Linux Foundation President Used MacOS For Presentation at Open Source Summit (itsfoss.com)

Slashdot reader mschaffer writes:It appears that Jim Zemlin, President of the Linux Foundation, was using MacOS while declaring "2017 is officially the year of the Linux desktop!" at the Open Source Summit 2017. This was observed by several YouTube channels: Switched to Linux and The Lunduke Show. Finally it was reported by It's FOSS.

if, indeed, this is the year of desktop Linux, why oh why cannot people like Zemlin present a simple slide presentation -- let alone actually use a Linux distro for work.
A security developer at Google has now "spotted Jim Zemlin using Apple's macOS twice in last four years," according to the article, which complains the Foundation's admirable efforts on cloud/container technology has them neglecting Linux on the desktop.

Ironically, in March Zemlin told a cloud conference that organizations that "don't harvest the shared innovation" of open source "will fail."

Comments

Coherence lack.

[Anonymous Coward]

Inuff said.

Presenter laptop

[Anonymous Coward]

When I present, usually my slides are loaded onto a conference laptop.

Re:Presenter laptop

[Anonymous Coward]

id like to think this is true, but i do a lot of tech presentations and its in fact rare that you aren't able to use your laptop.
I suspect its because there are other issues when copying stuff over to another laptop with different programs, including licensing issues, compat, etc.

Re:Presenter laptop

[Anonymous Coward]

Even at most of the national conferences that I present at, I usually use my own laptop.

Re: Presenter laptop

[Anonymous Coward]

A) it's an OPEN SOURCE conference

B) the person who spotted it said he was creating the slides on an Apple device, not presenting

You jabronis who modded this +5 insightful should RTFA before grading the comments people make.

Re:Presenter laptop

[stooo]

>> When I present, usually my slides are loaded onto a conference laptop.
1) You shouldn't do that
2) that Laptop was never an Apple one.

Re:Presenter laptop

[codeButcher]

Same here. The slides are also uploaded somewhere afterwards for interested parties to look at.

At the moment, I do the presentation in Libre Office, then export it to PDF. So no fancy effects, but looks OK and is portable to whatever your computer runs.

Then again, I'm not a Linux evangelist.

Re:Presenter laptop

[Anonymous Coward]

You obviously didn't bother to read the story which reports the person in question using OS X on a plane before ever reaching the conference to use any "conference laptop". And has been doing so for years.

Re:Presenter laptop

[OneSizeFitsNoone]

All Linux Foundation conferences I attended there was no conference laptop, every talk was presented from the talker's own. But maybe keynotes are delivered from the conference's.

Obligatory Nelson Muntz quote

[quonset]

Ha ha!

Because

[Anonymous Coward]

There is no good software for presentations on Linux that compares to Keynote or PowerPoint.

Also - a presentation already in Keynote or PowerPoint doesn't convert so easily.

Finally - who the fuck cares it's a presentation. When Microsoft or Apple made presentations about early revs of Windows or MacOS do you think anyone cared that they used transparencies and a projector?

Re:Because

[0100010001010011]

There is no good software for presentations on Linux that compares to Keynote or PowerPoint.

Jupyter Notebooks presentation mode is great.

It is lacking in key features like "Word Art", but for a technical presentation it's pretty good.

Re:Because

[chipschap]

There is no good software for presentations on Linux that compares to Keynote or PowerPoint.

I've found this to be true only at very extreme levels of flashiness where razzle and dazzle are more important than content, and you want people paying attention to the special effects rather than the point you're trying to get across, if there even is one.

The most probable scenario for this, in my own experience, is suits selling expensive stuff to suits ... stuff that the salesman doesn't really understand and the prospective buyer maybe isn't capable of understanding.

Short of that, if you, you know, actually want to get a message across, Linux has all sorts of excellent options.

Re:Because

[sombragris]

I'm no Apple user so I don't know about Keynote. But for ensuring compatibility, I make sure that my wife's PowerPoint presentations are all converted to PDF.

Anyway, in Linux you could use Impress, which is more than enough for most people in need of a graphical slide editor.

As for me, in my lectures I use Beamer in LaTeX, which is more than enough for my needs. And its output is, again, PDF.

I can project anything of these with Okular in presentation mode, easily. So I think Linux is more than capable in the area.

Re:Because

[Anonymous Coward]

Uh, what's wrong with LibreOffice Impress?

Re:Because

[exomondo]

It isn't just software for presentations though, whether you're doing visual design, image manipulation, video production, audio production, CAD, CAM, CAE, 3D modeling, etc... you're almost always better off with a Mac or Windows machine because even in the outside case where one of the products you use is available on Linux and is best suited for that particular task (say Blender for a lot of 3D modeling tasks) it is almost always available on Mac and Windows too so you don't have to be hobbled in all your other tasks by a lack of software due to the choice of operating system. It's not as though an application like Blender is any different on Linux, Mac or Windows because the operating system itself isn't offering any compelling feature and you could certainly argue that is appropriate as the OS's job is to run the software.

Yes certainly Windows 10 has gotten itself a bit of a privacy stigma hole that Microsoft is trying to dig it out of but macOS doesn't suffer this and in the corporate environment Windows is able to be controlled enough that this isn't a big deal so hoping for the competition to fail isn't really a viable option.

What you need to ask yourself is what, as a normal pragmatic user, makes a Linux system a better option?

Re: Because

[Anonymous Coward]

Have you ever presented at an actual business? The razzle dazzle is the only part that counts at the end of the day.

Re: Because

[chipschap]

Have you ever presented at an actual business? The razzle dazzle is the only part that counts at the end of the day.

Presented stuff many, many times, but to be fair, it was almost always technical stuff where content mattered.

Re:Because

[chipschap]

You raise valid questions, but the original assertion was that Linux doesn't have decent presentation software, and the scope of my reply including that, and no more.

But I will answer you briefly: Linux offers openness, freedom, and control. It also does everything I need with increasingly little in the way of limitations for the things I need to do. That's why I use it. Whether that line of thought and practice provides a sufficient business case for others is up to them to decide. Obviously, we should use what works for us. I'm not at all from the school that says everyone should be on Linux. Some should, some shouldn't, and for many it probably doesn't matter either way.

Re:Because

[exomondo]

Yes, apologies for broadening the scope. I didn't mean to imply that your response was one to be applied to everything.

I certainly see why some people use it, I don't use it exclusively but I do use it in scenarios where it is the most appropriate choice. It just so happens those are very niche.

Re:Because

[sombragris]

Agreed with parent. And in addition, the examples offered by grandparent are corner cases. Most desktop work is done in an office suite and/or a Web browser. In both regards, Linux is well covered.

Re:Because

[rrohbeck]

I use LibreOffice. Never had a problem with PowerPoint compatibility in either direction.

Re:Because

[Anonymous Coward]

Most desktop work is done in an office suite and/or a Web browser. In both regards, Linux is well covered.

In that case the operating system doesnt matter at all so why bother using something different to all the people in your organization to which the operating system does matter? Case in point there was no reason for Jim Zemlin to use Linux over Mac in his presentation so he just used Mac.

Re: Because

[Anonymous Coward]

I disagree. Linux does everything for me on the desktop that I need. I don't even need windows at all. Unfortunately, Jim zemlin agrees with you.

Re:Because

[sa666_666]

Most desktop work is done in an office suite and/or a Web browser. In both regards, Linux is well covered.

In that case the operating system doesnt matter at all so why bother using something different to all the people in your organization to which the operating system does matter? Case in point there was no reason for Jim Zemlin to use Linux over Mac in his presentation so he just used Mac.

It's called "eating your own dogfood". It's disingenuous to promote a platform without at least using it yourself.

Re:Because

[dknj]

You get "Word Art" with inkscape.

Although it is 2017, and LibreOffice requires an external editor to launch. There's no excuse why we can't embed Inkscape, Dia, Xmind, etc. directly into LibreOffice when the user adds a file of that type to the document..

-dk

Re:Because

[sombragris]

In that case the operating system doesnt matter at all so why bother using something different to all the people in your organization to which the operating system does matter?

Fair question. First, I'll give you an answer which was already offered in this thread:

But I will answer you briefly: Linux offers openness, freedom, and control. It also does everything I need with increasingly little in the way of limitations for the things I need to do. That's why I use it. Whether that line of thought and practice provides a sufficient business case for others is up to them to decide. Obviously, we should use what works for us.

Second, as for using "something different to all the people in my organization", I'm my own organization. I work for myself so I get to choose my platform.

Re:Because

[andydread]

for those of us actually out in the field doing the hard work of switching small businesses to Linux that statement is rarely true. Quickbooks unfortunately doesn't run on Linux and when you setup a samba server it does not work with more than one user. I'm afraid I have to inform you that many many small businesses probably the majority cannot use Linux on the desktop if they need Quickbooks and unfortunately, at least here in the USA most of them use Quickbooks.

Re:Because

[sproketboy]

Keep apologizing.

Re:Because

[chipschap]

Then why are you (presumably) in the business of switching small businesses to Linux, if it won't work for them?

As I've made clear above, I'm all for Linux because it's right for me (and many, many others).

But if it's not a fit, and something else is ... leave things alone.

Re:Because

[emaname]

I use LibreOffice. Never had a problem with PowerPoint compatibility in either direction.

I used to say that.

Last April I was given a MS PPT to convert to LibreOffice. The bullets changed (and not in a good way), the font changed, all the indents changed, all the animations stopped working, and there were problems with some of the images. Essentially I had to recreate the entire presentation.

Then when I tried moving it back, everything fell apart again regardless in which file format I "saved as."

There was a time when I could create PPT presentations and move them between OSes. It doesn't appear to be that way anymore.

BTW, I had all the MS fonts installed on my Linux machine, the most recent kernel, and most recent LibreOffice. My distro uses rolling updates. Didn't matter.

LibreOffice still has work to do. I'll still promote it to people I know. But it still needs work.

Re:Because

[kenh]

Sun's Scott McNealy cared - he cared a lot.

Re: Because

[bill_mcgonigle]

Have you ever presented at an actual business? The razzle dazzle is the only part that counts at the end of the day.

Depends on the business. This may be true if you're presenting to idiots or if presentations never existed before 2002.

Frankly, reveal.js is all most people need who can hack out some trivial HTML - you'll save tons of time nudging around layouts. You should only be illustrating your talk with slides anyway.

Re:Because

[kenh]

why bother using something different to all the people in your organization to which the operating system does matter? Case in point there was no reason for Jim Zemlin to use Linux over Mac in his presentation so he just used Mac.

Did you forget that Jim Zemlin is President of the Linux Foundation? If Jim is using a MacOS laptop because that's what everyone in his organization uses, then that begs the question even harder - how can the Linux Foundation argue convincingly that Linux is poised to take over the desktop if the Linux Foundation can't/hasn't cut over their operations to Linux?

Re:Because

[kenh]

His ORGANIZATION is the Linux Foundation, does no one there use Linux on their desktop?

Re:Because

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes that is precisely the point I am making. If he is indifferent to the operating system then it should be no surprise to anybody that 97%+ of personal computer users use Windows and/or Mac.

Re:Because

[Anonymous Coward]

And in addition, the examples offered by grandparent are corner cases.

So Linux provides the lowest common denominator of computing: The office work that can be done on pretty much any computer with a keyboard and mouse. While everything else (what you deemed "corner cases") is handled by Windows and Mac.

Whenever somebody suggests something you can't do on Linux the evangelists pop up calling it a "corner case", like all the ways in which The GIMP is inferior to Photoshop for example. But the fact is all these "corner cases" add up to defining pretty much all desktop computing that isnt the most basic office work.

The Linux community more broadly needs to *address* these "corner cases" rather than constantly dismissing them. Even if Linux did a fine job of solving 90% of the use cases for 90% of the users when Windows or Mac solves 100% of their use cases then obviously they are going to choose that instead.

Re: Because

[exomondo]

If it does everything you want then great, but most people are interested in running their applications rather than caring what operating system is running. There are certainly applications that run on macOS that do not run on Linux, maybe Jim Zemlin needs (or prefers) one of those or perhaps there is some feature in macOS that he likes that Linux-based operating systems do not provide.

Yes as the head of the Linux Foundation giving a presentation on mainstream usage of Linux that does send a bad message but outside of that role why should he use Linux over macOS? Like what is it that Linux offers to the average desktop user that macOS and Windows do not?

Re:Because

[Anonymous Coward]

What the Linux community would have to do to get those apps is make them easy to port from Windows and Mac OS code, and unfortunately that would mean re-implementing huge amounts of stuff in Win32, .Net, Apple's Cocoa, etc.

Stuff like Mono and GNUStep is interesting but won't get you very far, especially when so much is kept proprietary (like the Quartz layer). Plus it would kind of defeat the purpose of using Linux, POSIX APIs and all that, if you have to port all the layers instead of just your business logic.

It's the old Catch-22: Linux won't succeed on the desktop without apps, but the apps won't get written until Linux succeeds on the desktop.

