Intel CEO Exits President Trump's Manufacturing Council (axios.com)

Ina Fried, writing for Axios: Intel said Monday that CEO Brian Krzanich was leaving President Trump's American Manufacturing Council, the latest executive to distance himself from the president following the weekend's events in Virginia. In a blog post, Krzanich said that the decline in American manufacturing remains a serious issue, but said that "politics and political agendas have sidelined the important mission of rebuilding America's manufacturing base. I resigned to call attention to the serious harm our divided political climate is causing to critical issues, including the serious need to address the decline of American manufacturing," Krzanich said in a blog post. "Politics and political agendas have sidelined the important mission of rebuilding America's manufacturing base."

Comments

Because AMD got onboard?

[NuclearCat]

Or maybe some ARM dudes?
It's really purely politics, IMHO. If someone have chance to do something good, he should not give up trying to do so.

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[MouseR]

Not sure there's anything good to be brought in to a guy that does only what he thinks is right (or profitable to his family).

I'm quite disappointed Tim Cooks is still on that comity. Sure he was noble to put his personal life out of a decision that concerned his employers, although Apple is generally quite outspoken for their support of LGBT, all while WH trashes on them. But still standing besides him with the rest of the insanity that goes on in that administration is, IMO, insane.

The army generals have had more cahoonies by not taking orders from a Twit ^H^H^H^H^H Tweet.

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[ganjadude]

when did the whitehouse trash them???

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[jellomizer]

Is it purely politics no. But it is a big part, the other part is being associated with the Trump Administration, who is systematically isolating much of Intel's customer base.
Business wise, staying connected with the Trump Administration has a lot of risk, with a small reward if anything.

They got in hoping to influence how business should be done, and make sure policies will protect them. However being connected to such a divisive figure is possibly be connected to a large percentage of your customers being insulted. Would hurt.

If Intel supported Trump when he has one of his rants, just to stay on his good side, they could loose a big customer base to AMD and ARM.

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[MouseR]

It's all over the new. Dont see how you missed that. NYTime resume of the most recent ones.

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[Anonymous Coward]

Of course it's politics. Trump's going to get impeached.

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[Type44Q]

a guy that does only what he thinks is right

You're talking about a guy that does only what his handlers want him to. It really couldn't be more obvious... unless, that is, you have an IQ no greater than 115 or so (if so, don't feel bad; at least it isn't lonely there).

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[Anonymous Coward]

/r/iamverysmart

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[Anonymous Coward]

They didn't, but that doesn't stop Fake News from claiming he did. Trump has always been very pro-LGBTQP which is one reason that weakened his support among Republicans.

He also was never accused of being a racist by the media until he ran for President. Then the NYT scrubbed their web site of pictures and stories about Trump and his former black girlfriend. More fake news. The neo-Nazis hate Trump for not being a racist. It's Fake News that tries to tie them together.

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[bluefoxlucid]

No evidence, just "you're stupid if you can't see it."

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[ShanghaiBill]

It's all over the news.

Trump is amazing. Republicans were failing once again to repeal Obamacare, the CBO was estimating that their latest plan would deprive 15 million Americans of health insurance, and his poll numbers were falling fast. So he changes the subject, and manipulates the Democrats into arguing about combat soldiers in skirts, even though the military had already said this is a total non-issue. Absolutely brilliant.

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[Anonymous Coward]

Labeling anything critical as "fake news" is the functional equivalent of sticking your head in the sand.

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[ShanghaiBill]

You're talking about a guy that does only what his handlers want him to. It really couldn't be more obvious...

Trump has directly contradicted his own "handlers", and made them look like fools. For instance, the statements he made about firing Comey. Several of his top advisors have been fired or quit. It certainly is not "obvious" that they are controlling him, and unlikely that they are.

Re: Because AMD got onboard?

[Anonymous Coward]

How is this amazing? He isn't the first to do this. And we all know what he's doing. It isn't helping him that's the crazy part. Yet he keeps trying to fool us like a magician. What goes around comes around, remember that.

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[Anonymous Coward]

Trump beat many contenders for a reason. The Democrats and vast media empire that are or are controlled by them are choosing to be emotional and easily manipulated.

Just look at the gamesmanship. Next time Trump says something particularly offensive on twitter, look for the important event happening in congress. The press takes the bait and misses the real news to express their emotional outrage.

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[d.w.mitchell.55]

Has he contradicted or somehow made Putin look like a fool?

Re: Because AMD got onboard?

[Anonymous Coward]

You don't really understand how impeachment works ?

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[Rakarra]

Obvious troll throwing up strawmen is obvious.

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[HiThere]

We need for Trump to be impeached...after Prence. And that won't happen until about half of the Republican legislators think it's their best choice. Not soon.

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[dbIII]

Not even Trump is controlling Trump.
He's the creature from the id.
Now what was it a lot of people were saying last year about how we'd be in fear of nukes if Hillary was elected? I'd even take that toll-booth prick Christie about now.

Re:Because AMD got onboard?

[cheesybagel]

No. It's probably because Intel would rather move their production to China.

Time to abandon ship

[TimothyHollins]

Ah yes. I'm guessing the PR hit could no longer be considered worth the private venue to Trump's ear. Good to know that even the 1% are starting recalculate the cost vs profit of Trump.

(Don't get me wrong, I think it is the CEO's responsibility to take every opportunity to increase the company's chances at success, I just think they should stick to legal and "honest" means - and whispering in Trump's ear like Grima worm-tongue seems like neither of those)

Re:Time to abandon ship

[MightyMartian]

The other question is just how much value do these CEOs actually get? The President is so u reliable and so prone to fits of pique that can he be relied upon to listen, or to stick with any commitment?

It really is coming to look like everyone; Congress, the courts, business, are all simply routing around the White House.

Re:Time to abandon ship

[110010001000]

I think originally they thought they were going to get value out of it, but now they are like rats running out of a sinking ship.

Re: Time to abandon ship

[Anonymous Coward]

The value was good PR for taking part in a pro-US jobs council and for good PR when leaving said council. Trump gave some of his ideological opponents ammunition without any benefit. Sad.

Re:Time to abandon ship

[93 Escort Wagon]

I just think they should stick to legal and "honest" means - and whispering in Trump's ear like Grima worm-tongue seems like neither of those)

Is Ivanka being cast as Éowyn, in this scenario?

Re:Time to abandon ship

[Paradise Pete]

now they are like rats running out of a sinking ship.

It's not only the rats that run from a sinking ship. Wouldn't you? It's not like everyone else just sit and says "well the ship is sinking, but at least there are no rats."

Re:Time to abandon ship

[Anonymous Coward]

The banks were paying millions for each hour-long speaking appearance by Bill or Hillary.
According to you, this was because it is Trump who is actually the 1% candidate (and Bill/Killary are just epic speakers...).

Bonus question: guess how much the Nobel Prize laureate is making since leaving the White House? Because the list of countries he made peace with is huge (for the DNC/humor challenged: Barack invaded more countries that 2 previous presidents combined, with disastrous results).

Re:Time to abandon ship

[mapkinase]

Trump is like pinata. With crap instead of candy. Everyone knows that you need to hit it hard to win, but nobody wants to deal with the flying shit.

Re: Time to abandon ship

[Anonymous Coward]

What? You are acting as if no other president gets a payday the same way. Fuck off with your partisan bullshit.

Re: Time to abandon ship

[KGIII]

No. I would swim from a sinking ship.

Re: Time to abandon ship

[david_thornley]

Ideally, step up into a lifeboat. (At least on the sloops I was on, the rule was "never step down to the life raft", since until the boat was actually sinking it was safer than the liferaft.)

Re:Time to abandon ship

[ebvwfbw]

Backwards dude. The Democratic party is what's full of shit. I feel like captain obvious here. They own the main stream media, which is why we hear nothing but crap from them.

Time to step back, either way. Look at what's happening. Which side is lying to you? Which side is desperate to make you believe they're telling the truth no matter what and time and time again are shown to be lying to us. Just look up Debbie Wasserman Shultz - where's the story on her? Could go on. Only the stupid still support the left.

Re: Time to abandon ship

[KGIII]

Those bastards in the Navy (I was still enlisted as a Marine) made me jump off a perfectly good boat. (They get mad when you call it a boat.) There was no stepping into a life raft and calmly leaving. No, it was sailor dive into cold water and then swim around until they blow the whistle. Then, we climbed back into the boat, a perfectly functioning boat.

It was pretty horrible.

Translation: No handouts for Intel

[Anonymous Coward]

Guess his subsidy proposal got voted down.

Re:Translation: No handouts for Intel

[Anonymous Coward]

Apparently ideological purity is more important to the left than jobs for the little people they claim to care about.

Re:Translation: No handouts for Intel

[Anonymous Coward]

I love how the Trumpies whine about subsidies, when they are without a doubt the biggest welfare recipients.

Re: Translation: No handouts for Intel

[Anonymous Coward]

None of Trump's policies will create jobs. Most will destroy them.

If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

The internet has spoken. Soon, 43% of this country will be labeled a Neo-Nazi.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[jellomizer]

No,
But the Neo-Nazi are his strongest supporters. Chanting his name like he is the second coming or something.
They are other groups that will just support him because he decided to run as a Republican
They are other groups that will do whatever their Church tells them to vote for, and the Church will change its ideals to match the party.

However, he is shown to be one of the worst presidents in history. He is fumbling in a government where he has the majority on all levels, yet we are seeing the American Checks and balance system in full force, to make sure we don't kill ourselves from him.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[tbannist]

The internet has spoken. Soon, 43% of this country will be labeled a Neo-Nazi.

Nah, even if you labelled every Trump voter a Neo-Nazi, as unlikely as that is, you'd barely crack 23% of Americans, because only half of eligible voters voted. However, given that there are many Americans who are not eligible voters, we need to refine that number further. There are 323.1 million Americans, but only about 248 eligible voters. Since we know Trump received exactly 62,984,825 votes, we can calculate an upper level of denouncement of approximately 19.5% of Americans based on voting behaviour.

Having said that, there are no credible claims that all Trump voters are Neo-Nazis, however it is entirely accurate to note that the Neo-Nazis love Trump. Some people may be confused by that statement but it's similar very similar to the situation with David Hasselhoff. Germans love Hasselhoff, but that doesn't mean that if you love Hasselhoff that you're German.

Alternatively, you could calculate the upper limit at 34%, which is Trump's approval rating, though that's also sketchy since people could, in theory, approve of Trump for reasons other than his courting of white supremacists. I will now let you get back to your self-pity and bemoaning about how it's so unfair that old white men only have most of the power now, instead of all of it.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

Watch it, talking sets and subsets may get you put on the enemies list at this point.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[xevioso]

I wonder what the percentage is of people who are German Neo-Nazis who prefer Trump and love David Hasselhoff?

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

We tried to warn you how far the Overton window was being moved by the election of Obama, and the dream of a permanent democrat majority across the country.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

To speak in programming parlance, "neo-Nazi," "white nationalist" are pointer variables to the same address the variable "Juden" pointed to in Nazi Germany. The address is a Boolean that is used to grant or deny human rights to individuals.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe if the Democrats hadn't been outed by spooky fucking Podesta emails like him literally having a bullet point, "ensure demographics is destiny". Those rascally rooskies!

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

You're a moron, suck a dick and stfu. Your orange inbred traitor hero is about to be impeached. And THEN he's going to fucking PRISON. Suck it.

Trump is going to be the poster child for retarded GOP failed adventures for DECADES to come. Democrats will definitely be elected because of Trump, for a long time.

