Slashdot Mirror
October Gnome Released
k_wayne writes "The Gnome team have finished an amazing bug hunt and we are left with a pretty cool stable release of the Gnome system. See the announcement made by Elliot Lee. The gnome developers are now moving their attention toward the next generation gnome release. This new Gnome stuff is not only very stable, it's got some very cool stuff in it. " One really nice new feature is dingus-clicking: you can click on a URL in the terminal and have Netscape come up. XChat, glade, more translations, and easier bug reporting some of the most significant features.
But yesterday I just 'apt-get upgrade'd my Debian potato system, like any other day. It automagically upgraded to October Gnome (there was careful work done this time to make sure that all the distros had packages ready the day it came out). Everything worked perfectly, since the distro is continuously updated and checked.
Debian unstable is up to 4050-odd packages comprising everything ever anywhere. I'm up to 537 of them installed.
After I upgraded to October Gnome, I went to a CMU-LUG meeting where Jacob Berkman (the gnome-core maintainer and panel hacker) talked about October Gnome!
:)
Simple, go get those particular packages. Upgrade then do a rpm -Uvh package_name like described previously. Don't forget to delete your old .enlightenment [if you're using enlightenment] and .gnome directories. Enjoy!
> Today, it seems, we've turned the tables.
/.ers subscribe to the same opinion on every topic.
Was it the same poster? Contrary to beliefs popular in certain circles, not all
--
It's October 6th. Where's W2K? Over the horizon again, eh?
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
Well, unless I drink too much, and even then I usually just fall asleep.
- NotZed (in Australia)
__// `Thinking is an exercise to which all too few brains
_
\\/ are accustomed' - First Lensman
Well, people seem to be a little hostile towards Gnome, so I thought I would add my thoughts on the matter...
In my opinion, Gnome is much more developer-friendly than KDE. I see KDE as a desktop for complete newbies up to general computer use, but see Gnome as more of a power-user desktop. It uses the Gtk widget set, which was written to be open source by open source people. It is all GLPed, and always has been. It is not quite so take-over-the-desktop oriented as KDE is, giving much more flexibility (never had a specific window manager, parts can easily run without the whole). So, while everybody says "A is better than B" back and forth, one has to realize that the two are as different as apples and tuesday. They act differently, look differently, and are just plain different. If you like one, wht difference does it make if I like the other? I think they both serve their purpose quite well and am happy they are both there.
By the way, I run neither Gnome nor KDE. I do have Gnome installed on my system, as I like it better in general and sometimes play with the latest toys, but usually I just run FVWM as a window manager and use XEmacs to do my coding.
Posted from the wireless couch.
- A URL
- A mailto: URL
- An email address
- A pathname (ala the Common Lisp notion of pathname, namely a structured object that represents a filename)
- A MIME object dropped onto the clipboard
Then, if there is ambiguity, make sure that whatever we "think" the object is happens to be accessible in that expected form.Notably, if it's a file reference, validate against /etc/magic to determine whether the method we think we're going to apply to it is actually appropriate to what's in the file.
A "controller" part would be the provision of control to select the method by which the object is to be viewed. Which leads naturally to the "view" portion of the paradigm...
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
I suppose you've forgotten the time you came looking for Miguel on #kde on openprojects, where he'd tell newcomers "Go to #gnome instead, KDE sucks!"
I find it a little harder to forget, considering Miguel never told me how to get to the GNOME IRC channel. But it didn't seem like hostility then and I don't see why it should now.
-Taj. PS Which developer was it on #gnome who stole something you claim you never wanted to hide anyway?
All the libraries are LGPL which is worse than the QPL, even RMS hates it. And KDE is much more developer friendly. It's easy to develop applications and they have more widgets like HTML widgets, etc...
> s/just/jury/
Unterminated command string! hehe... just picking nits...
--
- Sean
It's a fine line between trolling and karma-whoring... and I think I just crossed it.
- Sean
dpkg -l | wc -l
o m.*"
/mill
428
Downloading 30 packages instead of one huge is only a problem for those who don't understand how to use the tools available to them.
man ncftpget
Example:
> ncftpget "ftp://ftp.sunet.se/pub/doc/lpf/programming.freed
programming.freedom.1.gz: 13.64 kB 199.71 kB/s
programming.freedom.10.gz: 5.32 kB 109.12 kB/s
programming.freedom.11.gz: 4.65 kB 129.30 kB/s
programming.freedom.2.gz: 10.02 kB 58.00 kB/s
programming.freedom.3.gz: 10.19 kB 136.75 kB/s
programming.freedom.4.gz: 10.70 kB 161.11 kB/s
programming.freedom.5.gz: 11.69 kB 201.46 kB/s
programming.freedom.6.gz: 12.22 kB 160.36 kB/s
programming.freedom.7.gz: 9.79 kB 63.93 kB/s
programming.freedom.8.gz: 14.75 kB 172.54 kB/s
Now go practice.
IF I had the bandwidth to upgrade form an ftp site, and gnome had an rpm dir with all the rpms, I'd just do an rpm -Uvh * and let my system determine which rpms I need :-)
Only 'flamers' flame!
