From Bicycles To Washing Machines: Sweden To Give Tax Breaks For Repairs (mnn.com)

jenningsthecat writes: The Swedish government is putting its money where its mouth is when it comes to encouraging the repair of stuff that would otherwise be thrown away, according to both The Guardian and Fast Company. The country's Social Democrat and Green party coalition have submitted proposals to Parliament that would reduce the value-added-tax (VAT) on bicycle, clothing, and shoe repairs from 25% to 12%. Also proposed is an income tax deduction equalling half the labor cost of repairing household appliances. According to The Guardian, "the incentives are part of a shift in government focus from reducing carbon emissions produced domestically to reducing emissions tied to goods produced elsewhere." Per Bolund, Sweden's Minister for Financial Markets and Consumer Affairs, said the policy also tied in with international trends around reduced consumption and crafts, such as the "maker movement" and the sharing economy, both of which have strong followings in Sweden. The VAT cut may create more jobs for immigrants as it could spur the creation of a new home-repairs service industry. Also, from a science standpoint, the incentives could help cut the cost of carbon emissions on the planet as it should in theory reduce emissions linked to consumption. "I believe there is a shift in view in Sweden at the moment. There is an increased knowledge that we need to make our things last longer in order to reduce materials' consumption," Bolund said. The Guardian's report concludes: "The proposals will be presented in parliament as part of the government's budget proposals and if voted through in December will become law from January 1, 2017."

Comments

It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[macraig]

I doubt this will be a compelling incentive if the cost of repair labor in Sweden is comparable to that in the United States. People don't repair things because (a) many are deliberately designed not to be easily reparable and (b) the labor cost of the "experts" is disproportionate to the value of having it repaired. Shaving a little bit off the sales tax of the bill is not going to offset the disproportionate cost of the alleged expertise.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[reboot246]

And many times the labor cost is far higher than the actual amount the "laborer" is being paid. Somebody is making that extra money, but so many times it's not the person doing the actual work.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[ShanghaiBill]

Somebody is making that extra money, but so many times it's not the person doing the actual work.

Go to Craigslist and hire someone direct. Or go to nextdoor.com and ask your neighbors for a recommendation. If someone does a good job, give them a good review on Yelp. Spread the word.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

In all such cases, you have the opportunity to perform the actual work, and own the company, allowing you to charge whatever you want.

That is, of course, if you have the skill needed to perform the actual work, and customers want to pay your going rate.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

The ideal is to give a tax break to companies making goods, so they can make them repairable. However, here in the US, a lot of companies pay $0 in texas, so it may not work, but in civilized countries that actually enforce tax codes, this would be a useful thing.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[ShanghaiBill]

That is, of course, if you have the skill needed to perform the actual work

For most repairs, no skill is needed. Just go to Youtube, type in the product you are repairing, and a short description of what the problem is, and you will get a dozen videos showing exactly how to fix it.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

For most repairs, no skill is needed. Just go to Youtube, type in the product you are repairing, and a short description of what the problem is, and you will get a dozen videos showing exactly how to fix it.

this does not work very well when the internet is what's broken

Re: It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[thundercattt]

It's true. I worked for Lenovo. For instance say an LCD replacement for tablet or laptop. You pay $300-400 for the tablet 700-800 for laptop (guestimate). LCD part on eBay $40. Repair depot charges$300. May as well buy a new one

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

I've been practicing this for about the last ten years. Seems to be working well for me and I now rarely buy anything new unless I am lazy. FWIW, I built my house and remodeled another.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[known_coward_69]

and the parts are usually a rip off. it's like $500 or $600 for a dish washer. if it breaks then most times the part is like $400 plus the labor plus waiting weeks for delivery where you might as well just buy a new one.

only time it's cheaper is with phones and tablets where it's like $100 to have apple fix your screen or $193 for Samsung to fix a screen on a Note.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

Enjoy your building code violations! Make sure you buy LOTS of fire extinguishers and practice leaving in emergency situations.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

AC didn't say that they didn't have inspections and also didn't say they didn't subcontract any of the work.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[aliquis]

I doubt this will be a compelling incentive if the cost of repair labor in Sweden is comparable to that in the United States. People don't repair things because (a) many are deliberately designed not to be easily reparable and (b) the labor cost of the "experts" is disproportionate to the value of having it repaired. Shaving a little bit off the sales tax of the bill is not going to offset the disproportionate cost of the alleged expertise.

Part of the labor cost is of course the up to ~75% taxes on work ..
Anyway, this is most likely also an way to try to get immigrants into work by say offering to replace bicycle tires or possible sewing but of course there will not be much at all happening with that so it's just a fucking joke.

The former more market liberal but still obviously fucked up government option lowered the cost of restoration of your home and various home services by 50% and made the VAT on restaurants and the taxation on hiring youths lower and I think the current government has replaced the first two with 30% instead and at most half the value of what was previously allowed / person and upped the later two and run their own stupid "politicians know" alternatives and ways of forcing whatever idea they have onto society.

The best solution is of course to simply lower taxes and let the market and people themselves figure out where to put their money but well - can't have that, it's a regulated socialist shit-hole after-all.

/ Johan Krüger Haglert, Swede, totally "racist."

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[rtb61]

I had a lawnmower for 25 years, I went to buy another, with a straight face, they said no matter what I bought it would not last that long, lucky to get 5 or 10 years. There is one way to guarantee repairs, force warranties up, way up. Forget the bullshit 30 day warranty lets, start at a decade. It will completely alter design and serviceability for the better.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Pentium100]

The best solution is of course to simply lower taxes and let the market and people themselves figure out where to put their money but well - can't have that, it's a regulated socialist shit-hole after-all.

Regulated socialist shit-hole is better than unregulated US-style capitalism where private corporations are more powerful than the government and can do whatever they want. After all, the market is free, so you are free to choose any internet service provider serving your area:
1. Cable company A - $100/month for 10mbps and 100GB data cap.
2. Telephone company B - $100/month for 10mbps and 100GB data cap.

You are completely free to choose from any of those options. Or maybe you have to choose one from the list of one - just like in elections in the USSR.

I think that small companies should pay less taxes and be more free, bowever, once a company gets too large, it should be put under tight control from the (democratically elected) government, so the company serves the people and not its stockholders/CEO.
The idea here is that a market with a lot of small companies offering similar products is quite free and self regulating. However, once one or two companies get too large, all the others would not be able to compete and it raises the bar to enter the market, therefore, the large company should be regulated more. An example would be Microsoft - a lot of people hate Windows 10, but still buy laptops with it, because it is really difficult to find a laptop without Windows (and one that works well with Linux) because of all the deals Microsoft has made with the manufacturers.

Another example would be the cable TV STB fight between FCC and the cable companies. There is no valid reason to force subscribers to buy/lease the STB from the cable company if compatible ones are available. "Cable company wants more money" is not a valid reason.

An example from my country would be the pricing of food after the national currency was replaced with Euro). It is cheaper to drive 200km to Poland to buy food than it is to buy it locally. The large stores blamed this on the farmers and larger VAT in my country. However, you can go to Poland and find milk from my country there cheaper (presumably the farmer does not give a discount to the foreigner). And the price difference is much bigger than the VAT difference. This results in a problem that if you buy stuff in Poland, you pay taxes to their budget and not the local one.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

"And many times the labor cost is far higher than the actual amount the "laborer" is being paid. Somebody is making that extra money, but so many times it's not the person doing the actual work."

This is true. When I worked in Repair for a large Chain, I got a flat 38% of the fixed Labor price, with no Commission on Parts. (This is a good thing- Otherwise Techs would just stuff in extra parts, not needed.)
And I actually did quite well, because I was, and am, very good at this kind of thing. But back then, there were still good local Jobbers that had or could quickly get any odd parts needed. All gone now. Of course, one can buy off the Internet, but especially because of Counterfeiting, this can be risky.
I know a guy who has this figured out. He just repairs one thing- Varian Gas Chromatographs. This limits his Parts Stock, and there is practically no other competition on the West Coast. Oh... he just turned 82. (He retired from Varian two decades ago.)
But General Repair...

Even if one can source the Parts, the Service Manuals are now considered IP, and not available to the Public.

Minolta made fine cameras, and then Sony bought them. Actually what they bought was Minolta's IP and customer base. Sony never had any intention of repairing old Minolta cameras or making new ones. So when one came in for service, what Sony offered was a pro-rated refund of the original purchase price for those cameras still under warranty or not far out of it, and then they crushed the returned cameras. And that was it. (It worked out for me; seeing where my RMA was coming from, I got a full refund on my two year old Minolta A2 with the flaky sensor. I bought a Pentax K100d....)
This made economic sense for Sony. Infrastructure for repair is expensive to set up and keep stocked. HP did exactly the same thing when they bought out Apollo, and then shut it down in order to move the long established and almost fanatical customer base to dull, dull HP-UX.

I started fixing TVs and Stereos in Middle School. As a Kid, I worked cheap, but still managed to put a fair chunk away for College. But that is impossible now. (Actually, improbable. A $40 Coffee Maker recently died on me after two weeks, so before either sending to the Manufacturer for Repair or junking it, I just popped the back- A loose connection. My Portable Icemaker died on me after six months, pop the back... that just turned out to crud on a bare wire flow sensor. There was a schematic on the back! I still fix things all the time, but I can understand how most can't be bothered, or be bothered to learn. BTW, what can't be fixed gets gutted for parts...)

