Vista won't fail, it doesn't really matter if it's far better than XP or not.....It will look different and all the PC manufactures will preinstall it on their machines, everyone that buys a new PC will get and use it, and within several years after it's release it will be used by the majority of PC users (since the majority will have bought a new PC by then).
agree with you so far
Meanwhile the Mac lovers will call it a cheap ripoff of Mac OS X (which it probably is) and the Linux users will say you can get that stuff for free (watch the demo of Novell Linux 10 with xgl, it demonstrates all the cool windows effects MS is saying will be in Vista, and then some). But the majority of PC users won't know or care. To them it's a new feature when it shows up in MS Windows.
Yep - agree here too.
The only thing that will break the cycle of everyone adapting MS's newest OS is the ability to effortlessly run Windows apps on Linux, or Mac. It's sad but true.
Now this is where I disagree. You made good arguments that the reason Vista won't fail is because the PC builders will all pre-install it and then ignored that fact when making your closing statement.
What will break the cycle is when people can walk into/browse the website of a PC vendor and purchase a PC with whatever OS they want on it. As long as the vendors/manufacturers are locked into agreements with MS then the average PC buyer has no choice and the dominance of MS on the desktop continues. Many PC users are too lazy to install a new browser or patch their existing OS let alone install a whole new OS. Until they can buy a PC without Windows installed they simply won't bother to change. Trouble is few manufacturers are prepared to take the risk (to their profit margin) of challenging their MS agreement and we end up in a cause-effect loop.
That's Access' real value: the ability to make point-and-click interfaces without actually having to know how to program
I can think of a few people (me included) who would say this was Access' real problem not its value:o)
Anyway for those who like to produce forms etc. via point and click there's always things like OOo 2, kexi and knoda. Not that I've used any of them with a vengeance but they seem to do the job (maybe not Access' job but *that* may not be such a bad thing;o) ).
How's 'bout the possibility that most people just didn't think it was very good?
erm...surely by "flopped" they mean "didn't do well at the box office", so how exactly did people think it wasn't very good without seeing it? Perhaps they didn't go to see it because of bad reviews, maybe the few that did thoguth it was bad and *everybody else* belived them, but I don't think we can ssume that people didn't watch something (the first time) because they didn't like it - can we?
Teaching people the concepts of where to find the usual supects in an application: file,edit,view, configuration and how to save as, cut, copy and paste...etc, is far more useful in real life, because they may be using a real world application they've never seen before.
Unless they end up using MS Office 12 which will do away (screenshot) with typical menus like edit, view etc. Hopefully the keyboard shortcuts will still work because that's what I mostly use.:o)
Select a rectangular area with the select tool. Click the 'selection to path' button, then the 'draw path' button. Not exactly that direct, I'll agree, but there's no fiddling around with masks required.
I'll agree it's not intuitive it took me six months of using it before I worked out how to draw a circle/rectangle. That said this is the way I do it..
Select a rectangle/circle with the select tool. Choose Stroke Path from the Edit menu. Set your brush (if required). Click OK.
Shock! Horror! Exchange of money for goods and services!
What is the world coming to.
I wasn't complaining that you have to pay for the software I was complaining that the Microsoft advertising campaign implies that as long as you have Windows you can do all the media production stuff they speak of. The only concession they make is saying "There's a world of software running on Windows..." nowehre do they mention that additional (and often expensive) outlay is required.
They're not the only ones and it drives me mad. I lose track of how many times I have to explain to people that merely having a Centrino chipset does not mean you can use wifi broadband on the beach!
Deliver software with a minimum functionality and allow them to be replaced without having to jump through hoops (try actually replacing IE).
Install browser of choice. Change 'Program Defaults'. Delete IE icons.
Wow. That was hard. Yes, the IE dlls and program are still sitting on your system, but for all intents and purposes, it's gone.