Re:Because

[Ol Olsoc]

I use LibreOffice. Never had a problem with PowerPoint compatibility in either direction.

I used to say that.

Last April I was given a MS PPT to convert to LibreOffice. The bullets changed (and not in a good way), the font changed, all the indents changed, all the animations stopped working, and there were problems with some of the images.

I've had that happen from one Windows machine to another. Or Windows to MacOS. Or MacOS to Windows. Office is simply not compatible with anything - including itself. This is exactly why I insisted on the presentation running on a vetted laptop where the presentation was opened, saved, and all slides veerified if MO was used.

There is only one Office suite that works on all three, and is compatible between all three. And that is AO.

Re:Because

[thegarbz]

LibreOffice still has work to do.

I wonder if they do, your example sounds familiar to me .... without ever leaving Powerpoint. Duplicating slides, copying and pasting content, even copying and pasting formatting, or moving a slide from one presentation to the other (selecting either keep source formatting or use destination) has frequently resulted in messed up formatting for me.

I've also had that between different computers where something that looked fine on my laptop suddenly ran off the edge of the page on the presentation machine, even on the same version of MS Office.

Re:Because

[jandersen]

That is funny - I usually have to repair my wife's presentations, that she has made in Windows - and I use Impress for that. It may be she is just very bad at it and/or I'm very clever, but just saying. How compatible and what is best probably depends on the person and how they use it.

LibreOffice still has work to do. I'll still promote it to people I know. But it still needs work.

Perhaps that is so - although, I am not a fan of always heaping more and more functionality onto a program that is mostly meant for writing smaller documents and that sort of thing. Of course, I don't actually write much that would fit into any word processor - I mostly write maths, so use LaTeX.

Re:Because

[MMC Monster]

I use Linux as my main home computer since ~2004.

That being said, I keep one macbook at home for presentations (it's the only non-linux computer I own).

I haven't tried Impress in a while. Maybe it's gotten better.

But Keynote has drag-n-drop videos, beautiful master slide sets, pretty transitions, and supports multiple monitors with the ability to show one slide on the projector while previewing the next on the laptop monitor.

Now, do the shiney and pretty effects matter during a presentation? Absolutely. I'm not generally giving presentations to a bunch of tech guys or PhD candidates. I give them to adults with (at best) a high school diploma. And they like things with a little pizazz.

Re:Because

[houghi]

I have seen people do presentations on PDF. I have seen people use Notepad++. I have seen I have seen people using the whiteboard only.

If you depend on the software to do the presentation, just hand out the printouts and stop wasting my time.
I hate it when they hand then out afterwards. That means either you di not present it very well as I need to re-read it and you wasted my time or you wasted the pape as I will never re-read it, Send/give it upfront. That way you can do a fast presentation and there will be more time to FAQ or coffee.

So yes, Linux does have technical solutions, but giving a good presentation is a social problem.

Re:Because

[poet]

I present original content dozens of times a year. Libreoffice is good but not that good. It has a clunky interface, it is hard to customize slides in a way that is productive and has odd "irks". Due to these limitations (and I have been using Libreoffice since it was StarOffice), I have recently switched to Google Slides. I actually write my talks in Google Slides and then download them as ODP and open them in Libreoffice for final publish. That said, I would argue that Libreoffice is 100% fine for 95% of presenters. I have also worked with Power Point and it is miles ahead of Libreoffice in terms of usability and consistency. I think as Free/Open Software people we tend to use our ideology to justify our bad software.

Re:Because

[chipschap]

This ignores the fact that Linux solves 100% of the use cases for a large percentage of users, and might be chosen by them because it's free and open.

I keep hearing things like "LibreOffice is inferior to MS Office" and "GIMP is inferior to Photoshop" when in fact the same arguments apply: LO and GIMP probably provide what 90% of users need. The upper end market, who truly need (say) Photoshop, are indeed corner cases.

I do a lot more than web surfing and office suite stuff, and Linux satisfies 100% of my use cases. The last remaining "lack" had been decent scanning and OCR but that's been solved now for several years. As to GIMP, I've done book covers, posters, flyers, etc. with no problem.

Re:Because

[TheFakeTimCook]

There is no good software for presentations on Linux that compares to Keynote or PowerPoint.

I've found this to be true only at very extreme levels of flashiness where razzle and dazzle are more important than content, and you want people paying attention to the special effects rather than the point you're trying to get across, if there even is one.

The most probable scenario for this, in my own experience, is suits selling expensive stuff to suits ... stuff that the salesman doesn't really understand and the prospective buyer maybe isn't capable of understanding.

Short of that, if you, you know, actually want to get a message across, Linux has all sorts of excellent options.

Linux people are even more clueless about "polish" than Windows people.

And that's saying something...

Re:Because

[TheFakeTimCook]

His ORGANIZATION is the Linux Foundation, does no one there use Linux on their desktop?

Don't dangle that kind of phrase out... You're REALLY asking for it!

But, I'll be nice. This time. ;-)

Re:Because

[TheFakeTimCook]

I'm no Apple user so I don't know about Keynote. But for ensuring compatibility, I make sure that my wife's PowerPoint presentations are all converted to PDF.

Keynote (like almost ALL Applications on macOS), can easily output to PDF. PDF support is (and always has been) built into the OS itself.

Re:Because

[Plumpaquatsch]

His ORGANIZATION is the Linux Foundation, does no one there use Linux on their desktop?

They don't have desktops, only MacBooks.

Re:Because

[Anonymous Coward]

I keep hearing things like "LibreOffice is inferior to MS Office" and "GIMP is inferior to Photoshop" when in fact the same arguments apply: LO and GIMP probably provide what 90% of users need. The upper end market, who truly need (say) Photoshop, are indeed corner cases.

The corner cases are important, why choose an alternative platform that supports 90% of things when the incumbent platform supports 100% of them?

As to GIMP, I've done book covers, posters, flyers, etc. with no problem.

Nobody is saying you cant do those things but you dont disrupt an established status quo by being 90% as capable or even equally capable, you need to be *better* than the incumbent(s). That is how Linux succeeded so spectacularly in the embedded world and how the iPhone took over the smartphone market. It is also how Windows Phone, webOS, FirefoxOS, etc failed so spectacularly in the smartphone market. Sure you could do the basic stuff like web browsing, email, IM and various apps but they werent actually any better than the incumbents.

It's frustrating to see so many Linux advocates just dismiss all criticism with the response "well it works fine for me" because we all benefit from addressing those concerns as this broadens the usage which creates that positive feedback loop of more users gets more support from both hardware and software vendors.

Re:Because

[chipschap]

The corner cases are important, why choose an alternative platform that supports 90% of things when the incumbent platform supports 100% of them?

Because, as I've said many times: freedom, control, openness.

Of course we all want to see Linux broaden its appeal. And you make a decent point by saying that Linux has to offer something more in order to get people to look at it. I believe that freedom, control, and openness --- especially freedom from built-in spyware --- are good selling points.

The big elephant in the room hasn't come up in this thread, which is surprising. High-end gamers are probably always going to be on Windows, and they're a big enough group not to be considered a corner case. My opinion and use cases might be different if up-to-date gaming was of interest to me. But my checkers, chess, go, and Skat programs all run with Linux Wine. That actually says a lot as to how far Wine has come, but it's certainly not the answer to everything or even most things.

Re:Because

[Anonymous Coward]

There is only one Office suite that works on all three, and is compatible between all three. And that is AO.

Or Office365. Microsoft, of all companies, has been the one to abstract their Office suite away from the OS and make it OS agnostic by putting it on the web.

Re:Because

[Ol Olsoc]

There is only one Office suite that works on all three, and is compatible between all three. And that is AO.

Or Office365. Microsoft, of all companies, has been the one to abstract their Office suite away from the OS and make it OS agnostic by putting it on the web.

Unless there has been a drastic change, opening up a PowerPoint that was composed on a Windows machine then on a Mac, gives fascinating results, and you would not want to wager a cup of coffee, much less your job on them looking like they did as originally composed.

This is argument form experience.

Re:Because

[Anonymous Coward]

There is no good software for presentations on Linux that compares to Keynote or PowerPoint.

I've found this to be true only at very extreme levels of flashiness where razzle and dazzle are more important than content, and you want people paying attention to the special effects rather than the point you're trying to get across, if there even is one.

Hear, hear !

If you only need to talk to the main points on the slides, especially to a technical audience
who are more than capable of following up on the main points for themselves, then there's
even MagicPoint (http://member.wide.ad.jp/wg/mgp/)

      - Magic Point is an X11 based presentation tool
      - Sources are in plain text
      - Output is rendered onto the X11 display, so just redirect your laptop's display to the conference's mega-screen and away you go.

and, if you need PDF for the conference to serve up as the archived presentation,
then MagicPoint will produce PostScript, or render the slides as PNGs.

Re:Because

[Anonymous Coward]

Linux user here, I have always done resumes as pdf files. They have the best compatibility of any rich file format I can think of.

Re:Because

[Anonymous Coward]

I used to do tech support for faculty at a research university, and had one professor bring me her PowerPoint presentation which she was due to present, and all the videos failed to play.

She had copied the presentation onto a department-owned laptop (Windows XP) to do the presentation, so I checked to make sure the source videos were all on the hard drive - which they were.

However, she had copied the presentation way deep into the filesystem hierarchy, something like C:\Users\Guest\Department\Documents\Conference\Presentations\Saturday\ blah blah blah.

I remembered in the back of my mind something about paths in Windows being limited to 255 characters or thereabouts, so I copied the whole presentation and source videos up to C:\Users\Guest\Desktop and the videos played fine.

Sometimes things don't even have to be converted to fail...

Re:Because

[Ol Olsoc]

However, she had copied the presentation way deep into the filesystem hierarchy, something like C:\Users\Guest\Department\Documents\Conference\Presentations\Saturday\ blah blah blah.

I remembered in the back of my mind something about paths in Windows being limited to 255 characters or thereabouts, so I copied the whole presentation and source videos up to C:\Users\Guest\Desktop and the videos played fine.

Sometimes things don't even have to be converted to fail...

I call these "Stupid Windows tricks" and assign a big number to them. All manner of amazing things, like people not finishing a CD, which you can't do anything about, to the pretend long filenames they had. Using weird fonts that are only on their machine, Microsoft getting ito a bitchfight with a popular codec provider, so they removed the codec, and left you high and dry.

This can happen even if you pre-flight the things. We had a dry run once the evening before a big meeting and everything worked. Our IT department pushed an update in the middle of the night, and the next morning no one's video worked. Of course, the IT department only checked if Office Word and Excel opened. The only cure we ever came up with was for me to use my own special case laptop, which was independent of the local network, and not updated until I said it was.

My hatred of Microsoft is well earned.

Isn't it obvious?

[Anonymous Coward]

Linux has become so good on the desktop that it is now indistinguishable from MacOS if you don't know the tells. He thinks he's using Linux.

Re: Easy

[Anonymous Coward]

Please also tell us your theories on how Trump was behind 9/11!

Rule 1: Eat your dog food.

[140Mandak262Jamuna]

MsDev is very good for the developers because Microsoft is using it to develop Windows and Office. MsDev is a nightmare for the build group building very large applications. because, Microsoft is not using the recommended build process in MsDev to develop and deploy Windows and MsOffice.

Don't harv. shared innovation will fail ...

[aliquis]

Well, maybe he's still living it.

Maybe there just haven't been any shared innovation on the Linux desktop. Ever thought about that? ;D

Re:Don't harv. shared innovation will fail ...

[gmack]

Or it's just that Jim Zemlin doesn't really get open source or it's community. Remember that this is the clueless blowhard that thought people joined the Linux Foundation to get free stuff.

Entirely normal

[Anonymous Coward]

That's entirely normal. Those machines belong to the conference and presenters supposedly have no say. I guess people are expecting everyone to be paranoid like rms when it comes to commercial software (or more recently, open source software such as LLVM.)

Even rms gave one of his TED(x?) talks from a Windows machine. Stop being paranoid.

Re:Entirely normal

[Anonymous Coward]

When you're presenting your case for going vegan you don't stuff your face with the slow-cooked beef cheek because that's what the conference catered for you.

You constantly hear Linux advocates talk about how the systems on shop shelves are Windows and so users buy them and just use whatever is installed, this just reinforces the point that that is an entirely practical and acceptable approach for users to take. Sure you *could* use Linux, but there is no reason to proactively bother with it, if your system is a mac or windows then just use that.

Re:Entirely normal

[nomadic]

"That's entirely normal. Those machines belong to the conference and presenters supposedly have no say."

The linked story notes he was observed creating the presentation on a mac laptop. On an airplane.

Anonymous Coward

[Anonymous Coward]

Wishes you a good night.

IOW, do as I say...

[GerryGilmore]

...not as I do. Horrible! As someone who ran a presentation to Intel execs back in 2003 using OO running under Linux on an Itanium, I call Bullshit(TM) on anyone who says "Oh - nothing else measures up to Powerpoint!".

Re: IOW, do as I say...

[Anonymous Coward]

And the fact you haven't had a job since then says what?

