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Sony Promises Better Face Identification Through Depth-Sensing Lasers (theverge.com)
An anonymous reader quotes a report from The Verge: Speaking with Bloomberg last week, Sony's sensor division boss Satoshi Yoshihara said Sony plans to ramp up production of chips to power front and rear 3D cameras in late summer, responding to demand from multiple smartphone manufacturers. Though Yoshihara is geeked about the potential for augmented reality applications, the most intriguing aspect of this new tech would appear to be a better form of face identification than we currently have. The Face ID approach that Apple first brought into use on the iPhone X -- and others like Xiaomi, Huawei, and Vivo have since emulated -- works by projecting out a grid of invisible dots and detecting the user's face by the deformations of that grid in 3D space. Sony's 3D sensor, on the hand, is said to deploy laser pulses, which, much like a bat's echolocation, creates a depth map of its surroundings by measuring how long a pulse takes to bounce back. Sony's sensor chief argues this produces more detailed models of users' faces, plus it apparently works from as far away as five meters (16 feet).
I do not want my phone emitting laser pulses. This has the potential to be dangerous, albeit not lethal with the typical power levels found in a modern phone. It sounds like it also could be hijacked and used to sense a user's immediate surroundings if it works out to 15 feet. It probably could generate a 3D map of the inside of your house as you walked through it. With this type of information, you quickly lose superiority over a burglar or invader, especially given the superior firepower and element of surprise they are likely to have.
Lol sorry
I imagine the caution label on this will be something like...
Caution, do not look into laser with remaining eye.
Do not look at phone with remaining eye.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Here's a better idea: Let's not shoot lasers at people's faces.
Liberty - Security - Laziness - Pick any two.
Unlike other forms of security. Biometrics requires a targeted attack, vs a generalized attack.
So overall you are probably more protected because you are really not that special enough to require someone to go into extra means to copy your bio-metrics for you to hack in.
I have an iPhone with Apples face reader. Compared to the fingerprint reader is is six on one side and half a dozen on the other.
It is annoying that I need to be looking directly at the phone for it to respond. However the fingerprint reader likes to fail when my hands are sweaty at the gym, or the button has gotten dirty.
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
Call me a luddite, but doesn't shooting lasers directly at one's face from arm's length seem a bit ludicrous? Is a password THAT hard to type?
All the comments so far are some variation on "oh no, shooting LAZORS at someone!"
I've worked with both the pattern projection systems (like kinect) and the TOF imaging chips. The TOF systems are a more elegant solution, but don't seem to be all that superior in practice. Since they use interference they have a window of distances they're sensitive to, with a tradeoff of precision and how deep the window is.
used to do this hit the hobby market. Time to start planning some projects...
FaceID is vastly better than fingerprint detection so I am happy to see Sony offering something to where this can be offered to many other phone makers...
It's only half of the equation though, once you get a detailed depth map you need software to be able to verify it's an authenticated face. Probably Sony will have some kind of reference implementation for that, that while not as good as Apple's will be good enough for most people.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Beau not working, again?
Don't bite the other hand that feeds.
Wanna buy a shirt?
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I have an iPhone with Apples face reader. Compared to the fingerprint reader is is six on one side and half a dozen on the other.
In my experience sometimes FaceID is preferable and sometimes TouchID is preferable depending on the use case. There are a lot of times where having to have the phone looking right at you is rather awkward. Using ApplePay is a good example - for that the fingerprint ID is usually preferable in my experience, especially for things like going through a drive through. I'd say 80-90% of the time I prefer FaceID but that other 10-20% I really prefer TouchID.
To map face conttours one is going to need sub-centimeter resolution. I'd speculate that to actually make this distinguishing -- the point of face recognition, one would need millimeter resolution. SO that would put the time reolution below 30 picoseconds.
Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
I switched off "Require Attention for Face ID" in Settings.
As you say; my main threat is the average meth head stealing my phone and FaceId will prevent them and any downstream buyer from looking at my data.
My twin nieces will still defeat your facial recognition software. Every time.
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
"Do not look at the laser light with your remaining eye."
Maybe it's just me but I still wonder about why anyone is putting so much valuable information on their phone that it needs this level of security. If I lose my phone or it's stolen, all the finder/thief is going to get is my contacts' phone numbers, some photos, and music I've copied onto the phone. No need to have laser facial scanning to protect that. (Nope... no online banking and definitely no social networking via my phone.)
CUR ALLOC 20195.....5804M
First, No Biometrics does not require a target attack. It is still just a string of data taken from the input of a device and generalised attacks are still possible both in the brute force "faked sensor data" and algorithm specific "generic adversarial attack".
Second, if your biometrics are subject to a targeted attack, that is the biometric becomes known beyond the level of detail the sensor uses, you are 100% locked out of using that biometric until the state of the art advances to use more data than your attacker has on you.
Third, As the Police have so vigorously asserted in court you have no expectation of privacy over your biometric data. Now I am no legal expert so I don't know the full length and breadth of the implications of that but I do know that the Police wanted that to mean that unlike a traditional password, that you can refuse to enter under your 5th Amendment right against self incrimination, you can be forced to unlock devices locked with biometrics under penalty of law.
Fourth, as the ability to automate these attacks progresses, and they will inevitably progress, the bar for "really not that special enough" goes lower and lower and lower.
Purely curious, but what about FaceID do you find to be vastly superior?
Because I don't have to ever think consciously about authenticating, it just happens. As someone else said in the past, the feel of it is like using a phone without a passcode... A few examples:
1) Notifications show up, but text is not revealed until I look at the phone.
2) I really can just Siri to open any app with the phone locked, and it will open up without having to wait for the prompt to unlock.
3) I can just pick up my phone and by the time I'm swiping it up to open it's unlocked and I am in.
4) On an iPad FaceID has an additional feature of meaning the device truly has no orientation, which makes it nicer to use (no fingerprint/home button to seek out to move between apps).
5) It also is way nice if you have touch sensitive gloves, since you don't have to take off the gloves to unlock and use your phone. However, there is a sticking point there - I've not been happy with any touch sensitive gloves I've bought yet. I bought two light pairs of gloves last year, and the touch registration was a bit iffy to start, but after a year has past, this winter I find it does not work at all. If anyone has any suggestions for very good gloves, or particular tech to look for I am all ears (both gloves I had just had a touch registering fabric, but I think there is some more wire mesh looking material I have seen in the past that may hold up better).
6) For older users FaceID is super reliable (as the older you get the more distinctive your face is). TouchID has trouble the older you are - the fingerprint sensors the government uses for global entry cannot even read my mothers fingerprints anymore. TouchID on an iPhone does work for her, but sometimes it's not able to read prints depending on how dry her hands are.
Some people said I was being hyperbolic but I am serious, I would never buy another device without FaceID, for anyone.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley