Joking About Giving Money To ISIS Can Cost You Money (arstechnica.com)

Reader rudy_wayne writes: A person who was using Venmo, an app that allows people to send money to each other via their phones, sent $42 to repay a friend, and jokingly labelled it "ISIS Beer Fund". He immediately got an e-mail from Venmo questioning the purpose of the money. Although he tried to explain "The $42 was payment to a dear friend for two pitchers of Samuel Adams Boston Lager" he was informed "Due to OFAC regulations, we are not allowed to give the funds back to you or issue a refund." The Treasury Department's Office of Foreign Assets Control is a 54-year-old institution, quietly working to keep money out of the hands of America's enemies.From the report, "It turns out -- shockingly -- this isn't the first time someone's Venmo transaction was cut off at the knees with a reference to subjects that are a matter of national security. Venmo won't explicitly say what words will trigger blockage, Gawker pointed out in October.

Comments

Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[OverlordQ]

~nt~

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Calydor]

Meanwhile, terrorists are smart enough not to label a money transfer as ISIS BOMB FUNDING.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[JackieBrown]

Meanwhile, terrorists are smart enough not to label a money transfer as ISIS BOMB FUNDING.

Yeah, but if it turned out it really was for ISIS and the institution knowingly ignored and help facilitate the transfer of funds, they would be liable civilly and criminally.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[the_skywise]

Yeah they probably memo that as "Payment to a dear friend for two pitchers of Samuel Adams Boston Lager"

And the Department of Financial Security Monitoring (comrade) goes "Oh that's so nice - we approve of that".

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[UnknownSoldier]

/sarcasm "Curses. Technology foiled by human ingenuity. Again. News at 10."

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Shoten]

Meanwhile, terrorists are smart enough not to label a money transfer as ISIS BOMB FUNDING.

Actually, not all of them are. Just the ones that are around long enough to be noticed by anyone besides the people that hunt them.

Remember, terrorists are not super-human. Just like everyone else, 50% of them have a double-digit IQ.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

Sure, and that explains why the money didn't get to the recipient, but does not explain why the money was stolen from the sender.

We never should have let the authoritarians get away with their war on politically incorrect drugs. It led to our government being able to steal whatever they want.

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

Exactly. They do the minimal amount of effort needed to shield themselves from the law and benefit from all the other transactions that are suspect. In my opinion financial transactions need to be much more transparent to the public. Government and corps cannot be trusted to police or monitor the movement of finances. There will never be incentive to benefit anyone but themselves.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[omnichad]

You think they are exactly average intelligence compared to the general population?

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

What if it really was for ISIS?

I don't see the problem.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Sperbels]

Knowingly ignored? Because four English letters that don't even represent the name of the terrorist group, but do represent many other things: Accidentally typing a common English word twice, An Egyptian god, a lunar crater, and asteroid, many geographical locations... a whole bunch of stuff actually: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

those are likely the ones they convince to blow themselves up for glory in the afterlife...so if the below average terrorists strap on the suicide vests, then that means statistically the ones left over are all above average.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Joe_Dragon]

federal POUND ME IN THE ASS could of happened.

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Type44Q]

Fine; can I at least offer them a roast-pork sandwich??

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

I generally do expect a different result, living in America. That is, not the PRC, or the Soviet Union, or Nazi Germany.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[wisnoskij]

What I want to know is if any supporter of major terrorist organizations has ever labelled their money transfer as "ISIS Donation"/"Bomb Fund"/"Al-Qaeda". Just give me one person in the history of the world stupid enough to do that, and there is at least some argument to me made for this ridiculous sounding policy.

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

You wish it was that good as the aforementioned places. You are in America after all, land of unlimited opportunities... For things to go sideways

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[fustakrakich]

That totally depends on which institution.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[fustakrakich]

Just like everyone else, 50% of them have a double-digit IQ.

Just high enough to demand payment in American greenbacks.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

Or maybe his friend was a really big fan of The TV show:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0072516/

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

I wonder how long before HSBC is busted for banking for isis and fined *finger in teeth * one million dollars!

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

Or Archer, which would even make sense for a drinking money joke.

http://archer.wikia.com/wiki/I...

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

It's not just the "ISIS Beer Fund" label, but when you combine it with the large amount of money, I can see why they need to investigate it.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[tsqr]

Meanwhile, terrorists are smart enough not to label a money transfer as ISIS BOMB FUNDING.

That's right. And a terrorist attempting to smuggle a bomb aboard a commercial airline flight is smart enough not to tell the baggage porter, "There's a bomb in that suitcase." But if a regular (non-terrorist) person says such a thing in jest, they will get a thorough anal probing.

Many years ago, long before the establishment of TSA, I was flying with a work colleague to a contractor site on the opposite coast, with a smallish but heavy hunk of electronic equipment that had been under test until shortly before we left for the airport. The baggage inspector put her hand on the cardboard box containing the equipment and exclaimed, "It's warm! Why is it warm?" My idiot colleague responded with, "Don't worry; it's not a bomb." I could have happily strangled that guy on the spot. Need I add that his little joke resulted in our being led off to a small room for an extended, unpleasant interview?

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[belrick]

That word "knowingly". I do not think it means what you think it means.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[linuxgurugamer]

Gaah! I started to read that link, but what a load of hogwash.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[jellomizer]

Well if I were trying to replace my TWAIN scanner drivers with a different method.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[fustakrakich]

What? Where is the hogwash? You think the government is innocent? We playing and selling to both sides, just like during the Iran/Iraq war. Where is the difficulty in understanding that?

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[aberglas]

The policy is not at all ridiculous at all, you just miss the point. Terrorism is a very serious business and we cannot have people making fun about it. Not at airports, not anywhere. The more serious people take terrorism, the more funding is available.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, he probably expected a different result. Who knew this "Venmo" thing was a money-stealing scam? Sure, many people probably assume it's a scam until they see evidence to the contrary, but others default in the other direction.

I predict this "OFAC regulations" thing is about to become very popular with online criminals. "Sorry, I can't forward the money nor refund it. It's mine now, sucker, and I have A LAW to hide behind. Muahahaha!!"

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

"let"?
How do you intend on stopping them? Peashooters?

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[fustakrakich]

Sorry, maybe this is more suitable to your tastes...

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[flopsquad]

Ah the Windows tagline that never was. Apparently it tested poorly in the scientific computing community, and with everyone else.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

I hope your comment was intended to be funny, because free speech trumps terrorism stuff.

And if you don't agree, go live in a fascist state, instead of one which believes in free speech.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

Ah that classic bit of war on terror bullshit. "We have to take every obvious joke serious because terizim!"

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

The more serious people take terrorism, the more funding is available.

Especially when funding comes by stealing money transfers from people joking about terrorism.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Locke2005]

Nope, the opposite is true: the more we make fun of terrorist groups, the less likely alienated Muslim youths are to run off to Syria to join them!

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

What your friend said was pretty stupid, but let's be honest: the long interview would have happened no matter what. The inspector was already in alert mode, so showing her or explaining about a hunk of electronic equipment would not in any way have diffused the situation.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[squiggleslash]

Why not? Since when has a certain terror group (which doesn't even call itself ISIS) have a monopoly on that sequence of letters? Just for reference, I know of at least one school called the Isis Middle School, and it's in Oxford, England (or was, apparently it closed a few years ago, but not due to any terror ties...)

Blocking funds because those four letters appear in the description is utterly absurd.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[linuxrocks123]

That doesn't sound like a joke to me. It was an honest statement, and relevant to the inspector's question. Granted, it wasn't a particularly helpful response, so perhaps was said with some annoyance, but still, pretty unassailable. I agree with the sibling poster: you were going to the room either way.

I'd like to know how they could have used that statement in interrogation. "YOU SAID IT WASN'T A BOMB? YOU KNOW LYING TO AN OFFICER IS A FEDERAL OFFENSE? YOU WANT TO TAKE THAT STATEMENT BACK?"

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Swave An deBwoner]

Unless they are from Lake Wobegon in which case they are all above average.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Swave An deBwoner]

Congratulations! You have proven Poe's Law.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[aberglas]

It is interesting how people cannot see beyond the end of their nose. Stopping alienated Muslim youth running off would be an absolute disaster. That is why we go out of our way to alienate them. To grow the industry.

Remember, every time a government agency spends umpteen million dollars on some silly scheme the GDP of the nation goes up by that amount.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Jiro]

People under stress say and do stupid things related to the source of the stress. And bombing a plane is highly stressful. I would expect that bombers would have a high chance of going to either extreme--at one end is making bomb jokes and at the other end is being too eager to volunteer "oh, no, I don't have any bombs" when nobody even mentioned the word 'bomb' yet.

Don't think that just because it's stupid for someone with a bomb to mention it, that they won't.

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

Archer needs money, you know.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

This is fucking stupid. I could be for someone they know named Isis or it could be in reference to the Egyptian god.

The word "Isis" is not a reason to overreact like this. They're just a bunch of paranoid, think-of-the-children, SJW nutjobs and every one of them should go die in a fire.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Gojira Shipi-Taro]

Seriously. The policy is stupid but how hard is it not to say completely stupid shit like that for no reason (apart from fucking with a perfectly innocent person monitoring the queue)?

It's a financial transaction. Not a post on Slashdot.

Perhaps think a LITTLE harder?

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[rtb61]

Talking about that Egyptian Goddess https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/..., you would reckon people could have quite a bit of fun with that, poking them for being named after an Goddess, and not covered up at all. It seems like the do not understand the Goddess they are named after at all ;).