Re:IOW, do as I say...

[MangoCats]

Apathy, lack of caring about political posture - not willing to eat his own dog food.

People in positions like that should be more sensitive to appearances, I'm sure in his mind it's not a big deal, which is why his mind should be in another line of work.

Re:IOW, do as I say...

[Registered Coward v2]

...not as I do. Horrible! As someone who ran a presentation to Intel execs back in 2003 using OO running under Linux on an Itanium, I call Bullshit(TM) on anyone who says "Oh - nothing else measures up to Powerpoint!".

True. There are many options for making boring presentations full of useless eye candy...

Re:IOW, do as I say...

[kenh]

Was that an itanium laptop? I'd love to hear more about your running a presentation off a laptop running a server chip.

Re:IOW, do as I say...

[thegarbz]

"Oh - nothing else measures up to Powerpoint!"

There are many software packages from Microsoft that are irreplaceable. Powerpoint is not one of them. If anything it is pretty damn close to the bottom of the pile in terms of capability.

Re:IOW, do as I say...

[jeremyp]

Your assessment of Powerpoint and Open Office is based on one use-case from 14 years ago that didn't involve Powerpoint?

I say BS to that.

Dogfood

[NaCh0]

Do you want to know the best way for an executive to give an out of touch presentation?

Don't use your own product.

What this guy does isn't a huge deal, but if he had personal trouble with the linux desktop, perhaps he or most likely one of the developers under his influence would scratch that itch for all of us. Leadership is a tough thing when you don't live by example.

Re:Dogfood

[DontBeAMoran]

Do you want to know the best way for an executive to give an out of touch presentation? Don't use your own product.

I guess that explains Tim Cook and the complete lack of updates for some Macs, laughable updates for others and for-the-rich-only Macs.

Re:Dogfood

[MangoCats]

Back in the late 90s I was working with a bunch of guys who were promoting a new product idea that ran on Palm Pilots - it took a while to convince them that they really should own, carry and use Palm Pilots themselves if they wanted to make the most effective pitches to the VCs. They finally did, and just after they did they hooked up with a VC that gave them actual funding.

Re: Dogfood

[Anonymous Coward]

Did you think maybe the computer used for the presentation wasn't his? I've been to a lot of conferences that required speakers to use the location's computers.

Re:Dogfood

[Anonymous Coward]

This is neither here nor there, but I'm pretty sure that Microsofties came up with the phrase "eat our own dogfood" (yum!) back in the '90s.

Re: Dogfood

[kenh]

Did you think maybe the computer used for the presentation wasn't his? I've been to a lot of conferences that required speakers to use the location's computers.

Follow the links, he was spotted using MacOS to create the slides AND present them.

Oh wait, it's Slashdot - nevermind - just make up any reasonable motivation and ignore any actual facts in the linked-to article.

Re:Dogfood

[jwymanm]

Awesome post. I'm hoping this guy, if even knows how to use Linux Desktops or if he is just a hired figurehead that has connections, might consider it after this press. "As the Executive Director of The Linux Foundation since its inception, Zemlin has had a hand in every major decision in the history of the foundation and its projects." - wikipedia - This right here alone is even more reason for him to use Linux only (or at least mostly).

Re:Dogfood

[HiThere]

Possibly so, but (almost) irrelevant. This guy was representing the Linux Foundation at a public event. And the Linux Foundation nominally pushes Linux, so he should have been using Linux. That he wasn't, however, isn't surprising given the actual historic trends of Linux Foundation actions.

Re:Dogfood

[TheFakeTimCook]

Do you want to know the best way for an executive to give an out of touch presentation? Don't use your own product.

I guess that explains Tim Cook and the complete lack of updates for some Macs, laughable updates for others and for-the-rich-only Macs.

Wow! Off-Topic much?

Re: Easy

[Anonymous Coward]

Drumpf did SystemD on 9/11 he is finished now in peach!

tldr:linux foundation president doesnt have a wind

[mSparks43]

My desktop has been linux for maybe 9 years now. started centos 5 with no windows boot after dual booting fedora/windows since the 90s.

Year of the linux desktop kinda irrelevent now isn't it? Linux devices have had the lions share of global cpu cycles since the samsung s5. Even microsoft released its flagship visual studio product for generic linux in recent years, and office runs on android linux natively for a while, not that you need it now libreoffice has the ribbon ui. China and Russia and many other countries have linux variants.

Only guys waiting for the linux desktop are the people who don't earn enough to buy a semi decent phone.

Can We Get Confirmation?

[ytene]

If true, this story would be disappointing, because of the hypocrisy if for no other reason. I've searched for articles or photographic proof of the claim but not found any yet... There are images of the presentation up and running, but the display shows an all-screen slide and it isn't possible to definitively identify the operating software.

The only reason I ask [and I don't have an opinion on the claim one way or the other] is because I'm aware of several friends of mine who run both Windows and Linux on MacBook Pro hardware. Their justification is that even though it's crazy-expensive, the Apple MacBook Pro hardware is among the very best available today, hence their use of the product. I make this additional observation because if Zemlin walked in to the theatre / hall carrying a MacBook Pro it would be easy to conclude that he was running MacOS. However, until there is actual concrete proof, nobody can say with certainty what OS the guy is running.

Perfectly happy to express my disappointment when the evidence is on the table, but until then...

Re:Can We Get Confirmation?

[lucm]

If true, this story would be disappointing, because of the hypocrisy if for no other reason. I've searched for articles or photographic proof of the claim but not found any yet...

None of the two Youtube links offer proof. They both manage to talk about it for 18 minutes, repeating over and over what is basically already in the title of their videos, and one of them is mentioning the other. But no evidence is offered.

Not only that, but in both videos they assume the guy doesn't use Linux at all, based on the alleged fact that he did a presentation using an iPad.

I guess we'll never know if it's true because now the the focus is not on facts anymore, every source will just start quoting each other.

Re:Can We Get Confirmation?

[kenh]

The "It's FOSS" link has a tweet claiming he was spotted creating the presentation slides on a MacOS laptop.

Re:Can We Get Confirmation?

[mentil]

evidence is offered [...] the guy doesn't use Linux at all

BURN THE WITCH! /s

Re:tldr:linux foundation president doesnt have a w

[pak9rabid]

My desktop has been linux for maybe 9 years now. started centos 5 with no windows boot after dual booting fedora/windows since the 90s.

I'm pretty sure Fedora didn't exist in the '90s. I assume you mean Red Hat?

The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[williamyf]

My FOSS days started in 1995 with FreeBSD, and then in 1996 with Linux (Slackware Unleashed, I forget the Version) in the University, then I was a firm proponent on the server side... I've been hearing about the linux desktop for a loooong time...

But, that was 22 years ago. Nowadays, in a production desktop, I have some requirements, which are quite different from the requirements on a Phone, or a Kiosk, or a retail point, or a computer for Kids/Schools:

* I want the power of an OpenSource Unix (Darwin) under the Hood, wrapped in a slick GUI (sadly, propiertary) that makes my workflow Easier and does not change all of the sudden (BTW, Ubuntians, how's the Transition from MIR/Unity to Wayland GNOME going?).

* Also, is nice if the Hardware in which that software resides is well built, and all the drivers play nice (granted, thanks to things like Dell's project MIR, this is easier nowadays with Linux too). I have stuff to do. Playing decetvive with drivers and libraries was entertaining in 2002 (last time I did that). Nowadays, not so much, quite the contrary, very, very frustrating!!!

* Also, I want commonly used productivity Software available, no matter if it is FOSS or Closed. The dektop/laptop is a TOOL for Production, I want to use the most suitable tools to do my work. For instance, when I was teaching at the university, I did Everything using LibreOffice (for MAC). When I started doing technical training for Telco OpenStack Cloud (Huawei's Flavour) and Hadoop/Spark/Storm (Nokia's CEMoD 16), I pretty much had to use Office. otherwise, the powerpoints would loose all formatting, and it would take ages to fix that (and no one paid me to fix it), Macros in the Excel report sheets would be borked. Also, many iLO/IPIMI/Javascript crap would not work on Linux... You get the drift.

* But, from time to time I have to unwind. I want the available games in steam for my machine to cont in the Thousands, not in the hundreds...

* Speaking of telco clouds: What do you think those clouds used? If you guessed KVM, Redhat, CentOS, SuSE, Apache, Puppet, MariaDB, Postgres, yarn, etc, you are right, come collect your prize. The requirements for servers are different than from desktop, which in turn are different from cellphones, which in turn are different from kids/school computers, which in turn are different from ... you get the idea!!!

Now, these are the reasons why he did it. Having said that, the irony does not escape me that, he being a top dog in a linux company, he should "Eat his own dog food". Even microsoft eats their own dog food.

But, this being The Linux Foundation, and not The GNU/Linux foundation, or the FOSS foundation: how much of FOSS is "his own dog food". Certainly the linux kernel is. But neither X-free86 nor Wayland seems to be part of his dog food. Nor are KDE/GNOME/Enligthment/all other window environments out there. Is Pulseaudio/ALSA part of his dog food? What about security practices like demanding the root PW for changing the timezone or adding a printer from school? So, If the guy used a MAC with OSX instead of linux, can you blame him? perhaps a little bit, yes. If he also used PowerPoint or Keynote instead of LibreOffice, can you blame him? In my oppinion, no way!!!!

Do not believe me, well, perhaps this guy who was using a macbook on 2012 (with linux), that does not like GNOME 3 and maybe, just maybe, knows a thing or two about linux (certainly he knows more about linux than me and you), can enlighten you all, even more than I can, on why some people preffer MACs to Linux and WinPCs. Please read his rant on the link...

http://www.zdnet.com/article/l...

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

Is it really Necessary to throw in random caps where They serve no Purpose? Those random caps are really jarring and distracting when trying to read through your wall of words. Dropping the caps where they belong (e.g. "linux") doesn't help, either.

And the computers you're taking about are Macs, not Media Access Control addresses. Case makes a difference. But that loops back to your use of Random caps.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Billly Gates]

Apple should be the last platform a tech user should use. It seems the only reason people use it is because people hate Microsoft.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[williamyf]

English is not my first language. Is Spanish (I also speak french).
Did you saw how I spelled detective in the original post? Well: I'm slightly dislexic (very slightly, people would not know if I did not point it out).
I have an essential tremor.
And, I have the bad habit of not proof-reading when I post to forums or personal stuff. Only for serious work.

And yet, with all those handicaps, I was able to score 296/300 in my first try at the ToEFL in 2005

How was your DELE? Do you speak any language other than English?

And, aside from my bad grammar? Any opinion on the ACTUAL CONTENT [caps intended] of the post?

You know, the actual IDEAS [caps intended]? I guess a guy who like you read the elements of style many times, and has such a mastery of English can overcome my bad use of capitalization and grasp the ideas and analyze them well enough to make a significant contrubution to the discussion...

Let your ideas and discernment capacity shine, and be your presentation card.

PS: Quile likely, there are more mistakes in this post. That is to be expected. Sorry.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

some ppl want open source/linux on the desktop for philosophical reasons/because they think it makes them cool. these people will not succeed.
some ppl use linux on the desktop because they can't be bothered by the limitations of proprietary software and dont give 2 shits about configuring a couple of things every now and then (plus, they know how, and it takes them a minute, not 3 days)

that's the main difference. if you don't know why you'd technically use linux instead of OSX for example, you're doomed to fail.

at my work place about 2-3% of the ppl have linux and 100% of them use it because they *actually* like it better - not because they think its a "good thing to do" (OS-level virtue signaling, lol)

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Tough Love]

You're a FreeBSD guy, not a Linux guy. Of course you are biased to Apple. Doesn't change the fact that Zemlin is completely tone-deaf. Well, silver lining here: it's high time his incompetence became widely known. Time to put this poseur out to pasture.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

You may have some good points scattered about, but as the bloody summary stated, the title of presentation was "2017 Year of the Linux desktop". Their offical twitter account boldly stated: 2017 is officially the year of the Linux desktop!

It doesn't frankly matter what he personally works on, whether he fully believes in the virtures of FOSS, or really even the state of things, he stood up there claiming that it's finally the year of the Linux desktop while using a goddamn Mac.

And he wasn't some guy off the street, he is the President of the Linux Foundation!

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[loonycyborg]

Software quality on Macs had sharply declined and you aren't in any better position than a windows or linux user anymore wrt stability and bugginess. So the only remaining reason to use anything Apple now is to show your social status.

Re: The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

In fairness, he never said it was the year of the linux laptop and a desktop would have been too large to bring in for a presentation.

Re: The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[williamyf]

In fairness, he never said it was the year of the linux laptop and a desktop would have been too large to bring in for a presentation.

Please, mod this guy up as funny! Really!

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

I'll never understand how Slashdot readers are so devoid of skepticism and are willing to wail against someone just on the say so of some guy on the Internet without having any proof offered whatsoever. BTW its from a guy who has a personal beef with Zemlin.

Re: The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

That's not true. There is still way less malware on Mac, no antivirus interfering with everything you do, and the software on Mac is much more stable. Including Microsoft Office software for Mac.

