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The Russian Plan To Use Space Mirrors To Turn Night Into Day (vice.com)

merbs writes: Throughout the early 90s, a team of Russian astronomers and engineers were hellbent on literally turning night into day. By shining a giant mirror onto the earth from space, they figured they could bring sunlight to the depths of night, extending the workday, cutting back on lighting costs and allowing laborers to toil longer. If this sounds a bit like the plot of a Bond film, well, it's that too. The difference is that for a second there, the scientists, led by Vladimir Sergeevich Syromyatnikov, one of the most important astronautical engineers in history, actually pulled it off.

126 comments

  1. Insanity. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Has there been any thought given as to what this might do to the flora and fauna? Screwing up diurnal rhythms, mating seasons, migrations, etc. I mean seriously, this screams terrible idea.

    1. Re:Insanity. by captjc · · Score: 5, Funny

      Yeah, but just think of it, a 168 hour work week. People will no longer need to go home at night and can work 24/7! Think of all the profits!

      Plus the syndicates will finally be free of that menace, Batman. There is no Batman if there is no night time.

      --
      Slow Down Cowboy! It's been 1 hour, 47 minutes since you last successfully posted a comment
    2. Re:Insanity. by Rhacman · · Score: 1

      There is no Batman if there is no night time.

      "I am the damp-dreary-overcast-day!"

      --
      Account -> Discussions -> Disable Sigs
    3. Re:Insanity. by NotInHere · · Score: 1

      The move won't happen anymore, because it happened already. What you said above was an actual political issue of the early industrialisation, when humans figured out how to make light without having to kill whales, or lighting up candles or some larger fire. These methods were just bad, the versailles hall of mirrors room needed tons of candles in order to be properly lit.

    4. Re:Insanity. by wired_parrot · · Score: 4, Informative

      From the article, they were planning on lighting up urban areas only. The mirrors wouldn't be large enough to light up more than a city, and the light would only have been the equivalent of a bright moonlight. And cities already have electric illumination at night. So this would only be substituting current electric night time lighting in city centers with the reflected light, which would have the advantage of cutting energy costs. The idea was being pitched as an energy saving measure for city centers. It's not so terrible if limited to urban centers.

    5. Re:Insanity. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Here in Seattle, we don't let a little darkness stop companies from requiring "Seattle Hundreds." You know, 16 hours Mon-Thu and 12 hours Fri-Sun.

    6. Re:Insanity. by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      But beware of the marshall, because it's always High Noon.

    7. Re:Insanity. by Dusthead+Jr. · · Score: 1

      If I'm not mistaken that was one of the plot points in Batman and Robin. Using mirrors in orbit to thwart Mr Freeze's plans.

    8. Re:Insanity. by OrangeTide · · Score: 2

      As you get closer to the poles (higher latitude), the diurnal rhythms get a bit messed up, at least for non-native species like us humans. Long nights in the winter results in various health issues and depression. At around 60 N we're talking about only 4 hours of daylight, but a human is most comfortable at around 12 hours of daylight.

      --
      “Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
    9. Re:Insanity. by fche · · Score: 2

      Maybe not much. Each 200m-diameter mirror illuminating a 5700m-diameter area on the ground implies a 1:28 reduction of light intensity right there.

    10. Re:Insanity. by demonlapin · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Again, I don't know why you guys do this shit for megacorps. Some startup where you might become a billionaire? Hey, I can see killing yourself for a couple of those in your early 20s in hopes you hit the jackpot. But Microsoft? Hell, Google? They're already huge. They've already made their billionaires, and you weren't one of them. Get a job at a company that will pay you for working tolerable hours at a fair rate.

      This also goes a long way to explaining the difference in pay between flyover country and the coasts. "Oh, yeah, I pay more for the apartment, but I have a lot more disposable income"... and no time in which to spend it. I get nine weeks of paid vacation a year. You can have that when you pry it from my cold, dead hands.

