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No More Pancake Syrup? Climate Change Could Bring an End To Sugar Maples (sciencemag.org)

An anonymous reader shares a research report: Savor that sticky, slightly nutty sweetness drenching your Sunday morning pancakes now. The trees that make maple syrup will struggle to survive climate change, a new study reveals. Researchers had thought that pollution from cars, factories, and agriculture might buffer sugar maples against an increasingly warm and dry climate by supplying soils with fertilizing nitrogen. But the new analysis, which examined 20 years of tree and soil data in four Michigan locations, finds that extra boost of nitrogen won't be enough. Instead, the researchers report today in Ecology, a lack of water will stunt the trees' growth.

363 comments

  1. Well, no more Maple Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    But there's still that liquid-abortion that is artificial syrup.

    1. Re:Well, no more Maple Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Aw, looks like someone didn't get their handjob by a bearded gentleman this morning :(

    2. Re:Well, no more Maple Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Again with your mom.

    3. Re:Well, no more Maple Syrup by Joce640k · · Score: 1

      But there's still that liquid-abortion that is artificial syrup.

      Sure, but only poor people will have to use that.

      This story is just "fake news" to anybody with money.

      --
      No sig today...
    4. Re:Well, no more Maple Syrup by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1

      Sugar maples are not going away. Their range will just shift northward. There will be fewer in Michigan, but more in northern Ontario.

    5. Re:Well, no more Maple Syrup by dryeo · · Score: 4, Insightful

      And how long will it take for those Maples to grow in Northern Ontario? Is the soil suitable? Here, maples prefer rich bottom land soil. Are there other tree species that can move north faster and/or adapt faster? Here, Alders are the primary pioneer species, not surprisingly as they can fix their own nitrogen.
      There's also the question of whether warming will cause more or less rainfall. The Maples around here love rain.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    6. Re:Well, no more Maple Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The fake stuff tastes better, anyways.

    7. Re:Well, no more Maple Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, your mom.

    8. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by c6gunner · · Score: 5, Insightful

      wtf?

      Ontario and Quebec are literally covered in maple trees. Maple syrup productions is practically a cultural tradition in Quebec. The whole Canada/Maple Syrup thing is one of the stereotypes which is actually true.

      How are you seriously wondering if CANADA, the country with a maple leaf on it's flag, will be able to grow maple trees??

    9. Re:Well, no more Maple Syrup by XxtraLarGe · · Score: 1

      And how long will it take for those Maples to grow in Northern Ontario? Is the soil suitable? Here, maples prefer rich bottom land soil.

      They grow fine in the U.P. of Michigan, northern Ontario shouldn't have any problems. And hey, guess what? They didn't get that name because there aren't any maples in Ontario. ;-)

      --
      Taking guns away from the 99% gives the 1% 100% of the power.
    10. Re:Well, no more Maple Syrup by Rakarra · · Score: 1

      Sugar maples are not going away. Their range will just shift northward.

      The problem is that less sunlight falls on northern latitudes. While I like the idea of maple syrup from the Northwest Territories, at the southern border you'll still have about four months of the year where where you only have a couple hours of sunlight a day, and conditions are pretty arid as well. Can a sugar maple survive in that environment? Yes, 'trees' could, life certainly can, but can a specific tree make that adjustment in a 100-year period?

    11. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Man discovers irrigation! Film at 11!

    12. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

      The whole Canada/Maple Syrup thing is one of the stereotypes which is actually true.

      It is known...

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
    13. Re:Well, no more Maple Syrup by pjbgravely · · Score: 1

      How could you not know that deciduous trees drop their leaves and hibernate during the winter? Being further North gives more sunlight for the trees during the summer when the trees have leaves. The only problem for the tree would be if the winter exceed its lower temperature limit.

      --
      Star Trek, there maybe hope.
    14. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by dryeo · · Score: 1

      Yes, I'm actually aware of my countries flag. I'm also aware of how maples grow here in the west, though not so much in the east, which is why I raised some questions. Too many people think trees are like Ents, just pick up and move.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    15. Re:Well, no more Maple Syrup by dryeo · · Score: 2

      Ontario is huge. When talking about northern Ontario, are we talking about around Lake Superior or around James Bay?

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    16. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      How are you seriously wondering if CANADA, the country with a maple leaf on it's flag, will be able to grow maple trees??

      Are you sure it's a maple leaf? https://www.smbc-comics.com/index.php?id=3670

    17. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by HiThere · · Score: 1

      Well, it's reasonable to worry, what with permafrost melting and such. But Canada has a lot of space north of where the trees are currently growing, so I'm not seriously worried about *that*.

      OTOH, the summary pointed the finger at "not enough water", and people have been irrigating from before records started being kept. So unless the report was mis-summarized the headline is blatantly inflammatory.

      --

      I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
    18. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 4, Informative

      The main problem with syrup in Canada is surpluses. . They have production quotas to prevent overproduction and support higher wholesale prices.

      The world is not going to run out of pancake syrup, and stupid alarmist articles like this are counter-productive at getting people to take climate change seriously.

    19. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by c6gunner · · Score: 4, Funny

      Fair enough, and I wouldn't have been surprised by your comment if someone had suggested that Canada could pick up the slack on Banana production, but come on ... Maple Syrup? If there's one thing I expect people to know about us it's that we're all a bunch of maple syrup swilling lumberjacks.

    20. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Well you missed the whole point...

      The real problem, is that, ideally, you need temperature deltas around the freezing point to get the sugar out in the water that you collect through the taps. Ideally something like -6deg.C to +6deg.C everyday. Flowing days if you will... Not too much wind either.

      The weather is all crazy and stuff nowadays. So you can get a terrible season with only a few good flowing days. That is the problem.

      Add to that that:
      1- sugar and water won't flow at all if it is too cold (duh!!!!)
      2- the taps you drilled in the tree will start plugging-up after a while (normal response to the "agression" that the drilling is), like in about 30 days
      3- sap will start to flow and ruin the taste if spring comes in early (contrary to popular belief, what is boiled into syrup is not regular sap, as it is otherwise unpalatable when the burgeoning process kicks-in too early, we call it "eau de bourgeon", literally burgeoning water)

      So you are bound to only hope for a few pumping days in the season. Anything between mid-January to mid-April can now be considered "fair game"... Sugar producing is not for the faint of heart...

      Reply to This Parent Share

    21. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by dryeo · · Score: 1

      Birch syrup around here, makes interesting beer. As for bananas, it is surprising how many people have them growing in their yards around here now a days, along with palm trees. The bananas even produce fruit the odd year.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    22. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by c · · Score: 1

      Ontario and Quebec are literally covered in maple trees. Maple syrup productions is practically a cultural tradition in Quebec.

      Yes and no; we've got all kinds of maple trees, but the range of the sugar maple doesn't actually extend that far north in either province. From the latitude of the great lakes on down, roughly.

      That being said, Canada will be the last place to run out of maple syrup, and I don't doubt that the tree will spread north as things warm up.

      --
      Log in or piss off.
    23. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by kenai_alpenglow · · Score: 1

      Don't know about production-quality trees, but you've got sugar maple trees growing wild in an area in TEXAS. They grow well throughout the southern US (don't know about Florida). They make great ornamentals as well--The grow faster than a white oak, slower than a red oak. They just don't compete well in the wild with other trees (including red maples, which the native folks used to tap for a "sugary drink") there. So if the climate does move north why won't those there still live? Maybe plantations for new production, if needed.

    24. Re:Well, no more Maple Syrup by dryeo · · Score: 1

      How long does it take for the seeds to ripen? Here the Big Leafed Maple flowers early in the spring and drops its keys late in the fall, so about 8-9 months. Short season means seeds don't develop.
      Maple syrup production is also dependent on the correct weather in the spring, warm days and cold nights. How the weather ends up in the far north is a big question mark.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    25. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No stories like this are not counter productive.

      Gets people to think about how climate change will affect their lives

      In oh so many little ways. And big ways too.

      Stop denying it, you are not helping

    26. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh yes, birch beer! Spruce beer too.

      But not pine beer, gah. Retsina ok tho.

    27. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by c6gunner · · Score: 2

      Getting people to think about how something will affect their lives is great. But when they find out that you lied to them, they tend to get a bit mad.

      Tyrants always pull the "we have to shape the truth for the public good" thing, but it's never convincing. It's an especially stupid thing to do when you're dealing with an undeniably true problem like climate change. Why piss people off with stupid lies when the truth is enough of a problem on it's own? Even if you're the kind of immoral shitbag who doesn't mind knowlngly lying to millions of people you should at least stop and consider that, tactically speaking, it's a shit approach.

    28. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by pots · · Score: 1

      Do the trees in Texas produce enough sap to make a significant amount of syrup? My understanding of maple harvesting is that the trees need a particular climate, with consistently below-freezing nights and above-freezing days, to get the sap to flow well. Consequently, even though there are maple trees all over, there are only two regions where maple sap is produced in significant quantity: the northeat US / southeast Canadian region, and some place in Russia.

    29. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by c6gunner · · Score: 1

      Those are all great details, but the range of the sugar maple is still more than wide enough that warming hasn't affected production and even much greater warming will still allow harvesting in more northerly locales. Plus there's nothing preventing the maple from spreading further north as the climate warms.

      More importantly, thought, TFA posits that lack of water will be the real issue rather than warming itself. This is doubly silly. Irrigation is a problem which we worked out millennia ago, and it can be used in especially dry regions. The majority of the sugar maple crop shouldn't require irrigation at all, though, meaning that the worst case scenario here is that Michigan maple syrup becomes slightly more expensive to produce than Quebec maple syrup.

    30. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1

      Gets people to think about how climate change will affect their lives

      No it doesn't. It just erodes your credibility.

      Remember the wise advice of Mark Twain: "When in doubt, tell the truth."

    31. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you're invested in this global warming, global cooling, global bullshitting scheme, you will crater this year.

    32. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well the unfiltered thruth is this : "climate change will kill all mapple trees in Michigan, mapple syrup production in Ontario will flourish, you will pay around a 100 dollars for a syrup bottle though...have a nice day".

    33. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      After the recent election, I asked Mark Twain about that, and he said "Well, fuck it, lie your ass off, apparently nobody gives a goddamned shit if you bury the truth in a shallow grave, piss on it, then praise the smell of your own farts" so maybe you should keep up to date.

    34. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by bobmajdakjr · · Score: 1

      i dont think i have ever even had real maple syrup before. recently i started checking all the bottles i pick up after the cvs brand syrup had a weird texture/consistency and yeah âoewell, shitâ

    35. Re:Well, no more Maple Syrup by Marxist+Hacker+42 · · Score: 1

      Exactly right. What is the matter with say, producing Maple Syrup in Greenland instead of New Hampshire? Might even get a longer sap season out of it!

      --
      SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
    36. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by Marxist+Hacker+42 · · Score: 1

      Lying to people just makes the whole rumor of Climate change as false grow.

      --
      SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
    37. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by Marxist+Hacker+42 · · Score: 1

      At which point Greenland will pick up production, at$.75/bottle, to undersell Canada.

      --
      SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
    38. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by Marxist+Hacker+42 · · Score: 1

      Plenty of soil bottomland in the Tundra, once it melts.

      --
      SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
    39. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by dryeo · · Score: 1

      Most of Ontario (and Quebec) is basically bedrock, the Canadian Shield, which was scoured clean by the glaciers.
      From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

      The current surface expression of the Shield is one of very thin soil lying on top of the bedrock, with many bare outcrops. This arrangement was caused by severe glaciation during the ice age, which covered the Shield and scraped the rock clean.

      The lowlands of the Canadian Shield have a very dense soil that is not suitable for forestation; it also contains many marshes and bogs (muskegs). The rest of the region has coarse soil that does not retain moisture well and is frozen with permafrost throughout the year. Forests are not as dense in the north.

      What forests there are, are Boreal in nature, partially due to the crappy soil. From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

      Taiga soil tends to be young and poor in nutrients. It lacks the deep, organically enriched profile present in temperate deciduous forests.[25] The thinness of the soil is due largely to the cold, which hinders the development of soil and the ease with which plants can use its nutrients.[25] Fallen leaves and moss can remain on the forest floor for a long time in the cool, moist climate, which limits their organic contribution to the soil; acids from evergreen needles further leach the soil, creating spodosol, also known as podzol.[26] Since the soil is acidic due to the falling pine needles, the forest floor has only lichens and some mosses growing on it. In clearings in the forest and in areas with more boreal deciduous trees, there are more herbs and berries growing. Diversity of soil organisms in the boreal forest is high, comparable to the tropical rainforest.[27]

      If you have any citations for rich soil existing in the tundra, I'd be interested .

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    40. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by Marxist+Hacker+42 · · Score: 1

      What do you think muskeg turns into once it rots? Of course, to rot, it must first melt...

      --
      SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
    41. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by LinuxLuver · · Score: 1

      The study was in Michigan. Canada won't be having any trouble for quite a while yet.

      --
      Only boring people are ever bored.
    42. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by dryeo · · Score: 1

      Peat. Muskeg is just basically bog.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    43. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by c6gunner · · Score: 1

      aka fertilizer.