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

That somebody is the tax office.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

Labour is much more expensive in Sweden than in the United States.

Re: It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

That wouldn't make America great again. It would just change it from being a collection of assholes to being a collection of assholes with tiny dicks.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, you didn't read the " Also proposed is an income tax deduction equalling half the labor cost of repairing household appliances"? Because that solves point b. for you.

That takes away 50% of the labor costs. So if a repairman usually takes $100/h you only have to pay $50 (even though the repairman still gets his $100).

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[andot]

You need the right tools and parts. Companies are already restricting selling spare parts and using nonstandad screws and bolts. Apple and Jura for example.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Darinbob]

For many things thrown away, no repair is even necessary. We're in a throw away culture, with perfectly good items tossed away just because it's not fashionable anymore. I think it's a good idea that at least one country has decided to try and make a change.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

Buy one with a japanese engine

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[aliquis]

The market gave me my first alternative in my apartment.
10 mbps uncapped already back in year 2000 for only $23.4 / month. By "Bredbandsbolaget" and ethernet, but it was very unusual and this was the first place in the nation.

The copper telephone network has been made by the government / their telephone company, that offered various DSL services. I'm not hooked up there but that would be another alternative.

By now there's also the cellular network of course. I don't know how many network constructionists we have because we have more cellular companies who rents capacity on those networks / use them for their services. Maybe there's 4-5 networks at-least to pick among.

Since I live in an apartment it's sure through the one who own the apartment which happen to be the municipality but regardless it's connected to cable TV. The cable TV company offer Internet through their network.

Finally and most importantly really the apartment is connected to the dark municipal network which have .. 10? different providers of capacity, and yeah, even my summer home which I'm never at can be connected to that thanks to EU which has granted money for building such networks to rural locations.

So as you know I've got lots of options, my mother out on the country side would just have copper/DSL and cellular network connection to pick from I think.

At one time back in the DSL days there was also talk about hooking people up through the power cables. And about at that time together with cable TV the idea of building a governmental network to hook everyone up died.

If you're doing it without the market IMHO the right thing to do is it what has been done here - build the infrastructure in the way of digging down the cables and then let others offer their services on them. I guess that also solve the issue with people in rural areas not being connected otherwise. If you let the market do it then you just have to move to a place where the market has felt it was worth to hook people up.. But with multiple providers which a cross-over of capacity which own their own networks and don't share you're of course over-spending on the infrastructure but on the other hand I guess they could had agreed on sharing too.

Sure the money ends up in Poland but on the other hand the reason it's cheaper there is most likely because they are poorer and work for lower salaries and pay less in rent and have cheaper land and .. Also it's not necessarily like you actually lose on giving them money if that give you cheaper items.
Protectionism is pretty stupid. Why grow tomatoes in Sweden and buy a Spanish truck when you can buy tomatoes from Spain and get a Swedish-made truck instead?

At-least if one actually do hate inequality between nations and that some are born more poor then others why care about jobs, spending and improvements happening mostly in poor countries?

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

Well actually enforcing of tax codes is not always easy - asking apple to pay up in EU may end up with some of banks fined to oblivion. US behave like an empire. The question is: did it cross their peak yet.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Pentium100]

build the infrastructure in the way of digging down the cables and then let others offer their services on them. I guess that also solve the issue with people in rural areas not being connected otherwise.

This is what my country is doing. If you do not want to build the infrastructure, the government will and then you can lease it along with your competitors. Without the government doing this, a lot of people would not have access to high speed internet (because it wouldbe too expensive for a single provider to do and the providers may decide against building the infrastructure together and sharing the costs). This also allows smaller companies (or new ones) to better compete with the large ones because they now only need to build the infrastructure in the area their customers live in instead of also building their uplink to another city.

Sure the money ends up in Poland but on the other hand the reason it's cheaper there is most likely because they are poorer and work for lower salaries and pay less in rent and have cheaper land and

The average salary in Poland is a big higher. I guess the money is more equally shared among the managers and the workers.
And importing stuff is always bad for the local country, I mean, I am bringing money to another country and leaving it there (when I buy something, part of the money goes to the government as VAT, part of it goes as income tax and then when the employee spends his salary locally, part of that money also goes to the government as tax) instead of paying the taxes in my country.

I do not think that Communism (state has complete control over the market) would be good. It would not. However, I'd like to call my idea (where large companies get tighter leashes) "enforced free market", that is, the government's job here would be to make sure that the market is free and no single company has undue influence on it (because that may lead to a monopoly and that is worse than the state controlling the market).

All this assumes democratic and not completely corrupt government. If the government is a dictatorship or really corrupt, then it is just as bad as the large corporation.

Unregulated free market has positive feedback - it easier for the rich to get richer than for the poor to catch up, or, a bigger company can become even bigger easier (by buying the competitors etc) than a small one can grow. This leads to income inequality and a lot of stale capital (billions that are sitting in a bank account and not doing anything), which, of course leads to all the money going from the poor to the rich and staying there.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[ooloorie]

For most repairs, no skill is needed. Just go to Youtube, type in the product you are repairing, and a short description of what the problem is, and you will get a dozen videos showing exactly how to fix it.

Don't forget to do the calculation of whether it's worth it: if a repair takes you two hours, think about how you could spend those two hours instead. That includes thinking about how much two hours of your own labor are worth relative to the cost of hiring someone else.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[drinkypoo]

Don't forget to do the calculation of whether it's worth it: if a repair takes you two hours, think about how you could spend those two hours instead. That includes thinking about how much two hours of your own labor are worth relative to the cost of hiring someone else.

If it's only two hours, it's a pretty easy decision. Spending two hours of my life on repairing something will make me a better person. Not only am I reducing my footprint upon the planet but I'm also becoming better at repairing things. It becomes a more difficult decision when it's going to take a couple of days, at which point the job begins to actually impact your life and require that other parts of it be reorganized if you want to get it done in a timely fashion.

I do a lot of fixing of stuff. Much of it is quite simple, some of it turns out to be a lot harder. I just brought home a car which was originally $70k for which I paid $200. It's properly on PNO with no back reg so it was only $20 for a trip ticket plus $30 in registration/title fees. I'm going to swap a transmission and some other parts out of a $2000 car and get it some new glass and I'll be at around $4k all in including the timing belt tools, parts I've bought for the other car which are coming over, etc. The difference between that and the price of a new shitbox buys a lot of fuel to feed the 300HP V8 and my ass will thank me for parking it in a Recaro. Unlike some trivial "look it up on Youtube" exercise where you're replacing a motor start cap or something else equally trivial, this takes actual commitment and research.

It does however actually outline the potential problem; if I do that it's not really better for the planet. Well, if I do it, it might be, because I drive so little and am willing to drive a vehicle way into the big big mileage; most of the lifetime energy cost of one of my cars is in production. I can drive a V8 and still use less energy overall than an average Prius driver because I arrange my life to not include a commute. But it's equally possible for someone to do this and then drive the piss out of it and we haven't actually saved anything by paying them to repair it...

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[drinkypoo]

Enjoy your building code violations!

There are two kinds of building code violations, relevant and irrelevant. An example of an irrelevant kind is not having at least two electrical outlets on a wall that's 8'1" long. An example of a relevant kind is using 2x2 instead of 2x4. Sadly, we used to build houses with 2x6 wall framing, and not this little candy-ass smooth-milled lumber that's under the stated size either, but rough-hewn timbers cut with a sawblade and then assembled. That's why so many of those houses are all moldy now; they actually remained standing during floods. Too bad they weren't placed somewhere sensible.

Building a house is actually easy AF. Designing it is the hard part. Our landlords did everything but design and frame this house and actually, it's the design that's let it down the most. After every earthquake, all the doors have a different set, because the house wasn't triangulated properly. It just flops around like a big square jello cube. They did pick out all the cheapest switches and the like, but any developer would do the same. I personally would spend just slightly more to get a halfway decent brand of switches and outlets, but maybe that's just me.

Make sure you buy LOTS of fire extinguishers and practice leaving in emergency situations.

If you don't do this in any home you're a dumb ass.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[drinkypoo]

I had a lawnmower for 25 years, I went to buy another, with a straight face, they said no matter what I bought it would not last that long, lucky to get 5 or 10 years.

They lied like dogs. Buy a Honda. You will have to replace carburetor parts periodically if you buy pump gas for it, though. That's the ethanol's fault. It happens to carbureted cars, too, especially if you don't drive them enough. The ethanol is aggressively hygroscopic, and draws moisture into the carburetor. It also eats the fuel lines.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[ooloorie]

If it's only two hours, it's a pretty easy decision. Spending two hours of my life on repairing something will make me a better person. Not only am I reducing my footprint upon the planet but I'm also becoming better at repairing things.

Well, if it makes you feel better about yourself, good for you. But don't kid yourself: you don't really stick to that most of the time. If you repaired and maintained your home and your car the way people used to, you wouldn't have any time for anything else.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[hey!]

