We used to be a Winders shop here running 10 servers and 15 workstations running Winders on all machines. Now we have 25 servers and 17 workstations. ONLY 2 servers and 3 workstations are now running Winders.
The workstation this is being written on was bought with RedHat preinstalled at a lower price than if it had Winders on it and is still running RedHat. Price was not a factor in buying it this way. I would have paid more to have RedHat if I needed to. Why did I buy it that way??? I wanted it that way and it will remain to be a Linux box.
I'm fixing to buy a new laptop and HP is at the top of the list. Why? Linux pre-installed! I am not paying for software that I am not going to use. For the record I don't steal software either I am happy to PAY someone for their labor in producing software, and yes this workstation I am on has Linux apps that I PAID gladly for. Its not so much about free software. For me it is about what works and what is secure.
Anyone want to buy some Windows software? We ain't using it anymore.
Funny I haven't had any of the problems you described. Yes I have "invested" 1000's of hours in learning the system but I wouldn't say it was a waste. Hell I've invested 1000's of hours learning Winders too. This is how I make a living. Didn't you spend 100's of hours learning Winders? If you didn't the problem is obivous. Your problem isn't the OS but the user interface at the keyboard. You are right it ain't Winders.
You are right in the sense that is takes more to load an app on Linux but then again this is what keeps web sites from autoloading crap on my workstation I didn't ask for. Personally I put up with the little extra it takes to load an app than to hassle of cleaning spyware off my machine once a week.
The truth is I like Winders ease of use and their openess of their OS I make a lot of money fixing them because of the barn doors they left open.
Maybe I can't play the latest and greatest game on my Linux box but then again I work with computers NOT play with them.
Your missing the point. Sure I'll do an install on 500 machines but not for free. Yes GNUCash is free but labor isn't. The savings is lets say your going to load QuickBooks instead. The labor still cost and now you have 500 licenses to buy too. Or are you going to load those 500 copies of QuickBooks for free? Which is cheaper?
So where is your savings now running Winders?
Yes I do know about deployment of complex packages on a large scale and haven't had anymore problems than deploying the same on Winders. I guess keeping up with all those client licenses is no problem for you either....
As the Postmaster I can say your wrong about the cost. Yes your figures on bandwidth and such are about right BUT you forget the cost of the employees it takes to handle complaints, blocking sites, and research it takes to find the site spamming to block them. About 60% of my time is spent not dealing with normal operation of the servers but dealing with spam issues and I don't do this for free. since email is a free offering to customers profits from other services have to pay my wage for dealing with this problem.
We're a small company and spam costs our company about $3000.00 a month. Bandwidth and storage isn't the cost problem but labor is what cost.
I know I don't process a million spam complaits in a month so your guess of it costing $20 to $30 an month is WAY off base. Like I said I like to get paid just as anyone else does and this is the true cost of spam. Me sitting here at this workstation trying to keep the bastards out. Besides even if it does only cost 4micro$ per spam it is still THIEF OF SERVICES no matter how you cut it. Spamming is stealing. I'm sure whatever job you work at you don't work for free. Neither do I. Just as in anything the largest cost of something is normally in the labor.
The thing is if you go to a p0rn site or to a USENET group you want to go there. You went there on your own. You wanted to see it. Spam on the other hand is forced down your throat. You paid for your connection and are using the way you want. Spammers DON'T pay to send their sh_t. The best cure would be if they started finding them dead in the woods with spammer cut into their chest. Fear is a good ally.
Microsoft equips a lot of these machines. For less than a $1000 you can get the software you need from MS to this: Windows Server, Exchange with Outlook clients, SQL Server, the whole package. Out of the box each user has one password, one username. For e-mail (remote and locale), desktop logins, remote access, for desktop fax routing, ftp, web publishing, etc. Single-sign on.