    44. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by dryeo · · Score: 1

      No. Fertilizer is stuff like nitrogen, phosphorous and potassium. This is more like organic filler. Good for holding moisture and buffering fertilizer but by itself it grows stuff like crap. It also has a tendency to being acidic, which reduces most plants take up of fertilizer.
      There's a peat bog down the road from me, the only trees growing in it are stunted Lodgepole Pine.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    45. Re:Well, no more Maple Syrup by lsatenstein · · Score: 1

      And how long will it take for those Maples to grow in Northern Ontario? Is the soil suitable? Here, maples prefer rich bottom land soil. Are there other tree species that can move north faster and/or adapt faster? Here, Alders are the primary pioneer species, not surprisingly as they can fix their own nitrogen.
      There's also the question of whether warming will cause more or less rainfall. The Maples around here love rain.

      Quebec will become the maple syrup capital of Canada, possibly tied with Ontario and British Columbia.

      --
      Leslie Satenstein Montreal Quebec Canada
    46. Re:Well, no more Maple Syrup by dryeo · · Score: 1

      Probably too warm of springs here in BC. We don't have much in the way of hardwood forests here either as the conifers usually out compete them.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    47. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by Marxist+Hacker+42 · · Score: 1

      And Peat is basically soil. Very good for growing a wide variety of things.

      --
      SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
    48. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by Marxist+Hacker+42 · · Score: 1

      And thus Japanese Maple which while it has a lower output of sap than sugar maple or bigleaf, still can be tapped for syrup, and LOVES acidic, organic fill soil.

      --
      SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
    49. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by dryeo · · Score: 1

      This, http://homeguides.sfgate.com/t..., claims that Maples like a pH of 5.5-7.3 whereas peat usually measures more like 4.4 according to http://thegardenofoz.org/peat..... Your article doesn't actually say what the ideal pH for Japanese Maples is though they do compare them to blueberries and various members of the Rhodo family so it sounds like they do like quite acidic soil, which is likely rare for an Acer. Someone else mentioned problems with the invasive Japanese Lilac in Sugar Maple forests. Lilacs hate acidic soil so I assume they're flourishing in closer to neutral soil.
      They also like light fluffy well drained soil in general and like so many plants, need oxygen for the roots, not really bog plants. Add enough sand, at least equal to the peat and add perhaps 25% compost, cultivate, and it might work. Not really efficient for large plantations of Maples.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    50. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by dryeo · · Score: 1

      Recipe for lawn soil, 60-70% sand, 15-20% peat and 15-20% compost. Peat makes a wonderful soil amendment, especially if starting with clay or needing to acidify your soil. By itself, no nutrients and no air for the roots to take oxygen up.
      Most plants die when waterlogged due to lack of oxygen and peat forms under anaerobic conditions.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    51. Re: Well, no more Maple Syrup by eric_harris_76 · · Score: 1

      stupid alarmist articles like this are counter-productive at getting people to take climate change seriously.

      Personally, I think they're doing a public service.

      But that's just because I know Al Gore bought seaside real estate. (Or so I've been told.)

      Of course, it could just mean he he feels Good Will Prevail. Or that he's not sure, but he wants to have an even greater personal take in the GWP outcome.

      --
      There's no time like the present. Well, the past used to be.
  2. Ok, this climate change thing just got real by disgruntledlurker · · Score: 4, Funny

    For the love of God, won't somebody please think of the pancakes?!?

    1. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There's really only one question when it comes to syrup;

      Aunt Jemima or Log Cabin?

      And there is only one right answer.

    2. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      There's really only one question when it comes to syrup;

      Aunt Jemima or Log Cabin?

      And there is only one right answer.

      Yes, the correct answer is Mrs. Buttersworth.

    3. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by Flea+of+Pain · · Score: 2

      For the love of God, won't somebody please think of the CANADIANS?!?

      Fixed that for you.

      --
      Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.
    4. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 1

      For the love of God, won't somebody please think of the pancakes?!?

      I am! Please leave the maple syrup off it!

      There is something about Maple Syrup that is really off-putting to me. I can't stand to be in the same room as anyone who is using it. Vinegar has a similar reaction to me. Something about being in a room with someone pouring vinegar on their chips, or maple syrup on their pancakes makes my stomach churn and completely kills my appetite. I'm not a picky eater- but anything with either of those smells is going to turn my stomach.

      Maple Syrup to me smells like a mix of really strong Urine and Roadkill Skunk; I can't see how anyone can put that in their mouth... but we're all different. There are even some weirdos out there that don't like pineapple on pizza.

      --
      "That's the way to do it" - Punch
    5. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No shit!

    6. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 2

      For the love of God, won't somebody please think of the CANADIANS?!?

      Fixed that for you.

      I understand Canadians now that I know they are pancakes.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    7. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      For the love of God, won't somebody please think of the pancakes?!?

      I am! Please leave the maple syrup off it!

      There is something about Maple Syrup that is really off-putting to me. I can't stand to be in the same room as anyone who is using it.

      Tase and smell being related, have some wide variations. I have never heard of maple syrup issues, but if you have a problem, it's real. I have a sharp sense of smell, but I cannot smell bayberries. I also can smell distinct differences between males and females that others don't seem to notice. Just to be certain, I'm talking about clean and unperfurmed of either. Some times I think people react by way of their sexual preferences even if they aren't concious of it.

      I can't see how anyone can put that in their mouth... but we're all different. There are even some weirdos out there that don't like pineapple on pizza.

      It's sort of unfortunate, because for most of us, maple syrup is a sweet and mellow taste that is just this side of heaven.

      I agree on the pineapple on pizza. A pineapple and ham pizza is my favorite, but I don't get it too often because no one else in my circle likes it. Jerks, the lot of them!

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    8. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by corychristison · · Score: 2

      For the love of God, won't somebody please think of the CANADIANS?!?

      Fixed that for you.

      No doubt. Canadian here.

      Canada supplies around 71% of the worlds maple syrup. Which contributes around $381,000,000 CAD to our economy just in exports.

      Source: http://www.agr.gc.ca/eng/industry-markets-and-trade/market-information-by-sector/horticulture/horticulture-sector-reports/statistical-overview-of-the-canadian-maple-industry-2016/?id=1509039990148

    9. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Karo!

    10. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Claims to be Canadian but did not apologize.... LIAR.

    11. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maple Syrup to me smells like a mix of really strong Urine and Roadkill Skunk; I can't see how anyone can put that in their mouth... but we're all different. There are even some weirdos out there that don't like pineapple on pizza.

      If you like maple syrup, you'll love vegemite.

    12. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      So, here's the study. The bolded clause at the end, which relies on no data whatsoever, but is only a ritual obeisance to the Narrative, is the only part that supports the headline. My congratulations to the authors for retaining a shred of integrity.

      Abstract
      Most forest ecosystems are simultaneously affected by concurrent global change drivers. However, when assessing these effects, studies have mainly focused on the responses to single factors and have rarely evaluated the joined effects of the multiple aspects of environmental change. Here, we analyzed the combined effects of anthropogenic nitrogen (N) deposition and climatic conditions on the radial growth of Acer saccharum, a dominant tree species in eastern North American forests. We capitalized on a long-term N deposition study, replicated along a latitudinal gradient, that has been taking place for more than 20 yr. We analyzed tree radial growth as a function of anthropogenic N deposition (ambient and experimental addition) and of summer temperature and soil water conditions. Our results reveal that experimental N deposition enhances radial growth of this species, an effect that was accentuated as temperature increased and soil water became more limiting. The spatial and temporal extent of our data also allowed us to assert that the positive effects of growing under the experimental N deposition are likely due to changes in the physiological performance of this species, and not due to the positive correlation between soil N and soil water holding capacity, as has been previously speculated in other studies. Our simulations of tree growth under forecasted climate scenarios specific for this region also revealed that although anthropogenic N deposition may enhance tree growth under a large array of environmental conditions, it will not mitigate the expected effects of growing under the considerably drier conditions characteristic of our most extreme climatic scenario

    13. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by corychristison · · Score: 1

      When did Slashdot become Reddit?

    14. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 1

      Maple Syrup to me smells like a mix of really strong Urine and Roadkill Skunk; I can't see how anyone can put that in their mouth... but we're all different. There are even some weirdos out there that don't like pineapple on pizza.

      If you like maple syrup, you'll love vegemite.

      Vegemite is kinda salty and tasteless. I neither love nor hate it.

      Marmite is much better.

      --
      "That's the way to do it" - Punch
    15. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by sexconker · · Score: 1

      About 2 years ago.

    16. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Didn't you hear the way he said No doubt? Listen again. Pretty sure he said no doot. Sorry you missed that the first time. (Also Canadian).

    17. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's because pineapple on pizza is wrong and should be illegal. I do agree with you that maple syrup is disgusting, though.

    18. Re: Ok, this climate change thing just got real by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Curious, is it real maple syrup or that corn syrup based crap some companies try to pass off as maple syrup?

      Because they are very distinctively different. Corn syrup is horrible. Real maple syrup is delightful.

    19. Re:Ok, this climate change thing just got real by dacaldar · · Score: 1

      Mod parent up

      I'm a bit disappointed at this Ameri-centric article. So Michigan might lose maple syrup. Ontario has lots, and Quebec is like "tiens ma biere".

      Canadian sugar maple range is lower than Michigan, and has plenty of water sources - it'll be one of the last places in the NE to dry up.

      I think we'll be ok....

  3. Tea, Earl Grey, hot by jfdavis668 · · Score: 2

    Don't worry, we will soon invent the replicator and you can make all you want. Of course, it will be powered by a coal fired electrical plant.

    1. Re:Tea, Earl Grey, hot by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Who says it couldn't? If the captain asked for just "tea", or "tea, the usual way", I'm sure it would get it right. However the captain didn't spend his entire life on the enterprise; developing the habit of being precise with your requests to replicators would probably be good general practice to ensure that you get what you want, wherever you happen to be. And officers on pseudo-military vessels probably tend not to be sloppy when it comes to giving instructions, even to machines.

    2. Re:Tea, Earl Grey, hot by Shogun37 · · Score: 0

      No, we'll just switch to using SJWs for our power needs. California and NYC alone could power the entire North American continent. Talk out wind power...

    3. Re:Tea, Earl Grey, hot by bn-7bc · · Score: 1

      Well that seem quite spesific it spesifys botf tyope of beverage, blend/make an temparture (you might hav a profile that tells the replicators what exsact temp you want hot to be, as that might vary between individuals)

    4. Re:Tea, Earl Grey, hot by istartedi · · Score: 1

      Scotty, shovel in more coal. We need to make Monroe, Virginia on time!

      --
      For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
    5. Re:Tea, Earl Grey, hot by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I wish we could specify to you how to spell correctly.

  4. Only for elites by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I dare you to find real maple syrup from anywhere that's serving pancakes. Even high end restaurants just carry the high-fructose corn syrup this days. Just like many things in this world, cheap and fast are the wave of the *future*.

    1. Re:Only for elites by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Cracker Barrel still uses the one true Maple syrup. Everywhere else uses the disgusting fake stuff.

    2. Re: Only for elites by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

      Sadly, Cracker Barrel uses a 50/50 blend now.

    3. Re:Only for elites by david_thornley · · Score: 1

      I've been to restaurants that will serve it to you at an extra charge.

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
    4. Re: Only for elites by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Hmm, bottle here in my hand says 55/45 blend. But yeah, can confirm it's not pure.

    5. Re: Only for elites by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You are correct, and it's been like that since at least 2009.

      https://consumerist.com/2009/1...

    6. Re:Only for elites by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 2

      Maybe that's a USA thing. Real maple syrup is actually quite common in restaurants in Québec.

      --
      #DeleteFacebook
    7. Re: Only for elites by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      oh shit. That sucks.

    8. Re:Only for elites by guyniraxn · · Score: 1

      Corn is subsidized in the US, making maple flavored corn syrup far cheaper and common.

    9. Re:Only for elites by AvitarX · · Score: 1

      I've found that in the US people prefer fake syrup. I personally find it unconsumable, I'd much rather just use butter and rub it in sausage/bacon grease, but most people prefer the thick stay on top gross stuff. That's my observation from hosting brunches anyway.

      --
      Wow, sent an e-mail as suggested when clicking on "use classic" banner, and got a fast response that addressed my msg
    10. Re:Only for elites by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I doubt any high end restaurant serves pancakes and syrup at all.

    11. Re:Only for elites by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      Maybe that's a USA thing. Real maple syrup is actually quite common in restaurants in Québec.

      Yeah, I've always been amazed when going to Supermarkets in Canada. Freaking big cans of it, and not all that expensive. I always bring several back.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    12. Re:Only for elites by vux984 · · Score: 1

      Well that wasn't hard....

      http://dedutch.com/menus/the-p...

      First item on the menu... 'The Canadian'...'Served with genuine maple syrup'

    13. Re:Only for elites by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Not yet, but should it become rare somehow, watch them go nuts over it.

      In my experience, when it comes to expensive dining, it's not the taste that matters but showing off that you can afford it.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    14. Re:Only for elites by Creepy · · Score: 1

      Even if corn wasn't subsidized, it'd likely still be cheaper than maple. Lots more ramp up time with trees, a limited amount can be tapped from each, requires a larger growing area, etc. My sugar maple is relatively young (like 3 years old) and is nowhere near thick enough to tap. I'm guessing they need 8-10 years at least.

    15. Re:Only for elites by Hal_Porter · · Score: 1

      Shame about the racist name. I'd eat there if they renamed it to Caucasian American Barrel.