There is not enough context to map 'blah.txt' to an actual file on disk, thats basically why.
Seems to me that a convention using the CWD of the foreground process on that terminal might be a useful default directory for "blah.txt"
I think it's quite ok to use a version name instead of a version number to indicate a release of a bundle of software. It sounds much cooler and is easier to remember than 1.0.53.
However, this month thing may get confusing. How can you know if e.g. JuneGnome is newer then OctoberGnome if you don't have the year in it..
Greetings,
Ivo
In ncftp, mget * and then rpm -Fvh * was easy enough for me. The -F option upgrades all previously installed packages.
Knowing these and other magic spells is the hard part (for the general public, anyway).
Windowmaker is one single program
GNOME is many many programs
Windowmaker is a windowmanager
GNOME is a desktop environment.
You cannot say "Windowmaker is one 3 files, GNOME should be too", as they are totally different things.
GNOME has been fairly stable for me since about V0.9, but once it passed about V1.0.9, it hasn't crashed in any major way that I can remember. The only version of GNOME that I had a problem with was 0.3. Version 1.18 is very stable and if you don't want to upgrade, fine, just don't be so close minded. Just because it crashed once in the past, doesn't mean it's not stable now.
Common to what. My first Gnome-installation took hours to download all this libs (56k modem). I admit having used a RedHat-system by the time.
Nevertheless, it IS bloat as kde is (not accepting your bloat-definition).
"Wer einen tanzenden Stern gebären will..." F.N.
It should work just fine. They took the SRPMs from 6.1 to make the Red Hat GNOME RPMS.
I gave up on Gnome due to all the bugs
Well, what are you waiting for? This is the stable release you have been waiting for and no longer need to be a bigot!
--
You know, the one with all the flames for people who don't know about Linux? I didn't post the last thread, but yes this one is from me. mosfet@kde.org
I get a kick out of reading Slashdot comments on the PCWeek thing, about how 21 security updates aren't that bad, you just wget the whole directory, then rpm -Fvh *.rpm and you're done. And how one big service pack from Microsoft is bloated and slow and inefficient....
Today, it seems, we've turned the tables. "30 packages? What a pain! Why don't they just give me one big package that I can click?"
:)
Much obliged. I really appreciate your making these available.
Wish me luck with the upgrade!
As far as I know Apt will do it, in a simpler fashion than RPM. Seems to be better configured for the power user than RPM.
========================================
Death will come, and will have your eyes
-- Pavese
Hey - this sounds completely brilliant!
:-) is a much better solution.
I have often been frustrated using Mutt at the remote server where I collect my mail. It's not astoundingly inconvenient to cut & paste a URL, but "insta-click"(tm
I wonder how it will handle URL's that have broken across a line?? Anyone got the answers?
A little planning goes a long way...
Team is a singular collective noun, and as such can be used with both 'has' and 'have'...
The team have finished...
The team has finished...
Basically, you are saying 'the [members of the] team have finished' in the first instance. Absolutely nothing wrong with that...
T.
Why didn't they implement a regex->action coupling? You can implement opening URL's from xterms using this by creating a regex for an URL, and binding netscape to that URL.
You could also use this to open a texteditor whenever something like blah.txt is encountered.
This is your sig. There are thousands more, but this one is yours.
...but then again, I did when 1.0 came out. They did themselves no favours then, but I suppose we're all entitled to one mistake.
For the record, I think the 'click in a terminal' feature is beyond cool.
One thing: October GNOME? What does October stand for? Let's see... October Can Take Off Because Errors Remedied?
The .deb's seem to be gone on the FTP.
Does anybody know anything about it?
Or do I have to start compiling tar-balls and CVS-snapshots again?
Frankly, they should also use version number, it is much more easy to follow the evolution of a product based on its version number (minor enhancement ? increase minor number) than on the month of the release...
Maybe they don't use version number because they fucked up the 1.0.0 version which should have been labeled 0.9.9 to say that it was feature complete but not yet stable. But that doesn't mean that using version number is a bad thing, it just mean that you have to be cautious about your version number..
Hmmmm... I went to the site and had a look at the RH rpm's and I'm a little miffed that they expect me to download and install 30+ packages. Why not at least put them into 5-6 larger ones. It would certainly make the process much easier.
Anyways, I'm going to give it a try, heck, maybe I'll write a perl script to automate the process.
Gnome has a baaaaaaaaad reputation in the Nokia division where I work. People call it the synonim for "crappy". I believe there is much good work behind the project, I also know how powerful is the object model on which it's based, ultrakudos to Gnome. But when they released version 1.0, they shot themselves in the feet.
Personally I had a non-nice experience installing Gnome, I admit I never made it working. I also admit I didn't try very hard because fvwm2 was enough for me at the time, and KDE got my heart when I tried it later. KDE was nice enough to not want me trying to install Gnome again. But I am sure the guys here will happily install it on the RH boxes, and I will certainly have many feedbacks on how it's performing. I wish Gnome all the best, and succesful bug-hunting.
Sigged!
"Dingus clicking"
I'd love to see that enter the vernacular:
"Launch Netscape"
"no, you have to click the dingus"
"no, click"
"here"
"the DINGUS!, click the DINGUS!"