Re: The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

It's REALLY HARD to be THAT ignorant. Let's give credit where due. This jackaninny has never touched a Mac. He'd be afraid of the cooties. Just like girls

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

yeah yeah I will believe f**king moron who haven't used Mac before ever.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[rcase5]

When I started my web development and hosting business 15 years ago, I decided to go with Linux for my servers and MacOS for my business-related desktop. There were a few reasons for this decision, but here are the most important:
1. MacOS plays well with Linux. MacOS natively speaks the same protocols that Linux does, most importantly ssh.
2. I needed the ability to run commercial software that was not readily available on Linux, such as Quickbooks.
3. I can't STAND Windows! Windows had me cussing and swearing up a storm for a while before I started the business, and I saw absolutely no reason to subject myself to that nonsense, especially since MacOS would cover many the holes I needed covered from a commercial software standpoint (see points 1 & 2).

That was then. Nowadays, I find myself in agreement with Rick Beato. Apple hardware is increasingly becoming more about form over function. At least Apple hardware used to be about both; it looked good, but it also functioned well with at least some degree of serviceability and compatibility down the road (for their computers, anyway). Plus, I'm really finding that I don't need to rely on commercial software as much as I used to, and everything I need I can run on Linux. So I am currently using the last set of Apple computers I will probably ever buy. The next systems I buy for the business will be just like the systems I buy for me personally; the desktop will be something I assemble myself, and the notebook will be something well-built but relatively inexpensive that I will promptly see a Linux distro installed over what will likely be a Windows 10 pre-install.

But to say that Apple is the last platform a tech user should use is completely wrong, especially if you deal with the Linux world on a regular basis. I would say MacOS is essential if you're a tech user that needs some compatibility with commercial software but also works in the Linux world, and is FAR superior to Windows in that context.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

How is this rated +4, interesting? The guy in the video is not a "tech user". He rants about iTunes and FaceTime.

Wait a second, I forgot that the typical Slashdot reader uses Windows and maybe does technical support, but probably are simply tech enthusiasts. Most are not developers. Most are not sysadmins. Most would stare blankly if given a bash prompt and directed to find the file that contains the word "clue".

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[ArylAkamov]

But, from time to time I have to unwind. I want the available games in steam for my machine to cont in the Thousands, not in the hundreds...

Only counting steam, it's up to nearly nine thousand.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[lyovushka]

Imagine Elon Mask showing up to a Tesla event in diesel VW. He may have good reasons, say he may need to travel longer than the current range of Tesla cars. But how idiotic would it look? The same applies here. I don't buy your excuses. Jim Zemlin is a disgrace.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

Nearly all Ubuntu usrs stayed with GNOME 2. We are MATEs now .... and consign UNITY to pre-teen squintsville buggers haven't got their first dry-hump. Big boys differ. Our 24" to 32" monitors rule the desktop and GUI_peeps using mobile squint-screens ought ***not*** be able to follow where the 4-8gig big-dogs bark video! Cower before your big-screen masters peeps and here ... SMASH ... eat this metal chunk of NVIDEA fan-housing. .

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

Apple used to be awesome. I have an 8-year-old MacBook that I've upgraded with more RAM and an SSD and it's hands-down the best machine I ever owned. I bought it because it runs Mac, Windows, and Unix software. It's like having 3 machines in one.

But I agree they have lost their way. I'm seriously considering Linux for my next laptop, but I may have to go through withdrawal.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[demonlapin]

Well, there's also WAF. My last Windows machine was fantastic for the time, and I had a great 27" monitor. But my office is in the formal part of a formal house, and she didn't want a bunch of cables. So I bought an iMac when it was starting to age, and frankly, I'm perfectly happy with it. Unix CLI, decent GUI, and it can even run Windows in a pinch. I bought a Mac for the looks. And it does look a hell of a lot better than most of the other stuff out there, even Dell's all-in-ones, at basically no price premium.

Performance is more important than aesthetics when you're talking servers, but for a desktop? I'm not crunching numbers. I'm mostly surfing, and the Mac looks better and doesn't really cost much more (if any) than a comparably-capable Windows machine. I do miss my two-monitor setup, but that's a separate issue (the Mac can do it, I just don't; gave my old big monitor to a guy with macular degeneration so he could actually read things).

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't be such a prick. If caps distract you so much don't read it.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

I agree 100%. I have to use macbook pro for work and it is utter garbage. There are only 2 things good about macbook - screen and battery life. Latest macbook is not upgradable and not repairable and it has only 1 type of port. This makes it terrible as a development machine. To connect anything it needs a dongle of one sort or another. Even iphone needs a dongle to connect to macbook.
The mac software is garbage as well. It has no logic in menu placement and shortcut placement. For instance Xcode has bunch of views that are only available from pressing an obscure button on the screen and not from a menu. Os crashes often or must be rebooted when external monitor is connected. If you select some resolution that is not on default menu, mac does not show anything on the external monitor after it goes to sleep and wakes up.
So what that it is based on BSD kernel or some other unix kernel? The software that comes with it is barely sufficient to do anything. And not every open source tool is available through homebrew. An how about programs going off screen in a way that is impossible to recover? Just google this problem and there are many people recommending song and dance routine to bring your window back on screen.

I have been using windows and linux for many years (more than 20) and windows is much better than it was in the days of XP. It is stable and usable. And there are tons of tools available for any type of work. Want unix experience - install cygwin. It is way better than anything that apple has. Want ssh? Install pytty or any number of ssh clients. Want to connect with linux, install samba on your linux, works like a charm.

Linux today is also much better than macos - just install lubuntu and you get a stable simple environment that just works. AND all the software is included. As long as you do not need to run on the cutting edge hardware, linux is great.
If you want a decent computer just get lenovo or dell. For the price of one macbook pro, you can get two laptops that as just as light have almost as good display and slightly worse battery life. And you dont need to spend a fortune on dongles.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Billly Gates]

Wake me up when the LS command can show hidden files and folders without crazy hacks that go away after you restart the terminal program. Does Apple have a native package installer? How about init? Inet last I looked had a program called netinfo that rewritten everything in a gui which violates the spirit of Unix.

All MacOSX is is a dumbed down GUI on top of a Mac kernel. It is not Unix like in spirit more than SystemD is. Infact, Apple was the first to make it fashionable to ban init. Solaris and now Linux followed suite with SystemD but hey its popular because it's not Windows. In Unix everything is a text file so you can use the terminal tools. Not so in MacOSX.

With Windows ( ugh) I can at least enable the Hyper-V role, use PowerShell, install WSL Ubuntu, and even run the win32 version of LAMP.. I know some people can run mysql under MacOSX but is it easy to install? With Windows I have visual studio community edition for free. Is the XCode free? Apple got rid of CUPS, Samba or rather a strange proprietary fork of Samba, Apache, and other standards they cancelled or subverted.

Not to mention everything is cheap glued in and obsolete for an expensive price. This guy I linked was a former Apple fanboy as shown. There is no logical reason to use Macs.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

Why can't bash in MacOSX can't display hidden files and folders without over ridding it's defaults if Apple is so awesome for tech people?

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

Why can't bash in MacOSX can't display hidden files and folders without over ridding it's defaults if Apple is so awesome for tech people?

ls -a is "overriding defaults" ?

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[bn-7bc]

Was LS ment to be in capitals or did you mean ls. Because ls -a displays hidden files just fine. Unless of cause a well documented parsmeter is considered a cracy hack.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

vi ~/.bashrc or .tcshrc and/or .login depending on your shell
alias ls 'ls -a'

Save file. There's your ls command that can show hidden files every time after you restart the terminal program.

Other fun .login entries over the years for Windows/Cygwin/other UNIX/Linux environments (cd and back being the most useful):

mesg y
if (-e /usr/mail/username) egrep ^"From " /usr/mail/username
alias frm 'grep ^From: /usr/mail/username'
alias mail 'mailx'
alias tot 'grep rel_ev $1'
alias lock '/usr/bin/X11/xlock -mode blank'
alias wp '/wp/wpbin/xwp \!* &'
alias rasmol 'rasmol.8'
alias shell 'xterm -sl 1000 -sb -rightbar -ms red -fg white -bg black -e /usr/bin/tcsh -l'
alias otherhost 'ssh -C username@123.456.7.89'
alias otherhosts 'sftp -C username@123.456.7.89'
alias octave 'octave --force-gui'
alias ls 'ls -F'
alias df "df -h \!\!*"
alias cd 'set ol="$cwd";chdir \!*'
alias back 'set bk=$ol;set ol="$cwd";cd $bk;echo $cwd'
alias his 'history -r | more'
alias logout 'source ~/.logout ; exit'
alias row 'ps -fu username'
alias grad 'grep "MAXIMUM GRADIENT" $1'
alias ener 'grep "ENERGY IS" $1'
alias rad 'grep "RADIUS OF" $1'
alias vi 'vi -C'
alias rasmol 'c:/Program\ Files\ \(x86\)/RasWin/raswin.exe \!* &'
alias cpco 'cp tempfile.pdb c:/Documents\ and\ Settings/username/Desktop/'
alias cdd 'cd c:/Documents\ and\ Settings/username/Desktop/'
alias spell 'aspell -c'
alias date "date +'%a %b %e %R:%S %Z %Y' | sed s/+03/AST/"
alias cp 'cp --preserve=timestamps'
alias last 'last -f /var/run/utmp'
alias xpdf 'c:/Program\ Files\ \(x86\)/Adobe/Reader\ 11.0/Reader/AcroRd32.exe \!* &'
alias pdftk '/cygdrive/c/Program\ Files\ \(x86\)/pdftk4all/pdftk.exe'
if (-e .reminder) cat .reminder
if ($?SSH_CLIENT) setenv DISPLAY `printenv SSH_CLIENT | cut -d" " -f1`:0.0

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

Wake me up when the LS command can show hidden files and folders without crazy hacks that go away after you restart the terminal program.

ls -a shows hidden files and folders, WTF are you smoking?

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

My personal favorite:

$ cat /etc/resolv.conf
#
# Mac OS X Notice
#
# This file is not used by the host name and address resolution
# or the DNS query routing mechanisms used by most processes on
# this Mac OS X system.
#
# This file is automatically generated.
#

Yep, definitely Unix alright.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Billly Gates]

Wake me up when the LS command can show hidden files and folders without crazy hacks that go away after you restart the terminal program.

ls -a shows hidden files and folders, WTF are you smoking?

No not Mac permissions. If Office ever borks ls -a won't show the hidden container folders in the profile. With Linux you do not have these problems as Apple always knows whats best and tries to hide things. Not even Windows does this.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

> No not Mac permissions. If Office ever borks ls -a won't show the hidden container folders in the profile.

Huh? What kind of hidden files are you talking about?

There are two ways to hide files/folders in Mac OS, using chflags and a dot-filename, both of which show up with ls -a. What does Office do?

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[PhunkySchtuff]

Are you on drugs?

[kai@blackmac ~]$ cd ~/Library/Group\ Containers/
[kai@blackmac ~/Library/Group Containers]$ ls -1a
. .. .DS_Store .SiriTodayViewExtension
2BUA8C4S2C.com.agilebits
68MH8658M5.com.getharvest.Harvest.Documents
8HSTZV64A5.com.acqualia.soulver
Adobe-Hub-App
DPA6233TPQ.com.macphun.aurorahdr
DPA6233TPQ.com.macphun.aurorahdrPro
G69SCX94XU.duck
N66CZ3Y3BX.com.twitter.twitter-mac.today-group
TKTL7FHMW5.com.coppertino
UBF8T346G9.Office
UBF8T346G9.OfficeOsfWebHost
UBF8T346G9.OneDriveSyncClientSuite
UBF8T346G9.ms
XXKJ396S2Y.123D-3DPrintReadyAppsSuite
com.adobe.accmac.explinder
com.apple.InputMethodKit.TextReplacementService
com.apple.MessagesLegacyTransferArchive
com.apple.Preview
com.apple.PreviewLegacySignaturesConversion
com.codeux.apps.textual
com.getdropbox.dropbox.garcon
group.com.apple.notes
[kai@blackmac ~/Library/Group Containers]$

Now, tell me, what am I not seeing that is actually there but somehow hidden from ls?

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

of which 12 aren't crap

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[sorinm]

Not my experience, sorry. Worked on linux desktop for 18 years or so. I have a mac, I have to work with it every now and then. Normal development tools (eclipse and all that) are ok but the "slick" user interface is hilarious. It may have a hidden logic but that escapes me. Save dialogs are different from one app to another and some of them will only give me 4-5 directories in which I can save the file. After the last update, the finder does not show all the directories in my home, not clear why. I will never understand why the top menu bar is so popular, my mouse has to travel a lot of unnecessary distance.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[thegarbz]

Given the content said he was promoting Linux on the desktop, the Linux desktop with all the wonderful features you listed is most definitely his dog food.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[thegarbz]

Performance is more important than aesthetics when you're talking servers, but for a desktop?