Alt-whiny-bitches.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

As of today it's fallen to 37%

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/trump-approval-ratings/

But honestly, we can assume a good half of those are just really misinformed because they mainline right-wing media.

Even given my short thirty-five-ish years on this planet I feel safe in assuming around 15% of the US population are actual irredeemable pieces moral, ethical filth.

I mean I used to want to believe in the general good in the hearts of man but, you know, Trump got elected and the actual Nazis are publicly marching again.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[denzacar]

But the Neo-Nazi are his strongest supporters. Chanting his name like he is the second coming or something.
They are other groups that will just support him because he decided to run as a Republican
They are other groups that will do whatever their Church tells them to vote for, and the Church will change its ideals to match the party.

Nazi supporters ARE Nazis.

It's not an issue of ownership or genetics or of social status. It's an ideological issue.
They don't have to quack like Nazis (though they do) or goosestep like Nazis (though some clearly do that as well) - simply thinking like a Nazi makes one a Nazi.
Ideology dictates behavior. Not the other way around.

The only thing is that most of them were HIDING their beliefs until now.
Not cause they thought that it's wrong to be a Nazi - but cause they knew that it wasn't popular.
Now, when it is clearly "in" to be a Nazi again, they are crawling out from under their beds, swastikas and all.

And there's no labeling going on.
A KKK-er is not labeled a racist by stepping out into the light and uncovering his face.
That's unmasking.
And nobody's making them do that. They are unmasking themselves all on their own.
Cause they feel like the time for hiding has past.
They might be a tad off there.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[MightyMartian]

He can't even give a speech to the Boy Scouts without acting like a bloviating halfwit. But fumbling calling out Neo-Nazis? Really? That's got to be the easiest thing a president could do. Wag your finger, say "Shame shame shame!" That's what's expected of you.

I have no ideas whether the rumors are true that Bannon was the one who cautioned against speaking too strongly against the white supremacists, but the rumors that Bannon's time at the White House is coming to an end would certainly mesh well. But it comes too late for this.

I don't know whether Donald Trump is actually a racist or not, but one thing is certain, he lacks any real judgment, and relies on his advisers and proxies, some of which are clearly both malignant and naive.

Re: If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

Ok, linking Trump and the KKK or Nazi skinheads is a little ridiculous. Although I'm sure his slavik wife and continued business and personal relations with jews aligns him really well with their ideology. He really has nothing to apologize over since he had nothing to do with it. No more than Obama had to do with BLM supporters shooting cops or the guy that just shot a bunch of sitting republican congressmen at a baseball practice in DC. Sometimes in politics, people you wont necessarily want will still support you.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[MightyMartian]

It's reaching a point where if this unpopularity is sustained into next year, it's going to really fuck over the midterms for the Republicans. There's a lot of faith been put in General Kelly that he can impose order on the chaos in the White House, and maybe impose some discipline on Trump, but if the incredible, almost unbelievable mishandling of Charlottesville is any indication (seriously, how hard is it to call out white supremacists by name?), then I'd say Kelly has been an utter failure thus far.

There's still time for Trump to pull himself out of this tailspin, but I'm just not convinced he's intellectually or emotionally capable of doing what needs to be done. He seems completely dedicated to destroying his own presidency.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

They are not his strongest supporters. There are so few of them. Less than the many who have rioted against Trump since he was elected. Keep thinking that and then us deplorables will vote him to another 4 years.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

Lol.

I've heard this particular dream uttered out a thousand different ways - and yet it hasn't come true.

Keep dreaming, alt-whiny-sore-losers, you might get lucky. In the meantime it looks like you're the one sucking a great big dick.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh fuck off.

There were more acceptable speeches than the one that some people wanted. That's freedom of speech for you.

I fucking hate statements like "he lacks any real judgment". He had enough "real judgment" to get himself elected to the most powerful seat in the world.

Stop acting like a you're some fucking super genius. You're just another dumb cunt like the rest of us.

Re: If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

Then why did it take 2 days for him to finally do a teleprompted condemnation of the nazi, with as much sincerity as his teleprompted apology for the pussy-grabbing video. I don't think he even specifically mentioned the driver or his action of ramming into people. Not to mention that these nazi guys are Trump fans, he there was nazis in the streets praising my name I would make sure to let them know that I don't want their help and that they could go fuck themselves.
It's not even an isolated incident, each time he was forced to condemn racist acts, he did it reluctantly and weakly, like "don't do that, it's not right", like a father forced to punish his son. Compare that to mostly anything that Trump doesn't like where he goes on twitter to scream his hate.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[bluefoxlucid]

It's too late for the Republicans. Have you seen the new budget? Everyone is pissed off. Social Security's 2016 report says the Trust is insolvent by 2034 (last page); the new 2018 budget reduces tax funding flowing into Social Security. The AARP, anyone who follows NASI, and even many of our current-generation are quite unhappy about this, and ... well, there goes your voter sentiment.

America's aging population and you fucked around with retirement. I get a pass on that because I'm making it more-stable to ensure people get what we promised; you cut benefits, reduce funding, and jeopardize the entire system, you only get roasted. Old people don't have a lot of shit to deal with anymore; you touch their last source of survival, they don't forget for a long time. Medicare and social security will be your downfall if you intend to cut benefits.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[sexconker]

Did you curl up into the fetal position, rock back and forth and stammer that out between sobs and wiping away your tears?

Any day now the RUSSIAN PROOF will come out!

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

The Republicans would LOVE to get rid of Medicare and Social Security, (and replace them with other things that would make THEM more money, directly) - it just remains to be seen if they think they can get away with it :P

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[sexconker]

Trump got elected and the actual Nazis are publicly marching again.

You're 35. You don't know what a Nazi march looks like. If your grandparents are alive and old enough, ask them.

All I see is ugly, angry, and powerless rabble bitching at eachother and hating eachother. Just as the 1% wants them to. Bread and circuses? Fuck that, make them be their own circus.

Re: If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

He has nothing to apologize over. You cant hold any politician responsible for what some fringe group does as that is well outside control. Regardless of political persuasion, this is silly.

Re: If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[93 Escort Wagon]

He didn't say "apologize" - he said "condemn".

But nice attempt at erecting a straw man.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

..there are no credible claims that all Trump voters are Neo-Nazis, however it is entirely accurate to note that the Neo-Nazis love Trump.

And Trump loves them, obviously, otherwise why was he so reluctant to name them this weekend.

Re: If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

Him getting elected says more about the people who voted for him.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[PopeRatzo]

Old people don't have a lot of shit to deal with anymore

Are you kidding? I have to deal with this goddamn smartphone and this little itty-bitty keyboard on the screen that I can hardly see and the fact that the picture is always tilting sideways for no reason. There must be something wrong with this thing, because every time I go to the grocery store, I get a notification popping up that tells me I'm at the grocery store. I KNOW THAT YOU FUCKING IDIOT PHONE, I DROVE HERE. I wish I could go back to my flip phone. Better still, I want a land goddamn line with a rotary dial. And I wish they'd put Mannix back on TV.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[PopeRatzo]

You're 35. You don't know what a Nazi march looks like.

I can help with that.

https://www.google.com/search?...:

http://markmaynard.com/wp-cont...

https://fsmedia.imgix.net/b9/d...

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/money...

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[bluefoxlucid]

The fiddly bits in your life won't make your life fall apart. Failed romantic goals, failed career goals, failure in school, failure to pay your mortgage, and severe medical issues will make your life fall apart.

Old people are way past school, family, and career building; they have an income source (retirement fund, pension), medical issues, and any remaining bills (rent, and possibly the tail end of a mortgage). Those things are stable thanks to social security and medicare. When they cease to be stable, your life is now threatened--people don't like that.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[AaronW]

I don't know if my grandfather actually saw a Nazi or not. He was too busy running radio for the RAF on a bomber that was bombing them. He was also instrumental in the discovery that the Germans were using radar which earned him the Distinguished Flying Cross. He flew 42 B-11 anti-submarine sorties as well as air support for D-Day. Very few people in his squadron survived the war. If he were alive today I'm sure he'd punch a neo-nazi in the face or shoot them.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Rakarra]

All I see is ugly, angry, and powerless rabble bitching at eachother and hating eachother.

What do you think the Nazis were? No, not the Nazi Party in the 30s and 40s, the Nazi Party and the NSDAP of the Weimer Republic. They slowly clawed together power because conditions in Germany after World War I were... not good, to say the least, and got much worse under the Great Depression. They managed to successfully scrape together popular support taking that poor, hateful rabble and giving them a target to their anger. Jews, homosexuals, non-Aryans in general, immigrants, lots of people, but those first two in particular. That's the thing about the ugly angry rabble -- they still have power together. Harness it, and you can do terrible things with it.

Re: If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Anonymous Coward]

Trump didn't condemn them hard enough so he has to apologize for his lack of a strongly worded condemnation...

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[dbIII]

but the rumors that Bannon's time at the White House is coming to an end would certainly mesh well

The day after Bannon gets a huge amount more press than Trump is the day Bannon goes. Until then he's probably safe so long as he keeps telling Trump about his loyalty - swearing fucking fealty as if to a King.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[dbIII]

America's aging population

No problem, increased immigration and an amnesty on illegal immigrants will fix that :)
How's that for a statement designed to really piss off some Republicans who have forgotten the practical steps that Reagan took on immigration.

Re: If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[PoopJuggler]

It will be interesting to see how he apologizes for getting us into a nuclear war with North Korea over who's dick is bigger.

Re:If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[Rakarra]

I'm not really sure how you leap from "Nazis took advantage of the downtrodden to persecute the non-Aryans" to "the answer is to persecute the Aryans." Gay/genderfluid/whatever aren't inferior to straights on principle, but neither are they superior. I don't see why the reaction to the pendulum swinging to one extreme is to make it swing to the opposite extreme.

Re: If you don't exit you're a Neo-Nazi.

[unixisc]

A lot of the same people voted for Obama

Wow...

[Anonymous Coward]

I did nazi that coming.

Rule of acquisition #33

[DontBeAMoran]

It never hurts to suck up to the boss.

Re:Rule of acquisition #33

[MightyMartian]

Unless the boss is becoming so toxic that being seen anywhere near him could make you part of the collateral damage when he falls.

And it's not like Trump's doing anything wonderful for Intel. Trump's unorthodox views on trade and immigration pose a threat to Silicon Valley, so what good does it do to sit on some sort of advisory council where none of your advice will be taken? Add in Trump's bizarre inability to call out racists, well, I'd say this is a pretty good example of rats fleeing the ship.

Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

If you sign up to lend Orange Hitler, and his army of Neo-Nazis your credibility, don't be surprised when a Nazi runs over a real American, and hurts your brand.

You signed up for the racist traitor's agenda hate, bigotry, and incompetence... You aren't going to teach a Russian owned traitor to love America, so just focus on defeating the hate and racism that defines his presidency and base of support.

Re: Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

He's such a racist bastard ... He condemned all hate instead of just white hate.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

I hope you get run over by a Dodge Challenger. Or maybe a BMW or Audi.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

Each and every man under my command owes me 100 Nazi scalps.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

Because the ANTIFA folks were non-violent

http://legalinsurrection.com/2...

Why don't you do the species a favor and go play on the freeway.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

Ain't nothing wrong with fighting Nazis.

Our penchant is for fighting Nazis, confederates, racists, and Russian secret agents is what makes America great.

