I will not knock Xandros, for I think it is a good thing they're out there, and also a good thing any time a Windoze user makes the switch, but the person writing this blurb for/. should have a lobotomy. 'Polished desktop product'? Perhaps it looks good to a Microsucker XP freak, but anyone previously exposed to something more tasteful will find it downright 'FUGLY'.
Xandros is not 'polished'. It might be better than XP, but then again most things are. OSS continues to suffer from a lack of investment in the kind of graphics work done in the commercial sector. Quick summary: programmers cannot design graphic user interfaces. Once more: programmers cannot design graphic user interfaces. Keep saying that until it sinks in.
I'm glad someone found this story and pointed this out. All along we've considered the 'Napster issue' from an impartial POV when yes, DUH, everyone knows what crooks these recording company execs are, everyone knows at least half a dozen horror stories about how songwriters and performers are getting ripped off all the time. Music is supposed to be nice, and beneficial, and soul-soothing - it's a wonder and a mystery why these lowlifes get into the business in the first place.
Both David Lindley and Courtney Love have spoken out eloquently against them in the past. I think we should remember who the real villains are here - and that they're not 13yos with a few songs on a hard drive.
Forgive me, but who is Kieren McCarthy? And how can he prove the existence of something that he by definition cannot know anything about?
And why does this always happen whenever Windows gets the shit kicked out of it?
Kieren McCarthy, whoever you are, I am sure this comes as no great news to you, but 1) you are full of it; and 2) you're a dupe - perhaps a paid dupe, perhaps an unpaid (and therefore even more duped) dupe.
My argument is only anecdotal, but even as such it offers much more substance and evidence than this charlatan.
I have never - and I literally mean never - come across a company so freaking security conscious as Apple. I mean, these guys are out in front and thinking and preparing for possible security vulnerabilities waaay down the line - years ahead.
All you have to do is read the programming tutorials to understand this.
And their grasp of Unix is excellent. These guys really know security, and for them security is a top, if not the top, priority.
Exposing a bug in OS X gets you an immediate response - and by 'immediate' I mean 'immediate': within a couple of hours at the most. And the contact you get becomes a liaison between you and the development team. And even more impressive, they actually keep after you to complement your information so they can get to the bottom of it.
Now honestly, Mr Kieren McBullshit, who else does this? Eat you know what and do you know what. You should be ashamed.
There used to be a time when Apple traced every hardware flaw back to the design phase - and corrected it. This thinking they have today about software and security echoes that type of thinking.
You might accuse Apple of many things, but lax on security is not one. My information is only anecdotal, but it's more than good enough for me: in terms of security, Apple are simply best.
So crawl back into the woodwork, Mr Microslave, until next Windows gets walloped by a simple hack written by a teenager sitting in his underwear at his computer halfway around the world.
This was goddamned good. Thank you. (That's all I wanted to say here. You're so spot on it's not funny. And the way these MCP idiots have been hired - and the schools who guarantee that no matter who they are they will pass - Vito Corleone should take lessons from Bill Henry Gates.)
But we're not really talking law here. OK, maybe some are, but I think most people just feel the outrage. They'd love to see Microsoft pay for this, they'd love to see the world tell Microsoft 'clean up your act or get out of town', but finding a scapegoat is not what we need. It's what people look for, but it doesn't help. Improving things so they don't happen again is what is essential. Aldous Huxley said things like this were a waste of time.
But the world has had long enough to do something about this nonsense. All that is ever done - same as with Columbine-type things - is that people talk and talk and talk about them - the way they talk about any reforms in that backward society - until they're all worn out and have forgot the entire incident - so life can go on as normal.
Stop talking - start doing. Start telling the suits with money that they can't back Microsoft anymore. That wanting to plan a family holiday with Excel is not a good enough reason to put the corporation and the Internet at risk. That familiarity is not good in this context. That S-O and all those other laws are someday soon going to light a fire under their pathetic fat behinds. Start making the people around you change. And stop just talking about it.
A VERY good point, a VERY valid point, but you're forgetting one thing:
You too have culpability here. I don't hear you rescuing people at sea, but you've admitting you go through the gruelling process of yanking your 'personal computer' around town just because...
