"What's the average sentances for perjury?" I believe it's around the 4-5 year mark if it's a big enough deal.
"why is pejury still a crime?" Perjury is still a crime b/c in the courts we are not supposed to lie under oath. Hell, in life we're morally not *supposed* to lie. At least in my books. Even those acceptable white lies to spare people's feelings are not justified morally. Which is my point. Not on a legal level or anything like that. The whole "law for all or for none" is a legality issue and not a moral and ethical one.
The issue I raised was that just b/c someone got away with it, either slipping through or being convicted and not sentenced, does not make it morally or ethically right for others to break that same rule.
I don't care who has gotten away with it and how "important" of a figure they were. That still doesn't justify others doing it.
Sure but if someone slips through the cracks, should we then all be able to justify those same actions? Doesn't make sense to me. If it was wrong before, someone getting away with it then makes it right? That's pretty specious reasoning.
Way to keep your morals and ethics alive. The ol' "well they do it so I can" argument seems pretty flawed to me. If one person gets away with murder, does that mean we all are able to murder? If one person sues for spilling hot coffee on herself, are we all allowed to do it? If someone embezzles and gets away with it, are we all allowed to do it?
See where I'm going with this? Maybe not b/c you're too busy "sailing the seven seas as a pirate" and basking in your self-righteous justification.
Re:Setting up an MP3 Server is a bad idea.
on
Control-Alt-Recycle
·
· Score: 1
Not only that but that idea really only works once or twice. Next thing you know you'll have a stack of old computers that you "use" in your house b/c you were too scared of throwing them away.
On top of donating to a recycling center, wipe that hard drive clean and donate it to your nearest school or youth group center. They can always use a new machine. Hell, give it to the kid down the street or across the hall to get them started with computer.
The best part of that is then it's another person's problem now if they want to get rid of it;)
Holy crapoly. Insightful? Mods sniffing glue again or what? It's funny. Laugh. Don't take it as a life altering statement. "Dude, that idea is so...what's the word....oh sweet there it is in the dropdown man....in..sight..ful. Sweet man. *sniiiiffff*"
1. Bad burns. Who do you go to if you get a bad copy? Can you get a refund?
Of course they'll offer a refund. Odds are they'll be checking the disk before spitting it out to ensure it's at least readable or even verify the whole thing.
2. Who maintains the file server that the vending machine uses. I am sure a rouge CompUSA employee could easily throw a virus or two on the ISOs.
This is a possibility I guess. Odds are they've thought of it but whether they've taken steps to prevent it...
3. How do you get the CD key?
Printed on a CD jewel case cover maybe.
4. Who wants to stand there and wait for a CD to burn?
The whole 2 minutes? There are like 52x burners out there last I checked. Maybe even faster. My 24x burns a full cd in like 5 minutes. So you figure out what you want, start a burn, browse the store a bit more, come back and there you go. Or you stand there and look at the shiny dials and lights.
5. I hope they use a damn good burner, most will wear out rather quickly.
They're probably using a Cicero...ok I mean, yes the burners could wear out. I'm sure they are prepared for that scenario.
So Konqueror can use one tactic to try and better integrate and gain inroads, but if a monopoly makes the same solution to try and protect their position...it's illegal? Better they should allow the little guy in to take over their business?
"What is illegal, however, is leveraging monopoly power in one market to succeed in another"
Seems to me that's somewhat subjective to determine what "leveraging monopoly power" is. So if I try to use my already exisiting strengths to my advantage including brand name recognition and UI branding, that's a bad thing? Basically, any company that is a monopoly has no shot at getting in to another market b/c people will find a way to claim they are leveraging their power. Unless of course people don't dislike said company. Then it's all well and good for them to give it a go.
"Internet Explorer, in this scenario, succeeds not because it's an superior product to Netscape Navigator,"
Are you sure about that? Maybe subsitute Mozilla for Netscape:)
"they're using success in one sphere (the OS) to crowd out the competition in another (the web browser)"
To me, it seems they're using success in one sphere to try and attain success in another sphere. Also, Gates has always talked about the browser and OS becoming one and it seems to be a genuine idea of his rather than some spin to justify integrate IE so tightly. He gains nothing by people using IE over Mozilla that I can see.