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[whit3]

What if it really was for ISIS? I don't see the problem.

Like, Isis, the old Egyptian deity? Why would beer money, transferred within the US, be confiscated rather than allowing an offering to the goddess of some tasty beverage? The "Office of Foreign Assets Control" is bound to return the guy's money, if they have it. "Unreasonable ... seizure" is prohibited by the US constitution (amendment #4). It might not happen soon, but unless a court orders otherwise, they can't keep the money. 'Detaining' someone's property can be a problem. I can see it, clearly. Why can't you?

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

I've had the honor, so to speak, of working with OFAC. The actual OFAC list is horribly fuzzy - all Osama bin Ladin would have had to do is not use the Fox News spelling ("Usama") and a computer match would fail. But a popular Hispanic name caused no end of grief because it was also the name of a money-laundering travel agency. It also included the entire democractically-elected government of Palestine, name by name. Just for having been elected to office.

One thing I never heard of, however, was that the financial organization could confiscate funds just because you came up on the OFAC hit list. I can see the Feds doing that as a variation on the old asset forfiture beer-money raising scam, but not the bank.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

...Just give me one person in the history of the world stupid enough to do that

How about anyone who gave to this lot?

What I want to know is if any supporter of major terrorist organizations has ever labelled their money transfer as "ISIS Donation"/"Bomb Fund"/"Al-Qaeda".

Oh, I forgot, they weren't terrists, but good ole freedom fighters...me bad...

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

ISIS are model Muslims. True paragons of the Faith.

Such people would never drink beer. Or watch porn.

Oh wait, didn't bin Laden ...???

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

It is not an investigation.

Venmo has a list of words that they believe they can use to steal money from customers. They can if they want issue a refund or let it pass. Only if it was actually isis or hitler they could forward the money to government.

If gov was involved he would either get money back or get a fine. One or the other.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

ISIS is a CIA operation. It is named after the goddess these people worship.IOW the CIA sends more funds to ISIS than anybody else.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[jc42]

... The "Office of Foreign Assets Control" is bound to return the guy's money, if they have it. "Unreasonable ... seizure" is prohibited by the US constitution (amendment #4). It might not happen soon, but unless a court orders otherwise, they can't keep the money. 'Detaining' someone's property can be a problem. I can see it, clearly. Why can't you?

Probably because Venmo is handled by a private corporation (and a flock of banks), and the US Constitution is generally considered by the legal system to apply only to the US government. Corporations can legally do lots of things that the government can't, such as enforce religions, ban unacceptable speech, etc., etc.

There are laws again theft that do apply to corporations, and Venmo may be charged under such laws. But corporations commit thefts like this all the time, and they often get away with it.

(Actually, if Venmo were a government agency, they'd probably drag the suspected terrorist off to a holding cell for a bit of "enhanced interrogation". So maybe the victim should be glad they're only stealing his money. ;-)

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

Well... That is because of horribly stupid legislation along with a nation of cowards. Can't help you with that. But it's clear that you need to stay away from cloud "services" and encrypt everything. If only just to save yourself from an incompetent government.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

Terrorism is a very serious business and we cannot have people making fun about it.

Terrorism is an unimportant subject compared to politics and democracy.
Are you going to stop people form making jokes about that too?

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[KGIII]

That's true but the complaint here seems to be ISIS. Now, I can make a reasoned argument that one should be allowed to send funds to ISIS. I could, I could make that argument. I could even make it sound good. Can you do that?

'Cause this leads me to next point...

I like drugs as much as the next person - and probably more than most but how'd you get to drugs from ISIS? Are you gonna make the argument that it's about poppy growth and not about head chopping off? Or... 'Cause I'm not actually sure what that has to do with this story which is OFAC and ISIS.

I mean, you made a good point and all but are you sure you're in the right thread? Drugs will do that to you. I speak from experience. and I suspect I've the posting history to prove it, that posting while inebriated will make you do some screwy shit. But, yeah... I'm not really seeing a clear connection between this particular event and drugs - though I'm guessing they probably do the same thing for drugs, that's not actually material to this particular event. It does look good and it's hard to argue with it but it's just not actually the topic.

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[KGIII]

I wonder how long the company held onto the transacted funds and collected interest on said funds and I wonder what happened to the transaction fee. I've never used the application, I admit, but I'm betting there was a transaction fee associated with it as well. It might not be much with this one person but how often does this sort of thing happen and how much money is actually made by this?

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[KGIII]

The corporations can steal it from you and the government can beat it out of you. Seems like a rather rowdy buggering no matter which way you go, doesn't it?

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[KGIII]

Yes, I can see it now. All the local women out there pointing, laughing, and poking fun at the ISIS members as they walk down the street, fresh from beheading a homosexual boy and those ISIS members being so ashamed that they run and hide their faces in their mother's skirts.

Boy, making fun of 'em for being named after an Egyptian Goddess is high on their list of dislikes! They're certainly cowed by the jokes, innuendo, and tittering from the teen girls that line the streets and the hordes of old men who sip coffee and play Pinochle all day.

It'd probably even make them think twice about what they're doing! Those silly gooses!

On a more serious note, I'm actually sure more than one person has cracked jokes about it. I just pretty sure they'll happily use it as an excuse to be outraged and do some apostate murdering as their chosen method of recourse. I'm also guessing that those close enough to actually make said jokes are more concerned with keeping their lives than they are at making witty remarks and clowning around. But, you know, that's just a hunch. ;-)

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[pepsikid]

I'm extremely interested in knowing what, if any, explanation would NOT result in the bank sorrowfully seizing that naughty money?

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[KGIII]

Actually, for better or worse there are some people who seem inclined to take any reference, that is not serious (or perhaps reverent) enough, to be a BAD THING©. In some places, making certain references will get you in trouble. An example would be making a bomb joke in an airport. Probably not gonna be considered funny by anyone - not even if you're a comedian. It's probably going to result in a variety of repercussions.

So, for better or worse, I don't know what nation you live in but it's certainly not the United States of America. No, they've been working on reducing the right to free speech for quite a long time. It's probably not too late to stop it without bloodshed but I doubt cooler heads will prevail and I suspect we'll slide toward greater and greater tyranny and control. It also seems likely that it will be at least partially at the behest of the majority or, at the very least, a very vocal minority.

If I had to, I'd further speculate that such is the natural progression of governance. There's a pendulum and, quite often, the pendulum swings with violence. I'd even suggest that if we could stop the pendulum before it swung too far then there would be less violence. That'd require rational actors and humans are not rational beings, they're rationalizing beings.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[davester666]

I'd like to thank him for doing his part to reduce our national debt. More people should do this.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Maritz]

Given that other popular acronyms for those dickheads are ISIL and IS, people better start writing their transaction notes in past tense exclusively.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Maritz]

I personally think that even apparent demagogues of a particular faith are a whole lot less pious when they think no-one's looking. Probably because they don't believe it quite as much as they let on, and it's actually about power and control (which of course, is the point of religion in the first place).

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[butzwonker]

I guess the journal ISIS by Chicago University Press has gotten funding problems...

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

Sure, but the idiot probably admit guild by stating it was a joke. Do you know how fast you were going? Do you know why I am stopping you?

Never admit anything to authoritarian ass hole. When asked why he send money to terrorist, he should never said it was a joke; The only correct awenser is that he did not, THEY are mistaken.

You think the worst thign that can happen is losing his money? Wait until the government start punching his name in the system. Was it Buttle or Tuttle?

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Maritz]

The two sets of people in particular who stand to benefit most from terrorism being taken 'seriously' are the current political elite, and terrorists. Both want to play it up to the maximum possible. In that they are certainly allies.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Maritz]

I reckon I would put "don't talk about bombs" just under "don't talk unless required" in my agenda for suicide bomber classes. But yeah, I'm sure they do all sorts of weird things.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[N1AK]

It's $42 dollars to a friend for some beer with a message they probably assumed no one other than the recipient actually sees; maybe it is a little stupid to assume that this kind of stuff isn't being monitored constantly and overreacted to but that's pretty depressing in itself.

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

1. Soap box
2. Ballot box
3. Jury box
4. Ammo box

Please use in order.

However, it does seem that the soap box still has some potency left. The ballot box seems to be broken as ever. Without #1, the jury box unfortunately will not help. Jurors need to begin refusing to convict people of victimless "crimes." Perhaps the fact that they do is evidence that the soap box is broken and in effect so is the jury box. As far as the ammo box, I guess I'm not sure. It seems futile at first glance, especially when I consider that the militias are just as big of a threat to me as big government thanks to anti-homosexual Jew-sponsored propaganda. (Granted, they've been at it nearly 2,000 years since their early cult invention--Christianity--torched the Library of Alexandria.)

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

They take the money to stop it getting to ISIS via a different route, Obvs.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[sociocapitalist]

Yeah they probably memo that as "Payment to a dear friend for two pitchers of Samuel Adams Boston Lager"

And the Department of Financial Security Monitoring (comrade) goes "Oh that's so nice - we approve of that".

Your transfer referencing SABL has been blocked due to federal regulations against funding potential weapons development.

Scanning Aerosol Backscatter Lidar

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[sociocapitalist]

What I want to know is if any supporter of major terrorist organizations has ever labelled their money transfer as "ISIS Donation"/"Bomb Fund"/"Al-Qaeda". Just give me one person in the history of the world stupid enough to do that, and there is at least some argument to me made for this ridiculous sounding policy.

