Hey - I've been playing on B-net as rapingnewborns since the days of starcraft.
My account hasn't been questioned or closed.
The name isn't a hobby (as I quote online) - it goes back to the day of vs newbs games. Those games usually had some hardcore players who just wanted to have an easy game. Well, I'd join in those games to beat or rape the newb killers.
Wow. I can see the interest in this, but it's been there all along. There's the X-Terminals which run off the network. All they have is some memory and a NIC. Pump out a login window to the unix farm and you're set.
Interestingly they had this at UD and I recall that at one point there was a fun exploit that let a hacker take over an x-terminal. My only concern would be that the same type of exploit would be doable with a linux boot.
Ahhh, the memories of UD's network. I graduated from there in '99 and if it wasn't for the network there, I don't think I'd ever have gotten broadband or decided to work in the networking field.
Right now I'm at the University of Pittsburgh, which is supposedly a "sister" school - I can say that the network here bites compared to UD's back then.
Ok, I might not be the best writer in the world - I might not even be in the top 1/2. If you're writing for a magazine, I would hope you have better transition paragraphs than those I wrote in high school papers.
If I am going to read your magazine (re: infotainment) I would hope that I would have an entertaining read while I drew out information.
I remember those days, back before Napster. We had Network Neighborhood and Ethernet connections to the dorm. Edit your lmhosts file and you could see any computer on the campus if you wanted to. No need for Napster. In some ways I miss it, you'd just see a new computer and open it and wade through all the crap someone would share. It was a simple time, a fun time. We didn't need to actually copy the song, just click it and you'd listen to it. It was nice then too cause before Napster, finding a song was a task. Mp3's were aplenty but in hiding. Eventually there was mp3.com and scour.net, but the joy was finding that song you had stuck in your head but couldn't find on the internet on some random lan computer.
Besides the obvious "because it can be done" answer, is there any reason why someone wants to port Linux to the XBox or any other video game system for that matter? Lets be real, I buy video game systems so I can veg out from the whole dealing with computers to play games - why would I want to make my video game system into a computer.
I worked for a company and got screwed out of a ton of cash because of the way these laws work. What also got me is how this is worded in the handbook we got - which has now been amended online:
"Employees who refuse to work overtime when they do not have a valid emergency that prevents its, and when no other qualified employee is available, are subject to disciplinary action, and may forfeit future opportunities to work overtime."
What I always found humourous was the last part about forfeitting future opportunities - hell, if I'm not getting paid for them, you can keep 'em. I didn't quite agree with this policy, especially after I wound up working 21+ days straight with over 8 hours a day. Shortly thereafter I quit and since I was the "qualified employee" the OT clause talks about - most of the projects I was involved in still haven't been done. BTW, I've been out of there for 5 months.
Back on topic though, the system is in failing. Most of the places I've worked required you to work OT without pay - some would be nice and give you time off (comp / flex time) or get you dinner or some gesture of good will. Most just expect you to work the hours and shrug it off like you did nothing. That makes an employee feel like crap. The problem I see with companies is that they don't want to hire on new people because these laws, most from the FLSA, exempt tech employees. In my case I was a network engineer who drove a company truck. Since I could travel between South Carolina and Georgia, I was exempt since I fell under the Interstate Commerce portion of the act. In some cases you work in a team and you fall under a quasi-supervisor position that they can claim you held.
I gotta bring up the last level to the original Contra game. Think about it, you have to shoot a huge phallic beast that shoots out white / pink things. After that, you gotta take out a heart type beast that's kinda like an embryo. I don't know about you, but I always thought that Contra was an abreviation for Contraception.
I have 2 experiences that throw each other off balance. First the more recent one, the bad one.
I worked for a really crappy company. I did general computer technician work as well as custom programming and LAN/WAN Design and Administration. I worked there for 5 months and finally quit after I realized I was working well over 50 hours a week with no thanks to show for it (overtime and such) - this wasn't too much of a problem except that even if I worked a 12 hour day, if I came in 5 minutes late I'd hear all about how they can't take tardiness. After I quit, a month goes by. I get a letter asking me to return my shirts (we got those company logo shirts that every company has). I wasn't too pleased since the shirts, I felt, were gifted to me. Also in the letter they were asking me for a program I had written - turns out someone there deleted it after I left and they now didn't have anything to give to a customer they already billed. Fine with me however in the letter and a later email they were accusing me of deleting it. I met with a person from the company and they demanded that I return the software - which I didn't have - and that the software is costing the company $1600 to recreate. I asked about my lost wages due to them docking money for my shirts as well as my last months commission and all I got was "We're not going to pay because YOU lost the software". It gets me that a company could be that sleazy and do this. Even if I was the last programmer on Earth, I wouldn't recreate this software for them now - they burned a bridge.
