That's why I don't know why _by default_ it isn't set up to have the whole of/home under cvs
CVS isn't designed for that, unless you only store documents or have some pretty stringent filters setup on CVS. CVS is for versioning, and you don't really want to maintain a backlog of every version of every file in your home directory.
Most modern cellphones record voice memos. The Ericcson T68 does, and it has no camera. My phone has a built-in speaker phone that picks up ambient voices pretty well, but it has a camera.
The only way to have a secure computer is to encase it in cement, with no way in or out. Similar to a building, although the workers complain a bit too much.
Same, except for northern Washington. Lemme know if you find any good resources.
Southern Washington here, let me know. I'd be interested in seeing anything at all as a result of it. Natural disasters and car accidents are a spectator sport.
To extend the analogy to Gator, I tried their uninstall process, from their website. Guess what? It told me that it ran, but it didn't remove Gator from my test system. So, I tried it on another bench system, and it didn't work there, either. You can label that mere anecdote, but I take it as evidence that their uninstall process would fail on at least some systems run by those less educated in computers than me. Suddenly, it's not so out-in-the-open any more, eh?
I would have to wonder about your competence. Not to be mean, but I've gone through this a few times. I have never had it stick around after following all the instructions they provide. It goes away, and I even ran AdAware afterwards. But, this is a mere anecdote, as well.
Two things to note: if they're collecting information about you, they're "spying" in the dictionary sense of the word. Someone behind me with a bullhorn is not very secretive, but although secrecy is implied by the term spying, it's not necessary.
So, you download an application that advertises they deliver targetted advertisements based on what you view... and that's spying? No, it's delivering a product based on what they describe the product as.
I'm not a trend setter. I call it what everyone else calls it. Hey, I already try to use "GNU/Linux" where I can, and that's enough for me.
Funny, that is the same excuse people said about racism and lots of others. "If everybody jumped off a cliff..."
But... it doesn't *get* uninstalled. Go for it, install it on your machine. Then un-install it the add/remove programs way they tell you. See what happens in a few days.
It gets uninstalled. I have done this, several times. It's not a big deal, you follow the uninstall instructions and it goes away. You just aren't following the instructions for whatever piece of software you got.
What great free software? If you mean masking "malware" under the guise of a password saving utility, that doesn't sound so great to me.
DivX, Kazaa, and lots others. You are missing the point, Gator the company has a lot of applications. There is the advertising piece which is what gets installed, which is bundled with the Gator password thing. There is also a bunch of other apps that Gator makes. GAIN is the advertising piece.
Why you gotta be a dick?
My mother told me I could grow up to be anything I wanted to be, so I became an asshole.
Personally, I don't give a shit who knows where I live or what color boxers I'm wearing - just don't fuck with my PC by sticking all these advertisements on it using crappy code that is known to cause major headaches for the desktop support folks.
Then don't install the application. How hard is it to not click "Yes" on a dialog box that has a big green aligator on it. Blaming the company for the users ignorance isn't right. They are being clearly prompted for the Gator install, and they chose Yes.
(and major money. Gator and pals must cost the industry millions in support calls. I've been called on site to fix these crappy problems at least once a week, and we're just a very, very small company.)
So, you complain because you have a job and get paid because of Gator... and Gator is forcing all of these people to install it. I know I get a visit by a big alligator with a gun everytime I use Windows. It scares me.
In my own experience, installing JUST gator, will net you lots of other spyware in a few weeks time. I've done it on some machines as a test. Now, I did it awhile back, but the machine generally just did nothing, with gator installed. Maybe they've cleaned up their act a little bit, but the history of the product will forever keep it in the "spyware" category for me and anyone else that scans for spyware.
I think it really depends upon what you call Spyware. I would call it Malware or Idiotware, but Spyware is a complete misnomer.
You approve of this? They get you to install this software under the premise that you'll "sometimes get an add on your screen." They don't mention that you can't remove it and it's going to download other adware for you.
Yes, they do tell you exactly how to uninstall. They also pay a lot of software developers to make great free software to use. The problem with Gator is that they got bundled in with some evil broad brush of other software providors because a) they write shitty software and b) they make money.