In regards to the last paragraph, you imply that if you're small, you can hit as many people as hard as you like. But if you're big, you need to be careful to avoid hitting anybody. That's exactly my issue with this whole idea. Yes, I do see the idea of capitalism and free markets and playing nice. I do agree with those. I'm not defending all of Microsoft's moves they've made. I just have issues when people say IE shell integration is anti-competitive. Or that having Media Player in the OS by default is anti-competitive. Restricting vendors from installing other media players, yes. Saying they can't include one of their products in another of their products is ridiculous. As long as they allow for the choice, I see no problems with the actions taken by a "monopoly".
I don't know if you actually answered his question. He asked what the difference was and you went off on monopolies. Why does a monopoly make what Microsoft did any different from what Konquerer does? Do you know what it is? Nothing. It's the same functionality (in the big picture). Why is the guy who hasn't been a success allowed to use this tactic whereas the guy who has made it big isn't allowed? "B/c they're a monopoly". That just seems like flawed logic to me. If you want competition and everything on an equal playing field then everyone should also be treated equally in determining good business practices or "illegal" ones. It stinks of hypocricy.
This is not insightful. It's a regurgitation of a saying that is said every damn time MS either bashes or, in this case, embraces, open source.
At best it can be modded Underrated. But insightful? Come on. Do we need to see the same damn posts modded up over and over again? Go mod up an original comment as insightful. Whether it's right in your eyes or not.
A cup of brewed coffee can have over 100mg of caffeine by itself and most caffeine pills right now are 100-200 mg of caffeine. So 500 would be like downing 5 cups of strong coffee or a few regular pills at once. I'm sure it would still get your heart racing but 25 cups of coffee it is not.
Not that I entirely agree with him (and not that I don't;)) but his math is just fine . 100% are biased in some direction, 50% don't admit it. Works by my account.
"I say it isn't immoral. That's all the authority I need. Don't know about you."
I'm probably going to need more than your word;) Maybe it's me but that seems a bit like a self-serving statement. If you were to decide that screwing over someone for monetary gain was completely moral, should that make it so? Shouldn't all humankind have a bit of a say in the morality issue? Of course, it can be partitioned off a bit farther where individual societies have different ideas of immoral and the likes but that's for another day I guess.
"Rights don't need to be justified. They simply exist."
How do they exist? What makes them so? Where are they set out as a right? And yes, one person's "right" might harm another person. That should open up the question of whether that right is proper or not. I'm not saying that no rights exist, I'm questioning how we (we as a very broad term) decide what is a right and what isn't. I suppose you might say that you do:)
"It's both sophistic and sophomoric to argue by fabricated analogies that are designed to lead the other side away from the thrust of the issue"
I wasn't using an analogy to lead away from the issue. I was moreso using it to further the discussion on it. Don't assume that all analogies are improper. Moreso, I don't find that it was sophistic in any way or sophomoric at all. It's not like this is the first time I've opened my mouth in a discussion. Discussions present points that can get refuted or agreed or even broken down further. To simply dismiss something so quickly might seem to imply a sophmoric attitude towards discussion. I, however, have not made that assumption about you.
"It's also common among people who are ashamed to be human."
Damn, that's a strange conclusion to come too:S
And try not to assume that I believe in everything I'm saying here. That's what makes discussing things interesting. You don't have to believe in what you say but by arguing for what you don't agree in, you may see the other side in a new light.
Who's to say it isn't immoral? And who's to say we're better off with exploring and changing everything? And who's to say the life of a scavenger was any worse than the life we lead now?
And who's to say we have any "right" to do any of this? Who says we're not just guests here (earth and otherwise) and have no specific rights at all other than to enjoy what we were given? You don't just go into a hotel and start opening every door and examining under the floorboards claiming you have a right to do so?
