you're incorrectly intertwining market share with install base. The problem with that is that market share is a figure that relates directly to quarterly or yearly sales figures (something that translate well to Linux and OS X because these platforms tend to outlive their usefullness as compared to their Windows competition this compelling individuals to keep aging hardware longer and not make another sale)
Linux has it even wose than OS X, because Linux is distributed for free, so in most cases... it wont translate to a "sale"
Think of it like this... if a single Windows user buys 4 computers in 4 years and a Linux or OSX user buys 1 computer in that same time period, the way "marketshare" works is that Windows would have the lions share of the market while Linux and OSX users would be religated to a fraction of that figure EVEN THOUGH THE SAME NUMBER OF INDIVIDUALS WOULD BE USING THE COMPUTER.
If the *Install Base* term were used instead, each platform would occupy the same number of users. Unfortunately, this misappropriation of words has caused the entire population to believe market share translates to install base.
This must change. The alternative OS community must work in unison to break this trend by correctly using the appropriate term to describe one or the other.
I'm surprised anyone would say this? His show made me laugh almost as hard as Tom Green used to. (on his first show... not that lame talk show he later got)
Since Ali G got taken off the air in the United States, few Americans will understand the understated reference to Ali's precurser to any type of review.
if I had mod point, I would have given you some.
"But that's not a problem, because there's a little arrow to show that it's a shortcut, or no arrow if it's not."
You're missing the point entierly. The dock is an application launching point. Its not a destination point.
Various locations between folders should allow items to be moved as you would expect them to be moved... not aliased. The fact that its got an arrow after it doesn't make it inconsistant. Apple's solution on the other hand IS consistant. Applications in the dock that are running always have arrows... those that aren't... dont. Applications that get moved ARE moved, and applications that are alaised (shortcutted) ARE shortcutted.
"What is this amazing ability of Mac users to bash a feature in Windows but defend that very same feature in MacOS?"
Because its not the same. What is this amazing ability of Windows users to look past Windows inconsistancies and try to find fault in Mac OS when its not similar to the way they are familiar with doing things on Windows?
"The problem with that is the dock icons can represent at least five different things:
Running applications"
Not a problem... there's a little arrow to show that the application is running... or no arrow if its not.
"non-running applications"
Again... no arrow. (No problem there)
"folders"
Again, no problem... easy to distinguish folders from application icons.
"files"
No problem. Application files/documents look different from the application icon itself, but look distinctly different from other application file/documents.
"and open windows (minimized.)"
Because the minized window is the image of what the maximized image would otherwise be (rather than a generic icon to represent it)... this too is not a problem.
"So by moving things to the desktop... what are you asking it to do? Move the application?"
Moving things to the desktop does exactly what you would expect it to do... move it to the desktop. (Unlike Windows which is inconsistant... sometimes creating a shortcut and other times moving the file itself)
"create an alias?"
Moving a file from one location to the next should never create an alias.
"move a window to the desktop (can't really do that.)"
"Apple people have a shittier time with their dock"
Apple don't have "a shittier time with their dock". You are simply hearing from a vocal minority. The rest of us love the dock.
Curious, how does XP handle icon resizing and such if its a dock clone. I'd imagine it the scaling and the clarity of the icons would look very bad because the UI is not vector based like OS X.
"If you notice in Windows XP, you can't change the size of the taskbar"
When items get added to it... something's got to give. You either need to make the items smaller or show less image data. Apple chose the wiser of the two options before it. The ability to lock the dock would be a step backwards IMHO.
"For the OS X dock this would be a good feature beacuse it is easy to accidentally remove programs from the dock by slightly dragging the mouse when you double click"
You don't double click items in the dock to launch/activate them. Its all single-click. Second, you have to drag an item relatively far outside the dock to remove it. If you slightly move it... (as per your analogy) the item snaps back to its origional position.
"and it is easy to change the size of the dock by accidentally dragging the mouse on the border."
You don't resize the dock by dragging the mouse on its border. You have to command-click the line-seperator and drag... (a combination you wouldn't be using otherwise when at the dock and so it makes the chance of accidentally re-sizing the dock almost impossible.