"good"
It's 10 PM. Do you know if you're un-American?
You see, Gnu/Linux is no longer just for the computer elite, it for a much larger crowd who for some reason, want to take a chance with this bold new platform.
Hacking value isn't a boolean value, friend. It is qualitive in all shapes and sizes. Think, there is probably somebody who used to be famliar DOS batch files and task-switching in DOS who right now is experimenting with Python. Think, someone who used to write HTML in MS Notepad is, right now, learning vi. Think, right now, someone is writing their first shell script. Think, right now, someone is learning Perl.
If there is one good GNU/Linux can cause because of it's hype, it would be the spread of true computer literacy and the aknowledgement of what computer literacy really is.
Desktops like Gnome and KDE aren't just catering to the masses, they are catering to people who are less secure with a command-line, but still want to learn. Tell me this, what difference is there between developing in gEdit rather than emacs or vi.
Why is it, you think, that people are coming to Unix? Probably because Windows isn't fun anymore. A little while ago, I saw one of the last issues of DOSWorld in the newsstands. I glanced through it and saw the various tricks and hacks with batch scripts and DOS and thought to myself, these people would love GNU/linux. I believe that many of these people do. DOSWorld doesn't exist anymore.
I would love to see a scripting utility for gnome to make access to the desktop more easier. Access to all the Corba objects and bonobo componets with documentation, something compelling to even the least computer literate.
Ah, but one can dream...
--
Hmm this really depends on your point of view. In one sense it is bloat to use lots of libraries if you never use any of those libraries for other apps - since you have an app installed for just one main program. OTOH the point of Linux dynamic libraries is to be able to link in the least possible so maing your apps as small as possible at runtime. For a projects point of view code reuse is an important aim so if there is someone else already maintaing a particular library why recreate the wheel. In GNOME's case there are a variety of advanced features built in to the system which really makes it a desktop environment and development framework so hence it does have a lot of dependencies. For example XML is being used for a lot of the config data hence you need a libXML the same applies for CORBA etc. However, just think of the size of the apps if the func for panel interaction had to be statically linked in and the general waste when every app had a copy of the XML functions within them!
besides, if you want "themes" you can have them in windows too. Take reveal for example. http://reveal.unpaved.com/
---
"Team" is a singular noun. "Have finished" is a plural verb phrase when used in the third person as this sentence uses it. They don't go together. This article should start with, "The Gnome team has finished. . . ." You wouldn't say "John have finished. . . ." would you?
Sure, it is great they fix bugs instead of just moving forward with new features. I do not think that it is "impressive", though.
My point (which, judging by the moderation, I did not get accros too well :-) was that releasing software as version 1.0 when it is full of bugs is not too good, promotion wise. They called 1.0 stable, and now it turns out it was so buggy that the bugfixing alone is "impressive". It surely makes me wonder whether I can trust that this release is stable.
It reminds me of Windows, where Win95 was said to be so much more fun. And then Win98 commercials come along, stating that Win98 will take away the headache. (They had such commercials in Denmark, I do not know if it was world-wide. They had a box of painkillers of the brand "Windows 98" if I recall correctly).
I am a programmer. When I fix a bug, I apologize that I put it in in the first place. I do not celebrate myself as being the great bugfixer. It is merely the word "impressive" that I am against - not the bugfixing in itself. As I said, fixing bugs is great!
--
I rather like start menus.
I just happen to like to bring mine up by right-clicking anywhere on the root window, so I use WindowMaker.
The latest version of WindowMaker lets you add folders to its application menu, and open its contents with any ol' command. I do use KDE's file manager, and the command I use is kfmclient -exec [filename], which does the same thing that clicking on the file in a kfm window would do. You can also use any ol' shell command to generate submenus, which allowed me to add my bookmarks to WindowMaker's app menu via a Perl script.
They have to many things to download for the base distribution. There are like 20 packages just to get the basic GOME installed. If it were not for the fact that distros like SuSE, Redhat, and Slackware to name a few, to include GNome on there cdroms, I'd never have tried gnome. Kde was much easier, there were 3 files to download to get the system up kdesupport, kdelibs and kdebase. Anything else was / is extra. Not to turn this into a desktop war, but don't you think that it would be easier to install there stuff if they did it this way? I have heard of many an experienced Linux user having problems getting gnome up and running. BTW I do like gnome very much, and my currentl desktop consists of windowwmaker window manager gnome task bar and kfm. A little bit of diversity never killed anyone :-)
Only 'flamers' flame!
Anyone else notice that their releases tend to occur *immediately* after RedHat makes their CD image? Just in time so that it can't go on the next OS release. Something MUST be afoot. fnord
-Chris
I downloaded the new October GNOME RPMs from one of the mirror sites, and they ran on my Red Hat 6.1 system w/o a hitch.
I use gftp to grab the entire directory of the ftp server. Then at the command line, cd into the new directory and run 'rpm -Uhv *.rpm"; very convenient!
The new features are great, a definate must-have for all GNOMErs out there... Stable as a rock, too.
What is a dingus? Some kind of wild animal from Australia?