Well...
http://www.oddee.com/item_9894...
"10 Of The Dumbest Terrorists Ever"

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Bongo]

And there's a bunch of companies called ISIS, after the River Isis, part of River Thames.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

Or maybe his friend was a really big fan of The TV show:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0072516/

I was just a little kid running around in pajamas on Saturday mornings when that show aired. I can remember that even back then I thought that ISIS was hot as hell.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[squiggleslash]

Come to think of it, it would be amusing if the British government confiscated the private pension payments of Americans living in the UK. I mean, those are blatant IRA contributions - and as such obviously terrorist in nature...

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[rtb61]

Their whole exercise is a massive ego trip. Nothing at all to do with faith and everything to do with ego, anything that punctures that ego makes the weaker and more chaotic and affects their ability to recruit. In case exactly how much effort do you think is required to mock them, billions of dollars like bombs, hundreds of millions of dollars, in reality not even thousands of dollars and it will have a greater impact that millions of dollars worth of bombs. So on a more serious wake up to yourself, every avenue is worth it and those worth most provide the greatest return for the least capital investment.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[MitchDev]

No shit, America HAS already fallen. It's just going through the death throes and too few people have noticed or admitted it....

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't know. In Baltimore near where I live they do it all the time, which is why there are so many murders.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[TheCarp]

This never made any sense to me. Incorporation is a status invented by the government. I don't see why a company should be able to enjoy such a privileged status as limited liability without restriction. Why should congress have the power to grant such limitations on liability to companies that don't respect the rights of their fellow citizens?

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Vlad_the_Inhaler]

I remember reading about someone called Isis a few weeks ago, her Facebook profile had repeatedly been deleted. What would happen here?
The simplest solution is not to use this "service".

Btw, don't bombs cost more than $42 to make? A lot more?

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Sperbels]

Well, once he fills out his 27b/6 in triplicate, everything should be okay.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[thegarbz]

Given the propensity towards recruiting engineers I would say they are far more intelligent.

Even intelligent people have imaginary friends.
And what kind of an idiot would reject 72 virgins.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Grishnakh]

I can easily make an argument about sending funds to Isis: what if that's the person's name? There are women out there who are named Isis, it's the name of an Egyptian goddess.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

No, they impounded the money. If he wants them he can get it back, through some legal proceedings.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

That sentence doesn't make any sense.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[omnichad]

Lots of Slashdotters are virgins and get rejected every day.

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Type44Q]

Placards. Pea shooters will likely be banned shortly...

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Type44Q]

fresh from beheading a homosexual boy

Was that before or after they were done raping him?

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Type44Q]

but what a load of hogwash.

Your dedicated adherence to the official narrative has been noted. ;)

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

Are you, or have you ever bin Laden?

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Type44Q]

I strongly suspect you're wasting your efforts but I commend you for trying.

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Type44Q]

And what kind of an idiot would reject 72 virgins.

Actually, I covered this in detail several months back (this was quite popular so I'm shamelessly reposting it - if you haven't gathered, I'm nothing if not shameless):

When they showed up at the door, at first I thought they were Mormons (Jehovah's Witnesses tend to dress a little shabbier). The only way I could tell they were actually Isis was when I saw the little star-and-crescent pendants they were wearing. In any case, I invited them in and we discussed the ins and outs of their theology over a couple rounds of scotch I had tucked away for just such an occasion (I thought they might balk at the offer but they said that while it was okay for their suicide bombers to drink, recruiting is considered such a shitty assignment that drinking is pretty much encouraged). Anyway, after our conversation had run its length, we had a cheerful departure and I watched them slowly weave down the driveway in their bullet-ridden Hilux (barely managing to avoid snagging their bed-mounted 50-cal on a low-hanging limb). When I'd gone back inside, I sat down and spent some time researching on the Internet, giving careful consideration to the various merits of their belief system (there were more than a few, I assure you), However, in the end I decided that while having to wear a long beard would suck (too itchy) and I don't much care for the thought of eating goat (their eyes weird me out), being outnumbered by 72 virgins would be the real deal-breaker: Six dozen entitled, passive-aggressive little bitches that are guaranteed to be terrible in the sack (being virgins and all)... no thank you.

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[KGIII]

Always after. Never before. What? Do you think they's savages or something?!?

Do I need to put in the /s? I'm thinking I do not, with you - at least. You're smart enough to understand. *sighs* Others? Not so much. Speaking of smart, my project is coming along nicely. You should send me an email sometime and ask for the URL - especially if you're any good at that web stuff. *nods*

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

It does, actually. Imagine the scenario where terrorists just started pen-testing services by trying different keywords to see what's being monitored. At least by holding the money you make that exercise have a material cost.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[KGIII]

I mean ISIS the terrorist organization. Presenting a well-reasoned argument supporting the idea that one should be able to send them, specifically, funds is a bit more difficult but, having thought about it, I think I can do it and pull it off.

I should add that I was on the debate team all the way through from about 7th grade until I got my Ph.D. some years later. (Obviously, not the same team.) I skipped a couple of years but I liked it because it forced me to be creative and I am not naturally a creative person. I have to actually work at being creative and it's not easy.

I think I could do fairly well presenting that argument. It's a matter of freedom and, even if the system were perfect and only blocked appropriately, the government has no business worrying about such affairs. I'd have to take a pretty hard-line approach to it but I'd start with a series of questions such as, "We must ask ourselves, should the government be in the business of curtailing speech. Should they?" That's assuming conversational debate but I think I could do it - I'd then lead into it that way.

Unfortunately, I'm a realist. I think that we should not be at liberty to fund true terrorist organizations but I think we should have some checks and balances and that this should be processed by the government and not some corporation. I feel there shouldn't be a set of names but individual acts that are highlighted should be judged on their own merits.

However, I could make a well reasoned argument that it should be allowed.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[KGIII]

I'm going to have to walk a thin line. You will see why. Play nice Mr. NSA man who reads this! Play nice and use your damned head for something other than a hat rest, Mr. NSA man who's now definitely reading this.

When I was a kid we used to do things like take empty CO2 cartridges and fill them with black powder and a "Chinese" (waterproof) fuse of varied length. Sometimes we'd score them. They'd blow a big ol' hole in the ground and throw shrapnel around everywhere. Total cost (back then) about $0.10, probably. The CO2 cartridges were empty from our BB Guns. We also used anything else that looked handy.

We blew up everything. It was like $6 for a 5# box of black powder. It's not that much more expensive today. One company, in their infinite glory, sold their powder in a 1# container and the container was made of aluminum and had a screw on cap. I think that one was $1.50. A *pound* of gunpowder might not sound like much. It's a whole lot of fun.

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

You can make a decent size ANFO charge with $42, which is primarily what organizations like the Taliban were using against soldiers.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[cellocgw]

You're a debate team member. That means you want to win despite the underlying validity or lack thereof in your position.

That makes your entire post pointless, unless you like trolling.

As NdGT says, "Lawyers argue. Scientists discuss and test."

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[computererds]

Btw, don't bombs cost more than $42 to make? A lot more?

Nope. I won't get detailed on making field expedient explosives; you'll have to trust me that they can be made on the cheap.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[kmoser]

Btw, don't bombs cost more than $42 to make? A lot more?

Obviously they were crowdfunding.

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

Can't they just see who and where they were sending the money TO and be able to tell if that account is a terrorist?

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[CanadianMacFan]

You do realize it's 72 former /. users.

Re: Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

One _should_ use stupid labels like this to highlight the stupidity of the system. I've been known to use "cocaine smuggling" on my bank transfers. A software engineer I know always uses email subject lines like "double the length of your t00l"

We do this because we understand the world is big and complicated, and we don't want to live in a world that is simplified to the point of stupidity and where everyone everywhere takes everything literally.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[misnohmer]

The policy is not at all ridiculous at all, you just miss the point. Terrorism is a very serious business and we cannot have people making fun about it. Not at airports, not anywhere. The more serious people take terrorism, the more funding is available.

Are you seriously suggesting that it's government business to be getting involved in a verbal joke between 2 private individuals? They guy didn't start a website collecting ISIS Beer fund, or place posters, or even post a public comment on a site - it was a private comment between 2 individuals. The terrorists sure won with people like you - terrorized to the point that they are willing to give the government full rights to censor and even punish (by taking money) private conversations between 2 people. This is truly ridiculous.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[jewsdid911]

Go put a fedora on. Atheism is the dumbest religion of all.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[jc42]

If you look into the history of the concept of a "corporation", you'll find that it was developed for exactly this purpose. The idea is that if it's illegal for a person to do something, you can create a corporation consisting of several people, together they do the thing that would be illegal for any of them to do, and if there's a legal challenge, they can just say "Hey, I didn't do it; the corporation did." The legal system can punish the corporation if so desired, but the corporation doesn't pass the punishment along to its employees. This is referred to as "limited liability", and it's the primary reason that corporations were invented. It insulates the corporation's owners from legal liability.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Coren22]

I think his tin foil hat might be a little tight as well. It seems that the author's failure is in conflating support for people opposed to the rule of Assad with supporting ISIS. He must not realize that there are several organizations in Syria, not just a couple. There is also some stuff that appears to be supposition on why a case against someone was dropped, and taking it to a totally different level than anything that was actually released about the case. But, this is the way the Guardian works, they take a single document, and conflate it with every one of the conspiracy theories they can come up with.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Coren22]

Never greet your uncle Jack in an airport...

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[fustakrakich]

Well, for one thing, there is more than a "single document". But hey, people are most welcome to believe whatever makes them most comfortable. I am not interested in confronting the faithful who won't admit they've been taken for a ride.