You know why 'because'...
You could, OTOH, have a NICE set of SuSE discs and never have to worry about that ever again.
Bill never claimed his software was good. He never tried to make it good. But you are not forced to buy his shite. If you do, you are a fool.
I still don't buy the "Microsoft is responsible" talk
Playing hard to get, eh?
How much more evidence do you need?
You're talking hundreds of billions of dollars already. In damages. So much that if Bill paid people back for everything his software has done, he'd be in the poor house (where he belongs - might build up some character finally) and he'd still have half left to pay.
Show us another major CEO, now or in the past, who has caused more damage to customers and the environment than he himself as made. Show us. Even a marginal case like this: show us just one.
It's not exactly news that running Microsoft systems is the only sure-fire way of getting the living daylights kicked out of you. There are many levels of culpability here.
Remember that there is a woman in California in the process of instigating a class action against Microsoft because 1) she bought a PC unaware of how crappy the Microsoft code is; and 2) became through that code a victim of identity theft.
But the blame falls equally on the morons who continue to house Microsoft systems in Microsoft shops. I quote from a Slashdot comment four years ago in the wake of the Love Bug from the Phils:
I heard some TV news this morning describe it as 'a wakeup call'. Forgot Melissa already, eh? How many wakeup calls does it take? Methinks wakeup calls now come with a snooze control.
It is just as much the fault of those responsible for continuing to rely on Microsoft systems. The last instance of prevention is often the legally most culpable. That instance can and most likely will be accused of negligence. And sad to say, that is just what we need in this world.
Put another way by Scott Petersen of eWEEK:
If you leave your keys in the car while you pop into the convenience store to buy a gallon of milk, is it the thief's fault your car was stolen?
Yeah, Mandrake is best. They're also closest to going out of business.
Therefore the key would seem to be to _not_ produce new versions so you stay in business longer.
In fact, I would hazard a guess that it's the software companies that offer no products at all who have the best chance of being market leaders.
Maybe MS have the right idea after all - and this way, with no new versions, they don't have to deal with new vulnerabilities. It looks like a win-win from here.
Read yourself. How do you think they got where they are today?
They were minding their own business and sticking to their areas until the Shanghai businessmen came along.
Not that any of this is news if you're at least 14 years old. It was all over AU Newsweek in a cover story at the time. It required only you be able to read.
Sorry if that would have been too much for you.
If my post suggests to you I am hypocritical, yours suggests you are ignorant.
We've been running Macs in the family exclusively for over two years. None of us have ever had a crash. Not a one. I think it's the language. Sure, there's more, but this discussion of desktops sidesteps the issue of languages.
C is a great language. Obj-C proves that by its deferential treatment. Apple say you can learn Obj-C in two hours. Obj-C builds on Smalltalk.
C++ builds on Simula. As does Smalltalk. But Alan Kay doesn't exactly like C++, and he's the one invented both Smalltalk and the term object orientation. So that should give you a clue.
C++ is incredibly complex. It puts ordinary programming grunts in a tailspin. It doesn't even have dynamic binding. It's the quintessential simple idea that gets hairy and tangled by the time it's half done. Without a doubt C++ is responsible for most of the woes in software development today.
Obj-C makes it all simple again. The precise clear relationships you had in C, that were somewhat lost when you needed 150% more code because you needed a GUI, are back again. It's clear, it's clean, and it's rugged. NeXTSTEP has a history interwoven with Obj-C, and Apple and NeXT made additions to the language, and Interface Builder marks the first and only time these technologies have come together, but Obj-C can stand in its own right.
In short, I don't think it's relevant to port a desktop to Linux. I don't think it's a good idea, and I don't think it will give Apple any market benefits.
But the entire world would benefit if they got the language Obj-C more out in front.
Years ago the Koala was threatened by Shanghai developers who started digging up their habitat to build expensive condos. The Aussie government did nothing. A lady in the area petitioned everyone, got nowhere. She even ran after Peter Garrett, singer in Midnight Oil, for assistance, and was rebuffed at the door so to speak.
I spoke with Peter's press agent about this. 'They're all so politically naive' he commented. Which is about as pompous as it gets - they never would let the woman through just to state her case.