What a strange thing to say. I would say in terms of the home you are an absolute edge case. Desktop aesthetics matter for the receptionist at that flashy office where your customer will see the back of the monitor before anything else. It matters if your office is the formal part of the house. .... What kind of house is that by the way, a studio apartment?

Most computers are not in the formal part of the house, and most towers even if they are can be safely hidden away under a desk leaving only a monitor and some wireless accessories in view.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[demonlapin]

It's the kind of house where the real estate agent would call it a "study" or "library" rather than an office, but it's where my computer sits, and there's no room under the desk for a tower, because my desk is an antique built for the pre-typing era. My wife's office is mich more practical.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

> Save dialogs are different from one app to another

There are standard save dialogs, but a lot of apps roll their own in order to 'distinguish' themselves. It's bad design but there's no way to stop it. And It's not Apple's fault.

> I will never understand why the top menu bar is so popular, my mouse has to travel a lot of unnecessary distance.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fitts's_law

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

That's a nice story. Let let me give you a tip for Finder.

Next time you open Finder, click on "Go" in the menu bar. In the context menu that appears, take note of the "Go to Folder..." menu item and the shortcut Command+Shift+G. Try it out. You can use this shortcut whenever you are in a save file dialog to quickly go to any directory you wish.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Bill Hayden]

I know some people can run mysql under MacOSX but is it easy to install? With Windows I have visual studio community edition for free. Is the XCode free?

Here's where you went off the rails. Using MAMP, Mysql is trivially easy to install on MacOS -- easier than on any other platform, I'd say. And yes, XCode is free and always has been.

The fact that those 2 things were your main supporting arguments against using Macs tells us a lot about your MacOS "expertise".

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

Performance is more important than aesthetics when you're talking servers, but for a desktop? I'm not crunching numbers. I'm mostly surfing, and the Mac looks better and doesn't really cost much more (if any) than a comparably-capable Windows machine.

So first you say performance is not important and then you're justifying the price by comparing to a higher end windows machine?

Cool.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

> And yes, XCode is free and always has been.

Actually IIRC there was a while there where you had to be a registered Apple developer ($99 a year) or pay $4.99 for Xcode on the App Store.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Ash-Fox]

1. MacOS plays well with Linux. MacOS natively speaks the same protocols that Linux does, most importantly ssh.

Of course, in today's world, Windows is better than macOS at this sort of thing, it can run Linux binaries natively on the platform.

But to say that Apple is the last platform a tech user should use is completely wrong, especially if you deal with the Linux world on a regular basis. I would say MacOS is essential if you're a tech user that needs some compatibility with commercial software but also works in the Linux world, and is FAR superior to Windows in that context.

No, it's worse than Windows now. I can run Ubuntu userland natively under Windows, can't do that under MacOS. You also have full access to development tools like Visual Studio that supports integration with it.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Windowser]

The next systems I buy for the business will be just like the systems I buy for me personally; the desktop will be something I assemble myself, and the notebook will be something well-built but relatively inexpensive that I will promptly see a Linux distro installed over what will likely be a Windows 10 pre-install.

Let me introduce you to notebooks built for Linux: https://system76.com/

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Rakarra]

Is it really Necessary to throw in random caps where They serve no Purpose?

Aside from the capitalization of MIR and MAC, two words that are not acronyms, I thought the GP was refreshingly accurate with the capitalization. Certainly far more than most, and I found it less distracting than the posts where people don't bother capitalizing at all.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Rakarra]

Although now I'm noticing Productivity, Software, Phone, Hardware, etc. I'm not sure why it took careful scanning for me to realize that.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[garcia]

I have been running Linux in some full-time capacity for 18+ years and in some capacity for 21+ years and my daily desktop use is on a Mac at work. Why? Because I need to fully and seamlessly integrate with my coworkers without any issues at all.

This means I need fully supported Office (via installed 365), ability to share my screen in our office through the office's system, and any number of other things which make Linux less than ideal; much the same way it was when I was in both undergrad and graduate programs requiring the same sort of deal. That said, we do all of our server stuff in Linux, we do our development on Linux, and we trust it for any number of tasks which we find it well-suited.

Just because I choose to use a Mac doesn't mean I don't fully support Linux, it's just that I value my ability to operate w/my coworkers more than the time I would need to invest in ensuring I can.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Rakarra]

The AC keeps posting this in multiple threads, and no one is really sure what he's talking about.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[TheFakeTimCook]

Wake me up when the LS command can show hidden files and folders without crazy hacks that go away after you restart the terminal program.

Um, it's really hard, I know: Try typing "ls -a". See, done!

http://www.mactrast.com/2011/1...

Inet last I looked had a program called netinfo

macOS (OS X) hasn't used NetInfo in, well, in a VERY long time. Like TWELVE years...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

Apple was the first to make it fashionable to ban init

They didn't make it "Fashionable". They fucking INVENTED it (launchd) in 2005! And then Open Sourced it. But the FOSSies couldn't just accept a gift from Apple. They just HAD to go and fuck it all up. In a LOT of ways, the abomination that is systemd is a microcosm of all that is wrong with the entire F/OSS "Community".

BTW, macOS has been using launchd essentially trouble-free intstead of that retarded init since 10.4 (Tiger). IOW, WELL over a decade.

Read it and weep:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

All MacOSX is is a dumbed down GUI on top of a Mac kernel. It is not Unix like in spirit more than SystemD is.

"Dumbed-down GUI"? YOU write it!

Not Unix? Sorry. OS X/macOS has been a CERTIFIED Unix since at least 10.5 (around 2007), and maybe even before. Wake me when Linux of ANY flavor is a Certified Unix...

https://www.infoworld.com/arti...

In Unix everything is a text file so you can use the terminal tools. Not so in MacOSX.

In macOS, most config files are a flavor of xml, which is a flavor of text.

I know some people can run mysql under MacOSX but is it easy to install?

Yep. I found and used a one-click Installer that gave me an entire LAMP (well, XAMP) stack in just a few minutes.

Ah, here's one now...

https://www.macupdate.com/app/...

Next!

Is the XCode free?

Yep. Has been since OS X 10.0.0. They no longer include it on the Install Disc (but you can get it here) :

http://www.mactrast.com/2011/1...

Apple got rid of CUPS

Bullshit. Apple purchased CUPS in 2007, and STILL kept it Open Source!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

...Samba or rather a strange proprietary fork of Samba

Again, bullshit, at least sort of. Apple got rid of SAMBA because it had become a dumpster-fire of unmitigated proportions, and, because it became GPLv3, which Apple will not abide. They wrote their own SAMBA replacement, whiich, after a couple of revs, is stable enough and full-featured enough that they actually have DEPRECATED their own AFP sharing system in favor of SMB.

http://appleinsider.com/articl...

...a strange proprietary fork of [...], Apache...

I don't know about you; but this seems to be a standard version of Apache, and it shipped with macOS Sierra, which is still the current version of the OS:

https://medium.com/@JohnFodera...

And the version is ships with it (2.4.23) is also reasonabl

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

Not Unix? Sorry. OS X/macOS has been a CERTIFIED Unix since at least 10.5 (around 2007), and maybe even before.

Yeah but don't you know ALL Unixes worked exactly the same before OS X came along?

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

Reminds me of The Simpsons episode when a neighbor calls Homer and says his nuisance dog is making a mess in her yard. Homer argues vehemently that it couldn't be his dog because his dog is tied up in the backyard. Homer knows this because he says, "I tied him up myself!" As the neighbor lady protests that the Simpson's family is the only inconsiderate family capable of committing this destruction in the neighborhood, Homer digs in and doubles down and furiously disputes that it is his dog! Of course, moments later, he sees his muddied dog with a stupid grin on its face carrying the broken leash in its mouth.

You're Homer Simpson. Keep digging, man.

"LS" (sic), right? You're brilliant.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, for what it's worth, there is actually thousands of games for Linux on Steam now. Last count I saw was over 3000. Valve may have put the Steam machines plan on hibernation for now, but it still caused a -lot- of game developers to support linux.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[rcase5]

1. MacOS plays well with Linux. MacOS natively speaks the same protocols that Linux does, most importantly ssh.

Of course, in today's world, Windows is better than macOS at this sort of thing, it can run Linux binaries natively on the platform.

But why? In all the time I've been running MacOS on my business desktop and Linux on my servers, I have yet to see piece of binary software that wasn't available for both Linux and MacOS, both native. And in extreme cases, if I needed software to run on MacOS that was available on Linux, I could download the source and compile it so I can run it natively. But I have NEVER had to do that.

But to say that Apple is the last platform a tech user should use is completely wrong, especially if you deal with the Linux world on a regular basis. I would say MacOS is essential if you're a tech user that needs some compatibility with commercial software but also works in the Linux world, and is FAR superior to Windows in that context.

No, it's worse than Windows now. I can run Ubuntu userland natively under Windows, can't do that under MacOS. You also have full access to development tools like Visual Studio that supports integration with it.

Okay, it's true that I have had very little recent experience with Windows. If it's true that Microsoft has adopted Ubuntu compatibility for Windows (and I have no reason to doubt you), then great! It seems Microsoft has finally realized that their all-GUI all the time philosophy is not a great solution for everybody.

But, again, I ask why? Aside from the fact that I have always been able to find the same software for both MacOS and Linux, the truth of the matter is I very rarely need to run the same software on my Mac than I do on my Linux servers. If I need to do something on the servers, I just login with ssh, run whatever program I need to run on the server, or change whatever configuration I need to change and reset the daemon afterward, all without having to clutter my Mac with any additional software. In Windows-world, you always needed some piece of client software to do those kinds of things (but perhaps this has changed?). In *nix world, all you need is some sort of terminal connection and a CLI, and it's been that way for decades.

You make great arguments for someone who was like me 15 years ago, starting a tech business but trying to decide what to run on their business desktop. But if Windows now has Ubuntu compatibility, then why not just run Ubuntu? I don't need to run Windows for anything. In fact, in almost 20 years, with the lone exception being games, I haven't run Windows for anything. And I've survived just fine all this time without having to use Visual Studio. I just don't see the need to fork out good money for something I have grown to distrust and dislike over the years (and I had a solid 10 years of in-depth experience with Windows before I finally decided I had enough). Also, Microsoft's handling of the Windows 10 roll-out and subsequent apparent spying on their user base has not inspired my confidence in suddenly becoming a Windows convert. I do not trust Microsoft's motives; I haven't for a long time and nothing they've done in the last 20 years has convinced me to change my mind.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Ash-Fox]

I have yet to see piece of binary software that wasn't available for both Linux and MacOS, both native. And in extreme cases, if I needed software to run on MacOS that was available on Linux, I could download the source and compile it so I can run it natively. But I have NEVER had to do that.

I have and MacOS is a problem when it comes to following the UNIX certification it has, because it certifies it for something it can't do (likely didn't test for the cases I encounter).

An example of this is basic functionality like fork(). MacOS does not forbid you to fork(), but it expects you to fork() and exec() when it cannot guarantee you that the libraries you are using are safe from async-signal-safe. POSIX demands you guarantee your code can be forked even in a signal handler at any time.

I have had to port software that does a fork() without exec(), this is allowed by POSIX standards, however MacOS couldn't guarantee the libraries in use are 'async-signal-safe' and in turn it crashes the thread.

So while I can compile a fair few applications across to MacOS, there are annoying system dependent bugs that require to write workarounds in, this is why some applications in darwinports, macports and brew have unexpected segfaults during certain operations on macOS. Theres an even bigger issue with the pthreads issue, but it takes too long to explain. Anything graphical wise like OpenGL (for doing headless rendering work) is a PitA to deal with on MacOS too, since it's OpenGL implementation adds unnecessary constraints in a similar way.

Meanwhile, Windows's Linux subsystem runs native ELF executables and doesn't suffer any of these issues. In short, even if you have an application that's been already pre-compiled for MacOS, it does not mean it will function correctly in all cases.

the truth of the matter is I very rarely need to run the same software on my Mac than I do on my Linux servers.

In today's common administration/devops/development world, technology like Docker, Puppet, Chief and Ansible is generally developed, tested and maintained on desktops machines. Even if you do push that off to a server to handle for your systems later on. By the way, these technologies have bugs relating to some of the issues I talked about above on MacOS.

If I need to do something on the servers, I just login with ssh, run whatever program

If that's the case then there isn't really a good justification for you to be using MacOS. It's more expensive for less for what is just a dumb terminal by your usage scenario.

In Windows-world, you always needed some piece of client software to do those kinds of things (but perhaps this has changed?)

In Windows, you turn on a feature called 'Bash for Windows', which installs a minimal native Ubuntu userland image. Then you can install anything like ssh the same way you would under Ubuntu, 'sudo apt-get install openssh-client' from the CLI.

But if Windows now has Ubuntu compatibility, then why not just run Ubuntu?

To go back to original need of running commercial software. Windows is the best platform for running almost any type of commercial software out there to. Additionally, if any of your work involves Windows servers and such, it's an immense time saver to be able to use the Windows desktop management interfaces locally.