    11. Re:Insanity. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      From the article, they were planning on lighting up urban areas only. The mirrors wouldn't be large enough to light up more than a city, and the light would only have been the equivalent of a bright moonlight. And cities already have electric illumination at night. So this would only be substituting current electric night time lighting in city centers with the reflected light, which would have the advantage of cutting energy costs. The idea was being pitched as an energy saving measure for city centers. It's not so terrible if limited to urban centers.

      Sure it's not such a terrible energy saving measure...unless the cost to build the damn thing was eleventy bazillion dollars, sending your ROI into fucking orbit.

      Don't give a shit who you are or what your currency is. Space shit ain't cheap.

    12. Re:Insanity. by shaitand · · Score: 1

      The idea went down in flames and the brilliant engineer (who mankind owes a great deal for his contributions to space exploration) who was behind it died in 2006. This isn't really a news article so much as a "I bet you didn't know about" sort of thing.

      The modern offshoot of this plan is just massive solar generators in space. One of which would supposedly supply a third of the global energy consumption.

    13. Re:Insanity. by Gates82 · · Score: 4, Informative
      It would actually be a reduction of 812:1; given that the ratio between the area of two circles is ratio bewteen their diameters squared.

      --
      MGB

    14. Re:Insanity. by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 2

      I used to work insane hours like that. Never helped me when downsizing came around. Work for your boss to climb? Never again.

      --
      (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
    15. Re:Insanity. by fche · · Score: 1

      Good point, thanks.

    16. Re:Insanity. by kheldan · · Score: 1

      This should be called 'The Russian Plan to Make Global Warming Worse, Faster'. Of course what do they care? Anyone living in Vladivostok or Siberia probably welcomes global warming.

      --
      Are YOU using the TOOL, or is the TOOL using YOU? Think about it!
    17. Re:Insanity. by morphotomy · · Score: 1

      Arthur C Clark has a great write up on the subject.

    18. Re:Insanity. by painandgreed · · Score: 2

      Sure it's not such a terrible energy saving measure...unless the cost to build the damn thing was eleventy bazillion dollars, sending your ROI into fucking orbit.

      Don't give a shit who you are or what your currency is. Space shit ain't cheap.

      Some quick Googleing and I see that Boston, as an example, spends 8 million annually just on street lights and space X costs $100 to 260 million for a launch. Assuming a 20 year lifespan of the satellite, you end up with $160 million to mess around with. So it's not completely absurd that such a plan might pay for itself if it can be done with a single satellite that is cheap enough and lasts long enough. If doing multiple cities, there might be some savings in manufacture of satellites as they aren't all one offs.

    19. Re:Insanity. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Unless the setting is changed, and the mirrors become concave...then Putin will burn his enemies with THE POWER OF THE SUN!

    20. Re:Insanity. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      We need to open up the breadbasket of Siberia soon or risk mass starvation!

    21. Re:Insanity. by Gavagai80 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Keep in mind that you can't stop maintaining the street lights and you'll have to use them a lot of nights, because space mirrors don't work when it's cloudy or foggy.

      --
      This space intentionally left blank
    22. Re:Insanity. by Circlotron · · Score: 1

      If these things are just re-purposed solar sails, how are they expected to stay put in orbit? Won't the sun just blow them away?

    23. Re:Insanity. by mysidia · · Score: 1

      They can avoid making global warming worse by diverting light AWAY from the part of the earth that is currently day, thus the results would be more global-warming neutral, AND the tradeoff for making it day 24x7 in one area is that it would be night 24x7 in another area.....

      May I suggest the state of California to be the location to have light diverted away from it, so it becomes nighttime 24x7 there?

    24. Re:Insanity. by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 1

      The guy who is behind this thing is claiming that the entire system can be built and launched for under a billion.

      (Note that a single launch can launch several mirror satellites.)

    25. Re:Insanity. by Immerman · · Score: 1

      True, but compare to the coal-black moon, which offers a 1:1,000,000 reduction in light intensity when full, which is still enough light to barely enable color vision. 1:28 would be *bright*, probably brighter than most modern urban centers are currently lit.

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    26. Re:Insanity. by CanadianMacFan · · Score: 1

      Plus with the move to LED street lighting the costs will go down.