Re: Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

That was only after the shitstorm. His initial comments on the issue show how partisan, petty, and out of touch he is. It's also transparent that he was trying not to lose his white supremacist voters (don't worry, they aren't going anywhere). His approval rating is abysmal because of shit like this. I don't expect him to become a liberal, but it would be nice if he would just stop being so goddamn unpresidential!

Re: Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[MightyMartian]

And once again the false equivalency.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[MightyMartian]

Absolutely. My great-uncle was picking shrapnel out of his body for a couple of years after shooting up Nazis in France. Why suddenly is wanting to fuck over Nazis suddenly a bad thing?

Christ, in the 30s and 40s Woody Guthrie had "This Machine Kills Fascists" scrawled on his guitars. I can only imagine the Alt-right outrage at that now.

At what point was society required to show deference to a pack of white supremacists and fascists? Where did this transformation come from? How did we get from D-Day and the Civil Rights movement to bowing down to the sacred right of Nazis to preach hate? Sure, they have the right, but goddamnit, our grandfathers or great-grandfathers (depending on your age) stuck their fucking necks out, went to Europe, Africa and Asia to fight Fascists, so fucking hell, having a counterprotest and maybe even a few punches thrown at these goons is more than they deserve, and better than they got when we marching troops and tanks into their ideological progenitors' cities and bombing the living fuck out of them.

Re: Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

Which false equivalency is that?

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

Christ, in the 30s and 40s Woody Guthrie had "This Machine Kills Fascists" scrawled on his guitars.

If this is true, your comment is the most insightful comment I've ever seen on Slashdot as I've never pieced together where Stross's "This machine kills demons" came from before.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[MightyMartian]

http://farm1.static.flickr.com...

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[penandpaper]

? How did we get from D-Day and the Civil Rights movement to bowing down to the sacred right of Nazis to preach hate?

First, the war ended.
Second, they are fellow American citizens with every right that you have.
Third, the civil rights in the constitutions apply to every American.
Fourth, what makes America great is the fact that we allow neo-nazi's to speak because we afford the protections of law to every American citizen no matter what ideology they have.
Finally, the government does not get to decide when the protections of law be rescinded based on political ideology.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

How did you get here, from there? Simple - the GOP embraced the south, allowing southerners who still want the Confederacy, slavery and white supremacy back to have a voice in national politics - which they then weren't happy with, so they elected Trump, (with help), who is everything they've been wanting. The white supremacists have ALWAYS been there ion your country, it's just the GOP gave them an outlet which they feel they now control, and so can afford to be more vocal and active, whilst ensuring the state has to work for the, rather than against them.

I'm afraid the US civil war never ended - it merely changed in form, and now the South is WINNING...

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[sexconker]

Dodge is a damn fine car. Ran over my wife with a Dodge.

-Young Zeke

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[MightyMartian]

Jesus Fucking Christ, there are damned few actual socialists in the United States. There is, however, a long sad sordid history of racism in the United States.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[MightyMartian]

I'm not saying anyone should revoke their right to peaceful protest. I'm saying that all these false equivalencies with BLM and the like look at best like whatabouterry, and at worst an outright attempt to white wash (excuse the pun) what these Neo-Nazis really are.

Re: Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

Erm, the United States left is _against_ collectivization of business. Like, literally not socialist. There is an actual socialist party you can complain about if you want but it is in no way the general left.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[penandpaper]

Ok, if you think it's false equivalence. Would you blame BLM if they were marching down the street chanting "what do want dead cops, when do want it now". The government rescinds their permit to protest, orders the cops to not intervene should violence happen, and the police direct the BLM march toward anti-blm protestors that have been known to be violent? After which, is then banned from every private server and social media platform and blamed as the ones who started it?

BLM has been tied to violent perpetrators and associated to rioting more than once. BAMN has been violent and leaders arrest for inciting riots/rioting. Antifa has repeatedly used violence and antagonized violence with other protests. You may not like people doing it, but it isn't false equivalence when each has promoted hatred toward a race as the vice mayor of Charottesville have shown. There is blatant hypocrisy.

Of all the neo-nazi/white supremacists protests that happen, they only seem to get violent when the police don't do their job and antifa or bamn show up antagonizing violence. Why is that?

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

Why suddenly is wanting to fuck over Nazis suddenly a bad thing?

Because the media-industrial complex (CNN/DNC/NSA/Pentagon) turns "Stop Nazis" into
"Kill all conservatives, impeach Trump, nuke Russia"

I am not a conservative, but I know where this is headed. After the identity libtards get their way, my head is next in the noose.

Re: Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

Why is this modded troll? Everything is says is the truth.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[DRJlaw]

In the age of Photoshop, it's good practice to use reference materials when available.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[MightyMartian]

There are some violent BLM protesters. The entire movement does not stand for doing violence. So that's the false equivalence.

Neo-Nazis and White Supremacists on the other hand are inherently violent groups. It isn't just a matter of a few errant members, it's that their entire worldview is fundamentally antisocial.

And I'll repeat, I'm not talking about revoking permits or using any state power to limit their right to free speech. They have as much right to the commons as anyone else, providing they remain within the bounds of the law. What I'm saying is that these attempts by certain conservative elements to whitewash what these white supremacist groups really are needs to stop, and that needs to start with the President of the United States not grouping Neo-Nazis in with groups like BLM and Antifa. I don't support what every BLM and Antifa supporter does, but in general I support the notion that African-Americans be treated fairly and without bias, and that Fascists be challenged at every turn.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[MightyMartian]

Other than some people demanding Trump's impeachment (and it's hardly limited to the far left), I don't know any organization who wants to kill the conservatives and nuke Russia. That looks to me like your strawman. In other words, you're just making it up, or, at best, taking a few wingnuts comments and then declaring that the entire movement's official policy is the same. It's all part of the game of trying to make groups like BLM and Antifa look as bad as groups we do know our very bad; namely White Supremacists and Neo-Nazis. I'm curious as to why you would even want to take part in such an exercise. Is there some reason you need to white wash white supremacists?

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[penandpaper]

There are some violent BLM protesters. The entire movement does not stand for doing violence. So that's the false equivalence.

Neo-Nazis and White Supremacists on the other hand are inherently violent groups

I must have missed all the violence that happened with every march these groups have done. You are saying that they are inherently violent but they have only spoken their views. Racist views or not they have not done any action. When do youd ecide a white supremacist march should be violently shut down? if they are inherently violent why is it antifa and bamn are more violent? why is it violence only erupts when antifa show up and the cops do nothing?

providing they remain within the bounds of the law.

I don't understand when antifa are antagonizing violence with government complicity.

not grouping Neo-Nazis in with groups like BLM and Antifa.

so far out of those 3 groups, 2 of them have been violent. Words are not violent.

Fascists be challenged at every turn.

It matters how you challenge them. Violence is NOT the answer.

African-Americans be treated fairly and without bias,

That goes for every race. It is fashionable to hate white people. Just ask the vice mayor of charlottsville.

Re: Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

Pretty sure the answer is we don't condone violence as a civilized society ?

Let laws and justice take care of things. At least that's the idea.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Darinbob]

Those were the communists who were in power, although they weren't really communists they also had a very distorted view of socialism too. Blame stalinists, maoists, etc.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

How did we get from D-Day and the Civil Rights movement to bowing down to the sacred right of Nazis to preach hate?

Every US soldier that died fighting Nazis did so to defend rights like those.

maybe even a few punches thrown at these goons is more than they deserve

Your uncle would be ashamed of you for advocating violence against protesters. Those actions is what has caused events like last weekend. Unlikable groups believing they are superior or oppressed protesting, then being antagonized and victimized by people like you. The whole thing explodes into violence and Neo-Nazis attract more followers because you are proving them right by being violent first.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[AaronW]

My grandfather helped fight Nazis during WWII. He was a radioman for the RAF and was involved during D-Day. He discovered the Germans were using radar which earned him the Distinguished Flying Cross. I'm sure he'd punch these people in the face if he were alive today. I have another relative who was almost captured behind enemy lines by the Nazis but by knowing German he was able to escape.

Shooting these bastards is too good for them. These people deserve something slow and painful.

Here's a good documentary on these assholes.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[AaronW]

White supremest and other alt-right groups have killed far more people since 9/11 than any other group, including jihadists. Hell, the FBI just blocked another Oklahoma city bombing by a white supremest. BLM pales by comparison and for the most part, BLM has been peaceful and at its core, the group espouses peaceful demonstrations. The second deadliest terror attack in this country was carried out by white supremest in Oklahoma City. Then there are the 9 people killed in a Charleston church, or the six people killed at a Sikh temple in Wisconsin.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Rakarra]

Ain't nothing wrong with fighting Nazis

As long as you're actually fighting Nazis, and not just.. calling people whose politics you don't like a Nazi and then taking off the glove, because Nazis are fair game, right?

Our penchant is for fighting Nazis, confederates, racists, and Russian secret agents is what makes America great

You should add "fighting socialists and communists" to the list as well. That's a looong American tradition.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[penandpaper]

the group espouses peaceful demonstrations.

"what do we want, dead cops. when do we want it, now". Would they be peaceful if the cops didn't enforce the peace and allowed anti-BLM protestors that are known to be violent to clash with them?

Few questions
Why stop at 9/11? What about the 90's, 80's and 70's? I am sorry but looking at a small piece of data to skew it to what you want to be is disingenuous considering the 6 year calm after 9/11. http://www.start.umd.edu/pubs/...

That only runs to 2010 but it very much puts into context what you are claiming. Or "Only 6% of
  groups that have attacked the United States are focused on a religious ideology". But from what I can tell, leftist ideology is popular among terrorists.

What is the point in only having a partial view of data?

Are you more concerned about a lone wolf or a group?

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

Nazi supporters are all about free speech, fairness, non-violence, and equivalent treatment until they actually start acting on their ideology, then crushing opposition by any means necessary is fair game.

Yes, violence in all its forms deserves condemnation. Yes, it sucks if BLM members yell things like wanting "dead cops", but it's free speech. Hateful, awful, free speech, but that's no different from letting the Nazis speak, which they were allowed to do. They get treated the same on that front, so no whining about it is deserved. If people truly understand free speech, then they understand that it does *not* mean you get to speak unopposed or in whatever forum you want.

Whenever groups of people turn violent, regardless of politics, they should be met with the law. They'll be treated equally in that regard too. So BLM, BAMN, and Antifa have "repeatedly used violence"? Yes. And they got off completely free? Uh, no. They get arrested just like everybody else when they cross the line.

So you can take your "hypocrisy" statement and shove it, because the great majority of people and institutions accept free speech and don't accept violence, and they handle both as best they can even when the situation is distasteful to deal with.

Nobody said that police had an easy job keeping protesters and counter-protesters apart, or that it always works out, but they try. What you seem to be advocating is for neo-nazis to show up to make their "peaceful" statement without any opposition to antagonize them. Thanks to a horrible historical track record for Nazi ideology, that isn't going to happen, and unfortunately that means that some small fraction of people will think (mistakenly) that they have to use violence to get their point across.

Let's just say people have good reason to be rather confrontational, and I'm sure there's plenty of reciprocation when it comes to "antagonizing" anyway. Perhaps the Nazis need to learn that in order to shed their abominable history, they're going to have to get used to turning the other cheek rather than showing up with batons and giving in to violence so easily when taunted.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[dfenstrate]

White supremest and other alt-right groups have killed far more people since 9/11 than any other group, including jihadists. Hell, the FBI just blocked another Oklahoma city bombing by a white supremest. BLM pales by comparison and for the most part, BLM has been peaceful and at its core, the group espouses peaceful demonstrations. The second deadliest terror attack in this country was carried out by white supremest in Oklahoma City. Then there are the 9 people killed in a Charleston church, or the six people killed at a Sikh temple in Wisconsin.