Also, Microsoft's handling of the Windows 10 roll-out and subsequent apparent spying on their user base has not inspired my confidence in suddenly becoming a Windows convert.

I'm not really interested in converting you. I'm just raising a specific issue with some of what you were saying earlier because it's simply not true today. If you're going to say don't use or use something, say it for the right reasons.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Anonymous Coward]

I have had to port software that does a fork() without exec(), this is allowed by POSIX standards, however MacOS couldn't guarantee the libraries in use are 'async-signal-safe' and in turn it crashes the thread.

Can you fix it? Fork() and exec() are part of the open-source code in Darwin.

Re:The same Reason Many of us Greybeards use MACs

[Ash-Fox]

Can you fix it? Fork() and exec() are part of the open-source code in Darwin.

Yes, I can. My day rates are generally on par with Deloitte and KPMG for such projects.

"the year of the Linux desktop"

[Anonymous Coward]

That just gets funnier every year I hear it.

Re:"the year of the Linux desktop"

[luther349]

once vulkin gets more widely used this will remove the last big roadblock for linux and thats games.

Re:"the year of the Linux desktop"

[Anonymous Coward]

Wayland is adding more roadblocks (no games with wayland)

Re:Easy

[bferrell]

There is, unfortunately, among certain developer communities a certain mindset that allows a thought process that seems to go something like this:

      I have a new idea. This new idea will disrupt everything and is therefore good. Everything from before must go. Rinse, repeat.

I guess it makes them a living. It makes working around them hell.

It just happens that Redhat employs certain highly visible people. If you look a bit closer, you find much of this and it's underpinnings come out of freedesktop.org and in aggregate those folks are all over the place.

Re: tldr:linux foundation president doesnt have a

[mSparks43]

fedora was launced 2003 according to wikipedia, before that was mandrake linux and an early redhat, but fedora was the first install i started using more than windows. all basically the same because they use the redhat rpm system.

Sigh.

[ledow]

Eat your own dog food.

If you can't, then you have no faith in your own products.

To be honest, Linux Foundation was always just some-off, not-affecting-me group anyway. I never quite get what they do, or where the money comes from or goes to.

But you can't say "Linux does/doesn't work on the desktop" until you've done it yourself.

P.S. Yes, I've done it. Exclusively. For 8+ years. While managing Windows networks for a living. It's perfectly viable, and in many ways better.

Nowadays, though, I virtualise everything so it barely matters what the core-OS is and can work in Linux or Windows depending on what I'm doing.

For sure, if I was working for something called the Linux Foundation, myself and EVERYONE under me would be using Linux. Unless I literally had used it and had deemed it inadequate myself, in which case there's be bigger problems than what my people were using to get their work done.

Re:Sigh.

[Anonymous Coward]

>To be honest, Linux Foundation was always just some-off, not-affecting-me group anyway. I never quite get what they do, or where the money comes from or goes to.

What, are you too lazy to type out a URL? Here, let help you.
http://www.linuxfoundation.org/about/

Hint: It's an industry trade group dedicated to promoting Linux-based technologies in commercial enterprises.

Re:Sigh.

[ledow]

I stand by my assertion.

What do they do?

It seems a load of company-focused rhetoric, I can't dig through to what they actually DO. Specifically what do they do FOR Linux?

A few bits of project-hosting is all that pops out, and I'm sure there are any number of places that do the same.

Re:Sigh.

[CrybabiesArePeople]

Yes. And using a Mac to do a presentation on Linux in servers or cars would be OK. But saying this is "the year of desktop Linux" with a Mac is stupid. Either it IS "the year", hence use a Linux system, or it isn't. It seems that the guy was reciting words without understanding their meaning, or really not bothering.

Re:Sigh.

[Anonymous Coward]

I stand by my assertion.

What do they do?

...

Apparently they use Macs to create pro-Linux presentations for Open Source conferences.

it's just to bad they have poor hardware / choice

[Joe_Dragon]

it's just to bad they have poor hardware / choice and are pushing the store with DEV fees and a 30% a bit to hard. also has censorship and sand boxing that limits some tools.

And apples hardware is crap I can see SOLDERED ram but the upgrade price is to high. But SOLDERED storage is just to far.

The new imac pro looks to have ram sticks but do to looks they will make you that you will to need to unglued the screen to change it so be ready to pay $800-$1000 for an 32GB to 64GB ECC ram upgrade. At time when a full set of 64GB ECC is only about $800

Fits...

[XSportSeeker]

Saying 2017 is "officially the year of Linux desktop" is pure bullshit anyways, so he could be using a Surface Studio for all I care.
Linux dominates a whole ton of categories, including servers and supercomputers, but let's cut the bullshit right there.
Linux doesn't even have the same marketshare Windows 8.1 has, which has the same marketshare of Windows XP.
Windows 10 has like over double of both put together, and Windows 7 almost double of Windows 10.
That's how distant Linux is. Mac OS has a bigger market share than all Linux distros put together on desktops.

In any case, it's just weird... it's not like you can't make presentations on Linux or anything like that. Doesn't look good when the president of a foundation doesn't actively use what he's supposed to be promoting though.

Re: Fits...

[mSparks43]

Interested how you are measuring that. user agents on websites?

don't visit much open-web on linux, torbrowser lies and somewhere like stack exchange doesnt seem to report.

Sales of redhat? dowloads of ubuntu? population of north korea using red star OS?

I'd guess theres more desktops on Linux in China now than there are desktops in the rest of the world.

Re: Fits...

[Anonymous Coward]

I'd GUESS theres more desktops on Linux in China now than there are desktops in the rest of the world.

And THAT is why you fail

Re: Fits...

[mSparks43]

Even http://gs.statcounter.com/os-m... has Linux waaayyy ahead of windows. So I reckon you are only fooling yourself.
Operating System Market Share Worldwide - August 2017
Android Linux
39.82%
Windows
36.1%
iOS
13.68%
OS X
5.1%
Unknown
2.72%
Other Linux
0.8%

Re: Fits...

[Anonymous Coward]

And if you actually bother to hit the Desktop only button:

Windows
83.53%
OS X
11.95%
Unknown
2.15%
Linux
1.79%
Chrome OS
0.56%
FreeBSD
0%

Re: Fits...

[mSparks43]

and if you hit the windows only button.
Windows 100%

But that still doesnt answer my original point - which is these are all BS numbers when most linux desktop browsers report windows as their OS to avoid useragent problems. and pretty much all of China (who have more internet users - mostly on linux, than the US population) isnt in the statistics. So how exactly do you measure it?

https://itsfoss.com/linux-nati...

Makes you wonder why you pay the fee

[Anonymous Coward]

Zemlin always seemed a bit plastic but this really takes the biscuit.

In other news I guess Matt Garret won't be getting invited to be a Linux foundation fellow any time soon.

I recently bought an LWN subscription, I don't think I'll bother renewing the Linux foundation one...

Jim Zemlin? Douchebag??

[Anonymous Coward]

Jim Zemlin has shown himself to be a major douchebag for his representation of FOSS, We need to show him the door.

Re:Jim Zemlin? Douchebag??

[Anonymous Coward]

>We need to show him the door.

That still won't get Karen Sandler on the LF's BoD! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

SJW ENTRYISM FAIL!

Uh...

[Lunix Nutcase]

Ironically, in March Zemlin told a cloud conference that organizations that "don't harvest the shared innovation" of open source "will fail."

What's ironic? macOS does "harvest" open source code. Tons of it.

This guy

[DuroSoft]

Should be taken outside and shot behind the chemical shed

Re:This guy

[Anonymous Coward]

Matthew Garret is a perpetually aggrieved dink.He is always upset about something, usually trivial which no one but other perpetually aggrieved and easily offended people like him actually give a shit about. I really don't think he needs to be shot, though.

Well known idiot

[Tough Love]

Jim Zemlin is a well-known idiot who is more tolerated by the community than respected. He is found of boasting about how he "writes Linus's paycheck". In reality, Jim Zemlin is just a random no-talent enjoying a free ride by being at the right place at the right time.

Re:Well known idiot

[Anonymous Coward]

He outwitted the likes of sjw's trying to infiltrate the Linux Foundation board by changing the bylaws to remove individual member elections of board members, thus keeping the zealots out.

Re:Well known idiot

[Anonymous Coward]

Left hand, or right hand, or both?

Doesn't Help Much

[Roger W Moore]

All that does is change the question to why a conference called the "Open Source Summit 2017" does not use Linux to present. I suspect the reason is that presentations are all about polish and while I love Open Source software the one (and perhaps only) thing that commercial software does seem to do better is polish.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

Perhaps for some end users GUI software. I'd say Clang and LLVM are way more polished than MSVC though.

I think its more that Apply focuses on polish more than most people, opensource or otherwise.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[Harlequin80]

Because the conference is operated by a 3rd party company. They made sure everything is working and the provide pre-tested equipment and setup. You don't setup your own systems at a conference hall.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

If you had ever had a booth at any of these conferences you would quickly learn that the facilities are controlled and run by corporations and under Union control. Sometimes you can't even move an extension cord from one side of the booth to the other without a Union work order and usually many hours of delay. And don't even let them see you with a screw driver or wrench in your hand.

So I would not be surprised if there was a computer furnished for the presentation and presenters HAD to use that computer. Still, the Linux Foundation President should have had a boot able USB drive with Linux on it and his presentation. _that_ last part was a joke.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

+1. Everything I ever needed to know about unions I learned the first time I helped my employer set up a convention booth at Moscone Center.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[kenh]

Then that simply changes the question to why didn't the reporter comment on the fact that ALL PRESENTERS at the open source conference used a MacOS?

Your trying too hard too make an excuse, it is quite common for conference organizers to get a a podium with VGA/Audio jack at the podium for presenter laptops.

If you clicked on the link provided you would see that the person in question was seen using a MacOS TO CREATE THE SLIDES, not just present them.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[kenh]

He was spotted creating the slides on a MacOS laptop - does the union control of all activities in a convention hall knows no bounds!

Seriously, people need to stop projecting their personal experiences onto whatever story they read and actually FOLLOW THE LINKS PROVIDED before replying! (I know, "Welcome to /")

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[Ol Olsoc]

All that does is change the question to why a conference called the "Open Source Summit 2017" does not use Linux to present. I suspect the reason is that presentations are all about polish and while I love Open Source software the one (and perhaps only) thing that commercial software does seem to do better is polish.

I use MacOS, Linux, and Windows computers. I use any of them to present with. Makes no difference to me, and shouldn't make any difference to anyone else. He was using a UNIX computer which is quite similar to a Linux computer. Has it been confirmed that his computer is running the MacOS operating system? I have a nice old 27 inch Core2Duo iMack I have Linux installed on sitting beside me.

Regardless, this is a really dumb thing to get excited about.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[Ol Olsoc]

Because the conference is operated by a 3rd party company. They made sure everything is working and the provide pre-tested equipment and setup. You don't setup your own systems at a conference hall.

You sure about that? I've gone to meetings with others with the sole intent of making certain that the presentation works. The first priority is that my specific laptop was used. And very often you do not want your slideshow ot be on someone elses computer period. You know - reasons.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[nomadic]

"+1. Everything I ever needed to know about unions I learned the first time I helped my employer set up a convention booth at Moscone Center."

So you're extrapolating about all unions from your experience with a single union in a single facility in a single state? I think maybe your sample size is too small.

Re: Doesn't Help Much

[Malc]

You're comparing a set of command line tools with an IDE? I'll take MSVC over lldb any day of the week, and the Xcode front-end over the plain llvm-analyzer

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[The123king]

TRWTF is using Apples presentation software. Sure, it works, but it's got nothing on PowerPoint or compatibles, such as Open/Libre/Whateveritisnow Office.

It's like trying to crack a nut with a hammer. Sure, it'll get the job done, but you still should use a nutcracker.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

All that does is change the question to why a conference called the "Open Source Summit 2017" does not use Linux to present.

You mean why they don't use open source to present?
All open source operating systems aren't based on Linux.

Re: Doesn't Help Much

[hackwrench]

I like QuickC

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[TheRaven64]

If you're running a conference and you want people to present on your computer, then macOS makes the most sense. It can happily be configured to display PowerPoint, Keynote, {Libre,Open}Office, Google Docs, or PDF presentations and can be tested with all of these in advance. Any other platform is going to lose at least one of these options and end up with cranky speakers sulking that they can't use their fancy animations. Of course, PowerPoint doesn't embed fonts by default anymore, so the PowerPoint slide decks will look crappy if they use any custom fonts...

Re: Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

Only 2 years ago I was in a team of 8 and 3 of us ran linux on the desktop. Now its a team of 13 and its only me still running it (EL7). Nearly everyone is on mac, 2 people on windows (7). Macs do unix, and are easy. We still build and support about 50 linux servers and they work well (and 2 windows servers to run junk proprietry software). Truth is there is plenty of mac desktop software, you can ssh in to things and run any linux software too. Ive never spent any of my own money on apple hardware but when your just looking at a list of hardware and can say 'i want that one' the mac becomes an attractive option. We need unix, were time poor and it just works. Commercial OSes have come a long way (osx and windows) and have risen to the challenge of Linux. Linux will remain a major player but its fragmentation which made it strong is starting to become a weakness compared to its modern competitors.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[AmiMoJo]

These days they often just provide an HDMI cable and you bring your own laptop. HDMI has video and audio, it can run for 10+ metres no problem. Bring your own laptop and, if required, dongle.