      --
      echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
    16. Re:Only for elites by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can't be racist against white people, silly!

    17. Re:Only for elites by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 1

      Maples are usually tapped beginning at 30 to 40 years of age.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

      It seems you'll have to wait a few more decades.

      --
      #DeleteFacebook
    18. Re:Only for elites by AlanBDee · · Score: 1

      I've found that in the US people don't know there's a difference. It wasn't until my wife came back from a trip to Maine with actual maple syrup that I realized I had been eating maple flavored corn syrup. At my grocer, 100% pure maple syrup is 5-10 times as expensive, but worth every penny.

    19. Re:Only for elites by AvitarX · · Score: 1

      I had to submit and start buying both types because people would complain about:
      1) the maple flavor
      2) the sweetness
      3) that it soaked in

      I agree also that most people don't realize they aren't usually using maple syrup, but also, once they realize, most seem to prefer the fake stuff.

      --
      Wow, sent an e-mail as suggested when clicking on "use classic" banner, and got a fast response that addressed my msg
    20. Re: Only for elites by DigiShaman · · Score: 1

      BTW, what happened with Brad's wife? Why was she fired?

      --
      Life is not for the lazy.
    21. Re:Only for elites by laie_techie · · Score: 1

      I've found that in the US people don't know there's a difference. It wasn't until my wife came back from a trip to Maine with actual maple syrup that I realized I had been eating maple flavored corn syrup. At my grocer, 100% pure maple syrup is 5-10 times as expensive, but worth every penny.

      My family was poor when I was growing up. We didn't use store-bought syrup; we made our own! 3 cups white sugar, 1 cup brown sugar, 2 cups water, 2 tsp Mapeline, and 1 tsp vanilla (boil sugars and water, remove from heat and stir in flavorings). I dislike the fake stuff they sell in stores. I buy dark amber maple syrup from Costco.

  5. I use preserves by rsilvergun · · Score: 1

    A lot less calories and I like the taste better. It's a pain to find the ones that are more fruit than cane sugar though.

    --
    Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
    1. Re:I use preserves by XxtraLarGe · · Score: 2

      A lot less calories and I like the taste better. It's a pain to find the ones that are more fruit than cane sugar though.

      To each their own, but there's nothing quite like fresh maple syrup. My dad has several trees up on the farm that he taps to make his own. If you have time & patience, it's free, and you know there's no cane sugar in it. ;-)

      --
      Taking guns away from the 99% gives the 1% 100% of the power.
    2. Re:I use preserves by lactose99 · · Score: 1

      This is truth right here.

      --
      Fully licensed blockchain psychiatrist
  6. Trees die if you don't water them? by erapert · · Score: 2

    Well no shit, Sherlock.

    1. Re:Trees die if you don't water them? by gtall · · Score: 1

      The point is rather than if you plan for a commercial maple outfit, how many trees on what kind of acreage can you possibly water without (1) running out of that free water from the stream you'll be needing, (2) keeping the young trees watered long enough to become of a size you can squeeze for sap.

      Scale matters, you should get some.

    2. Re:Trees die if you don't water them? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So what does this have to do with global warming?

    3. Re:Trees die if you don't water them? by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      The point is rather than if you plan for a commercial maple outfit, how many trees on what kind of acreage can you possibly water without (1) running out of that free water from the stream you'll be needing, (2) keeping the young trees watered long enough to become of a size you can squeeze for sap.

      Scale matters, you should get some.

      Warmth and the way the winter weather breaks is a bigger issue AFAIAC. The Maple trees will slowly work their way north. The question is will they supplant other trees, and will there be people to harvest the sap when it rises in late winter early spring? These issues will be a bigger problem.

      Another thing interesting is there is a claim that the climate will be drier. I hope they are not talking about climate overall. If they are, they have it backwards. Some areas will be drier, others will be a lot wetter. Average temps going up equals higher rate of water evaporating, so unless it disappears like the water that covered the entire earth by several miles after the Noahchian flood, therre's going to be more rainfall overall.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
  7. You fat fucks by bazmail · · Score: 0

    If you eat pancakes for breakfast then I have news for you, its not the lack of syrup that will kill you, its CHD.

    1. Re:You fat fucks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Enjoy your morning gruel, you poor, pancakeless soul

    2. Re:You fat fucks by mspohr · · Score: 0

      CHD? I assume you mean Coronary Heart Disease.
      This can be caused by butter (or other synthetic fat) and eggs but you don't need either to make pancakes.

      --
      I don't read your sig. Why are you reading mine?
    3. Re:You fat fucks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This can be caused by butter (or other synthetic fat) and eggs but you don't need either to make pancakes.

      The link between saturated fats and heart disease has been disproven, since it seems you haven't been keeping up. Butter and eggs are back on the healthy menu.

    4. Re:You fat fucks by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Aww, someone's doc told him to lay off the sweets...

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    5. Re:You fat fucks by penandpaper · · Score: 1

      I prefer fried chicken and waffles you insensitive clod! Still need maple syrup.

    6. Re:You fat fucks by butchersong · · Score: 1

      Hello. I don't often get a chance to talk to people that live in the 1980's. I have some bad news about Michael Jackson and Bill Cosby...

    7. Re:You fat fucks by mspohr · · Score: 1

      I'm even older than that... I live in the 60s
      Now, get off my lawn.

      --
      I don't read your sig. Why are you reading mine?
    8. Re:You fat fucks by sexconker · · Score: 1

      Butter and eggs are good for you.

    9. Re:You fat fucks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      CHD? I assume you mean Coronary Heart Disease.

      Nope: Canadian Health Department.

    10. Re:You fat fucks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      newsflash! Everything will kill you.

  8. Are you serious... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    A lack of water will stunt the growth of trees... What exactly are the qualifications for being an ecologist again? Are they hiring?

    Seriously though. Why is it that every time climate change gets brought up it's 30 or 40 assumptions deep into a chain of cold-sweat fever dreams about shit that people can totally live without anyway?

    1. Re:Are you serious... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I can't live without maple syrup. I will kill myself if I can't get it anymore.

    2. Re:Are you serious... by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 1

      A lack of water will stunt the growth of trees... What exactly are the qualifications for being an ecologist again? Are they hiring?

      I'm no botanist, but I do know that if you put water on plants, they grow.

      --
      #DeleteFacebook
    3. Re: Are you serious... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Like out of a toilet?

    4. Re:Are you serious... by Joce640k · · Score: 1

      Why is it that every time climate change gets brought up it's 30 or 40 assumptions deep into a chain of cold-sweat fever dreams about shit that people can totally live without anyway?

      What sort of mouthbreathing drooltard can't make the connection between whole classes of trees dying and big problems on planet earth?

      This isn't smartphone factories that are closing because of bad weather.

      --
      No sig today...
    5. Re: Are you serious... by penandpaper · · Score: 1

      Yea, well I haven't seen no plants grow out of no toilets before!

    6. Re:Are you serious... by kenh · · Score: 2

      Or Brawndo - it's got electrolytes!

      --
      Ken
    7. Re:Are you serious... by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      A lack of water will stunt the growth of trees... What exactly are the qualifications for being an ecologist again? Are they hiring?

      I'm no botanist, but I do know that if you put water on plants, they grow.

      The article is badly flawed. Water isn't going to be the determinant. I'm not certain how they projected that the Northeast of North America is goint to turn into a desert anyhow.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    8. Re:Are you serious... by rogoshen1 · · Score: 1

      well because scare stories drive page hits.

      Coffee, bananas, maple syrup, skinny, attractive women. These are things rumored to be going extinct.

      They are also make for a much more interesting headline than "global temperature averages are thought to change by X in the next 30 years" (Usually some vanishingly small number, relative to what we're used to dealing with in every day life.)

    9. Re: Are you serious... by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 1

      Well, I mean, it doesn't have to be out of the toilet, but, yeah, that's the idea.

      --
      #DeleteFacebook
    10. Re:Are you serious... by Bob+the+Super+Hamste · · Score: 1

      The best global warming headline ever is this one from the BBC:
      Great tits cope well with warming

      --
      Time to offend someone
  9. Pffft by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Another garbage post by mstrash. Good job.

    1. Re:Pffft by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Cause this site has Natalie Portman, naked and covered in grits. Or at least it used to.

  10. Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Fly+Swatter · · Score: 3, Informative

    Most consumers will never notice, most of the pancake syrups in the supermarket are just manufactured sugar with some coloring.

    And well, another corporate cartel with price fixing experiences bad karma, let me shed a tear for you. As for the trees, I do feel bad for them.

    1. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      There's a brand at my local store that is made with real sugar, at least. The price isn't significantly higher than the HFCS stuff.

      Pure maple syrup is $20 for a tiny little bottle. Too expensive for my tastes.

    2. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Real maple syrup is MILES and MILES away better than that sugar crap. It's not even in the same arena tastewise.

      I'd rather go without pancakes or waffles than have that HFCS crap, simply because it tastes bland in comparison to true maple syrup.

    3. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Thyamine · · Score: 1

      Those of us who enjoy real maple syrup will. If you like chemicals, continue with your manufactured sugary crap.

      --
      I will shred my adversaries. Pull their eyes out just enough to turn them towards their mewing, mutilated faces. Illyria
    4. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by FatAlb3rt · · Score: 1

      I'd bet that more than 1/2 the people under the age of 30 have never had anything other than the corn syrup stuff.

    5. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by jfdavis668 · · Score: 4, Funny

      That's why I use High Fructose Bee Vomit.

    6. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Eloking · · Score: 2

      Most consumers will never notice, most of the pancake syrups in the supermarket are just manufactured sugar with some coloring.

      And well, another corporate cartel with price fixing experiences bad karma, let me shed a tear for you. As for the trees, I do feel bad for them.

      As a representant of the nicest country in the world, I call that this is utter nonsense! (Sorry about that)

      Talking about the trees... If the climate get hotter, couldn't we simply move the production more to the north? After all, It's not like we don't have space avalaible : http://www12.statcan.gc.ca/cen...

      --
      Elok
    7. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It must be nice to be so rich. For me a bottle of real maple syrup will by itself cost half what I spend on a weeks groceries. A bottle of real syrup or half a weeks groceries? I'll take the groceries, thankyouverymuch.

    8. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by oldmac31310 · · Score: 1

      I'd rather go without pancakes or waffles. Fuck your syrup.

      --
      http://www.acetonestudio.com
    9. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      yuck, yuck, yuck. The only acceptable substitutes for real maple syrup are real fruit syrup or honey, nothing else will do. I'll eat a plain, buttered pancake before mrs butterworth or anything else touch my plate.

    10. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by penandpaper · · Score: 4, Funny

      I do like chemicals. All kinds of chemicals. I ingest them all the time. What do you have against chemicals?

      Pro-tip, stay away from dihydrogen monoxide. It's a real killer! Nasty stuff.

    11. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Vermonter · · Score: 1

      Buying maple syrup in tiny bottles is a sucker's bet. Spend $55-$65 to get a whole gallon, and have enough to last you at least a year.

    12. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Freischutz · · Score: 4, Funny

      That's why I use High Fructose Bee Vomit.

      Same problem, manufactured sugar with some coloring.

    13. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 1

      +1 Funny from me, my good sir.

      --
      #DeleteFacebook
    14. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Gilgaron · · Score: 1

      I've not seen honey for sale, labeled as such, that wasn't honey when you look at the ingredient list. Are they lying/being fooled by suppliers?

    15. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And well, another corporate cartel with price fixing

      A finite amount of real maple syrup is made every year, and the taste is unique to maple sap, and you can't just fake it. The higher the quality, the higher the price.

      That the maple syrup producers have decided "we're not selling you our stuff for stupidly low prices which don't let us recoup our costs or reflect the scarcity of our goods" is only rational. You may want to buy it for pennies, but it's a limited commodity, and prices reflect that.

      You wanna eat crappy high-fructose corn syrup? Then buy the cheap shit and quite your whining. I guarantee you corn is far more subsidised than maple trees.

      That there have been Maple Syrup Heists in Canada tells you it has value as a commodity.

      Most consumers are idiots, which is pretty much an established fact. The fact that most people can't tell the difference doesn't mean there aren't people who can. Hell, I know someone whose father made award winning maple syrup which was head and shoulders above pretty much everything else. If you grew up with the real stuff, the fake stuff is just garbage pretending to taste good sold to people who don't know better.

      Maybe you simply don't know a fucking thing about maple syrup or what actual food tastes like because you're used to eating shitty products made with HFCS?

    16. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by CaptainDork · · Score: 2

      Of all the comments so far, this one is at least addressing TFS, so thank you.

      If the climate get hotter, couldn't we simply move the production more to the north? After all, It's not like we don't have space available.

      Migrating trees can be done, but the questions is: can we also migrate the ecosystem that the trees upon which the trees depend?

      They have pretty strict requirements regarding sunlight, growing periods, seasonal air temperatures, and the soil must contain certain recipes of nutrients, temperatures, moisture, pH, and microbial activity.

      Humans can migrate and adjust to changes and adapt to life, perhaps, without maple syrup.

      --
      It little behooves the best of us to comment on the rest of us.
    17. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Flea+of+Pain · · Score: 4, Funny

      A whole YEAR??!!?!?! You clearly aren't Canadian. That's aboot a weeks worth in my house.

      --
      Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.
    18. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not high fructose. It's Rice syrup from china. They're not disclosing it, calling it pure honey and shipping it through 3rd party? countries, to disguise it.