They call this stuff spyware, I think, because it spies on what you do and it shows you ads according to what it thinks you like. None of it (yet.. I think..) is sending your keystorkes out to a remote server, or letting people view your desktop.
It what they do constitutes spying, I expect the CIA to have neon sides on top of their covert agents from now on.
Every other workstation I sit at, at any company with internet access (most of them), IE has about 10 "search" bars, popups spring up every 5 seconds, and gator is in the task tray (or not... user might have tried to remove it, but it's still there.. you just can't see it.)
First, how do you know that Gator installed those? If a user "accidentally" installed Gator, how can you blame Gator for all the other shit software on their system?
The reason why I go up against the hordes on here is because I actually approve of the way Gator handles this. I think their software sucks, but it isn't about the software. It's about the ethics of a company. This company knew that they were going to piss of privacy zealots, so they went out of their way to disclose everything.
I used to work for an advertising company, on the software side. I was acquaintances with a marketing guy who went into client services. I asked him about privacy, and his stance on the internet. He said the same thing I think, and I still agree with him 4 years later, "Nobody cares about you, we sell you and everybody else like you in a nice package because that's what advertisers want." People don't have privacy on the internet unless they go through painstaking efforts to get it. You can, with little effort, find out who I am and where I live (although I have a few things thrown in the mix to throw off the stupid people) but I'm just not important enough. If you can find out where Bill Gates, and countless others live, you don't give a shit about me.
I never said it did distributed computing. I said it analyzed your data with your CPU cycles before sending it off to HQ.
How else do you think it works? Would it ask you to do it for you? "Hi, we don't want to use your precious CPU cycles to strip out your personal information and only provide demographic data, could you do it for us?"
Yeah. You are still full of it, sparky. Go read up on GAIN and you will find out exactly what they do. It's amazingly simple to learn what Gator does, it's on the front freaking page.
While it is getting much nicer about its popups, that was never the problem with Gator. It has a tendency to use your CPU for their data anaysis on the information they collect on your browsing habits. It also has been known to make microcharges to your credit card ($.35-$2, but it is still annoying). I love E-Commerce, but I refuse to shop online on any computer with Gator because of this.
No, it hasn't. You are making this up. It has never done anything even remotely close to this. If the Gator programmers were good enough to make it detect the unused cycles and do distributed computation, the application wouldn't be such a piece of shit.
You do realize that you are just a clown, right? There are no factual statements in your post.
Without any doubt in my mind, the most evil form of spyware I am personally aware of is the infamous insidious Gator.
Why? I would also like facts, not anecdotes that can't be reproduced or backed up. Gator is shitty software, but they fully disclose everything they do (hence, not spyware) and even provide working uninstall instructions. People just find it difficult to uninstall because they refuse to uninstall the bundled software.
I just don't get why Slashdot has this hard-on about bitching about Gator.
That's right. Now if terrorists crack the launch codes and launch our missiles against our own cities, we'll be able to sue Certicom to recoup our losses.
I was just thinking of posting something along these lines. XML shouldn't be used for storing binary data, because we already have file formats for this. You could also use an open compression form so that you actually have one single file (or just use tar, whichever, since compressing images doesn't do jack shit) which is easier to send out.
The main issue with using the same rendering engine is that screens are never the same. Colors are different, even font packages are different amongst Windows, Mac, and Linux. What about multi-lingual support, with right to left text support, etc? It gets pretty tricky working around all that stuff.
If your an HTML jocky, you might be better versed in the aesthetics of UI design than most C coders.
I guess this is why www.apple.com looks better than Aqua?
Oh wait...
HTML jockeys suck ass at graphic design. Graphic artists, who design for a living, are good at UI design. Or UI developers, who use code or generators to do it are good.
HTML jockeys are middle-managements bitch, nothing more.
Nobody's saying Gator's illegal, what we're saying is that something that abusively sends private and personal information to a third party, such as web surfing habits, is spyware and people need to be aware that's what it does.
Wrong. There is no evidence that Gator is sending information to third parties. It is purely speculation, as Gator hides what goes on with their servers.
