. And to add insult to injury, they made her issue a public apology.
I've seen the same disgusting proceedings in my own country: if an agency makes a mistake against an individual, whether it is a wrongful arrrest, an incorrectly denied zoning permit, or a bloody traffic fine: if they know they can make you back down instead of having to admit their own mistake, by making your life a living legal hell at the taxpayers' expense with zero risk or inconvenience to themselves, they will. And the sad thing is: even if these cases and the sickening behaviour of the officials driving them become publicly known, nothing ever happens to these officials or to those ultimately responsible.
If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
as well as others things. carry only today's needs.
Yep, I took a LittleBits Synth Kit with me on a flight earlier this year, got pulled off for extra screening and had to explain the thing to them.
I was flying from LA to New Orleans to VFX supervise Big Momma's House 2 (ok, not the best film ever.) Among the things I brought with me was a pelican case of LEDs and batteries, we used to put tracking marks on walls and other things. I'll admit that seeing it go through the x-ray machine, it looked a little iffy.
The TSA agent then took the case, and extended his arms as far as he could, closed one eye, before slowly opening the box and peeking inside. Which, of course, I found insulting. No respect.
I love Mondays. On a Monday, anything is possible.
Fuck the Patriot act
Come to California. White folks are a minority in a minority-majority state. Also, the California Republican has more in common with the spotted owl than 1/10th of the U.S. population. Not as many tea party nuts running around here.
What's kind of strange is that up until the early 1970s there wasn't *any* security for air travel. At all. Some of the shuttle flights didn't even require you to buy a ticket in advance, they sold them on the plane.
Even after the first few hijackings, the airlines were stridently opposed to security screening, thinking it would turn off customers and make the airport experience a nightmare. They would have rather just paid the fucking ransoms and moved on.
I can remember in the late 1970s we used to ride our bikes to MSP and walk the gates. I'm sure we must have had to have gone through metal detectors, but they clearly didn't give a shit about a couple of 13 year old boys walking to the gates.
It's kind of hard to fathom why air security got so extreme relative to how lax it had been and how much the airlines resisted increasing it, even when their planes were pretty regularly getting hijacked.
(For great background, read "The Skies Belong to Us" -- a great review of both skyjackings generally and the Western Flight 701 hijacking to Algeria in particular).
Always keep your bombs under 100ml.
Because the Third Act needs a Ticking Clock.
Unfamous enough that even the submitter didn't know how to spell his name. "Mims", not "Mimms". Kinda undermines your point.
Why is this news?
Actually I lived and worked in California for a while, first in the bay area then SoCal. I dont have much too good things to say about San Francisco (too much like the North East where I came from), but I have almost nothing but good things to say about SoCal. I loved every day living in San Diego, which is more conservative than other parts, but people white and otherwise were either friendlier, or at least just more more respectful.
I left for work and love (married someone back east) but hope to eventually make it back to California, if the droughts don't kill it.
SoCal is nice.
As long as your AC is working.
Then again, why should the AC if nobody else is...
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Damn straight, how DARES he make anything himself? Doing anything yourself, that's so Un-American, can't he buy some crap made in China like every normal person?
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
And the sad thing about it is that the 9/11 hijackers were people who'd entered the country legally and would have been have been detected had the 1970's level air security laws actually been enforced.
Instead of correcting that, however, we got new laws and new restrictions on travel and association with those who travel and a much more intrusive screening process that notoriously doesn't catch people with ill intent, so thank goodness for alert passengers!
To be fair, if it's battery powered it can easily become a bomb. But they don't confiscate all the cell phones.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
I know it's anecdotal, but I have never had an issue carrying custom made hardware through checked or carry on. RF brass boards, PCBs, test equipment, etc. I've had baggage scanners wipe EPROM's, and TSA dump an $80k VNA out of it's Pelican case, and another TSA who said those micro-hook probes looked "painful", but never a security hassle. Go figure.
Gaming computers apparently also classify as "terrorist weaponry".
No. They were probably just wondering what you were doing out of your parents' basement.
Have gnu, will travel.
Traveled from Austin to Breckenridge for the holidays but decided against taking my Raspberry Pi I got for Christmas and other assorted cables and hardware for this very reason.
AC in SoCal? You must be joking. There's no need for AC in SoCal. It's naturally cool and non-humid in summer. That's a part of the reason it's so overpopulated (climate).