    19. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      For the last few years, it's been listed in the ingredients as "Invert sugar", but it's still actually honey.

      The FDA has a raging boner for chemical names for food and demands everyone list their ingredients accordingly.

    20. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Since corn syrup is pretty much exclusively a US thing, I highly doubt that.

    21. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by SScorpio · · Score: 1

      Depends on the size of the bottle and what you spend on groceries. You can get a quart or liter of real maple syrup for $15-20.

      And a little bit of it goes a long way.

    22. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I spend about 40 bucks a week on groceries, so as I said, a bottle is about half a week of groceries. And it may go a long way, but it's still 20 bucks for a condiment.

    23. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Pray tell, where does this magical syrup come from that completely devoid of chemicals?

    24. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Talking about the trees... If the climate get hly you canotter, couldn't we simply move the production more to the north? After all, It's not like we don't have space avalaible

      Alternatively, you could have oranges and mangoes. Rejoice! See the bright side!

    25. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wrong, the real stuff tastes like toe-jam.

    26. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Like the Gros Michel banana -- remembered only by the flavor of artificial banana -- "Maple" trees will be remembered by the taste of artificial maple flavored syrup and hideous plastic wreaths is the fall.

    27. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Meh - the fake stuff tastes better. I hate to say so since I usually try to go "premium" on lots of things, but I've go three bottles of real genuine maple syrup sitting unused in my pantry right now. I keep them around in case anybody else wants some, but realistically Ms Butterworth's tastes better to me.

    28. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Pro-tip, stay away from dihydrogen monoxide. It's a real killer! Nasty stuff.

      I like to bathe in it, even though laying face down in an inch of it will kill you. Less than 1cc of it also could kill you, if you froze it and propelled it out of a barrel at high enough speed... and into yourself, in a vital location. Some chemicals are fine or even beneficial in small quantities, but what about larger ones? Many "vitamins" and minerals can cause negative health effects if overconsumed, even ones which are necessary for life.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    29. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      can we also migrate the ecosystem that the trees upon which the trees depend?

      The tree farms? Sugar maples exist in their current numbers precisely because we farm them. The ecosystem you're fretting about is more available than you imagine and less a stringent requirement than you imagine.

    30. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'd bet that more than 1/2 the people over 30 have never had anything other than the corn syrup stuff.

    31. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes. Chinese honey is faked, and flooding the US market.

    32. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by penandpaper · · Score: 2

      Really nasty stuff.
      http://www.dhmo.org/facts.html

      Some choice dangers of the stuff.

        Death due to accidental inhalation of DHMO, even in small quantities.
      Prolonged exposure to solid DHMO causes severe tissue damage.
      Excessive ingestion produces a number of unpleasant though not typically life-threatening side-effects.
      DHMO is a major component of acid rain.
      Gaseous DHMO can cause severe burns.
      Contributes to soil erosion.
      Leads to corrosion and oxidation of many metals.
      Found in biopsies of pre-cancerous tumors and lesions.

      Beware! We should act now to ban the stuff.

    33. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      whoosh?

      CAPTCHA: bafflers

    34. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Freischutz · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Most consumers will never notice, most of the pancake syrups in the supermarket are just manufactured sugar with some coloring.

      That's why I use High Fructose Bee Vomit.

      Same problem, manufactured sugar with some coloring.

      I've not seen honey for sale, labeled as such, that wasn't honey when you look at the ingredient list. Are they lying/being fooled by suppliers?

      Somebody finds my comment funny, but it wasn't meant to be. Counterfeit honey is a real problem and detecting it using sophisticated scientific methods is a growing business since the counterfeiters are getting extremely sophisticated at beating the quality assurance tests. A lot of cheap counterfeit honey comes from China and it is bankrupting natural honey producers around the globe in large numbers. There is a new documentary series on Netflix Called 'Rotten' that contains an excellent episode on the honey industry and the problem with fake honey.

    35. Re: Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I just checked. 2 brands, both with honey listed.

    36. Re: Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Fun fact: the dairy industry lobbies the government to allow them to add all kinds of stuff to milk and cream without having to display it on the label.

      Most recently, they pushed to make it legal to add sucralose or aspartame to chocolate milk without showing it on the label. Thankfully that was shot down.

    37. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The preferred IUPAC name is oxidane.

    38. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Umm...perhaps we should ask the question "if you can't tell the difference without intense scientific investigation & instruments can we really call something 'fake'"..."man-made" maybe but "fake"...its like man-made diamonds...indistinguishable from 'real' diamonds so they force the producers of man-made diamonds to laser etch them so they can be 'distinguished' from 'real' (or its vice-versa can't remember which).

      It's not for me to make pronouncements but seems to me if we can get honey & diamonds at significantly cheaper price that's a 'win'.

    39. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Best comment. I think this all the time when people go on about 'chemicals'.

    40. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by SScorpio · · Score: 1

      Don't look at the spices aisle then.

    41. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      About $11-$13/16oz from local suppliers for me.

    42. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      Maple syrup out of a beer bong...

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    43. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      Water is for washing, wine is for drinking.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    44. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      They can tell synthetic diamonds by the types of inclusions.

      Some really fancy diamonds are etched with serial#s, but that's to make them less stealable. At least in theory.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    45. Re:Corn Syrup and High Fructose Corn Syrup by Flea+of+Pain · · Score: 1

      Stop stealing my Christmas traditions, ya hoser.

      --
      Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.
  11. Realistic Climate Change by foxalopex · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I believe that human caused climate change is occurring considering everything else we've changed on earth (we literally move mountains now) but I don't think it means the end of the world. Folks who are predicting the end of the world are likely being overly alarmist but that's not to say we should sit back and do nothing. I've seen increasingly worse local flooding in recent years and weather's becoming more unstable. The worry isn't so much that the world will end but that it is going to be more difficult to make a living as the things we've been use to (relatively stable climate and weather for close to a millennium) might be going away. Change is expensive.

    I live in Canada, I like maple syrup and it makes sense that if it warms on average that trees might not do so well. Trees are rooted and take decades to mature so I imagine to compensate it's going to take a few decades to move them north to more appropriate climates. So saying there's no more maple syrup seems silly, saying that there might be shortage and it'll get more expensive makes more sense.

    1. Re:Realistic Climate Change by c · · Score: 1

      I don't think it means the end of the world.

      It certainly doesn't.

      Humans have shown that we can readily adapt to major disruptions in living space, food supplies, or other resource limitations by simply killing off enough of each other that whoever remains does okay, or even thrives.

      --
      Log in or piss off.
    2. Re:Realistic Climate Change by Dutch+Gun · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Stop being reasonable. You're completely missing the point of the click-bait headlines.

      --
      Irony: Agile development has too much intertia to be abandoned now.
    3. Re:Realistic Climate Change by gtall · · Score: 1

      Unless we manage to cause a runaway greenhouse effect.

    4. Re:Realistic Climate Change by dbialac · · Score: 2

      Keep in mind, too, that a stable climate is incredibly unusual on earth. The climate usually is unstable. As for warming, when I was growing up, we were warned that the earth was due for an ice age. All that CO2 we released may have just staved off that experience and prevented Paris from becoming a glacier.

    5. Re:Realistic Climate Change by dbialac · · Score: 1

      We haven't come close to a runaway greenhouse effect. During the Mesozoic, there was far more CO2 in the atmosphere than there is today, and the world was, as would be expected, more tropical. All that's going to happen is that we grow certain crops further north than we do currently. Things that can survive in the warmer conditions will flourish. Things that require very cold conditions are few and far between and will likely adapt through natural selection. Change isn't an end, it's a natural course.

    6. Re:Realistic Climate Change by CaptainDork · · Score: 1

      Humans don't need maple syrup.

      There are many synthetic syrups on store shelves ...

      It's like a guy at work telling me that I would not want any of the pork sausage he just made.

      I tried it and he was right.

      I was raised on store-bought sausage and fresh sausage tastes nasty.

      OTOH, I love to shoot, clean, and fry me up a mess of rabbits and have since I was a kid.

      I cannot stomach tame rabbit.

      Humans will survive climate change, but it won't be pretty.

      A post above suggested moving the trees North.

      What if "North" (for these trees or any other thing of value) was on somebody's land?

      That's what we need to be concerned about.

      --
      It little behooves the best of us to comment on the rest of us.
    7. Re:Realistic Climate Change by Opportunist · · Score: 0

      During the Mesozoic, also no humans wanted to survive on this planet.

      Hey, did you know? During the Hadean, the temperature was also WAY higher and there was rocks falling from the sky left and right, so if that happened today, no biggie, right?

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    8. Re:Realistic Climate Change by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Climate has always changed on this planet. Correct. There's two caveats here, though: First, the change in temperature has never been that fast in any history we can somehow observe and second, a change in climate has NEVER been beneficial for the apex predator.

      Or any organism that didn't want to change a lot.

      In other words, our choice seems to be to either change our behaviour now to prevent or at least limit the change in the climate, or to change our behaviour later when the change in climate forces us to.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    9. Re:Realistic Climate Change by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      a change in climate has NEVER been beneficial for the apex predator.

      Care to explain sharks then?

    10. Re:Realistic Climate Change by eclectro · · Score: 1

      . So saying there's no more maple syrup seems silly, saying that there might be shortage and it'll get more expensive makes more sense.

      This is absolutely true. Market forces will predominate. Making extreme bad arguments only makes people dismiss the science of climate change more, not recognize it for its truth.

      --
      Take the cheese to sickbay, the doctor should see it as soon as possible - B'Elanna Torres, "Learning Curve"
    11. Re:Realistic Climate Change by c · · Score: 1

      I predict that the zero survivors will definitely thrive.

      --
      Log in or piss off.
    12. Re:Realistic Climate Change by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      To quote George Carlin:
      "The planet is fine, the people are fucked"

    13. Re:Realistic Climate Change by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "A few more decades to move north." How long do you think it would take if there wasn't climate change to begin with? How soon are temperatures expected to hit levels that will be beyond the sustainable threshold for maples?

    14. Re:Realistic Climate Change by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're right. Just look at Europe in the late 14th century after the Black Plague had reduced the population by more than half.
      Think about what our current world would be like with a similar population reduction.

    15. Re:Realistic Climate Change by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Reasonable?
      He started with "I believe..." and you should have stopped reading right there.

    16. Re:Realistic Climate Change by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Humans have been adapting and changing to our environment...for like ever...how is it particularly troublesome that we will have to continue to do so...

      O in regard to your 'climate change has NEVER been beneficial to the apex predator'...the fact that no other 'apex predator' had any ability to technologically adapt or change their environment the way humans can makes this argument entirely fallacious.

    17. Re:Realistic Climate Change by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ummm...given that the effects of climate change aren't manifesting themselves 'tomorrow' but over time of decades & maybe 100s of years my first thought might be 'seems the trees will have time to move' (and if they refuse we'll point guns at them & make them move. :-))

    18. Re:Realistic Climate Change by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      All that CO2 we released may have just staved off that experience and prevented Paris from becoming a glacier.

      And typing those words might have saved your life. It's about as likely there was a flash flood under that sock puppet's bridge.

      One look at https://xkcd.com/1732/ is enough to kill that trolling bullshit.

    19. Re:Realistic Climate Change by dbialac · · Score: 1

      You understand we're nowhere near close to Mesozoic levels of CO2 or temperatures. The fact is, though, we're the most adaptable species ever in the history of this planet. We'll find a way.

  12. No World above Michigan by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm pretty sure some new locations further north will now be able to grow these maple trees if Michigan can no longer grow then due to climate change.

    1. Re:No World above Michigan by Flea+of+Pain · · Score: 1

      Nope. Nothing grows further North than Michigan. It's where the edge of the flat world is.

      --
      Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.
    2. Re:No World above Michigan by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The UUP. The Upper Upper Peninsula.

  13. Agriculture. by hackwrench · · Score: 1

    There are these things called pipes and technology called agriculture. The same processes we use to do the studies are the same processes we use to fix the problems the studies uncover.

  14. I'm not opposed to cane sugar by rsilvergun · · Score: 1

    it's what makes preserves... well... preserve. But cheap jellies that are mostly sugar end up tasking like cheap candy because, well, that's what they are.

    --
    Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
    1. Re:I'm not opposed to cane sugar by penandpaper · · Score: 1

      Don't worry, they sell preserves without preservatives. I saw the light myself with some Blackberry Preserve labeled "without preservatives".

      Truly remarked times we live in.

    2. Re:I'm not opposed to cane sugar by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I had a bottle of water that was labeled "gluten free". I was like. Damn I didn't know my water had gluten in it.

    3. Re:I'm not opposed to cane sugar by penandpaper · · Score: 4, Funny

      Reminds me of the Himalayan pink rock salt labeled as 'non-gmo'. It was even the 'verified non-gmo project' label too!

      Truly, informative labels for the informed consumer.

    4. Re:I'm not opposed to cane sugar by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I saw gluten free reduced sodium salt. Top that! Used a silicon filler.

    5. Re:I'm not opposed to cane sugar by burtosis · · Score: 1

      Well, to be fair that salt block has lots of organisms in it and they aren't genetically modified.

    6. Re:I'm not opposed to cane sugar by burtosis · · Score: 2

      I myself got some gluten free whole chickens. I was like "damn send this crap back. I want chickens that are genetically modified to produce wheat gluten directly thus giving the skin a nice flaky crisp texture."