Gator publicly announces and states in both their EULA and on their website (and GAINs website) everything they do with the data they collect. They have always taken a full disclosure policy. If someone walks behind you with a megaphone announcing every move you make, they aren't much of a spy, are they? Same thing.
By falling into the "They say it somewhere therefore it isn't" trap you're undermining the very reason for describing it as that in the first place.
I think you need to understand what "spy" means.
As for your comments about "dumbass users", can I assume you're talking about the 90% of computer owners who (a) have not been trained in this stuff from birth (b) Are putting up with these messages constantly and just want them to go away (c) Have every reason to believe, unless others more knowledgable than them shout it from the rooftops, that Gator is, as the message implies, just a tool that needs to be downloaded like Flash, RealOne, etc, in order to view the website content?
Stated by someone who has never even seen a Gator installation screen. Gator comes with Advertiser supported software. Yes, you can get Gator by visiting a website, but it's primary distribution is through software. People just blindly click "Yes" on any page that comes up in an install. This is their target audience. If someone believes that they need Gator, they come to that conclusion themselves and not because of anything Gator says.
If so, perhaps an explanation of why you don't want them to be notified, easily, quickly, using a single word that sums it all up, what Gator is and that it's undesirable?
I just don't agree that Spyware is that word. Shitware, Malware, and others are perfectly valid. Their code bears the quality similar to what an autistic 5 year old looped out on shrooms would produce. I'm just saying call it for what it is. Gator is bad enough without having to make shit up.
A lot of people go off about how Gator has a long running history but it's complete bullshit. They can't produce valid resources to back it up, and it's just word of mouth. I can disprove anything people say just by pointing them to go to a download page and read what comes up on the front-page.
as long as you define an idiot as someone who isn't as clued up about computers as your good self, of course?
An idiot is someone who follows the masses and repeats what others say without thinking for themselves. I don't care about how educated you are, if you just do what everyone else tells you to do always, you are an idiot.
I've actually held you with a fairly high sentiment and thought you were reasonably objective. Shame you are acting like the other Slashbots on here.
If Gator is spyware, why do the post on their website what they do? Gator is shitty software that relies on dumbass users that click "Yes" on every dialog box that pops up.
Before it comes up, no, I don't agree with the lawsuits. But I've never agreed to Gator being called Spyware. Lets just all call it "Stupidware" because it's much more fitting.
The student who made a fool out of the airport security system was conducting an act of civil disobedience, but the part of civil disobedience everyone seems to keep forgetting is it involves a public crime done to get attention, of course he's gonna get arrested and charged for it. He should be, he didn't just say "Somebody could.." he went out and did it.
The thing is, before September 11th you could bring a box-cutter on an airplane. Hell, I accidently brought a 5" butterfly knife through airport security in 99 or so.
The kid who did that was proving a point, and to prove that point he had to act. Merely telling them wouldn't do anything, and the facts are supportive of this.
Now, to bring this on-topic and on-base, because I believe it was a valid point.
Civil disobedience is the best way of proving a point when the masses won't listen to you. What will it take for people to realize these voting systems are flawed and dangerous? Bruce Campbell being elected President of the United States of America?
That is civil disobedience I can appreciate, just like the student, because it shows that things aren't as good as they should be and that jeopardizes my safety.
Thanks for setting me straight. I really deserved it.
I'm really glad you understand that you do deserve it. Posting hurtful comments on a public message board is just silly at best, and that's only if they aren't intentional.
Trolling isn't the answer! You can get help, there are many shelters for Trolls wishing to convert.
Slashdot Mirror
That's why I don't know why _by default_ it isn't set up to have the whole of /home under cvs
CVS isn't designed for that, unless you only store documents or have some pretty stringent filters setup on CVS. CVS is for versioning, and you don't really want to maintain a backlog of every version of every file in your home directory.
There is a WTC in Portland, OR and Seattle, WA. In fact, there is almost always a WTC near you.
Most modern cellphones record voice memos. The Ericcson T68 does, and it has no camera. My phone has a built-in speaker phone that picks up ambient voices pretty well, but it has a camera.