    27. Re:Insanity. by Dynedain · · Score: 2

      That other $160M will probably need to be spent on the satellite itself (design, construction, monitoring, orbital adjustments, etc). There went the budget! Not to mention ruining your citizen's night vision even more than what they currently experience.

      Street lighting is a good solution as it can be installed only where necessary. Blanketing an entire city with uniform night time lighting is an incredible waste of resources.

      Now if it could be used for energy generation or telecommunications instead, then I think there's something to the idea.

      --
      I'm out of my mind right now, but feel free to leave a message.....
    28. Re:Insanity. by kheldan · · Score: 1

      I've actually heard of ideas to put stuff in the upper atmosphere (light enough to stay there) that would effectively raise the albedo of Earth, reflecting more sunlight back out into space. Not sure how practical it would be. There's also a short story by David Brin where an alien race used millions of small, steerable mirrors to induce an ice age on a planet they later wanted to colonize (they did this because the planet had a sentient species on it, and they weren't very nice aliens). Things like this aren't so totally far-fetched that they couldn't be done.

      --
      Are YOU using the TOOL, or is the TOOL using YOU? Think about it!
    29. Re:Insanity. by invictusvoyd · · Score: 1

      Space debris will ensure that "batman returns"

      _____________________________
      News at 9 : Space mirror shattered by wrench in orbit

    30. Re:Insanity. by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      space mirrors don't work when it's cloudy or foggy.

      They work just fine. When it's cloudy or foggy during the day, it doesn't go pitch black, does it? It just dims. So you have two mirrors, and when it's overcast you use the second one to give you more light to compensate.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    31. Re:Insanity. by bfpierce · · Score: 1

      Most of us live in giant illuminated cities, this is just illuminating these places from space instead of lots of little lights.

      I think you might be overthinking this a tad.

    32. Re:Insanity. by Aleksej · · Score: 1

      Anyone living in Vladivostok or Siberia probably welcomes global warming.

      Vladivostok seems to be a bad example there. It is only a few degrees colder than Moscow, and is a port.

    33. Re:Insanity. by JohnStock · · Score: 1

      Spoken like a true Ferengi

    34. Re:Insanity. by bored_engineer · · Score: 1

      *shrug* I live at 65 degrees north latitude, and am fine. I know of one or two people who have problems, but most here seem to get along well. In fact, people seem a little more odd in the summer, frenetically busy trying to soak up as much sun as possible. ;-)

    35. Re:Insanity. by OrangeTide · · Score: 1

      Your anecdotal evidence aside, seasonal affective disorder exists and while some people have no problems and others have only minor systems, there are numerous studies showing that as your move towards the equator the frequency of the condition in a population diminishes.
      Treatments of phototherapy are usually effective (but not always), and tend to point to daylight hours being a cause.

      --
      “Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
    36. Re:Insanity. by Gavagai80 · · Score: 1

      If we're talking about lighting intensity similar to a full moon or several moons, as in the article, then it does in fact get very dark when clouds cover the moon.

      --
      This space intentionally left blank
    37. Re:Insanity. by toddestan · · Score: 1

      Most urban areas get significantly brighter during the night when it's cloudy out because all the light pollution reflects off the clouds (even more so in northern climates when there's also snow on the ground). Obviously, without the streetlights you're going to have a lot less light to reflect, but you could probably get away with a lot less of them.

    38. Re:Insanity. by OffTheWallSoccer · · Score: 2

      Pardon my asking, but what type of job affords nine weeks of paid vacation? I'm envious!

    39. Re:Insanity. by eric_harris_76 · · Score: 1

      I ... AM ... KESSLER!!!

      --
      There's no time like the present. Well, the past used to be.
    40. Re:Insanity. by demonlapin · · Score: 1

      As much as I'd like to tell you, it would be unwise for me to do so. Let us simply say that I work in a job where my labor is completely interchangeable with my co-workers' (someone has to show up to do the work, but it doesn't matter who; we don't hire people that can't pull their weight), and where we have all chosen to be paid substantially less in order to have free time.