The cited count starts after 9/11 and stops before the Orlando massacre. Plus it ignores what's going on in Europe. If you cherry pick your date ranges like that you can make anything you like seem true. "White Supremacists kill more people than Muslim terrorists if you don't count a bunch of days and locations where Muslim terrorists have killed people."

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[david_thornley]

The only reason Communists got in the lead is that they had more time. Militarist Japan and Nazi Germany murdered people at very roughly twice the rate of the Soviet Union and Communist China. (Fascist Italy and the other Axis powers did not commit megamurders at all.) It's not that Germany and Japan were morally superior or even equal, it was that we took them down. Consider that Hitler convinced Russians that Stalin was a comparatively good choice, and the resistance against Nazis legitimized Communism in many places.

Blaming Socialists for the Communist atrocities is something like blaming Republicans for neo-Nazi atrocities. Communism has been pretty well debunked. People who now call themselves Socialist are actually in favor of capitalism with social responsibility. Heck, Otto von Bismarck was in favor of social programs, and he was very definitely not a Socialist.

The Nazis nowadays have roughly the same ideals as the Nazis my father fought. I was on a neo-Nazi mailing list for years, for some reason, and they're still for getting rid of non-whites and Jews. They still aren't interested in rational thought. I can explain WWII democratic capitalism in a way that makes sense. I can explain Soviet Communism in a way that makes sense (not to say that Communism made sense, but it had assumptions and reasoning from them). I can't explain Fascism in such a way, because as a movement it rejected materialism and reason.

If I physically attack a Nazi over what the Nazi says, I'm a criminal. If I denounce Nazis and what they say and what they stand for, I'm using my freedom of speech. If I refuse to deal with Nazis, I'm using other freedoms. The best you can say about Nazi speech is that it's actually legal in a country with very strong freedoms of speech.

It was necessary to win the wars as fast as possible (see above about megamurder rate), and bombing was a vital part of that. Under the lowest assumptions I can make about Chinese civilian deaths in 1945, and the rosiest estimates about when Japan would have given in, I find that the nukes killed fewer Japanese civilians than they saved Chinese civilians. Note also that Hiroshima was the headquarters of the defense of the island of Kyushu, and was swarming with soldiers, as opposed to women, children, and old folk.

The Axis started this business of bombing civilians indiscriminately. The Allies finished it. I hope we'll never have to pick it up again.

Re:Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[david_thornley]

There are groups with ideologies I really don't like. Some of them call themselves Nazis, and I call them Nazis. Some associate happily with Nazis and espouse the same sort of hateful ideology, and I often call them Nazis as a matter of convenience. The rest of the groups I call things like Republicans, fascists, dominionists, theocrats, etc. I try to be reasonably precise.

Re: Don't lend a racist clown your credibility...

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe you just can't see the equivalency. Dead = dead, by ISIS, or DUI, or Black rioter or cop-killer, or other mental cases, or black-hooded antiFAs, or MS13, or Cartels, or rapists, or pedophiles, or....
Apparantly only one is truly morally offensive, a 20 yr old mentally deranged punk hanging out near some neo-nazis, in a car down the street and driving past the place there was supposed to be a blockade into a crowd that was a mix of both decent (like the victim) dissenter a armed and boiling over for a row other class of dissenters.
And one more time I ask, why not just let the fascist pigs be alone and demonstrating only to themselves (like you can't hear a tree fall if you aren't in the woods, and leading a passel of "I hope something awful happens" so-called journalists). THis all couldn't have happened in that scenario, and the world woulda been a better place, not worse as it is now.

Translation

[sjbe]

In a blog post, Krzanich said that the decline in American manufacturing remains a serious issue, but said that "politics and political agendas have sidelined the important mission of rebuilding America's manufacturing base. I resigned to call attention to the serious harm our divided political climate is causing to critical issues, including the serious need to address the decline of American manufacturing

Translation: "I'm too much of a coward to publicly denounce Nazis and white supremacists by name and Trump's support for them and only am resigning because of pressure from bad publicity to my company that is resulting from my slow exit from this useless advisory body."

"Politics and political agendas have sidelined the important mission of rebuilding America's manufacturing base."

What a load of crap. America's manufacturing base is fine and certainly doesn't require rebuilding. America has a HUGE and thriving manufacturing base. By itself it is approximately the size of the GDP of the UK and twice the size of the GDP of Russia. It could be improved but Trump isn't going to be the guy to lead that charge and anyone who didn't realize that in the first 100 days of his administration is an idiot. Improving manufacturing in the US will require careful planning, good policy, and sensible strategy. We aren't going to get any of those as long as Trump sits in the oval office.

Re:Translation

[tbannist]

In a blog post, Krzanich said that the decline in American manufacturing remains a serious issue, but said that "politics and political agendas have sidelined the important mission of rebuilding America's manufacturing base. I resigned to call attention to the serious harm our divided political climate is causing to critical issues, including the serious need to address the decline of American manufacturing

Translation: "I'm too much of a coward to publicly denounce Nazis and white supremacists by name and Trump's support for them and only am resigning because of pressure from bad publicity to my company that is resulting from my slow exit from this useless advisory body."

That's a pretty poor translation because the next line of the press release says:

"I have already made clear my abhorrence at the recent hate-spawned violence in Charlottesville, and earlier today I called on all leaders to condemn the white supremacists and their ilk who marched and committed violence."

I think it's closer to "Trump loves praise too much to denounce the violence of his most ardent supporters, so fuck this, we're out."

"Politics and political agendas have sidelined the important mission of rebuilding America's manufacturing base."

What a load of crap. America's manufacturing base is fine and certainly doesn't require rebuilding. America has a HUGE and thriving manufacturing base. By itself it is approximately the size of the GDP of the UK and twice the size of the GDP of Russia. It could be improved but Trump isn't going to be the guy to lead that charge and anyone who didn't realize that in the first 100 days of his administration is an idiot. Improving manufacturing in the US will require careful planning, good policy, and sensible strategy. We aren't going to get any of those as long as Trump sits in the oval office.

I think you're saying the same thing as Krzanich, he just took longer to reach the same conclusion.

Re:Translation

[MightyMartian]

He sure isn't going to improve it by fucking over Canada and Mexico in NAFTA renegotiations. Trump's knowledge on trade and economics is equal to his knowledge in just about every other area; nil to none. The man truly is a profound idiot, but hopefully once Bannon is gone, he'll be surrounded by a few less idiots.

Re:Translation

[HiThere]

I think you misunderstand his point. He wasn't condemning Nazis because that's not important to him (despite the second paragraph). He was leaving the council because it wasn't useful to his company, his opinions were ignored, and it was irritating some of his customers.

Most top business leaders don't have strong opinions about Nazis as such, many of them support fascists. US fascism in business is much more similar to that of Mussolini than to that of Hitler (with isolated exceptions) except that there is no pro-Italian bias...though there often does appear to be a strong pro-"people like me" bias.

Re:Translation

[unixisc]

What a load of crap. America's manufacturing base is fine and certainly doesn't require rebuilding. America has a HUGE and thriving manufacturing base. By itself it is approximately the size of the GDP of the UK and twice the size of the GDP of Russia. It could be improved but Trump isn't going to be the guy to lead that charge and anyone who didn't realize that in the first 100 days of his administration is an idiot. Improving manufacturing in the US will require careful planning, good policy, and sensible strategy. We aren't going to get any of those as long as Trump sits in the oval office.

How is America's manufacturing base fine, when most of the things one finds in most shops are either made in China, or else, other countries like Vietnam, Costa Rica, Indonesia, et al? Intel was actually a good example to hold to the US market, since they have several fabs in the US and one or more in Israel. Thinking like the above is what was common in the Bush years, and what cost the GOP several elections. Trump has shown them how to start winning - by putting the interests of the country above that of their pet lobbyists.

Re:Translation

[david_thornley]

Fairly simple consumer goods are usually made abroad. Making them in the US would raise their cost considerably, and make the US as a whole poorer, while it provided what would essentially be makework jobs.

Re:Translation

[unixisc]

It also causes money to flow out of the US, instead of within, thereby increasing the trade deficit.

Re:Translation

[david_thornley]

And protectionism brings the entire world economy down. We tried that in the 1930s. I'd rather have at least a full century before we try it again.

Smoke? What smoke?

[__aaclcg7560]

Is someone's gold-plated brick outhouse on fire?

So the solution...

[Anonymous Coward]

So the solution to our divided political climate is to divide yourself by not engaging the other side? This is why our political climate is so divided. One side refuses to talk to the other, even when there is common ground to be gained.

Re:So the solution...

[__aaclcg7560]

Don't worry. The Republicans will soon talk to the Democrats to get the debt ceiling and continuing resolution pass to avoid a government shutdown on their own watch.

Re:So the solution...

[Anonymous Coward]

Stupid moron - you know damn well the Democrats refuse to discuss tax cuts or lower the debt ceiling and that Obama and the Democrats REFUSED TO NEGOTIATE A BUDGET for the past 8 years forcing the Republicans to pass continuing resolutions leading to the largest debt in US history from which we may never get out of.

But please, do keep up with your storytelling... you're so good at it.

Re:So the solution...

[Neuronwelder]

The last time the government almost shut down it cost us only 24 billion. Pocket change!!

Re:So the solution...

[__aaclcg7560]

[...] Obama and the Democrats REFUSED TO NEGOTIATE A BUDGET for the past 8 years [...]

I guess you don't remember the budget that the Senate Democrats passed in 2013.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/24/us/politics/senate-passes-3-7-trillion-budget-its-first-in-4-years.html

Re:So the solution...

[Anonymous Coward]

I guess you don't remember the budget that the Senate Democrats passed in 2013.

I guess you don't remember:

1) The Senate can't do jack without the House.
2) The Senate Democrats couldn't get their 2013 budget accepted by the House, and vice versa.
3) Appropriations in that year were handled via continuing resolution, as they have been for the last 8 years.
4) Budget bills and appropriations bills are different animals.
5) The Democrat-controlled Senate passed that bill in 2013, and the vote split along party lines: it received no republican votes. That's not exactly great evidence of negotiation.

But other than those facts you overlooked, you make a GREAT point, creimer.

Re:So the solution...

[__aaclcg7560]

But other than those facts you overlooked, you make a GREAT point, creimer.

You forgot the part where Republicans refused to go to conference (regular order, which is currently being ignored by Republicans today), shutdown the government, and, two weeks later, accepted the exact same budget deal that they would have gotten if they went to conference with Democrats.

Re: So the solution...

[Anonymous Coward]

Such as? Seems to me Republicans are all too happy to continue funneling money into the coffers of the 1%, shitting on our rights, education, and healthcare in the meantime.

Republicans don't have a shred of politics that's in my favor. I only stand to sink further into poverty with their ideology.

Re:So the solution...

[HiThere]

If someone isn't listening, then after awhile it becomes obvious that talking to them is a waste of time.

Surprising

[93 Escort Wagon]

You'd think if anyone could understand something that overheats on a regular basis, it'd be Intel.

Re:Surprising

[DickBreath]

Maybe Intel didn't want to be associated with an orange F00F clown?

Re:Surprising

[neurosys]

Zoooom!! That comment really went over your head huh...