That would require reading the entire summary, which would make it harder to be snooty about them dumb furriners.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

I wouldn't say they are irrelevant, they are just not as critical. The outlet distance is to reduce the use of extension cords and power strips, which is the third leading cause of electrical fires. And you don't need two outlets on an 8'1" wall....you need an outlet at least 12' (measuring baseboard length, i.e. skipping doors) and on any wall greater than 24".

The NEC is large and complicated and I've made the mistake once of pointing out to an inspector things that he flagged that were allowed, quoting the NEC. They may not make you fix that one thing but they might try damn hard to find every other little thing.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, you want to run your stuff forever:
1) only use non-oxygenated gas
2) buy from a company that will continue to provide parts (honda is great for engines but just ok for mechanical stuff, john deere is great, sears/craftsmen used to be great but has really gone down hill, or buy a commercial focused product from any vendor, they cost a lot more initially but the parts availability is usually much better.
3) buy a service manual with whatever you buy
4) Do the regular maintenance

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[AthanasiusKircher]

But don't kid yourself: you don't really stick to that most of the time. If you repaired and maintained your home and your car the way people used to, you wouldn't have any time for anything else.

Well, first off, most homes and cars don't need to be "maintained... the way people used to" because of advances in both design/materials and tools for maintenance. For example, most people used to have lots of wood trim on exteriors of houses (if not complete wood siding) that needed to be repainted on a regular basis to avoid rot. Nowadays, few homes are built with materials that need that level of maintenance. Moreover, paint quality has improved significantly over the years, so a good paint job can probably last at least many years longer than they used to. The quality of cheap tools that also speed up the painting process has improved significantly too.

Same thing with cars. Cars used to need much more frequent maintenance than today. Nowadays, many cars can run for several years with only periodic oil changes and tire rotations -- both of which are trivial to perform with just a few simple tools. (Well, except for some new cars where they make it a pain in the neck to perform oil changes without a lift.)

So, first thing is that people don't NEED to maintain stuff the way they used to. Secondly, your statement is more than a bit of hyperbole. After all, how much time exactly do you hire people to repair your home and your car each week? Do you seriously think it's enough that "you wouldn't have any time for anything else"?

Then you have to deal with the inefficiency of hiring people for repairs. Several problems there -- if you've ever actually owned a home (or a car, for that matter), you probably realize that the majority of maintenance people out there SUCK. Either they're incompetent or they're in a hurry and skip steps or they use cheap materials or methods that you'd never use if you actually wanted a repair to last, etc. So, it's not only the time investment in researching someone to hire, scheduling them to come over and do the repair, and paying them -- but then you need to budget in the extra time to call them back and complain and get them to come back to fix the stuff they forgot, or the time and money it takes to hire a new person a year or two later to come back and "do it right." Seriously -- even the competent contractors I know are a problem, because they tend to be busy because they do good work... which means they're always short on time and they just forget stuff. It's very rare to find someone who's actually competent AND takes pride in their work AND who will call you back quickly -- if you do find them, they are worth their weight in gold.

And here's the thing -- you can prevent some of that latter inefficiency if you have some clue what you're talking about and have enough expertise to have some idea what to expect in terms of maintenance -- and that usually comes from doing it (or related jobs) yourself. Then you can hire someone and at least have a clue whether they seem competent enough to do the job, and you won't pay them until you've checked it over and realized the five things they messed up that will actually cause the problem to recur.

Bottom line -- if you want to hire people to do all of your maintenance, that's fine too. But if you really want your repairs to be "done right" (particularly on a house), be prepared to spend more time selecting a good person to do the job and/or pestering the sub-par person you hired to redo it than the job probably would actually take if you did it yourself. And yes, while I'm not in these services myself, I have family members in construction and various home services... they'd tell you the same thing.

Thus, in the long run, it's probably more time and energy efficient (not to mention efficient from a monetary standpoint) to at least learn how to do most smaller jobs yourself. The small stuff is particularly time and money inefficient for hirin

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[AthanasiusKircher]

For most repairs, no skill is needed. Just go to Youtube, type in the product you are repairing, and a short description of what the problem is, and you will get a dozen videos showing exactly how to fix it.

I would disagree with this. For anything beyond the most basic repairs, you'll probably encounter various "bumps" along the way in trying to replicate what someone on Youtube does, or realize that they skipped a few essential explanations about things (often basic stuff that anyone familiar with that type of repair would know already), etc.

I agree that Youtube is a great resource for this sort of stuff, but it's like saying, "Baking bread doesn't require any skill. Just watch a Youtube video." Except you probably will encounter some problems and unanswered questions the first time you try to bake a loaf of bread, and you'll probably get much better results on your 5th loaf than your 1st, simply from the experience of doing it a few times. Also, you'll probably get better results if you already know something about baking something else (e.g., cakes, biscuits, whatever), than if you've never baked anything before.

A lot of repairs are similar, except unlike baking bread, you want to get it right the first time... which means you often end up doing a lot more troubleshooting and sorting out minor issues if you're unfamiliar with that type of repair. The "skills" required are often quite minimal, but they do come from experience -- and the next time you have to do something similar, you'll probably spend 1/4 the time doing it, because you have "skill" (however basic).

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[drinkypoo]

Well, if it makes you feel better about yourself, good for you. But don't kid yourself: you don't really stick to that most of the time.

I do when it's reasonably convenient to do so. Many devices are now prohibitively difficult to repair. Sometimes I still try, and fail for one reason or another, at least learning something in the process. If it's out of warranty and it's broken and it costs too much to have someone else do it, I've got nothing to lose.

If you repaired and maintained your home and your car the way people used to, you wouldn't have any time for anything else.

I do everything vaguely within my skillset. That means all of the plumbing that's not underground (by which I mean the pump, I don't have a crane for pump fishing) and all of the electrical, and most carpentry-type repairs. If I don't know how to do it, I learn. There is one other exception, which is the roof. It is old and crappy and I am huge and clumsy. I don't mess around with the roof. That includes the part of the chimney that goes through it, but doesn't include the part inside the house, which I replaced. But this place is a rental, so I have relatively little motivation to climb up there. Electrical is easy, so I just do it. Plumbing is something you need right away, so I just do it. If I knock a hole in the wall I don't call a drywall guy, I just patch the hole. If I need an appliance installed I don't call the movers, I get out the blankets and dollies.

In spite of this, home maintenance takes up less than 1% of my time. Maybe this house is just less shit than average? It certainly seems to be made out of the same crap, though.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[drinkypoo]

And you don't need two outlets on an 8'1" wall....you need an outlet at least 12' (measuring baseboard length, i.e. skipping doors) and on any wall greater than 24".

This is a local code thing. Because after the NEC you still have local bullshit to deal with. Some of it makes sense and some of it is just there so that they can slap you with a fine of some kind if they want to. If a wall is longer than 8' then you need two outlets in it. Whee! I'm all in favor of things like seismic codes but the building codes are just stupid anyway. For example, all wire must be sheathed specifically in PVC, which releases dioxin when it burns. Or how about people being allowed to install homes with flammable roofs and siding when they live in forest fire country? Hello? Here's another good one, in a fire propane tanks become bombs. In theory they can release their goods without exploding, in practice that's not what actually happens. But we're not required to have a blast-deflecting wall around them, which could be made out of earth bags for basically nothing in materials and a couple of Mexicans' labor for a day. Arguably, in most of California we should only be allowed to build homes out of stacks of shipping containers or similar so that they have both quake and fire resistance :P

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Dutch Gun]

You can still buy quality lawnmowers. Just buy a good brand, like a Honda, and then properly maintain it. There's a reason some mowers cost $150 and some cost $800.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

I love it when ignorant fools like you use a hyper-regulated market to demonstrate why a free market won't work.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

Last year I scrapped a 4 year old honda mower because the replacement transmission was unavailable, even though it was listed in the book for just under the cost of a new mower.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Pubstar]

My mechanic is cash only, unlicensed. He also gives a 6 month warranty on his work as long as you are running nitrous in the engine. His work is the best I've had and he is the only guy that is extremely upfront with labor and parts cost, and doesn't charge extra for parts. I found this guy by word of mouth, and I now refuse to take my cars anywhere else.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[I75BJC]

The Summary quote is that an income tax deduction for 50% of the labor of the repair. You didn't mention that and it might be a significant amount depending on the Swedish income tax structure or it might be enough for people to repair their gadgets.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[macraig]

I really dislike the savings as an income tax deduction. Not only is the savings deferred for up to a year, but the only way you'll ever receive it is by meticulously documenting everything. This savings is tacked-onto the process, in other words, instead of being an integral part of it. I don't believe that can succeed long term.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[macraig]

I really dislike the savings as an income tax deduction. Not only is the savings deferred for up to a year, but the only way you'll ever receive it is by meticulously documenting everything. This savings is tacked-onto the process, in other words, instead of being an integral part of it. I don't believe that can succeed long term.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[MercTech]

With poverty level cheap foreign labor it is often cheaper for the end user to replace rather than repair.
An example for consumer electronics:
    It takes me 3-4 hours to repair a cracked solder joint on a wave soldered board with disassembly and reassembly of the unit. This would be actual repair charge on top of charge for labor done to identify what and where the problem is. Assuming a mean shop labor charge of $65 an hour (cheap rate these days) that would come to $195.00 to $260.00 before sales tax. Around $200.00 to repair an item that can be replaced for $100.00.
      I doubt if mitigating taxes on labor to repair will make any appreciable effect on the cost differential between replacing and repair.
Opinion:
    The biggest foe to repair vs replace is the "inventory tax" which surfaced in the 1990s to further milk the populace for tax money. In a nutshell, many jurisdictions implement a quarterly tax on saleable parts kept in a warehouse. This discourages having repair parts available. Old farts like me really notice that you can't get a part for an item over two years old any more. Whereas, in decades past, you could call the manufacturer and get a part for 20 year old items.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

I am old enough to remember when television and radio sets were expensive (in relative terms), and drug stores, supermarkets and other places had little kiosk for testing vacuum tubes (if you do not know what that is. Please go to Wikipedia or Google (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vacuum_tube). these devices are available as collectible antiques on eBay today. Would go to our radio or television set, pull them out and drive down to the tube tester in our Studebaker.