Is it worth upgrading whatever gnome comes with 6.1 RedHat to this new Gnome? Or are they so close it doesn't matter? I'm guessing that RH6.1 has a gnome only a few minor patches behind. Am I correct?
Nuff Said.
:-)
"I got annoyed by the KDE wanna-be-developers who started monitoring the GNOME IRC channel"
Miguel spent 24 hours a day on #kde for 2 weeks disrupting every argument with his babbling and whining, trying to convince every visitor that we are some sort of evil entity.
I used to respect Miguel before that.
Roberto Alsina, speaking for himself, not for KDE.
One really nice new feature is dingus-clicking: you can click on a URL in the terminal and have Netscape come up.
OMG!! I have got to install this thing!
Ah yes? And your such a hotshot programmer?? Why don't you enlighten us by listing some of the programs you've created?
:-)
Didn't think so!
Ok some random bable form me: 1) why the heck would you want to run stable, awsome software on windows? 2) gnome is based on gtk, and yes I know it's been ported, but gnome looks and acts a lot like the docking bar on windows.. admittedly it's a lot NICER but hey windows stinks sorry dude you've reached the world where windows sucks and the most innovating software that is being made right now is free, and for operating systems outside of the normal Windows or Mac worlds. sorry buddy but you need to wake up and smell the coffee.
Dude! you need to wake up and drink the coffee. It was a joke. go buy a sense of humor.
I looked for the debs on ftp.debian.org but all that seems to be there is the original slink ... apt-get is going to be a little painful over a modem. Sometimes I just want to burn a bunch of new stuff to cd and take it home.
support gun control: take guns from cops
1.0 was the release of the API, not of 'GNOME' as a package. Unfortunately it was taken this way, and many of the components that are considered a part of gnome were not at 1.0 then (and still aren't last time I checked!)
Hey, I have Redhat 5.2 RPMS at:
ftp://saturn.aae.uiuc.edu/pub/gnome
(Disclaimer: a bit off topic...)
Has anyone tried running Java/Swing under Gnome? I enjoy using both KDE and Gnome, but KDE seems to run AWT/Swing far better than Gnome. This is with both Blackdown and IBM JDK's...
> Ah yes? And your such a hotshot programmer?? Why don't you enlighten us by listing some of the programs you've created?
Gnome. By programmers, for programmers, and damn sure no one else.
I havea feeling with more and more mainstream desktop usage we, as the experienced users, are going to be getting more and more of these confused comments. We houls be prepared to instuct with gentle hands and not blast people for something that could be confusing.
For clarification:
WindowMaker, E, KWM, FVWM, Blackbox and similar are windowmanagers. Windowmanagers control placement of windows, decoration of titlebars and such.
gnome/kde are desktop environments. It sounds confusing but it's not. Gnome/KDE applications each have a common look and feel to them. Wether it be QT with kde or GTK with gnome. The only difference between kde/gnome other than the look is that kde comes with its own WindowManager (defined above). If anyone wants to add to this I can set up a webpage that has information on this somewhere. It seems rather important to me. Maybe a page for newbies with common misconceptions they may have?
"Fighting the underpants gnomes since 1998!" "Bruce Schneier knows the state of schroedinger's cat"
named after "the hunt for red october"? after all they did "hunt" for bugs :)
forgot me login at home
Bill Gates is so busy with the Internet, he wants to make desktop+Internet look as one. This is kinda the same thing, if you ask me, please don't go too far! Desktop/Internet integration is unnecessary crap!
KDE may be in the lead at the moment, but (IMHO) It's not "winning"
I recently tried KDE just to see what the fuss was about. It does do cool things, but I found it a bit kludgy in comparison to Gnome.
This is my personal oppinion, not ment as flame bait.)
just my 2e-2$
--Jamin Philip Gray
jamin@DoLinux.org
Celebrate the finer things in life
Mosfet:
Just ignore the jerk. It's probably far more constructive to speak to someone with greater maturity, like Havoc. His attitude alone is helping to give Gnome a more tolerant face.
Additionally, keep up the great work. I've seen your work on theming and it is fantastic.
They certainly don't go easy on anyone else.
Have you noticed that they only support Red Hat Package Manager derivatives and not DPKG? I guess it's not surprising since Eliott works for RedHat.
Firstly, I've used GNOME for several months, more recently I've been using KDE. And I see newbies-to-computers practically every day.
I like GNOME/GTK for it's technological design and also because it is beautiful when themes are installed. However, on this last point people complain about the speed of GNOME in comparison to KDE which of course can be mostly answered by GNOME users using a plain theme. IIRC someone on #gnome did say that s/he was hoping to re-write the gtk-engines package to improve it's speed considerably, here's hoping...
With KDE, the applications are far more consistent. In GNOME apps, many file dialogues can be seen (see GIMP (okay, not strictly GNOME) verses GQView) and various UI styles are involved. Granted, they all use GTK, but there lacks consistency here. On KDE it's a very different (not neccessarily better) story
Perhaps when the guidelines for writing GNOME apps for v2 come out, they will contain stricter usage of widgets. Don't complain that that restricts choice - choice is for people who run E/WM/AfterStep *without GNOME or KDE - people running GNOME/KDE usually do for for complete consistency throughout their applications and that is best today in KDE.