Understandable

[Anonymous Coward]

This administrations goal is self aggrandizement. Bill logic construction, vetting, and instantiation is a weak point in a similar vein to an foreign programmer who purchased their diploma being unable to code solid logic capable of passing vetting and compilation.

Setting up federal level manufacturing enticement logic is difficult and requires careful planning, cunning and experience.

What I believe would be a solution is an engineering approach combined with open source. IE they should setup a database connected website with approved architectural plans allowing for factory building copies to be rapidly constructed by removing red tape for much of the planning and approvals process other than location, foundation, orientation and insulation though these could also be accessible via simplified menus. Sub sites should be setup with access to engineering plans for robotics along with easy to understand explanations for their setup, function, acquisition or construction.

Empowerment allows for flourishing. Removal of financial overhead in the form of tax incentives is nice but is not the totality of the battle to resurrect the ailing manufacturing sector. Empowering the masses to allow more entry into the game currently grasped tightly by the powers that be who have no incentive would allow for more flourishing. Removing much of the stagnation caused by current intellectual property legislation would also be a boon.

If the Intel gentleman was truly interested in focusing on these issues rather than getting in bed with one of the most corrupt regimes in American recent history I do not believe he could be stopped from achieving these goals.

The concept of religion, fascism, freedom, and marketing have done less for the human race than the engineering solution which produced the tooth brush and eye glasses.

... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Noishkel]

A bunch of degenerate a-holes from both extremes of US political spectrum (ANTIFA and the Alt-Right) get in a fight after the Mayor of Charlottesville orders a STAND DOWN of the police... so there for Donald Trump is evil and everyone must distance himself from him. Because obvious reasons, of course?

Am I getting this right, comrades? Because that's what it seems to be.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Noishkel]

Source about the stand down of the Charlottesville PD.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/...

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[mspohr]

No

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Noishkel]

Well thank you for that precise and well thought out explanation.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's because of Trump that people are angry and openly hostile to others.

Either you dislike Trump, dislike his leadership and the direction he would point the country in, and end up angry, or you like Trump, follow his lead, and become openly hostile to those that disagree with you.

Thanks, Trump.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

Never let a good crisis go to waste. People are taking full advantage of the opportunity to associate everyone who supports the president with Nazis, without any care in the world as to the consequences of such a rash action.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Noishkel]

That's the most childish statement I've read in days on this website. So we're not going to just start RIOTS every-time the DUELS ELECTED PRESIDENT does something you don't like.

Yeah welcome to why the right have been stockpiling firearms to the point we have 660 million of them. Nut job left wing agitators that will never be satisfied and are eager to start riots.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

The word is "therefore", you illiterate moron.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Noishkel]

Yeah, no kidding. The left in the Bay Area have been starting riots for about a year and a half now. Nothing good came out of it. They didn't get positiveness media coverage for it. And in fact some of the leaders ended up being arrested anyway, including the ring leader of BAMN, one of the bigger know groups of rioters. Nothing changed, other than the insurance rates for the people that had to deal with aftermath.

Sorry lefties, you don't get a pass because you THINK the other person is worse. Just like the SOB that ran down the protestors with his car.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

The right wing are a bunch of paranoid fools who think everyone is out to get them and that nationalism is a good idea. The left wing are a bunch of narcissistic idiots who think everyone is stupid and that communism is a good idea.

The two tail monster of the normal distribution are the just worst extremes of humanity. They are the violent authoritarians. Don't associate with either of those two groups. They aren't worth your time. They are just brain dead agitators who know nothing except they want to try out the failed totalitarian crap of the 20th century.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

Thanks Obama

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[mspohr]

No. All of it.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Noishkel]

Well that's a sentiment. Too bad you can't write policy with that level of 6th grade logic.

I tell you what son. You can autistally shrek about this crap all day. But at the end of the day we have to have some level of policy. If all you can do is scream about who is and is not authoritarian enough than you deserve to find out what real authoritarianism looks like.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Noishkel]

Ohh hoo, I miss spelled a world. Everything I have said is invalid forever.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

get in a fight

mowing down people with a vehicle goes a little past "fight"

Am I getting this right, comrades?

no, it went right over your head

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[MightyMartian]

The closest the Dems have to a Communist is Sanders, and some might argue he's only a Democrat of convenience, but even if you accept him as a full-fledged member, just about anywhere else in the world he'd be considered a social democrat, the kind of person that has, by and large, run most European countries since the end of the Second World War. There hasn't been a meaningful Communist movement in the United States since the 1930s, and most Democrats would be viewed as moderate Tories in Canada or the UK.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[MightyMartian]

And what exactly are the consequences? Trump is making himself toxic, and the more toxic he becomes, the more he sheds support. He really has no support in the Senate at all, and only a fairly small faction in the House that would stick their neck out for him. Quit blaming other people for Trump's ignorance and stupidity.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Game Genie]

Facist terrorist murders a peaceful protestor and President spinelessly says, "well, gee, there are two sides to every story". Yeah, that's something to get upset about.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's been obvious that Trump is evil any time these past 20 years.

But in this case, the biggest indicator is his personal encouragement of American nazis. First with the false-equivalence of "Many sides", then with the canned statement read (from an autocue, a tool he used to ridicule Obama for using) with all the sincerity of a third-grader thanking the principal for this wonderful event - and even then he couldn't bring himself to single out the nazis for special condemnation, or to use the word "terrorism".

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's disingenuous to suggest the handful of angry tankies(far-lefties, socialists, etc) are a threat that's anywhere near as bad as the very organized far-right extremism that's taken over one of the US's major political parties. The founder of a far-right extremist, openly racist rag is one of the President's closest political advisers.

Outside of the far-right bubble that a disturbing amount of old slashdotters live inside, the boogeyman that is Antifa really isn't a huge deal. Literally more violence happens between parents at little league games every year.

Not excusing far-left violence or extremism. It's certainly not the answer to Trumpisim. Neither is dumbshit socialism, which is trying really hard to take over the Democratic party despite being an obviously Center-left social and center-right fiscal party since Clinton. (Seriously fuck Sanders)

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Noishkel]

Yeah not even remotely similar to what he said. Not. Even. Close.

Honestly, President Trump really is becoming the Rorschach test for politics anymore. Show a photo of the man and see what the left will make out of it.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

To others of us, it seems that the POTUS and DOJ are encouraging an alt-white nationalist resurgence and, therefore, patriotic citizens who believe in the promise of equal opportunity and civil rights within the United States are stepping forward to combat the growing fascism.

Re: ... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

And all these videos of leftist nutjobs surrounding cars banging on them etc is cool right I mean they shouldn't be run down cause their in the street like dumbasses

We don't even know if this guy did it on purpose or if he was afraid for his life .

At least I don't know that I haven't seen that evidence yet

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Noishkel]

'Organized far-right extremism'.

Based off of WHAT?? A few ASSHOLES that shit-post? Where are the well organized right wing militias? WHERE? NAME ONE SITUATION, where an ORGANIZED group of ANY right wing assholes did anything of note that wasn't WORSE than leftist did.

Son we have at LEAST 412 MILLION individually owned guns in the US. But yet we DON'T have organized right wing violence. Because there would not BE any left wing a-holes in the nation left, outside of the major cities. If this was a problem, YOU WOULD FUCKING WELL KNOW ABOUT IT ALREADY.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Noishkel]

Oh look, another anno-commie comes to play.

Sarcasm retard. That's why I used to term 'comrade'. Anyone that's NOT a left wing moron will realize that political violence is 'bad'. Not just when it first the left's narrative.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Noishkel]

Yeah I'm not taking any shit from another anno-commie. Find a better argument.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[bluefoxlucid]

You forgot the #PizzaGate hashtag.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Headw1nd]

No, that's mostly all wrong. I'll try to fill you in.

Last week, there were protests in Charlottesville, VA that had been organized by a member of the self-described "alt-right". These protests were loosely associated with a planned removal of a confederate statue from a local park, though it would be fair to say that their overall message was broader than that. A majority of the named groups involved were associated with white supremacist or white nationalist views. Also taking part in these protests were a number of people identifying a Nazis and displaying Nazi symbols. The Nazis, in case you don't recall, were a political party that ran Germany during World War II, were avowed enemies of the United States, and were formally abolished in 1945 after the defeat of Germany in that war. It is doubtful that any of the protesters had any actual connection to the Nazi party, and their motivations for associating themselves with a defunct organization that had been until its destruction a grave enemy of the United States are unclear.

The rally was scheduled to begin at noon on the 12th, at the same time counter-protest activities were also scheduled to occur in another location. However, at the rally site violence began to erupt, and with the deteriorating situation the Virginia state police cleared the area where the rally was to take place, and some of the rally participants moved to another location to continue the rally. This is the part you seem to have some awareness of.

The important part, that you seem to be missing, is that later in the day an individual who had taken part in the original rally drove a car into a crowd of counterprotesters, mimicking attacks that have been carried out earlier this year by Islamic terrorists in Europe. There are numerous videos of this incident, which in all aspects seem to show malicious intent. One person was killed, and a number wounded. The driver was taken into custody, and has since been documented as having a long history of idolization of the Nazi party. It is relatively obvious, barring extraordinary evidence to the contrary, that this was an act of politically motivated terrorism.

Which brings us to President Trump. In previous incidents, much scrutiny has been brought to bear on the way presidents address terrorist attacks. President Obama was pilloried for failing to refer to terror attacks by Islamic militants as "radical Islamic terrorism", as many quite rightly saw this as an attempt to disconnect Islam from the incidents and avoid offending Muslim supporters and allies. President Trump took a similar position, refusing to name the ideology associated with the terrorist perpetrator, and many have wondered if he might be in a similar fashion hoping to not offend allies, and thus raising the question of who these allies are. Also in doing so he made an equivalence between the violent but mutual fights of earlier in the day, and the asymmetric, unprovoked attack with the vehicle.

So there you have it. People are upset at Trump because in the face of an obvious, terrorist attack by a person sympathetic to the enemies of America, he chose to give a mealy-mouthed response that avoided assigning any blame or reaffirming any of the shared cultural values of the United States, a response that flies in the face of his reputation as a person who is not afraid to tell it like it is.

Re: ... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

Concur re Democrats vs moderate Tories. Regarding Canada, how does Bernie stack up to the NDP which is an actual left-centre party with some (local) electoral successes? And there are parties at the federal or provincial level left of the NDP.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Noishkel]

Yes, because news from multiple known news sources is the same as a bad internet meme.

News flats leftie: the fact that you mock everyone you disagree with is why you HAVE the problems with the right now. You're not convincing anyone of your position. You're just alienated people that might have otherwise supported you. Did you NOT noticed that the 'alt-right' didn't exist about a year ago? Where do you think that's going to go from there?

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[sexconker]

They'refour

Re: ... how exactly does this make any sense?

[MightyMartian]

He'd probably fit somewhere in the moderate wing of the NDP. The NDP does have its own further left fringe, moreso in the past than now, but these days they've been trying to rebrand themselves as social democrats, much as Labour is trying to do in the UK.

Honestly, these accusations that Democrats (in the US), NDP (in Canada) and Labour (in the UK) as being neo-Marxist types is just absurd, either shouted by idiots or by people who are trying to create some sort of false association.

If Sanders was PM of, say, Denmark, he'd pretty much be in the political center. But in the US, because just about all politicians are in fact one brand of "Tory" or another, he looks far left. The US doesn't have a far left political movement of note since the Depression.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[bluefoxlucid]

ZeroHedge is a raving conspiracy site. You get the same ridicule as citing Mercola.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

The important part, that you seem to be missing, is that later in the day an individual who had taken part in the original rally drove a car into a crowd of counterprotesters, mimicking attacks that have been carried out earlier this year by Islamic terrorists in Europe.