I don't don't where you got you pricing structure, but you ain't buying all those M$ products for LESS the $1000.00. I haven't checked the prices in awhile, but the last time I bought W2K server it was $11280.00 with ONLY 10 client licenses. That was just for the server software. Last I checked MSSQL was around $3200.00 with ONLY 10 client licenses. Lets say you have just 20 people in an office and they all need a connection the to DB well then there is more money invloved. My MySQL DB doesn't care how many connections and it is faster and more reliable. My files server doesn't care how many connections ti has either.
We are a mixed shop here. Both Windows and Linux servers. With the Windows servers getting less and less in here. Yes Linux and most of its is for the most part harder to set up. It takes about 2.5 hours to set up a W2K box. It takes me about 4 hours to set up a RedHat box. This means that I have spent 1.5 hours longer on the set up. now if I pay $1280.00 for W2K and either got Fedora for free or paid (I think) $150.00 for RedHat Enterprize. Haven't I saved money? Maybe took a bit longer. Then comes the license issue? RedHat doesn't care how many clients I have hanging on my server M$ does! Then we have the security issues (Oh yea I forgot my 34 item security check list for basic server configuration on W2K another 2 hours) A basic Rehat Load everything is turned off. Yes it takes longer to turn on what I need, but isn't this easier and better than with MS going and turning OFF everything I DON'T need or even want? Hell somethings you don't want that comes with M$ you CAN"T TURN OFF!
It isn't that I'm a zelot about any system. I am a Systems Engineer I use what works and is reliable, and cost isn't that big of a factor. If I could find a reason to pay M$ prices for a BETTER OS I would. The reason I don't pay and use Linux is that it is better, more reliable, and more secure. If Windows was better I would pay the price and run it. As an engineer what I know is I spend more time working on the M$ boxes that the Linux boxes. This is what my customers look at too. They like to pay me as little as possible. Time sheets don't lie. Some may say "Oh you spend more time on the Windows platform because you don't know it." WRONG!!!! I have work with NT since 3.51. I have that worthless piece of plastic too. I am the first to admit it that yes I do know Linux as well not near the knowledge that I have on Winders. Yes Linux does take me longer sometimes because of my lack of knowledge on it but this isn't the fault of the OS. It is a matter of my training. Once whatever it is to learn is learned it is simple the next time. I don't bloat the time sheet because of my lack of skill and blame it on the OS. Hey we can't know everything, but I can learn.
Yes single signon is "tightly intergrated" into the Windows OS, but it is right there in the Linux CD too! You just have to load it and turn it on! NIS works quiet well
Is Linux read for Joe User? NO! One day it will be.
You are wrong. It is the author's lawyer doing this. When you hire a shark they become you "Acting Agent". Other words they are YOU, and acting on your desires and acting in your behalf. So Katie T. is the perp it this one.
To me it would seem that after being a victim herself it would give her some insite and wouldn't victimize others.
Does everyone else see a trend here? Just today all the articles on lawyers and the law suits. Like to one posted today about some lawyer getting his feelings hurt because someone called him a name on Yahoo. If we followed Shakesphere's advice and took all the lawyers out and shot them. I do think the world would be a better place. At least there wouldn't be all these suits.
This case is a case of site hijacking. If anyone should get anything out of the it should be Katie Jones. After all she was there first.
Thank you for your email. Being a Vietnam Vet at one time I really enjoyed killing. Since then I haven't had the oppertunity to kill anyone legally in the last 30 years and I truly love a fire fight. I look forward to the arrival of your hench men and have left my front door unlocked for easy access. You will recieve their heads via Fedex next day air after feeding their bodies to my hounds to confirm the kills.
To keep your company from suffering the loss of capital covering the death of your employees please send $80,000.00 US DOLLARS to my paypal account.
As An American I do understand you response and agree with a lot of what you say, but you forget. The Internet is not controled by any country. It is privately owned companies that supply the network connection even to the goverments themselves.
We block IP ranges we don't really look or care what country. We block troublemmakers. Yes we have blocked alomost whole countries but it is not the country but the ISP we are blocking. Yes we block American networks too. Mostly likely most of our block are on US IP ranges.