Again as a lot of people have said, the number of packages which needs downloading should come down. Even KDE may just have one or two packages are can be merged, and I understand that something may be happening at least in a small way on the GNOME packaging front soon. I hope so.
Where GNOME does however fall down against KDE is in application documentation. Having used KDE for a couple of months now I have seen a noticable difference in the priority given to helpful diologues with "Help" where possible and appropriate. GNOME has these quite sparingly, although I may be doing the new release an injustice.
I hope this will fire up some good constructive development efforts for the v2 release - I see the KDE v2 preview screenshots and can only see good - let's hope that GNOME v2 can produce a more consistent, solid environment with plenty of functionality.
I haven't dealt with him personally but everyone I talked to does seem to like him and he is not as nasty as a lot of the other people. People say he's a good guy. I never seen him spread FUD or flame or be a nuisance either. mosfet@kde.org
Since there's so many accusations of the FSF and GNU being communistic, perhaps this really does refer to the October Revolution. Remember how Lenin was summoned to Moscow after the Czars were thrown out of rulership? The old evil feudalistic regime was being replaced by a non-communistic government. This was intolerable. Freedom must not be allowed to come to Russia unless it was the approved Marxist/Leninist version. So Soviet Russia was born, those few months of fledgling freedom erased from the history books.
Is this what October Gnome means? Non-GNU desktops are popular. This is intolerable. All supporters of the political party known as GNU must band together. This is a revolution. KDE must be utterly destroyed, fair or foul, and its memory erased from history. Free Software must not be allowed to exist without the blessings and sanctifications of St. Ignutius.
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned
Isn't it time for Gnome to get their own HTML browser? After all, Gnome is already approaching the bloated side. Clicking on an URL and having the 500 pound monstrosity called Navigator pop up is enough to send 16Meg systems into terminal thrashing.
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned
My ANTterm program on the Acorn did URL launching from a terminal window years ago...
Still, it's a good feature.
Hugo
Come on, stability improvements cannot really be that impressive? I for one am not impressed that they manage to fix their own bugs. It should nearly always be the number one priority for any programmer.
I am impressed that they rushed 1.0 out the door so soon that it took them this long to get it stable (if it is stable now). I gave up on Gnome due to all the bugs, and KDE being stable is no excuse for rushing a buggy 1.0 out the door.
--
i trid to get it to run under windows 95, but it would'nt work. somone said i needed a complier to get it working but i thought my system was fully complient?
pls help!
z3r0K3wl859@aol.com
I seem to remember a time with 5.2 when I attempted to update the GTK and glib RPM's using Gnome's RPM's, and it really, REALLY broke things. I ended up backing out of the RPM, and then 6.0 came out. Now that we're at 6.1, and idea of Gnome.org's RPM's will update 6.1's RPM's without a hitch?
I'll just go compile it up on my Slackware system, but I dare not touch comnpiling on the RedHat machine for fear the wrath of the RPM discrepency demon..
-- I'm the root of all that's evil, but you can call me cookie..
Take from
../og-old if you want to read them. E-mail me if you
http://people.redhat.com/sopwith/og/. Does this mean that the GNOME and KDE projects are diverging again?
I got annoyed by the KDE wanna-be-developers who started monitoring the GNOME
IRC channel to find this "precious gem of knowledge" URL, and thus have moved
the mentioned files into a different directory.
I just get really annoyed/angry when people claiming to bear a white flag of
peace, claiming to want cooperation, and claiming to care about the future of
the desktop have nothing better to do than watch the GNOME hackers at work.
The two files are in
have any questions as to why things were worded the way they were in the
press release & announcement. I have nothing to hide.
If you prefer IRC, stop by irc.gimp.org #gnome some time.
Thank you for your time.
-- Elliot Lee
Hermed annonceres udgivelsen af
- O k t o b e r G N O M E -
(version 1.0.53)
Det glæder GNOME projektet at kunne annoncere tilstedeværelsen
af "Oktober GNOME". Denne nye version kommer med et stabilt,
nem-at-bruge, og kraftfuld skrivebords miljø for brugere af UNIX-
lignende operativ systemer såsom GNU/Linux.
===> Hvad er GNOME?
GNU Network Object Model Environment'et (GNOME) er et gratis
skrivebords miljø for UNIX-lignende systemer, som tillader brugere
at udføre basis systemopgaver, såsom filhåndtering og ændring af
brugergrænsefladen uden at skulle benytte svære og komplicerede
kommandoer ved kommando prompten
GNOME kommer med et kraftfuldt grafisk miljø, som gør det nemt at
benytte UNIX-lignede systemer. Ved brug af træk-og-slip filhåndteringen
kan brugere manipulere filer og skrivebords ikoner. Komplet kontrol
over brugergrænsefladens "look and feel" er mulig via kontrol centeret,
som tillader brugere at opnå maksimal komfort og produktivitet gennem
forskellige udseende-temaer og andre indstillinger. GNOME panelet, det
centrale element på GNOME skrivebordet, er en fleksibel og meget
konfigurerbar element der bl.a. kan benyttes til at starte programmer og
forskellige redskaber.