Muslim drives large truck into shoppers on a sidewalk: N-n-not all M-m-muslims!

Redneck drives small car into protestors blocking a street: N-N-NAZIS EVERYWHERE!

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

Watch the carcrash videos from Charlottesville: police take full three minutes to send in some officers, and another 4 minutes for the police cars/ambulances to arrive.
Here's one for you I got the timestamps off: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fcKpsM1zi1g

(as a bonus, in that video you also see the dying woman getting robbed of her cellphone at 1:39 by a neonazi, apparently (who else would steal from the dying...)

Just fucking watch, and decide yourself whether the police were on-site, or were ordered to stand down. Afterwards, if you feel like it, ponder what else you might be oblivious to, in your infinite wisdom.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

Muslim drives large truck into shoppers on a sidewalk: N-n-not all M-m-muslims!

Quite.

Some muslims, too many but far from all of them, are complete fuckwits.

Redneck drives small car into protestors blocking a street: N-N-NAZIS EVERYWHERE!

Hardly everywhere, no.

That said, one nazi is one too many, just as one militant jihadist is one too many.

You are a bit daft. I hope you get better soon.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

Is one Antifa protestor with a baseball bat too many?

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

an obvious, terrorist attack

Last I read the perp hasn't been charged with anything terrror related. The only ones for whom this is "obvious" are those who profit politically from doing so.

Re: ... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Baron_Yam]

>NDP (in Canada) ... as being neo-Marxist types is just absurd,

The NDP, while usually the most moral of the parties, is staggeringly incompetent at reconciling their policies with reality. I like them as a significant minority opposition party.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[HiThere]

I didn't watch the video, however:
Actually, many people have stolen from the dying. Sometimes they were close relatives. Your presumption that just because someone stole a cell phone from a dying woman that they were neo-nazi is fallacious. Given the circumstances I might put the odds at greater than 50%, but that was just because there were a bunch of neo-nazis in the area.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[HiThere]

Sorry, but the pro- vs anti- violence spectrum appears to be orthogonal to the left-right spectrum. But people are always more ready to condemn violence committed by those opposed to them in some way...practically any way that they are publicly aligned with. Is blowing up a Mosque terrorism? What about blowing up a birth control center? I'm sure you feel a difference between those two, even if you condemn both.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[HiThere]

Sorry, he *did* say more than that, but that is a reasonable paraphrase of one of his sentences on the topic.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[HiThere]

Personally, I'm all in favor of statues to Robert E. Lee, but he should be dressed as an inventor or engineer rather than as a general.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Cl1mh4224rd]

FBI and DHS Warned of Growing Threat From White Supremacists Months Ago

The FBI and the Department of Homeland Security in May warned that white supremacist groups had already carried out more attacks than any other domestic extremist group over the past 16 years and were likely to carry out more attacks over the next year, according to an intelligence bulletin obtained by Foreign Policy.

Even as President Donald Trump continues to resist calling out white supremacists for violence, federal law enforcement has made clear that it sees these types of domestic extremists as a severe threat. The report, dated May 10, says the FBI and DHS believe that members of the white supremacist movement “likely will continue to pose a threat of lethal violence over the next year.”

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[Anonymous Coward]

'Organized far-right extremism'.

Based off of WHAT?? A few ASSHOLES that shit-post? Where are the well organized right wing militias? WHERE? NAME ONE SITUATION, where an ORGANIZED group of ANY right wing assholes did anything of note that wasn't WORSE than leftist did.

Son we have at LEAST 412 MILLION individually owned guns in the US. But yet we DON'T have organized right wing violence. Because there would not BE any left wing a-holes in the nation left, outside of the major cities. If this was a problem, YOU WOULD FUCKING WELL KNOW ABOUT IT ALREADY.

My God, the blacks are going to walk all over you.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[david_thornley]

Actually, someone who takes a cell phone from a dying woman isn't even necessarily stealing it, although that's the most likely case.

Re:... how exactly does this make any sense?

[david_thornley]

There's a difference between blaming Muslims and blaming Nazis. There are hundreds of millions of halfway reasonable Muslims. It's a religion people are born into. Many of them hate others for being others, but not nearly all. There are no halfway reasonable Nazis. It isn't a religion, it's a radical political movement, much like some Muslim ones. They hate others for being others (or they wouldn't be Nazis).

politics

[Reverend Green]

politics and political agendas have sidelined the important mission of rebuilding America's manufacturing base

It appears he is doing exactly what he decries - letting petty sectarian political grandstanding take priority over economic issues.

Or alternatively: maybe he has no interest whatsoever in rebuilding America's manufacturing base, and is using this as a convenient excuse to shirk his civic duty.

Re:politics

[Anonymous Coward]

politics and political agendas have sidelined the important mission of rebuilding America's manufacturing base

Tell us more about the president's infrastructure plan

It appears he is doing exactly what he decries - letting petty sectarian political grandstanding take priority over economic issues.

Or alternatively: maybe he has no interest whatsoever in rebuilding America's manufacturing base, and is using this as a convenient excuse to shirk his civic duty.

Considering that Trump's attempt to "rebuild America's manufacturing base" has resulted in his own outsourcing of thousands of jobs and companies like Carrier sending even more jobs out of the country, maybe it's time to cut Trump out of this loop.

Re:politics

[Anonymous Coward]

It just means that he'd like to stay in a politically neutral council, but it's no longer possible thanks to, among other things, Trump's inability to convincingly condemn a terrorist nazi. #somuchwinning

Re:politics

[PoopJuggler]

There is absolutely no economic benefit to being part of Trump's circus of idiots. He made the right move.

Re:politics

[bluefoxlucid]

Rebuilding America's manufacturing base would result in Americans at all levels (especially the poor) being poorer and America's job market shrinking in total. Why is this considered a good thing?

Re:politics

[Reverend Green]

Get real, broham.

Re:politics

[bluefoxlucid]

That's not an answer.

Re: politics

[Reverend Green]

America in the past tried being a major industrial power. The result was a free country with widespread prosperity, an invincible military, and safe streets.

Then we tried deindustrialization. The result, which we see all over today's America, was a police state with widespread poverty, a military increasingly dependent on our geopolitical rivals for its supply chain, and grim dangerous cities.

Why the fuck would anyone avocate doubling down on an obviously, terribly failed public policy like that?

Re: politics

[Reverend Green]

Thanks for letting everyone know that you stand on the side of petty partisan politics, and against the economic best interests of your countrymen.

Re:politics

[constComment]

Actually, there are studies out of Harvard that show that standard of living is tied to the diversity of products a nation produces. The US has seen the value of its input to production slip for many sectors for the last 15 years. This would indicate that the US is experiencing declining economic diversity which is a bad thing. You are conflating network value created in apps such as Facebook with economic activity that actually improves standard of living.

Re: politics

[constComment]

The prosperity you speak of is the externality of possessing a vibrant economic ecosystem. Those that understand ONLY comparative advantage overlook this. Heck, most of those that understand comparative advantage do not even realize what limiting assumptions underlie its principle.

If globalization were such a great policy why has US median income stagnated for almost 20 years?

Re: politics

[bluefoxlucid]

America in the past was mainly agricultural, and then technology changed and agriculture became cheap. We export a lot of that, and import some.

The economic situation which made local manufacture a good idea has changed. This isn't causally tied to a police state, either.

As for widespread poverty, let's take some facts about pants manufacture. The import of men and boys's cotton trousers and shorts amounts to around 178,000 total jobs before they're dropped off at a U.S. port. That's 0.11% of the population; the other 90% (consumers under ~$140k income). In short: the effect on price of moving the jobs here is massive; the positive effect on employment and the spending power of these employees is minimal.

So what happens?

if we manufactured pants in America instead of importing them from China and paid the factory workers minimum-wage, then minimum-wage workers across the country would spend 3 hours working instead of 1.8 hours to buy a pair of pants, while people making the median $28/hr income would expend 0.8 hours instead of 0.5 hours. In other words: work longer to buy the same thing. As you raise the factory-worker wage, the factory workers become more-capable of buying pants (0.11% of employed population), but the remainder of the working-class have to expend even more time to purchase said pants (89.89% of employed population). Of course the rich just buy expensive Italian imports or whatever $1,500 American-made, custom-tailored suits they buy now.

But wait, there's more!

Because this labor-time is exchanged to these workers, it's not exchanged to any other worker, whereas formerly it bought other things. That means a reduction of those jobs. So we're talking about moving from McDonalds to the factory, right?

... not quite.

Each truck carries the same amount of pants--or hamburger patties, or shoes, or stupid fidget spinners. If we spend more money for the same pair of pants--or, more precisely, more labor-hours's wage on the same pants--then less of something must ship, be that fewer pants, fewer burgers, or fewer Gameboys. That means fewer truck-driver hours, and fewer trucker jobs.

Likewise, your local FedEx guy carries only so much on his truck, or else your local retail cashier makes only 980 item-scans per hour. Fewer items delivered (by ship-to-home or by retail) means fewer of these workers.

Overall, you might break even with a sub-minimum wage; by the time you hit minimum wage plus social insurances (which are taken as payroll taxes), management overhead, and the cost of equipment maintenance, you're already net-losing jobs. The jobs you keep by-the-numbers are themselves stripped from other industries (hence the net loss: you create 8,000 and lose 10,000, obviously those 8,000 were taken from other industries), and represent a disruption to someone else's life by job loss, but whatever.

So I ask you: why the fuck would anyone advocate raising the amount of time the great, vast masses of Americans need to work to afford the same goods, thus requiring either 60-hour work weeks or a lower standard-of-living and a greater spread of poverty while reducing the total available jobs, only to place some minuscule number of Americans into a specific type of job which will not enrich them so much as the jobs available now? Why do we want America to face greater unemployment and deeper poverty? Why do we want to lower the standards of the middle-class, and kick many of the poor below survival levels?

Re: politics

[bluefoxlucid]

If globalization were such a great policy why has US median income stagnated for almost 20 years?

20 years ago, I could get the kind of high-speed Internet I have at my house for $58,000/month.

20 years ago, many of the standard and low-level economy-package features in cars--luxury features, safety features, power windows, power seats, nice stereos--were high-end luxury items that cost quite a lot.

20 years ago, it was technically-possible to make computers quite fast and with much storage; such computers were of much lower specification than the ones used today, and cost tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars.

20 years ago, people in middle-income households spent a larger proportion of their income on food and clothing, and yet they ate more food at home instead of dining out so frequently as they do today.

20 years ago, the home energy bill was a larger proportion of the middle-income for a house of the same space.

20 years ago, cell phone service had limited minutes, and cost nearly a hundred dollars a month. Data transfer was measured by-the-megabyte--if you had it at all. The phones had few features, yet cost hundreds of dollars. People asked why a cell phone cost $400.

20 years ago, the middle-income gave a standard-of-living that's laughable by today's standards. Your quaint little third-world country of 1995 was a world of few luxuries, little income, and much expense--and you thought you were well-off because you had a telephone that could go three rooms away without a cord! The neatest thing was the $80 device that answered phone calls for you and recorded them without requiring a cassette tape, allowing you to instantly skip messages, erase messages in the middle, and do all kinds of other magical things.