Re:Did you expect a different result? ~nt~

[Anonymous Coward]

So you have insider knowledge about terrorists' money transfers? I think someone's knocking on your door.

Legal?

[Anonymous Coward]

Sounds like he needs to take them to court.
Just claiming that someone might be a terrorist doesn't give you the right to steal their money.

Re:Legal?

[dejitaru]

Taking them to court for $42 doesn't really seem worth it, especially considering in the article that was published he admitted knowing what he was doing (but probably drunk).

Re:Legal?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's not about the money. It's about sending a message.

Re:Legal?

[mrchaotica]

In a sane and just society, civil court wouldn't be the right place to deal with it. In reality, this is a simple issue of theft and all the guy should have to do is file a police report and wait for the perp at Venmo to get arrested.

But of course, we live in an insane and unjust society where essential rights are allowed to be abrogated by contract law. Until we fix that, we will never progress.

Re:Legal?

[Anonymous Coward]

In a sane and just society, civil court wouldn't be the right place to deal with it. In reality, this is a simple issue of theft and all the guy should have to do is file a police report and wait for the perp at Venmo to get arrested.

As part of the complaint he can allege that Venmo may be in receipt of terrorist funds. Oh the irony drips from his pen.

Re:Legal?

[LT218]

Taking them to court for $42 doesn't really seem worth it, especially considering in the article that was published he admitted knowing what he was doing (but probably drunk).

Making a joke, even in poor taste isn't against the law unless explicitly defined such as yelling "Fire!" in a theater. The amount should be of secondary importance compared to the principle of standing up to anyone who confiscates your money when you have broken no laws that would give them legal standing to do so.

The rules vary by location and such but in general, getting small amounts of money that are rightly owed to you is precisely what small claims court is for. You generally do not need a lawyer for most small claims suits.

Sadly, on average we have become an extremely lazy and complacent society. The entities that want to take your rights away know this and have gamed the system by purposely making it inconvenient to stand up for your rights. Nothing will change until people stop being lazy and stand up for their rights even if it is inconvenient and requires some effort.

Re:Legal?

[Dunbal]

Due process died a long time ago. Now the rule is "aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand it's gone!"

Re:Legal?

[Dunbal]

Taking them to court for $42 doesn't really seem worth it

This is exactly what they are counting on.

Re: Legal?

[Type44Q]

In reality, this is a simple issue of theft and all the guy should have to do is file a police report and wait for the perp at Venmo to get arrested.

Extremely well put.

Re:Legal?

[Anonymous Coward]

isn't against the law unless explicitly defined such as yelling "Fire!" in a theater.

Sigh, not this again.
There is no law against yelling fire in a theater, even if there isn't a fire, and even if it's a crowded theater.
However, the law does hold you responsible for your actions. So, if you cause a panic, by yelling fire or dropping your pants or whatever, and people panic and get hurt, you will be held responsible for the damage and harm you caused.
But if you yell fire, and nobody reacts because they know you're a dumb joker, then you won't get fined or punished, because there are no laws against that. Unless you keep doing it, ignore requests to leave the premises, and get arrested for trespassing.

Re:Legal?

[Anonymous Coward]

Taking them to court for $42 doesn't really seem worth it, especially considering in the article that was published he admitted knowing what he was doing (but probably drunk).

Theft isn't just a civil matter. The point isn't to sue them for $42, the point is to stop a criminal from stealing more money.

Re:Legal?

[Anonymous Coward]

No jury would ever find in his favor. The defense just needs to show a YouTube pic of some kids being killed by Daesh, mention the fact that the organization can't know or not if it is real... game over.

Re:Legal?

[Anonymous Coward]

$42 for 2 pitchers of a standard domestic beer seems like a ripoff and maybe he should be going to court with the bar.

Re: Legal?

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm sure they will be working on shifts to solve that case. IANAL but the fact that you knowingly gave them possession relegates it to civil court, as well

Re:Legal?

[Impy the Impiuos Imp]

Fine tidbit: The fire in a theater quote was originally from a Supreme Court ruling (and now considered one of the worst of all time) that went on to do a lot more than outlaw stirring up a stampede needlessly, and uphold a law making it illegal to publish pamphlets that urged people to "resist the draft using all legal means", during WW I.

The ruling argued it interfered with Congress' power to raise armies via recruitment. The judge who authored it soon changed his mind, but it was not overturned until freaking 1969.

Re:Legal?

[Anonymous Coward]

Nope, less than $500 isn't even worthy of a civil court case.

Re:Legal?

[mysidia]

Taking them to court for $42 doesn't really seem worth it,

Taking them to court for $42 PLUS legal expenses PLUS the cost of time off from work.

Re:Legal?

[mysidia]

This is exactly what they are counting on.

At this point, you'd think there would be a whole industry of companies you could sell your interest in the $42 to, who would give you five bucks and automate the process of suing the parasites to hell.

Re:Legal?

[Obfuscant]

But of course, we live in an insane and unjust society where essential rights are allowed to be abrogated by contract law.

Using PayPal is an essential right?

You want to use their system, why shouldn't you agree to their terms? You aren't forced to use it. It's a convenience for you.

The biggest insanity of society today is the number of conveniences that people are now claiming as essential rights.

Re:Legal?

[just another AC]

But of course, we live in an insane and unjust society where essential rights are allowed to be abrogated by contract law.

Using PayPal is an essential right?

You want to use their system, why shouldn't you agree to their terms? You aren't forced to use it. It's a convenience for you.

The biggest insanity of society today is the number of conveniences that people are now claiming as essential rights.

Right. So if your local movie chain (or insert any other commercial operation) puts some obscure rainy day clause in small writing on the movie ticket, you won't complain if you sit in the movie and they announce they aren't going to show the movie or give you a refund?

This is about the right to not be defrauded. It might not make the top 3 inalienable rights, but it sure as hell is enshrined into law in a dozen different ways. If you want to live in a capitalistic society, this is the one thing you need to ensure it doesn't completely collapse.

Re: Legal?

[Anonymous Coward]

All he needs is to show that he isnt in the slammer.

Re:Legal?

[Anonymous Coward]

No welcome to the real world. This is not amusement park; and things don't always go your way.
And yes counter-terrorism units are not very well know for their humor; they just can't afford it.

Re:Legal?

[mishehu]

It's not just about being lazy. Think about how much of everything is centered around on wearing your done completely so that you no longer have energy to fight back and will just pay up. Making threats of lawsuit hold no weight, you actually have to go and file the paperwork. I'm rather overworked at the moment, and don't have time to deal with going to small claims over $42 - the opportunity cost for me for that is too high. And yet I would really love it if somebody kicked the shit out of whoever thought that ISIS == Daesh. Besides, does Daesh actually allow for the consumption of alcohol? I don't think the Wahabi'ists in Saudi do, but don't know about Daesh.

Re:Legal?

[Obfuscant]

Right. So if your local movie chain (or insert any other commercial operation) puts some obscure rainy day clause in small writing on the movie ticket,

Of course I will complain about it. But I won't try claiming that watching a movie in their theater is some kind of essential right. I'll take them to small claims if I need to, but small claims court isn't about enforcing "essential rights", it's about enforcing contracts and reasonable terms in such. Like the fitness of purpose, etc.

This is about the right to not be defrauded.

I'm sorry, what? You forgot about the right of free people to enter into contracts here.

If you want to live in a capitalistic society, this is the one thing you need to ensure it doesn't completely collapse.

You need to ensure that contracts don't contain invalid or one-sided terms, but once that's done, the law should end. Trying to claim that seeing a movie is an essential right is far outside of the scope of the law.

Re:Legal?

[rew]

So let me make up an example story.

You're going on vacation or business trip and call a cab to go to the airport. You put your luggage in the trunk, have a pleasant conversation on the way to the airport and after you pay the driver, he says: Sorry sir, but the trunk-security-system detected [something dangerous that is NOT in your luggage], your luggage is being safely destroyed, have a nice day.

You agreed to the "terms and conditions" of the cab company that they may scan your luggage and proceed as appropriate when they detect something dangerous. That seems entirely plausible and acceptable, until it hits a false positive and they are destroying YOUR property.

Somehow, it seems that SOME people feel "safe" that something is being done. But taking people's property because of a perceived threat is wrong. It would be acceptable if they say: "Your transfer triggered a double check, it will go through with a couple of days delay". If someone really thinks this is a serious threat, then go ahead and arrest the guy.

This is similar to the discrimination situation. It's all fun-and-games until it happens to you and they pick on you.

Re:Legal?

[Obfuscant]

You agreed to the "terms and conditions" of the cab company that they may scan your luggage and proceed as appropriate when they detect something dangerous.

Wrong.

This is similar to the discrimination situation.

Joking about a payment being for ISIS isn't a discrimination situation.

Why do you need an app???

[Anonymous Coward]

It's called Paypal, Millenials.

Re:Why do you need an app???

[jenningsthecat]

It's called Paypal, Millenials.

If you're trolling, then reel these in:

https://bgr.com/2015/05/20/paypal-credit-scam-25-million/

http://fortune.com/2012/02/24/ebays-got-a-paypal-problem/

https://www.consumeraffairs.com/online/paypal_02.html?page=2

That's just the tip of the iceberg. I refuse to use PayPal, and anybody who doesn't take some other means of payment, doesn't get my business.

Re:Why do you need an app???

[omnichad]

That's as much of an app as Venmo. Either gives you the option of using the web site instead.

Re:Why do you need an app???

[Anonymous Coward]

And Paypal is not an application how, exactly?

Yes, I don't expect them to read the reason...