National sprog understøttelse gør det mulig for brugere at opleve/bruge
GNOME på næsten 30 forskellige sprog, og sprogholdene arbejder næsten
konstant på at øge antallet af understøttede sprog.
For udviklere, kommer GNOME med en standard applikation ramme
(framework). Dette sikre en konsistent grænseflade som brugere let kan
lære. Applikations rammen gør det mulig for udviklere nemt at benytte
forskellige teknologier, såsom CORBA, træk-og-slip, GNOMEs kanvas/
billede model, XML, libglade, og programmeringssprog uafhængighed
til at bygge særdeles kraftige applikationer.
===> Hvad er nyt i Oktober GNOME?
Forbedringer:
. Imponerende stabilitets forbedringer tillader bekymrings-fri brug.
. Tilgængelige funktioner i de centrale applikationer er blevet
udvidet og forbedret
. Samarbejde mellem GNOME udviklerne er mere behagelig, takket
være en simpliceret problem reporterings proces.
. Mange flere sprogoversættelser er blevet tilføjet af GNOME oversættelses
projektet.
. "Magisk url" funktionen i terminal "widget'en" tillader web integration
med alm. applikationer.
. Glade brugergrænseflade udviklingsværktøj tilføjet.
. XChat irc klient tilføjet.
. CORBA grænseflade tilføjet for vigtige skrivebords servicer.
. Mange tilføjelser til GNOMEs flotte farvede ikoner fra GNOME ikon
projektet
===> Hvordan installerer jeg Oktober GNOME?
For instruktioner om hvordan man installere denne nye udgave, besøg
venligst 'Kom igang' siden på http://www.gnome.org/start/
Udover kildekoden, er forkompilerede pakker tilgængelig for Red Hat,
Caldera og SuSE Linux distributionerne. - og pakker for andre Linux
distributioner er under vej.
===> Hvordan kan jeg få hjælp til at bruge GNOME?
Hjælp er tilgængelig via en bred række at forskellige medier, såsom
postlister, irc kanaler og online dokumentation. Besøg venligst websiden
på http://www.gnome.org/ for mere information.
God fornøjelse,
-- GNOME holdet
Dansk annoncering af Kenneth Christiansen
Achtung Debian user!
Incase you aren't aware of it, the most redeeming feature of Debian is apt! I have it crontab'd to update my entire distro every night, just edit your sources file for the unstable, and `apt-get dist-upgrade`... mmmmmm.
This was a response to a thread posted on the KDE story a few days ago (last post there), and he sits there flaming me (no I wasn't the AC to make that post, although I did say something similiar on the mailing lists). Now he thinks we are all sitting on IRC watching him. I for one know I have better things to do - like continuing to code for KDE2... I only was on Gnome IRC once and that was to try to start a joint effort on the Gimp. But this kind of behaviour is becoming expected. mosfet@kde.org
KDE may be in the lead at the moment, but (IMHO) It's not "winning". I recently tried KDE just to see what the fuss was about. It does do cool things,
Well you obviously tried KDE 1.x which is the most widely used desktop around. But the 1.x-tree hasn't been touched by most KDE-developers since more than half a year now (only some minor fixes have been added for KDE 1.1.2). Since then people are working hard on KDE 2 which already has much better theming and many more and superior features and technologies (html & java, CORBA, Kanossa, excellent multimedia-framework e.g.) than GNOME has. The developers of KOffice are even working since more than a year now on kword, kpresenter, etc.. .
If you're looking at the bleeding edge of both projects it's obvious which project 'will' 'win' -- and it's not GNOME
AC
BTW: In doubt at least the user wins
The last word in the subject line of your post says more about you than I could.
Eliot:
people.redhat.com/sopwith/og/
The real press releases:
people.redhat.com/sopwith/og-old/
You act as if KDE and GNOME are being shoved down your throat. They aren't. If YOU DON'T LIKE THEM, YOU DON'T HAVE TO USE EITHER OF THEM. Even if your Linux distribution comes with one or the other you are in no way forced to run it.
I know all the unix commands for listing, copying, and moving files, and could use them to do all my file management from the console or an xterm. But you know what? I don't want to. It's quicker and easier to use drag-and-drop. You may disagree, but in Linux IF YOU DON'T LIKE SOMETHING, YOU DON'T HAVE TO USE IT.
I agree that themes are trivial. But I do believe that it is reasonable to add a little eye candy if you want to. You look at the monitor all the time, you should have something cool to look at if you want. However, not everyone who uses KDE or GNOME uses themes. I don't use them because I don't want to fool with them, but that's my choice, and I have no business speaking for other users. Linux is cool because IF YOU DON'T LIKE SOMETHING, THEN YOU DON'T HAVE TO USE IT.
Now people are going to talk about stability and performance issues. I have a P200 that is far more powerful than what I need to get by. I can afford to use up some RAM and CPU cycles. And when I need the stability for something (like a long download), I just exit X Windows and do it from the console.