On the other hand, I worked for another employer and left them a while back and we have a great relationship. It's mutually beneficial since I will get contacted to do some interesting project and I will receive a nice paycheck for that. On the employers side, they don't have to have a Network Engineer or Programmer sitting around there collecting dust. We both work around each other's schedules and we have established a good degree of trust.
If you're just starting out with this, make sure you do get a contract or some type of pay scale though. Mostly all companies don't want to pay for additional help from you after you quit and they will almost always make you feel like you OWE them something.
So the point is to just leave the room when someone clicks through the EULA.
Hmmm, I'm thinking of a new business model, We set up offices where people bring in their computers and applicable software, all legally purchased and then leave for 1/2 hour. We install the software so the user has no clue as to what's going on and we then turn the computer and software back over to them. They have a working application and never agreed, therefore not bounded to, the EULA. Anyone else want a piece of this dot-con?
F'n aol. Just when Trillian gets out.724 and the road is looking good, aol decides to screw it all up again. Now after 3 minutes or so I get kicked off with a message:
You have been disconnected from the AOL Instant Message Service (SM) for accessing the AOL network using unauthorized software. You can download a FREE, fully featured, and authorized client, here http://www.aol.com/aim/download2.html .
Coincidently, I think it's only being done to a handful of users, some of my friends who use Trillian have no problems.
Is this legal? I know aol has been doing this covertly for a long time, but now they are telling you explicitly use AIM or else.
Most companies come back with a different settlement number, and we negotiate," says Jenny Blank, the BSA's director of enforcement. "I'm not going to say they're cheerful about it, but they recognize that this is probably easier and less expensive than taking the case to court."
This is funny cause I live up in the Northeast where they show a commercial that has hammed up acting just like this for Jacoby and Meyers. One lawyer comes in and says something like we're being sued, the other says something like flip off. The first lawyer then says it's Jacoby and Meyers, the second jumps the gun and says we'll settle. I found it humorous, then again I've been drinkin jameson all night.
yeah, i love it when the person just hits 5 keys and gets a paragraph completed. I think when someone invents that, it'll blow speech input out of the water.
This paragraph was brought to you using only the letters f and j.
Re:Linux World Summary (or why i was disappointed)
on
LinuxWorld Summary
·
· Score: 1
I enjoyed the room, stopped by, no one except what seemed to be a librarian was there. Not quite the rowdy crowd I remember from last year. Maybe I shoulda just stole one of them compaq bean bags and the foosball table and brought in some noise.;)
First of let me start by saying how LinuxWorld has pained me so. I usually get a ton of t-shirts and software (last year I got a complete Solaris 8 OS package and all the software I could choke my sun box with) but this year I got crap, a stupid plane, Ximian had stupid frisbees instead of their neat shirts and monkey combos from last year, and information packets from companies. It was a real disapointment.
Onto the serious side of how it's becoming business orientated, that's a good thing. I work as a consultant and I try to have as many skills as I can muster up. Linux has always been one of those things I could do, like whittlling or embroidery, but wasn't really useful. Now that the industry is offering corporate solutions and enterprise servers, maybe I can use my Linux skills and get more money. I'm in it for the money and you'd have to be stupid or extremely rich to not do so yourself. So what if some code I wrote a few years ago winds up in the hands of some corporate schmo, if I meet someone using something I helped create I think that would impress them more so than saying I got a certification and know how it works.
As for LinuxWorld again, I am upset that the "fun" booths were gone but I can understand that some companies just didn't have the cash to keep going and through natural capitalist selection the big fish are still in the pond. I only wish they'd bring some joy into it.
Does anyone want me to whittle them a carved Indian statue?
Back when I was a student, I took a Data Structures course where the professor would do automatic grading. We'd simply email the code files to his account before a certain time and the program would run and generate output. There would be 9 tests that the program would run to make sure it was getting the correct output. You would always get 10 points for handing in something so if you even bothered to send an email you got a 10. Now if your program passed a test, another 10 points, all 9 tests and 100%.