So the Koala is threatened. And it's not as if it has places all over the world to live. This place is about it. And now they supposedly have condos there. No wonder the poor things are going nuts.
So what to do? Shoot 20,000 of them. Good solution, Australia!
Harvesting is a violation, but spam-crawling is ethically worse, and there is no way this guy could get 45 million addresses through opt-in. Where on his site does he let people opt in? Or opt out for that matter?
He's a crook, pure plain and simple, and it took this guy to get me to side with Microsoft in a controversy!
Use GIMP all you want - and I think most people are glad it's around - but this discussion is not really about GIMP or PS for that matter.
It's about the ability of OSS to compete well in the marketplace. And it doesn't. People devote their spare time to OSS, and people who make so much anyway they're busy 60-80 hours a week churning out hot apps are not going to have any time.
How many of the Quark/Adobe team do you think are moonlighting working on projects like GIMP?
Companies with a need for financial success will, if they're lucky, have that success, and through hard work. OSS is so different. But if OSS is to succeed, it must also be able to do this.
Slashdot Mirror
Maybe not, but maybe yes.
The metric system is a good example, but an even better example would come from the same sphere: IT.
And there is such an example: MS-DOS version 2.11, which because of its popularity in Europe, was long a standard enen in the 'colonies'.
And why not just use VMWare?
If there's any secure way to use that shite, this is it.
Regardless of category. And we don't even run Linux here. But there is no better candidate, and that's pretty obvious.
My advice, take it or leave it...
Switch jobs fast. You do not want to get into C++. It's a freaking mess. Remember Alan Kay, father of OO? Here's a quote:
I invented the term 'object-oriented' and I can tell you I did not have C++ in mind.
-- Alan Kay
Sun used to have a program like this - yes, with a GUI. That was several years ago.
A quick succinct comment:
Recording companies are the most crooked lowlifes in the world.
Their polished desktop product
/. should have a lobotomy. 'Polished desktop product'? Perhaps it looks good to a Microsucker XP freak, but anyone previously exposed to something more tasteful will find it downright 'FUGLY'.
I will not knock Xandros, for I think it is a good thing they're out there, and also a good thing any time a Windoze user makes the switch, but the person writing this blurb for
Xandros is not 'polished'. It might be better than XP, but then again most things are. OSS continues to suffer from a lack of investment in the kind of graphics work done in the commercial sector. Quick summary: programmers cannot design graphic user interfaces. Once more: programmers cannot design graphic user interfaces. Keep saying that until it sinks in.
You gotta love this quote from Wired's ace reporter:
the proliferation of a NEW category of deceptive software
How long have Lavasoft been out there?
Registrar: domaininfo.com
Domain Name: lavasoftusa.com
Record created: 21 May 2001
Record last changed: 27 May 2002
Record expires: 21 May 2006
Prolly is a Usenet pest who never reads the FAQs...
... which only works until the next calamity hits.
Instead, try this...
Or this...
And then you can turn off that snooze control.
I'm glad someone found this story and pointed this out. All along we've considered the 'Napster issue' from an impartial POV when yes, DUH, everyone knows what crooks these recording company execs are, everyone knows at least half a dozen horror stories about how songwriters and performers are getting ripped off all the time. Music is supposed to be nice, and beneficial, and soul-soothing - it's a wonder and a mystery why these lowlifes get into the business in the first place.
Both David Lindley and Courtney Love have spoken out eloquently against them in the past. I think we should remember who the real villains are here - and that they're not 13yos with a few songs on a hard drive.
Forgive me, but who is Kieren McCarthy? And how can he prove the existence of something that he by definition cannot know anything about?
And why does this always happen whenever Windows gets the shit kicked out of it?
Kieren McCarthy, whoever you are, I am sure this comes as no great news to you, but 1) you are full of it; and 2) you're a dupe - perhaps a paid dupe, perhaps an unpaid (and therefore even more duped) dupe.
My argument is only anecdotal, but even as such it offers much more substance and evidence than this charlatan.
I have never - and I literally mean never - come across a company so freaking security conscious as Apple. I mean, these guys are out in front and thinking and preparing for possible security vulnerabilities waaay down the line - years ahead.