Anti-lock brakes had been optional up until 2004 in Europe; in 2013, the United States made anti-lock brakes and electronic stability control mandatory for all newly-sold passenger cars. Back in the 90s, these things cost hundreds of dollars to add onto a base-model car. Even with all these fancy upgrades, people pay the same proportion of their income for a car, and just end up with much-better cars than they would have bought 20 years ago.

The US median income has become capable of purchasing more and more every year. That means it's been increasing, not stagnate. Of course I understand nobody told you that, so you just repeat what you've heard over and over.

Re: politics

[constComment]

You are confusing technological advancement with purchasing power. The “luxuries” that you cite are not included in the areas where people actually spend most of their money. Housing, transportation, food, education, and medical care account for 88% of dollars expended by the average person. All of these have risen in real terms outpacing or equaling income gains for most.

  (As a side note, the luxury features you cite in cars are actually a function of higher real prices. When base costs of something go up, relative cost added by options decreases and those options are consumed in greater quantities.)

By your reasoning, Andrew Carnegie would be the poorest person in the world for no amount of expenditure by him could have purchased an iPad..However, few would agree with you.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fac...

Re: politics

[Reverend Green]

Sorry bromeister - your sophist arguments don't fool anyone anymore. The policy you advocate is currently in place, and is an ongoing disastrous failure.

Maybe you're one of the few who has profited handsomely from selling out your countrymen - or maybe you're just their running dog. But for the overwhelming majority of working Americans, your policies have FAILED.

Re: politics

[bluefoxlucid]

Nope, I'm a working-class American currently employed in computer systems security and systems administration. Economics is a hobby.

You claim the policy I advocate is an ongoing disastrous failure, yet our tech sector has continuously grown faster than lay-offs and faster than immigrant labor has come in. More Americans have been put to work in the tech sector each year than the flat increase in the American population. Unemployment has fallen as low as 4.7% post-recession, although there's another one coming up soon. Middle-income households are immensely more wealthy than they were in the 80s and 90s, and even a decade ago. The upper-class has grown, and the middle-class has shrunk, indicating a transition of middle-class households to upper-class households--although our lower-class has grown as well.

The only people who have lost out are the poor, and that's because of our lackluster poverty-control policies. Our means-tested welfare systems fail to reach many families in need. HUD is a disaster, and TANF benefits have decayed in purchasing power since 1996 due to not being inflation-adjusted. Minimum wage is cost-of-living adjusted and doesn't share prosperity--and besides, doesn't guarantee a minimum weekly wage as Franklin D. Roosevelt had intended, as underemployment is rampant. Social Security's old-age, survivors, and disability insurance pensions are also COLA, and have been under continuous attack for nearly a decade, with the latest being this new budget to hurry along insolvency, coming after attempts to "save" Social Security by denying 5 million Americans disability benefits, raising the retirement age (providing benefits to fewer Americans), or tying COLA to a chained CPI (reducing the benefit).

Our system is built to keep the poor at their fixed level of poverty, not to bring them along with America's growth and prosperity. While middle-income households spend smaller proportions of their income on food, clothing, and other essentials, the bottom quintile continue to spend a solid 16% on food--although the great many things manufactured in China have eased the pressure, and their spending on clothing and various household supplies has diminished greatly. We have not built a system to support the poorest among us as Americans, but rather as an inconvenience.

The last thing we need is medieval economic policies to make the situation even worse. We need a restructuring of our welfare policies to ensure that Americans get their fair share, that the poorest are supported and included in our economic growth, and that our public aid systems actually cover the vast span of the needy instead of failing to reach the great majority of those in poverty.

I suspect this is PR

[blind biker]

More exactly, virtue signaling on a corporate level. I'm sure it'll work, too.

Re:I suspect this is PR

[Anonymous Coward]

Virtue signaling: the latest overused term; an armchair sociologist's explanation for everything the "other side" does

Re:I suspect this is PR

[AmiMoJo]

I just find it amazing that people think a company like Intel, which sells mostly to OEMs and other businesses rather than the public, engages in virtue signalling that would harm their own business.

Also, stop virtue signalling. We get it, you don't like virtue signalling, no need to go around virtue signalling about it.

Re:I suspect this is PR

[Anonymous Coward]

Why are you trying to stop people using that term? What is YOUR agenda?

Re:I suspect this is PR

[JoshuaZ]

You are unfortunately correct. The term originally was used in specific academic contexts to describe certain types of behavior in religious communities where people would publicly engage in more stringent than theologically necessary behavior. But people are abusing the term to essentially mean something like "course of action that I don't think is justified under my value system and therefore I'll assume they have an ulterior motive." This is a very unfortunate abuse of language.

Re:I suspect this is PR

[whoever57]

I just find it amazing that people think a company like Intel, which sells mostly to OEMs and other businesses rather than the public, engages in virtue signalling that would harm their own business.

You mean the same company that has probably spent over $1B on the "Intel Inside" campaign? You really think that Intel doesn't care about its image amongst consumers?

Re:I suspect this is PR

[HiThere]

I agree that it's PR, but my take on it is that he was really saying "Since you aren't going to listen to anything I say anyway, I might as well get what advantage I can out of cutting my losses.".

Tim Cooks?

[denzacar]

There is no such person on Trump's White House Manufacturing Council. Not even on the White House's page which still lists the people who have quit the council.

As for who's still on the council...

Resigned from council:

Elon Musk, Tesla
Ken Frazier, Merck & Co., Inc.
Kevin Plank, Under Armour
Brian Krzanich, Intel

No longer CEOs (still listed on White House web site):

Klaus Kleinfeld, Arconic
Mark Fields, Ford Motor Company
Mario Longhi, U.S. Steel
Doug Oberhelman, Caterpillar

Currently on council:

Andrew Liveris, The Dow Chemical Company
The Dow Chemical Company said Liveris would remain on the council.
Bill Brown, Harris Corporation
Michael Dell, Dell Technologies
Dell declined to say whether Michael Dell would leave the council.
John Ferriola, Nucor Corporation
Jeff Fettig, Whirlpool Corporation
Alex Gorsky, Johnson & Johnson
Greg Hayes, United Technologies Corp.
Marilynn Hewson, Lockheed Martin Corporation
Jeff Immelt, General Electric
GE said its non-executive chair Immelt will remain on the council.
Jim Kamsickas, Dana Inc.
Rich Kyle, The Timken Company
Thea Lee, AFL-CIO
Denise Morrison, Campbell Soup Company
Dennis Muilenburg, Boeing
Scott Paul, Alliance for American Manufacturing
Michael Polk, Newell Brands
Mark Sutton, International Paper
Inge Thulin, 3M
Richard Trumka, AFL-CIO
Wendell Weeks, Corning

Re:Tim Cooks?

[PopeRatzo]

The Dow Chemical Company said Liveris would remain on the council.

Of course the Dow Chemical CEO would stay on Trump's "council".

Here's why:

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us...

Aren't you glad the swamp is drained?

Re:Tim Cooks?

[MouseR]

"
For Apple's part, Tim Cook last week pointed out numerous ways he disagrees with Trump, but stated that his personal beliefs weren't enough to make him walk away from the Trump administration's councils, because he felt the need to keep the bigger picture in mind. "At the end of the day, I’m not a person who’s going to walk away and say, “If you don’t do what I want, I leave.” ... But I care deeply about America. I want America to do well. America’s more important than bloody politics from my point of view."
"
Source.

Re:Tim Cooks?

[denzacar]

Except he's NOT on the White House Manufacturing Council. And neither is Bezos.

Article conflates and confuses a single meeting, organized mainly so Trump could feel good about himself while everyone else suffered, with positions on WHMC.
It even makes that distinction... but then loses it.

Other companies attending the meeting include Alphabet, Microsoft, MasterCard, Intel, Qualcomm, Oracle, Adobe, and more.
The meeting, which was announced earlier this month, follows a few other efforts by the Trump administration in modernizing the government with the help of CEOs from tech companies, including the "White House Office of American Innovation" and "American Technology Council."

Re:Tim Cooks?

[denzacar]

What some people won't do for free stationery...

Re:Tim Cooks?

[cheesybagel]

I hope so. What does Apple manufacture in the USA to begin with?

Re:Tim Cooks?

[denzacar]

Hipsters?

Poor Intel

[Anonymous Coward]

After AMD's newest processor I guess they had to get in the news somehow.
Pity they chose to sacrifice their position. They won't be missed.

Segmentation Fault

[Anonymous Coward]

Intel CEO tried to access a White House paige.

Re:Whose fault is it...

[Anonymous Coward]

When you are an asshole, people won't cut you any slack.

GWB was also an idiot, but managed to seem like a decent human being. So, despite his bumbling, he maintained enough support to get a few things done.

Trump can't manage to seem like a decent human being. So people are willing to believe the worst and/or don't think it is worth putting their own reputations on the line to defend him.

That's why he is getting nothing done and can't get anyone credible to take him seriously, stop the huniliating leaks or marginalize the conspiracy theories.

Trump tried to catch flies with battery acid. No surprise, it didn't work.

He is a lost cause and his support is rapidly shrinking down to a sad minority of lost cause aficionados. He is left to try to get things done with the help of people distinguished by their inability to get anything done.

Still trying to polish that turd ?

[Anonymous Coward]

For fuck's sake. I used to be amused by all the Trump apologists on this board. But now I'm no longer amused. I'm sickened by it. I know a lot of them are trolls (which sicken me even more) and others are just paid shills, but I know some of them are authentic, genuine Trump voters who continue to support and defend that miserable piece of garbage no matter what.

How much longer are you going to try to polish that turd ? Haven't the past six months of White House chaos, preceeded by decades of his "illustrious" discusting business carrier been enough to convince you that he's one of the most discusting scumbags in America ? And you still think he belongs in the Oval Office ? A cruel, heartless, ruthless, misogynistic narcissistic mentaly unstable psychopath as your fucking president ?!?

Why can't you wake up to reality and simply say "We screwed up. Big Time" ? Is your personal pride more important than your country ? than the future of your children and granchildren ?

Re:Still trying to polish that turd ?

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh FFS. Trump not denouncing these fucktards in the particular way you wanted him to denounce them means nothing. It is just dribble. He made a perfectly adequate statement. Pointing that out is not being a Trump apologist - it's just reality.

Re:Still trying to polish that turd ?

[MightyMartian]

He didn't really denounce them at all until 48 hours after the events. What he did was make some general statement against violence, basically trying to equate the anti-fascist protesters with a pack of Nazi thugs. It was only when members of his own party began calling him out, and even his own press people couldn't really explain his unwillingness to call out the Nazis (many of which seemed quite keen to make the association between themselves and the President), that he finally made an explicit condemnation of the white supremacists.

Antifa can be pains in the ass, but there's no real history in the US of Antifa abusing anyone, but there is a very long history of minorities being targeted by white supremacists.

Re:Still trying to polish that turd ?

[Anonymous Coward]

-- “The white nationalists in Charlottesville did not hide their intentions. They were there to revel in the Trump presidency, which explicitly told them it was time to ‘take their country back,’” Rubin notes. “Former KKK grand wizard David Duke left no confusion as to his followers’ admiration for the president: ‘This represents a turning point for the people of this country. We are determined to take our country back. We’re going to fulfill the promises of Donald Trump. That’s what we believed in, that’s why we voted for Donald Trump, because he said he’s going to take our country back, and that’s what we’ve got to do.’”

