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Saudi Arabian Teen Arrested For Online Videos With American Blogger (theguardian.com)
Mazin Sidahmed and Nicky Woolf, reporting for The Guardian: A male Saudi Arabian teenager has been arrested in Riyadh over a series of online videos of conversations between him and a female Californian streaming-video star that went viral. A Riyadh police spokesperson, Colonel Fawaz Al-Mayman, said the teenager, known online as Abu Sin, was arrested on Sunday for engaging in "unethical behaviour" in videos with Christina Crockett, a popular broadcaster on the conversational live-streaming site YouNow. Abu Sin's real name is not known. "His videos received many comments and many of the commenters of the general public demanded for him to be punished for his actions," Al-Maymann added, according to the Saudi Gazette. The two amassed thousands of fans on the YouNow network, and later on YouTube after videos of the two speaking were uploaded there. The videos featured Abu Sin -- a nickname given to him for his broken teeth -- and Crockett communicating despite their significant language barriers. The popularity of the videos of the two of them surprised Crockett, she told the Guardian in an interview. As a broadcaster on YouNow, she can invite her fans to join her broadcasts on split-screen, which is known as "guesting."
So they had conversation. So what is the problem? It didn't come clear in this post at slashdot.
He talked with a woman! Unclean! Unclean!
Participated in an online video with a woman who didn't have her face covered. That and I think they danced a little bit.
This is the sort of thing that SJW's should be fighting against......instead they decide to focus their efforts on restricting speech in some of the most liberal places on Earth.
If you post as Anonymous Coward, don't expect a reply.
It will be interesting to see whether continuing incidents like these over the next several years spark enough domestic and international outrage that totlitarian regimes are forced to change their governing practices.
I'm more surprised anyone really wants to live in Saudi Arabia, but some folks like that kind of totalitarian nonsense...
Yeah, how could anyone "want" to live where their family is and their entire genetic line has existed for several millennia? Why don't they just pack up and move someplace better? Because it's easy.
And we just sold them tanks.
To be fair a little dance is a slippery slope.
First you do a little dance, that leads to making a little love, and then you get down tonight. Get down tonight.
"That's the way to do it" - Punch
I think its terrible and I dont think he deserves it
which is a pretty reasonable response, but what most Americans don't understand or for that matter tend to respect are cultural differences. Theyre quick to point out the injustice of the Saudi criminal code yet conveniently overlook the fact that it is a criminal offence to dance at the Jefferson Memorial, or that until 1967 interracial marriages were illegal in a plurality of states. Transgender Americans can still face prosecution for simply using the toilet in 5 states, and it wasnt until 2015 that gays could be married in the land of the free.
Abu Sin knew what he was doing. Sometimes incarceration is a risk you take to try and make a cultural change or statement.
Good people go to bed earlier.
Saudi Arabia has laws banning men from engaging in any form of socializing with any women they aren't married or related to. Public lashing is a common punishment for those offenses, too, so it's not just a few days in jail that he's facing.
We? So what role did you personally have in selling them tanks?
Saudi Arabia has a whole set of laws governing how single men and women are allowed to interact with each other. I think it's a terrible idea to extend these laws to online interaction with foreigners. But, apparently, enough people over there think it is appropriate enough a thing to do that an arrest was made.
He financed their construction.
Well, that's not entirely clear. If the Saudis bought them, then the Saudis financed them. If the Saudis bought them for less than what they cost, then either the manufacturer(s) subsidized some of the cost, or the taxpayers did. Which brings us to the fact that such expenses come out of the discretionary budget, which means it's essentially paid for almost entirely by income taxes or by debt that will be serviced by income taxes ... and that means that only about half of the people in the country actually have a hand in financing such things because the other half pays no income taxes. And of the half that does pay them, of course a small portion of that group pays the majority of those taxes.
So, "we" is indeed not an obvious thing, here.
Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
Abu Sin knew what he was doing. Sometimes incarceration is a risk you take to try and make a cultural change or statement.
Abu Sin was a young boy talking to a woman. To say he fully understood the ramifications of his actions is absurd. He almost certainly knew it was a social taboo, but to say he was trying to make cultural change is really stretching. We do not know his intentions, but Occam says hormonal teenager trumps activist any day.