Rights are a tricky thing. It's easy to proclaim "I have a right to ". It's not as easy to question whether it's a justified right and whether taking advantage of this right will have any benefit in the end. Maybe the only way to find that out is to use the right. Knowledge is tricky business:)
Re:Utter Nonsense
on
Melting Europa
·
· Score: 0, Flamebait
Whoa, who crammed a 40' stick 50' up your ass? The CEO of one of, maybe the, biggest PC distributors steps down as CEO and you don't think it's important? Maybe you like all the SCO stories or the stories from a post by Linus on some mailing list but I think some other stuff thrown in between those "riveting" stories is nice.
"In particular parts, I had to wonder whether the writer even speaks English as his first language
(words were consistantly mispelled through out the memo, for example, brought was spelled "brough")"
You mean words like implicications, impliciations, anti-competive, rackateering, asualt, adimately, consistantly, mispelled, through out, with out, deteremined and legite? Let's not get into the grammar. Were those all meant as jokes or what?
"If I had come across something like this, then I would have cleaned it up."
Then you would have been distorting the original message which could be considered...fraud. Geez, maybe even collusion to make MS (-- note the S not $. That is so 1990) look bad b/c as it stands now, this document looks very dodgy in terms of authenticity.
For your first point, I don't think that's really a big problem. First, when I was a minor, very seldom did we buy our own beer. We got someone legal to buy it for us. If I ever did buy beer as a minor, I sure wouldn't use a credit card, it was straight up cash. If the distributors are knowingly selling to minors, then all they have to do is to start a cash-only policy to sell to said minors.
2) Truer words could probably not be spoken. (Though I'm in Canada and we're not terribly sue-happy...yet)
Isn't that what people mean when they say "Linux and Mac don't have as many viruses b/c not as many people are trying"? And isn't that usually disregarded as nonsense? It is a Tuesday though so maybe it's different today. It's so hard to remember anymore.
Slashdot Mirror
"can't think of something that begins with z"
;)
zima. what? it's kind of close to being a good drink?
Why would you do that to your grandmother you sick sick bastard!
;)
:)
Not the windows install but the not properly setting it up up part to allow all of that to happen
But kudos on a fairly funny post
"What's the average sentances for perjury?"
I believe it's around the 4-5 year mark if it's a big enough deal.
"why is pejury still a crime?"
Perjury is still a crime b/c in the courts we are not supposed to lie under oath. Hell, in life we're morally not *supposed* to lie. At least in my books. Even those acceptable white lies to spare people's feelings are not justified morally. Which is my point. Not on a legal level or anything like that. The whole "law for all or for none" is a legality issue and not a moral and ethical one.
The issue I raised was that just b/c someone got away with it, either slipping through or being convicted and not sentenced, does not make it morally or ethically right for others to break that same rule.
I don't care who has gotten away with it and how "important" of a figure they were. That still doesn't justify others doing it.
Sure but if someone slips through the cracks, should we then all be able to justify those same actions? Doesn't make sense to me. If it was wrong before, someone getting away with it then makes it right? That's pretty specious reasoning.
Way to keep your morals and ethics alive. The ol' "well they do it so I can" argument seems pretty flawed to me. If one person gets away with murder, does that mean we all are able to murder? If one person sues for spilling hot coffee on herself, are we all allowed to do it? If someone embezzles and gets away with it, are we all allowed to do it?
See where I'm going with this? Maybe not b/c you're too busy "sailing the seven seas as a pirate" and basking in your self-righteous justification.
Not only that but that idea really only works once or twice. Next thing you know you'll have a stack of old computers that you "use" in your house b/c you were too scared of throwing them away.
;)
On top of donating to a recycling center, wipe that hard drive clean and donate it to your nearest school or youth group center. They can always use a new machine. Hell, give it to the kid down the street or across the hall to get them started with computer.
The best part of that is then it's another person's problem now if they want to get rid of it
Worst...idea...ever
Holy crapoly. Insightful? Mods sniffing glue again or what? It's funny. Laugh. Don't take it as a life altering statement. "Dude, that idea is so...what's the word....oh sweet there it is in the dropdown man....in..sight..ful. Sweet man. *sniiiiffff*"
1. Bad burns. Who do you go to if you get a bad copy? Can you get a refund?
Of course they'll offer a refund. Odds are they'll be checking the disk before spitting it out to ensure it's at least readable or even verify the whole thing.