No goverment can do anything about this really but cutting off an ISP and having their customers called them and complain or take their money somewhere else WILL make a change. It all about profit.
The Internet is not free. It is not owned by any country. It is a network of PRIVATELY owned networks. I as an owner of this little network have the right to refuse service to anyone. You say help the country what if they don't want the help. Besides how can I help Spain? It isn't Spain its Telefónica' that is the problem.
I is not my job to police the network in Spain, but it is my job to protect my customers. Spain doesn't pay me my customers do and they want this. I am the police here on this network and the ONLY recourse I have to stop these crimes is to cut them off at the firewall. IF Spain or Telefónica' want to pay us to police and clean up their network we will be happy to do this. Again the Internet is made of privately owned networks that must get paid to pay their employees to do this work. The Internet is not FREE! It is not paid for by countries but by private compaines like us. We ALLOW you to connect.
You as the comsumer have the tools to fight this. QUIT PAYING THEM MONEY!!! Sooner or later they will go broke and be replaced by another ISP or will figure out they are losing money and stop allow spammers and scammers to use their network. It a matter of policeing the networks which is the ISPs job. Do bad things on this network and you WILL get cut off.
I am doing what I can to stop these crimes against MY customers who PAY ME! It called the blacklist. Sorry but this is a job that pays for me to live and the ONLY responsibility I have is to my paying customers and they LIKE my blacklist. Get Telefónica' to pay us $2,000.00US per month for spam processing and we will lift the ban. Until then I am truly sorry for cutting you off but it is really up to me to only do something about it for my customers and to protect them. Its really up to YOU. You pay for the network your on. Think about it with your connection you are indirectly promoting spam and scams. Get another provider. Or CALL YOUR PROVIDER and complain.
Don't complain here. Complain to Telefónica' they are the ones that are allowing massive amounts of spam going out of their system which makes postmasters like me kill IP ranges at the firewall. I am sorry about your problem but Slashdot nor I am the cause of you getting turned off.
ISPs like are the cause of you getting turned off. There is only one recourse. Find another one and quit paying money to the ones that allow such traffic to flow out of their network. The only way to stop this is the hit the ISP in the pocket book. This is the reason they allow spamming is they are making money off of the spammers.
Hey I too am sorry about that and if Telefónica' will send me a check for $2000.00US a month for spam processing I will turn them and you back on. I do understand its not you but somebody needs to pay for my bandwidth. Right now people pay me to turn Telefónica' off!
If they sue me for downloading music maybe I can give them my dirty socks as payment.
Re:Haliburton's burned hallowed hurtin' ballads
on
Linux in Iraq
·
· Score: 1
I would Mod you "Insightful" It doesn't matter what Linux will do or won't do. It is a matter of who is paying and who is getting the money. How can all these companies with no-bid contracts make money from free software when they make cost+30% ???? They can't so they would rather get an inflated price on paper and then an under the table kick back to them and tack 30% on the inflated paper price. You can't do that with free downloads or $40.00 a box copy of software.
How do I know this? I have work on jobs like this and have seen it time and time again. You see this is what the war is all about $$$$$ in the right peoples pocket.
Blow it all up your friends that make the bombs and the planes make BILLIONS. Then you frineds in the construction business (some are the same that helped you blow it up in the first palce) come along and rebuild it for BILLIONS. You and your friends get rich. People die and our counrty goes broke, but they get the cash!
Sounds like a winning plan if you are on the right side of the fence.
Same song and dance they did to the Indians here so long ago and the music keeps playing. Only the name of the people that we refer to as "Savages" changes.
I hate to disagree with you but, I've been a postmaster of mail servers for a lot of years. Yes open relays used to be a problem. Now its home users on broadband connections. Most of what I see comes from Commcast.
I wish it was open relays that was the problem they are easy to fix by blocking the IP subnet. You can't do this really unless you block Commcast althogether, and this doesn't work. These spammers have 1000's of zombie machines so they use one and then move to another. They do this hourly.