When the assignment was given out, we'd be given 6 of the 9 tests that were going to be run. During the semester I was also taking other time intensive courses so I did not have time to sit down and code some of the projects correctly so I would analyze the inputs, find the differences and have my program act as a parser finding simularities and printing out prefabricated output files for the 6 tests we had. This would ensure me a 70%, and a B+ for the class (I also scored very highly on all the exams so I had a A in the course).
The instructor leading my course was an assistant professor who was looking to make a name for himself. Turns out there were quite a few people doing this as well. So he made an example out of me saying how I was cheating and instructed other students to do so. Instead of accusing me for whatever cheating scheme I described above, he accused me of plagarism. This turned into my savior since I could easily claim that my code was unique from all others. Hell, some of the other scams would find the output files the professor was comparing to and copy them as their own output files so the program would always pass the test.
Now I work for Microsoft;)
MIS, CS, or CIS degree is a tough choice, but you can make a wise one now since you've got some experience. If you want to stay as a DB Admin for life, go for CIS and concentrate on networks and databases. If you want to program, go for the CS degree. If you want a degree for the sake of having a degree, go for an MIS degree (The MIS degree isn't held too highly in my book, but it does let you take some business courses).
My opinion is to go for the gusto; get a CS degree. If you're really into computers you'll enjoy it when you're done because the information you get out of it is going to give you more appreciation for the computer. It's probably the tougher road, but if you're up to it, it's worth it.
Try getting a call from an office 30 miles away saying that the exchange server isn't letting users get mail or open files on their remote directory only to find that the other admin decided to install a new antivirus package without deleting the old one. That's a real pisser.
If that is the case I should have no problem telling people I have over 10 years experience but I can't. I'd love to sit and spin yarns about how I started programming games on the Commodore 128, but that's far from saying I have 3+ years programming in BASIC; my experience would then start at 9 years old. The reality is that employers want someone who has not only worked with computers but has also worked with a lot of people, and in many situations. It's a crazy world of scenarios out there and you need to have some under your belt before you can claim you have experience.
I agree with this. Here's some logic that won't fly in the professional world : I went to college for 4 years working on a CS degree, therefore I must have 4 years experience. College is professional, therefore my experience is professional experience.
Has anyone noticed that in this economy, employers are looking more at years experience than certifications. I know already that I've been passed up for a position because I didn't have 5 years experience but I held certifications that would be useful for that position.
I pose a question to anyone reading this with Certifications. In this down economy, do they even help? I have a CCNA, CCDA and a lot of other letters. The moment I was laid off from my last job I stopped paying the 100 bucks for each test and just let em lie. Is anyone still going for them and if so are they helping any more.
I know what you're feeling, being young and in network / systems administration. It's what I did until I was laid off back in March. I haven't been able to find a job since then and I have been told that my qualifications are great and I know what I'm doing, it's just that I don't have the years of experience.
I have 3 1/2 honest to good years of experience under my belt, I have down on paper that I have more since I also count the time I helped with some servers at college (yeah, quake and quake 2!), which I find relavant since it was making sure users could connect and use the resources (what a sys admin does).
Why I don't buy your story is that you are only 19. Is this your first job? If so, enjoy it and get ready to work in the help desk hell for a few years now that the business is slow. Be lucky that you got a taste of what you want to do.
I'd like some more info on your background, like college, certifications, experience, work history, etc. so I could get a better picture of all this.
I got a CS degree not too long ago and I remember all too well this policy of cheating.
I think that the code you write in college has no place in the real world other than to judge your own abilities. By copying someones answers you will have just defeated the purpose of the assignment. All I know is that because of having to do all my assignments myself, I feel confident in my own abilities which in turn will greater benefit a team.
On another related topic is group projects. When I was in college (all but 2 years ago) I had a handful of courses that emphasized group work. Some courses suffered from having assignments done as group work and some couldn't have been done without it. One class the professor decided that it was time students learned to work in groups, so we were divided into groups of 4 to tackle a project that was meant to be done individually. His motives were good except he also forgot to teach us the essentials of working in a group as opposed to on our own. This led to 1 student doing and 3 students watching - a very poor idea. On another front I had great group assignment in a later class where we had to write compression / decompression utilities from scratch. It taught us a lot about planning and dividing work up since the professor went through how we could tackle this assignment efficiently.