2. Who maintains the file server that the vending machine uses. I am sure a rouge CompUSA employee could easily throw a virus or two on the ISOs.
This is a possibility I guess. Odds are they've thought of it but whether they've taken steps to prevent it...
3. How do you get the CD key?
Printed on a CD jewel case cover maybe.
4. Who wants to stand there and wait for a CD to burn?
The whole 2 minutes? There are like 52x burners out there last I checked. Maybe even faster. My 24x burns a full cd in like 5 minutes. So you figure out what you want, start a burn, browse the store a bit more, come back and there you go. Or you stand there and look at the shiny dials and lights.
5. I hope they use a damn good burner, most will wear out rather quickly.
They're probably using a Cicero...ok I mean, yes the burners could wear out. I'm sure they are prepared for that scenario.
"Legally, they have to play by different rules."
:)
So Konqueror can use one tactic to try and better integrate and gain inroads, but if a monopoly makes the same solution to try and protect their position...it's illegal? Better they should allow the little guy in to take over their business?
"What is illegal, however, is leveraging monopoly power in one market to succeed in another"
Seems to me that's somewhat subjective to determine what "leveraging monopoly power" is. So if I try to use my already exisiting strengths to my advantage including brand name recognition and UI branding, that's a bad thing? Basically, any company that is a monopoly has no shot at getting in to another market b/c people will find a way to claim they are leveraging their power. Unless of course people don't dislike said company. Then it's all well and good for them to give it a go.
"Internet Explorer, in this scenario, succeeds not because it's an superior product to Netscape Navigator,"
Are you sure about that? Maybe subsitute Mozilla for Netscape
"they're using success in one sphere (the OS) to crowd out the competition in another (the web browser)"
To me, it seems they're using success in one sphere to try and attain success in another sphere. Also, Gates has always talked about the browser and OS becoming one and it seems to be a genuine idea of his rather than some spin to justify integrate IE so tightly. He gains nothing by people using IE over Mozilla that I can see.
In regards to the last paragraph, you imply that if you're small, you can hit as many people as hard as you like. But if you're big, you need to be careful to avoid hitting anybody. That's exactly my issue with this whole idea. Yes, I do see the idea of capitalism and free markets and playing nice. I do agree with those. I'm not defending all of Microsoft's moves they've made. I just have issues when people say IE shell integration is anti-competitive. Or that having Media Player in the OS by default is anti-competitive. Restricting vendors from installing other media players, yes. Saying they can't include one of their products in another of their products is ridiculous. As long as they allow for the choice, I see no problems with the actions taken by a "monopoly".
Probably
I don't know if you actually answered his question. He asked what the difference was and you went off on monopolies. Why does a monopoly make what Microsoft did any different from what Konquerer does? Do you know what it is? Nothing. It's the same functionality (in the big picture). Why is the guy who hasn't been a success allowed to use this tactic whereas the guy who has made it big isn't allowed? "B/c they're a monopoly". That just seems like flawed logic to me. If you want competition and everything on an equal playing field then everyone should also be treated equally in determining good business practices or "illegal" ones. It stinks of hypocricy.
This is not insightful. It's a regurgitation of a saying that is said every damn time MS either bashes or, in this case, embraces, open source.
At best it can be modded Underrated. But insightful? Come on. Do we need to see the same damn posts modded up over and over again? Go mod up an original comment as insightful. Whether it's right in your eyes or not.
A cup of brewed coffee can have over 100mg of caffeine by itself and most caffeine pills right now are 100-200 mg of caffeine. So 500 would be like downing 5 cups of strong coffee or a few regular pills at once. I'm sure it would still get your heart racing but 25 cups of coffee it is not.
http://www.cspinet.org/new/cafchart.htm
Not that I entirely agree with him (and not that I don't ;)) but his math is just fine . 100% are biased in some direction, 50% don't admit it. Works by my account.