All you have to do is read the programming tutorials to understand this.
And their grasp of Unix is excellent. These guys really know security, and for them security is a top, if not the top, priority.
Exposing a bug in OS X gets you an immediate response - and by 'immediate' I mean 'immediate': within a couple of hours at the most. And the contact you get becomes a liaison between you and the development team. And even more impressive, they actually keep after you to complement your information so they can get to the bottom of it.
Now honestly, Mr Kieren McBullshit, who else does this? Eat you know what and do you know what. You should be ashamed.
There used to be a time when Apple traced every hardware flaw back to the design phase - and corrected it. This thinking they have today about software and security echoes that type of thinking.
You might accuse Apple of many things, but lax on security is not one. My information is only anecdotal, but it's more than good enough for me: in terms of security, Apple are simply best.
So crawl back into the woodwork, Mr Microslave, until next Windows gets walloped by a simple hack written by a teenager sitting in his underwear at his computer halfway around the world.
We'll be waiting.
This was goddamned good. Thank you. (That's all I wanted to say here. You're so spot on it's not funny. And the way these MCP idiots have been hired - and the schools who guarantee that no matter who they are they will pass - Vito Corleone should take lessons from Bill Henry Gates.)
But we're not really talking law here. OK, maybe some are, but I think most people just feel the outrage. They'd love to see Microsoft pay for this, they'd love to see the world tell Microsoft 'clean up your act or get out of town', but finding a scapegoat is not what we need. It's what people look for, but it doesn't help. Improving things so they don't happen again is what is essential. Aldous Huxley said things like this were a waste of time.
But the world has had long enough to do something about this nonsense. All that is ever done - same as with Columbine-type things - is that people talk and talk and talk about them - the way they talk about any reforms in that backward society - until they're all worn out and have forgot the entire incident - so life can go on as normal.
Stop talking - start doing. Start telling the suits with money that they can't back Microsoft anymore. That wanting to plan a family holiday with Excel is not a good enough reason to put the corporation and the Internet at risk. That familiarity is not good in this context. That S-O and all those other laws are someday soon going to light a fire under their pathetic fat behinds. Start making the people around you change. And stop just talking about it.
A VERY good point, a VERY valid point, but you're forgetting one thing:
You too have culpability here. I don't hear you rescuing people at sea, but you've admitting you go through the gruelling process of yanking your 'personal computer' around town just because...
You know why 'because'...
You could, OTOH, have a NICE set of SuSE discs and never have to worry about that ever again.
Bill never claimed his software was good. He never tried to make it good. But you are not forced to buy his shite. If you do, you are a fool.
I still don't buy the "Microsoft is responsible" talk
Playing hard to get, eh?
How much more evidence do you need?
You're talking hundreds of billions of dollars already. In damages. So much that if Bill paid people back for everything his software has done, he'd be in the poor house (where he belongs - might build up some character finally) and he'd still have half left to pay.
Show us another major CEO, now or in the past, who has caused more damage to customers and the environment than he himself as made. Show us. Even a marginal case like this: show us just one.
What difference does that make? They're still spamming. I don't care if they do have a valid return address: 'unsolicited' is still 'unsolicited'.
Everyone thought they were a joke once upon a time. But they're not - they're really that dumb, that bad.
'We never worry about code efficiency; if the code gets too slow, we just throw more hardware at it.'
- Microsoft programmer
PS. Anyone who fails to see the connection between this and this needs brain surgery fast.
It's not exactly news that running Microsoft systems is the only sure-fire way of getting the living daylights kicked out of you. There are many levels of culpability here.
Remember that there is a woman in California in the process of instigating a class action against Microsoft because 1) she bought a PC unaware of how crappy the Microsoft code is; and 2) became through that code a victim of identity theft.
But the blame falls equally on the morons who continue to house Microsoft systems in Microsoft shops. I quote from a Slashdot comment four years ago in the wake of the Love Bug from the Phils:
I heard some TV news this morning describe it as 'a wakeup call'. Forgot Melissa already, eh? How many wakeup calls does it take? Methinks wakeup calls now come with a snooze control.