Okay so go do that and then go to the Windows or Office update site with your other browser? You'd also think that your suggestion means you'll be no longer be using IE but try printing an HTML e-mail from Outlook or OE without IE. I had a user who changed their IE print margins, went to print an HTML message and found half the text was off the page because the margin was too small for Outlook!
Plus you forgot to add "turn off quicklaunch bar" as that is an instance of IE. I know this because when one of our PC's got infected by an IE Browser Helper Object (aka adware that popped up ads every five minutes). The thing kept popping up even though we did all you suggested. Turned out quicklaunch was running an instance of IE and the BHO as well!
Yeah because Microsoft really needs advertising... if only they could get their product out there, if only people knew about windows....
They seem to think they do - read any IT publications/websites without M$ adverts recently? In the UK they have been running a series of ads telling us how great Windows is because of all the software you can run on it. Of course they forget to mention that you have to pay for most of that software.
And the first thing consumers will ask is... How do I install Media Player and IM?
I doubt they'll ask for a specific app - they'll more likely ask - "how do I play my music files and do that contacting people instantly thingy?" at which point their helpful techie/support person will tell them how to download and install one (of a range) or how to install one of the bundled (but NOT installed) ones.
make MS include optional software, perhaps on a second disk, with more important things like Firefox being the default browser on an out of the box install. CD 2 could have things like OpenOffice, or Free instant messengers.
On a second disc? Most people I know don't even get one! OEM installs with install CD's (NOT recovery cd's) are a rare thing these days.
The real problem here is because almost all PC's come with Windows pre-installed. So if you buy a Windows box set then fine you get all the other stuff as part of the bundle you chose to buy. But when you buy a PC and it comes with Windows pre-installed then you should be given a choice which other apps you want to use - if any. M$ doesn't allow OEM's a lot of leaway when it comes to choice of apps to supply with their Windows installs.
Here's what OEM's should be allowed to do - when you run the OEM welcome wizard (you know the bit that asks you what your name is) it should ask you what choice of browser, media player and e-mail client you want. The exact choice could be determined by OEM's and there's no reason why the M$ apps couldn't be default options. That way at least people can say "no" without having to jump through loads of hoops to uninstall the things you didn't want in the first place.
It's OEM machines that have bundled software which is impossible to get rid of that annoy me - be they Windows with IE/WMP/OE, anti-virus try-outs or pre-installed ISP connections.
[slightly OT] I bought a couple of NEC PC's recently that came with Norton AV installed by default. I didn't want Norton as we have a multi-licence for something else. But these copies of Norton had no remove app at all. They were not listed under add/remove programs, they had no uninstall program or link (regardless of who was logged in). Eventually I had to download another remove program from Symantec just to get rid of Norton AV. Of course while I did all this I had to keep closing Norton's reminders which were helpfully telling me my virus database was out of date and thus I was forced to connect a Windows machine to the web withot an up to date virus scanner!!! After getting rid of that - installing Firefox and hiding IE from the user was a doddle! [/slightly OT]
Man, if I had the mod points I'd throw them your way! This is exactly what I have been wondering for years now. I don't get why M$ has been the focus of so many nutty rulings and lawsuits when countless other companies do the same thing everyday without the slightest peep from "Joe average citizen."
"Countless other companies"? - care to name some? I can't think of anyone doing it to this extent because I can't think of anyone with the same opportunities and market share (in whatever industry). A person may choose to buy a Sony DVD Player (maybe not after recent events) but that doesn't mean they *have* to buy only Columbia/Tri-Star movies to watch on it.
As it happens - Joe Average Citizen (by which I take it you mean the average PC user) doesn't seem to complain much about Microsoft's tactics either - it's generally M$' competitors/enemies who do that - but isn't that the point of the rulings?
The average windows user doesn't complain because they're not usually aware that alternatives even exist. To them: Windows == the computer, WMP == how I play music, IE == how I browse the web with no choice involved at all. This is largely due to M$' marketing and deployment strategies. Now, those applications may well eventually become the choices the average user would make but the rulings are generally made to give them that choice in the first place. That is to encourage competition and thus innovation - that's the reason they give anyway.