-- Meanwhile, alt-right leader Richard Spencer dismissed Trump’s statement as “nonsense,” telling reporters at a news conference yesterday that "[only] a dumb person would take those lines seriously.” Spencer also said he did not consider the president’s words to be a condemnation of the white nationalist movement. “I don't think he condemned it, no,” said Spencer, whose group advocates for a form of American apartheid, per Business Insider. “Did he say 'white nationalist?' 'Racist' means an irrational hatred of people. I don't think he meant any of us.” Asked whether he considers Trump an ally, Spencer replied that while he didn't think of Trump as “alt-right,” he considers the president to be “the first true authentic nationalist in my lifetime.”

-- Compare Trump’s muted reaction to Charlottesville with his animated response last December to a similar incident in Columbus, another college town where an extremist plowed a car into a crowd of people. Abdul Razak Ali Artan, an Ohio State University student, drove a Honda sedan through a crowd outside a school building last November before emerging from the vehicle and slashing at people with a butcher knife. As president-elect, Trump flew to OSU to meet with survivors and praise the cop who shot the attacker. “This is a great honor for me today,” Trump told reporters during the visit. “We’re in a fantastic state that I love, Ohio.” One big difference: Artan was a Somali Muslim refugee. It's not even clear Trump has tried to call the mother of Charlottesville victim Heather Heyer.

-- In this context, Trump’s announcement that he is mulling a pardon for Joe Arpaio can be viewed as a strategic sop to mollify some of the most xenophobic elements of his nativist base. The president told Fox News in an interview published yesterday that he is “seriously considering” a full pardon to the former Arizona sheriff, who was convicted last month of criminal contempt for ignoring a federal judge’s order that he stop racially profiling Hispanics.

“I might do it right away, maybe early this week. I am seriously thinking about it,” the president told Gregg Jarrett. He called Arpaio a “great American patriot” who has “done a lot in the fight against illegal immigration”: “Is there anyone in local law enforcement who has done more to crack down on illegal immigration than Sheriff Joe? He doesn’t deserve to be treated this way.”

Washington Post

Re:Still trying to polish that turd ?

[Anonymous Coward]

there's no real history in the US of Antifa abusing anyone

So, how often does Moldylocks let you lick someone else's jizz out of her hairy Crevasse Of The People?

Shill harder. Communism is the very definition of failure.

Re:Whose fault is it...

[tbannist]

...that "politics and political agendas have sidelined the important mission of rebuilding America's manufacturing base..." The president has been doing what he can on the executive side on things like trade, vocational training, et al. The politics & political agendas that have been doing the sidelining have been things like the obsession w/ Russia, daily protests against the president, the fake news media (now including FNC) slamming him for everything he does. Trump is not the one who has been ignoring the issues involved w/ bringing manufacturing back into the country

What a load of bull shit. Trump could be working on things that matter regardless of the circus, but he's not and the only person to blame for that is Trump himself. We know Trump has spent over a 5th of his time in office at his personal golf courses. If he can spend time on that, and doesn't have time to work on a plan for manufacturing jobs, then we can clearly see where his priorities are.

Those guys who leave b'cos Trump failed to explicitly mention 'White Supremacists', as opposed to the implicit inclusion of them in his remarks, are precisely the people who allow their own politics & political agendas to sideline the missions for which they were on that council in the first place.

Trump has no problem specifically denouncing just about anyone else, so why does he have such a soft spot for the KKK?

Re:Whose fault is it...

[TrancePhreak]

So you want him to rule like a dictator? He should just force his policies on everyone instead of going through congress?

Slam political posturing with political posturing

[ebyrob]

Nice job Intel!!! Where did you dig this guy up?

I hope he's not making any important decisions for you, like oh, maybe putting vPro in everything... Oh wait, it's all starting to make sense now.

Re:Whose fault is it...

[MightyMartian]

Well, if there's one positive attribute of the Trump presidency, it's that Congress is going to pull back a whole lot of powers that it deferred to the Presidency over the last seventy years or so. Ringfencing Russia sanctions are only the beginning. I'll wager there's probably drafts of bills to prevent him from buggering up trade agreements, ringfence the FBI and a whole host of other initiatives that will come down the pike. The US Government is kind of like the Internet, it routes around damage, and while Trump can still do a lot of it, a good deal of the modern Presidential powers aren't in fact constitutional, but statutory.

"Politics and political agendas have sidelined the

[Anonymous Coward]

No shit, that's what you just let it do.

What winning looks like?

[Anonymous Coward]

So America, is this what winning looks like?
 
If so, then yes, we are doing so much winning I'm sick of winning.

Re:What winning looks like?

[Anonymous Coward]

So America, is this what winning looks like? If so, then yes, we are doing so much winning I'm sick of winning.

Speaking of "winning", why are so many southern rednecks proud of having ancestors who fought on the losing side of an armed insurrection?
And still, confusingly, equate "confederate" with "American" and "patriot" ??

Re:Whose fault is it...

[DickBreath]

Please do not post spoilers without spoiler alerts. It is impolite to those who don't see what is coming.

You Can't Always Get What You Want

[boudie2]

Every nation gets the government it deserves. Joseph de Maistre. (1860)

And Obama was so great at bringing us togethor

[Anonymous Coward]

This kind of shit makes me sick

Wise choice

[WillAffleckUW]

Very wise choice.

Re:Whose fault is it...

[Anonymous Coward]

We know Trump has spent over a 5th of his time in office at his personal golf courses. If he can spend time on that, and doesn't have time to work on a plan for manufacturing jobs, then we can clearly see where his priorities are.

He has also spent a third of his time lying in bed sleeping. 8 hours a day of total inactivity, disgraceful! Mr Trump, why do you hate America?

WTF?

[poofmeisterp]

What in the hell is a statement like that from a company I haven't seen an American-manufactured CPU from since the mid-late 90s? Plus the fact that he repeats the same shit over and over would indicate that he's not being truthful, and making sure the statement is received clearly to all that observe it. Simple psychology.....

P.S. I said MANUFACTURED, not "sold in the".

Re:WTF?

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm not sure what gave you this idea, but the majority of Intel fabs producing current products are still in the US.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

Re:WTF?

[poofmeisterp]

What gave me the idea is looking at every Intel chip I've held/worked with since the mid-90s and seeing it was manufactured in another country.

Re:Whose fault is it...

[Anonymous Coward]

Please do not post spoilers without spoiler alerts. It is impolite to those who don't see what is coming.

we're all going to die

oops, sorry

Re:Whose fault is it...

[DickBreath]

Not even a cliffhanger?

I'm just gonna leave this here...

[Shotgun]

politics and political agendas have sidelined the important mission of rebuilding America's manufacturing base. I resigned to call attention to the serious harm our divided political climate is causing to critical issues, including the serious need to address the decline of American manufacturing,"

Rephrase: Politics have sidelined the important mission, so I'm going to make a political statement as I quit the team working on the important mission.

face in palm.

Re:I'm just gonna leave this here...

[Anonymous Coward]

politics and political agendas have sidelined the important mission of rebuilding America's manufacturing base. I resigned to call attention to the serious harm our divided political climate is causing to critical issues, including the serious need to address the decline of American manufacturing,"

Rephrase: Politics have sidelined the important mission, so I'm going to make a political statement as I quit the team working on the important mission.

face in palm.

face in palm

Bad move

[Anonymous Coward]

AMD seems to get out with new cpu and gpu and gamers seem quite pro-trump.

Antifa

[Hylandr]

So the terrorists are winning then?

I'm buying AMD

[Anonymous Coward]

AMD is the savior of the WHITE RACE!

The productive sector doesn't care.

[Anonymous Coward]

Anybody who is actually a member of America's productive society doesn't care.

Re:Whose fault is it...

[penandpaper]

The bowels didn't evacuate... Or did they?

Hours later, Trump walks back his denouncement

[dcollins]

Predictably. Anyone waiting all weekend, and watching the brief/terse statement on Monday, could see that his heart was totally not into it. Especially considering his willingness to attack anything else that moves under the sun at the drop of a hat.

NY Times, Aug-15, 4:30 PM:

A Combative Trump Criticizes ‘Alt-Left’ Groups in Charlottesville

David Duke, Aug-15, 4:45 PM:

Thank you President Trump for your honesty & courage to tell the truth about #Charlottesville & condemn the leftist terrorists in BLM/Antifa https://twitter.com/NBCNews/status/897554574663442432

Re:Hours later, Trump walks back his denouncement

[Baron_Yam]

And yet, a good portion of the USA will continue to support him because he's supposedly on their 'team'. And they think he'll deliver on the promises he made them that were never possible to deliver on in the first place. His ongoing supporters will include a surprising percentage of women, Muslims, and Hispanics, and people who think they can get a fair deal from him. Perhaps those numbers are dropping over time as reality sets in.

He's unfit by temperament and education at a minimum... but everyone around him keeps making excuses and blaming left-wing conspiracies. And he's the leader of the most powerful nation in the world, which makes it all that much more amazing (and horrifying) that he hasn't been run out of town yet.

Re:Whose fault is it...

[HiThere]

Well, that's a optimistic take on a miserable situation. I hope you're right.

Intel hates America. News at 11.

[sethstorm]

Intel has now shown that their commitment to America is just to provide a PR piece.

Re:Whose fault is it...

[Anonymous Coward]

Although I agree with the sentiment, I think the real benefit will be that the next election will be won on constitutional change, the real fight will be about providing a better political system for the voters. This whole debacle has done nothing but highlight all the inadequacies of the current system from the electoral college, congress to the Presidency it is all broken and it all needs change. And candidates that come forward and offer that change will the candidates that prosper in the next election.

And two more are out...

[denzacar]

From TFA:

Resigned from council

Elon Musk, Tesla
Ken Frazier, Merck & Co., Inc.
Kevin Plank, Under Armour
Brian Krzanich, Intel
Scott Paul, Alliance for American Manufacturing
On Tuesday, August 15th, Scott Paul announced on Twitter that he was leaving because it was the "right thing for me to do."
Richard Trumka, AFL-CIO

No longer CEOs (still listed on White House web site)

Klaus Kleinfeld, Arconic
Mark Fields, Ford Motor Company
Mario Longhi, U.S. Steel
Doug Oberhelman, Caterpillar

Currently on council

Andrew Liveris, The Dow Chemical Company
The Dow Chemical Company said Liveris would remain on the council.
Bill Brown, Harris Corporation
Harris declined to comment.
Michael Dell, Dell Technologies
Dell declined to say whether Michael Dell would leave the council.
John Ferriola, Nucor Corporation
Jeff Fettig, Whirlpool Corporation
"The company will continue on the Manufacturing Jobs Initiative to represent our industry, our 15,000 U.S. workers, and to provide input and advice on ways to create jobs and strengthen U.S. manufacturing competitiveness," a Whirlpool spokesperson told Yahoo Finance.
Alex Gorsky, Johnson & Johnson
Greg Hayes, United Technologies Corp.
Marillyn A. Hewson, Lockheed Martin Corporation
A Lockheed Martin spokesperson declined to comment.
Jeff Immelt, General Electric
GE said its non-executive chair Immelt will remain on the council.
Jim Kamsickas, Dana Inc.
Rich Kyle, The Timken Company
Thea Lee, AFL-CIO
Denise Morrison, Campbell Soup Company
The company strongly condemned the attack, but Morrison will stay on the council "to have a voice and provide input on matters that will affect our industry, our company and our employees in support of growth."
Dennis Muilenburg, Boeing
Michael Polk, Newell Brands
Mark Sutton, International Paper
According to Business Insider, the company will remain on the council.
Inge Thulin, 3M
Wendell Weeks, Corning