    41. Re:Insanity. by OffTheWallSoccer · · Score: 1

      For a second I thought you might be a teacher (they get summer off and they often earn lower wages), but then you threw me that "interchangeable" curveball.

  2. global warming alert by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That would add a lot more heat to the environment, just when there's already too much.

    1. Re:global warming alert by penguinoid · · Score: 1

      If you believe the Russians are particularly concerned about global warming, I got some prime Siberian real estate to sell you.

      --
      Don't waste your vote! Vote for whoever you want, unless you live in a swing state it won't matter anyways
    2. Re:global warming alert by bondsbw · · Score: 1

      It may block the same amount of sunlight as it passes over the day side of the earth (unless it is in a polar orbit that is synchronized with the earth's revolution around the sun).

      Perhaps even more, since its reflective timeframe would be limited as it would pass into the earth's shadow. Also I assume the material's opacity is greater than its reflectivity.

      --
      All my liberal friends think I'm a conservative, all my conservative friends think I'm a liberal.
    3. Re:global warming alert by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      i will buy that real estate and wait for the equator to become a desert.

    4. Re:global warming alert by castionsosa · · Score: 1

      I would think they would be more worried about Kessler Syndrome than global warming. The more stuff in space, the greater a chance some of it will smack other stuff, causing pieces to fly off and smack other stuff... rendering entire orbits unusable for centuries.

    5. Re:global warming alert by alphatel · · Score: 2

      i will buy that real estate and wait for the equator to become a desert.

      It isn't already?

      --
      When the foot seeks the place of the head, the line is crossed. Know your place. Keep your place. Be a shoe.
    6. Re:global warming alert by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No. Most of it is under a few hundred feet of water. Most of the (comparatively) dry stuff isn't desert, either.

    7. Re:global warming alert by mysidia · · Score: 1

      Not worried.... the Vogon Constructor Fleet will be here to clear the obstructions for the intergalactic highway, long before it becomes an issue.

    8. Re:global warming alert by Immerman · · Score: 1

      Not really. IIRC the CO2 from burning 1 watt-hour worth of fossil fuel will, over the course of it's average lifetime in that atmosphere, retain about 1,000,000 watt-hours worth of extra heat. By switching to reflected sunlight you could light cities radically brighter than today while still radically reducing global warming.

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    9. Re:global warming alert by matfud · · Score: 1

      It is in a sun synchronous (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun-synchronous_orbit) polar orbit in theory. So you need a fair few of them. However they are to small compared to the sun to cast a shadow (the sun is not a point source. Also the foot print moves pretty damn fast.

      When illuminating the night side areas the rotate and change angle to point the reflected light at a specific location

  3. Must have been a slow day at Motherboard by Crashmarik · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Does take a certain something to try and recast a 20 year old failure as a great success

    1. Re:Must have been a slow day at Motherboard by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You sure it was a failure? Russia had no money back then you know

    2. Re:Must have been a slow day at Motherboard by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 1

      In what sense it is a failure? They failed a single launch for a larger prototype, seemingly for no reasons connected to the prototype itself, and then funding dried up. But the prototype that they did succeed with showed that the idea is sound.

    3. Re:Must have been a slow day at Motherboard by lannocc · · Score: 1

      ...showed that the idea is sound.

      Funny, I thought the idea was light.

  4. Obligatory Joke by scunc · · Score: 4, Funny

    In Soviet Russia, night lights you!

  5. so overcomplicated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    In the USA we have lamps.

    1. Re:so overcomplicated by R3d+M3rcury · · Score: 1

      Yeah, but we developed a pen that could write in space while the Russians just used a pencil. So I guess both sides overcomplicate things.

      (It's a joke. Yes, I know that NASA didn't spend billions of dollars developing a space pen.)

    2. Re:so overcomplicated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And how much money and resources are spent powering those lamps, producing bulbs for them & replacing the fixtures? Especially with more modern materials it could be possible to launch multiple space mirrors on a single rocket. Definitely not something you would want to do on a global scale but it could be adventitious for a few large cities/regions that already artificially light themselves.

