The look and feel doesn't bother me. Perhaps I have completely forgotten what it was like using Windows for the first few years while I figured things out. Ah...to be a newbie again...
Do you know where I can get the ISOs for BigBrotherEasyInstall-Linux (tm)?
Seriously though, I understand your concern. A lot of people in the Linux community have been mis-labeled as "hackers" (yes, I'm aware that there are good and bad connotations of this word), and that's unfortunate. However, we cannot let that affect future development plans for "BigBrotherEasyInstall-Linux". If the consumer market wants it, give it to them. Make money. Be happy. It surely doesn't mean the loss of access to the nitty-gritty stuff.
(Oh and PS: "Did you run with an argument by answering your own question?", yes and that's the problem with the 960,000ms lag between posts. And let's go with "discussion" instead of "argument" since I think we both agree on different levels.)
The Proxim didn't come with the laptop -- it was one that I had in a different system. If I were going to choose something to work with the version of Linux that I wanted to run, I would have checked the "supported hardware" page.
That's just it though, isn't it. Why should the hardware tailor to the software? Shouldn't that be the other way around?
Perhaps we need a way to allow Windows device drivers to work with Linux -- anyone working on that yet?:^)
You know, I get asked to install upgrades all the time also. And I've done it a million times, sometimes with problems, sometimes without. However, I have never once had to edit the Windows resistry to get the machine to boot into the GUI correctly. If there was a problem with the video card driver, then it dumps me into one that works (hell, the RH installer didn't have a problem with the video driver, why did I?), and then I can correct it via the GUI.
Now, don't get me wrong -- I like config files as much as the next *nix masochist -- however, it's nice to have that option there when you're at the console and not 800 miles away on a VT100 terminal.
My point is that most of the Linux installs feel like Voodoo. If you don't get it right the first time, you have to cook some bones, say a few words, and dig into the dark underworld that is/etc in order to make things right again. It shouldn't be this way.
The prevailing message is,"Don't be different or we'll come to get you, too."
So...have they come to get you yet? No? No witch hunt because you are a Pagan running Linux on a Sparc? Hmmm...that's odd.
In the end, Linux will inevitably win the desktop war. It has to. Look at the rate that Linux has developed over the past 10 years compared to Windows. But in order to win, we must get past the stereotypical "they're going to take all of our toys away" fear and develop something for the herd. Then we can start developing the next OS that everyone will fear and whisper about around the water-cooler.:^)
PCMCIA isn't broken because XP recognized it just fine. RH 8.0 didn't even detect the card, nor did it list any Proxim cards in the "network devices" list. I tried the "cardctl" command and it listed the Proxim card, but I couldn't get the damn thing to work! Grr! What's even more degrading is that this isn't my first foray into Linux. I've used Linux, OpenBSD, and FreeBSD without problems and here I am stumped on a NIC.
"...transitioning Databases from Access to say a MySQL+Rekall solution."
See, that's the problem: the plus sign in your statement. Most people just want quick and dirty. What they can't do with Excel, they hack out with Access (and I mean hack in a bad way.) Granted, I have seen my fair share of good Access applications but most are crap. Until you can provide a tool to do simple database, query, forms, and reports all in one package, then you're not going to get the masses to migrate, even if you provide a solution by combining 2 or more technologies.
Oh, right. If XP doesn't work, try 2000 then 98 then 95 until you get it to work. Yeah, yeah, apples and oranges, but it still sounds silly, doesn't it.
So you see, once the population has EasyInstallBigBrother-Linux, water-cooler gossips come to claim Debian.
Wow...that's rather apocalyptic. "Easy to install" does not mean the end to open source, nor does it mean a huge generic kernel. It's not like I was adding hardware after the initial install. This was the initial install. The kernel should have been built to suit the needs of the hardware in the laptop. Later, if I wanted to install more hardware, then it could easily (relatively speaking of course) ask for the disk and then recompile the kernel.