    7. Re:I'm not opposed to cane sugar by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      Make sure you use that before it's expiration date.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  15. No maple in "pancake syrup" by Aaden42 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Let's be clear on terminology. "Pancake syrup" contains little or no maple. Maybe distilled smoke extract from a tiny amount of maple wood, but probably not even that. It's high fructose corn syrup & caramel color.

    Only 100% pure maple syrup is made from actual tree sap. As a New Yorker living on the Vermont border, I can assure you there's a difference between the good stuff and that crap they put in the clear plastic bottles.

    1. Re:No maple in "pancake syrup" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Other bullshit terminologies for fake maple syrup: Hotcake syrup, table syrup, original syrup, and natural syrup. Natural syrup is what you find at Cracker Barrel and is 55% cane syrup and 45% maple syrup, which up here in Vermont is fucking blasphemy.

    2. Re:No maple in "pancake syrup" by msauve · · Score: 1
      Let's be clear:

      The name of the food is "Maple sirup". Alternatively, the word "sirup" may be spelled "syrup".

      - 21CFR168.140

      "Pancake syrup" is an alternate name for "Table sirup." If a sirup has <66% soluble maple solids (and <74% cane and sorghum), it's table sirup. If 66% or more, it's maple sirup. So, pancake syrup may contain quite a bit of maple.

      --
      "National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
    3. Re:No maple in "pancake syrup" by edtice1559 · · Score: 1

      We are hearing this from fans of "real maple syrup." Much like we hear from fans of craft beers or certain wines. Or audiophiles. I'm not able to opine on whether there is a difference or not. But, the vast majority of consumers don't seem able to tell. Or they prefer the HFCS version :(

    4. Re:No maple in "pancake syrup" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But, the vast majority of consumers don't seem able to tell. Or they prefer the HFCS version :(

      Real maple syrup comes in a tiny-ass bottle for $15+. I'll cut it with Karo myself.

    5. Re:No maple in "pancake syrup" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Pancake syrup" is flavored from roasted fenugreek seeds. They make a mighty good Maple flavoring substitute.

    6. Re:No maple in "pancake syrup" by RedK · · Score: 1

      We are hearing this from fans of "real maple syrup." Much like we hear from fans of craft beers or certain wines.

      No. Coors is still Beer, no matter how much "fans of craft beers" hate to admit it. But, this :

      http://www.auntjemima.com/products/syrups/original

      Is just not Maple Syrup. Why is there a distinction ? Look at the Ingredients :

      INGREDIENTS: CORN SYRUP, HIGH FRUCTOSE CORN SYRUP, WATER, CELLULOSE GUM, CARAMEL COLOR, SALT, NATURAL AND ARTIFICIAL FLAVOR, SODIUM BENZOATE AND SORBIC ACID (PRESERVATIVES), SODIUM HEXAMETAPHOSPHATE.

      I don't see Maple in there. If it doesn't have Sap from a maple tree, it's simply not Maple syrup. It has nothing to do with "fandoms".

      --
      "Not to mention all the idiots who use words like boxen."
      Anonymous Coward on Monday August 04, @06:49PM
    7. Re:No maple in "pancake syrup" by aardvarkjoe · · Score: 1

      "Pancake syrup" is an alternate name for "Table sirup." If a sirup has
      "May" in this case means "is allowed to." In reality, any "pancake syrup" that you are likely to encounter will have little or no maple content, because of the cost. No mass producer would make a syrup with 50% maple, since you couldn't sell it for anywhere close to 50% of what the maple syrup cost originally.

      --

      How can we continue to believe in a just universe and freedom to eat crackers if we have no ale?
    8. Re:No maple in "pancake syrup" by Chris+Mattern · · Score: 1

      So, pancake syrup may contain quite a bit of maple.

      It's allowed to, but it won't. The whole point of table syrup is that it uses cheap corn syrup instead of expensive maple syrup. In order to maximize that advantage, a manufacturer will not put any expensive maple syrup in it, since he doesn't have to.

    9. Re:No maple in "pancake syrup" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maple is the color you stupid moron.

    10. Re: No maple in "pancake syrup" by Jesus+H+Rolle · · Score: 1

      Karo's not HFCS. It's just corn syrup.

    11. Re:No maple in "pancake syrup" by bidule · · Score: 1

      Anyone who regularly uses maple syrup can easily distinguish it from "post syrup". It's as far from raw sugar as honey.

      If you only want to sweeten your coffee, you might as well pick the cheap stuff.

      --
      ID: the nose did not occur naturally, how would we wear glasses otherwise? (apologies to Voltaire)
    12. Re:No maple in "pancake syrup" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Let's be clear, tree sap is nothing more than sugar suspended in water with a few minerals/chemicals that create the flavor. Aunt Jemima is nothing more than sugar suspended in water with a few minerals/chemicals that create the flavor.

  16. If it's water you need... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Just have Nestle give it all back.

  17. Not Worthy of /. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Informative

    Why is this on /. ? Seriously? I don't come to this site for these types of articles.

    1. Re:Not Worthy of /. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't come here for the articles at all. I just come for the trolls.

  18. Nothing will change. by JustNiz · · Score: 1

    Do you really believe that even now, anything natural goes into that shit anymore?

  19. Syrup from Michigan? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Most maple syrup is produced in Quebec. Outside of Canada, Vermont is the largest producer of maple syrup, and they make 5 times more than Michigan on an annual basis. Who cares if Michigan can't make maple syrup?

    1. Re:Syrup from Michigan? by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 1

      +1 informative to you.

      --
      #DeleteFacebook
  20. No, I counter--predict... by stilrz · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I make maple syrup on a *very* small scale in a major city. This "scientific" article is all bunk. 1) First, large scale maple producers already know that watering the trees while tapping helps production. If global warming from politicians hot air continues towards long term winter droughts,, Maple bushes can be irrigated. 2) There are over 3000 variety of maples right now and the sugar industry is growing out hybrids that can produce close to a 10% sugar content sap ( normal is 2%) Nature will provide drought tolerant if needed. 3) no-one uses pails. Maple syrup production is hi-tech: reverse osmosis is amazing 4) North America has an over-abundance of maple trees and syrup production 5) What is not mentioned that is serious potential for maple blight like oak wilt to destroy a lot trees 6) Canada 's political socialized maple syrup production does more harm to producers that climate change ever will Sure I only make about 7 gallons a year but I know more than these blowhards

    1. Re:No, I counter--predict... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      As a Canadian, I completely agree with all of the sentiments you've expressed here. Every year the local farmers bring hundreds of gallons of freshly made pure maple syrup to the local markets, and trust me, if there's a production problem, they'll figure out how to fix it right quick.

      Even the local Mennonites who bring the syrup in horse-drawn buggies don't use pails anymore. You only see them in use at the "historical park" sites that school trips visit, on three or four of the trees, to show the kids "how it used to be done" - and then they point at the hoses and rigging on the other trees and tell them about modern collection methods.

      Also, the Canadian government's Strategic Maple Syrup Reserve(tm) (it's a real thing!) is intended to cover for exactly the type of (very temporary) shortage this would involve.

    2. Re:No, I counter--predict... by Strider- · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Also, the Canadian government's Strategic Maple Syrup Reserve(tm) (it's a real thing!) is intended to cover for exactly the type of (very temporary) shortage this would involve.

      I hate to break it to you, but while the maple reserve does exist, it's not associated with the Canadian federal government, nor even the Quebec government. Instead, It's maintained by a federation of Quebec producers, and basically allows them to act as a Cartel when it comes to Maple Syrup.

      --
      ...si hoc legere nimium eruditionis habes...
    3. Re:No, I counter--predict... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The top ten google results on the subject says you are full of shit. The strategic maple syrup reserve "isn't associated with the Canadian government" in the same way that the American federal reserve or the US postal service isn't associated with the US government.

    4. Re:No, I counter--predict... by penandpaper · · Score: 2

      Strategic Maple Syrup Reserve(tm) (it's a real thing!)

      It even made the rounds on /. some time back!

      Someone tried to steal it!

      Don't worry. It was found.

    5. Re:No, I counter--predict... by pipingguy · · Score: 1

      No! You must submit to the catastrophic climate change narrative! You don't know anything! Shut up! 97%! We need to spend trillions of dollars!

    6. Re:No, I counter--predict... by stilrz · · Score: 1

      Another Dalton minimum coming... I can capture PA sunshine in my trees.

    7. Re:No, I counter--predict... by pipingguy · · Score: 1

      I don't know what that means. Nevertheless...

      You must submit to the catastrophic climate change narrative! You don't know anything! Shut up! 97%! We need to spend trillions of dollars! Why do you hate the planet! Extinctionist! All my friends agree with me! You're evil!

    8. Re:No, I counter--predict... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I hate to break it to you, but while the maple reserve does exist, it's not associated with the Canadian federal government, nor even the Quebec government. Instead, It's maintained by a federation of Quebec producers, and basically allows them to act as a Cartel when it comes to Maple Syrup.

      Without government blessing, a cartel can't operate and can't enforce its rules on maple syrup producers. The Quebec govt forces maple producers in Quebec to sell syrup via the cartel, or else.

      http://business.financialpost....

      And yes, the "or else" involves significant fines.

    9. Re:No, I counter--predict... by Strider- · · Score: 1

      The ISR is not owned, nor controlled by either the government of Quebec or Canada. It is controlled by a privately operated single-desk marketing system owned/operated by the syrup producers within the province. yes, the single desk part of it is mandory, but beyond that there is no government oversight or control.

      --
      ...si hoc legere nimium eruditionis habes...
    10. Re:No, I counter--predict... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes indeed...

      But the real problem, if you ask me, is that, ideally, you need temperature deltas around the freezing point to get the sugar out in the water that you collect through the taps. Ideally something like -6deg.C to +6deg.C everyday. Flowing days if you will... Not too much wind either.

      The weather is all crazy and stuff nowadays. So you can get a terrible season with only a few good flowing days. That is the problem.

      Add to that that:
      1- sugar and water won't flow at all if it is too cold (duh!!!!)
      2- the taps you drilled in the tree will start plugging-up after a while (normal response to the "agression" that the drilling is), like in about 30 days
      3- sap will start to flow and ruin the taste if spring comes in early (contrary to popular belief, what is boiled into syrup is not regular sap, as it is otherwise unpalatable when the burgeoning process kicks-in too early, we call it "eau de bourgeon", literally burgeoning water)

      So you are bound to only hope for a few pumping days in the season. Anything between mid-January to mid-April can now be considered "fair game"... Sugar producing is not for the faint of heart...

    11. Re:No, I counter--predict... by Guspaz · · Score: 1

      The Federation of Quebec Maple Syrup Producers is not controlled by the Government of Quebec, but provincial legislation grants it the right to regulate the industry and to fine any producer who refuses to comply with their regulations. In this manner, it isn't very different from other arms-length government regulatory bodies. It just has less oversight.

    12. Re:No, I counter--predict... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I make maple syrup on a *very* small scale in a major city. This "scientific" article is all bunk. 1) First, large scale maple producers already know that watering the trees while tapping helps production

      Which means you're kinda missing something .. the natural ecosystem of a maple forest.

      See, when you're not in a "major city", the trees grow in a place which has had snow fall on it all winter.

      So, the days where it's below freezing overnight and a little above freezing during the day with the sunlight getting stronger, this melts the snow. And miraculously enough, it waters the trees.

      It's called Spring. Up here in Canada, the places where you make the most maple syrup also have plenty of snow over winter.

      The maple syrup from a real, actual sugarbush is entirely better than your small scale in a major city, because the natural habitat of the maple tree isn't an urban setting. It's a healthy, mature forest.

      And, yes, for you Americans, I did say sugarbush.

  21. Bullshit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I make syrup every year and I can promise our trees aint going nowhere any time soon. They are doing just fine.

  22. Um by cascadingstylesheet · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The excerpt is somewhat less than explanatory.

    Michigan is literally surrounded by fresh water and that doesn't seem to be changing. If " that extra boost of nitrogen won't be enough" because water, then why do you think the trees won't have enough water?

    Maybe there's a reason, but the excerpt provided does not give it or even hint at it. (And I won't break tradition by actually reading TFA.)

  23. Well by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm shorting the Canadian economy. See you later suckers.

  24. This is a feature... by QuietLagoon · · Score: 1

    ... less maple syrup means more usage of corn syrup. Since corn-growing states tend to have a lot of climate change deniers, this will be viewed as a feature.

  25. Another BS Article from the Propaganda Mill by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This is so much BS I am not even going to address it other than to call it by it's rightful name, BS.

  26. Mrs. Buttersworth will be just fine by plague911 · · Score: 1

    No need to panic.

  27. Nothing of value by oldmac31310 · · Score: 0

    will be lost

    --
    http://www.acetonestudio.com
  28. 'could' by bonedonut · · Score: 2

    or, it 'could' cause them to proliferate to the point where there are way too many, and maple syrup becomes our main energy source.

  29. Study was in the US by hawkfish · · Score: 1

    The best maple syrup (due to a colder climate...) comes from eastern Canada, so I'd like to see a similar study done in Ontario and Quebec. This may just be another case of climate change preferentially destroying a US crop. Fortunately, it is produced mostly in blue states, so Real Americans can just keep pouring on that flavourless HFC-based slime.

