you're saying that newer computers aren't "safer" from attacks or whatnot, more economical to use, and don't reduce polution.vs. their 20 year old counter part?
um, i have an averatec 3225, and it's nice unless you have a need for dri. i haven't for the life of me figured out how to get dri working with that onboard via video chipset. maybe someother distros have it down, but i've got gentoo i just haven't gotten it to work. maybe that's a good excuse to give suse or someone else a try.
also, the fact that it supposidly maxes out at 512M ram is makes it kinda a bummer.
the onboard wifi works nicely through ndiswrapper though.
suspend to ram means (i think) you can close the lid and the thing goes into a VERY VERY low power consumption state. kinda like hiberante on MS maybe.
suspend to disk takes it a step further. you close the lid and the thing writes the ram out to swap partition and basically shuts down. you turn the machine back on and when linux boots, it identifies that it suspended and then reloads ram from the swap space. not only does it make startup a little faster, but it also keeps your work space intact. if only i could figure out how to shutdown networking just before it suspends to disk and bring it back up just after it resumes....
consumer storage is cheep, yep. but in the datacenter where you have to consider backups, it's not as cheep as you would think. getting disk space (and hardware in general) in a datacenter is a comodity.
i thought the mpeg-2 was recorded to the cd in minutes, not MB. i was under the impression that an 80 minute audio cd would also hold 80 minutes of mpeg-2 (vcd) video. that to the cd it's about minutes on the disk and not data on the disk. this just so happens to normally be about an 800 mb file as well.
ahh yes, gentoo has no RPM hell. it has it's own emerge hell.
emerge unmerge cdrtools
how does that leave all apps that use the cdrtools package? fscked i'd imagine. there's NO concept of reverse dependancy checking with the emerge system. you can't block the unmerge of a package because others use it. you can't even say for sure which package another package uses b/c of the "flexability" of the use flags.
funny funny. a P 200MMX would handle DVD playback just fine. a capable video adapter (r128) would be needed. albeit, i've only tried dvd playback on a pII 266 as the slowest processor, but playing a media like that doesn't hog cpu much. mostly in video.
but sure, faster processor, faster processor. gotta have one!!
Re:How many licenses can fit on the head of a pin?
on
PHP Not Moving To The GPL
·
· Score: 2, Interesting
the problem with java being "non-open source" is that an open source VM cannot be created and call it self java because they cannot have access to the "test suites" that one must pass to call themselves a java jvm.
during the recent javaone converence (too much fluff), the apache foundation made it clear that they would love the opportunity to have ahold of the test suites so someone could develop an opensource implementation. after all, they finally have achieved the ability to get a certified open source j2ee library/server set.
so, while java was designed to allow multiple vms existing, must they all be corporate vms? or even free vms? would ibm open source their vm if they could? would bea? i guess at least one of those two would be foot in mouth if they didn't.
kde is a "pretty" and well functional desktop, while Gnome is a beast for developers to use, for end user usability (ok/cancel buttons on the wrong side?), and over all eyesore. i don't understand why gnome has won in the korporate world (sun/eclipse, etc) perhaps it is due to less restrictive licenscing (lgpl.vs. gpl)? i dunno. personally, i wish at least the SWT would be kde based.
i'll start from the bottom and work my way up. yahoo messenger is a free "service". the telephone company is not. you buy phone service, you get a service agreement (hopefully). if the phone company breaks that agreement, you may have recourse.
again, hotmail is a free "service". i haven't read the service agreements for hotmail, but i'm pretty sure it includes stuff about: we provide this to you on an as is basis. it might work, it might not
AO who?
i'm not too familiar with these yahoo approved clients. what are some yahoo approved clients that have been negatively impacted by this change in their propriatary protocol/messenger system.
perhaps you're kidding, i dunno, but these free services do provide a lot. webmail, hosted on someone elses server has more reliable backup/recover procedures. in the 7 years i've used yahoo mail, i've _never_ has a message just disapear. i have had a hard drive crash w/o a backup anywhere in sight. and once i d/l my email from ISP and delete from their server, it makes it more challenging to get to the emails. hotmail/yahoo/gmail whatever is generally accessable anywhere you can get a public ip and out the firewall on port 80. though sometimes it may be more challening from some business who deem necessarry to block the well known webmail sites.
now, personally, i think that while gmail will be enticing (and i'll certainly sign up when given a chance), they'll need to really provide more than email. yahoo's calendar is really nice. it becomes a challenge now to simply forget when the date you officially became a domesticated individual.
all that would say is that they didn't come up with enough evidence to go to trial over it. there would be no ruling of anykind. just thrown out. anyone could come back later (and probably will) and sue anyone for linux copyright violations.