When is the last time you saw a television repair shop? Probably on reruns of the Andy Griffith show, which had one on their Mayberry main street set. It simply became cheaper to replace old equipment with new, much more efficient, units and then try and sell the old guys on eBay as antique collectibles. Since I make mention of it in my lectures from time to time I thought about buying some punchcards on eBay, the just cause too damn much! Arrrgh!

Re: It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

And soon, if you do a good enough job of spreading the word... they'll have more business than they can handle and will hire someone to do part of it. This is good for the economy in general, but remind me what specific problem you were *trying* to fix? ;)

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

This is an interesting thread. If you are concerned about the cost of manufactured things to the environment look for your local reused building material yard. "Recycled materials" is usually the phone book/online search category. Our yard has sinks, toilets, nails, screws, bolts, doors etc. You can donate to it for a tax deduction and most importantly, buy American made high quality stuff from the 1960s-70-s for 15% of the cost of new Chinese crap.
We remodeled our house using only partial rolls of old Romex, used steel electrical boxes, copper pipe, Simpson hardware, bolts and sinks. The material cost savings paid for half the labor.
If you don't live where used material yards are located, look them up to visit on your next trip through an urban area.
One thing that everyone can do is to place functional items you no longer want on top of or next to garbage cans, instead of inside them. People will pick them up and reuse, repair or sell them.

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

Amen Brother. Our mechanics are great, especially when compared to our local Honda dealer, which is owned by Penske out of Indianapolis.
Every time went to buy a washer at the Honda parts department, ten minutes were spent typing into a keyboard and producing receipts in triplicate. The poor parts guy was as frustrated as we were. "They want to have a daily spreadsheet of what's sold at corporate headquarters".
Honda corporate occasionally sends teaser low rates on oil changes and service. We definitely use those, but all other times, our local garage gets the work.
Our local mechanic gives us a cash discount. If another kind of business, say a cafe has a 5% profit margin and you pay with a credit card, they get 95% of what you charged back from the credit card company, therefore earning zero on the transaction. Those little white "Square" iPhone credit card readers cost the merchant .50 per transaction. Fight this by using cash.
If you can't write it off (your income taxes,) what's the point of writing it up?

Re:It's the cost of the labor, stupid

[tlhIngan]

Companies are already restricting selling spare parts and using nonstandad screws and bolts. Apple and Jura for example.

That's a basic intelligence test for repair and preventing warranty fraud, actually. Far too many people go to YouTube and see how to fix something, then actually try to do it, without realizing they don't have the proper tools (no, a butter knife is NOT a screwdriver), or even skill/dexterity to repair (use a tool to lift the flap on the connector - do not rip the cable out or you may tear the cable, rip off the connector, or break both to the point both parts need replacing).

If you're handy enough to go online and buy the proper tools, you probably at least have the necessary skill not to screw it up worse than it already is.

And some of the worst people to deal with are warranty fraudsters. Hell, try denying a warranty claim because the device has water damage. They'll deny it left right and center, ask for managers, etc., even though the device is clearly dripping so much water it's making a huge puddle on the counter that's dripping onto the floor. Nope, it wasn't water damaged!

Now Assange has got more to worry about.

[dwywit]

The USofA can't have other nations doing something serious to reduce consumption. This will give the US govt solid reason to invade and conquer Sweden.

If Assange gets extradited to Sweden.........

On the other hand, it's a reduction in taxes, it'll give the GOP a stroke trying to figure out whether to support this or not.

On the gripping hand, Sweden has a fairly robust welfare structure, and that's SOCIALISM!

Re:Now Assange has got more to worry about.

[Zontar The Mindless]

Fortunately, Sweden cares very little about what the GOP thinks, of this I can assure you.

Re:Now Assange has got more to worry about.

[aliquis]

Just come and liberate us.
The government is the enemy. Gogo.

Donald Trump. Are you listening? It's either you or Putin. Someone got to save us.

/ Johan Krüger Haglert

Re: Now Assange has got more to worry about.

[Anonymous Coward]

Sweden cares very much what the US thinks: they changed all of their copyright laws overnight to please the MPAA. It's not like they had any choices of course...

Re:Now Assange has got more to worry about.

[Anonymous Coward]

alt-right.swedish.politics.bork.bork.bork

Re: Now Assange has got more to worry about.

[Zontar The Mindless]

I didn't say "US", now, did I? No, I did not. I said "GOP".

I'm sorry you don't understand that these are two different things.

Re:Now Assange has got more to worry about.

[Anonymous Coward]

I pay about 1200SEK (~140USD) extra per month for healthcare so i don't have to wait for a month or more if something happens. (see story of why below)

And i still do have to pay for every doctor-visit (about $20) and i have to pay for all prescribed medicine i buy.. (slight discount but forced to use the generics).. We do have a ceiling so when you reach ~2000SEK per year for doctors visits you don't have to pay anything more and when you reach ~2000SEK for medicine you get it for free too..

But biggest problem is that you have to push yourself thru the system because they want to do as little as possible..... Remember when i had a BIG infection and they just said "wait for a few more days"... Well, after 1.5 weeks i insisted, and refused to leave, before they drain "swelling".. Comment from doctor when he realized what was coming out from there was "This was not good"... spent 3 weeks with daily visits to them for draining it + getting prescribed powerful antibiotics...

Swedish health care may be semi-free / cheap, but good it is not.

If i get sick and have to stay home for 2 months i will not get anywhere close to full pay..
http://www.oresunddirekt.dk/en... ... (and you still have to pay tax on that money of course!)

and the cost of living in Sweden is not cheap..
http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-...

Re:Now Assange has got more to worry about.

[Anonymous Coward]

"This will give the US govt solid reason to invade and conquer Sweden."

As a US citizen, that fucking sounds good to me.

Sweden is the Saudia Arabia of feminism, where thinking about looking at a woman is a prosecutable offense if you're not an immigrant. It's where European self-genocide, as penance for something soemthing during WWII was first conceived. It's the final crematorium of big L Liberal values.

Fuck the Enlightenment, right Sweden? Fuck the Magna Carta. Fuck the Rights of Man. Someone somewhere who is yearning to turn Sweden into the rape capital of the Europe and burn democracy to the ground wants to immigrate as an economic refugee .

But why invade, when we could much more easily nuke?

Re:Now Assange has got more to worry about.

[Anonymous Coward]

On the gripping hand, Sweden has a fairly robust welfare structure, and that's SOCIALISM!

Social welfare states are in the right wing/fascist tradition, not the socialist tradition. It was Bismarck and Hitler that advocated, pioneered, and implemented social welfare policies. That's why social welfare states are particularly common in the German-influenced sphere.

Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

Sweden?!?!

Tax cut?!?!?

To encourage job growth?!?!

"Progressive" heads explode!

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

christ on a cracker, you really are a retard.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[PopeRatzo]

Sweden?!?!

Tax cut?!?!?

To encourage job growth?!?!

"Progressive" heads explode!

Until you figure out that the tax cut is not to corporations and the rich, but to regular people, and alt-right heads explodes instead.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[ShanghaiBill]

Sweden?!?! Tax cut?!?!?

Sweden has high taxes by American standards, but by many measures they are otherwise even more capitalist than America. Their post office is privatized, as is a big fraction of their educational system. It is very easy to start a business, and while regulations are strict, they are also streamlined and the bureaucracy is fast and efficient. Sweden ranks 8th out of 185 countries on the Ease of doing business index. America is only one notch higher.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

until the mega corpse make the FDA or another alphabet agency require a "manufactures license" to repair and sell equipment to kill off all the small businesses that spring up, like what is happening in the vaping industry.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

You are a retard - "vaping industry"? You mean the fake cigarettes that are as cancerous as the regular ones, plus often explode on their own volition?

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[PopeRatzo]

like what is happening in the vaping industry

"My box mod is made from Reardon metal!"

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[BlueStrat]

"My box mod is made from Reardon metal!"

I expect that quite soon, as regulatory capture and cronyism kills off small single-proprietor businesses and the few large 'connected' (tobacco co,s, mostly) manufacturers jack up prices for cheap (but legal!) junk as typically happens, that many people will just be paying somebodies' kid brother for one of the rigs he puts together out of used laptop batteries in his basement while he's smoking blunts.