    (BTW, I grew up in NH, so I'm not shilling for the Canadian co-ops...)

    --
    You will not drink with us, but you would taste our steel? - Walter Matthau, The Pirates
    1. Re:Study was in the US by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The best maple syrup (due to a colder climate...) comes from eastern Canada

      No, it comes from Costco, dumbass.

    2. Re:Study was in the US by Strider- · · Score: 1

      The best maple syrup (due to a colder climate...) comes from eastern Canada,

      I love how people often refer to Ontario and western Quebec as "Eastern Canada". Canada is a vast, vast, country, and Ontario, especially, is much closer to the middle than it is to the eastern side.

      --
      ...si hoc legere nimium eruditionis habes...
    3. Re:Study was in the US by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The middle longitude of Canada is found in Manitoba and Nunavut, so all of Ontario lies in the eastern half of Canada. But the real problem with your statement is that Ontario itself is vast, stretching from nearly the middle of the continent to within 50km of a navigable Atlantic port (Montreal).

      Beyond physical geography, Ontario's human geography is eastern. Almost all of Ontario's human population is much closer to the Atlantic Ocean than the middle latitude. In terms of transport, economics, trade and history, Ontario is very much in eastern Canada. This is entirely distinct from "Atlantic Canada" and "down east".

    4. Re:Study was in the US by Strider- · · Score: 1

      Then again, Toronto always consideres itself to be the center of the universe, and forgets that the country continues on beyond Thunder Bay. ;)

      As the old joke goes: How many Torontonians does it take to change a light bulb? Just one. He holds it in the socket while the world revolves around them.

      --
      ...si hoc legere nimium eruditionis habes...
    5. Re:Study was in the US by hawkfish · · Score: 1

      The best maple syrup (due to a colder climate...) comes from eastern Canada,

      I love how people often refer to Ontario and western Quebec as "Eastern Canada". Canada is a vast, vast, country, and Ontario, especially, is much closer to the middle than it is to the eastern side.

      Makes about as much sense as calling Kentucky the midwest I suppose. And I've been to most of the Maritimes (although L'anse aux medeaux is still on my bucket list) so I get it. (And yes, I can "read this" too!)

      --
      You will not drink with us, but you would taste our steel? - Walter Matthau, The Pirates
    6. Re:Study was in the US by hawkfish · · Score: 1

      The best maple syrup (due to a colder climate...) comes from eastern Canada

      No, it comes from Costco, dumbass.

      (I know, don't feed the trolls. But can I pour some "pancake syrup" on this one?)

      I may have grown up in NH, but I live in Seattle, which is the home of Costco, so I've had ample opportunity to compare them. Perhaps if you got out of your parents' basement, you might have a wider range of experiences to draw upon when commenting. Not to mention a bit more wit.

      --
      You will not drink with us, but you would taste our steel? - Walter Matthau, The Pirates
  30. Comeon no water? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Lack of water in Michigan? We're fucked.

  31. Move north by shayd2 · · Score: 1
    The solution to Climate Change is to buy land further north.

    Canada (and Russia) should have sugar maples by 2070

    Michigan can switch to cotton and, eventually, sugarcane.

    1. Re:Move north by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 1

      The solution to Climate Change is to buy land further north.

      Canada (and Russia) should have sugar maples by 2070

      Michigan can switch to cotton and, eventually, sugarcane.

      Who knew that Canadians were so prescient when they put a maple leaf on their flag? How could they have guessed that Canada might have maple trees by 2070?

      Next we'll finally be able to start exporting poutine to Canada.

      --
      "That's the way to do it" - Punch
  32. Could, but won't by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    More leftist propaganda.

  33. Can't eat your gold reserve now can you? by dlingman · · Score: 1

    This is why we have a strategic maple syrup reserve in Canada:

    https://www.theglobeandmail.co...

  34. BS by holophrastic · · Score: 2

    First off, Michigan? Really?! It's a maple tree. It declares its nationality with thousands and thousands of national flags on each and every tree. Maple trees were always just-visiting Michigan. If you want maple, know that they'll always be alive and well in their home country.

    Second, maple was always arbitrary. Personally, I enjoy the less-sweet, sharper taste of birch syrup even more. You'll find them combined quite often -- that's a good stepping-stone if you need such a device.

    Pfffff. Michigan maples. I mean, really. What are you thinking? What's next? British wine? Australian tea? I know: Texas tofu.

    1. Re:BS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This guy is either from Vermont or Ontario ---^^^

      He's hurt a study was done in Michigan on maple trees, LOL!

    2. Re:BS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The sugar maple is Michigan's most common native tree species. Vermont supplies the half of the U.S. supply of Maple syrup but Michigan could easily out supply them considering they have more maple trees.

    3. Re:BS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      When European settlers came to the new world, they had to create a new axe head shape to get through the tough native trees, like sugar maples. Guess why that new shape, which is the most common shape found today in Canada, is called the Michigan Head Axe.

      Clearly you have never been to Michigan. Maples are native. Cold temperate forests are best for them. Any areas north of Michigan turns to boreal forests, where Maples need extra care.

    4. Re:BS by holophrastic · · Score: 1

      Like I said. If you ask a maple tree where it wants to live, it tells you with each and every leaf. And for a few months of the year, it tries extra-hard to make a glorious show of its choice.

      It doesn't want to be in Michigan, let it leave in peace. Be happy you get a contingent in Vermont -- they don't really want to be there either.

    5. Re:BS by holophrastic · · Score: 1

      You're funny. You think that maple trees can't grow north of Michigan. I think you need to learn to read. Start with flags. Last I checked, stars & stripes don't say maple to me. Neither do eagles, elk, moose and a gun. And I don't know about you, but a pine tree ain't no maple tree.

      You find a flag that says "maple" to me, and I'll agree that maple trees grow there quite happily.

    6. Re:BS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      my grand mother used to commissions a batch of birch syrups from a maple syrup producer of her village. she used that as an medication so I always assumed it tasted bad.... a great tasting cure, I wish I remember what it was used for cause she is not there anymore (she died at 97)

    7. Re:BS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I remember it was again rheumatism

    8. Re:BS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ummmm... "could"?

      Well then, that settles it! Michigan is the center of maple syrup production because it "could" make the stuff.

      In other news, I "could" become a neurosurgeon, the oceans "could" dry up, and Big Giant Orange Head "could" become an acceptable President and human being.

      Everything that could happen will happen!

  35. As if by jabberw0k · · Score: 2, Informative

    Because the climate has been utterly static and changeless for millions of years until the evil oil companies snapped their fingers. Or maybe everything changes over time, and species adapt? It's almost as if the global warming climate alarmists disbelieve in natural selection, isn't it?

    1. Re:As if by Gilgaron · · Score: 1

      Range fragmentation. If a species is fine suffering disasters that don't quite effect its whole range, but you fragment it with development, now you have isolated pockets that can be wiped out that won't be recolonized as easily. If the pockets are isolated long enough, you may even induce speciation.

  36. IS NOTHING SACRED by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I see so many jokes on this thread. Think of the children.

  37. wait wait wait by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Let me get this straight... we were banking on extra pollution to counter the effects of global warming?! Oh OK, I'm sure that study wasn't industry sponsored!

  38. Is this US-centric ? by dasgoober · · Score: 1

    Are they just talking about the ones in Vermont or in Canada, too ?

    Are there places in Europe that produce maple syrup ?

    1. Re:Is this US-centric ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Climate Change Could Bring an End To Sugar Maples in Michigan

      Fixed title because editors didn't.

  39. In case of emergencies... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Get a hand cranked, solar powered radio/flashlight/iPhone charger for when the maple syrup goes sideways..

  40. Known about this in Canada for at least 4 years by mark-t · · Score: 1
  41. Free? Not really by sjbe · · Score: 1

    My dad has several trees up on the farm that he taps to make his own. If you have time & patience, it's free, and you know there's no cane sugar in it. ;-)

    "Free"? Only if you don't count the cost of the fuel you'll burn reducing the sap down to syrup or assign any value to your time. There also is the cost of the taps, buckets, and other gear in the process which aren't expensive but not free either. The process of making the syrup from sap takes many many hours. It takes about 40 parts sap to make 1 part syrup. I suppose you could do it over a wood fire outdoors but that's harder to control and you still need a large supply of wood.

    All to get something you can buy from the store for a few dollars. It's an interesting thing to do (I've done it) but not really practical from an economic point of view. The opportunity cost is pretty high to make maple syrup unless you do it industrial scale.

  42. Less water does not make sense by SuperKendall · · Score: 1

    If the average temperature does rise, that means more water in the atmosphere due to greater evaporation of the oceans. How anyone can make the claim there will be "less water" with absolutely zero data to back that up nor any historical precedent for changing climate zones, is beyond me,

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    1. Re:Less water does not make sense by Shotgun · · Score: 1

      That's ok. We're also being told that an average increase of two degrees will both melt the ice caps AND make the tropics to hot to support human life.

      --
      Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
      Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
    2. Re:Less water does not make sense by SEE · · Score: 1

      Don't you know that higher temperatures cause deserts?

      That's why you start in the really wet polar regions, go to the drier temperate regions, then reach the great dry deserts of the subtropics . . . and if you venture beyond them to the tropics, you reach the Lifeless Ring of Eternal Fire.

  43. I don't believe in climate change. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Belief == opinion without evidence.

    Like evolution and gravity, human caused climate change is a fact.

    Belief is irrelevant.

  44. Maple isn't the only syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    No, it won't be the end of pancake syrup. There are an almost infinite number of sources for sugar with which to make pancake syrup.

    I personally prefer pancake syrup made from sugar cane. It tastes way better than maple syrup.

    1. Re:Maple isn't the only syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Preach it, brother!

    2. Re:Maple isn't the only syrup by PPH · · Score: 1

      Delete this! Eh.

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
  45. Pancake syrup is a false economy by sjbe · · Score: 1

    There's a brand at my local store that is made with real sugar, at least. The price isn't significantly higher than the HFCS stuff.

    Who cares? Neither one has any flavor worth bothering with. It's a false economy. It seems cheap but still is somehow overpriced.

    Pure maple syrup is $20 for a tiny little bottle. Too expensive for my tastes.

    Then you have no taste. Pancake syrup (artificially colored sugary sludge) doesn't even remotely resemble real maple syrup in flavor. I don't regard them as being even in the same food group much less substitutes. If your local store charges that much then shop online. You can get awesome burbon barrel aged maple syrup for $30 and that's a specialty item. (not affiliated in any way but I've bought this stuff and it's great) A small bottle of normal maple syrup in my grocery store costs $8-12. You can get a gallon for less than $50 and that will last a year or more for most people.

    1. Re:Pancake syrup is a false economy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      Then you have no taste. Pancake syrup (artificially colored sugary sludge) doesn't even remotely resemble real maple syrup in flavor.

      It's for the kids. At 1, 3, and 5, they can't tell the difference. Most of it ends up on the table or in their hair anyways.

  46. No danger to maple syrup by Roger+W+Moore · · Score: 3, Insightful

    If this article is anything to go by it got a lot less real. What all these sorts of articles (there was one about coffee being wiped out a year or so ago) completely fail to take account of is that if one area is becoming less hospitable to a particular plant another area is almost certainly becoming more hospitable. The regions where certain crops will grow changes over time even without human-made climate change: the Romans used to have vineyards in the UK, something which is only recently again becoming feasible with rising temperatures.

    Having to move to another region will be disruptive but that is nowhere near the same as claiming that maple production will be wiped out. It will just move further north to colder, wetter climes. Human-induced climate change is a serious problem and we have to act to curb it but I do wish we could "keep it real" when discussing the problems it will cause: these are bad enough without stupid articles like this gratuitously inflating them and making it easier for the deniers to ignore all warnings because some are so ridiculously wrong.

    1. Re:No danger to maple syrup by dryeo · · Score: 3, Insightful

      How long does it take for a Maple to mature enough to produce syrup? Do Maples require other pioneer species to create fertile soil for them? Are other trees better for adapting to the more northern areas? Lots of variables involved in eco-systems moving.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    2. Re:No danger to maple syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If human history is anything to go on: Not long since we'll be planting them in excess to meet demand, doesn't matter because we're capable of analyzing the soil and fertilizing it accordingly, doesn't matter because we'll clear an unprofitable land to make it profitable. Lots of variables humans have been overcoming for milenia.

    3. Re:No danger to maple syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >It will just move further north
      Sure. Now look at a map. How much land mass is there further north? For every square mile you gain further north, you probably lose six or ten further south.
      Also there's this wonderful thing called gulf stream. If climate change interrupts it, that land mass further north (at least if belongs to Europe) is not going to become warmer, it's going to become colder. A lot. Yup, global warming wasn't the right term, climate change is, and it's going both ways depending on where you look.
      Same with coffee. Sure, you can go higher up the mountain. Until you run out of mountain.

    4. Re:No danger to maple syrup by pkwatz · · Score: 1

      Maples are like weeds - they grow easily and quickly.

    5. Re:No danger to maple syrup by Mashiki · · Score: 1

      How long does it take for a Maple to mature enough to produce syrup?