That's why I'm a cat person. Kitty goes out, Kitty comes back in. She ain't dumb, she knows where her food dish is.
Their food bowl is not always where we think it is. My sister had a cat who often disappeared for days. Eventually they found out he was getting fresh fish from a lady down the road who "thought he was a stray" (somehow overlooking the yellow collar with his name on).
The GPS side may work well for cats - if they could make 'em smaller. Cats are more prone to disappearing than dogs IMHO - especially when they sense a trip to the vet approaching.
The key word here is "supported", you can't expect Redhat, Novell or even Microsoft to support your modifications.
If you don't want official support from any vendor, you modify away - and support it yourself.
Exactly - the Microsoft guy's statements are ( clever ) FUD. It's talks about OSS but it's really about support contracts not OSS. If you want to use OSS and modify it you can but if you want it - or anything - supported then mucking around with it is not usually in the terms of the support contract. In general support contracts are not open - but then they're not supposed to be.
It's like the warranty stickers on certain hardware. Break that sticker (i.e. make your own mods) and you're no longer covered by the warranty if it goes wrong. So it is with software support contracts.
IME Support contracts are generally the same regardless of the software licence.
We have to keep writing though because if we don't they'll take the "nobody uses it" approach. At the moment they may think that but after they get enough messages they'll have to change or lose custom. Which do you think'll want to do?
As an aside - following yesterday's post about Windows Live - I went to http://www.live.com/ and (using BugMeNot) logged in. At the top was a message saying "Firefox users: Firefox support coming soon - please be patienet:-)". Interesting that M$ are now acknowledging that at least some of their users prefer to use alternative browsers.
Man am I getting pissed at the little fucker popping up every time I visit a site with Flash on it. Don't the devs get it ? There's no way am on earth I'm installing Flash coz I don't want no Flashvertising.
I somewhat disagree with the knowledge of the ending ruining the film experience. Most everyone knew the ending to Apollo 13, but that was still a great movie. I remember watching it in the theater thinking, "Maybe I'm wrong; maybe they did die in space." To me, that's good film making. I'm not saying that the prequels are the best movies ever made, but to me, they were fun rides. Sith did a fine job keeping me entertained, and I never felt that I was just waiting to get to the end so I could see Darth Vader being built.
I get the point about the new fans and I know that in reality they were a major reason behind this venture. I was just saying why I felt *I* didn't enjoy the new films as much. YEMV.
With regard to knowledge ruining the film - certainly I have seen lots of films where - possibly by previously reading the book - I knew the storyline and it didn't ruin my experience of the film (LoTR and the Bourne* films spring to mind).
But this wasn't a case where I had read a book or it was based on some historical fact - that is the whole plotline was laid out. This was an overall storyline which was already mapped out. Anakin Skywalker becomes Jedi Knight, betrays Jedi and become Darth Vader. There's a lot of scope in there for how that storyline takes place and whereas in most cases that sort of scope means I often enjoy seeing how the director interprets the story comapred to my view in this case I didn't. What I was saying was that for me I think it was this pre-conpecption that spoiled the films rather than bad film-making or a weak character per se. My point being that perhaps not everyone who did not enjoy the later trilogy did so because of the standard reasons often given.
As it happens - as films in their own right - I felt the new trilogy are okay. It's just that ( again for me ) they had a lot to live up to and they didn't do it. That doesn't mean I'm going to deny they are part of Star Wars but it might mean I won't rush out to buy the DVD's. I'll probably wait until they drop in price after Christmas.:o)
----- * Saying that the (new) Bourne films bear virtually no resemblance to the books other than character names and thus can be enjoyed without any reference to book plotlines.:o)
That's true, but people wouldn't go to see these movies unless they liked them in some way. People like to tell themselves they don't like them because they're so kitch, but then they go to see them anyway.
A little paradoxical don't you think? How can you go and see a film because you like it when you haven't seen it yet?