Re:If the dock had been introduced back in the day
on
Tog Takes on Mac OS X 10.3
·
· Score: 2, Insightful
"I found this to be really arrogant. It was like the boys from NeXT came in and simply assumed they knew better than everybody else"
Not arrogant at all. The guys at NeXT DID know better and so therefore it was right to take over Apple's former UI staff. Guys like TOG are just bitter about it.
"All documents look the same"
Um, no they don't.
"But for the most part he is right. All documents look the same, no tagging, trash can in the dock, dragging from the dock erases what you drag. It's dangerous."
No it doesn't. Dragging to the dock creates an alias (shortcut for you Windows users). Dragging away from the dock simply d-letes the alias
> I would like to see a vendor incorporate the same style mechanisms that Apple used (like the minimalist design that offers a lot of functionality at m fingertips) along with a nice $150 - $250 price tag."
Sounds like you're in the market for an iPod mini.
"That would be cool. So until Apple decides to lower their prices, or a vendor think of an attractive design - this puppy rolls with his CD player."
Yep... you are indeed in the market for an iPod mini
>When you guys grow up and learn how to use two mouse buttons or *gasp* three, then I'll start listening again. Or has apple gotten rid of the one button mouse finally?
Wow... its interesting to see how igorant some peope still are about Apple. Apple has had support for multi-button mice since for years... I believe as far back as system 8 (maybe earlier?)
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I think it has less to do with stigma and more to do with which of the two companies provided a better solution.
you're incorrectly intertwining market share with install base. The problem with that is that market share is a figure that relates directly to quarterly or yearly sales figures (something that translate well to Linux and OS X because these platforms tend to outlive their usefullness as compared to their Windows competition this compelling individuals to keep aging hardware longer and not make another sale) Linux has it even wose than OS X, because Linux is distributed for free, so in most cases... it wont translate to a "sale" Think of it like this... if a single Windows user buys 4 computers in 4 years and a Linux or OSX user buys 1 computer in that same time period, the way "marketshare" works is that Windows would have the lions share of the market while Linux and OSX users would be religated to a fraction of that figure EVEN THOUGH THE SAME NUMBER OF INDIVIDUALS WOULD BE USING THE COMPUTER. If the *Install Base* term were used instead, each platform would occupy the same number of users. Unfortunately, this misappropriation of words has caused the entire population to believe market share translates to install base. This must change. The alternative OS community must work in unison to break this trend by correctly using the appropriate term to describe one or the other.
Ya, but we all know that what you really meant is that Steve jobs 0WNs Microsoft
In the same respect that one might understood if I said,
"I 0WNs JOO!"
Call me when you have a version for OS X.
7-9 fans for the PPC 970s based on 130 nanometer process.
.65 nanometer process which are much cooler than their predecessor.
Chips used in this XBox would be using G5s based on the
I think the opposite... software should accomidate hardware. Software should be the comodity and hardware the primary asset.
Really?
I'm surprised anyone would say this? His show made me laugh almost as hard as Tom Green used to. (on his first show... not that lame talk show he later got)
Since Ali G got taken off the air in the United States, few Americans will understand the understated reference to Ali's precurser to any type of review. if I had mod point, I would have given you some.
Since you can take a PC drive and put it into a Mac... but a PC cant accept the Mac drive... which computer is less compatible now?
Geez man... all you need to do is visit www.apple.com/xserve and you will see that Apple sells rack mounted serves with all of these clasifications.
Shoot, right on the front of that page at the very top is a description of their new 1U rackmount server.
G5s XServes already have ECC Ram.
Screw themselves?
Telling them to upgrade their computer is hardly telling them to go screw themselves... especially when it can produce a better result anyways.
"But that's not a problem, because there's a little arrow to show that it's a shortcut, or no arrow if it's not."
You're missing the point entierly. The dock is an application launching point. Its not a destination point.
Various locations between folders should allow items to be moved as you would expect them to be moved... not aliased. The fact that its got an arrow after it doesn't make it inconsistant. Apple's solution on the other hand IS consistant. Applications in the dock that are running always have arrows... those that aren't... dont. Applications that get moved ARE moved, and applications that are alaised (shortcutted) ARE shortcutted.
