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Linux On Windows 10: Running Ubuntu VMs Just Got a Lot Easier, Says Microsoft (zdnet.com)
Liam Tung reporting for ZDNet: Ubuntu maintainer Canonical and Microsoft have teamed up to release an optimized Ubuntu Desktop image that's available through Microsoft's Hyper-V gallery. The Ubuntu Desktop image should deliver a better experience when running it as a guest on a Windows 10 Pro host, according to Canonical. The optimized version is Ubuntu Desktop 18.04.1 LTS release, also known as Bionic Beaver. Microsoft's work with Canonical was prompted by its users who wanted a "first-class experience" on Linux virtual machines (VMs) as well as Windows VMs. To achieve this goal, Microsoft worked with the developers of XRDP, an open-source remote-desktop protocol (RDP) for Linux based on Microsoft's RDP for Windows. Thanks to that work, XRDP now supports Microsoft's Enhanced Session Mode, which allows Hyper-V to use the open-source implementation of RDP to connect to Linux VMs. This in turn gives Ubuntu VMs on Windows hosts a better mouse experience, an integrated clipboard, windows resizing, and shared folders for easier file transfers between host and guest. Microsoft's Hyper-V Quick Create VM setup wizard should also help improve the experience. "With the Hyper-V Quick Create feature added in the Windows 10 Fall Creators Update, we have partnered with Ubuntu and added a virtual machine image so in a few quick minutes, you'll be up and developing," said Clint Rutkas, a senior technical product manager on Microsoft's Windows Developer Team. "This is available now -- just type 'Hyper-V Quick Create' in your start menu."
It would be nice to have this the other way. I use Linux as my Desktop OS, but it might be nice to run Windows in a VM condom to play games without having to physically disconnect my primary Linux hard drive to keep Microsoft's dirty mitts off of it when I boot Windows.
Why would I want to run Linux in a Windows VM when I can do the opposite?
Liberty - Security - Laziness - Pick any two.
I was doing that already years before MS got into the Linux game (out of desperation, I might add) and don't need their "help" to run a linux VM inside MS Windows.There is nothing MS has that I want.
Both Wine and various VM solutions usually run Windows programs just fine.
And thanks to Valve, now basically any game in the Steam catalogue can run on Linux. Period. Which is huge.
(Even if it actually runs on a Windows with a Linux backend, since Steam is not actually a Linux application, but merely disguising itself in some Wine wrapper, with the un-Unixy/Linuxy uglinesses hanging out left and right. Like its complete ignorance of LSM rules of where which files should go, its attempt to be its own package manager instead of using the OS one, and so on. But hey... baby steps.)
Nowadays, basically only specialty/niche software (e.g. for music production or certain industries) sometimes have problems with Wine, and otherwise, everything runs under Linux.
Not that the never-worked-fully-and-never-will Wine never stopping to be a half-done work of progress isn’t an annoying problem, of course. (I truly appreciate every bit of work that went in there, though.)
It's not Linux's job to be compatible with some greedy corporations's shitty non-platform-agnostic software (or hardware) though.
Windows 10's update system and the complete lack of control over it has me going the other way. Some of us run simulations that can take days to complete. Some of these machines are on private networks and do not require constant updates. Microsoft has not accounted for this AT ALL. We're moving away completely...
The broad driver and application support of Windows with the powerful UNIX-like utilities of Linux, for the majority of users that is a good combination. Yes there is a tiny percentage of computer users that feel hurt and will never forgive Microsoft for their transgressions from decades ago but that's ok, this isn't targeted at you just like whatever bespoke, non-mainstream, usability rats nest of a Linux distro you use is not aimed at the broader population of computer users.
so that more data can be stolen from the users.
I don't think you understand what the word 'stolen' means, we've been through disproving those idiotic claims made by the RIAA/MPAA many times before. In terms of what data is collected that has been made very clear now, there are pages on Microsoft's site that detail it.
And in case you mean GNU, why would I run a professional OS on a toy OS?
Because the "toy OS" is the one that actually runs all the professional applications, the so-called "professional OS" is trash on a desktop which is why relatively nobody uses it, even macOS has multiple times the userbase that GNU/Linux has and the only way in which Linux has been made into a usable operating system for end users has been for Google to strip out the GNU bits.
GNU/Linux is good for embedded and server uses. If you want to run professional applications on the desktop then Windows is the way to go (even with hundreds of distributions comparatively nobody uses GNU/Linux there), for mobile you're best off with iOS or Android because all the GNU/Linux attempts at mobile are complete garbage and it's the same story for VR, AR and wearable platforms.