That said, this probably happens quite a bit with teenagers, just not out in the open. Then, afterwards, after the physical and mental scarring endured, these young men learn hate. And that hate is not towards his oppressors, the regime and religion that beat him down. Instead it is twisted at women or those who do as they did, that they should suffer the same punishments. This is how these types of systems stay in place and prosper.
Silence is a state of mime.
But woman in video isn't subject to those laws, thus this interaction can't be in the scope of the law.
Yep, if you don't nip this in the bud, pretty soon women will be demanding to leave the house without their husband's permission.
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
Look, all that really matters is that Hillary Clinton has the Saudis' backs, as long as they give her family a bunch more cash.
Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
You're undoing your own argument. Culturally, nobody gives a damn if you dance at the Jefferson Memorial, though some people might give a damn if a bunch of people wasted time writing and fussing about legislation to change that law that nobody cares about. On your other topics, you've made your own counterpoint. Culturally, the west has moved very quickly on areas like gay marriage. In practical terms, it's a done deal. There will be lots of little rough edges to clean up for a few years yet. Meanwhile, the Wahabbists and their ilk in the Middle East are going full-throttle backwards into the medieval days they miss so badly.
Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
But woman in video isn't subject to those laws
No, but unfortunately, as a Saudi, the man in this case certainly is.
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
> Once again religion demonstrates it's worthlessness.
Oh please, its not "religion." Its fucking human nature. Stalin was the biggest killer in modern history Mao Zedung the second and Hitler was probably third. The first two were officially atheist the last was only nominally christian because that's just what white people in germany were.
As long as you are focused on "religion" as the cause of the problem rather than just another neutral tool that can be co-opted you are never going to improve the world. Know your enemy.
Fuck it. The sooner it is wiped off this earth the better.
Not just Hillary, but pretty much every U.S. politician for decades now. Oil trumps morality any day, and it also crosses all party lines.
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
It may be a matter of not sticking ones nose in another country's business: fix our own backyard first.
Meddling in the Middle East just seems to make things worse. If they wanna be medieval and keep resisting modernization, there should come a point where we give up trying to modernize them and instead focus on issues closer to home.
Table-ized A.I.
Apparently he was streaming when he was arrested (police arrives at 7:00): https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent. Polar Scope Align for iOS
Christina: 'Today we are having our follow up split-screen live stream with Abu Sin in Riyahd. What up Abu!'
Abu appears in the split screen. He is in the middle of a public square, his hands are bound to a pole and his shirt is removed. In the background is crowd of onlookers and a large masked man in black unrolling a whip.
Abu: 'Whassup Christina Just chillin since our last stream, Yo!'
Christina: 'Cool. Do you like Beyonce?'
Abu: 'Totally, but my AAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.... favorite is Justin Beiber.'
Oil trumps morality any day, and it also crosses all party lines.
TRIGGERED.
Saudi Arabia and their stupid pointless shitty laws
Meanwhile, they have a teenage pregnancy rate that's almost 1/3 of the US'
Just saying, it does seem to have an effect.
You're right... though I don't limit it to Islam. I hate all religions.
Yes Francis, the world has gone crazy.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
It's for their own good, right? Wouldn't it be great if we didn't have to put up with all these "used" women and sloppy seconds?
If all it takes is that "the general public demanded for him to be punished for his actions" then I demand that Colonel Fawaz Al-Mayman be punished for his actions, along with every member of the police that arrested Abu Sin. Who's with me?
Think it'll work? *crickets*
Between the honor killings, forced marriage and FGM happening in Saudi Arabia I can understand why their teen pregnancy rate is so low!
Yes Francis, the world has gone crazy.
[Americans are] quick to point out the injustice of the Saudi criminal code yet conveniently overlook the fact that it is a criminal offence to dance at the Jefferson Memorial, or that until 1967 interracial marriages were illegal in a plurality of states.
I think most Americans are quick to point out stupid laws in the U.S., too, when they become aware of such laws. But most Americans are just too stupid to vote out the Congresscritters who enact such laws.
Can't hold hands, kiss in public, but they can have sex with goats/sheep, car mufflers etc and it's ok. What a backwards society!