Re: Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

First correct use of the homophone "you're" I see in months. Thank you!

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

Not, if you specifically promote thing you are not using. It's like macdolands CEO going to burger king,

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

Then that simply changes the question to why didn't the reporter comment on the fact that ALL PRESENTERS at the open source conference used a MacOS?

Your trying too hard too make an excuse, it is quite common for conference organizers to get a a podium with VGA/Audio jack at the podium for presenter laptops.

If you clicked on the link provided you would see that the person in question was seen using a MacOS TO CREATE THE SLIDES, not just present them.

It doesn't matter what OS they need in presentation. A presentation technology (to create/display/etc.) is irrelevant to the content. The main purpose of the summit is not about how to do a presentation or slide show technology. However, it is quite a common behavior of humans that like to nit-picking on everything that they do not have a hand on it, so that they can feel better of themselves. This situation is a good example.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

Humans often fill gaps in their knowledge with prejudice. Biologically, this is probably advantageous.

Re: Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

Funny. Now I understand why Windows needs the bash shell integration so badly. Mac has a nice GUI and a good shell so I guess the Linux developers can get everything they need.

Sorry though, XCode is a complete dumpster fire when it's stacked against VS.Net, but still better than vi and gdb.

Re: Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

No platform four homophones.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

I was immediately reminded of Lee Iacocca taking charge of Chrysler. A lot of senior execs were driving BMWs, Mercedes, etc. Iacocca told them to get rid of them and get a Chrysler.

He said, if you don't like it, make a Chrysler that's the car you want to drive.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[Ol Olsoc]

I was immediately reminded of Lee Iacocca taking charge of Chrysler. A lot of senior execs were driving BMWs, Mercedes, etc. Iacocca told them to get rid of them and get a Chrysler.

He said, if you don't like it, make a Chrysler that's the car you want to drive.

Imagine going from a Mercedes to a K-Car!

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[Ol Olsoc]

Not, if you specifically promote thing you are not using. It's like macdolands CEO going to burger king,

I know this is Slashdot and all, but in the world where people venture out of Mom's basement, people do eat at other places than their own. And only a few obsessive compulsives restrict their food intake to only a few things. I had a co-worker who only ate mashed potatoes or French fries, corn, and Steak or Wendy's hamburgers. That's it. And he was considered weird. With using multiple Operating systems, I know how to use whatever operating system's presentation software. And which presentation software I use has no relationship to which OS I consider "best."

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

Not always, I ran a small conference with 450 attendees and the presenters were expected to bring their own laptop and dongle to connect to the projector. I only had to use a loaner laptop about 4 or 5 times for those who did not bring their own.

Re: Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

I got the Beats(tm) homophones, but they suck.

Re: Doesn't Help Much

[fisted]

???

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[HiThere]

Since he was representing the Linux Foundation he should have used Linux. But it's long been clear that the "Linux Foundation" doesn't actually speak for or represent Linux, but rather a collection of businesses that have some connection, however oblique, with Linux.

Re: Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

Sounds like you're regularly surrounded by idiots.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[TheFakeTimCook]

TRWTF is using Apples presentation software. Sure, it works, but it's got nothing on PowerPoint or compatibles, such as Open/Libre/Whateveritisnow Office.

It's like trying to crack a nut with a hammer. Sure, it'll get the job done, but you still should use a nutcracker.

I'm sorry; but Keynote (Apple's Presentation Software) wipes the floor with PowerPoint (and the Open/LibreOffice crap).

https://www.apple.com/keynote/

Apple created Keynote years ago specifically for Steve Jobs to create, well, Keynote Addresses, and it's gorgeous transitions and animations are still head and shoulders above everyone else, and make the other guys' attempts look like the amateur hour they are.

THAT's why they not only Presented, but CREATED their Presentations on Keynote.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[TheFakeTimCook]

"+1. Everything I ever needed to know about unions I learned the first time I helped my employer set up a convention booth at Moscone Center."

So you're extrapolating about all unions from your experience with a single union in a single facility in a single state? I think maybe your sample size is too small.

And maybe not.

Re:Doesn't Help Much

[TheFakeTimCook]

If you're running a conference and you want people to present on your computer, then macOS makes the most sense. It can happily be configured to display PowerPoint, Keynote, {Libre,Open}Office, Google Docs, or PDF presentations and can be tested with all of these in advance. Any other platform is going to lose at least one of these options and end up with cranky speakers sulking that they can't use their fancy animations. Of course, PowerPoint doesn't embed fonts by default anymore, so the PowerPoint slide decks will look crappy if they use any custom fonts...

EXACTLY!

Re: Doesn't Help Much

[Anonymous Coward]

Does the director of NASA always present from space? Or does he have a foot on a rocket while he presents? Does he wear a pilots helmet or flight suit while he presents? Hold a moon rock? No? That's weird, since he's the leader of an administration that's all about air and space. Oh, wait, it's just a routine presentation. I bet he does breathe, though. That's kind of air-y.

MacBook Pros now Dogshit

[Anonymous Coward]

You can't service them hardly at all. I dare you to find me a comparible Dell laptop that isn't as good or better spec-wise (lack of flashy apple logo duly noted, you will be the bane of your hipster coffee shop). Your Dell will also be completely user servicible with a standard screwdriver AND have onboard Ethernet. Macs have now sadly become overpriced consumer hipster shit and you are a sucker if you buy one for any other purpose than running macOS

Re:MacBook Pros now Dogshit

[Anonymous Coward]

Macbook Pros don't need hardware service. I have two, since 2012 and they now work better than when I bought them thanks to the updated OS. The hardware is still the same and there never were any issues.

Re:MacBook Pros now Dogshit

[Anonymous Coward]

Macbook Pros don't need hardware service. I have two, since 2012 and they now work better than when I bought them thanks to the updated OS.

Ahaha oh boy, the fanbois are out in full force tonight. Every Mac I've ever owned has had a piece of hardware die - keyboard, trackpad, GPU, failed LCD panel, logic board, HDD, SDD, and dead pixels in the display. Worse off was dealing with the retards at the "genius" bar in full denial that anything is wrong.

I forgot Macs are magical devices that never break and operate beyond the laws of physics, not stuffed with the same fucking hardware chips that PCs are.

Re:MacBook Pros now Dogshit

[nomadic]

"Macs have now"

Now?

Re:MacBook Pros now Dogshit

[nomadic]

Small sample size, but of the two Macs I've owned in my life, both died after a couple of years. Power supply went wiggy in one, while the other died because the display cable was stupidly put in a poorly-designed hinge (as Apple eventually admitted publicly). They fixed the latter the first time it went out because of the stupid design decision (driven no doubt by narcissistic sociopath pseudoartist Steve Jobs), but when it inevitably went out again they wouldn't. I have literally 10+ year PC laptops that still run.

Re:MacBook Pros now Dogshit

[Anonymous Coward]

driven no doubt by narcissistic sociopath pseudoartist Steve Jobs

Like the time he made the engineers on the original Macintosh redo the PCB layout to make it more "pretty" as opposed to routing the trace lengths for memory timing. (Spoiler: it didn't work and they had to change it back)

Re:MacBook Pros now Dogshit

[Anonymous Coward]

And I have 10 year old macs that still work.. Inf act I'm typing this on a 2007 MBP. So you have no point.

Re:MacBook Pros now Dogshit

[Rakarra]

Macbook Pros don't need hardware service

If you say this, then you do not have very much experience with computers.

The FOSS replacements for Office don't complete.

[LWATCDR]

Simple OpenOffice and Libre Officer are just not nearly as good as Microsoft Office. I use Linux every day for work but I also have a Windows PC just for Office and Skype for Business, Google Docs, OpenOffice, and Libre Office are just not as good as Microsoft Office. Until it is it people will use OS/X and Windows.

Re:The FOSS replacements for Office don't complete

[Anonymous Coward]

I have a computer supplied by the business, used only for the business (for tax and security reasons) though at home, that runs Windows 7 Enterprise managed by the organization using Office and related software. I have a home computer (several, actually) that run Windows 10 and do not interact with the business computer. A couple of them also have Linux Mint in VMs, tracking developments and trying to get the last couple of Home Use Windows things fixed up to work in Linux. The idea being that when (not if) MS stops supporting my old but adequate hardware I will reverse positions and put Linux on the hardware with Windows (if still needed for those couple of holdout software bits) in the VM. I'm not an Apple fanboi, but have used Macs in the past and can easily see them as being preferred for business use as compared to Linux - better support in general unless you want to spend time doing it yourself.

As noted by others (perhaps at even more excessive length than me), it's reasonable to have different o/s and software environments for different uses.

because Desktop, not Laptop!

[Anonymous Coward]

I would be surprised if the guy brought a Mac desktop to show the slides.

Re: tldr:linux foundation president doesnt have a

[Anonymous Coward]

But you said you used it since 90s, nut

Re: it's just to bad they have poor hardware / cho

[Anonymous Coward]

Wrong. 27" iMacs have and have always had removable ram WITH ACCESS DOORS

There's closed and then there's prison

[slashmydots]

So you've got nice and open Linux, then you've got relatively locked down but still pretty freedom-oriented Windows. Then a million miles away in a different dimension and outside the observable universe you've got Apple as a company and all their garbage products by extension. But you guys know how Apple fanboys are. They're stuck in 2004 when owning Apple products made you better than everyone else and everyone was so jealous of your ability to spend money you don't have.

Re:There's closed and then there's prison

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm not some huge Apple zealot, but are you high? iOS is locked down yes, get over it. Mac OS though is open to do anything you want with. There's none of the tracking shit like Windows has now, things like SIP can be disabled readily and easily, and quite frankly their ecosystem, as hostile as it can be sometimes to outside devices, works brilliantly together. Retarded port decisions on laptops and phones, shitty watch ideas, etc etc are all fair game too, but at least use the fucking platforms before you dredge up tired, old, and downright false rhetoric.

Re:There's closed and then there's prison

[bn-7bc]

Well OSX defaults Re lookced down, but with a bit of googeling snd a few terminsl commands most if not all restrictions can be turned of if you want to, is this a hatd barier for 90% of people, probably, but then again thsy are not the once complaining. Do you have aåany citations for thr gatbage products you reffer to. I’ll be the first to admitthst theit coputers are not lightly to win any spec war but how often is thst relevant?If you are right and spples produckts are garbsge, why do apple consistsntly score high on costumer satisgaction servays, it can’t sll le fanboy love can it?

Re:It's because

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm guessing it's you that sucks ass. I use a dual monitor setup on my laptop all the time. Know how hard it was to setup? I plugged in the second monitor.

Re: Easy

[Anonymous Coward]

Donald, is that you?

Vi and EMACS

[SeattleLawGuy]

Live-debugging my X config file in front of a room of open-source users is not my idea of a good time.

They'd be perfectly civilized until you picked between vi and emacs...

Re:Vi and EMACS

[bn-7bc]

Yes what is up with that? I never understood the exitor war, unlese you ar stuck in a situasion where your editor of choice is nor svslable, and you are noy able to install the editor what is the big deal, people use what works best for them. If the question is which of the 2 is best for beginners (well probably none of them, but that is a different debate)

Re:Vi and EMACS

[Cid Highwind]

Does anyone really still use emacs? (other than RMS)

No surprise

[Anonymous Coward]

A long time ago, I walked through LinuxWorld about an hour before it was open to the public, and nearly every large screen that was about to be used for presentations was showing a Windows logo.

Also, I've been trying to ditch Windows for Linux for a very long time, easily 15 years, and I haven't been able to do it. There are simply too many apps I depend on for work and recreational computing that don't have serviceable equivalents under Linux, not to mention the still poor driver support for things like large format color printers.

Because of my professional background, I likely hate MS more than the average person on this site, yet I effectively have no choice but to stick with Windows or make the big shift to a Mac and support a company I hate nearly as much as I do MS.

not surprised

[Nex6]

at allot of conferences you see alot of macs, even among OSS devs. many run Linux/BSD in a VM. even some of the kernel devs work in this work flow. I know a few OSS Devs and most have Macs, and Run in VMs.

and anyone who thinks, impress is anywhere close to keynote or powerpoint in dreaming is like 10 years behind and thats being nice. I tryed to
do a impress deck once with video, audio transitions and i spent days on it and it never worked. but i was able to do it in powerpoint in a few hours.

THATS why he used a mac.... its very simple he wants to get shit done... and I am really sure i has Linux VMs he spends most of his time in....

Well ... At Least

[Anonymous Coward]

At Least the Linux Foundation is not a Soviet Socialist Union. Erstwhile Mr. Jim Zemlin would be toiling deep in a Salt Mine at Vorkuta with little chance of release on good behavior.