I - like many others I suspect - went to see Phantom Menace on the basis that it was the frst new Star Wars film for a couple of decades. I went to see Attack of the Clones in the hope that it would be better than Phantom - it was but not much. I went to see Revenge of the Sith because I had seen all the others at the cinema and wanted to catch this one on the big screen too.
I think I didn't like them - compared with the original trilogy - because I knew the ending and the whole thing felt like they were shoe horning a story I basically already knew into three long films. The sense of mystery - in not knowing where the story was going - was lost in these films compared with the original one.
As for the trilogy being a cash machine/cow. It is but then it was always going to be and in the end I think we kidded ourselves if - at this stage - we thought it would be a lot more than that.
Newsprint doesn't contain as much tree as it used to.
In the UK at least newspaper publishers are required by law to ensure that their newsprint in made of a minimum of 65% recycled fibre - this goes up to 70% on 1 Jan 2006.
Why not? If it's legal for them to send unsolicited junk to us, it should be legal for us to send unsolicited junk to them. As already mentioned, this is pretty much the only way we will ever end SPAM. Laws against it are pathetically difficult to enforce.
As already mentioned several times, spammers frequently (always?) spoof the reply to and from headers. How exactly do you propose to spam the actual sender (the spammer) and not just the poor sod whose e-mail address they have spoofed in the reply to?
Slashdot Mirror
Or the look on the dog's face as you plugged the power lead into the only available socket.
You don't have to endure the sales calls I get.
Then again, now that you've published your mobile number...
Without having to install.
http://www.opensourcecms.com/
Surprised nobody has mentioned that site yet. You get to try them as demos which are reset every two hours or so.
agree with you so far
Yep - agree here too.
Now this is where I disagree. You made good arguments that the reason Vista won't fail is because the PC builders will all pre-install it and then ignored that fact when making your closing statement.
What will break the cycle is when people can walk into/browse the website of a PC vendor and purchase a PC with whatever OS they want on it. As long as the vendors/manufacturers are locked into agreements with MS then the average PC buyer has no choice and the dominance of MS on the desktop continues. Many PC users are too lazy to install a new browser or patch their existing OS let alone install a whole new OS. Until they can buy a PC without Windows installed they simply won't bother to change. Trouble is few manufacturers are prepared to take the risk (to their profit margin) of challenging their MS agreement and we end up in a cause-effect loop.
That's Access' real value: the ability to make point-and-click interfaces without actually having to know how to program
:o)
;o) ).
I can think of a few people (me included) who would say this was Access' real problem not its value
Anyway for those who like to produce forms etc. via point and click there's always things like OOo 2, kexi and knoda. Not that I've used any of them with a vengeance but they seem to do the job (maybe not Access' job but *that* may not be such a bad thing
maybe the few that did *thoguth* it was bad
:o)
maybe they could spell too - sorry about that!
How's 'bout the possibility that most people just didn't think it was very good?
erm...surely by "flopped" they mean "didn't do well at the box office", so how exactly did people think it wasn't very good without seeing it? Perhaps they didn't go to see it because of bad reviews, maybe the few that did thoguth it was bad and *everybody else* belived them, but I don't think we can ssume that people didn't watch something (the first time) because they didn't like it - can we?
Unless they end up using MS Office 12 which will do away (screenshot) with typical menus like edit, view etc. Hopefully the keyboard shortcuts will still work because that's what I mostly use.
I'll agree it's not intuitive it took me six months of using it before I worked out how to draw a circle/rectangle. That said this is the way I do it..
Select a rectangle/circle with the select tool. Choose Stroke Path from the Edit menu. Set your brush (if required). Click OK.
Shock! Horror! Exchange of money for goods and services!
What is the world coming to.
I wasn't complaining that you have to pay for the software I was complaining that the Microsoft advertising campaign implies that as long as you have Windows you can do all the media production stuff they speak of. The only concession they make is saying "There's a world of software running on Windows..." nowehre do they mention that additional (and often expensive) outlay is required.