Of course, if you look at an XP disk or even "/windows" for example, it's not insanely huge (by today's HD standards.) My 80GB drive is not choking on the 800MB Windows install. I say, make a Linux distro that "has everything" and even a "huge kernel" -- it won't make distros like Debian or Gentoo go away because the developer, hacker, tinkerer community needs it.
This is my "switch" story: I just got a Dell Latitude C600 laptop. "Hey," I said to myself, "...why don't I try to install Linux on it?" So, I grabbed some RH 8.0 CD's that I had and set out to installing. The CD booted fine, I chose the standard workstation installation and off I went. When I got to the monitor / video card, I accepted the defaults and soon I was finished.
Upon reboot, the screen flashed several times at the text login prompt and finally, a teal box with garbled characters appeared in the middle of the screen. Now, being an avid/. reader, I knew that this was a problem with my X configuration. So, I hit enter to get out of the garbled box, logged on as root and edited my XF86Config file with some suggestions from a forum that I found after searching Google. I typed "startx" and boom...I was in!
So far, you would have lost the average user at the login prompt. I admit, installing on a laptop isn't always easy, but you shouldn't have to edit config files to change the "r128" to "vesa". [Relax, I'm venting here.]
The second problem I had was with the Proxim Orinoco Wireless card. No network. Card not detected. Not even a selection to add it under "Network Devices". This time, the "how-to" that I found didn't help. Nothing that I could do could make the card work. And to top it off, Proxim doesn't provide Linux drivers.
So I went with XP. One disc and everything worked.
My point is not that Windows is better than Linux, because believe me, I would rather have gone with Linux on my laptop. However, until it's easy to install (you know, just go through the prompts and most everything works), you're not going to get anyone to switch.
"After finishing the Macarena at the Diablo sing-along, one
mother whispers that today is the sixth birthday of David Warneke, a
camp volunteer's son. "We're not allowed to sing 'Happy Birthday,' "
warns Debi Jansen, a co-director."
This is just sick. Are we eventually going to get to the point where you won't be able to sing a song you heard off of the radio without paying the proper fees? Ugh.
I just took a walk out to see both of these and I'm amazed that they haven't been paved over or torn up over the years. Perhaps they were strategically placed so as to avoid water mains and other underground items that might need to be dug up?
Each device, which runs on battery, should last approximately two months. When possible, devices can be recovered and reused. The cost of each is estimated at $10,000.
$10,000??!! I bet there are plenty of Linux geeks around Slashdot that could do it for a fraction of that!;^)
The reason the US isn't implementing IPv6 has nothing to do with address space.
I could be wrong, but it might have something to do with the cost of upgrading all of the routers. And I'm not talking about just hardware costs, I'm talking about the amount of time it will take net admins to upgrade their equipment. "Spend money to make money" doesn't seem to apply in this economy.
Voicechat or Videochat: Not NAT-friendly, not at all. Anyone who can help me with this will be on my friends list
I used to pull my hair out trying to get Netmeeting to work, now I use a program called iVisit. (Windows only as far as I know -- Look it up, cause there's something screwy about the website I came up with.) I'm now able to do 15fps videoconferencing with full duplex audio behind my OBSD NAT/Firewall/Router with limited fw changes.
"I'm leaning toward the idea that this really won't help spammers much, but with the caveat that it really doesn't help spam filter writers much either, since looking at the spams you get would make it obvious what techniques were being used anyway."
If I were a spammer, I would just download SpamAssassin and check the content analysis algorithms. I don't think it's too difficult for them to get their hands on anti-spam software.
Slashdot Mirror
The look and feel doesn't bother me. Perhaps I have completely forgotten what it was like using Windows for the first few years while I figured things out. Ah...to be a newbie again...
I know my analogy was incorrect, but face it: there really isn't that much difference between 95 and XP? ;^)
Do you know where I can get the ISOs for BigBrotherEasyInstall-Linux (tm)?
Seriously though, I understand your concern. A lot of people in the Linux community have been mis-labeled as "hackers" (yes, I'm aware that there are good and bad connotations of this word), and that's unfortunate. However, we cannot let that affect future development plans for "BigBrotherEasyInstall-Linux". If the consumer market wants it, give it to them. Make money. Be happy. It surely doesn't mean the loss of access to the nitty-gritty stuff.