Which would you prefer happen to be in the luggage on your or your family's next flight because TSA missed it? (gasp! inconceivable! right?)

Strat

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[willy_me]

Tax cuts benefit those who pay more taxes - the rich. A family that exists just above the poverty line is not going to get anything back when they have their washing machine repaired. But a wealthy individual would get a significant amount back - hardly fair.

A better solution would be to increase the "environmental" tax and apply the additional tax revenue to pay for recycling and other environmental programs. Now everyone benefits equally. And by raising the price of appliances, the government would be promoting more repair and reuse of appliances.

Re: Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[fluffernutter]

Have you seen evidence that they cause cancer? I recently read the opposite; that they may be coming around to accepting them as a stop smoking method. I don't use them, just interested.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Zontar The Mindless]

I'd really like to see what factual basis you're employing for this argument, because I'm not seeing one. In fact, I come to exactly the opposite conclusion, maybe because (a) I live in Sweden, (b) I know what a washing machine costs here, and (c) I can do simple maths.

Washing machine X costs the same regardless of your income. (Yes, if you make more, you can buy a more expensive machine, in which case it's a different machine.)

If I make 100000 SEK a year and spend 10000 of it on that washing machine, that's 10% of my income. If I spend 5000 to repair it, that's 5%. If I get back 2500 of that on my taxes, that's 2.5%.

If I make 200000 SEK a year and spend 10000 of it on a washing machine, that's 5% of my income. If I spend 5000 to repair it, that's 2.5%. If I get back 2500 of that on my taxes, that's 1.25%.

So, if anything, the tax cut actually benefits low-income folks *more* than it does the wealthy since it returns a greater proportion of their income. What's your evidence to the contrary, other than grand pronouncements?

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[flyingfsck]

This is VAT. Everybody pays VAT. Rich and poor. I know, that is a foreign concept to an American, but Sweden is not in America.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

It is very easy to start a business, and while regulations are strict, they are also streamlined and the bureaucracy is fast and efficient.

+1, Funny. You obviously don't live here, or know anyone who runs a small business here.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[aliquis]

Sweden?!?!

Tax cut?!?!?

To encourage job growth?!?!

"Progressive" heads explode!

It's not really a tax cut - they will still spend the money just tax something else.

What it really is is political regulation of the choice of the people from spending their money on something else than a new bathroom, someone to clean their home or bicycle tube repair into doing one of those things instead because the taxation are different on the different choices.

By taxing something else more and this lower you just just as well see it as them spending tax money on repairing stuff people didn't thought was worth repairing otherwise. Because the government knows best. Which of course is all that Sweden is about and 100% socialist / authoritarian / anti-liberal / anti-choice.

/ Johan Krüger Haglert

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Kkloe]

why should a poor sod have a washing machine to start with?

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

as long as you hand over 2/3 of all your profits to the state , runing an business is not that hard Sweden. Maktintressen an living as an small business is bloddy hard , growing is even harder. And if you start an small business and cash out you are looking at 2/3 tax on the cash out.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

Just because you think it is hard it doesn't mean that it is easier elsewhere.

Re: Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

http://www.nbcnews.com/health/...
http://www.iflscience.com/heal...
http://www.livescience.com/547...

Propylene glycol, a chemical found in e-liquids, can irritate the eyes and airways, Siegel said. Early studies have also revealed that when propylene glycol or glycerin are heated and vaporized, they can degrade into formaldehyde and acetaldehyde, he said. Both of these chemicals are considered carcinogens, although it's not yet clear how repeated exposure to them may cause cancer, he said.

does not require much looking..

Does not require much looking...

Re: Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

You should read about popcorn lungs. Now, if you want a relatively safe tobacco product to consume, use snuff. Destroys your gums in the long run, though.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Darinbob]

High tax rate but also high return on value to citizens. The US has a very low tax rate but also a very low return back to citizens. What pisses off people is when they pay taxes but get very little to show for it (except a gargantuan military).

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

And this one notch highers is because big corporation enjoy tax heavens USA and fast bribery track to Congress. Not that Swedes are much different. The country is smaller and you steal and rape you get the bill usually. No place to hide easily except in Nordic tundra, which as we know is not among the most desired retirement places for banksters and other financial services crooks.

Re: Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Alumoi]

http://www.nbcnews.com/health/...
http://www.iflscience.com/heal...
http://www.livescience.com/547...

Propylene glycol, a chemical found in e-liquids, can irritate the eyes and airways, Siegel said. Early studies have also revealed that when propylene glycol or glycerin are heated and vaporized, they can degrade into formaldehyde and acetaldehyde, he said. Both of these chemicals are considered carcinogens, although it's not yet clear how repeated exposure to them may cause cancer, he said.

does not require much looking..

Does not require much looking...

Does not require much comprehension, either.
I know English is hard, but try and look up the difference between will and can and will and may.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

That's easy, the one made in the basement. The quality will be better, the price lower and I can repair it easily with always available parts.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[drinkypoo]

Sweden has high taxes by American standards, but by many measures they are otherwise even more capitalist than America. Their post office is privatized, as is a big fraction of their educational system.

What a coincidence. Our post office is privatized, as is a big fraction of our educational system. And then there's the influence of school administrators' unions, which are not to be confused with educators' unions as they are not the same thing and they are typically in direct conflict over where the money should be spent. Educators' unions want to spend money on education, and on reasonable salaries for educators. The admins' unions want gross administrative salaries that detract from education, and fuck everyone else. Schools thus become for-profit enterprises, even when they're "public".

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[hey!]

It's well established that sales taxes are regressive. That's why Texas has no income tax, but a whopping 8.05% sales tax.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[hey!]

as long as you hand over 2/3 of all your profits to the state , runing an business is not that hard Sweden. Maktintressen an living as an small business is bloddy hard , growing is even harder. And if you start an small business and cash out you are looking at 2/3 tax on the cash out.

Running a small business is hard anywhere.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

... get very little to show for it ...

Because many Americans whinge when their taxes go to poor people. How many Americans are complaining about their gargantuan military, gargantuan correctional service, nationalized transport 'security', the untouchable police, politicians and CEOs? Americans are told that they need all those people and must excuse their bad behaviour. Who's complaining about the corporate welfare, or the failing education, healthcare and legal representation in the USA?

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Gavagai80]

Sales taxes normally exempt food items for that reason -- so the poor can eat without being taxed. One can of course get more selective and put extra tax on luxury items. Sales taxes can be as progressive or regressive as you design them to be.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

. What pisses off people is when they pay taxes but get very little to show for it (except a gargantuan military).

No, what pisses people off is the free ride their tax money gives all of the scum on welfare living in almost free housing.

How about including a section on the 1040 that would allow people to select where their tax money gets used - and then see how many select "welfare and free housing"?

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[hey!]

Connecticut has a luxury tax on clothing costing over $1000. Several states exempt certain items like coats. But in general most states tax all clothing. Pennsylvania is the only state with a sub 4% income tax rate that exempts any clothing.

Re: Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[fluffernutter]

The first article talks about formaldehyde, not cancer...
Second article says there isn't much evidence... which is why I was asking in the first place
Third article says some stuff about possible heart and respiratory issues, nothing about cancer

Do you f'n read?? You just wasted my time, thanks. Even worse, you are spreading misinformation.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

Government only "returns" what it wants. Pacifism that enabled Hitler and state support of Islamic rapists are the kind of "value" you get in Sweden

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[PopeRatzo]

This is VAT. Everybody pays VAT. Rich and poor. I know, that is a foreign concept to an American, but Sweden is not in America.

Except a tax break for repairs will disproportionately benefit the people at the lower end of the scale. Think it over.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

My experience of living in Texas for several years was that they didn't exclude food from sales tax.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

"Until you figure out that the tax cut is not to corporations and the rich, but to regular people, and alt-right heads explodes instead."

Strange logic given the fact that most on the 'right' are against a VAT tax to begin with.

We just laugh at the boot lickers that thought it was a good idea in the first place.

Re:Who's gonna pay "THEIR FAIR SHARE"?!?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

Sales taxes normally exempt food items for that reason -- so the poor can eat without being taxed. One can of course get more selective and put extra tax on luxury items. Sales taxes can be as progressive or regressive as you design them to be.

Sales taxes are always regressive in every case that I have seen, but politicians and special interest groups can create the illusion that this isn't the case.

In typical cases, the sales taxes still apply to a lot of the infrastructure, tools, supplies, and so forth that is needed to produce the product and transport it to the store where the customer will buy it. Given the complex logistics chains of the modern word, there is typically a lot of places where sales tax is being added. VAT taxes the worst kind of sales taxes in this regard, of course.

For a concrete example of one of the many sales taxes that hits the ability of the poor to buy food, consider gas taxes. That food has to be transported to the store, and it isn't being carried by bicycles. Worse, there are lots of parts and tools and supplies that go into keeping the transportation vehicles running, and these are generally affected by the tax as well. Property taxes also work into the mix in a negative fashion - those vehicles need to be stored and repaired somewhere, and the store selling the food also a location.