[JcMorin]

Why would they read and analysed the reason of the transfer... I guess this will drive people using other technique such as Bitcoin.

Re:Yes, I don't expect them to read the reason...

[amiga3D]

I had never heard of Venmo so I googled it. After reading about it I was like "what the fuck?" Paypal isn't bad enough? The whole thing is sketchy at best. This is what happens when you get rid of physical money. Venmo may be convenient but it's also a convenient way to get fucked as this guy apparently discovered.

Apps!

[Anonymous Coward]

App appers who app apps using apps get apped!

Apps!

Re:Apps!

[Anonymous Coward]

This.

This tool deserves to lose his money.

WTF?

[OzPeter]

Do they really think that the terrorists explicitly mark the reason for their payments?

Re:WTF?

[H3lldr0p]

We can't take that chance. Won't you think of all of the children!

On a more serious note, all it takes is for one person to screw up for them to be caught. Something like this could potentially catch such a mistake but that chance is so small as to make no difference. So what we end up with are hidden rules to catch the improbable butting up against the inevitable joke that will occur. It catches the innocent, the profane, and those who are attempt to point out that the emperor has no clothes. Punishing them all in the same way as if they had done something violently wrong and doing so without trial or appeal.

Re:WTF?

[Anonymous Coward]

That's how Venmo enforces it [just like many other private companies], yes. That's not how the legal system in the US works, though.

Re:WTF?

[Wycliffe]

On a more serious note, all it takes is for one person to screw up for them to be caught.

I can see using this for investigating but if nothing is found then the money should be returned. I tend to go shopping at several stores right before a big trip which is atypical for me so it's common for me to get a call from my credit card company or sometimes even have my card get turned off but as soon as they verify that the transaction is fine then everything goes back to normal. They also have random triggers for money deposits or withdrawals at the bank where they write your name in a book if you hit some secret thresholds. Again, this has happened to me a few times but that was it, presumably someone investigated and decided that I was fine and moved on.

Re:WTF?

[jratcliffe]

Think of it this way. They let the payment go through, odds are 99.99% it's a joke. They make maybe $1 in fees. If it isn't a joke, and OFAC nails them, it's at minimum $100k in legal fees, potential penalties, and reputational problems. That's an expected value of $10. So, it becomes a bad bet.

Re:WTF?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's more that nobody wants to be "that idiot who forwarded money with 'for teh terrorz' on it to a real terrorist" when the TLA's kick in the door.

It's not about whether they actually thought it was for terrorism, it's pure ass-covering and fear of what the government will do to you if you can't prove you followed procedure.

Re:WTF?

[Anonymous Coward]

Having been a corporate drone for the past 2 decades, I've come to the conclusion to never, ever underestimate the sheer amount of stupidity in the world, especially in positions of power.

Re:WTF?

[Anonymous Coward]

For the bureaucracy, there's no percentage in being understanding, having a sense of humour, or any of that.

Think of it this way. An idiot marks a payment as "ISIS Beer Fund". There are only 2 possibilities:

1). It really is money for an ISIS beer fund. If the payment is allowed to go through, ISIS gets to laugh at the bureaucracy and keep the money. In short it's fodder for yet another internet video from our terroristic 'friends' and a black eye for the government;

2). It's a bad joke and not ISIS beer money. Yet if the transaction is allowed to go through, Won't You Think Of The Children types (as well as umpteen Fox talking heads) can get all exercised about how it 'might' have been terrorists. If the transaction is stopped and goes public, then everyone blames the citizen doing it for being an idiot.

Either way, for the bureaucracy the best way to handle this is to stop the payment. There's literally no downside for them doing so. Conversely there's lots of downside if the bureaucracy fails to intervene.

Re:WTF?

[aliquis]

Do they really think that the terrorists explicitly mark the reason for their payments?

I wouldn't be surprised if "Allahu akbar" or "Insha'Allah" would be triggers .. :D

Because US is more culturally and politically confident than Europe =P

Re:WTF?

[K. S. Kyosuke]

Think of it this way. An idiot marks a payment as "ISIS Beer Fund". There are only 2 possibilities:

1). It really is money for an ISIS beer fund. If the payment is allowed to go through, ISIS gets to laugh at the bureaucracy and keep the money. In short it's fodder for yet another internet video from our terroristic 'friends' and a black eye for the government;

2). It's a bad joke and not ISIS beer money. Yet if the transaction is allowed to go through, Won't You Think Of The Children types (as well as umpteen Fox talking heads) can get all exercised about how it 'might' have been terrorists. If the transaction is stopped and goes public, then everyone blames the citizen doing it for being an idiot

Or, the third of your "two" possibilities is that the guy simply wants to buy some Isis beer.

Re:WTF?

[FrozenGeek]

Do they really think ISIS has a beer fund?

Re:WTF?

[russotto]

Or maybe they want to buy beer for Isis

Re: WTF?

[Anonymous Coward]

And even if they lose, they get $42! You'd be a fool not to.

Re: WTF?

[Anonymous Coward]

Which would be fine if they were forwarding the investigation to feds.

But they just take the money.

What's in a name?

[Anonymous Coward]

I actually went to school with a girl who was named Isis. Guess she's going to have a hard time accepting money from anyone!

Re:What's in a name?

[the_skywise]

You went to school with All Mighty Isis?!

Re:What's in a name?

[zlives]

time to visit a panama lawyer

Re:What's in a name?

[Anonymous Coward]

I was more worried about the Feds showing up at my doorstep when I was researching a certain link-state routing protocol.

Re:What's in a name?

[zlives]

she wasn't all mighty, i mean pretty cool and all but, she did get her but kicked around for quite a bit.

also i wonder what isis thinks of being named after a female heathen god :)

the God, she is funny

Re:What's in a name?

[arglebargle_xiv]

I have an ISIS flag on one side of my house, a Pakistani one on the other, and an al Qaeda sign over the door. I live in a bad neigbourhood, but never have to worry about it because my place is watched by the CIA, the NSA, the Secret Service, the DHS, and the ATF.

Re: What's in a name?

[Type44Q]

I wonder if I can buy an offshore for forty-two bucks...

Re:What's in a name?

[Anonymous Coward]

You clearly need a red Jolly Roger, just in case anybody breaks in, so you can state that you fairly advertised that no quarter will be given.

Re:What's in a name?

[Impy the Impiuos Imp]

I actually went to school with a girl who was named Isis. Guess she's going to have a hard time accepting money from anyone!

I used to watch Isis as a kid -- she hung with Shazam. I would watch Isis while sneaking my mom's Ayds weight loss chocolates.

It was a heady time.

Re:What's in a name?

[R3d M3rcury]

Same here--without the chocolates.

For those of you kids who don't get it, this might help.

Re:What's in a name?

[linuxrocks123]

You win the Internet.

Re:What's in a name?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, but they'll watch it burn too.

Re:What's in a name?

[Maritz]

lol. Stick up a Jamaican flag and you'll get the DEA too.

Legal!

[mi]

Just claiming that someone might be a terrorist doesn't give you the right to steal their money.

Well, it works for tax-evasion accusations — why not for terrorism ones?

Re:Legal!

[Anonymous Coward]

Works for drugs, except they don't even have to bother with accusations.

The government's been stealing money from people for decades now, the only question is who's going to stop it? Clearly not the Republican party (how many bills have they even proposed in order to curtail the IRS's power to harass conservative organizations? This is clearly a power that the Republican party wants the IRS to have). Not the Democrats either.

These days I vote straight ticket libertarian and fill in the blanks with republicans for the few local legislative spots left and democrats for the judicial spots. Best I can do as long as I've got mouths to feed. When I can walk away from my job then I'll think about running for an office.

Re:Legal!

[Anonymous Coward]

To quote the Fourth Amendment:

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Easy money

[qbast]

So it is enough to mention 'OFAC regulation' to steal money without consequences? Sue the bastards.

Re:Easy money

[radish]

Good luck suing a company for following the law.

Really now..

[Anonymous Coward]

The Treasury Department's Office of Foreign Assets Control is a 54-year-old institution, quietly working to keep money out of the hands of America's enemies.

Except when coming from the U.S. government itself, right?

1$1$

[roman_mir]

1$1$, actually a dollar sign can be drawn with two vertical lines close to each other over one S. Obviously U$A money are all about funding terrorism....

Is Venmo international?

[the_skywise]

Why does the Office of Foreign Assets Control regulations apply to an unarguably domestic transaction?

Is this some sort of goofy legal technicality that because the transaction went through the internet they routed it to an off shore server and back just so they could listen in?

Re:Is Venmo international?

[Anonymous Coward]

seriously, mod this up

captcha: ledger

Re:Is Venmo international?

[Anonymous Coward]

Why does the Office of Foreign Assets Control regulations apply to an unarguably domestic transaction?

Because they mentioned ISIS, so it is not "unarguably domestic". There's nothing goofy about the regulation. The government did not "listen in". They company did, as required by the government.

Re:Is Venmo international?

[Anonymous Coward]

The government did not "listen in". They company did, as required by the government.

That's a distinction without a (practical) difference.

Re:Is Venmo international?

[tsqr]

Why does the Office of Foreign Assets Control regulations apply to an unarguably domestic transaction?

Probably because there are quite a few domestic groups that front for the Muslim Brotherhood, who in turn provide support to Hamas and Hezbollah. Like there used to be quite a few domestic groups that fronted for the IRA.

Re:Is Venmo international?

[Impy the Impiuos Imp]

Computers listening for keywords is fine, but it is supposed to just flag a human review.