One final thought to all this is that if you are in college you must remember that all the lessons you learn there are not the final solutions. Wherever you go after leaving will decide exactly how you will work.
Slashdot Mirror
Hey - I've been playing on B-net as rapingnewborns since the days of starcraft.
My account hasn't been questioned or closed.
The name isn't a hobby (as I quote online) - it goes back to the day of vs newbs games. Those games usually had some hardcore players who just wanted to have an easy game. Well, I'd join in those games to beat or rape the newb killers.
Wow. I can see the interest in this, but it's been there all along. There's the X-Terminals which run off the network. All they have is some memory and a NIC. Pump out a login window to the unix farm and you're set.
Interestingly they had this at UD and I recall that at one point there was a fun exploit that let a hacker take over an x-terminal. My only concern would be that the same type of exploit would be doable with a linux boot.
Ahhh, the memories of UD's network. I graduated from there in '99 and if it wasn't for the network there, I don't think I'd ever have gotten broadband or decided to work in the networking field.
;)
Right now I'm at the University of Pittsburgh, which is supposedly a "sister" school - I can say that the network here bites compared to UD's back then.
This was a pointless post
Ok, I might not be the best writer in the world - I might not even be in the top 1/2. If you're writing for a magazine, I would hope you have better transition paragraphs than those I wrote in high school papers.
If I am going to read your magazine (re: infotainment) I would hope that I would have an entertaining read while I drew out information.
Gaaaah! Painful words, make stop!
I remember those days, back before Napster. We had Network Neighborhood and Ethernet connections to the dorm. Edit your lmhosts file and you could see any computer on the campus if you wanted to. No need for Napster. In some ways I miss it, you'd just see a new computer and open it and wade through all the crap someone would share. It was a simple time, a fun time. We didn't need to actually copy the song, just click it and you'd listen to it. It was nice then too cause before Napster, finding a song was a task. Mp3's were aplenty but in hiding. Eventually there was mp3.com and scour.net, but the joy was finding that song you had stuck in your head but couldn't find on the internet on some random lan computer.
*sob*
Besides the obvious "because it can be done" answer, is there any reason why someone wants to port Linux to the XBox or any other video game system for that matter? Lets be real, I buy video game systems so I can veg out from the whole dealing with computers to play games - why would I want to make my video game system into a computer.
I worked for a company and got screwed out of a ton of cash because of the way these laws work. What also got me is how this is worded in the handbook we got - which has now been amended online: "Employees who refuse to work overtime when they do not have a valid emergency that prevents its, and when no other qualified employee is available, are subject to disciplinary action, and may forfeit future opportunities to work overtime." What I always found humourous was the last part about forfeitting future opportunities - hell, if I'm not getting paid for them, you can keep 'em. I didn't quite agree with this policy, especially after I wound up working 21+ days straight with over 8 hours a day. Shortly thereafter I quit and since I was the "qualified employee" the OT clause talks about - most of the projects I was involved in still haven't been done. BTW, I've been out of there for 5 months. Back on topic though, the system is in failing. Most of the places I've worked required you to work OT without pay - some would be nice and give you time off (comp / flex time) or get you dinner or some gesture of good will. Most just expect you to work the hours and shrug it off like you did nothing. That makes an employee feel like crap. The problem I see with companies is that they don't want to hire on new people because these laws, most from the FLSA, exempt tech employees. In my case I was a network engineer who drove a company truck. Since I could travel between South Carolina and Georgia, I was exempt since I fell under the Interstate Commerce portion of the act. In some cases you work in a team and you fall under a quasi-supervisor position that they can claim you held.
I gotta bring up the last level to the original Contra game. Think about it, you have to shoot a huge phallic beast that shoots out white / pink things. After that, you gotta take out a heart type beast that's kinda like an embryo. I don't know about you, but I always thought that Contra was an abreviation for Contraception.
