Call me lazy, but I would like it if they would just tar ball it up into one massive rpm, or tar.gz, or whatever. I hate having to run around looking for seperate libs and the like. Otherwise, congratulations GNOME team, keep up the good work.
I am on the GNU/Linux side. You want to know why, one reason and one reason only. OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARE. If you think MS is ruthless and brutal, stop and look at how Apple behaves. Apple is the most proprietary Computer/Software company in the world. If they were in a position to control the market, we would be in even deeper shit than we are in now. I don't care what their desktop looks like, or what their kernel is based on. They are playing the same game that MS is playing, their just smaller and weaker, so they don't pack as much punch. Also, OSS delivers what it promises, and nothing less. OSS doesn't promise more than it can deliver. If you think OS X is going to deliver as promised, just have a look at all of Apples other projects. Like any large company, they never deliver what they promise. Don't buy the into the marketing.
Okay, perhaps this will create a flame war, if so, I apologize in advance. Let's have a look at what's really going on. Let's talk about innovation and duplication. Mac OS X, BeOS, Linux. All of these systems are Unix's with GUI front ends. Technologically, neither one of them is all that innovative. The GUI is 20+ years old, it was invented by Xerox many years ago. Unix is 20+ years old, it was invented by AT&T for their high speed frame relay switches. It's been 20 years, and nothing new is on the scene. C++ is an update of C. Java is an update of C++. The only real innovation that has come to pass in the last 20 years, is the GPL, open source movement. This is not a technological improvement, instead it is a social improvement. Open source will open the way for further Technological advancement, by altering the way people communicate ideas. In a world that is fast becomming a collective society, whether we like it or not, Open source is the way that future technological developments will come about. That is why I choose Linux. For the moment, GNU and Linux are on the forefront of the OSS movement. All of these other systems are simply proprietary spin offs of the idea. Sure, they have OSS parts and pieces to them, but at their heart, they are still part of a dying bread. The come from the age of proprietary software. In technological terms, BeOS, Mac OS X, and Linux are pretty much on similar ground. Sure, each one will have its streangths, but only one represents the future. GNU/Linux is so much more than just an OS. It represents a dream that so many before us have strived to achieve, and failed. This is the dream of Collective Unity. Think about the amazing phenominon that is GNU/Linux. Now, I don't for a moment believe that GNU/Linux will save the world, it wont. But it represents, to me, a glimmer of hope for things to come. Perhaps my words don't do justice to what we have here before us. My hope is that others too realize the far reaching implications of what is happening here. Linux breaks new ground because no generation before us could claim to have done what we are now doing. That is the heart of the matter, that is why I love Linux the way I do.
I've been promising it for years. This will really blow your socks off folks, it is the brand new wheel!! It's based on BSD 4.4 wheels! Basically it is a poor implimantation of BSD, with a Mediocre GUI Mac Hubcap. It won't really work like the old wheel because it wont fit any of the old axels. It will cost several thousands of dollars to own and operate. It won't really do anything new, since its basically the same old wheel. Now, here is the really good part. It is made by the people who know what proprietary is all about. In order to use this wheel, you will have to buy our Mediocre carriages. These carriages are expensive, and somewhat slower than the lower cost, more flexible models. These carriages use the great G3 system, but we have limited its performance by adding all this shit on to it, and limitting its performance. You should really buy our Wheels and carriages, why, well THINK DIFFERENT , don't ask intelegent questions like why!
NT admins get paid a fraction of what Unix admins get paid. The whole premis behind NT is lower cost of ownership. Translate this, cheaper labor. As for Linux admins, their time is comming
The year 2000 issue is mostly hype. Think about it. Computer companies now have a reason to demand that their customers upgrade. Software companies will follow in the same manner. Governments now have a reason to raise taxes to pay for all the new hardware and software. Banks will justify raising fees to pay for the upgrades. Insurance companies will raise their costs. And on and on..... It will be a buyers boon in the markets, especially after all the fools buying heavily inflated stocks, aka Yahoo at 250+???, panic. As always their will be winners and loosers, what makes the difference is who understands the game, and who doesn't. Oh, one more thing. Expect to see governments taking advantage of the ignorance that abounds. Expect to see the executive branch grab even more power with the use of states of emergency. I doubt we will see marshall law, if the executive branch is cleaver enough, they will grab the power in ways that few americans pay attention too. The biggest danger is not Y2k, its our collective ignorance.