Re:Is Venmo international?

[JoelKatz]

A "foreign asset" is one owned or controlled by a foreign entity, even if the asset itself is in the United States.

Re:Is Venmo international?

[Anonymous Coward]

Which it did. To which the human reviewing the case said "Hahahano."

Overreaction to a dumb joke? Of course it is. But unreasonable? Some low level office worker is not going to put his job on the line for a stupid beer joke.

Re:Is Venmo international?

[K. S. Kyosuke]

It kind of didn't sound like anything in this case was owned or controlled by a foreign entity. (Unless the beer was an import - which it could have been...from Israel, of all places.)

Re:Is Venmo international?

[JoelKatz]

Well, to be unreasonably charitable to Venmo, that's what they were investigating.

How come every time I try to type "Venmo" it comes out "Venom" and I have to correct it?

Re:Is Venmo international?

[Sir Holo]

Why is the text of the note I attach to a money transfer –intended for my uses only – not encrypted?

Why does Venmo think that they are the enforcers? Why are they reading customers' note-to-self?

The field could contain an invoice number, project number, case reference, and so on. Such information is privileged information of a business or person.

Would you want your money-transfer service snooping on you, and then selling details to competitors, so they can under-cut you on bids? Where are the controls on companies like Venmo to prevent them from doing whatever they want with the info?!? (e.g., private business info, or personal purchases)

Re:Is Venmo international?

[radish]

Why does Venmo think that they are the enforcers? Why are they reading customers' note-to-self?

Because they would be shut down if they didn't. The law requires companies enabling money transfers to know who is transferring money to who, and to look for certain suspect transactions and report/block them. Don't blame Venmo, blame the government.

Re:Is Venmo international?

[brausch]

All financial institutions (FI) in the US are subject to OFAC regs.

Venmo's canned response is incorrect or at least incomplete.

Lots of ordinary words and names get flagged by OFAC. The FI is responsible for checking and then they can either: approve the transfer or forward the problem to the government to handle.

The money is required to be "held" subject to the review. If everything is innocent, the owner should eventually get his money back.

DOS them

[Anonymous Coward]

everyone should send the minimum amount of transfer and keyword the shit out them so all of the transactions get flagged, bringing the entire stupid operation to a halt. what a bunch of clueless morons putting these rules in place.

Re:DOS them

[Anonymous Coward]

You want to coordinate a cyber attack against a financial institution under the name of a known terrorist organization?

Well, it's a bold strategy, lest see if it works out for you.

That's why

[plopez]

When I use money for illegal purposes I use money orders!

Re:That's why

[Anonymous Coward]

When I use money for illegal purposes I use money orders!

You fool. I use cash. Cocaine laced US twenty dollar bills straight from the bank teller's hand to an envelope.

while not the first time,

[WindBourne]

this may be the first time done as a joke. The others were likely intended for ISIS, or AQ, or Taliban, or North Korea, etc. . IOW, we have plenty of enemies that work in America and send home. Just like Europe and any other free nation.

Re:while not the first time,

[GuB-42]

Beer fund, for a so-called Islamist group, how can it be anything but a joke?

Re:while not the first time,

[WindBourne]

Totally agree. BUT, they can not afford to take chances.

Re:while not the first time,

[lgw]

Almost any totalitarian extreme can be justified with that reasoning. "Not taking chances" should be the reason to investigate, not the reason to act.

Re:while not the first time,

[Obfuscant]

You want to dismiss the word "ISIS" as irrelevant to the transfer, but don't see that "beer fund" could be just as irrelevant to the actual transfer. Not that any of it was serious, but joking with people you know have absolutely no sense of humor is not a productive occupation, and complaining when they don't exhibit the sense of humor you knew they didn't have is a waste of time.

I'm more concerned, why would a pitcher of any beer cost $21? You have to be nuts to pay that much.

Re:while not the first time,

[N1AK]

All true, but I think you're assuming more about what he means than you should. If you handle financial transactions then there are burdens placed on you by the government; even if you think that such a message is an obvious joke you could be putting your company in existential peril by processing the payment or giving the money back. Thus even though you might think this is all bollocks, you "can not afford to take chances."

Re:while not the first time,

[lgw]

Oh, I agree that we've become a totalitarian state, I'm just saying it's a bad thing.

What an amatuer

[jittles]

Everyone knows that you put "Sensual Massage" in the memo field on checks and other such transfers. Unless you're paying a big corporate entity. Then you probably ought to be serious and put an account number.

Re:What an amatuer

[Anonymous Coward]

Everyone knows that you put "Anal fisting" in the memo field on checks and other such transfers.

FTFY.

Re:What an amatuer

[the_skywise]

I thought that was pipe-laying (can't even find that old lawsuit joke on google... it keeps taking me seriously. :) )

Re:What an amatuer

[KGIII]

When I was a young man we had these old fashioned things called "Checks." They were filled out by hand(!) and actually required that you write down numbers and fill in information. Yeah, it was both scary and a hassle, all at the same time. It also meant we had to do math. Often, we did this math without the aid of electronic computational devices. It truly was a barbaric time.

Anyhow, I used to put in a whole bunch of stupid shit in the memo section on the checks. I even filled them out accurately - more than once - for things like weed. Yes, I've paid for weed with a check - I've paid for other drugs with a check but I didn't fill that in, but I have put weed in there. I've also put "alcohol," "call your wife," and "too drunk to care." In fact, I put all sorts of stupid shit in the memo section.

Nothing ever happened to me. Nobody ever called, visited, or even said anything unkind. I don't think I put anything with terrorism in there. I might have but I kind of doubt it. I'm pretty sure I put in everything *but* terrorism related stuff. I'm pretty sure I put in the stupidest things you can imagine, or damned close. Yet, not a word was ever said.

Somehow, I think it would not go over so very well today. I don't think I'd actually try it today. It's not that the laws are so very different or anything. It's the collection of data that seems to be changed. I don't think the banks ever did anything with the memo information back then. If they did, I never knew about it. I wrote a whole lot of stupid things in that section. I've even put stuff like "hookers and blow" in there - obviously not while buying hookers and blow.

Pretty obvious

[Anonymous Coward]

Some people just don't think.
A friend once sent me 10 dollars on paypall with the note "thanks for the XXX".
Almost got the account closed for violating their terms of service.
Some situations you just don't joke.
Like saying you're going to bomb the airport, or telling a cop your car is full of drugs.

Re:Pretty obvious

[Anonymous Coward]

Or going into a bank and trying to make a joke about it being a stickup.

Re:Pretty obvious

[Anonymous Coward]

did you substitute "XXX" for something else that you don't want to disclose here OR did your friend literally write "XXX" and paypal flagged it as prostitution money?

captcha: flashers

Re:Pretty obvious

[Anonymous Coward]

Paypal hates moonshine ?

Same as drugs

[thinkwaitfast]

I once transferred money from my savings to checking account and wrote 'supplies for meth production' in the optional for section and it was rejected.

Re:Same as drugs

[Mitreya]

I once transferred money from my savings to checking account and wrote 'supplies for meth production' in the optional for section and it was rejected.

Aren't you glad that your money was not confiscated?

Re:Same as drugs

[thinkwaitfast]

Yeah, but it wasn't very much money. My college roommate used to write much worse things when he'd pay me by check. As for keeping money, I did a wire transfer last month and the receiving bank, also an account owned by me, rejected it for some reason and the sending bank got the money back and charged me $82. This was on a $100 transfer. That was in addition to the $40 to send it.

Re:Same as drugs

[Gojira Shipi-Taro]

Why? what possible fucking reason would you have for thinking that would NOT cause issues?

Just to make a point? OK you made your point and you got inconvenienced over it.

Except that nobody cares. It was a stupid joke, it hit a filter run by stupid people (which you should have expected) and you ran into bureaucracy. Next time, perhaps leave out the joke that the mouth breathers will not get.

Re:Same as drugs

[Obfuscant]

You paid $40 to wire yourself $100? Why not just take $100 bucks out of the bank, put three 20's into your pocket, and flush two 20's down the toilet?

Re:Same as drugs

[KGIII]

Pfft... Where's the convenience in that? I bet there's not even an app for that! Well, at least not nominally.

Who pays that much for beer?

[Anonymous Coward]

Who the hell is paying $21+ for a pitcher of beer? Stated that he was only paying for his portion and tip for the two pitchers so does that make it really $42 per pitcher? You can buy a damn keg for that much money.

Re:Who pays that much for beer?

[mlts]

Depends on the town. Here in Austin, $21 is actually cheap for a pitcher of craft beer. Heck, a hamburger + fries + drink is $50-$60 at some places in town, and that's not the ritzy downtown places either.

Re:Who pays that much for beer?

[Anonymous Coward]

...a hamburger + fries + drink is $50-$60 at some places in town...

A fool and his money are easily parted.
This 27 oz monster will set you back maybe $14 in Nashville.

Re:Who pays that much for beer?

[tsqr]

Who the hell is paying $21+ for a pitcher of beer? Stated that he was only paying for his portion and tip for the two pitchers so does that make it really $42 per pitcher? You can buy a damn keg for that much money.

I guess that depends upon the beer, the size of the pitcher, and the hipsterosity of the drinker. I can tell you that 22 oz bottle of Deimos (a red ale from Ecliptic Brewing in Portland, OR) goes for $9. I don't know what their keg price is, but I'm pretty comfortable thinking it's more than $42.

Re:Who pays that much for beer?

[Anonymous Coward]

Heck, a hamburger + fries + drink is $50-$60 at some places in town, and that's not the ritzy downtown places either.