The only way to have a secure computer is to encase it in cement, with no way in or out. Similar to a building, although the workers complain a bit too much.
Same, except for northern Washington. Lemme know if you find any good resources.
Southern Washington here, let me know. I'd be interested in seeing anything at all as a result of it. Natural disasters and car accidents are a spectator sport.
To extend the analogy to Gator, I tried their uninstall process, from their website. Guess what? It told me that it ran, but it didn't remove Gator from my test system. So, I tried it on another bench system, and it didn't work there, either. You can label that mere anecdote, but I take it as evidence that their uninstall process would fail on at least some systems run by those less educated in computers than me. Suddenly, it's not so out-in-the-open any more, eh?
I would have to wonder about your competence. Not to be mean, but I've gone through this a few times. I have never had it stick around after following all the instructions they provide. It goes away, and I even ran AdAware afterwards. But, this is a mere anecdote, as well.
Two things to note: if they're collecting information about you, they're "spying" in the dictionary sense of the word. Someone behind me with a bullhorn is not very secretive, but although secrecy is implied by the term spying, it's not necessary.
So, you download an application that advertises they deliver targetted advertisements based on what you view... and that's spying? No, it's delivering a product based on what they describe the product as.
I'm not a trend setter. I call it what everyone else calls it. Hey, I already try to use "GNU/Linux" where I can, and that's enough for me.
Funny, that is the same excuse people said about racism and lots of others. "If everybody jumped off a cliff..."
But... it doesn't *get* uninstalled. Go for it, install it on your machine. Then un-install it the add/remove programs way they tell you. See what happens in a few days.
It gets uninstalled. I have done this, several times. It's not a big deal, you follow the uninstall instructions and it goes away. You just aren't following the instructions for whatever piece of software you got.
What great free software? If you mean masking "malware" under the guise of a password saving utility, that doesn't sound so great to me.
DivX, Kazaa, and lots others. You are missing the point, Gator the company has a lot of applications. There is the advertising piece which is what gets installed, which is bundled with the Gator password thing. There is also a bunch of other apps that Gator makes. GAIN is the advertising piece.
Why you gotta be a dick?
My mother told me I could grow up to be anything I wanted to be, so I became an asshole.
Personally, I don't give a shit who knows where I live or what color boxers I'm wearing - just don't fuck with my PC by sticking all these advertisements on it using crappy code that is known to cause major headaches for the desktop support folks.
Then don't install the application. How hard is it to not click "Yes" on a dialog box that has a big green aligator on it. Blaming the company for the users ignorance isn't right. They are being clearly prompted for the Gator install, and they chose Yes.
(and major money. Gator and pals must cost the industry millions in support calls. I've been called on site to fix these crappy problems at least once a week, and we're just a very, very small company.)
So, you complain because you have a job and get paid because of Gator... and Gator is forcing all of these people to install it. I know I get a visit by a big alligator with a gun everytime I use Windows. It scares me.
In my own experience, installing JUST gator, will net you lots of other spyware in a few weeks time. I've done it on some machines as a test. Now, I did it awhile back, but the machine generally just did nothing, with gator installed. Maybe they've cleaned up their act a little bit, but the history of the product will forever keep it in the "spyware" category for me and anyone else that scans for spyware.
I think it really depends upon what you call Spyware. I would call it Malware or Idiotware, but Spyware is a complete misnomer.
You approve of this? They get you to install this software under the premise that you'll "sometimes get an add on your screen." They don't mention that you can't remove it and it's going to download other adware for you.
Yes, they do tell you exactly how to uninstall. They also pay a lot of software developers to make great free software to use. The problem with Gator is that they got bundled in with some evil broad brush of other software providors because a) they write shitty software and b) they make money.
They call this stuff spyware, I think, because it spies on what you do and it shows you ads according to what it thinks you like. None of it (yet.. I think..) is sending your keystorkes out to a remote server, or letting people view your desktop.
It what they do constitutes spying, I expect the CIA to have neon sides on top of their covert agents from now on.
The problem with analogies is they are very seldom correct.
It is legal to walk down the street listening and singing to Britney Spears.
It is not legal to walk down the street listening and singing while taking LCD.