They're not the only ones and it drives me mad. I lose track of how many times I have to explain to people that merely having a Centrino chipset does not mean you can use wifi broadband on the beach!
"hear" is that I meant.
"what" is what you meant as well
Okay so go do that and then go to the Windows or Office update site with your other browser?
You'd also think that your suggestion means you'll be no longer be using IE but try printing an HTML e-mail from Outlook or OE without IE. I had a user who changed their IE print margins, went to print an HTML message and found half the text was off the page because the margin was too small for Outlook!
Plus you forgot to add "turn off quicklaunch bar" as that is an instance of IE. I know this because when one of our PC's got infected by an IE Browser Helper Object (aka adware that popped up ads every five minutes). The thing kept popping up even though we did all you suggested. Turned out quicklaunch was running an instance of IE and the BHO as well!
They seem to think they do - read any IT publications/websites without M$ adverts recently?
In the UK they have been running a series of ads telling us how great Windows is because of all the software you can run on it. Of course they forget to mention that you have to pay for most of that software.
I doubt they'll ask for a specific app - they'll more likely ask - "how do I play my music files and do that contacting people instantly thingy?" at which point their helpful techie/support person will tell them how to download and install one (of a range) or how to install one of the bundled (but NOT installed) ones.
On a second disc? Most people I know don't even get one! OEM installs with install CD's (NOT recovery cd's) are a rare thing these days.
The real problem here is because almost all PC's come with Windows pre-installed. So if you buy a Windows box set then fine you get all the other stuff as part of the bundle you chose to buy. But when you buy a PC and it comes with Windows pre-installed then you should be given a choice which other apps you want to use - if any. M$ doesn't allow OEM's a lot of leaway when it comes to choice of apps to supply with their Windows installs.
Here's what OEM's should be allowed to do - when you run the OEM welcome wizard (you know the bit that asks you what your name is) it should ask you what choice of browser, media player and e-mail client you want. The exact choice could be determined by OEM's and there's no reason why the M$ apps couldn't be default options. That way at least people can say "no" without having to jump through loads of hoops to uninstall the things you didn't want in the first place.
It's OEM machines that have bundled software which is impossible to get rid of that annoy me - be they Windows with IE/WMP/OE, anti-virus try-outs or pre-installed ISP connections.
[slightly OT]
I bought a couple of NEC PC's recently that came with Norton AV installed by default. I didn't want Norton as we have a multi-licence for something else. But these copies of Norton had no remove app at all. They were not listed under add/remove programs, they had no uninstall program or link (regardless of who was logged in). Eventually I had to download another remove program from Symantec just to get rid of Norton AV. Of course while I did all this I had to keep closing Norton's reminders which were helpfully telling me my virus database was out of date and thus I was forced to connect a Windows machine to the web withot an up to date virus scanner!!!
After getting rid of that - installing Firefox and hiding IE from the user was a doddle!
[/slightly OT]
Man, if I had the mod points I'd throw them your way! This is exactly what I have been wondering for years now. I don't get why M$ has been the focus of so many nutty rulings and lawsuits when countless other companies do the same thing everyday without the slightest peep from "Joe average citizen."
"Countless other companies"? - care to name some? I can't think of anyone doing it to this extent because I can't think of anyone with the same opportunities and market share (in whatever industry). A person may choose to buy a Sony DVD Player (maybe not after recent events) but that doesn't mean they *have* to buy only Columbia/Tri-Star movies to watch on it.
As it happens - Joe Average Citizen (by which I take it you mean the average PC user) doesn't seem to complain much about Microsoft's tactics either - it's generally M$' competitors/enemies who do that - but isn't that the point of the rulings?
The average windows user doesn't complain because they're not usually aware that alternatives even exist. To them: Windows == the computer, WMP == how I play music, IE == how I browse the web with no choice involved at all. This is largely due to M$' marketing and deployment strategies.