"What is this amazing ability of Mac users to bash a feature in Windows but defend that very same feature in MacOS?"
Because its not the same. What is this amazing ability of Windows users to look past Windows inconsistancies and try to find fault in Mac OS when its not similar to the way they are familiar with doing things on Windows?
"The problem with that is the dock icons can represent at least five different things:
Running applications"
Not a problem... there's a little arrow to show that the application is running... or no arrow if its not.
"non-running applications"
Again... no arrow. (No problem there)
"folders"
Again, no problem... easy to distinguish folders from application icons.
"files"
No problem. Application files/documents look different from the application icon itself, but look distinctly different from other application file/documents.
"and open windows (minimized.)"
Because the minized window is the image of what the maximized image would otherwise be (rather than a generic icon to represent it)... this too is not a problem.
"So by moving things to the desktop... what are you asking it to do? Move the application?"
Moving things to the desktop does exactly what you would expect it to do... move it to the desktop. (Unlike Windows which is inconsistant... sometimes creating a shortcut and other times moving the file itself)
"create an alias?"
Moving a file from one location to the next should never create an alias.
"move a window to the desktop (can't really do that.)"
Why would you want to do that?
"move a document to the desktop?"
We already covered this
"a folder?"
That has its own function key. No problem there.
"Apple people have a shittier time with their dock"
Apple don't have "a shittier time with their dock". You are simply hearing from a vocal minority. The rest of us love the dock.
Curious, how does XP handle icon resizing and such if its a dock clone. I'd imagine it the scaling and the clarity of the icons would look very bad because the UI is not vector based like OS X.
"If you notice in Windows XP, you can't change the size of the taskbar"
When items get added to it... something's got to give. You either need to make the items smaller or show less image data. Apple chose the wiser of the two options before it. The ability to lock the dock would be a step backwards IMHO.
"For the OS X dock this would be a good feature beacuse it is easy to accidentally remove programs from the dock by slightly dragging the mouse when you double click"
You don't double click items in the dock to launch/activate them. Its all single-click. Second, you have to drag an item relatively far outside the dock to remove it. If you slightly move it... (as per your analogy) the item snaps back to its origional position.
"and it is easy to change the size of the dock by accidentally dragging the mouse on the border."
You don't resize the dock by dragging the mouse on its border. You have to command-click the line-seperator and drag... (a combination you wouldn't be using otherwise when at the dock and so it makes the chance of accidentally re-sizing the dock almost impossible.
"I found this to be really arrogant. It was like the boys from NeXT came in and simply assumed they knew better than everybody else"
Not arrogant at all. The guys at NeXT DID know better and so therefore it was right to take over Apple's former UI staff. Guys like TOG are just bitter about it.
If the mods don't pump this guy's post up to (Score:5, Insightful) then there is certinly no justice in this world...
[roll eyes]
"All documents look the same" Um, no they don't. "But for the most part he is right. All documents look the same, no tagging, trash can in the dock, dragging from the dock erases what you drag. It's dangerous." No it doesn't. Dragging to the dock creates an alias (shortcut for you Windows users). Dragging away from the dock simply d-letes the alias
Lockable? What do you mean?
When did Microsoft get a finder Window?
Funny, I always consider that its benefit.
Why is rio such a big deal? Apple's iPod market share is MUCH MUCH larger than Rio's.
> I would like to see a vendor incorporate the same style mechanisms that Apple used (like the minimalist design that offers a lot of functionality at m fingertips) along with a nice $150 - $250 price tag." Sounds like you're in the market for an iPod mini. "That would be cool. So until Apple decides to lower their prices, or a vendor think of an attractive design - this puppy rolls with his CD player." Yep... you are indeed in the market for an iPod mini
>When you guys grow up and learn how to use two mouse buttons or *gasp* three, then I'll start listening again. Or has apple gotten rid of the one button mouse finally? Wow... its interesting to see how igorant some peope still are about Apple. Apple has had support for multi-button mice since for years... I believe as far back as system 8 (maybe earlier?)