All we need now are $30 magazines and we'll be on track for the end of everything in 2077.

Re:Who pays that much for beer?

[Anonymous Coward]

Depends on the town. Here in Austin, $21 is actually cheap for a pitcher of craft beer. Heck, a hamburger + fries + drink is $50-$60 at some places in town, and that's not the ritzy downtown places either.

I've always wanted to visit Austin for the music scene. Thanks for the warning. I guess I won't bother now, if the place is that big of a rip-off.

Down at my local bar & grill in Nebraska, I can get a half-pound cheeseburger, fries, and a bottle of domestic beer for $8.50 - as it should be.

Re:Who pays that much for beer?

[Anonymous Coward]

As a native Austinite, Austin -had- a music scene. It doesn't now, because the taxes have shut down all but the venues that cater to tourists or the spray-tan crowd. Don't bother with SXSW, because just a -ticket- costs $1200, then there is parking ($85/day), hotels, and other rip-offs. Plus, Dirty Sixth is named that for a reason... there are more than just bars and pubs that want in your wallet.

You won't find a hamburger, fries, and a beer or two for under $30 in Austin. Actually, make that under $50, because you have to pay a parking fee before you can get even near a decent eatery.

Hi, Jack!!

[turkeydance]

saw my old friend at the airport.

Re:Hi, Jack!!

[Anonymous Coward]

Jack waves and calls out "Have you seen Kyle?!"

keep money out of the hands of America's enemies

[fustakrakich]

That doesn't make sense. The government has been funding ISIS (and Al Qaeda, more money is made by playing both sides) for years. Must be part of the overall power grab the government has been engaged in since the turn of the century.

America

[fishscene]

Land of the Free Home of the Brave. Or as I like to say in cases like this: Land of the oppressed, home of the wussies.

Re:America

[Hognoxious]

How can they be oppressed? I thought guns prevented that kind of thing.

Re:America

[Anonymous Coward]

How can they be oppressed? I thought guns prevented that kind of thing.

Only when they're used to prevent this sort of injustice.

so what happens if I

[Anonymous Coward]

write repayment of personal loan from Mrs Isis when Isis that persons name?

Just Add Shazam!

[zenlessyank]

That will fool those silly computerized judgment whores.

It was just buying beers after the game...

[Anonymous Coward]

...it was an Intramural Soccer Inebriation Stipend.

See figure 1

[nicolaiplum]

So Venmo thinks it is acceptable to take someone's money away on arbitrary suspicion of wrongdoing without explanation?

No. They can see Figure 1.

it's right here.

[supernova87a]

As stated in the subsequently linked article, it is not some weird mystery / secret what words are flagged. Dept. of Treasury maintains an easily accessible list of "Specially Designated Nationals" which is their compilation of probably most/all of the keywords that will be searched to find if there are matches.

In this case, "ISIS" is all over that document, like in 30 different places.

More relevantly, it's a wake up notice to share-everything 20-y.o.s to be aware that not everything is a happy go lucky social media commenting platform with no consequences. And Venmo should make that clearer to users that the comment field is not just a joke.

Re:it's right here.

[david_thornley]

If I think you think the world is a bit too happy-go-lucky, is it OK if I steal your car?

Re:it's right here.

[Anonymous Coward]

In this case, "ISIS" is all over that document, like in 30 different places.

Which is completely idiotic, since the organization(s) in question don't call themselves that.

Re:it's right here.

[KGIII]

Well, so long as you're stealing his car then I guess it's okay.

The real question is, is that a joke or is that an attempt to be insightful?

Re:it's right here.

[Anonymous Coward]

only if i get to rape your dog. wait... maybe this isn't the right place for this kind of transaction.

Re:it's right here.

[Anonymous Coward]

It's not really a happy-go-lucky world, but it is a paradise of non-sequiturs.

Re:it's right here.

[david_thornley]

"More relevantly, it's a wake up notice to share-everything 20-y.o.s to be aware that not everything is a happy go lucky social media commenting platform with no consequences. "

This, in the context, reads to me like the GGP thinks Venmo is justified in confiscating the money. If I have misunderstood, then I apologize, and admit that I did a really lame attempt to make an insightful joke, but I've seen the sort of attitude I believed I perceived with that sort of language before.

Re:it's right here.

[KGIII]

The whole thread reads like that or other people just saying that it's a fact of life. I think that, if I had to guess, about 1:10 people had a problem with it - and I read the whole thread. The numbers might be a little different now but when I read it there were over 200 posts so I doubt they'd have changed much as there are 275 posts now.

I was (as you can guess) going for insightful. They don't care. It's someone else's money and they self-identify as a hipster. To continue in my attempt to be insightful, nobody cares about the rights of pedophiles.

Re:it's right here.

[david_thornley]

If it's a fact of life, it's a really dismal one. As far as defending the rights of pedophiles, sure, they need to be defended, so we agree there. There are other holes in people's perception, many in sex-related areas, where most people seem fine with denying other people basic rights.

DDOS OLFA

[Anonymous Coward]

Lots of $0.01 transactions with naughty words.
Send them to everyone.

He should have labeled it

[TheMadTopher]

for the Panamanian tax evasion account. They let that through automatically.

Which ISIS?

[Anonymous Coward]

My friends down at the International Secret Intelligence Service are going to wonder why their beer fund is running short this month.

Re:Which ISIS?

[Anonymous Coward]

And the fan club was really looking forward to the kegger:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0072516/

Trying this with Paypal

[Anonymous Coward]

Wish me luck

captcha: shutoff

This would really suck for women named Isis

[mark-t]

[nt]

Beer fund

[Anonymous Coward]

No sense of humor. No sense.
ISIS is also the name used for a scanner driver typr for scanners...
Fujitsu has ISIS drivers.

ISIS is also an FLA for "Is Stupid? Is Silly?"

Then they came for the practical jokers

[3john]

So everyone, add spook.lines to your outgoing money transfers.

^ https://github.com/emacs-mirror/emacs/blob/master/etc/spook.lines

Re:Then they came for the practical jokers

[MrKaos]

So everyone, add spook.lines to your outgoing money transfers.

^ https://github.com/emacs-mirro...

Wow, this has come a long way since the 80s/90s. Perhaps a haiku competition that only uses these words. The winner is judged by the amount of trigger word density which is then sent as spam to everyone.

ohhh the innocent days of the internet are long gone.

Re:Then they came for the practical jokers

[Anonymous Coward]

If half of those words actually trigger a filter no wonder they complain about data overload.

Beer payment is bootlegging

[flyingfsck]

He was in trouble for two reasons actually: Bootlegging and Terr Funding.

As Bugs Bunny would say: What a maroon!

No surprise

[Dirk Becher]

My experiences with border customs has led me to the conclusion that
U.S. law enforcement ist mostly designed to deal with wisecrackers.

Re:No surprise

[Locke2005]

So, if you see your friend Jack at the airport, don't suddenly shout out, "Hi, Jack!"

NOT Isis

[Anonymous Coward]

What if you put "Clearly NOT for ISIS" ?

What if you said "ISIS is ridiculous", referring to the Archer TV series?

Re:NOT Isis

[The-Ixian]

Or, "I am Sending money In dollarS"

Re:NOT Isis

[Anonymous Coward]

Imperial Stout Imbibing Social?
I fail to see how all of this is suddenly now beer drinkers' fault.
I suppose we should just cancel our upcoming Dark Ale Enthusiasts Social Hour?

I just got off the phone with Isis.

[Anonymous Coward]

She's really annoyed; thinking about not flooding the Nile this year.

Obligatory MIB reference

[green1]

"No ma'am, we at the FBI do not have a sense of humor we're aware of."

Where does the money end up?

[Harlequin80]

Surely the money can't remain with Venmo?

I would have thought that it would have to be remitted to a government department complete with a report detailing why it was seized, who the people involved in transaction were etc etc. Otherwise you have a massive incentive to a company to make up reasons to seize money and you are not providing any evidence to the security forces that would want to track money to terrorist organisations.

If the money is sent to OFAC or similar it should be possible to have that money returned to you on completion of 200 forms and waiting 11.5 months.

Re:Where does the money end up?

[jrumney]

Probably this is the way to go. Find out the government organization that should be responsible, and write a polite letter asking for your money to be returned. Hopefully someone human sees it, realises that it is obviously not terrorism funds, and starts tracking internally where the money went. When they find out that Venmo kept it for themselves, they don't just have an irate customer, who is going to have to spend more than the money is worth to get it back, on their ass, they have a government department.

Re:Where does the money end up?

[FrozenGeek]

Might be the carrot government offers to encourage enforcement of the regulations: file the right forms and you get to keep the money you confiscated.

Re:Where does the money end up?

[Harlequin80]

I doubt it. Part of the reason that govt bureaucracies are so inefficient is that every dollar needs to be accounted for and justified in triplicate. Also positive incentivising is not the norm for govt either. They tend to go the big stick and companies call it "cost of compliance" a lot of which is pointless paper trailing.

USGS ISIS

[Anonymous Coward]

Hopefully you aren't planning a career as a USGS ISIS software consultant: https://isis.astrogeology.usgs.gov/ or into Egyptian goddesses.

Except!!

[Anonymous Coward]

Based on citizens united Money = Free Speech.

It's all yours

[AndyKron]

you get what you fucking vote for.

Um

[Anonymous Coward]

Muslims don't drink alcohol. Bit of a problem there.