Now, those applications may well eventually become the choices the average user would make but the rulings are generally made to give them that choice in the first place. That is to encourage competition and thus innovation - that's the reason they give anyway.
Wow...considering the fact that most dogs have attention spans even lower than ...
Sorry I tuned out for a moment there - what were you saying?
Their food bowl is not always where we think it is. My sister had a cat who often disappeared for days. Eventually they found out he was getting fresh fish from a lady down the road who "thought he was a stray" (somehow overlooking the yellow collar with his name on).
The GPS side may work well for cats - if they could make 'em smaller. Cats are more prone to disappearing than dogs IMHO - especially when they sense a trip to the vet approaching.
Exactly - the Microsoft guy's statements are ( clever ) FUD. It's talks about OSS but it's really about support contracts not OSS. If you want to use OSS and modify it you can but if you want it - or anything - supported then mucking around with it is not usually in the terms of the support contract. In general support contracts are not open - but then they're not supposed to be.
It's like the warranty stickers on certain hardware. Break that sticker (i.e. make your own mods) and you're no longer covered by the warranty if it goes wrong. So it is with software support contracts.
IME Support contracts are generally the same regardless of the software licence.
We have to keep writing though because if we don't they'll take the "nobody uses it" approach. At the moment they may think that but after they get enough messages they'll have to change or lose custom. Which do you think'll want to do?
As an aside - following yesterday's post about Windows Live - I went to http://www.live.com/ and (using BugMeNot) logged in. At the top was a message saying "Firefox users: Firefox support coming soon - please be patienet
Couldn't you just Adblock the swf files or install Flashblock?
I get the point about the new fans and I know that in reality they were a major reason behind this venture. I was just saying why I felt *I* didn't enjoy the new films as much. YEMV.
With regard to knowledge ruining the film - certainly I have seen lots of films where - possibly by previously reading the book - I knew the storyline and it didn't ruin my experience of the film (LoTR and the Bourne* films spring to mind).
But this wasn't a case where I had read a book or it was based on some historical fact - that is the whole plotline was laid out. This was an overall storyline which was already mapped out. Anakin Skywalker becomes Jedi Knight, betrays Jedi and become Darth Vader. There's a lot of scope in there for how that storyline takes place and whereas in most cases that sort of scope means I often enjoy seeing how the director interprets the story comapred to my view in this case I didn't. What I was saying was that for me I think it was this pre-conpecption that spoiled the films rather than bad film-making or a weak character per se. My point being that perhaps not everyone who did not enjoy the later trilogy did so because of the standard reasons often given.
As it happens - as films in their own right - I felt the new trilogy are okay. It's just that ( again for me ) they had a lot to live up to and they didn't do it. That doesn't mean I'm going to deny they are part of Star Wars but it might mean I won't rush out to buy the DVD's. I'll probably wait until they drop in price after Christmas.
-----
* Saying that the (new) Bourne films bear virtually no resemblance to the books other than character names and thus can be enjoyed without any reference to book plotlines.
A little paradoxical don't you think? How can you go and see a film because you like it when you haven't seen it yet?
I - like many others I suspect - went to see Phantom Menace on the basis that it was the frst new Star Wars film for a couple of decades. I went to see Attack of the Clones in the hope that it would be better than Phantom - it was but not much. I went to see Revenge of the Sith because I had seen all the others at the cinema and wanted to catch this one on the big screen too.
I think I didn't like them - compared with the original trilogy - because I knew the ending and the whole thing felt like they were shoe horning a story I basically already knew into three long films. The sense of mystery - in not knowing where the story was going - was lost in these films compared with the original one.
As for the trilogy being a cash machine/cow. It is but then it was always going to be and in the end I think we kidded ourselves if - at this stage - we thought it would be a lot more than that.
As already mentioned several times, spammers frequently (always?) spoof the reply to and from headers.
How exactly do you propose to spam the actual sender (the spammer) and not just the poor sod whose e-mail address they have spoofed in the reply to?