Since every business is affected by the taxes, the market price of goods and services goes up. The net effect of these additional costs is businesses have to charge more money for their services. The poor, of course, are the most affected. The cost of food goes up, even if there isn't any direct sales tax on the food itself.

The only way a sales tax can be made progressive is to focus the tax on large expenditures, such as yachts, as no poor person will ever be buying a yacht. Even then you have to be careful, since the business selling the yacht is probably an employer of a lot of workers that are not rich, and they'll be adversely affected by the tax.

If this isn't clear, take a couple of courses in economics and business. Sales taxes (along with property taxes) are generally a cunning way for unscrupulous people to hide the true costs of their social policies: they bring lots of money into the government while hiding from people how much they are actually spending. Often, this is used by liberals to implement policies they favor while pretending those policies have no negative economic costs. Nothing wrong with liberalism, of course, but there's a lot wrong with the combination of liberalism and people lying to themselves (and others) about the real costs of the policies they support.

Extending taxes on income to include the large occasional items (such as gifts or inheritance) in a rational fashion - targeting the super-rich while going ordinary folks a break - makes a lot more sense than having sales taxes. But this isn't politically practical, since the rich have so much money to spend buying politicians and propaganda, so in typical cases everybody else gets screwed instead.

Compatible with EU rules?

[manu0601]

I wonder if EU commission will let that happen without complaining it violates EU's crazy free market rules

In the sick brain of EU leaders, a VAT incentive can be considered an unfair hidden state help for some actors. On the other hand, who could stand against such a green measure?

Re:Compatible with EU rules?

[ShanghaiBill]

I wonder if EU commission will let that happen without complaining it violates EU's crazy free market rules

That depends on how it is implemented. If there is a requirement that the repairperson is local to Sweden, then that would violate EU rules, and can, and should be, banned. But if a Swede can drive to Finland or Denmark to have the repair done, and still get the tax break, then it should be okay.

Re:Compatible with EU rules?

[climb_no_fear]

Germany has been doing this for years but in the form of a tax refund. You get all of the VAT back for things like the gardner, house cleaning or plumber but only up to 2k€ or so. Supposed to discourage undocumented work (and help Germany collect the labor income taxes).

Re:Compatible with EU rules?

[Kkloe]

what?, no?, if a finish company can open a repair shop in sweden and tax in finland, that is what the free market says in a nutshell

Re:Compatible with EU rules?

[Anonymous Coward]

But if a Swede can drive to Finland or Denmark to have the repair done, and still get the tax break, then it should be okay.

In that case the tax would be paid in Finland or Denmark so it will fall under their tax rules.

I know that you are thinking about the Apple case, but the illegal part about that was that a single company made a deal with the government.
As long as the tax exemption applies to everyone doing business in Sweden and not just friends and family of politicians it is completely fine.

Re:Compatible with EU rules?

[Anonymous Coward]

No. the Finish company would open a repair ship in Sweden and get the tax break for taxes paid in Sweden.
Whatever they do in Finland is none of Swedens business and whatever they do in Sweden is none of Finlands business.

It's not the US where you can be taxed long after you moved out just because you still have a citizenship.

Maybe I won't be so lonely?

[Anonymous Coward]

Nah.

Your Maytag Repair Man

Peter meet Paul

[Anonymous Coward]

These socialist countries oscillate back and forth between screwing different groups over, while claiming to raise the standard of living for all. You know what else works in perfect synchronized harmony? an anthill.

Good thinking

[bnmm]

Before rescuing the planet from carbon emissions the Swedes might want to rescue their country first:

SWEDEN IN CHAOS: Number of ‘no-go zones’ INCREASED as police lose control over violence

Sweden turns on migrants amid rise in violence and sex attacks

Sweden on the BRINK: Malmö in flames as vengeful thugs set cars alight

Re:Good thinking

[Anonymous Coward]

faggot

Re: Good thinking

[Anonymous Coward]

As someone from Sweden I don't know if I should laugh or cry every time articles like these are brought up.

It's cherry picking at best. Crime in Sweden is going down by all objective, measurable standards. Sure, we have problems like anyone else but this is just crazy.

Re:Good thinking

[BlueStrat]

Before rescuing the planet from carbon emissions the Swedes might want to rescue their country first:

SWEDEN IN CHAOS: Number of âno-go zonesâ(TM) INCREASED as police lose control over violence

Sweden turns on migrants amid rise in violence and sex attacks

Sweden on the BRINK: Malmà in flames as vengeful thugs set cars alight

Those who are working towards effectively abolishing national sovereignty and erecting a structure for central global governance know that great changes only occur at times of great turmoil, war, famine, financial/currency system collapses, and anarchy/chaos.

There are some disturbing societal/cultural/political parallels to pre-WW2 Germany occurring in the US. The EU is on fire. Nationalism and populism is on the rise in many powerful nations around the world. The global financial markets are in dangerous territory. Russia and China are flexing their military muscles.

It's not going to take a whole lot at this point to send the world off into a global catastrophic collapse and conflict. What might well emerge scares the crap out of me for the whole of humanity.

Strat

Re:Good thinking

[Zontar The Mindless]

You linked to the Express. But I'm willing to bet that you thought you were linking to a news site.

Re: Good thinking

[Zontar The Mindless]

What did you expect from the Express?—makes the Metro look like an actual newspaper.

Re: Good thinking

[Anonymous Coward]

Get lost... Stop propagating the lies that everything is fine...

https://www.bra.se/bra/bra-in-...

Re:Good thinking

[Bearhouse]

Except that the sources quoted are all the "Daily Express", a sensationalist rag.
Sure the Swedes have their problems, but less than those in many other European countries and the USA

Re:Good thinking

[F.Ultra]

There is no such thing as a no-go or no-fly zone in Sweden. The police outguns any criminal by several orders of magnitude and not a single cop killer have ever escaped justice (not to mention that it was 17 years since the last police man where killed).

Re:Good thinking

[Anonymous Coward]

Why is this considered a Troll? I'm so sick that telling the truth is banned from mainstream media. I live in a village with only a few hundred Muslims on a total population of 2300. From the attempted coup in Turkey until now, their have been way too many riots. A total of 43 cars were burned. Can you imagine this amount of cars in a small village? That's about 1 out of 12 cars were totally destroyed because of political problems in Turkey. 3 restaurants were destroyed, one was completely burned down including 3 neighbouring houses of non Muslim people.
 
Meanwhile there is still the constant threat from 'teenage' boys who keep on insulting, vandalizing and committing 'petty' crime. It's petty crime because local politicians say it's petty crime. But burglary, beating people, groping women, asking money from shop owners for protection, ... that's not 'petty' crime. And 40-50 year old Moroccans are no longer teenagers... And people driving in expensive cars are not poor people without opportunities.

Teachers in the local school are intimidated in the hope they resign so they can be replaced by Islamic teachers. Arab and Turkish is now part of the curriculum for kids from 6-12 years old and even the local children whose parents don't have the money to send them to a 'white' school are talking with an Arab accent. We can't even buy local food any more. Everything is Halal and Middle Eastern. The food is not bad, but we should have the right to buy our traditional food. It should be no crime to have our traditional 'eggs, bacon and sausage' breakfast for example. What's so xenophobic about the poor man's meal the croque-monsieur? Eating ham is not racist...
And I don't live in Sweden, nor am I a 'faggot'. Probably I'm a racist, xenophobe and islamophobe. That is at least what national politicians and the media claim as the reason why more and more people want less and less islamization.
 
We keep on hearing the same dogma over and over again: Western culture has to thank everything to the Arabs and is still morally, technologically, scientifically, culturally a lesser culture than the Middle East. Multiculturalism is really, really good, there are no downsides and without it we would end up in the dark ages. Islam is peace, there are no Muslim terrorists because Islam is peace. If a terrorist says he is Muslim, he lies because Islam is peace. Jadajada, blah, blah. The security service priority is to detect speech that might offend Muslims, instead of trying to detect potential terrorists. And terrorism treat is real. Because Muslim terrorism is looked away from, we now also get more and more extreme right and extreme left terrorism on top of the Muslim terrorism. Bravo, well played. Traditional parties all embraced the Muslim, so only extreme left and extreme right or submission is left for the 'islamophobes'.
 
The EU is falling apart because the Muslim hugging continues, and critics on this Islamization politic, that was started in 1975, are seen as dissident voices, extreme right, xenophobe, islamophobe. Islamophobe is a term that was invented to be able to put writers of critical opinions/blogs away as really evil people. Recently there is the Turkish issues. While Turkey is regressing to an Islamic state with a new sultan, European leaders keep on insisting that Turkey belongs in the EU. But a country with the same issues, Russia, is seen as the biggest threat, and every opportunity is taken to punish Russians. I'm not a fan of Putin, but I'm certainly not a fan of Erdogan who controls an army of Turks in Europe, the recent riots are a proof of this. Russia is blamed for every civilian death in Syria, but Turkey can keep on killing Kurds in their own country and in Syria and Iraq. They are both evil, the only difference is that one is Muslim (or at least wants that other call him the leader of Islam) and the other is secular.

Re: Good thinking

[hey!]

Probably worth noting that to compare crime rates reported, you have to use a similar method of counting. In every country something like a murder-robbery will be counted at least twice, once under the homicide category and once under property crimes. Sweden's rates are inflated by a system in which the same crime can be categorized more ways.