Re:Um

[Locke2005]

I have a brother in law that prays to Mecca 5 times a day... and drinks alcohol. His wife claims to be a Muslim and eats pork. Saying "Muslims don't drink alchohol" is a bit like saying "Mormons never have sex outside of marriage" or "Catholics never use birth control", isn't it?

Re: Um

[oobayly]

I was going to say that Islamist terrorists don't tend to drink alcohol, but then I remembered that Salah Abdelsalam (the terrorist that bottled it during the Paris attacks) was a rent boy...

Re:Um

[Anonymous Coward]

INCOMING TRUE SCOTSMAN ALERT!

Nico~Nico~Nii!

[Guppy]

Something similar has already been happening to weeabos, who use the term Nico, meaning a smile. Usually either in context referring to the video website Nico Nico Douga or to Nico Tanigawa's catchphrase "Nico-Nico-nii".

Unfortunately, there's also some Iranian corporation by name of NICO, so the term ends up triggering a flag somewhere.

Re:Nico~Nico~Nii!

[Guppy]

Whups, mistake. It's Yazawa Nico: https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

Look, terrorist

[Anonymous Coward]

... got an e-mail from Venmo ...

Because mass surveillance works, maybe not in stopping the bad guys, but it works for somebody.

... we are not allowed to give the funds back to you or issue a refund.

Side-stepping the issue of legalized robbery, yet again, there was little point in Venmo demanding a "please explain". This is like asking someone how old she is, on the internet: The answer is worthless.

EAS - Easily Confused Acronyms

[Anonymous Coward]

Sucks to have your communications and transactions flagged if you're talking about routing protocols

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IS-IS

Or an advanced scanning API

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image_and_Scanner_Interface_Specification

Having the First Name 'Isis' Has Become a Massive

[dhalsim2]

http://www.alternet.org/news-a...

Ad Injection time!

[Anonymous Coward]

So all I need is an ad network to inject the 4-character "ISIS" badword into all the non-TLS streams I can find, and wreak major havoc? Best DoS ever!!!

Won't you think of all of the money?

[Anonymous Coward]

Venmo gets to keep it, without any of that earning shit.

They refuse to rename their restaurant

[gnasher719]

In the middle of London, just outside Fenchurch Street station: https://www.google.co.uk/maps/...

And 50 metres away: https://www.google.co.uk/maps/...

Re:They refuse to rename their restaurant

[Anonymous Coward]

Or this river in Oxford

How fucking stupid.

[Anonymous Coward]

I can't wait until all the stupid old folks dictating policy with a McCarthy era mindset pass on and stop screwing with those who are left behind dealing with their shit.

Re:How fucking stupid.

[KGIII]

Ah, that's cute. You think it's just limited to people of a certain age and that it will get better with time.

Maybe

[Anonymous Coward]

we'll get lucky, and the Victorious Islamic State Army will be formed.

Venmo steals the money if you own a certain Toyota

[Cito]

Guy had work done on his Toyota and used the service to send money, as it wasn't a dealership.

He also had his money stolen and refused to be returned to either payer or payee.

http://www.wheel-size.com/size...

There is a Toyota Isis the morons have zero common sense.

They just scam with arbitrary keywords. Paypal/Capital One/Discover/Bank Debit cards don't care about "comments" they look only when it goes outside the U.S. to verify.

Fake

[Locke2005]

ISIS was the name of a payment processing system that just recently changed it's name as well as the name of a goddess, so I don't think there is ANY rational reason to penalize people for using just those 4 letters. Now, if he said "Daesh beer fund", on the other hand, I could see it. By the way, you know when ISIS refers to themselves, they use Arabic, not the English language acronym, right?

Sure sounds like theft...

[Anonymous Coward]

1. No Actual crime took place.
2. No crime could "Reasonably" be considered to have taken place based on the situation and evidence.
3. Freedom of Speech was 100% Violated here.
4. Due Process - 100% Violated.
5. 4th Amendment - 100% Violated.

Whatever "Agency" this is, actually pulled a sanctioned "Heist"

This should earn the agency some civil rights violations, all persons involved should see jail time, and IMMEDIATE limitations and PUBLIC oversight of that organization/agency should be put into place.

This... Was THEFT... Don't Agree?

Then just wait till its your turn to"Give"

So did the money not reach his friend?

[AbRASiON]

It's been confiscated? Pretty sure that's not legal, it's called theft.

Re:So did the money not reach his friend?

[Anonymous Coward]

No...you see, the money itself is what is actually charged with the crime.
That is what makes it all a-ok.

Middle ground

[Livius]

I'm not a fan of intercepting money this way, but I don't think we can eliminate it completely. But there should be some straightforward and rapid way for the money to be sent on its way as soon as someone has made a cursory investigation. Something like this lends itself to a ridiculous number of false positives (like this one).

Show me the warrant issued by a judge?

[wwalker]

How's this not a blatant violation of the Fourth Amendment? The one that says: "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."

Re:Show me the warrant issued by a judge?

[Anonymous Coward]

Because terrorists...

Penalty for false positives

[Anonymous Coward]

We can't blame a company for using code word triggers to hold up a payment, but the false positives should cost them. Send the money back and make the algorithms better. When every Joe has to alter behavior to please the algorithms, the machines have already won.

Re:Penalty for false positives

[lucien86]

Do you mean the metal machines or the humans who have turned themselves into mindless rule following automatons? Machines made of paper and words and human flesh..

Boycott

[lobotomy]

Yet another company that I will never have any dealings with. I suggest everyone else follow and spread the word.

Re:Boycott

[Gojira Shipi-Taro]

Why? because they didn't laugh at his stupid, pointless joke?

No. Thanks.

Re:Boycott

[lobotomy]

It wasn't a joke for them. It was a private message to the recipient. Whether you liked the joke or not is irrelevant.

Things not to do...

[Tolvor]

Don't joke about bombs at US airports.
Don't joke about having drugs in front of police officers.
Don't joke about job issues in front of your boss/HR/coworkers
Don't joke about guns anywhere (especially schools)
Don't joke about money laundering to financial institutions.

Yes people are dumb enough to think these are funny and bad things happen to them. This is not news. Next time they will (hopefully) know better.

total bogus

[Anonymous Coward]

muslims do not drink alcohol why would they have a beer fund?

Wont tell trigger words.

[Anonymous Coward]

Next step make every word in the Webster dictionary a key word. "I'm sorry we have confiscated all of your funds for official anti terrorist use."

A cleric, a rabbi and a preist...

[MrKaos]

walk into the ISIS beer fund bar

The bartender looks up and says, "Whaaaat???? Is this some kind of joke????"

Police state?

[dave420]

Everyone tagging this story "police state" apparently has no idea what constitutes a police state.

Easy...

[Kazoo the Clown]

1. Become a worshipper of the Egyptian goddess, Isis. 2. Create the ISIS Beer Fund 3. Wait for Venmo to pull the plug 4. Sue the pants off of them for violating your religious freedom 5. PROFIT!

So the real question is,

[Kazoo the Clown]

Are they allowed to get on a plane anymore?

In my country isis word has different meaning also

[Anonymous Coward]

Funny. In my country i could send money to friend and put message on it "isis rahat"... Meaning hes fathers money. Iisis word in this context is mostly used by children in my country :P Such bad isis supporters we all are :P

The money gets used

[Anonymous Coward]

I heard that Venmo is secretly funding ISIS.

Make some noise

[Anonymous Coward]

Wouldn't be funny if, immediately, everyone who is concerned about Freedom, got together with a friend or groups of friends and make multiple $0.01 transfers to as many people as they can with "exiciting" labels.

Do not help fund conservation effort of rivers.

[Anonymous Coward]

There is a river in England, called the Isis. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Isis. Don't, whatever you do, try to help fund any conservation projects.

Similarly, purchases from Isis Fluid Control systems, are now strictly forbidden! http://www.isis-fluid.co.uk/

However, the worst one, is ISIS's own R&D spin-off in Oxford. http://isis-innovation.com/.

Don't go here: http://isisltd.co.uk/

The real crime...

[Patent Lover]

.. is paying $42 for two pitchers of beer.

Wish I had the money

[TheCarp]

To do this myself, and do it for over $2500 so it doesn't end up in small claims court.

Fuck these sycophants and their masters. Sharing financial information with the government is a betrayal of your customers.

What?

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't know what "Venmo" is, but thanks to this info, I won't ever be using it. Not in the mood to sue someone to get my money back.

Can't buy tickets for the Shrine Circus

[bano]

http://www.isisshriners.com/
or
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
or
buying anything from the likely thousands of people in the world with the name Isis.

OFAC really isn't this dumb, this processor just is. Most OFAC scrubbing software only flags or blocks transactions and it is up to the financial institution to manually vet the transaction after any required reporting. The false positive rate in OFAC name matching is often listed as 50+%.

About those boxes...

[fyngyrz]

Americans typically use these boxes, in this order:

o Idiot box
o Cereal box
o Idiot box
o Amazon box
o Idiot box
o Comment box
o Idiot box

Idiot Scan

[lucien86]

Shows the absolute ridiculousness of security. Newsflash - real terrorists don't go about with the word 'terrorist' written on their foreheads. Also shows that 'Venmo' are NOT to be trusted..

How utterly lawless!

[Anonymous Coward]

So punishment without trial and you can't know in advance what actions will cause the government to rob you! So much for 'the rule of law'.

Someone that dumb...

[drevange]

deserves what they get. Sometimes life just sucks wtihout any help and sometimes you bring it on yourself

Four letter word

[Anonymous Coward]

so, who says ISIS referes to ISIS? This may be an acronym for many many things.