      Round 30 years, you can start tapping them around 20-25 years if the tree is in good shape though. People who are in the business have entire cycles of tree harvesting and replanting figured out for 100-150 years in the future in most cases. That's the case with one of syrup farms near me, they've been in the business since the 1870's. Generally when the trees hit 90-100 years old they're not worth much except to the lumber industry, which has a never-ending taste for hardwoods. Usually it's natural parasites, rot, or something else that gets the tree cut down and replaced though. I know of a few trees in this area that are in the 140 year range and are still tapped though. Older the tree though, the less of a chance that it produces anything but substandard sap(cloudy, off taste/colour when rendered down), etc.

      The study itself is actually pretty shit and one of the local arborist was talking about it on the radio(think it was on 730am or 920am early this morning), simply called it junk science. Maples are far more hardy species, then what the research paper paints it as. The real problem is the monoculture problem we're facing with many breeds of trees stemming from the "mass seed to tree production" programs from the 1940's through to the 1980's. Where entire tree crops were replaced with the "most hardy" variety available, and whole areas were planted with them. This for example is one of the reasons why the pine beetles in the US west and western Canada have had such a easy time attacking the trees(along with a lack of burn-offs, there's two sure ways to kill the beetles, purge it by fire, or use chemicals). There's also been a maple blight in the NE US and Canada for the last 30 odd years, but it's been kept under very tight control by simply removing trees that show infections then monitoring nearby trees and spraying anti-fungal agents into the ground.

      Truthfully, you're more likely to hear an actual arborist screaming about "Japanese Lilacs" then maple trees, or emerald ashworm borerers. The japanese lilacs are highly invasive and will kill younger trees because they grow so quickly, and devastate the lower forest floor.

      Do Maples require other pioneer species to create fertile soil for them? Are other trees better for adapting to the more northern areas? Lots of variables involved in eco-systems moving.

      All forests require a pioneer species, maples aren't any different. But the range of sugar maples, and maples in general? They're a hardy tree in terms of viable living regions. Maples through? They're kinda like black walnut without the kill-zone, if they get into an area with no competition, plenty of water, and lots of "dead growth" they'll spread like crazy.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    6. Re:No danger to maple syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It also failed to account for the lack of any measurable warming for nearly 20 years. But don't let that get in the way.

    7. Re:No danger to maple syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maple syrup can now produced by planting saplings and harvesting the syrup by cutting off the top of the sapling every year. It is more efficient and productive than tapping mature trees. And it can be up and running from an empty field in 3 to 5 years. Here's a quote:

        "The researchers estimate that the cost of production would be roughly the same as with current methods. “I think you’re going to find sugarmakers who are doing both,” said Perkins, “standard sugarbush and plantation.”
      With climate change, this dual approach may offer improved chances for success in the face of warmer temperatures. “If this region is going to warm more, then with a plantation we don’t have to rely as much on strong freeze/thaw cycles” to get sap flowing,” Perkins said, “because these smaller trees freeze faster and thaw faster.”

      and the link:
        http://northernwoodlands.org/knots_and_bolts/maple-minus-forest

    8. Re:No danger to maple syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The land to the north is permafrost. It is frozen marsh land. When the climate shifts and makes it a more hospitable temperature wise, that new land won't be terribly fertile, not anywhere near the level of the mid-west. It will be a painful transition.

    9. Re:No danger to maple syrup by Roger+W+Moore · · Score: 1

      Now look at a map. How much land mass is there further north?

      Well, since Canada is larger than the US, including Alaska, and much of it is rocks and trees I don't think we have much to worry about in terms of land area for the foreseeable future. The far bigger worry is the upheaval in everyone's crops changing, sea levels rising and flooding cities etc. Global warming will cause many serious problems but the eradication of maple syrup is not one of them.

    10. Re:No danger to maple syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And ... I see that Michigan (where the arm and forests of my childhood, nearly 70 years ago, still grow, and allowed us to harvest and cook down and sell maple syrup) still is cold, has a snowy winter, and should be able to still produce the syrup. And the trees are rather simple in their requirements, and already well-established to the 4 points of the compass, over great expanses.

    11. Re:No danger to maple syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And you stupidly will not admit those primitives what they want is to EXTINGUISH PLANTS because it is the way THEY are. What is missing is my newly found Brown Cow whole milk yoghurt MAPLE FLAVOR in the supermarket I found it it the last two times the flavor was there but was not stocked TODAY. But now I find in my email THIS reminding because the product is simply DELICIOUS and those primitives you want as servants cannot STAND people enjoying anything. So climate change is irrelevant, people will not move more than one finger, the producer, to save those trees if needed, but the primitives will act simultaneously, instantly synchronized, with no effort, at no cost, to HELP extinguish the damned pleasure and make a raucus against you and whoever they manage to reach with the CRISIS. That this is a very formal argument should matter.

  47. The difference isn't subtle by sjbe · · Score: 1

    I'm not able to opine on whether there is a difference or not.

    Then you've never actually tasted the real thing. The difference isn't subtle.

    But, the vast majority of consumers don't seem able to tell. Or they prefer the HFCS version :(

    They can tell the difference. The reason they buy the cheap crap is because it is cheap. You can buy a gallon of Ms Butterworth for less than $5. A gallon of real maple syrup will cost you $40-60. And yes it is worth the cost unless you are really tight for cash. And if you can't afford the real stuff you probably shouldn't be wasting money on crappy colored sugar sludge anyway.

    1. Re:The difference isn't subtle by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And if you can't afford the real stuff you probably shouldn't be wasting money on crappy colored sugar sludge anyway.
       
      I've heard some elitist crap in my life but this takes the cake. Next you'll be saying that people should eat apples instead of apple pies.

    2. Re:The difference isn't subtle by Shotgun · · Score: 1

      "Worth it" is a personal preference. I actually don't care that much for "the real thing", and would pay extra for Ms Butterworth; though, I have often mixed the two.

      Real maple syrup is too runny for my taste, and makes a soggy mess of the perfectly crispy edges of my pancakes.

      --
      Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
      Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
    3. Re:The difference isn't subtle by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I've tasted the real thing and it tastes like crap.

    4. Re:The difference isn't subtle by sjbe · · Score: 1

      "Worth it" is a personal preference. I actually don't care that much for "the real thing", and would pay extra for Ms Butterworth; though, I have often mixed the two.

      If you would actually pay extra for Ms Butterworth there is something wrong with your taste buds. I can understand someone not caring for maple syrup but I don't get anyone actually preferring colored sludge. That's like claiming Kraft Mac-N-Cheese is better than real mac and cheese made by a good chef.

      Real maple syrup is too runny for my taste, and makes a soggy mess of the perfectly crispy edges of my pancakes.

      Maybe try using less than a lake of it next time. Pro-tip, if it gets soggy then you are using too much.

    5. Re:The difference isn't subtle by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Also, don't go for the fancy stuff, it's too light and runny. I like 'Grade A Dark Amber' in the US or 'Medium (B)' in Canada. Just don't get them confused, because Grade B in the US is too dark.

    6. Re:The difference isn't subtle by Sneftel · · Score: 1

      De gustibus non est disputandum.

      --
      The opinions stated herein do not necessarily represent those of anybody at all. Deal with it.
    7. Re:The difference isn't subtle by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      try grade B maple syrup, it is cheaper and way tastier so you use less of it.

      syrup grading https://www.maplesyrupworld.com/pages/Maple-Syrup-Grading.html

  48. Freeze thaw cycles by sjbe · · Score: 3, Informative

    Maybe there's a reason, but the excerpt provided does not give it or even hint at it.

    Well there is the fact that to make maple sap move in quantity you need freeze thaw cycles. If temperatures warm sufficiently such that the temperature doesn't dip below freezing then you cannot make maple syrup in meaningful quantities.

    1. Re:Freeze thaw cycles by bidule · · Score: 1

      Well there is the fact that to make maple sap move in quantity you need freeze thaw cycles. If temperatures warm sufficiently such that the temperature doesn't dip below freezing then you cannot make maple syrup in meaningful quantities.

      This.

      A day of freezing night / melting days will produce more than a week without crossing the melting point.

      --
      ID: the nose did not occur naturally, how would we wear glasses otherwise? (apologies to Voltaire)
  49. Taste varies by sjbe · · Score: 1

    There is something about Maple Syrup that is really off-putting to me. I can't stand to be in the same room as anyone who is using it. Vinegar has a similar reaction to me. Something about being in a room with someone pouring vinegar on their chips, or maple syrup on their pancakes makes my stomach churn and completely kills my appetite

    To each their own but you understand that this is very weird? We're talking six standard deviations from normal here. Not being judgemental - I have some foods I can't stand in certain preparations. But that sounds like you have something wildly unusual about your taste/smell receptors.

    I'm not a picky eater- but anything with either of those smells is going to turn my stomach.

    Based on your previous statement I gently disagree about you claiming to not be being a picky eater.

    1. Re:Taste varies by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      real picky eater here and i wish I only found 2 condiments disgusting to the point of preferring not to eat even if a have to go 24hr without food (certain social situation likes weddings call for that)

  50. Just to be clear by kenh · · Score: 1

    Instead, the researchers report today in Ecology, a lack of water will stunt the trees' growth.

    So, life on the planet will become unbearable due to global warming/climate change causing the seas to rise, whilst simultaneously maple sugar trees will go away for lack of water?

    What's next, increased CO2 levels will lead to a mass extinction of all pigs, cutting off our only source of truly delicious bacon? (I do NOT consider so-called "Turkey Bacon" either delicious OR bacon.)

    --
    Ken
    1. Re:Just to be clear by techno-vampire · · Score: 1

      Try beef bacon. Not quite the same flavor, and tends to be a tad stringy at times, but very good taste, less cholesterol and very little wasted grease.

      --
      Good, inexpensive web hosting
  51. Re:Free? Not really by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I suppose you could do it over a wood fire outdoors but that's harder to control and you still need a large supply of wood.

    Hmmm ... over a wood fire outdoors is the only way I've ever seen it made, and it's the traditional way of doing it, and, oddly, by the time you own a maple forest you might also have a large supply of wood. It's been made that way for a couple of hundred years.

    I have a friend whose uncle makes it. He has a custom made (by him) boiler system with a series of vessels, which is over a big giant fire chamber. He makes several hundred gallons of it at a time.

    It's labour intensive, but once you have your startup costs for the hoses, taps, and buckets, the actual material cost is pretty low each year since he owns the land. But he can nicely supplement his income by selling some of it off once he's given a jug of it to his family members (who usually stand around and help tend the fire anyway).

    Sugaring season is as much a social event as anything. This was something traditionally done by farmers, and much of it still is -- so the labour isn't something they're afraid of, and it's happening in a season when the ground is covered in snow anyway since it's early spring.

    All to get something you can buy from the store for a few dollars.

    Throughout the history of maple syrup, that was anything but true.

    Humans have just become lazy and detached from how actual food gets made. Time was, much of your time was spent doing these things.

    But, I assure you, the best maple syrup is still made by old men on farms standing outside in the snow putting wood on the fire -- and that stuff you don't just walk into a supermarket and grab off the shelf.

  52. Random musings by sjbe · · Score: 1

    Humans don't need maple syrup.

    There are lots of things we don't technically need that are still worth having. Maple syrup falls into this category. I can live without it but the world would be a poorer place.

    There are many synthetic syrups on store shelves ...

    And they are terrible and have nothing even close to the flavor of real maple syrup.

    It's like a guy at work telling me that I would not want any of the pork sausage he just made. I tried it and he was right.

    Sounds like he wasn't very good at making sausage.

    I was raised on store-bought sausage and fresh sausage tastes nasty.

    To each their own but that's decidedly weird. That's like preferring Kraft Mac-N-Cheese to the real deal. Some store brand sausages are quite good but hand made sausages by someone who knows what they are doing are usually notably better. Not everyone knows what they are doing obviously.

    1. Re:Random musings by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The closer I've gotten to a maple syrup bottle was 6,000 miles. I won't miss it.

  53. Nothing of value would be lost without syrup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Humans can migrate and adjust to changes and adapt to life, perhaps, without maple syrup.

    Perhaps it's past time top get the human race away from moderately to highly sugary foods completely. Humans evolved to use practically every sense for survival. Taste was used to know if it was safe to eat or not. Sugar of any kind, much like alkalis and alkaloids, are toxic and will kill someone in due time. Most health problems can be traced to the consumption of simple carbs, sugars most of all. Our ancestors found out early on that if it tastes good or if it is bitter to spit it out. The best food for humans to eat are plants that are quite a bit closer to bland in flavor than what most are used to today while being rich in the very nutrients we need. Today the human race eats nothing but sugary and processed crap just because it tastes good. Then the morons wonder why they are so fat, have heart disease, hypertension, constipation, and/or any other issues that comes with consuming toxins. When maple syrup is gone that will bring the human race one step closer to getting away from such toxins and more toward a healthy diet. Perhaps that would be one of the very few positive aspects of AGW.

    Don't get me started on smoking, that was the dumbest idea any moron could have come up with, no matter the time period the person lived in.

  54. MICHIGAN!?! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    USAmericans never tired of navel gazing. Your syrup is for shit. Love, Quebec.

  55. Other Sources by f3ign · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I am no scientist, but I am a hobby maple syrup producer. We make maple syrup from a variety of trees that are available locally to us Red, Silver, Norway and Sugar. The difference is Red and Silver have lower sugar content and subsequently take more energy to convert to syrup. According to the abstract, this study focused on Acer saccharum (Sugar maple). I wonder for the short-term (20-50 years) the other species might out last sugar and what you see is a spike in real maple syrup sales. Just my thoughts.