Windows 10 will never touch a system I own. Period.
It's glorified spyware/adware. I don't care what it offers. Once Win7 is done, it's Linux from here on out, even with the recovery/UI issues.
Doesn't the host become a baremetal Hyper V and your Windows 10 Pro instance then becomes a guest? I haven't used Gen 2 Hyper V yet so forgive my ignorance.
Kriston
Why wait?
What does Windows 8.1 actually give you that's worth keeping? That's worth the risk of making your VMs vulnerable to viruses, spyware, and other malware running on the host OS?
BTW, if you want a GUI to create & manage VMs, you can use libvirt's virt-manager.
Do they provide complete source code, including any required compilation scripts and data that can be used to build this exact binary image that they're distributing?
Because that's what the GPL **requires** them to do.
Often hardware virtualization support defaults to off in the BIOS. With it on, there will generally be no noticable slowdown in a VM provided you give the VM a reasonable amount of RAM. You might see it called Intel VT-x or AMD-V in the BIOS. Enable it.
Sometimes people give a VM 256MB of RAM, then they are suprised that it's almost as slow as a machine with 256MB of RAM. If top performance is needed, a VM should have almost as much RAM assigned as you'd use in a bare-metal machine withh the same OS. IO buffer in the host reduce the RAM requirements a little bit.
The other thing that can happen is if you have a VM that does a ton of IO, you want to use virtio. Set the VM settings to use virtio rather than emulating a particular network card and hard drive. That can significantly faster, if the VM writes to disk a lot or it's pumping a hundreds of megabits through the network card.
... Let him post it once so he's heard, then delete any reposting in the same article.
I don't like it either, but I wouldn't want to see anything deleted unless it's libelous or illegal. Free speech shouldn't stop for the sensitivity du jour. I suggest per-user filter options to render a post in 1px font if it matches any of a list of regular expressions. Not deleted; not censored; not hidden, just hard to read.
The Russians have won. They have made the world a cesspool of distrust, greed, fear and hate.
[the Steam store's] attempt to be its own package manager instead of using the OS one
Which is "the OS one"? Linux does not provide a package manager. Nor does GNU alone. Package management under GNU/Linux is currently the job of distributions, and different distributions' package managers tend to be mutually incompatible. So which distribution's package manager should Steam be wrapping?
Components of WSL distributed as free software are subject to the Microsoft Open Source Code of Conduct. It's based on a combination of the same Contributor Covenant 1.4 that Linux uses and a (discontinued) TODO Group Code of Conduct.
Why would I want to run Windows, AT ALL, even in a VM, even with a gun to my head, when there's GNU/Linux?
One possibility is that the hardware you have isn't very compatible, such as an ASUS Transformer Book T100TA, and PC makers specializing in GNU/Linux (such as System76) don't offer replacement laptops in your preferred size range. WSL makes Windows into a hardware abstraction layer (HAL) for a GNU system.
Your comment echoes WSL issue 107. The solution is to enable source debs or source RPMs or whatever in the distribution that you install in WSL, and you will get complete corresponding source code for all packages provided by the distribution.
Games and specialty applications.
Unfortunately, developers pander to the masses precisely because they are the masses.
Microsoft strong-armed enough OEMs through the '90s and into the '00s that they won through ubiquity. Few people try alternatives when Windows comes "free", pre-installed, with every computer you buy.
Why would I want to run Windows in the first place ?
even worse :
Why would I want to run Windows 10 in the first place ?
aaaaaaa
Right. Personal data and usage habits are completely worthless to a company like Microsoft that has absolutely no incentive to, say, push ads out to users.
Now if you'll excuse me, I have to buy this new product that I just saw in my start menu.
CLI paste? paste.pr0.tips!
Features that VirtualBox has had for many years.
but does it run IN FAST KERNEL mode?
CLI paste? paste.pr0.tips!
Have they resolved the incompatibility of Hyper-V with other virtualization engines yet? I would love to try it, but enabling Hyper-V has always meant disabling my other VMs, which makes it virtually useless for me.
You might not want it, other people do.
Some people don't even like Linux, imagine that.
"It's such a fine line between stupid and clever" -- David St. Hubbins, Spinal Tap
It's now much easier to be vulnerable to both Windows and Linux attacks.
Because some tools are just plain better on Windows. Quite some years ago I was developing software which needed to run on linux, and the software was multithreaded. The problem was that at the time, debugging multithreaded software on linux sucked donkey balls. Gdb simply could not cope with breakpoints in multithreaded code without crashing.