So simply adding up all "reporting offenses" confounds two factors: the rate of underlying social disorder and the practices of the reporting system.

If you want to compare social disorder across reporting regimes, probably the best approach is to compare murder rates. If a murder is involved in an event then that event will always be counted in the murder category:

Japan, Singapore, Iceland: 0.3 per 100,000
Sweden, Portugal, UK, Iceland: 0.9
France: 1.2
Cameroon, Bangladesh: 2.8
India*, Moldova, Montenegro: 3.2
United States, Thailand, Iran: 3.9
Lebanon, Turkey, Ukraine: 4.3
Somalia: 5.6
Cambodia, Afghanistan: 6.5
Palestine: 7.4
Iraq: 8.0
Chad, Gabon, Togo: 9.4
Nigeria, Guinea-Bissau: 10.3
Mali, Antigua and Barbuda: 11.2
Democratic Republic of Congo: 13.5
South Sudan: 14.4
Botswana:15.4
Namibia, Panama: 17.2
Brazil: 24.6
Trinidad and Tobago: 25.9
Columbia: 27.9
Guatemala: 31.2
South Africa: 33
Belize:34.4
Jamaica: 36.1
Venezuela: 62
El Salvador: 64.2
Honduras: 84.6

Re: Good thinking

[Gavagai80]

One non-current year of slight rise, not adjusted per-capita, is quite the meaningless statistical cherry-picking. I have no idea whether crime is on the rise in Sweden (I'm American so I don't care), but it's easy to see that your link does not provide reasonable support for your claim.

What do you mean...

[matbury]

...we can't shop our way to a greener future? Consumer choice of which soon-to-be-landfill products isn't going to prevent climate change?!

Yeah, don't worry about this

[aliquis]

The immigrants set lots of cars on fire all the time.

Where I live towards the end of August more or less all the windows in the area center had been smashed and two weeks ago a car was lit on fire on "my" parking loot, someone had to set the youth center and music and dancing activity center on fire as-well as the children facility of the primary care center.

We also have all the immigrants in Malmö who use a in debt / criminal / social low-life "guardian" as owner of their car to not pay any taxes, insurance or parking fees and tickets and then when the cars are eventually removed from the system since no-one will pay all the fines on purchase they are just scrapped and what was it more that I was thinking off ...

Our "environmentalist" (more like "immigrationalists") "progressives" hate any personal responsibility for progression and any progression you can accomplish yourself, but they totally want society to bring it for you, with .. well.. the usual result I guess, which is close to none.

The Social rats dictatorship party know they need the beggars, the complainers, the demands, the free-loaders, the rats, the trouble-makers, the "the situation and actions of and in my life is someone elseÂs fault"-trash people to remain in power so they are so willing to bring in more of them and let them have their way.

Also of course Sweden is a country where vehicles are upgraded with new ones ran on bio gas or ethanol and so on because we all know that's environment friendly to produce as is replacing the vehicle fleet.

It's just a joke. But supposedly it's a good joke and if you're not in then you're a racist fascist anti-democrat.
Oh, and our local municipal home owner (which own lots of homes in this city) has figured out that having a working income will be a demand to get 75% of the apartments they rent out in the most trashy immigrant dense areas whereas in other places of the city for some apartments if you've lived with them or been in queue for over four years (as in not newly arrived immigrant) you will not be able to apply for it.
Because socialists politicians know best. Diversity & multi-culturalism - until the last European is dead and what was Europe is gone.

Re:Yeah, don't worry about this

[aliquis]

The immigrants set lots of cars on fire all the time.

Where I live towards the end of August more or less all the windows in the area center had been smashed and two weeks ago a car was lit on fire on "my" parking loot, someone had to set the youth center and music and dancing activity center on fire as-well as the children facility of the primary care center.

We also have all the immigrants in Malmà who use a in debt / criminal / social low-life "guardian" as owner of their car to not pay any taxes, insurance or parking fees and tickets and then when the cars are eventually removed from the system since no-one will pay all the fines on purchase they are just scrapped and what was it more that I was thinking off ...

Our "environmentalist" (more like "immigrationalists") "progressives" hate any personal responsibility for progression and any progression you can accomplish yourself, but they totally want society to bring it for you, with .. well.. the usual result I guess, which is close to none.

The Social rats dictatorship party know they need the beggars, the complainers, the demands, the free-loaders, the rats, the trouble-makers, the "the situation and actions of and in my life is someone elseÃs fault"-trash people to remain in power so they are so willing to bring in more of them and let them have their way.

Also of course Sweden is a country where vehicles are upgraded with new ones ran on bio gas or ethanol and so on because we all know that's environment friendly to produce as is replacing the vehicle fleet.

It's just a joke. But supposedly it's a good joke and if you're not in then you're a racist fascist anti-democrat.
Oh, and our local municipal home owner (which own lots of homes in this city) has figured out that having a working income will be a demand to get 75% of the apartments they rent out in the most trashy immigrant dense areas whereas in other places of the city for some apartments if you've lived with them or been in queue for over four years (as in not newly arrived immigrant) you will not be able to apply for it.
Because socialists politicians know best. Diversity & multi-culturalism - until the last European is dead and what was Europe is gone.

Should had said "a lot."

Also I should use my real name so people can find this in the future (and because supposedly it help with credibility and otherwise you're a liar according to the same dictatorship rats - what they actually mean is of course that you better self-censor yourself and if you're anonymous the chances of that to happen are less likely so they want to demand a real-name or that you shut up - preferably with the later as the actual result regardless.)
Anyway my real name is Johan Krüger Haglert and I live in Ã-rebro on Varbergagatan. So there. Enjoy.

Re:Yeah, don't worry about this

[flyingfsck]

Uhmm... Hi Johan, since you now published your address, I got to ask: Is your car burning yet?

Re:Yeah, don't worry about this

[Zontar The Mindless]

Hej Johan,

You can actually rent a flat in Malmö? Or do you mean "rent" as in "pay SEK 250 a year to be on a waiting list for ten years"? The latter is why I bought a flat in Stockholm...

Re:Yeah, don't worry about this

[aliquis]

No, it was a municipal car they had set on fire on this parking lot, three nearby cars where damaged though possibly including a black persons family van because he stood there when the fire department arrived and later moved it.

I have no car.
I've had a car parked here though and at-least one tire was cut though, I don't remember if it was multiple ones. Also my bike stolen possibly by a neighbor because the note was taken down in this stair-way only.

Re:Yeah, don't worry about this

[aliquis]

I don't live in Malmö I live in Örebro.

Re:Yeah, don't worry about this

[Zontar The Mindless]

Mitt fel. Förlåt mig.

Örebro? Känner du en kille vid namnet Jerry Gray? En klasskompis.

Re:Yeah, don't worry about this

[Anonymous Coward]

First You complain about every problem being the immigrants fauld and then You complain about "the situation and actions of and in my life is someone else's fault"-trash.

That is the logic applied by the racist Sweden Democrats when they try to portray Sweden as the worst country in the world because of immigration.

Sweden has a problem with poor and marginalised suburbs, just like all European countries do. But it is really nothing compared to other countries in the EU or the US. Sweden has seen a steady decrease of violent crime rates for many years and its worst areas are still among the safest places in the world.

Re:Yeah, don't worry about this

[Anonymous Coward]

I wonder if i can seek asylum somewhere from the crap going on here....

Planning to move out of Sweden within 2-3 years....

Re:Yeah, don't worry about this

[Anonymous Coward]

You are free to move anywhere in the EU (except the UK) if you can support yourself. Because of the Nordic Union, You are also free to move between the Nordic countries as You wish, without any special requirements.

But if You really want asylum, perhaps You could try Syria. According to right wing propaganda, they are sending all their worst to Sweden, so You might like the ones left there.

Re:Yeah, don't worry about this

[Anonymous Coward]

The right wing propaganda doesn't say to not help refugees, but to not accept them as immigrants. Right wing propaganda tells that we are still fighting the too high government spending and that we should all rely on our self to progress and not depend on the government because the government can no longer support this ideal since the financial crisis. New immigrants who need free houses, money and education means that we will have to work even harder, earn less and pay more taxes to fulfil the socialist dreams of an elite that is completely disconnected from reality.
 
Right wing propaganda points to the problems of many Europeans. Old people are put in homes were they are fed medication to keep them calm and hasten their death. Right wing propaganda points to the abuses of euthanasia. Although the intentions were good, many old people whose pension is too low to pay the bills are put under social pressure to ask for euthanasia. Being left alone on a small chamber with bad food makes them depressed, while the kids have to work, work, work to pay the bills and the high taxes. Right wing wants to return to family values, and while they admit that putting a stable family central is also an idea that was supported by Hitler, they say it is also a Christian value and the value that made Europe (and the US) great during the recovery after WWII. Broken families are the biggest source of poverty, especially the single mums families. This is a valid point in my opinion. At this moment single mum families are poor because they don't get enough free money from the government. But the government still has to pay of the debts made in the past and when they had to bail out the banks. There is no money to keep everyone out of poverty.
 