Drive a few hours east. That's where the hot weather is.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
Battery packs are considered electronics but increasingly they are very unstable packages of chemical energy. If you combine just one or two laptop batteries easy to get on board, short them out or puncture them could blow a nice hole in an aircrafts hull.
Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
He's not the first to discover the uses of the commercial shipping companies like Fedex, etc. At least since the mid 90s, people have been doing just that. Part of it was in response to all the airport security that was being developed using poorly-paid, and thus unqualified examiners. The other part was the airlines' growing limits on "excess" baggage, plus their tendency to fly your luggage to some place remote from where they were flying you. People reported that handing it over to the package-shipping people to deliver to your destination did an end run around the airlines' lost luggage issue and the government's incompetent security theater. And the cost was often less than what the airlines would charge for the excess luggage. Others read those reports, tried it, found that it worked, and switched to the same process. And on arrival, they had just the one carry-on bag, didn't have to deal with the airlines' slow luggage-delivery schemes, and could just grab a ride to wherever they were headed, where their luggage, equipment, etc. would be waiting for them.
The airlines should just say the hell with it, convert the bottom of the plane to a second deck of seats, and subcontract the luggage delivery with the folks who know how to do it right. Lots of the frequent-traveller crowd does it that way already.
Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
If he were either black or Muslim then he would have instead gotten an invite to the White house. Different standards for crackers though.
Yeah because if there's one group of people in America that truly knows what oppression is, it's the white folk. /s
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
For the last 4 years, ever since selling my software start-up, I have had incredibly easy international flights and always have a wonderful seat. Now, if I could just do something about the fuel costs and the luxury tax on my private jet.
I don't suppose who ever modded my post off-topic would care to explain the reasoning because I really don't see how this is the least bit off-topic.
I come from a place where "hot summers" are characterized by the warning from your mom that you should not go skating 'cause the ice might not be thick enough to carry you.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Before a holiday flight (I think Germany to Switzerland), I was put aside behind X-ray screening for some extra checks and questions. The reason was, that I was carrying -among other things- a point'n'shoot digital camera and an extra battery (smallish 1500mAh) for my smartphone in my bag. The extra battery and the camera's image sensor happened to overlap in the first X-ray screening pass, triggering some false positive detection.
In my opinion a toolbox on board of an airplane is more dangerous than a gun.
But it is incumbent on people whose professional job is apparently to scream "it's a bomb, it's a bomb! Everybody, we all need to freak out and assault this person, now!!" to have some idea about when to freak out and throw all their reason out the window, vs not freak out.
You don't call TSA ahead of time about your items, do you? And yet they are every bit as bomb-like as this guy's sensors. Electronics aren't bombs. They just aren't. I don't care how many religious pamphlets you have read all your life saying that wires=bomb; that doesn't make it true.
Another way of looking at this, is if these people are this incredibly unqualified to screen, then false positives aren't the only thing that can go wrong. Your community isn't just occasionally burning innocent people to death, but you also probably still have witches that your bumbling witchfinders are failing to catch. What are we getting in exchange for paying them?
As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
Good thinking. But re-read your post and you'll see that you have also inadvertently identified the thing that your bombing conspirators have in common, which makes them so easy to identify.
So now we really know what to do: stop letting people onto planes.
As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
Sheeeeeit. You want to get a bomb on a plane? Just fly out of Maccarran after DefCon is over. I stay until the end; by the time I fly the out (with all my exposed-wire-paraphenalia) TSA's collective mind is more completely blown than usual. They don't even look twice.
There's always some lovely stories at the talks about attendees' experiences at their origin airports, though. I can't imagine what those guys must think.
And, to all you naysayers: Forrest M. Mims is indeed the man, and quite famous. Just because "kids today" aren't forced to learn analog basics before doing hardware hacking stuff and *you* haven't heard of him doesn't mean squat. (See also: Steve Ciarcia).
We know they infect stuff you send on the mail and that they mess with checked up luggage. The ONLY "safe" way to take electronics around, in or out the US is to keep it ALL in your carry on, and if you lose visual contact with it while they are passing the x-ray, you just dump or sell it without ever connecting it again to your personal stuff. They even let you take overweight carry on if you explain it is very expensive.
Actually they do have a 'tricorder to point at someone and get a reading that says "bomb"' only they don't call it a tricorder they call it an explosive residue detector. I don't care how much electronics you're carrying if it doesn't set off the explosive residue detector then it should go.