afaik, this suit is all over a contract dispute and the whole linux copyright is merely a major point in the contract litigation.
seems pretty insightfull to me. guess it's all in the eye of the beholder.
anyway, people who used RH for free didn't get support. rh figured that some corporate people were installing software on 5 boxes and getting support for only one. but rh user base has always been after something that's not restricted on # of machines they can install it on and such. they're after the big bang for the buck now. and they're looking very Microsoftish with their licensing issues.
next point. compensating volunteers. news flash, volunteers don't expect to be compensated. they volunteer to do something they enjoy doing. sometimes it can be a bitch, but more often than not, it's something they genuinly enjoy doing. these people are to be highly commended for their efforts. again, RH has become a whore in this respect.
because consumers are too hard to support. in a corporate environment or even education environment, you have _some_ confidence that the people you're working with have some degree of education and experience with the computers.
so that you don't have tech support calls that go like:
tekkie: "now boot the cd to the cd marked boot cdrom"...
mother-in-law: "ok".. 10 second pause. "so, how do i do that?".
tekkie: "open the cdrom drive"
mother-in-law: "ok, it's open"
tekkie: "find the cd marked "boot cdrom"
mother-in-law: "got it"
tekkie: " put that cdrom in the computer and reboot the computer"
mother-in-law: "ok. i put the disk in the drive , now what?"
tekkie: "just a sec. gotta make a beer run before we get too far into this one"
how does this compensate for the fact that i can emerge kde, then emerge k3b (cd burning app for kde), then i can unmerge (uninstall) kde. this removes all libs, etc. the emerge doesn't check to see if other apps are using an app when you unmerge it. does revdep-rebuild unmerge the k3b for me?
there's also no way to say remove package "x" and all packages that require "x" and all packages that use "x". once you've added gnome to your system, you'd better leave it there. same for kde and other "big" apps.
exactly. i recall when lots of folks were switching over to debian. i could neer get it installed so stuck with RH for a bit longer. then i ended up drudging through a gentoo install. never looked back. there's time i wouldn't mind a debian type distro (kde kompiles), this gentoo thing is much nicer to the non-free software world.
red hat, heh. that is so like a 20th century distro.
you can dive into an unknown project, select a random source file and understand it. You may have problems getting the big picture, but the code itself is there - there are no suprises like operator overloading, defines etc. All you need to know about the class is in it (and it's superclass and interfaces)
that's often the case (possibly b/c good textbook examples exist and java programmers tend to study on coding habits and patterns). but java code can be written as messy as perl or any other language. also, perl code could be written to be readable, it's just that most often it isn't.
the java jvm can lock up hard. makes recovery quite interesting.
also java and.net are "successfull" b/c of general investment from big companes. there's lots of marketing dollars selling products and articles about these platforms. the PHB's read the PHB magazines, and those mags have articles re java and.net. Do those mags have articles on D? then it's not a competition.
it's nice that you get a warm fuzzy inside from all these ideas, but there are a lot of hidden costs.
first off, a wind genny that's going to actually give back to the grid seems to cost more than 50k. while nice for the environment, it's not very practical in any sense. that's 1/2 the house you describe above.
regarding the house you describe. sure the land/house you get will be a few grand cheeper, but everything is about location. a house like that is definately out in the sticks. you gain peace and quiet, and it costs you the convenience of living near a city. so, the option you describe is only valid if you're planning to live in the sticks. that's a small % of the folks there.
regarding the "other" items in our lives: tv, boat, gaming system, etc. these are entertainment items. these are purchased with entertainment dollars. typically what's left after expenses and savings becomes available for entertainment/recreational purposes.
electricity, heat, cooling, gasoline are all expenses. thus they're going to come from expense dollars. in order for the masses to flock to any other technology, it must be more cost effective in the long run. i can't even get a 20 year payback on the investment of a self sufficient solar system for my house. that's not going to cause people to flock there in masses. maybe it's a chicken/egg problem. people aren't buying the stuff, so manufacturing isn't huge, so prices are high. maybe raw materials to make these solar panels are high, but i doubt that. i've read you can kinda build one from common materials. haven't tried yet.
i also burn wood all winter long. gas bills are extremely low (have a innefficient water heater, but again, replacing it would either have to be cost effective, or it'll have to die). the wood is essentially free, even in the city. that's only because wood buring use is low and tree cutting business is healthy. the tree companies cut more trees than they can sell as firewood. so, i have a splitter and a hauler to go and grab what ever they're willing to give away. now, if i figure in the HOURS i spend on the wood (splitting cutting, hauling stacking, etc, it definately doesn't make financial sense. put my time at a measly 10$ per hour, and the gas heat is going to be cheeper. maybe i'm a slow cutter/splitter. but there's also the time to carry it in the house ever other day. and time feeding the fire, and getting it started after a days work. i love it, but it's a lot of work and it's not cost effective. thus, most people aren't going to use it.