Every other workstation I sit at, at any company with internet access (most of them), IE has about 10 "search" bars, popups spring up every 5 seconds, and gator is in the task tray (or not... user might have tried to remove it, but it's still there.. you just can't see it.)
First, how do you know that Gator installed those? If a user "accidentally" installed Gator, how can you blame Gator for all the other shit software on their system?
The reason why I go up against the hordes on here is because I actually approve of the way Gator handles this. I think their software sucks, but it isn't about the software. It's about the ethics of a company. This company knew that they were going to piss of privacy zealots, so they went out of their way to disclose everything.
I used to work for an advertising company, on the software side. I was acquaintances with a marketing guy who went into client services. I asked him about privacy, and his stance on the internet. He said the same thing I think, and I still agree with him 4 years later, "Nobody cares about you, we sell you and everybody else like you in a nice package because that's what advertisers want." People don't have privacy on the internet unless they go through painstaking efforts to get it. You can, with little effort, find out who I am and where I live (although I have a few things thrown in the mix to throw off the stupid people) but I'm just not important enough. If you can find out where Bill Gates, and countless others live, you don't give a shit about me.
I never said it did distributed computing. I said it analyzed your data with your CPU cycles before sending it off to HQ.
How else do you think it works? Would it ask you to do it for you? "Hi, we don't want to use your precious CPU cycles to strip out your personal information and only provide demographic data, could you do it for us?"
Yeah. You are still full of it, sparky. Go read up on GAIN and you will find out exactly what they do. It's amazingly simple to learn what Gator does, it's on the front freaking page.
While it is getting much nicer about its popups, that was never the problem with Gator. It has a tendency to use your CPU for their data anaysis on the information they collect on your browsing habits. It also has been known to make microcharges to your credit card ($.35-$2, but it is still annoying). I love E-Commerce, but I refuse to shop online on any computer with Gator because of this.
No, it hasn't. You are making this up. It has never done anything even remotely close to this. If the Gator programmers were good enough to make it detect the unused cycles and do distributed computation, the application wouldn't be such a piece of shit.
You do realize that you are just a clown, right? There are no factual statements in your post.
Without any doubt in my mind, the most evil form of spyware I am personally aware of is the infamous insidious Gator.
Why? I would also like facts, not anecdotes that can't be reproduced or backed up. Gator is shitty software, but they fully disclose everything they do (hence, not spyware) and even provide working uninstall instructions. People just find it difficult to uninstall because they refuse to uninstall the bundled software.
I just don't get why Slashdot has this hard-on about bitching about Gator.
That's right. Now if terrorists crack the launch codes and launch our missiles against our own cities, we'll be able to sue Certicom to recoup our losses.
So that is why the NSA chose a Canadian company!
it wont work. open source is too "open" for this to be possible.
When you learn how to program, and read such topics as "stenography" you won't be such a fucking idiot.
I was just thinking of posting something along these lines. XML shouldn't be used for storing binary data, because we already have file formats for this. You could also use an open compression form so that you actually have one single file (or just use tar, whichever, since compressing images doesn't do jack shit) which is easier to send out.
The main issue with using the same rendering engine is that screens are never the same. Colors are different, even font packages are different amongst Windows, Mac, and Linux. What about multi-lingual support, with right to left text support, etc? It gets pretty tricky working around all that stuff.
If your an HTML jocky, you might be better versed in the aesthetics of UI design than most C coders.
I guess this is why www.apple.com looks better than Aqua?
Oh wait...
HTML jockeys suck ass at graphic design. Graphic artists, who design for a living, are good at UI design. Or UI developers, who use code or generators to do it are good.
HTML jockeys are middle-managements bitch, nothing more.
Get these robots to drive NASCAR to entertain the automatons known as fans.
Before that, just have them post to Slashdot. Same effect, much more realistic milestone and nobody would notice.
Nobody's saying Gator's illegal, what we're saying is that something that abusively sends private and personal information to a third party, such as web surfing habits, is spyware and people need to be aware that's what it does.
Wrong. There is no evidence that Gator is sending information to third parties. It is purely speculation, as Gator hides what goes on with their servers.