Hahaha

Re:The FOSS replacements for Office don't complete

[kenh]

As noted by others (perhaps at even more excessive length than me), it's reasonable to have different o/s and software environments for different uses.

Even inside the Linux Foundation?

Reminds me of when Sun railed against corporations using IBM computers, but ran their back-office on an IBM Mainframe complex...

You lose gay cred if you're not seen with Apple

[Anonymous Coward]

Everybody knows that.

In other News.

[wkwilley2]

Sounds like the Linux Foundation is in need of a new President.

Re:In other News.

[Anonymous Coward]

I'd rather say Linux needs a new Foundation.

Re: Easy

[Ol Olsoc]

Please also tell us your theories on how Trump was behind 9/11!

Silly - Obama is the villian. He didn't do one thing about 9/11. There's no denying that.

Re: compatibility to foreign formats.

[fjin]

One workaround is to do presentations on Libreoffice, and then have also portable versions (Windows and OSX) of libreoffice on your USB-stick with the prensentations.

And what'd be the point?

[aglider]

What's wrong with that?
Linux is a kernel, not an OS.
But you need and OS for the presentation.
If none of the distros matches your requirements what are you going to choose?
Either something that doers or what you already have.

Re:And what'd be the point?

[Ash-Fox]

If none of the distros matches your requirements what are you going to choose?

What if there were and he just didn't choose them?

Re:And what'd be the point?

[aglider]

You need to ask him!
I am personally on Linux since 1999 and so far no distro satisfied me.
At the moment I am on Kubuntu and Archlinux.
For sure I won't go Windows. But if I had money I'd give OSX a try.

Trojan Allert

[Anonymous Coward]

This guy is a Microsoft Trojan horse. The linux foundation is completely and totally fucked. You should have known that the minute they let Microsoft sit at the table. Go to BSD cause soon linux won't be linux it will be compromised if it isn't yet.

Banning all other systems would be nonsense

[Anonymous Coward]

not allowing anyone to bring anything but Linux onto the conference, would only further the false image of the elitist Unix user stereotype. Most likely, it was someone else's computer and the presentation was loaded on it for him.

Re:I wouldn't use Linux for that, either.

[Anonymous Coward]

X config file?

The only times I've had to dick with that in a very long time have been for complex multi-monitor systems. Followed by digging up an obscure helpme thread on how to stop kscreen from trashing that configuration 5 seconds after the desktop started, which naturally involved hand editing a text configuration file.

But for hotplugging a secondary display and either mirroring or switching? No problems. The worst I can say is, the nvidia-settings tool is sometimes obnoxious with prompts when I wish it weren't.

The Linux Foundation != Linux

[emblemparade]

Despite its name the Linux Foundation has no direct relationship to Linux. It's yet another open source foundation, like Apache and Eclipse, and is very business-friendly and business-oriented. Indeed most of its projects have open source licenses other than GPL.

Which isn't to say that using a Mac in this case isn't ironic. But what's more ironic is the Linux Foundation's name.

Re:The Linux Foundation != Linux

[curcuru]

Not that slashdot threads normally want to hear more facts, but...

• The LF effectively controls the use of the LINUX registered trademark (which is legally owned by Linus), plus, quoting:
• "The Linux Foundation provides a neutral home where Linux kernel development can be protected and supported for years to come.
• Linux Foundation fellowships sponsor the work of Linux creator Linus Torvalds and lead maintainer Greg Kroah-Hartman
• Linux Foundation IT operations run the systems behind Linux kernel development on kernel.org
• Linux Foundation Training offers free and paid training courses and Linux certifications
• Linux Foundation Events organize gatherings where kernel developers can collaborate"

So while the people who run the business operations (like Jim) may not hack, the organization they run and budget they control does help fund kernel development directly.
Also, the ASF is a 501C3 public charity - completely different governance than the 501C6 non-profits like LF (essentially top sponsors pay for board seats) and Eclipse (a mix of sponsored/elected board seats).

Laptop vs desktop

[bentcd]

Strictly speaking a laptop isn't a desktop computer.

Not having kept in touch, how is linux battery and sleep management these days?

Re:Laptop vs desktop

[zekica]

My Latitude E5470 lasts 11h in Ubuntu 16.04 LTS and 11.5h in Windows 10 when not doing anything, with screen on - it consumes ~4W in linux and ~3.9W in windows 10. I haven't had any issues with sleep - it works 100% of the time - I only reboot the system for kernel updates.

Re: Easy

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, bigly

Linux Foundation

[Anonymous Coward]

Linux Foundation are so gay and hypocritical.
Thanks for reading my valuable contribution, now please vote me up

Maybe because...

[ogdenk]

Maybe because didn't have time to replace the dumpster fire known as GNOME3 or KDE with a real desktop environment that is usable with less than 32GB of RAM on his recent Linux or BSD install?

I am only half joking. My recent forays back to using *NIX on the desktop left me wanting to take a drill to my frontal lobe. GNOME and modern KDE are almost utterly unusable. MATE w/Compton wasn't so bad, XFCE was ok but the two flagships that are installed by default in most distressed are utterly disgusting resource hogs that seem less functional than Windows 3.1 out of the box but use 1000x the resources. If those clusterfucks are where desktop Linux/BSD are heading then what's the point? They aren't even efficient to use.

X-Windows used to be awesome, what the hell happened?! I'm actually thinking of just finding a decent standalone file manager and going back to WindowMaker at this point. The GNOME project has even managed to make their text editor UI suck.... that's pretty hard to do. Stop letting 20-yr-old kids who want their PC to operate like their phone rewrite perfectly good software.

Rant over.

Re: Maybe because...

[ogdenk]

Autocorrect sucks..... distress=distros

Re:Maybe because...

[Anonymous Coward]

Fluxbox + Rox

reminds me of...

[kwoff]

the Mozilla marketing head using Chrome.

Just pictures...

[Anonymous Coward]

Load of bullshit in above posts. Real, stinking, still warm, steamin' bull. Now, repeat after me:

Slides. Are. Just. Pictures. That. Exchange. For. Next. In. The. Queue. When. You. Click. Them.

Anyone thinking Linux based software is not capable of that, has exceeded their monthly trolling allowance, and it's only 18th in the month.

They don't believe in what they speak

[Anonymous Coward]

Meh, Linux is a second choice OS and even Linux users committed to the OS seem afraid to admit the platform is falling behind Mac OS and Windows. At one point I thought Linux desktop was closing in on Windows and some distro's do focus on a polished desktop experience. But as we say look's can be deceiving.

Re:They don't believe in what they speak

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually,with Windows 10, *Windows* is falling behind Windows. I have to use Windows at work and I was really reasonably happy with Win7. But that'll be gone soon. MS finally had a decent O/S and they've trashed it.

Meanwhile at home Ubuntu 16.04 MATE is stable, fast and simple, reproducing nicely what I'd previously regarded as the best Linux desktop, Ubuntu 10.04 with Gnome 2.

Show the poseur the door!

[Anonymous Coward]

For Christ's sake Jim Zemlin is milking the Linux Foundation for north of $300k/year for years. He could at least learn to "eat his own dogfood". Give a trained monkey a Thinkpad, a Red Hat distro, and Impress to get through the presentation if he cannot grok Linux.
Show the asshats like Zemlin the door! He isn't even a good poseur.

https://www.itworld.com/articl...
https://www.bloomberg.com/rese...

*former* marketing head

[Anonymous Coward]

It's a big difference when you are the former marketing head. Zemlin is still working at the Linux Foundation.

Well, they are the event producers

[curcuru]

The Linux Foundation has their own internal events division, and they produce both their own events as well as are contracted to produce some events for other organizations: http://events.linuxfoundation.... Obviously, the hotel physically provided the projectors, screens, etc., but it's the LF events team doing all the rest. The LF normally provides a .PPT slide template deck for speakers, although it's not required.

Mile ahread of Mac or Windows

[Murdoch5]

Out of the four computers I use on a regular basis, three of them are on Ubuntu 17.04 Desktop and the other runs BlackArch, it's not the year of the Linux Desktop, Linux is the Desktop OS for everyone.

Year of the Linux Desktop, just like last year was

[Chelloveck]

Is it even possible to say "The Year of the Linux Desktop" non-sarcastically any more? It's like saying nuclear fusion is five years away. It's been said for so long nobody could possibly take the phrase seriously anymore. Maybe the title of the presentation was intended to be a joke, with the punch line that it's being presented from a Mac?

stupid requirements

[Anonymous Coward]

A decade or so ago I always a hard time ditching completely my windows partition on my machine and using only free software. But since stopped studying been using it non-stop without any (major) issue. Why? stupid school work forcing you all kind of braindead shit on you ALL THE TIME.
I remeber when vm wasnt really an option cause it was too ressource hungry and ran like crap with abysmal performance, Most "important" website forced you to use IE or it wouldn't work, you had to use ms word because omg use this specific template for this and that and whatever.

If you are free to use gnu/linux software only and do not: you are the problem no bullshit excuse please.

Yes there is: LaTeX or html

[Kludge]

In my field of research it is easy to differentiate people's intelligence by what software they use for presentations.
The smart ones use LaTeX or html for their presentations.
Putting an ugly equation up in PowerPoint makes you look dumb.

Re:Because - strangest presentation tool.

[anon mouse-cow-aard]

I actually was fairly happy to do a presentation with a single dia diagram, and a script that extracted lines starting with a tag, and indicating which layers to include. Stuck that in a Makefile, and when I run it, it gives me a series of .png's. weird, yes, but actually pretty functional.

Re:Easy

[butchersong]

So they are the geek community equivalent of MBAs?

Obvious

[Anonymous Coward]

I know that this comment is going to get modded down, but it is really simple:

As much as I want to use Linux as a desktop, it still sucks and is still too buggy for day to day work. I don't have the time to be fucking around. The shit just doesn't work reliably.

This poor guy probably doesn't have the time either. He doesn't need to get up on stage for a presentation and have to fuck around making it work for 10 minutes either. Just use something that works every time.

butthurt

[profssrfink]

the amount of butthurt on this forum is pretty laughable. Who cares? OS X is a polished and beautiful platform and something Linux Desktops should strive for in terms of core technologies and usability. That being said linux desktops are great platforms. They are fast, efficient, and are much better than they used to be. Perhaps he's sending a message that Linux for the desktop isn't where it needs to be? Either way I see the point of saying he should have presented on a Linux machine and shown off some really easy ways to open and start presenting on a Linux platform. But I won't fault him for using OS X. OS X has an open source legacy and Apple contributes to open source projects at a high level.

Re:butthurt

[Anonymous Coward]

"Where are you, my little object of art? I am here to collect you." - Pepé Le Pew

and AO is???

[Walter White]

There is only one Office suite that works on all three, and is compatible between all three. And that is AO.

What is "AO?" Microsoft Office? (MO) Open Office? (OO) Libre Office? (LO) Some Other Office Suite? (SOOS)

Re:and AO is???

[Ol Olsoc]

There is only one Office suite that works on all three, and is compatible between all three. And that is AO.

What is "AO?" Microsoft Office? (MO) Open Office? (OO) Libre Office? (LO) Some Other Office Suite? (SOOS)

Apache Office.

This is the year

[Anonymous Coward]

Of Linux on the desktop of Linux evangelists.

Year of the Linux "desktop"

[Anonymous Coward]

That doesn't mean laptop. With desktops it's easy to get quality hardware. I have only found a very small handful of laptops that match the quality of a MacBook. The only comparable laptop I've found is the Dell XPS, but I still find the keyboard and touchpad to be much more superior on my old MacBook Air that I got rid of. Hardware aside, I only ever use windows for gaming anymore and that's it, I also don't do much gaming. Fedora has been my main OS for 2 years now

PR People

[kugeln]

I've typically always seen PR folks using Apple products if left to their own devices, as that seems to be the platform of choice for the personality type that makes you want to be a PR person.

Linux has no Vision

[Anonymous Coward]

Something Linux never had and will never have – Vision.

This is a requirement for innovation, creativity, and breaking new ground.

The Linux mentality could never come up this on their own:

Evolution of Mac OS (Mac OS 1.0 - Mac OS X 10.11) 1984-2015

Steve Jobs internal demo of NeXTSTEP 3 (1992)

Déjà vu - NeXTSTEP vs OS X

Linux is just a _copy_ (no vision to create something _new_) of a 45 year old crummy command line, with little else to offer. Linux desktop is for pretend wannabe nerds hiding behind broken bash cruft. Linux desktop is for idiots.

Online petition

[DmitryShurupov]

As I was really disappointed with this news, I've just made an online petition to see how many people would support it and how TLF would react.

Re:Online petition

[Anonymous Coward]

Are you serious??

I understand you think something should be done, but a petition to make someone do what you want? That seems a trifle...overbearing. :-P

Re:Year of the Linux Desktop, just like last year

[Gornkleschnitzer]

Year of the Nuclear Fusion-Powered Linux Desktop?