if i decide to build a place out in the hills where land is cheep, i'll definately consider geothermal, and maybe even solar and even wind power. geothermal is the one that seems to have the best payoff. 10-15 years is what i seem to gather, and then it's money in the bank. you have less to worry about adding 15k to the value of your house that way.
not quite sure how this relates to the topic at hand, but sure is good troll bait.
green energy will catch up and surpass fossil fuels when it makes financial sense. maybe in cali it makes sense now, but here in the midwest, it's cost prohibitive to install solar panels onto one's house. it's fairly cost prohibitive to use a geo-thermal heating system. i've checked into installing both, and only if you're personally planning to live long term in that place does it make sense. schools, businesses, yes. residence, not yet. unless you want to live out in the mountains the, that's about all you can get.
i'm not sure why e-85/ ethanol(sp) isn't taking off, there probably is some conspiracy behind that one. doesn't our gov't pay farmers NOT to grow corn that could be easily used to product ethanol? why does e-85/ethonal cost more per gallon than gasoline? why only e-85? why not pure ethanol? why are there absolutely NO fueling stations in OHIO that sell ethanol? probably because people in the midwest will put whatever is cheepest to use in their vehicle and gasoline is cheeper and gets better mileage. if E-85 were retailing for 1.00$ per gallon today, loads of people would be filling up with it.
people who are that much into religon will not be sending their kids to the public schools. they'll not be watching movies of the "world" make by the "world". they won't have a tv in the house to let that worldly influence into their lives.
i think the families that want to skip over that moment should take a harder look at their lives and what they're influencing themselves with. if you're going to watch "worldly" movies with your kids you need them to understand that they're created from a different perspective perhaps than you might have. otherwise, yes, stay away from movies.
Slashdot Mirror
you're saying that newer computers aren't "safer" from attacks or whatnot, more economical to use, and don't reduce polution .vs. their 20 year old counter part?
interesting.
um, i have an averatec 3225, and it's nice unless you have a need for dri. i haven't for the life of me figured out how to get dri working with that onboard via video chipset. maybe someother distros have it down, but i've got gentoo i just haven't gotten it to work. maybe that's a good excuse to give suse or someone else a try.
also, the fact that it supposidly maxes out at 512M ram is makes it kinda a bummer.
the onboard wifi works nicely through ndiswrapper though.
suspend to ram means (i think) you can close the lid and the thing goes into a VERY VERY low power consumption state. kinda like hiberante on MS maybe.
suspend to disk takes it a step further. you close the lid and the thing writes the ram out to swap partition and basically shuts down. you turn the machine back on and when linux boots, it identifies that it suspended and then reloads ram from the swap space. not only does it make startup a little faster, but it also keeps your work space intact. if only i could figure out how to shutdown networking just before it suspends to disk and bring it back up just after it resumes....
um.... let me think ... wal-mart does.
consumer storage is cheep, yep. but in the datacenter where you have to consider backups, it's not as cheep as you would think. getting disk space (and hardware in general) in a datacenter is a comodity.
i thought the mpeg-2 was recorded to the cd in minutes, not MB. i was under the impression that an 80 minute audio cd would also hold 80 minutes of mpeg-2 (vcd) video. that to the cd it's about minutes on the disk and not data on the disk. this just so happens to normally be about an 800 mb file as well.
ahh yes, gentoo has no RPM hell. it has it's own emerge hell.
emerge unmerge cdrtools
how does that leave all apps that use the cdrtools package? fscked i'd imagine. there's NO concept of reverse dependancy checking with the emerge system. you can't block the unmerge of a package because others use it. you can't even say for sure which package another package uses b/c of the "flexability" of the use flags.
nope, no rpm hell anymore.
funny funny. a P 200MMX would handle DVD playback just fine. a capable video adapter (r128) would be needed. albeit, i've only tried dvd playback on a pII 266 as the slowest processor, but playing a media like that doesn't hog cpu much. mostly in video.
but sure, faster processor, faster processor. gotta have one!!
the problem with java being "non-open source" is that an open source VM cannot be created and call it self java because they cannot have access to the "test suites" that one must pass to call themselves a java jvm.