    3. Re:so overcomplicated by blackiner · · Score: 2

      Yes, the Simpsons taught us the capitalist version of this plot: Local billionaire creates a device to blot out the Sun and sell electricity from his nuclear plant to the town 24/7.

  6. Ecological Consequences of Artificial Night Lights by SteveSgt · · Score: 2

    "Ecological Consequences of Artificial Night Lighting"
    [ http://www.urbanwildlands.org/... ]

  7. Night and day... by fustakrakich · · Score: 1

    ...you are the one
    Only you 'neath the moon or under the sun
    Whether near to me or far
    It's no matter, darling, where you are
    I think of you day and night

    --
    “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
  8. Makes sense by garyoa1 · · Score: 2

    Since global warming is pretty slow. Gotta speed it up somehow.

    --
    Wuddooeyeno? IITYWYBMAD? Like nuts? eclecticallyincorrect.com
    1. Re:Makes sense by NotInHere · · Score: 2

      In fact, if you put the mirror into Lagrange point L1, it can be used to prevent some of sun's light to reach earth, thus lowering solar input, and chilling the climate. Probably the idea sounds as insane as the one to build the hoover dam sounded to others back then*...

          (* yes some (not all roads are cool) of the giant buildings trump proposes are insane as well, and I hope it won't be seen differently in the future)

    2. Re:Makes sense by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It does not need to be a mirror, just an opaque object to cast a shadow on the Earth. As objects at L1 are not stable, fuel would be necessary to maintain the position of the space-based sun shade. If you had the ability to control which areas of the space-based sun shade were opaque over time, it might be possible to limit the growth rate of tropical storms to keep them from developing into hurricanes. If this were achieved, it would have significant economic impact.

    3. Re:Makes sense by Immerman · · Score: 2

      Nope, just the opposite. Fossil fuels contribute about 1,000,000x more energy in the form of thermal retention by CO2 than they do as combustion heat. Eliminate the CO2 and you can have 1,000,000 times as much light for the same impact on global warming.

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    4. Re:Makes sense by Megane · · Score: 1

      As objects at L1 are not stable, fuel would be necessary to maintain the position of the space-based sun shade.

      The L1 point itself is not stable but there are halo and Lissajous orbits around it that are relatively stable. The bad news is that a sun shade happens to be the one kind of thing where that would be least useful.

      --
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    5. Re:Makes sense by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, it's not our body temperature doing it. Do you also think acid rain and the ozone hole aren't caused by humans? Or the smog in China?

    6. Re:Makes sense by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Like so many other discussions about stuff in space or terraforming, this was discussed in KSR's Mars trilogy. They used an orbiting "soletta", a flexible mirror that would reflect onto itself. It was capable, when tuned, of either acting as a lens or as a prism, either focusing or scattering sunlight. You do that by making it out of conical strips which can alter their angle. If the angle of each cone is made more acute as you proceed towards the outer ring, then you get a focusing lens. But if you make each cone slightly broader, then you cause the light to miss the planet entirely. And because the light is departing the soletta at almost the same angle at which it arrives (after two reflections) it takes very little thrust for station-keeping. It should be highly achievable with solar panels and ion engines.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  9. Pics or it didn't happen. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ^^^^UP THERE^^^^

  10. Its a german one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Interesting

    As every modern weapon of mass destruction (except perhaps drones, those are american) it had been originally thought of by the nazis and gets first built by either the americans or the russians: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

  11. then we'd know who the space vampires are by turkeydance · · Score: 2

    i've been told we need to know.

    1. Re: then we'd know who the space vampires are by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah the werewolf oligarchs build it in order to kill the rivaling vampire oligarchs.

  12. Scorpion did it... by Jonah+Hex · · Score: 1

    s02e14 "Sun of a Gun" Sylvester's estranged father, a retired general, enlists the team's help after discovering that an African dictator has uncovered a deadly weapon of mass destruction from World War II and intends to use it. The team goes to an African nation to find out if the dictator has sodium panels which can concentrate sunlight before it can be launched on a rocket as a satellite death ray. Walter takes a steam in towels with the dictator who is smitten with his intellect.