Because it's easy.
You're going for facetious but you're right on point. It IS that easy. The world is a small tiny place. Until we start colonising Mars we're barely 30h worth of travel distance from anyone at any given time. If the goal is to simply get away from a shithole, heck you can do that in 4-5 hours for most of them.
I personally really don't understand the obsession people have with a place. It's just a place. There are many places in the world each with their own benefits. If one isn't completely happy with where they are, go someplace else.
By the way, greetings from the Netherlands. An awesome country which I didn't grow up in, don't have any family in and don't have a genetic line relating back to. I do miss my sister, so I called her up a few days ago and then booked a flight. Going to have a fun weekend abroad next week.
forceful penetration is the standard for rape. Women cant break that law,
Wow, you really abstain from internet porn, don't you? I have to say I admire your restraint.
Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
I'm more surprised anyone really wants to live in Saudi Arabia, but some folks like that kind of totalitarian nonsense...
Not exactly Saudi Arabia, but you have Janet Jackson who married a Qatari sheikh and moved to Qatar, which is a Wahabi country like Saudi Arabia. Similar shit
You're going for facetious but you're right on point. It IS that easy. The world is a small tiny place. Until we start colonising Mars we're barely 30h worth of travel distance from anyone at any given time. If the goal is to simply get away from a shithole, heck you can do that in 4-5 hours for most of them.
I'm not sure it is that "easy" if you consider how "immigration" works differently in different places. Some people would lover to get out of the shithole, but then it is impossible politically, financial, and/or economically because of where they are at the time (or where they want to go). Talking is easy. Doing it is a completely different story...
Yeah, cecurry turned out to be right. B'cos it is easy - the way Saudis can just pick up visas at a travel office in US embassies in their country (in sharp contrast to other countries). Also, becoming a citizen is easy if one have at least something like $250k that you can bring into the country.
As far as places go, a place is a place in the US - you have a uniform standard of living anywhere and everywhere. It's different from third world countries, where typically, the capital and a few major cities are decently livable, but other places are dumpsters. I'm not sure whether that's the case in KSA - they do have enough cash to make the entire country filled w/ El Dorados, but then again, since the 50s, they had been more busy funding mosques, madrassahs, dawa and jihadi groups worldwide that they may have overlooked the part where you can use money to make your desert country a real paradise.
In those countries, do people buy anything other than Mercs, Beamers, Porsches and so on?
One of the more hilarious typos for sure...
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
In Islamic jurisprudence - where the rules of a religion are translated into applied laws of a country - there are 4 schools - Hanafi, Shafi'i, Maliki and Hanbali (talking about Sunni Islam here - there are 2 in Shia - Jaafari and Khomeni'i). Most Muslim countries in Asia follow the Hanafi school - that is countries like Jordan, Iraq, Turkey, the stans (to the extent they're followed at all), Pakistan, Afghanistan, Bangladesh, Kuwait. Egypt and Syria follow a blend of Hanafi and Shafi'i, since al Azhar university in Cairo is where most of Shafi'i doctrine evolved. Other than that, Shafi'i is followed in Yemen, Somalia, Sudan, Indonesia, Malaysia and Brunei. Maliki evolved in Andaluz - Islamic Spain - and is the school followed in most of North Africa, aside from the East - Egypt, Sudan and Somalia.
Wahabism is an implementation of the 4th school - Hanbali - and would otherwise be an asterisk, but it's there in 2 countries - Saudi Arabia and Qatar. Since Saudi Arabia is the country that has Mecca and Medina, that makes it unignorable. Otherwise, there are stray sects of Islam all around - like Ibadi in Oman - which nobody notices.
Saudi Arabia remains a very rich country. Its subsidized citizens are obscenely rich, but even the non-citizens are doing rather well. It has, for example, a large population of Indians, who, despite having no prospect of citizenship, like their salaries much better there, than in their own reasonably free country.
For another example, it had a large contingent of Arabs from Palestine until 1991 (when the fools celebrated Saddam Hussein's invasion into Kuwait and were summarily expelled by the Saudis over it). They too preferred Saudi Arabia over the more secular destinations (like most other Arab countries).