during the recent javaone converence (too much fluff), the apache foundation made it clear that they would love the opportunity to have ahold of the test suites so someone could develop an opensource implementation. after all, they finally have achieved the ability to get a certified open source j2ee library/server set.
so, while java was designed to allow multiple vms existing, must they all be corporate vms? or even free vms? would ibm open source their vm if they could? would bea? i guess at least one of those two would be foot in mouth if they didn't.
kde is a "pretty" and well functional desktop, while Gnome is a beast for developers to use, for end user usability (ok/cancel buttons on the wrong side?), and over all eyesore. i don't understand why gnome has won in the korporate world (sun/eclipse, etc) perhaps it is due to less restrictive licenscing (lgpl .vs. gpl)? i dunno. personally, i wish at least the SWT would be kde based.
so you're the reason i have to pay so much in taxes, eh? get off yer lazy arse and start chipping in like the rest of us working bastards.
and they say the education sytem is failing...
i'll start from the bottom and work my way up. yahoo messenger is a free "service". the telephone company is not. you buy phone service, you get a service agreement (hopefully). if the phone company breaks that agreement, you may have recourse.
again, hotmail is a free "service". i haven't read the service agreements for hotmail, but i'm pretty sure it includes stuff about: we provide this to you on an as is basis. it might work, it might not
AO who?
i'm not too familiar with these yahoo approved clients. what are some yahoo approved clients that have been negatively impacted by this change in their propriatary protocol/messenger system.
perhaps you're kidding, i dunno, but these free services do provide a lot. webmail, hosted on someone elses server has more reliable backup/recover procedures. in the 7 years i've used yahoo mail, i've _never_ has a message just disapear. i have had a hard drive crash w/o a backup anywhere in sight. and once i d/l my email from ISP and delete from their server, it makes it more challenging to get to the emails. hotmail/yahoo/gmail whatever is generally accessable anywhere you can get a public ip and out the firewall on port 80. though sometimes it may be more challening from some business who deem necessarry to block the well known webmail sites.
now, personally, i think that while gmail will be enticing (and i'll certainly sign up when given a chance), they'll need to really provide more than email. yahoo's calendar is really nice. it becomes a challenge now to simply forget when the date you officially became a domesticated individual.
best
quite a subjective statement of course. while i like using the server itself, configuring it isn't quickly intuitive.
all that would say is that they didn't come up with enough evidence to go to trial over it. there would be no ruling of anykind. just thrown out. anyone could come back later (and probably will) and sue anyone for linux copyright violations.
afaik, this suit is all over a contract dispute and the whole linux copyright is merely a major point in the contract litigation.
seems pretty insightfull to me. guess it's all in the eye of the beholder.
anyway, people who used RH for free didn't get support. rh figured that some corporate people were installing software on 5 boxes and getting support for only one. but rh user base has always been after something that's not restricted on # of machines they can install it on and such. they're after the big bang for the buck now. and they're looking very Microsoftish with their licensing issues.
next point. compensating volunteers. news flash, volunteers don't expect to be compensated. they volunteer to do something they enjoy doing. sometimes it can be a bitch, but more often than not, it's something they genuinly enjoy doing. these people are to be highly commended for their efforts. again, RH has become a whore in this respect.
because consumers are too hard to support. in a corporate environment or even education environment, you have _some_ confidence that the people you're working with have some degree of education and experience with the computers.
so that you don't have tech support calls that go like:
tekkie: "now boot the cd to the cd marked boot cdrom"...
mother-in-law: "ok".. 10 second pause. "so, how do i do that?".
tekkie: "open the cdrom drive"
mother-in-law: "ok, it's open"
tekkie: "find the cd marked "boot cdrom"
mother-in-law: "got it"
tekkie: " put that cdrom in the computer and reboot the computer"
mother-in-law: "ok. i put the disk in the drive , now what?"
tekkie: "just a sec. gotta make a beer run before we get too far into this one"
how does this compensate for the fact that i can emerge kde, then emerge k3b (cd burning app for kde), then i can unmerge (uninstall) kde. this removes all libs, etc. the emerge doesn't check to see if other apps are using an app when you unmerge it. does revdep-rebuild unmerge the k3b for me?
there's also no way to say remove package "x" and all packages that require "x" and all packages that use "x". once you've added gnome to your system, you'd better leave it there. same for kde and other "big" apps.
exactly. i recall when lots of folks were switching over to debian. i could neer get it installed so stuck with RH for a bit longer. then i ended up drudging through a gentoo install. never looked back. there's time i wouldn't mind a debian type distro (kde kompiles), this gentoo thing is much nicer to the non-free software world.
red hat, heh. that is so like a 20th century distro.
you can dive into an unknown project, select a random source file and understand it. You may have problems getting the big picture, but the code itself is there - there are no suprises like operator overloading, defines etc. All you need to know about the class is in it (and it's superclass and interfaces)
that's often the case (possibly b/c good textbook examples exist and java programmers tend to study on coding habits and patterns). but java code can be written as messy as perl or any other language. also, perl code could be written to be readable, it's just that most often it isn't.
the java jvm can lock up hard. makes recovery quite interesting.