I have 2 experiences that throw each other off balance. First the more recent one, the bad one. I worked for a really crappy company. I did general computer technician work as well as custom programming and LAN/WAN Design and Administration. I worked there for 5 months and finally quit after I realized I was working well over 50 hours a week with no thanks to show for it (overtime and such) - this wasn't too much of a problem except that even if I worked a 12 hour day, if I came in 5 minutes late I'd hear all about how they can't take tardiness. After I quit, a month goes by. I get a letter asking me to return my shirts (we got those company logo shirts that every company has). I wasn't too pleased since the shirts, I felt, were gifted to me. Also in the letter they were asking me for a program I had written - turns out someone there deleted it after I left and they now didn't have anything to give to a customer they already billed. Fine with me however in the letter and a later email they were accusing me of deleting it. I met with a person from the company and they demanded that I return the software - which I didn't have - and that the software is costing the company $1600 to recreate. I asked about my lost wages due to them docking money for my shirts as well as my last months commission and all I got was "We're not going to pay because YOU lost the software". It gets me that a company could be that sleazy and do this. Even if I was the last programmer on Earth, I wouldn't recreate this software for them now - they burned a bridge.
On the other hand, I worked for another employer and left them a while back and we have a great relationship. It's mutually beneficial since I will get contacted to do some interesting project and I will receive a nice paycheck for that. On the employers side, they don't have to have a Network Engineer or Programmer sitting around there collecting dust. We both work around each other's schedules and we have established a good degree of trust.
If you're just starting out with this, make sure you do get a contract or some type of pay scale though. Mostly all companies don't want to pay for additional help from you after you quit and they will almost always make you feel like you OWE them something.
So the point is to just leave the room when someone clicks through the EULA.
Hmmm, I'm thinking of a new business model, We set up offices where people bring in their computers and applicable software, all legally purchased and then leave for 1/2 hour. We install the software so the user has no clue as to what's going on and we then turn the computer and software back over to them. They have a working application and never agreed, therefore not bounded to, the EULA. Anyone else want a piece of this dot-con?
oh, and nd Best Buy sucks.
why so glum, buy stock. maybe lucent will get out of the crapper on this deal.
You have been disconnected from the AOL Instant Message Service (SM) for accessing the AOL network using unauthorized software. You can download a FREE, fully featured, and authorized client, here http://www.aol.com/aim/download2.html .
Coincidently, I think it's only being done to a handful of users, some of my friends who use Trillian have no problems.
Is this legal? I know aol has been doing this covertly for a long time, but now they are telling you explicitly use AIM or else.
This is funny cause I live up in the Northeast where they show a commercial that has hammed up acting just like this for Jacoby and Meyers. One lawyer comes in and says something like we're being sued, the other says something like flip off. The first lawyer then says it's Jacoby and Meyers, the second jumps the gun and says we'll settle.
I found it humorous, then again I've been drinkin jameson all night.
yeah, i love it when the person just hits 5 keys and gets a paragraph completed. I think when someone invents that, it'll blow speech input out of the water. This paragraph was brought to you using only the letters f and j.
I enjoyed the room, stopped by, no one except what seemed to be a librarian was there. Not quite the rowdy crowd I remember from last year. Maybe I shoulda just stole one of them compaq bean bags and the foosball table and brought in some noise. ;)
Onto the serious side of how it's becoming business orientated, that's a good thing. I work as a consultant and I try to have as many skills as I can muster up. Linux has always been one of those things I could do, like whittlling or embroidery, but wasn't really useful. Now that the industry is offering corporate solutions and enterprise servers, maybe I can use my Linux skills and get more money. I'm in it for the money and you'd have to be stupid or extremely rich to not do so yourself. So what if some code I wrote a few years ago winds up in the hands of some corporate schmo, if I meet someone using something I helped create I think that would impress them more so than saying I got a certification and know how it works.
As for LinuxWorld again, I am upset that the "fun" booths were gone but I can understand that some companies just didn't have the cash to keep going and through natural capitalist selection the big fish are still in the pond. I only wish they'd bring some joy into it.
Does anyone want me to whittle them a carved Indian statue?