It is just as much the fault of those responsible for continuing to rely on Microsoft systems. The last instance of prevention is often the legally most culpable. That instance can and most likely will be accused of negligence. And sad to say, that is just what we need in this world.
Put another way by Scott Petersen of eWEEK:
If you leave your keys in the car while you pop into the convenience store to buy a gallon of milk, is it the thief's fault your car was stolen?
Hey what are you implying? That a critical patch can stop a Microsoft product from crashing every few minutes?
Watch yer tongue, anocelot! No MS product can be stopped! It's never been done! Ever! Microsoft are best!
Yeah, Mandrake is best. They're also closest to going out of business.
Therefore the key would seem to be to _not_ produce new versions so you stay in business longer.
In fact, I would hazard a guess that it's the software companies that offer no products at all who have the best chance of being market leaders.
Maybe MS have the right idea after all - and this way, with no new versions, they don't have to deal with new vulnerabilities. It looks like a win-win from here.
Read yourself. How do you think they got where they are today?
They were minding their own business and sticking to their areas until the Shanghai businessmen came along.
Not that any of this is news if you're at least 14 years old. It was all over AU Newsweek in a cover story at the time. It required only you be able to read.
Sorry if that would have been too much for you.
If my post suggests to you I am hypocritical, yours suggests you are ignorant.
We've been running Macs in the family exclusively for over two years. None of us have ever had a crash. Not a one. I think it's the language. Sure, there's more, but this discussion of desktops sidesteps the issue of languages.
C is a great language. Obj-C proves that by its deferential treatment. Apple say you can learn Obj-C in two hours. Obj-C builds on Smalltalk.
C++ builds on Simula. As does Smalltalk. But Alan Kay doesn't exactly like C++, and he's the one invented both Smalltalk and the term object orientation. So that should give you a clue.
C++ is incredibly complex. It puts ordinary programming grunts in a tailspin. It doesn't even have dynamic binding. It's the quintessential simple idea that gets hairy and tangled by the time it's half done. Without a doubt C++ is responsible for most of the woes in software development today.
Obj-C makes it all simple again. The precise clear relationships you had in C, that were somewhat lost when you needed 150% more code because you needed a GUI, are back again. It's clear, it's clean, and it's rugged. NeXTSTEP has a history interwoven with Obj-C, and Apple and NeXT made additions to the language, and Interface Builder marks the first and only time these technologies have come together, but Obj-C can stand in its own right.
In short, I don't think it's relevant to port a desktop to Linux. I don't think it's a good idea, and I don't think it will give Apple any market benefits.
But the entire world would benefit if they got the language Obj-C more out in front.
Years ago the Koala was threatened by Shanghai developers who started digging up their habitat to build expensive condos. The Aussie government did nothing. A lady in the area petitioned everyone, got nowhere. She even ran after Peter Garrett, singer in Midnight Oil, for assistance, and was rebuffed at the door so to speak.
I spoke with Peter's press agent about this. 'They're all so politically naive' he commented. Which is about as pompous as it gets - they never would let the woman through just to state her case.
So the Koala is threatened. And it's not as if it has places all over the world to live. This place is about it. And now they supposedly have condos there. No wonder the poor things are going nuts.
So what to do? Shoot 20,000 of them. Good solution, Australia!
You just went on my blacklist.
Harvesting is a violation, but spam-crawling is ethically worse, and there is no way this guy could get 45 million addresses through opt-in. Where on his site does he let people opt in? Or opt out for that matter?
He's a crook, pure plain and simple, and it took this guy to get me to side with Microsoft in a controversy!
* SLAMMERS FOR SPAMMERS *
Use GIMP all you want - and I think most people are glad it's around - but this discussion is not really about GIMP or PS for that matter.
It's about the ability of OSS to compete well in the marketplace. And it doesn't. People devote their spare time to OSS, and people who make so much anyway they're busy 60-80 hours a week churning out hot apps are not going to have any time.
How many of the Quark/Adobe team do you think are moonlighting working on projects like GIMP?
Companies with a need for financial success will, if they're lucky, have that success, and through hard work. OSS is so different. But if OSS is to succeed, it must also be able to do this.