(Oh and PS: "Did you run with an argument by answering your own question?", yes and that's the problem with the 960,000ms lag between posts. And let's go with "discussion" instead of "argument" since I think we both agree on different levels.)
The Proxim didn't come with the laptop -- it was one that I had in a different system. If I were going to choose something to work with the version of Linux that I wanted to run, I would have checked the "supported hardware" page.
That's just it though, isn't it. Why should the hardware tailor to the software? Shouldn't that be the other way around?
Perhaps we need a way to allow Windows device drivers to work with Linux -- anyone working on that yet? :^)
You know, I get asked to install upgrades all the time also. And I've done it a million times, sometimes with problems, sometimes without. However, I have never once had to edit the Windows resistry to get the machine to boot into the GUI correctly. If there was a problem with the video card driver, then it dumps me into one that works (hell, the RH installer didn't have a problem with the video driver, why did I?), and then I can correct it via the GUI.
Now, don't get me wrong -- I like config files as much as the next *nix masochist -- however, it's nice to have that option there when you're at the console and not 800 miles away on a VT100 terminal.
My point is that most of the Linux installs feel like Voodoo. If you don't get it right the first time, you have to cook some bones, say a few words, and dig into the dark underworld that is /etc in order to make things right again. It shouldn't be this way.
The prevailing message is,"Don't be different or we'll come to get you, too."
So...have they come to get you yet? No? No witch hunt because you are a Pagan running Linux on a Sparc? Hmmm...that's odd.
In the end, Linux will inevitably win the desktop war. It has to. Look at the rate that Linux has developed over the past 10 years compared to Windows. But in order to win, we must get past the stereotypical "they're going to take all of our toys away" fear and develop something for the herd. Then we can start developing the next OS that everyone will fear and whisper about around the water-cooler. :^)
PCMCIA isn't broken because XP recognized it just fine. RH 8.0 didn't even detect the card, nor did it list any Proxim cards in the "network devices" list. I tried the "cardctl" command and it listed the Proxim card, but I couldn't get the damn thing to work! Grr! What's even more degrading is that this isn't my first foray into Linux. I've used Linux, OpenBSD, and FreeBSD without problems and here I am stumped on a NIC.
Maybe I'll submit and try Mandrake...
"...transitioning Databases from Access to say a MySQL+Rekall solution."
See, that's the problem: the plus sign in your statement. Most people just want quick and dirty. What they can't do with Excel, they hack out with Access (and I mean hack in a bad way.) Granted, I have seen my fair share of good Access applications but most are crap. Until you can provide a tool to do simple database, query, forms, and reports all in one package, then you're not going to get the masses to migrate, even if you provide a solution by combining 2 or more technologies.
Oh, right. If XP doesn't work, try 2000 then 98 then 95 until you get it to work. Yeah, yeah, apples and oranges, but it still sounds silly, doesn't it.
So you see, once the population has EasyInstallBigBrother-Linux, water-cooler gossips come to claim Debian.
Wow...that's rather apocalyptic. "Easy to install" does not mean the end to open source, nor does it mean a huge generic kernel. It's not like I was adding hardware after the initial install. This was the initial install. The kernel should have been built to suit the needs of the hardware in the laptop. Later, if I wanted to install more hardware, then it could easily (relatively speaking of course) ask for the disk and then recompile the kernel.
Of course, if you look at an XP disk or even "/windows" for example, it's not insanely huge (by today's HD standards.) My 80GB drive is not choking on the 800MB Windows install. I say, make a Linux distro that "has everything" and even a "huge kernel" -- it won't make distros like Debian or Gentoo go away because the developer, hacker, tinkerer community needs it.
This is my "switch" story: I just got a Dell Latitude C600 laptop. "Hey," I said to myself, "...why don't I try to install Linux on it?" So, I grabbed some RH 8.0 CD's that I had and set out to installing. The CD booted fine, I chose the standard workstation installation and off I went. When I got to the monitor / video card, I accepted the defaults and soon I was finished.