Back when I was a student, I took a Data Structures course where the professor would do automatic grading. We'd simply email the code files to his account before a certain time and the program would run and generate output. There would be 9 tests that the program would run to make sure it was getting the correct output. You would always get 10 points for handing in something so if you even bothered to send an email you got a 10. Now if your program passed a test, another 10 points, all 9 tests and 100%. When the assignment was given out, we'd be given 6 of the 9 tests that were going to be run. During the semester I was also taking other time intensive courses so I did not have time to sit down and code some of the projects correctly so I would analyze the inputs, find the differences and have my program act as a parser finding simularities and printing out prefabricated output files for the 6 tests we had. This would ensure me a 70%, and a B+ for the class (I also scored very highly on all the exams so I had a A in the course). The instructor leading my course was an assistant professor who was looking to make a name for himself. Turns out there were quite a few people doing this as well. So he made an example out of me saying how I was cheating and instructed other students to do so. Instead of accusing me for whatever cheating scheme I described above, he accused me of plagarism. This turned into my savior since I could easily claim that my code was unique from all others. Hell, some of the other scams would find the output files the professor was comparing to and copy them as their own output files so the program would always pass the test. Now I work for Microsoft ;)
MIS, CS, or CIS degree is a tough choice, but you can make a wise one now since you've got some experience. If you want to stay as a DB Admin for life, go for CIS and concentrate on networks and databases. If you want to program, go for the CS degree. If you want a degree for the sake of having a degree, go for an MIS degree (The MIS degree isn't held too highly in my book, but it does let you take some business courses). My opinion is to go for the gusto; get a CS degree. If you're really into computers you'll enjoy it when you're done because the information you get out of it is going to give you more appreciation for the computer. It's probably the tougher road, but if you're up to it, it's worth it.
Try getting a call from an office 30 miles away saying that the exchange server isn't letting users get mail or open files on their remote directory only to find that the other admin decided to install a new antivirus package without deleting the old one. That's a real pisser.
If that is the case I should have no problem telling people I have over 10 years experience but I can't. I'd love to sit and spin yarns about how I started programming games on the Commodore 128, but that's far from saying I have 3+ years programming in BASIC; my experience would then start at 9 years old. The reality is that employers want someone who has not only worked with computers but has also worked with a lot of people, and in many situations. It's a crazy world of scenarios out there and you need to have some under your belt before you can claim you have experience.
I agree with this. Here's some logic that won't fly in the professional world : I went to college for 4 years working on a CS degree, therefore I must have 4 years experience. College is professional, therefore my experience is professional experience.
Has anyone noticed that in this economy, employers are looking more at years experience than certifications. I know already that I've been passed up for a position because I didn't have 5 years experience but I held certifications that would be useful for that position. I pose a question to anyone reading this with Certifications. In this down economy, do they even help? I have a CCNA, CCDA and a lot of other letters. The moment I was laid off from my last job I stopped paying the 100 bucks for each test and just let em lie. Is anyone still going for them and if so are they helping any more.
I know what you're feeling, being young and in network / systems administration. It's what I did until I was laid off back in March. I haven't been able to find a job since then and I have been told that my qualifications are great and I know what I'm doing, it's just that I don't have the years of experience. I have 3 1/2 honest to good years of experience under my belt, I have down on paper that I have more since I also count the time I helped with some servers at college (yeah, quake and quake 2!), which I find relavant since it was making sure users could connect and use the resources (what a sys admin does). Why I don't buy your story is that you are only 19. Is this your first job? If so, enjoy it and get ready to work in the help desk hell for a few years now that the business is slow. Be lucky that you got a taste of what you want to do. I'd like some more info on your background, like college, certifications, experience, work history, etc. so I could get a better picture of all this.
I got a CS degree not too long ago and I remember all too well this policy of cheating. I think that the code you write in college has no place in the real world other than to judge your own abilities. By copying someones answers you will have just defeated the purpose of the assignment. All I know is that because of having to do all my assignments myself, I feel confident in my own abilities which in turn will greater benefit a team. On another related topic is group projects. When I was in college (all but 2 years ago) I had a handful of courses that emphasized group work. Some courses suffered from having assignments done as group work and some couldn't have been done without it. One class the professor decided that it was time students learned to work in groups, so we were divided into groups of 4 to tackle a project that was meant to be done individually. His motives were good except he also forgot to teach us the essentials of working in a group as opposed to on our own. This led to 1 student doing and 3 students watching - a very poor idea. On another front I had great group assignment in a later class where we had to write compression / decompression utilities from scratch. It taught us a lot about planning and dividing work up since the professor went through how we could tackle this assignment efficiently. One final thought to all this is that if you are in college you must remember that all the lessons you learn there are not the final solutions. Wherever you go after leaving will decide exactly how you will work.