"I say it isn't immoral. That's all the authority I need. Don't know about you."
;) Maybe it's me but that seems a bit like a self-serving statement. If you were to decide that screwing over someone for monetary gain was completely moral, should that make it so? Shouldn't all humankind have a bit of a say in the morality issue? Of course, it can be partitioned off a bit farther where individual societies have different ideas of immoral and the likes but that's for another day I guess.
:)
:S
I'm probably going to need more than your word
"Rights don't need to be justified. They simply exist."
How do they exist? What makes them so? Where are they set out as a right? And yes, one person's "right" might harm another person. That should open up the question of whether that right is proper or not. I'm not saying that no rights exist, I'm questioning how we (we as a very broad term) decide what is a right and what isn't. I suppose you might say that you do
"It's both sophistic and sophomoric to argue by fabricated analogies that are designed to lead the other side away from the thrust of the issue"
I wasn't using an analogy to lead away from the issue. I was moreso using it to further the discussion on it. Don't assume that all analogies are improper. Moreso, I don't find that it was sophistic in any way or sophomoric at all. It's not like this is the first time I've opened my mouth in a discussion. Discussions present points that can get refuted or agreed or even broken down further. To simply dismiss something so quickly might seem to imply a sophmoric attitude towards discussion. I, however, have not made that assumption about you.
"It's also common among people who are ashamed to be human."
Damn, that's a strange conclusion to come too
And try not to assume that I believe in everything I'm saying here. That's what makes discussing things interesting. You don't have to believe in what you say but by arguing for what you don't agree in, you may see the other side in a new light.
Who's to say it isn't immoral? And who's to say we're better off with exploring and changing everything? And who's to say the life of a scavenger was any worse than the life we lead now?
:)
And who's to say we have any "right" to do any of this? Who says we're not just guests here (earth and otherwise) and have no specific rights at all other than to enjoy what we were given? You don't just go into a hotel and start opening every door and examining under the floorboards claiming you have a right to do so?
Rights are a tricky thing. It's easy to proclaim "I have a right to ". It's not as easy to question whether it's a justified right and whether taking advantage of this right will have any benefit in the end. Maybe the only way to find that out is to use the right. Knowledge is tricky business
I'll bet you're an american.
:)
Ok, relax it's just a joke..sort of
" and people tend to respect us as sources of information"
What people would those be?
It's a manziere I tell ya!
Whoa, who crammed a 40' stick 50' up your ass? The CEO of one of, maybe the, biggest PC distributors steps down as CEO and you don't think it's important? Maybe you like all the SCO stories or the stories from a post by Linus on some mailing list but I think some other stuff thrown in between those "riveting" stories is nice.
"In particular parts, I had to wonder whether the writer even speaks English as his first language
(words were consistantly mispelled through out the memo, for example, brought was spelled "brough")"
You mean words like implicications, impliciations, anti-competive, rackateering, asualt, adimately, consistantly, mispelled, through out, with out, deteremined and legite? Let's not get into the grammar. Were those all meant as jokes or what?
"If I had come across something like this, then I would have cleaned it up."
Then you would have been distorting the original message which could be considered...fraud. Geez, maybe even collusion to make MS (-- note the S not $. That is so 1990) look bad b/c as it stands now, this document looks very dodgy in terms of authenticity.
For your first point, I don't think that's really a big problem. First, when I was a minor, very seldom did we buy our own beer. We got someone legal to buy it for us. If I ever did buy beer as a minor, I sure wouldn't use a credit card, it was straight up cash. If the distributors are knowingly selling to minors, then all they have to do is to start a cash-only policy to sell to said minors.
2) Truer words could probably not be spoken. (Though I'm in Canada and we're not terribly sue-happy...yet)
Isn't that what people mean when they say "Linux and Mac don't have as many viruses b/c not as many people are trying"? And isn't that usually disregarded as nonsense? It is a Tuesday though so maybe it's different today. It's so hard to remember anymore.
That's their motto. "News for Nerds. Stuff that mattered." ;)