.net are "successfull" b/c of general investment from big companes. there's lots of marketing dollars selling products and articles about these platforms. the PHB's read the PHB magazines, and those mags have articles re java and .net. Do those mags have articles on D? then it's not a competition.
also java and
it's nice that you get a warm fuzzy inside from all these ideas, but there are a lot of hidden costs.
first off, a wind genny that's going to actually give back to the grid seems to cost more than 50k. while nice for the environment, it's not very practical in any sense. that's 1/2 the house you describe above.
regarding the house you describe. sure the land/house you get will be a few grand cheeper, but everything is about location. a house like that is definately out in the sticks. you gain peace and quiet, and it costs you the convenience of living near a city. so, the option you describe is only valid if you're planning to live in the sticks. that's a small % of the folks there.
regarding the "other" items in our lives: tv, boat, gaming system, etc. these are entertainment items. these are purchased with entertainment dollars. typically what's left after expenses and savings becomes available for entertainment/recreational purposes.
electricity, heat, cooling, gasoline are all expenses. thus they're going to come from expense dollars. in order for the masses to flock to any other technology, it must be more cost effective in the long run. i can't even get a 20 year payback on the investment of a self sufficient solar system for my house. that's not going to cause people to flock there in masses. maybe it's a chicken/egg problem. people aren't buying the stuff, so manufacturing isn't huge, so prices are high. maybe raw materials to make these solar panels are high, but i doubt that. i've read you can kinda build one from common materials. haven't tried yet.
i also burn wood all winter long. gas bills are extremely low (have a innefficient water heater, but again, replacing it would either have to be cost effective, or it'll have to die). the wood is essentially free, even in the city. that's only because wood buring use is low and tree cutting business is healthy. the tree companies cut more trees than they can sell as firewood. so, i have a splitter and a hauler to go and grab what ever they're willing to give away. now, if i figure in the HOURS i spend on the wood (splitting cutting, hauling stacking, etc, it definately doesn't make financial sense. put my time at a measly 10$ per hour, and the gas heat is going to be cheeper. maybe i'm a slow cutter/splitter. but there's also the time to carry it in the house ever other day. and time feeding the fire, and getting it started after a days work. i love it, but it's a lot of work and it's not cost effective. thus, most people aren't going to use it.
if i decide to build a place out in the hills where land is cheep, i'll definately consider geothermal, and maybe even solar and even wind power. geothermal is the one that seems to have the best payoff. 10-15 years is what i seem to gather, and then it's money in the bank. you have less to worry about adding 15k to the value of your house that way.
not quite sure how this relates to the topic at hand, but sure is good troll bait.
green energy will catch up and surpass fossil fuels when it makes financial sense. maybe in cali it makes sense now, but here in the midwest, it's cost prohibitive to install solar panels onto one's house. it's fairly cost prohibitive to use a geo-thermal heating system. i've checked into installing both, and only if you're personally planning to live long term in that place does it make sense. schools, businesses, yes. residence, not yet. unless you want to live out in the mountains the, that's about all you can get.
i'm not sure why e-85/ ethanol(sp) isn't taking off, there probably is some conspiracy behind that one. doesn't our gov't pay farmers NOT to grow corn that could be easily used to product ethanol? why does e-85/ethonal cost more per gallon than gasoline? why only e-85? why not pure ethanol? why are there absolutely NO fueling stations in OHIO that sell ethanol? probably because people in the midwest will put whatever is cheepest to use in their vehicle and gasoline is cheeper and gets better mileage. if E-85 were retailing for 1.00$ per gallon today, loads of people would be filling up with it.
i'm using win2k probably on NTFS and symlinks work just fine. JUNCTION.EXE is what i use.
Please. get ... off ... the ...soap box.
people who are that much into religon will not be sending their kids to the public schools. they'll not be watching movies of the "world" make by the "world". they won't have a tv in the house to let that worldly influence into their lives.
i think the families that want to skip over that moment should take a harder look at their lives and what they're influencing themselves with. if you're going to watch "worldly" movies with your kids you need them to understand that they're created from a different perspective perhaps than you might have. otherwise, yes, stay away from movies.