Visual studio otoh had no such problems, and was both a very handy tool for developing, debugging, and designing the unit tests. So I developed all infrastructure code with full test coverage on Windows, and then transferred it to a linux box and compiled everything with g++
Maybe these days, support for those use cases has improved, but at the time there was no reasonable linux based solution.
It wasn't a good experience. You would think, after all this time, that Microsoft could create a VM package that could run a linux distro without all the massive input lag from the mouse. It's performance was abysmal.
Secondly, Hyper-V causes a few unacceptable conflicts with it just installed on the machine. There was the ATI Radeon Re-Live overlay problem. It took quite some time troubleshooting that issue down to something that isn't even remotely related. Not being able to run other VM software is another issue. One could almost make the anti-trust parallel that got Microsoft in trouble for long ago with IE.
I am sure other people experienced other unintended behavior.
Steam runs much better with Windows as the native operating system. So do other resource intensive applications. And on a laptop, especially, sacrificing a few Gig of RAM to run the hypervisor and X Windows and running Windows inside the VM is sacrificing those resources to the virtualization layer. It's why, given the choices, I will normally equip a laptop as a Windows host and run Linux as the virtual machine, using an SSH client to access the Linux host to get cut and paste operations to work best.
There's a noticeable slowdown when you stress the graphics card with intense rendering or even bitcoin mining.
I just happen to be working on something where I need a windows port of a python app, and enabling ssh on a windows box is great, and I then ssh into it from from ubuntu laptop, and I can use cmd, powershell, or even bash. great! Installed vim, but I can't use it, the curses library/screen refresh doesn't work properly. If I do man man, I get the first page, and then the following pages don't show up. refresh in vim doesn't work. if I start typing the whole window goes blank. totally unusable. any idea who/where I would ask?
I'm still not sure what canonical (ubuntu) thinks they will get out of this deep corporation with microsoft.
Did MS make them some promises (that we're not aware of)?
If there is one thing that history has taught us, it's that those who work with MS hardly get any benefit (to put it lightly), still people keep thinking - this time it will be different!
On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero.
The init system was never GNU, usually either SysV, BSD, or BusyBox for embedded systems, gnome3 is available on most distributions, you can choose a different WM than Gnome3 if you want. In other words you are clueless and wrong on all counts.
Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
I've had the exact opposite experience developing with Java. Almost all of my tools runs noticeably faster in Linux than in Windows, including the database, IDE, and runtime executables. This is especially amplified when comparing Windows and Linux on machines with an SSD.
VMs can have direct access to hardware. Once I tried adding a Windows virtual machine on top of Linux (KVM) with a PCI graphics card dedicated to that machine. I was able to get almost 100% performance out of the card (tested with a mining software) and can even overclock it.
The issue is you need a separate PCI card for each virtual machine, (or purchase an extremely expensive server class GPU with multiple VM access). There are guides for similar setups, where you'd most likely to have the on board GPU for the Linux desktop, and a PCI one for Windows gaming VM. That also requires a KVM of sorts, since they would have discrete outputs.
This is the rational viewpoint. No wonder it was modded down to shit. Microsoft is the leader in open source. There are others but they lag far behind. In a few years when someone says "Linux" people will think of Microsoft as the default integrator and facilitator. Sorry RedHat, you tried.
I object to power without constructive purpose. --Spock
Because he just realized his relevancy and needed a way to make headlines.
I object to power without constructive purpose. --Spock
Windows doesn't need a package manager because all software brings its own dependencies. Perhaps this was an issue in 1985 when you needed to save disk space and/or applications were crash fucking each other. Yawn...
I object to power without constructive purpose. --Spock
All and none you pedantic, smelly fuck.
I object to power without constructive purpose. --Spock
Pump pump pump it up! Pump up the Ram...
I object to power without constructive purpose. --Spock
You sound like someone that swallows hook, line and sinker the "please allow our tracking cookies. We want to to have the meta experience on our sight that you richly deserve" and the ad blocker lines of bullshit.
Your sig here!
> why would I run a professional OS on a toy OS?
Running Linux on Windows allows for the full *nix ecosystem without having to reboot or fart around with Cygwin, can try-it-before-you-install, easier cross-platform development, etc.
Does it _really_ matter _why_ they want to do this?
I code professionally Java and .Net, Eclipse is an inferior IDE on pretty much all aspects compared to Visual Studio. The worst was IDE responsiveness, I can't stand lag and Eclipse did suffer much more than VS.