Upon reboot, the screen flashed several times at the text login prompt and finally, a teal box with garbled characters appeared in the middle of the screen. Now, being an avid /. reader, I knew that this was a problem with my X configuration. So, I hit enter to get out of the garbled box, logged on as root and edited my XF86Config file with some suggestions from a forum that I found after searching Google. I typed "startx" and boom...I was in!
So far, you would have lost the average user at the login prompt. I admit, installing on a laptop isn't always easy, but you shouldn't have to edit config files to change the "r128" to "vesa". [Relax, I'm venting here.]
The second problem I had was with the Proxim Orinoco Wireless card. No network. Card not detected. Not even a selection to add it under "Network Devices". This time, the "how-to" that I found didn't help. Nothing that I could do could make the card work. And to top it off, Proxim doesn't provide Linux drivers.
So I went with XP. One disc and everything worked.
My point is not that Windows is better than Linux, because believe me, I would rather have gone with Linux on my laptop. However, until it's easy to install (you know, just go through the prompts and most everything works), you're not going to get anyone to switch.
Err...wasn't that a DARPA grant?
This is a blatant plug, but I'm working on a MP3 Server based on Lincoln Stein's Apache::MP3, HTML::Mason, and MySQL:
TVDinner
I wrote my own little Perl scripts using MP3::Info and MP3::ID3v1Tag. While you're at it, you may want to check out Apache::MP3 and my own pet project, TVDinner Streaming MP3 Server.
They specify configuring Windows' built-in firewall to block those ports.
Yeah...that works. Disable file sharing so now Mom can't send files to Sister's "folder". Ugh...I can hear the support calls now.
Oh, and by the way, is anyone watching the global 593 spike?
RPC over HTTP. Hmm. Sounds like that Windows exploit. Funny, while looking for information, I came across this:
Internal .EDU posting?
"After finishing the Macarena at the Diablo sing-along, one mother whispers that today is the sixth birthday of David Warneke, a camp volunteer's son. "We're not allowed to sing 'Happy Birthday,' " warns Debi Jansen, a co-director."
This is just sick. Are we eventually going to get to the point where you won't be able to sing a song you heard off of the radio without paying the proper fees? Ugh.
I just took a walk out to see both of these and I'm amazed that they haven't been paved over or torn up over the years. Perhaps they were strategically placed so as to avoid water mains and other underground items that might need to be dug up?
Hmmm...maybe Disney will have to bribe Congress and get text messaging banned.
Disney isn't having any problems producing movies that don't suck.
Each device, which runs on battery, should last approximately two months. When possible, devices can be recovered and reused. The cost of each is estimated at $10,000.
$10,000??!! I bet there are plenty of Linux geeks around Slashdot that could do it for a fraction of that! ;^)
The reason the US isn't implementing IPv6 has nothing to do with address space.
I could be wrong, but it might have something to do with the cost of upgrading all of the routers. And I'm not talking about just hardware costs, I'm talking about the amount of time it will take net admins to upgrade their equipment. "Spend money to make money" doesn't seem to apply in this economy.
Voicechat or Videochat: Not NAT-friendly, not at all. Anyone who can help me with this will be on my friends list
I used to pull my hair out trying to get Netmeeting to work, now I use a program called iVisit. (Windows only as far as I know -- Look it up, cause there's something screwy about the website I came up with.) I'm now able to do 15fps videoconferencing with full duplex audio behind my OBSD NAT/Firewall/Router with limited fw changes.
"I'm leaning toward the idea that this really won't help spammers much, but with the caveat that it really doesn't help spam filter writers much either, since looking at the spams you get would make it obvious what techniques were being used anyway."
If I were a spammer, I would just download SpamAssassin and check the content analysis algorithms. I don't think it's too difficult for them to get their hands on anti-spam software.
Thank you -- if I had mod points, your post would be at +1 Insightful right now.
Notice: The public doesn't care about Slashdot. Slashdot will not make or break Linux. That is all.
Thanks!