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
Not to mention, girls are allowed to marry in their teens, under Islamic law. After all, Mohammed, when he was in his 50s, married a 6-year old girl Aisha and consummated it when she was 9. And in Islam, Mohammed is 'al insan al kamil', or the perfect model for mankind, and so there is no way they would outlaw pedophilia
Mod this up. Here in the West, most people assume that all people throughout the world wanna be free. But when they do become free, or get a choice, mob rule ensue. In fact, the Saudi royals are probably more advanced than their populace, who are just fed whatever the madrassahs teach. If the Saudi government was overthrown and replaced by a 'democracy' - the way the US did in Iraq and would like to do in Syria - al Qaeda would win the popular vote.
How the 'souvereign state of Saudi Arabia' treats its civilians is not our concern. We have no business intervening with their internal affairs.
Now, if it were the 'islamic terrorist state of Iran' where this happened, then of course it would have been a totally different story as Saudi Arabia is an ally to the petrodollar whereas Iran is not.
"Trump!!", the new Godwin.
As long as S.A. keeps selling its oil in US$ the US will not intervene with anything that happens inside the country, and will protect them militarily against other countries, except Israel.
"Trump!!", the new Godwin.
Having done it multiple times I can say that most countries do not place financial on the list, and when they do they do it for select countries. Politically also works in peoples favour in many places. This is also not new. I look at some cities in the Netherlands and they have had a majority immigrant population for a really long time. My airport taxi driver was Iranian and had been here for 35 years. Not wealthy, not well off, just didn't want to be there anymore. My sister grew up in Australia. She and her boyfriend said fuck it we're moving to Vienna recently and so she did. Sure there's paperwork but for the most part I look around and I see people of all colours, accents, backgrounds, wherever I go. People from war torn countries who are recent immigrants are easier to pick out on their inability to speak local languages than people who have been here for a long time. This has been universal in every country I've been in (except for China and Japan, very few immigrants there).
Yeah we may not all be able to go straight from being bombed to sipping martinis in Aruba, but to claim that immigration is some incredibly complicated thing to the point where its bad enough that you happily remain in a wasteland is more a reflection of the lack of effort.
B'cos it is easy - the way Saudis can just pick up visas at a travel office in US embassies in their country (in sharp contrast to other countries). Also, becoming a citizen is easy if one have at least something like $250k that you can bring into the country.
Yeah because the USA is the only destination to go to that makes the GP right. /sarcasm
Heck given the choice between the USA and the middle east I'm sure some would prefer the desert shithole. In the mean time there are many countries far more welcoming to immigrants and you really can just pickup and move. ... Like my Iranian taxi driver who's been here for a few years now. Not wealthy, not well connected, just didn't want to live in Iran anymore so he upped with his family and came to europe. No claiming assylum, nothing but a standard immigration process which most countries don't treat with hostility... Unlike the USA... Who are even hostile towards tourists.
Could I summarize this post as, "All countries' laws are basically equal in terms of injustice/ridiculousness?" I'm guessing not, but that's really the only solid claim i can really extract from it.
An interesting anagram of "BANACH TARSKI" is "BANACH TARSKI BANACH TARSKI"
Just like before 1967, a white person just had to find another white person to marry. The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread.
An interesting anagram of "BANACH TARSKI" is "BANACH TARSKI BANACH TARSKI"
Why do I get the feeling that the teenage pregnancy rate is not a statistic we're likely to get any clarity on in Saudi Arabia? If the "official" rate is 1/3 of the US, it seems like a pretty good bet that it's even higher than that in reality.
Kind of like how Iran has no gay people.
An interesting anagram of "BANACH TARSKI" is "BANACH TARSKI BANACH TARSKI"
You are right. If one is a Muslim w/ any amount of devotion, and has a skill that's desired by any business tycoon in the GCC countries, then it's a far better idea to settle in one of those countries. Just like the family of clock boy Achmet.
We're talking here about a Saudi guy who does not care for such rules, and who's now arrested for that. For him, he'd have done better by first getting out of there and then entertaining himself and anyone else this way. Although if he just knows Arabic, that would potentially be an issue - since there are no non-Muslim Arab countries.
;)