    Of course the weapon was attributed to the Nazi's and the depiction of the "laser like reflection of the sun" was hilarious, but I don't watch it expecting to see hard science. According to movies and tv shows, those crazy Nazi's abandoned bunkers all over the place with all sorts of crazy inventions in them. - HEX

    1. Re:Scorpion did it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      s02e14 "Sun of a Gun" Sylvester's estranged father, a retired general, enlists the team's help after discovering that an African dictator has uncovered a deadly weapon of mass destruction from World War II and intends to use it. The team goes to an African nation to find out if the dictator has sodium panels which can concentrate sunlight before it can be launched on a rocket as a satellite death ray. Walter takes a steam in towels with the dictator who is smitten with his intellect.

      Of course the weapon was attributed to the Nazi's and the depiction of the "laser like reflection of the sun" was hilarious, but I don't watch it expecting to see hard science. According to movies and tv shows, those crazy Nazi's abandoned bunkers all over the place with all sorts of crazy inventions in them. - HEX

      How the hell does that show stay on the air?

    2. Re:Scorpion did it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      CBS has a very... special... viewership.

    3. Re:Scorpion did it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      According to movies and tv shows, those crazy Nazi's abandoned bunkers all over the place with all sorts of crazy inventions in them. - HEX

      Yup. Makes you wonder why they lost the war. Maybe we had some secret weapons of our own. Top Men working on things.

      But where? In some sort of warehouse, perhaps?

    4. Re:Scorpion did it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My non-techincal wife likes that show.
      I watch it for the unintentional comedy.

    5. Re:Scorpion did it... by jsilver212 · · Score: 1

      Please stop abusing apostrophes. More than one Nazi are called Nazis. An apostrophe is used when replacing bits like in a contraction (e.g. do not = don't). It is also used for a possessive, e.g. "the Nazi's super weapon was super". Try to remember: don't add an apostrophe unless you have a good reason. To make a plural, just add an S. Anyway, I just had to write this, I'm not even going to post it, it was just lethargic to say something. I don't want to be "that guy", the Grammar Nazi. I don't expect everyone to write perfectly, especially in a silly online forum, but it just really makes it hard to read. I'm sure this post is not perfect either, I'm just hopefully trying help someone write in a less annoying way. See also: http://www.angryflower.com/bob...

    6. Re:Scorpion did it... by jsilver212 · · Score: 1

      Anyway, I just had to write this, I'm not even going to post it, it was just lethargic to say something. See also: http://www.angryflower.com/bob...

      I really did not mean to post that! Well whatever, I don't mean to post this either. #ApostropheLivesMatter

  13. Features by penguinoid · · Score: 1

    Would it have featured the ability to focus all the light onto a dissident-sized area?

    --
    Don't waste your vote! Vote for whoever you want, unless you live in a swing state it won't matter anyways
  14. Telling by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That RSC diagram, presumably from the early 90's, looks like something drawn in the US sometime in the 50's. It is amazing how badly communism retarded Russia.

    1. Re:Telling by KGIII · · Score: 1

      Are you sure it wasn't the Russians who retarded Communism?

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
  15. "literally turning night into day" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Might I interest you in a quick lesson explaining the difference between the words "literally" and "figuratively"?

  16. how many wasps does it take to.... by sdinfoserv · · Score: 1

    change a light bulb? 2.... 1 to call the electrician and 1 to mix the drinks. But really, just use a light bulb.

    1. Re:how many wasps does it take to.... by Locke2005 · · Score: 1

      How many software engineers does it take? None, that's a hardware problem! How many hardware engineers does it take? We thought you were going to handle that in software!

      --
      I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
  17. Please! by slazzy · · Score: 1

    Please! Won't someone think of the fauna?

    --
    Website Just Down For Me? Find out
    1. Re:Please! by Kartu · · Score: 1

      It would have been used only in cities. What fauna?

  18. L Ron Hubbardnova by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They deserve one, too.

  19. but wouldn't you.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    need a really really big mirror for this.. And this would screw up with nature, the wild life.. heck humans themselves.