I don't blame you for not liking KDE and GNOME. Personally, I hate GNOME and get frustrated with KDE pretty frequently. But don't whine about it like you've been done some sort of injustice. The bottom line is that, in Linux, IF YOU DON'T LIKE SOMETHING, YOU DON'T HAVE TO USE IT.
Yes, get the new GNOME packages - just download them to a directory, then, switch to root, do "rpm -Uvh *" and a clean GNOME upgrade should ensue. LOTS of good updates, features, and fixes. Then, sit back and be productive!!
I'd like to know the differences between E, ICEWM, WindowMaker (is that one? my brain hurts right now), etc. Examples such as what are the good features, vs. memory footprint and speed, etc. And how they relate to various environments like KDE and GNOME. (and ways of changing, via scripts. I don't like clicking on GUI buttons to change things when all it does is change a script, i'd rather fix it up myself).
Apologies if this doesn't make sense, i'm a semi-newbie, and AC. IMHO, however, this would make great info for other people than just myself.
Putting troll on the subject line should have been an indicator that it was a troll. People normally don't do that if they're serious.
come from?
Directly from the GNOME marketing department? ;)
I think the only reason GNOME is being even used is the fact that it comes by default with RH.
Who in their right mind would donwload 30 packages !!
I know this is flame bait, but someone has to speak up:
Why all the excitement for these sugar coating GUIs (KDE, GNOME, YADM). Do i really give a ph*ck about themes? Can i impress the people in my office with the incredibly baroque-looking desktop i can configure? Can i write a 100 line Perl CGI?
These are for script kiddies, Perl schmucks and wintel wannabes. You want to develop, make real applications, all you need is emacs, some good elisp packages, and a clean desktop. Yes, I agree that things like the CORBA interfaces to desktop service is an excellent idea. Yes, I know that htere are more than developers out there and they have there needs too. But all you out there talk about is themes, and and whether it plays solitaire and trivial sh*t like that. Don't pretend.
A few years back, Apple released a nifty little extension set that would "detect" what sort of text the user had selected (anywhere), be it a name, address, phone number, URL, etc... and allow user to use it in various ways via a contextual menu. It's still freely available, but I haven't heard Apple mention it in over a year, I guess they're too busy pushing iWhatever and Sherlock. Either that or its all part of the one-button mouse conspiracy.
I guess the (or at least one) 'problem' they face is that Gnome is made up of loads of different bits with different (yet often similar) version numbers and that adding a version number to the whole package may confuse/mislead (ie people expecting Gnome 1.0.50 to contain 1.0.50 versions of gnome-core, gnome-libs etc etc).
I think a named release isn't a bad idea.
The Great Chunder Page - Alcohol Induced Fun!
Boffoonery - downloadable Comedy Benefit for Bletchley Park
The subject says it all. From what you say, it doesn't sound that hard. Go forth, brother.
I know this is flame bait, but someone has to speak up
/.er mistake; assuming that everything in the world is designed for your exclusive benefit. The ultimate aim of Linux is to appeal to the masses, and the only way it can do that is with themes, solitaire and trivial shit like that. If it pisses you off, don't use it.
We should all respond to flame bait once in a while, so here I go...
You're making the fundamental
On the subject of pissed off, what does 'sh*t' mean? If you're going to swear, do it properly. If you're not, there are plenty of acceptable alternatives that don't require punctuation.
What's wrong with them ?? 30 or so packages ?? Are they fucking nuts ??
Does aanyone know what is "market" share for Gnome versus KDE ? I would guess it would be something like: Gnome : 5 % KDE : 40 % rest : 55 %
They worked very hard for over 2 months fixing bugs and adding features to make GNOME more worthwhile. While I don't agree with their pushing GNOME 1.0 out the door early, they still put a lot of work into this release. If all you can do is bitch and complain about GNOME, either don't say anything at all or contribute your services to the GNOME project and try to make a difference in something you want to see changed. I didn't like the fact that GNOME was sorely lacking in documentation, so I am now working on docs for GNOME 2.0. Do the same thing if you have skills they could use...
Cap'n Nedrick
Other people have already posted more complete replies, but one thing to notice is that British / UK usage is to use plural nouns with corporations. "Nike have released sales figures" is correct in British English. The phrasing might sound funny to Americans, who would probably feel more comfortable hearing "Nike has released sales figures."
...MMX) or a single collection of individuals (RH, MM1, MM2, MM3 ... MMX). I like the third interpretation, because the characters other than Robin are individually interesting, but Robin Hood could survive as a character even without them.
:)
Note too that Robin Hood and his Band of Merry Men can be thought of as 1 group (RH,MM), 2 groups (RH)+(MM), two collections of individuals (RH) + (MM1, MM2, MM3
Collective nouns -- whoah, dude! Heavy, heady, interesting, debateable.