Perhaps we will see the sexier side of slashdot. Perhaps it should be marketed under the name SPANK DOT:) All of us geeks could get our girls to dress up in SPANK DOT accessories. What a turn on. SPANK DOT, news for pervs, stuff that splatters.
Cool, but you don't become a linux expert by reading certification manuals. You become a linux expert by hacking at it over and over again, and reading the source code:) I suppose that certification is good, because it gives the management types a warm fuzzy fealing.
We use an Alpha 4000 5/300 with a 300mhz Alpha, running NT. I can tell you from direct experience that NT is not stable on this platform. NT has no true 64 bit support. What it does is rely on firmware to correct bit alignment on the fly. NT Alpha is only 32 bit, even though the alpha works in 64 bit. This is why NT needs a special X86 support BIOS chip to work on the Alphas. Putting NT on an ALPHA or PowerPC is a waste of good hardware
Technically it is not bad to have an X install. However, if your card has a buggy, or unique VGA interface, it can cause installs to be a real problem. The ncurses based install is almost guaranteed to work on all available hardware. Since Linux is intended for everything under the sun(no pun intended), it is better to have an install that you know will work, instead of one that is "sexy" Eventually, someone will build a stable X install, but the text install will probably always be the defacto standard for experienced Linux users. I imagine Red Hat and other distros will adopt an X install, as an option, within the next two release cycles.
The issue with the registry is that it is a single point of failure. On windows, if a programm can't access the registry, it can't find its dll's and it has lost the equivalent of its environment variables. Having a registry as MS impliments it, is a bad idea all around. As for Red Hat, the RPM database is not a registry. Applications don't access the database during run time. It is a reference point for install time, and even if it gets corrupted, it can be easily rebuilt.
Well, of course it will be "Free", but my download site will be served by a single 1200 baud modem that is on only ten minutes per day. The package will cost 129.00 to buy, but it will come with all sorts of proprietary installation utils, and non standard code.
I didn't mean to imply that he didn't have some validity to his point. I suppose I was out of line, what I should have said was that this whole thing isn't as big a deal as either side has made it out to be. Slashdot has made a difference in the hacker community. I don't think Rob, or any one at slashdot, was implying that this is saving the world, or helping the homeless. I believe that its implications are that hackers that act as a forum can make a difference in the hacker community. As a hacker, I do take a certain amount of pride in this, as it relates to the context of this community.
Hey, a friend of mine wants to write a distribution called dubian, because everybody should roll their own:) If I make my own distribution, I am going to color it purple, and the install will autodetect your personality, needs, wishes, and future. It will be unique, in that it will be like every other distribution out there:( My distribution will develope a cult following, and this group of followers will diss your distribution because it sucks! Quick, order my distribution today, It will ship first quarter of of some year in the near future. Replicating other peoples work, instead of improving on it, will be the moto for my distribution. My distributions web page will be http://www.redundant.redundant.doingthesamething_o ver_again.waste_of_effort.whyareyoustill readingthis.willthiseverend.probablynot.yetanother distro.arewedoneyet.ohlord_here_we_go_ag ain.com.net.org.tx.usa.enough_already
Hey, at least Intel publishes its hardware standards, and,well, nothing good to say about MS. Anyway, Apple wants to lock their market down, only Apple hardware, only Apple OS's. Hot news flash, proprietary kills. If you are proprietary, you automatically shoot yourself in the foot. Why do you think that the PC architecture is going strong after all these years, it certainley isn't because of technical supperiority, its because its open! Open source, open standards win every time:)
Slashdot Mirror
Call me lazy, but I would like it if they would just tar ball it up into one massive rpm, or tar.gz, or whatever. I hate having to run around looking for seperate libs and the like. Otherwise, congratulations GNOME team, keep up the good work.
Where do I sign
Feel the thunder.