Gator publicly announces and states in both their EULA and on their website (and GAINs website) everything they do with the data they collect. They have always taken a full disclosure policy. If someone walks behind you with a megaphone announcing every move you make, they aren't much of a spy, are they? Same thing.
By falling into the "They say it somewhere therefore it isn't" trap you're undermining the very reason for describing it as that in the first place.
I think you need to understand what "spy" means.
As for your comments about "dumbass users", can I assume you're talking about the 90% of computer owners who (a) have not been trained in this stuff from birth (b) Are putting up with these messages constantly and just want them to go away (c) Have every reason to believe, unless others more knowledgable than them shout it from the rooftops, that Gator is, as the message implies, just a tool that needs to be downloaded like Flash, RealOne, etc, in order to view the website content?
Stated by someone who has never even seen a Gator installation screen. Gator comes with Advertiser supported software. Yes, you can get Gator by visiting a website, but it's primary distribution is through software. People just blindly click "Yes" on any page that comes up in an install. This is their target audience. If someone believes that they need Gator, they come to that conclusion themselves and not because of anything Gator says.
If so, perhaps an explanation of why you don't want them to be notified, easily, quickly, using a single word that sums it all up, what Gator is and that it's undesirable?
I just don't agree that Spyware is that word. Shitware, Malware, and others are perfectly valid. Their code bears the quality similar to what an autistic 5 year old looped out on shrooms would produce. I'm just saying call it for what it is. Gator is bad enough without having to make shit up.
A lot of people go off about how Gator has a long running history but it's complete bullshit. They can't produce valid resources to back it up, and it's just word of mouth. I can disprove anything people say just by pointing them to go to a download page and read what comes up on the front-page.
as long as you define an idiot as someone who isn't as clued up about computers as your good self, of course?
An idiot is someone who follows the masses and repeats what others say without thinking for themselves. I don't care about how educated you are, if you just do what everyone else tells you to do always, you are an idiot.
you cannot take SAT using a calculator with a QWERTY keyboard
One more reason why Dvorak is superior to QWERTY!
I've actually held you with a fairly high sentiment and thought you were reasonably objective. Shame you are acting like the other Slashbots on here.
If Gator is spyware, why do the post on their website what they do? Gator is shitty software that relies on dumbass users that click "Yes" on every dialog box that pops up.
Before it comes up, no, I don't agree with the lawsuits. But I've never agreed to Gator being called Spyware. Lets just all call it "Stupidware" because it's much more fitting.
The student who made a fool out of the airport security system was conducting an act of civil disobedience, but the part of civil disobedience everyone seems to keep forgetting is it involves a public crime done to get attention, of course he's gonna get arrested and charged for it. He should be, he didn't just say "Somebody could.." he went out and did it.
The thing is, before September 11th you could bring a box-cutter on an airplane. Hell, I accidently brought a 5" butterfly knife through airport security in 99 or so.
The kid who did that was proving a point, and to prove that point he had to act. Merely telling them wouldn't do anything, and the facts are supportive of this.
Now, to bring this on-topic and on-base, because I believe it was a valid point.
Civil disobedience is the best way of proving a point when the masses won't listen to you. What will it take for people to realize these voting systems are flawed and dangerous? Bruce Campbell being elected President of the United States of America?
That is civil disobedience I can appreciate, just like the student, because it shows that things aren't as good as they should be and that jeopardizes my safety.
Thanks for setting me straight. I really deserved it.
I'm really glad you understand that you do deserve it. Posting hurtful comments on a public message board is just silly at best, and that's only if they aren't intentional.
Trolling isn't the answer! You can get help, there are many shelters for Trolls wishing to convert.
Sad thing is, they know a hell of a lot more about contemporary computers than I do.
Do you really need to know how to install a clear window in your chasis along with a strip of LEDs that flash according to the ambient music, though?
Fud, Fud, Fud.
I use Yahoo with Mozilla almost on a daily basis. On multiple computers, I can assure you that it's your problem and not Mozilla.
Yahoo is superior to MapQuest just in the capacities of the Yellow Page integration.
4. Dictionary, with laser highlighted.