Right wing propaganda alls point to the fact that subsidized houses have increased the house prices even more than before the subsidized social houses. Social houses are more expensive than non social houses simply because 'poor' (you are only poor with the right connections, many rich are considered poor because of being good friends with some politician) get free money to be able to buy social houses, while they don't get free money to buy the cheaper, non socialized houses. This is a valid point in my opinion. I earn too much to be able to buy a social house, so I have to buy the more expensive (because non social means non subsidized) and often smaller and less luxurious houses on the market.
The right propaganda is not as extreme as you claim it to be. The right wants to help refugees, build camps and mosques and schools, so they can continue their life and prepare to return to their home country once the war is over so they can rebuild their country, just like we rebuild Europe after it was destroyed after devastating world wars.
The right also wants to stop the NGO's who keep on importing massive amounts of migrants of whom 80% come from non war zones and are just fortune seekers and eventually end up in an illegal camp because uneducated fortune seekers don't get asylum when they don't come from a war zone. NGO's don't pick up 'refugees' in the middle of the sea, but along the coast lines of North Africa. There is a lot of proof of this, but it never gets the attention of the media (why you must ask, probably the same reason why the many rapes are not covered).

The right is put away as extremist and evil which even right wing people don't want, so the left 'we are always right, and the others are always extreme right like Hitler' get what they always screamed: extreme right opposition.

Re:Yeah, don't worry about this

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, the right wing that wants Sweden to go into an arms race with Russia does not seem keen to cut government spending.

Sweden does not have an overbearing government debt, in fact it has paid back a lot of it in the last two decades and it is a political decision not to pay it all back.

I think Your entire argument is pertaining to some other country. Euthanasia is not legal in Sweden, and if Your pension is to low to pay for elderly care, the state insurance will make up for the difference and make sure that you have some money left after the bills.

If the children of an elderly person wants to stay home and take care of them when they become sick, instead of sending them into elderly care, this is also possible. If You do that You will be employed by the local government as caretaker, and receive a monthly wage. Not a great wage, but not at the poverty line either. Most young people wants to live their own life and have a career of their own, but I have known several people who have used this to quit their job and take care of their sick parents instead.

I agree that single parents should get better support from the government if they are having financial problems. But this is a minor expense for a rich country like Sweden, so if there was a political will this could basically be done without upsetting the state budget very much. I'we yet to hear the right wing raise any such suggestions though.

Shortage of housing is a consequence of the fact that the government stopped subsidizing housing projects for rental flats. This made the big building corporations weary of investing large sums into project that will give a return on investment over many decades. This will likely be corrected by increasing the cost of living and thereby passing on the cost of the risk to the tenants.

In Sweden You dont get money to "buy" social housing, and You cannot be disqualified by earning too much. If You are in an emergency situation and live on the street, the government will find some kind of temporary shelter for You. If You have children they will have to arrange accommodations that are not harmful for the child and conform to certain criterion. But generally, the way to get governmental housing in Sweden is to wait in a queue. And the time You have to wait is proportional to how good the location is. So if You want to live in the most attractive parts of downtown Stockholm You will have to wait 25 years, while a few years is enough to get a flat in the suburbs (or even shorter in small towns).

But as a right-winger, should You really rely on social housing and government assistance? Why dont You go to a private landlord and pay the market rate? Its not like there aren't plenty of private landlords in Sweden. No-one owes You a cheap luxury flat in the best neighborhood.

Re:Yeah, don't worry about this

[An dochasac]

The immigrants..

(yada yada...)

...But supposedly it's a good joke and if you're not in then you're a racist fascist anti-democrat.>

(yada yada)

No, it's not a joke. It's not a joke that millions of immigrants are blamed worldwide if one commits a crime somewhere in the world but hundreds of crimes by racist, fascist anti-democrats are too common to be news anywhere. How many people know about the 64 arson attacks on refugee centres in Sweden and numerous similar attacks in Germany, Denmark and daily incidents of violence against immigrants in Ireland, the UK and elsewhere? How many know of the Afghan refugee driven to suicide in Sweden this week?

It's funny that here in Ireland, people shun the immigrants in the local repair shops but happily send hundreds of Euro to multinational sweatshops overseas where 90% of the money leaves the EU, never to return. The repair tax break is a good start but I can see right now that this is a small problem. We really need to repair our society so that we don't have so much shit for people like you to shovel onto the backs of immigrants and refugees.

American washers are easily repairable

[flyingfsck]

The 'old fashioned' big American GE washers and dryers are easily repairable. After 15 years of use, I ordered two 'overhaul kits' for a few dollars and installation took about 30 minutes, after which they were good for another 15 years. The overhaul kits contain all the washers, seals, rollers, belts and whatnot that always wears out and a detailed booklet on how to install it, complete with warnings about: Don't do this, since you may cut your fingers. The Chinese/Korean stuff you can't repair even if you can find the parts, because it is usually a clip on one time assembly or spot welded so it breaks when you try to take it apart.

This has happened in the car market

[Bruce66423]

Seven year warranties are reasonably common for cars, reflecting the fact that reliability has increased massively. Applying this to other industries would be interesting; in cars I get the impression that it was the Koreans who broke ranks on the issue and used this to overcome people's suspicion of this new source. There's an interpretation of British law that suggests a six year warranty is now part of the package, but it's not being enforced as such.

The problem of course is that for the poor, the extra cost which manufacturers would legitimately impose to raise the standards of their products to make them last longer would be a serious burden. In the longer term they would benefit from cheaper second hand good; the rich will replace white goods, furniture etc long before they wear out, leaving a good amount of life in them. But in the short term there will be an issue.

Yeah...

[denzacar]

Like that fixing that hidden iPhone 7 headphone jack problem.

Jobs of the past resurrected for the noble savage

[Anonymous Coward]

For decades the Western people had to buy stuff that was designed to break after the warranty period expired. This seems too cruel for the poor new immigrants, so why not subsidize jobs that were killed for the Swedes in the 70's and 80's to give free money to the immigrants. Guess were it will fail? New machines have proprietary components that can't be replaced because the spare parts are no longer available. This just ends up as a subsidized repair shop that doesn't even have to do its best to earn the money.

This is already done in my country and it is a complete failure. The traditional bike repair shops don't get any subsidies and have to compete with people who work for free and get paid whether they do a good job or not. Since the quality was so bad, they are now just social meeting places where you just got to drink some tea and occasionally help someone by repairing a simple defect like a flat tire or replacing a light bulb to earn your money.

Wow...

[kenh]

The country's Social Democrat and Green party coalition have submitted proposals to Parliament that would reduce the value-added-tax (VAT) on bicycle, clothing, and shoe repairs from 25% to 12%.

25% VAT in Sweden - wow... I guess that helps fund those "free" social services Sweden is famous for.

Re:Wow...

[Anonymous Coward]

25% VAT in Sweden - wow... I guess that helps fund those "free" social services Sweden is famous for.

Something that we in the USA should consider.

Lawn is broken

[Anonymous Coward]

My lawn is broken. Please repair it by trimming the grass and I will pay you and then take the tax cut. Thanks!

Not For All Products

[Anonymous Coward]

Automobiles are an example when there is a public benefit to buying a new model rather than repairing an older model. Newer cars are safer, use less fuel and pollute far less than older models.
                        We could aid in the repair idea by certifying that things like cell phones are created with easy and inexpensive repairs get tax breaks while phones that resist easy repair would pay a tax penalty.

Now,If only there was a way to repair modern stuff

[Anonymous Coward]

But there ain't. Look in a modern fridge, surface mount and break on removal connections. Look at a modern bike, screws made from super soft steel. Look in a modern toilet, tiny sliver thin plastic bars in a "module" that has to be replaced as a unit.

THIS WOULD HAVE BEEN A GREAT IDEA IN 1952!

fooled you

[Anonymous Coward]

The unintended? consequences of communist political correctness religion are the chief driver of the environments woes. More union jobs from more waste.

Wait....

[Anonymous Coward]

A DEMOCRAT wanting to lower taxes? And admitting it will create jobs! That is unheard of! Usually a Democrat will say raising taxes will create jobs, or some shit.

Paul Hawken has a better idea

[sydbarrett74]

We need to realise that most of us are not so much buying things themselves as much as the services they render. Unless you've made a hobby of collecting vintage power-drills, you don't care so much about the drill itself as you do for the hole it makes. In The Ecology of Commerce, Paul Hawken provides case-studies of business firms, such as Interface Carpet, which have moved to a leasing model where you lease the service of carpeting rather than buying physical carpet. This has many desirable effects, such as moving many expenditures from the CapEx to the OpEx column, and the provider (e.g., Interface) is contractually obligated to maintain the carpet and replace it upon wear-out. Another desirable outcome: manufacturers are incented to create more robust and durable physical goods, because they will be servicing and ultimately disposing of them. Moving to this model will meet vehement resistance, with many people crying out 'Socialism!' and other epithets, but even free-market ideologues should rejoice as it internalises many hitherto externalised costs and provides an accounting basis for them.

Re:Jobs of the past resurrected for the noble sava

[sydbarrett74]

That's why strict and heavily-enforced consumer rights laws need to be passed that make such planned obsolescence illegal, and require that products be designed for easy repair and recycling.