I would bet that you work for MicroSoft.
I am on the GNU/Linux side. You want to know why, one reason and one reason only. OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARE. If you think MS is ruthless and brutal, stop and look at how Apple behaves. Apple is the most proprietary Computer/Software company in the world. If they were in a position to control the market, we would be in even deeper shit than we are in now. I don't care what their desktop looks like, or what their kernel is based on. They are playing the same game that MS is playing, their just smaller and weaker, so they don't pack as much punch.
Also, OSS delivers what it promises, and nothing less. OSS doesn't promise more than it can deliver. If you think OS X is going to deliver as promised, just have a look at all of Apples other projects. Like any large company, they never deliver what they promise. Don't buy the into the marketing.
Okay, perhaps this will create a flame war, if so, I apologize in advance. Let's have a look at what's really going on. Let's talk about innovation and duplication. Mac OS X, BeOS, Linux. All of these systems are Unix's with GUI front ends. Technologically, neither one of them is all that innovative. The GUI is 20+ years old, it was invented by Xerox many years ago. Unix is 20+ years old, it was invented by AT&T for their high speed frame relay switches. It's been 20 years, and nothing new is on the scene. C++ is an update of C. Java is an update of C++. The only real innovation that has come to pass in the last 20 years, is the GPL, open source movement. This is not a technological improvement, instead it is a social improvement. Open source will open the way for further Technological advancement, by altering the way people communicate ideas. In a world that is fast becomming a collective society, whether we like it or not, Open source is the way that future technological developments will come about. That is why I choose Linux. For the moment, GNU and Linux are on the forefront of the OSS movement. All of these other systems are simply proprietary spin offs of the idea. Sure, they have OSS parts and pieces to them, but at their heart, they are still part of a dying bread. The come from the age of proprietary software.
In technological terms, BeOS, Mac OS X, and Linux are pretty much on similar ground. Sure, each one will have its streangths, but only one represents the future. GNU/Linux is so much more than just an OS. It represents a dream that so many before us have strived to achieve, and failed. This is the dream of Collective Unity. Think about the amazing phenominon that is GNU/Linux. Now, I don't for a moment believe that GNU/Linux will save the world, it wont. But it represents, to me, a glimmer of hope for things to come. Perhaps my words don't do justice to what we have here before us. My hope is that others too realize the far reaching implications of what is happening here. Linux breaks new ground because no generation before us could claim to have done what we are now doing. That is the heart of the matter, that is why I love Linux the way I do.
I've been promising it for years. This will really blow your socks off folks, it is the brand new wheel!! It's based on BSD 4.4 wheels! Basically it is a poor implimantation of BSD, with a Mediocre GUI Mac Hubcap. It won't really work like the old wheel because it wont fit any of the old axels. It will cost several thousands of dollars to own and operate. It won't really do anything new, since its basically the same old wheel. Now, here is the really good part. It is made by the people who know what proprietary is all about. In order to use this wheel, you will have to buy our Mediocre carriages. These carriages are expensive, and somewhat slower than the lower cost, more flexible models. These carriages use the great G3 system, but we have limited its performance by adding all this shit on to it, and limitting its performance. You should really buy our Wheels and carriages, why, well THINK DIFFERENT , don't ask intelegent questions like why!
Cool :)
NT admins get paid a fraction of what Unix admins get paid. The whole premis behind NT is lower cost of ownership. Translate this, cheaper labor. As for Linux admins, their time is comming
Where do I get it. Message to Quicken, You have a insant customer when your port is done :)!
The year 2000 issue is mostly hype. Think about it. Computer companies now have a reason to demand that their customers upgrade. Software companies will follow in the same manner.
Governments now have a reason to raise taxes to pay for all the new hardware and software. Banks will justify raising fees to pay for the upgrades.
Insurance companies will raise their costs. And on and on..... It will be a buyers boon in the markets, especially after all the fools buying heavily inflated stocks, aka Yahoo at 250+???, panic. As always their will be winners and loosers, what makes the difference is who understands the game, and who doesn't.