Tired of my customary (Score:1)
As much as I love open source, I prefer IntelliJ IDEA way more than Eclipse. For some reason, IntelliJ starts much faster, feels snappier, and runs the unit tests much faster in Linux than in Windows. It could have something to do with Windows Defender thrashing the disk as the poster above stated but it's also possible that the Linux JVM has better optimization (I haven't seen recent benchmark comparisons for JVMs of different OSes). For me, one of the biggest advantages of using Linux rather than Windows is not having to worry about NTFS locking files that are resident in memory. When that happens, processes that try to remove those files, such as refreshing Maven or Gradle dependencies, hang with no notification of why they're hanging and won't complete until the process that is using those files in memory is killed. As far as I know, no other file system in modern operating systems has this annoying limitation.
Take a look at: https://github.com/gnif/Lookin...
Forgetting the past puts us all in peril. From the days of DR-DOS up through the OOXML sham, Microsoft consistently practiced anti-competitive behaviour, working towards vendor-lock in and maintaining that lock in. Only when they didn't have market dominance did they actually try to compete fairly. You're seeing a better behaved Microsoft today likely because they're way behind in the mobile market, they've lost web browser dominance, and they're trying to carve out a place in the "cloud"; they're having to compete. To assume their monopolistic ethos has been cast out is naive. If MS had gotten their way, you'd run Internet Explorer on all your devices because websites wouldn't work with any other browser. Windows Phones would work so much better than OS X and Android when interfacing with work-mandated apps (running Microsoft Apps), that they'd be the only "sensible" choice. Do you really think there's no serious Outlook competitors because Outlook is so good, no developers can design better? Remember Nokia? Why did MS create XPS instead of using the capable and industry standard PDF?
You're quick to belittle those who lived and worked through years of MS's anti-competitive actions. It's prudent to be suspicious of anyone or anything that has repeatedly misbehaved in the past.
BTW, your "tiny percentage" comment as well as your assumption that the same would be using a "non-mainstream" distro makes you sound like a MS fanboi. Maybe only a tiny percentage ever took notice and cared, but that's the nature of the industry (how many know what OOXML is?). I've used Ubuntu since it came out and to this day, having used Debian, RH, and others before.
Windows 10 is a glorified spyware and DRM platform. Ubuntu is a vanity project which has done for linux everything that factory farming has done for chickens.
VirtualBox works very well, with nice support for multiple monitors.
One click to give/take away Windows VM network access as and when required.
Here is the diagnostics list for the telemetry with an explanation of what the fields are, also it is anonymized.
You mean there's what Microsoft says it is or does. Since the data transmitted encrypted, all those claims are unverifiable. I know it, you know it, Microsoft knows it. Give the past, I'd feel stupid trusting in that Microsoft accurately describes what they are doing there. Wonder what makes you so certain?
You realise that one line of text in the start menu you can just turn off right?
Pretty sure it's more than "one line of text", and the fact that you can go out of your way to turn it off until the next upgrade is worthless.
CLI paste? paste.pr0.tips!
The "Linux wave" has been coming for about 20 years now... exactly when is it supposed to arrive?
/* No Comment */
You'll have to explain to me the behavior your are describing because I don't suffer from it either using VS or Eclipse in windows server 2016 (my dev machine).
Tired of my customary (Score:1)
So you haven't tried Steam on Windows in a decade and you know he is lying about Steam running better on Windows?
Often hardware virtualization support defaults to off in the BIOS. With it on, there will generally be no noticable slowdown in a VM provided you give the VM a reasonable amount of RAM. You might see it called Intel VT-x or AMD-V in the BIOS. Enable it.
Sometimes people give a VM 256MB of RAM, then they are suprised that it's almost as slow as a machine with 256MB of RAM. If top performance is needed, a VM should have almost as much RAM assigned as you'd use in a bare-metal machine withh the same OS. IO buffer in the host reduce the RAM requirements a little bit.
The other thing that can happen is if you have a VM that does a ton of IO, you want to use virtio. Set the VM settings to use virtio rather than emulating a particular network card and hard drive. That can significantly faster, if the VM writes to disk a lot or it's pumping a hundreds of megabits through the network card.
When Ram prices come down, and the standard desktop cpu is 64gigs of ram, I will run virtual I/O
Leslie Satenstein Montreal Quebec Canada
Are you thinking of virtio auto memory ballooning?
I was talking about IO (disk and network) through virtio.
It's faster and less resource intensive to just memory copy directly from the guest to the host rather than pretending to be an Ethernet chip, or a SATA card. It uses less memory, as the virtio driver is basically just a line of code - copy data from guest memory to host.
Memory auto ballooning lets the VM memory usage dynamically adapt. You CAN set it to allow the memory usage to go higher than you would go statically, or you can just set the max thr same as you would and allow it to go lower via ballooning when the guest isn't using that much RAM.