    1. Re:but wouldn't you.. by Sowelu · · Score: 1

      Depends on how much of an effect you want. The light from a full moon is about one millionth as bright as the light from the sun (thanks Wikipedia), and its albedo is a lot less than a mirror (0.136 to be precise). All of which means...yes, it would take a gigantic mirror to get full sunlight, but you can get away with a relatively small one if you could be happy with something merely as bright as a full moon or three. It also means that your mirrors aren't necessarily dangerous as weapons--you don't need a big one for them to be useful.

  20. Already been done...sort of by Roger+W+Moore · · Score: 3, Informative

    It has already been done - sort of - by a town in Norway that uses mirrors to reflect sunlight down into the valley to extend the daylight hours. At a reasonably high latitude in the northern hemisphere there are not many flora or fauna to worry about in the middle of winter in an urban setting.

    The only time you'd need to worry about it is if they focus the light a lot to create a heat based-death ray. That would also be far more like the plot of a bond film...

    1. Re:Already been done...sort of by jklovanc · · Score: 5, Informative

      The Norway installation is there not to extend daylight but to direct sunlight to the town square so that people can experience direct sunlight. They used to get no direct sunlight for six months of the year. It would be unsettling to be in the shade six months of the year.

    2. Re:Already been done...sort of by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not if you are a ginger ninja... We welcome the shade!!!

  21. Necessary anywhere by SuperKendall · · Score: 1

    It doesn't matter where you park a giant shade mirror, the effects of solar rays hitting a large surface would eventually move it anyway.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    1. Re:Necessary anywhere by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      IIRC isn't L1 lagrange a gravity 'sink'?

    2. Re:Necessary anywhere by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      L1 is unstable. It's not a "proper" orbit; the earth just happens to be tugging hard enough to hold it back from the proper orbit at that altitude.

    3. Re:Necessary anywhere by jheath314 · · Score: 1

      How about closer to the sun than the L1 point, so that the radiation pressure is balanced by the gravitational pull of the sun?

      Of course, L1 isn't a stable Lagrange point, so you'd have to expend energy to counteract gravitational perturbations from the other planets and fluctuations in solar radiation... but given the amount of solar energy you'd be collecting you'd have plenty of power to spare for manoeuvring.

      No, the real problem would be the size of the damn thing. L1 is about four times the distance of the moon from the earth, so to block even 1% of the sun's light you'd need a shade almost half the moon's diameter.

      --
      Procrastination Man strikes again!
    4. Re:Necessary anywhere by Agripa · · Score: 1

      A statite would be a fine idea except Robert Forward is dead:

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

  22. Soviet SDI proof of concept by deodiaus2 · · Score: 1

    The thing about it is that it was built at a time of the Cold War SDI/Star Wars concepts. While as it might have had civilian uses, I suspect that it was a precursor to the equivalent of the American "Thousand Points of Light", a SDI concept that would use a ground based laser to fire into a orbiting mirror which would be redirected towards a target. However, if all you are doing is calibrating and orienting an orbiting mirror, you could sell it to the world as a purely scientific experiment.
    The kicker in all of this is the protests mentioned which would disrupt the natural night environment. Now, we have been polluted with lots of light during the night time for the last hundred years, so I doubt that this is hardly a valid concern. I don't think that even the atomic bomb tests, which did irradiate a lot of people in the Pacific did not draw the same level of "concern".

    1. Re:Soviet SDI proof of concept by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, a purely scientific experiment. Perhaps you could get some school kids to work on it as part of a class project. They might use it to make a giant bag of popcorn.

    2. Re:Soviet SDI proof of concept by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > "Thousand Points of Light"
      That was not an SDI concept. It was an excuse for government to leave social programs to the private sector.

  23. Typical "lets f*up nature because we can" attitude by dsmatthews9379 · · Score: 0

    A narrow-minded genius is actually a dangerous idiot, however the Russians are not alone in their ability to be smart enough to devise and execute such a plan but so lacking in general knowledge that they fail to see the harm it could do. Failing to realise the potential harm to ecosystems that are "clocked" by lunar cycles is about as myopic as any scientist can get.