  56. Let's be honest here.... by Jfetjunky · · Score: 1

    Many people would have no idea because they just buy that wretched, caramel colored, artificial maple flavored bottle of high fructose corn syrup. Real, actually, maple syrup is usually quite a bit more money.

    1. Re:Let's be honest here.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, it costs more and is absolutely disgusting. The fake stuff is cheaper and tastes way better. The real stuff is for elitist idiots, the same ones that buy bottled water and spend $1000 on a speaker cable.

  57. The problem isn't the world ending by rsilvergun · · Score: 1

    the problem is how we'd respond to the changes. For example, if the trend keeps up large parts of the Middle East will become uninhabitable. There will be massive numbers of refugees forced to migrate. After all, even small changes in temperature can have big impacts on crop yields. We're already experiencing some large scale migration of Muslims. Since these folks are being forced to leave they're not integrating into their new host societies. This is creating tensions which autocrats, dictators and Strongmen are quick to capitalize one.

    If all humans were rational climate change would be no big deal. But they're not. So those of us who _are_ rational need to head these kinds of problems off at the pass.

    --
    Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
  58. Re:Free? Not really by Green+Mountain+Bot · · Score: 1

    Says someone who has never had freshly boiled, light maple syrup. The stuff you get in the store is typically Grade A Medium or Dark. That's fine, and better than any artificial syrup product, but it's not like Vermont Fancy Light. In my experience, the only way you can get that unless you live in Vermont is to boil it yourself. If you have it available on your grocery store shelf, consider yourself very, very, lucky. And send me some, pls!

  59. Re:Mrs. Buttersworth will be just fine by CanadianMacFan · · Score: 1

    Said no Canadian ever.

  60. Pancake syrup != Maple syrup by OrangeTide · · Score: 1

    Pancake syrup and maple syrup are two very different things. You can certainly put maple syrup on your pancakes and waffles. But you can also put blackberry syrup on them as well. And you can use maple syrup to make candies, top icecream, or glaze donuts. But pancake syrup has no use outside of putting on pancakes, especially when feeding to children who don't know any better.

    My parents used to make simple syrup from brown sugar instead of paying for the usual colored sludgy pancake syrups. I found it too thin for my liking, but not everyone could afford maple syrup at the time. (it's much cheaper now than it used to be)

    --
    “Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
  61. M Go Blue! by OrangeTide · · Score: 1

    Yet the Michigan Wolverines are named for an animal that is doesn't appear in Michigan anymore.

    --
    “Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
    1. Re:M Go Blue! by XxtraLarGe · · Score: 1

      Yet the Michigan Wolverines are named for an animal that is doesn't appear in Michigan anymore.

      They were too embarrassed to be associated with u of m.

      --
      Taking guns away from the 99% gives the 1% 100% of the power.
  62. Re:Free? Not really by sexconker · · Score: 1

    If you already have the trees, taps, and buckets, then collection is free.
    40 to 1? Are you trying to make maple bouillon cubes?
    And it's not hard to control at all. A simple double boiler will do for any small batch. Periodically check on it for the desired consistency and to make sure the bottom pot still has water in it.

    What next? No one should bother making jam because picking fruit off the trees, cutting it up, and boiling it down is too labor intensive and too hard to control?

  63. Oy, millennial-ism by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm really not interested in your 'coulds' or 'mights', particularly from the millennial 'scientific' community. If half of your gripes came with actual proposed solutions, then maybe I'd give a shit. You are not whining to mom and dad anymore, please just go away, you aren't helping. And, pancakes? Really? Fuck off.

  64. I worked on a Maple Farm by Tighe_L · · Score: 2, Insightful

    This is crap. The sugar maples are doing just fine, and every year the yield is different based on the spring melt.

  65. Re:Free? Not really by XxtraLarGe · · Score: 1

    "Free"? Only if you don't count the cost of the fuel you'll burn reducing the sap down to syrup or assign any value to your time. There also is the cost of the taps, buckets, and other gear in the process which aren't expensive but not free either. The process of making the syrup from sap takes many many hours. It takes about 40 parts sap to make 1 part syrup. I suppose you could do it over a wood fire outdoors but that's harder to control and you still need a large supply of wood.

    He's retired, he's had the gear for years, and he's got tons of wood from dead-falls.

    --
    Taking guns away from the 99% gives the 1% 100% of the power.
  66. it's not just for pancakes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Try 2 tablespoons of real maple syrup on 2 cups corn flakes and 1 glass of skim milk for breakfast or dinner. Maple syrup is only 52 calories per tablespoon and tastes much better than sugary cereals' sweetness.

  67. I am not saying their data is wrong, but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I am not saying their data is wrong, but if you are buying maple syrup from producers in Michigan...well that's your first mistake. Not that Michigan is a desert, but New England, Upstate New York, Quebec, and Ontario all have significantly more water and are not predicted to to suffer the water woes Michigan may in the future.

  68. Not to worry... by rnturn · · Score: 1

    ... climate change deniers will soon be out with an advertising campaign telling us all that petro-chemically flavored High Fructose Corn Syrup will actually taste better than maple syrup. Besides when there is no more maple syrup, eventually, nobody will remember what it tasted like so you'll have to like the artificial stuff.

    --
    CUR ALLOC 20195.....5804M
  69. Re:Free? Not really by sjbe · · Score: 1

    If you already have the trees, taps, and buckets, then collection is free.

    That's like saying owning a house is free once you've made all the payments.

    40 to 1? Are you trying to make maple bouillon cubes?

    Yes 40 to 1. I'm just the messenger here and you don't have to take my word for it.

    A simple double boiler will do for any small batch.

    Small batch? You need 10 gallons of sap to make a single quart of syrup so that isn't exactly a tiny double boiler.

  70. Michigan by Topwiz · · Score: 1

    They make maple syrup in Michigan? Not seeing any issues in Vermont. 2016 was a record 1.99 million gallons and 2017 was just below that with 1.98 million. Tent caterpillars are a bigger threat to the Maple trees than warm weather. As long as it is below freezing at night and above freezing during the day during sugaring season, the syrup will flow very well.

  71. They do what with tree juice? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Good thing most people don't know the taste of maple syrup as most pour brown HFCS over their pancakes

  72. Shut up you and your facts by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Your facts don't coincide with the groupthink and are unacceptable. Racist!!!!

  73. Counterpoint by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    We don't have high temporal resolution data for a meaningful timeframe to make any claims about climatic rates of change.

  74. PANCAKE SNOBS ARISE by Slugster · · Score: 1

    I noticed crappy US pancake syrup a while back....
    I only bother to make waffles at home a couple times a year maybe.
    And I'm ~50 years old, so I remember when I was a kid that most of the name-brand syrups sold in the midwest-US had maple syrup in them.
    And I remember as a kid that I didn't like Karo (corn) syrup, because it didn't taste as good as the real maple syrup stuff....

    So I'm eating and pondering the Hungry Jack syrup bottle and I noticed that it said that the ingredients was just corn syrup, colorings and flavorings.
    It tasted good enough, but I thought "well that sucks? I thought it was maple syrup?"...(I only do this rarely, and I want real syrup dammit)
    So the next time I went to the store I looked through them all to see what ones were still made with maple syrup.

    NONE of the nationally-known brands were. They were all just corn syrup. A dead giveaway is when they say that they need no refrigeration, and real syrup had to be kept in the refrigerator after opening. All of the REAL maple syrup said that it must be refrigerated after opening....

    So then I paid $15 for a bottle of organic maple syrup (Wild Harvest) that was about 80% as big as the Hungry Jack bottle was that cost $5. The ingredients said just "maple syrup". And went another round of waffles.
    The Wild Harvest did taste significantly better , but it was very watery. It was not at all the way I recall from my youth.
    And when I returned to the store and looked at all the other real-maple-syrup brands, they all appeared to be about as watery as the Wild Harvest stuff was.

    The cheaper brands like Hungry jack and Mrs Butterworth are the correct thickness, but they don't taste like real maple does. And all of the gorumet/organic real maple syrup brands are too watery.
    So I expect that (at least in the US?) if you wanted good-quality syrup these days, you'd have to buy the 100% maple syrup stuff, and then boil it down yourself to get rid of the excess water.

  75. Trash Article - Never Fear, Maple Syrup is Here! by pubwvj · · Score: 2

    This article shows a fundamental lack of understanding about maple sugaring. The reality is that maple sugar is produced over a broad season across a broad range of geographic areas and even with large variations on altitude and what side of the mountain your sugar bush is located on. On top of that, for millions of years the winters and springs have varied year to year and sugar maples still survive. This article is just scary fake news, FUD.

    If these people writing the scary FUD news would actually do the real work of maple sugaring they would understand this.

    Unfortunately fake news like this will get picked up in the press and spread around while the truth gets ignored.

    Fortunately, those of us who really do maple sugaring know better than to listen to idiots like this.

  76. The Maple Syrup Heist by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There was a story about how insiders, trusted to safeguard the stored maple syrup, instead looted it and sold it bootleg. They filled the barrels with water to make it seem like they still had syrup in them.

    The Maple Syrup commission said that such criminal activity was "beyond imagination", and said they had taken steps to prevent recurrence.

    Then the whole scandal happened all over again! We're talking about an exact, step-by-step repeat.

    The Maple Syrup commission said that such criminal activity was "inconceivable", and said they had taken steps to prevent recurrence.

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/quebec-police-conduct-2nd-maple-syrup-raid-1.1184637

    Sure, Quebec doesn't have systematic problems with crime!

  77. 20 years of research... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ...to find a lack of water will stunt tree growth?

  78. Re:Trash Article - Never Fear, Maple Syrup is Here by AutodidactLabrat · · Score: 1

    I see Kochsucker denialism.
    Nothing more or less

  79. Re: Well, Canadian Maple syrup ain't the same by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yeah, but it's Canadian Maple syrup. It's got the rather bland polite taste as compared to the American Maple syrup that punches your taste buds awake.

  80. ....water the trees by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Seriously, they are predicting 'doom & gloom' for maple trees & the 'simple' solution is to use irrigation/water the trees....wow. Perhaps if the representation of these 'studies' wasn't 'doom & gloom' but rather something like 'Our study showed that with simple irrigation the impact on maple trees from climate change will be negligible' people might start taking them more seriously & the powers that be could work on plans based on that...e.g. start running water pipelines to where it might be needed for irrigation etc.

  81. Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That shit is nasty. Why would you suck jizz from a tree when you can get better stuff in jars from the store?

  82. Lack of water?? by Not-a-Neg · · Score: 1

    Lack of water??? But all of the crazed liberals have been saying cities are going to flood as the sea levels rise from ice melting. Make up your minds!

    --
    -==- Buy a Mac and leave me alone!
  83. blow up by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    if it gets 1 degree warmer, all the maple trees will explode.

  84. For God's sake by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Slashdot, this is the third we-are-all-gonna-die-due-to-climate-change post I've scrolled past today. Fuck you. Just fuck you.

  85. Who can afford it anyway? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Maple syrup costs $20 a pint.

    Maybe you rich tech hipsters -- who drop $40 on a quart of "raw" water -- can afford it, but most of the rest of us can't.

    So, as long as it only affects arrogant asses, who cares?

  86. According to a study from Michigan: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nothing grows well in Michigan.

  87. Re:Trash Article - Never Fear, Maple Syrup is Here by pubwvj · · Score: 1

    You must be using some type of weird glasses. And you missed.

  88. Sugar solution on pancakes? by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

    Euch! No wonder American dentists and diabetes doctors are so rich.

    --
    Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
  89. Fear not for the maple by Yakust · · Score: 1

    It seems these researchers don't know anything about actual maple syrup production.
    Most of the world's maple syrup is produced within 100km around where I live and I have visited multiple production sites.

    There is an accumulation of >100cm of snow every winter in the forests here.
    In the spring, the snow melts slowly and keeps the soil drenched for weeks.
    This is the time when maple water is collected and also the time when tree growth happens.
    Even with a warming of multiple degrees and a reduction in precipitation, there will still be snow accumulation and drenched soil in the spring.
    Anyway, a mature maple tree has roots deep enough to be able to catch water below the water table, even during a summer drought.

    It can take as much as 80 years for a maple tree to be mature enough to be a good producer of maple water.
    Starting a new plantation takes decades, stunted growth or not.
    Whether it takes 80 or 120 years will not affect the market.
    The important is the production levels of the existing trees.

    What could affect maple syrup production is if gets hot quicker in the spring.
    The maple trees produce only during the period in the spring when it freezes during the night and it
    If, due to global warming, the spring weather goes quickly from "winter-like" to hot enough that it does not freeze at night, then the maple season would be shortened.
    There is already a huge variation in production levels from year to year caused by the differences in spring temperature.

  90. Re:Trash Article - Never Fear, Maple Syrup is Here by AutodidactLabrat · · Score: 1

    Well, except for the facts documented in 99.91% of all formal accepted and peer reviewed journal articles in Climatology for, oh FORTY YEARS!!

  91. Remember Past Climate Changes ???? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The Roanoke Colony disappeared from the North American continent hundreds of years ago. Perhaps, because back then, there was an unusual THREE YEAR DROUGHT ! I'm glad the Maple Trees (syrup) and Yaupon Holly's (caffeine) survived ! Hint: Climate change has been occurring on this planet for hundreds of thousands of years or more....