Of course, whether Slashdot's editors ought conform to American idiom is another matter. I'd like to see them be consistent, and I offer my services as a copy editor.
timothy
jrnl: http://tinyurl.com/c2l8yr / foes: http://tinyurl.com/ckjno5
I always check the rpm's that I download with
/dev/null
/usr/doc/rpm-3.0.2/*
rpm --checksig *.rpm >
to make sure that the download succeeded. However, there are several packages in this release for which rpm reports "size GPG NOT OK". Some of the bad packages include:
audiofile-0.1.9-1.i386.rpm: size GPG NOT OK
gdm-2.0beta2-13.i386.rpm: size GPG NOT OK
imlib-1.9.7-1.i386.rpm: size GPG NOT OK
imlib-cfgeditor-1.9.7-1.i386.rpm: size GPG NOT OK
libghttp-1.0.4-1.i386.rpm: size GPG NOT OK
xchat-1.2.1-1.i386.rpm: size GPG NOT OK
Can anyone verify this? What does GPG mean? Doing a
grep -i gpg
indicates that GPG support was added to rpm version 2.90 but the man page and web pages say nothing about GPG. I am not sure if I should worry about it or not. I have never seen this particular error before. Anyone care to comment?
(BTW, I am running RedHat 6.0 + updates.)
Do you worry about the safety of that? In the past potato has had a few bad packages(bash/readline and now slang1), I trust you are either using stable (slink) or are very brave.
Also, some packages have an interactive install, how do you get around that in a cron job? Please tell me you don't use apt's option to automatically assume yes... as this seems ridiculously dangerous.
Ok, I'll bite. Gnome & KDE are MUCH MORE than graphical environments. The graphical shell is more an afterthought; it's the LIBRARIES that mean something. It has nothing to do with 'script kiddies and perl hackers'.
Take a browse on freshmeat...check out all the KDE & GNOME apps that have appeared recently. There's some REALLY good stuff in there, and we can thank KDE and GNome for that. The KDE & Gnome development libraries make it REALLY easy to make an attractive, relatively complex program that WORKS with other programs, hot off the compiler.
You're right though; themes are a distraction and a performance hog in the end. But shiny themes are going to help pry newbies away from Bill's world.
And you know what the BEST thing about themes is? YOU CAN TURN THEM OFF. Hell, turn the whole desktop environment off, run TWM...you still get the benefit of KDE & Gnome when you fire up KOffice or Gnumeric.
ever heard of urlview? It pops up a window after parsing some text (or an email message) displaying all that url-like items. You simply click a key and it loads your favorite browser with the url.
I couldn't find a link to urlview's homepage, but you can find info about it in Mutt's manual or at filewatcher
No that isn't bloat. Bloat is when you create new libraries using copy and paste instead of using common small libraries.
Ok, I'm biting :) Seriously, though your tone is flamish I think you raise a good question.
What do desktops have to do with developers? I develop from within a terminal window or a bare CLI and it sounds like you do too. This is true whether I'm working on Linux or Windows.
Desktops are for users.
Users like solitaire and desktop configurability.
Companies write drivers and most software for users, not developers. Open source, up til now, has been mostly written for developers. If you are satisfied developing Windows software on Linux with a paucity of drivers, that may be sufficient, otherwise users have to like Linux too.
This is not to say that creating a slim and mean desktop for development might not be a good idea, but extending the OS to users is more important just now.
/* I know this is flame bait, but someone has to speak up: */
/*
Elitist? Why not...
/* Why all the excitement for these sugar coating GUIs (KDE, GNOME, YADM). */
Because for the first time since its inception, X can be used in a consistent manner if a user so chooses? Because Ease of Use is finally delivered?
Becasue we no longer need to think about syntax of Window Manager Configuration files?
/* Do i really give a ph*ck about themes? */
Do you really want a desktop in varying shades of ugly grey?
/* Can i impress the people in my office with the incredibly baroque-looking desktop i can configure? */
Windows User - hey, its like Windows
NeXTStep User - hey, its like...
OS/2, Mac, Acorn, Amiga User......
Get the picture?
/* Can i write a 100 line Perl CGI? */
In the easy to use, syntax highlighting editor with KDE yes, with Gnome, more than likely. Look ma! - programming without vi or emacs - editing made easy.
/* These are for script kiddies, Perl schmucks and wintel wannabes */
And people whose money will support hardware, software and ease of use development for Linux, while providing jobs for Unix geeks who program, document and package Linux. Sounds good to me.
/* You want to develop, make real applications, all you need is emacs, some good elisp packages, and a clean desktop */
A compiler always helps, too.
Emacs sucking is another flamewar - but the UI of eother vi or emacs is hostile to point and click, or even casual explanation. It can be mastered, to award yourself points for mastering the trivia of Unix.
A clean desktop - is this one with NO desktop functionality and a bunch of xterms? - thought so.
/* I agree that things like the CORBA interfaces to desktop service is an excellent idea. Yes, I know that htere are more than developers out there and they have there needs too
Nice to see them addressed after 20+ years of Unix.
/* But all you out there talk about is themes, and and whether it plays solitaire and trivial sh*t like that. Don't pretend. */
Themes are optional, and trendy, and playing solitaire is vital to the health of any office worker using Windows, and finally having a desktop to discuss is not trivial shit, given the wait Unix has had to get a desktop.
George Russell
Let me guess. It isn't a real computer unless you can hear the tickety-tickety-clak-clak of the teletype and your bitchin' home-spun linux driver can load 100 punch cards an hour.
Maybe you should start your comments "Back in my day..."