Oh, one more thing. Expect to see governments taking advantage of the ignorance that abounds. Expect to see the executive branch grab even more power with the use of states of emergency. I doubt we will see marshall law, if the executive branch is cleaver enough, they will grab the power in ways that few americans pay attention too. The biggest danger is not Y2k, its our collective ignorance.
This wont affect me:)
At least you know microsoft is predictable. A predictable enemy is a dead enemy.
Perhaps we will see the sexier side of slashdot. Perhaps it should be marketed under the name :) All of us geeks could get our girls to dress up in SPANK DOT accessories. What a turn on. SPANK DOT, news for pervs, stuff that splatters.
SPANK DOT
Cool, but you don't become a linux expert by reading certification manuals. You become a linux expert by hacking at it over and over again, and reading the source code:) I suppose that certification is good, because it gives the management types a warm fuzzy fealing.
We use an Alpha 4000 5/300 with a 300mhz Alpha, running NT. I can tell you from direct experience that NT is not stable on this platform. NT has no true 64 bit support. What it does is rely on firmware to correct bit alignment on the fly. NT Alpha is only 32 bit, even though the alpha works in 64 bit. This is why NT needs a special X86 support BIOS chip to work on the Alphas. Putting NT on an ALPHA or PowerPC is a waste of good hardware
Technically it is not bad to have an X install. However, if your card has a buggy, or unique VGA interface, it can cause installs to be a real problem. The ncurses based install is almost guaranteed to work on all available hardware. Since Linux is intended for everything under the sun(no pun intended), it is better to have an install that you know will work, instead of one that is "sexy" Eventually, someone will build a stable X install, but the text install will probably always be the defacto standard for experienced Linux users. I imagine Red Hat and other distros will adopt an X install, as an option, within the next two release cycles.
The issue with the registry is that it is a single point of failure. On windows, if a programm can't access the registry, it can't find its dll's and it has lost the equivalent of its environment variables. Having a registry as MS impliments it, is a bad idea all around. As for Red Hat, the RPM database is not a registry. Applications don't access the database during run time. It is a reference point for install time, and even if it gets corrupted, it can be easily rebuilt.
One must remember that while fleas pale in comparison to the dog, it is the flea that brings the dog to action.
Well, of course it will be "Free", but my download site will be served by a single 1200 baud modem that is on only ten minutes per day. The package will cost 129.00 to buy, but it will come with all sorts of proprietary installation utils, and non standard code.
I'll just duplicate the current efforts in progress:)
I didn't mean to imply that he didn't have some validity to his point. I suppose I was out of line, what I should have said was that this whole thing isn't as big a deal as either side has made it out to be. Slashdot has made a difference in the hacker community. I don't think Rob, or any one at slashdot, was implying that this is saving the world, or helping the homeless. I believe that its implications are that hackers that act as a forum can make a difference in the hacker community. As a hacker, I do take a certain amount of pride in this, as it relates to the context of this community.
Relax, take a deep breath, and pull whatever you just sat on, out of your ass:(
Hey, a friend of mine wants to write a distribution called dubian, because everybody should roll their own:) If I make my own distribution, I am going to color it purple, and the install will autodetect your personality, needs, wishes, and future. It will be unique, in that it will be like every other distribution out there:( My distribution will develope a cult following, and this group of followers will diss your distribution because it sucks! Quick, order my distribution today, It will ship first quarter of of some year in the near future. Replicating other peoples work, instead of improving on it, will be the moto for my distribution. My distributions web page will be http://www.redundant.redundant.doingthesamething_o ver_again.waste_of_effort.whyareyoustill readingthis.willthiseverend.probablynot.yetanother distro.arewedoneyet.ohlord_here_we_go_ag ain.com.net.org.tx.usa.enough_already
Hey, at least Intel publishes its hardware standards, and ,well, nothing good to say about MS. Anyway, Apple wants to lock their market down, only Apple hardware, only Apple OS's. Hot news flash, proprietary kills. If you are proprietary, you automatically shoot yourself in the foot. Why do you think that the PC architecture is going strong after all these years, it certainley isn't because of technical supperiority, its because its open! Open source, open standards win every time:)