    Save this madness for your moon colonies..

    Then again it may have really been a cover for "over the horizon" radar reflectors......

  24. Mirrors the other way... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Couldn't one use mirrors on earth(or space) on mass to to reduce global warming(presuming it's needed).
    1KW per meter squared hits the ground, that's a hell of a lot of power to send back out/up; clear sky permitting etc. On mass etc..

    1. Re:Mirrors the other way... by Locke2005 · · Score: 1

      Sure, just paint the whole planet with reflective paint to cool it down... problem is, that also keeps all the heat generated inside the planet from escaping too! This effect is seen in the decrease in ice sheets adding to global warming, ice sheets are the most reflective naturally occurring surface we have.

      --
      I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
    2. Re:Mirrors the other way... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is not evidence of retention of the heat generated inside the planet from escaping. It is only observing that replacing the high albedo ground cover (ice covered with snow) with a lower albedo ground cover (ocean) will absorb more solar radiation. Shocker.

  25. Schlock Mercenary by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Hasn't this been done before?

  26. Can this be weaponized? by Locke2005 · · Score: 1

    Yes, of course it can. GoldenEye is soon to become reality (although it obviously wouldn't be as impressive as it was in the movie).

    --
    I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
    1. Re:Can this be weaponized? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It was Icarus. Originally called Solaris, but another movie had that name so they renamed it. This is from the Die Another Day movie. Goldeneye was a different movie.

  27. In Soviet Russia by Locke2005 · · Score: 1

    Mirror peer into you and take selfie!

    --
    I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
  28. "and allowing laborers to toil longer" by Jack+Griffin · · Score: 1

    Because if there's is one thing that labourers are crying out for, it's more time to toil...

  29. Re:Typical "lets f*up nature because we can" attit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This is a project that can be undone in seconds but please spread fear and ignorance.

    What damage exactly are you on about the fear of a dim light in a dark corner of the world oh the humanity.

  30. A weapon by BradMajors · · Score: 0

    For those who are not thinking... The purpose of this is to use as a weapon.

  31. Underestimating te effect of CO2 by Immerman · · Score: 1

    Actually, it would probably be a huge help to *reduce* global warming.

    If I recall correctly burning enough fossil fuels to produce 1 watt-hour of thermal energy produces CO2 which, over the course of it's average lifetime in the atmosphere, will retain a million watt-hours of solar thermal energy. So, you could use reflected sunlight to light up cities a thousand times brighter than they are today, while still adding a thousand times less excess heat to the Earth.

    --
    --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
  32. Is easy, Natasha! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    We put giant mirror in space. Light up Frostbite Falls like daytime. Moose and squirrel can't sleep. When they go crazy, we steal secret rocket fuel formula.

    Oh, Boris, you are a scheming nogoodnick!

    Stop it, Natasha! You're turning my pretty head!

  33. Sunlight? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I live in Sweden. What is this 'sunlight' people speak of?

  34. To be honest... by WillyWanker · · Score: 1

    I certainly wouldn't mind extra sunlight hours, especially in the winter. It's very depressing to wake up in the dark and come home in the dark. That being said, I absolutely wouldn't want it if it meant having to work longer hours.

  35. What could possibly go wrong? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Oh dear. I can't imagine the laundry list of things that will go wrong with this idea. The world has evolved around having day and night. The things that happen at night need to happen, and at night. Take away the night, and the things that need to happen at night might not happen at night, if at all.

  36. Civilian uses... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Light up:

    - Area affected by natural disaster to help clean-up / rescue
    - Open waters to aid search/rescue at night
    - World events (Olympics for night time events)
    - Northern mines/drilling operations doing winter installations (rental to re-coup costs)

  37. Re:Typical "lets f*up nature because we can" attit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Well, they do have places where the night last for months, literally. Something like this has the potential to make the artic and antartic areas livable and can be potentially sued to modulate the weather, so all in all not a terrible idea.

  38. Multi-tasking by popstack · · Score: 1

    They also use the Space Mirrors to Space Floss.