I do think that the owner of the machine should to something to cover the cost of the problem BUT I think the orginators are the ones that should be strung up by the balls. Personally I see this as a hack and hacking now comes under the homeland security act and carries a 10 year sentence. I think 10 years in jail rooming with one of the users of their penis enlargment formuals would be fine!
I really don't see why the laws are the way they are. They can hijack a machine and all is well. I hack their network and I go to jail for 10 years. They say the scales of justice are balanced. I think somebody needs to check the bitch's scale and her blindfold.
My passwords are secure. They are on a post-it note under the keyboard. Please don't tell anybody. Besides I use "password" for the password no one would ever guess that!
Linksys doesn't make drivers for their PMICA wireless cards and aren't intrested in making any either. I have talked with them. Isn't it weird that a company whose OS for all their hardware is UNIX based doesn't make UNIX drivers for their cards.
Slashdot Mirror
The workstation this is being written on was bought with RedHat preinstalled at a lower price than if it had Winders on it and is still running RedHat. Price was not a factor in buying it this way. I would have paid more to have RedHat if I needed to. Why did I buy it that way??? I wanted it that way and it will remain to be a Linux box.
I'm fixing to buy a new laptop and HP is at the top of the list. Why? Linux pre-installed! I am not paying for software that I am not going to use. For the record I don't steal software either I am happy to PAY someone for their labor in producing software, and yes this workstation I am on has Linux apps that I PAID gladly for. Its not so much about free software. For me it is about what works and what is secure.
Anyone want to buy some Windows software? We ain't using it anymore.
Funny I haven't had any of the problems you described. Yes I have "invested" 1000's of hours in learning the system but I wouldn't say it was a waste. Hell I've invested 1000's of hours learning Winders too. This is how I make a living. Didn't you spend 100's of hours learning Winders? If you didn't the problem is obivous. Your problem isn't the OS but the user interface at the keyboard. You are right it ain't Winders.
You are right in the sense that is takes more to load an app on Linux but then again this is what keeps web sites from autoloading crap on my workstation I didn't ask for. Personally I put up with the little extra it takes to load an app than to hassle of cleaning spyware off my machine once a week.
The truth is I like Winders ease of use and their openess of their OS I make a lot of money fixing them because of the barn doors they left open.
Maybe I can't play the latest and greatest game on my Linux box but then again I work with computers NOT play with them.
So where is your savings now running Winders?
Yes I do know about deployment of complex packages on a large scale and haven't had anymore problems than deploying the same on Winders. I guess keeping up with all those client licenses is no problem for you either....
We're a small company and spam costs our company about $3000.00 a month. Bandwidth and storage isn't the cost problem but labor is what cost.
I know I don't process a million spam complaits in a month so your guess of it costing $20 to $30 an month is WAY off base. Like I said I like to get paid just as anyone else does and this is the true cost of spam. Me sitting here at this workstation trying to keep the bastards out. Besides even if it does only cost 4micro$ per spam it is still THIEF OF SERVICES no matter how you cut it. Spamming is stealing. I'm sure whatever job you work at you don't work for free. Neither do I. Just as in anything the largest cost of something is normally in the labor.
1: Insert CD or your favorite disto
2: Run install
3: Never pay M$ tax again
4: For support read the online info on your favorite distro.
The thing is if you go to a p0rn site or to a USENET group you want to go there. You went there on your own. You wanted to see it. Spam on the other hand is forced down your throat. You paid for your connection and are using the way you want. Spammers DON'T pay to send their sh_t. The best cure would be if they started finding them dead in the woods with spammer cut into their chest. Fear is a good ally.
You all have done a wonderful job with a GREAT product. Keep up the good work. Yes your company is a great example that Open Source works!
I don't don't where you got you pricing structure, but you ain't buying all those M$ products for LESS the $1000.00. I haven't checked the prices in awhile, but the last time I bought W2K server it was $11280.00 with ONLY 10 client licenses. That was just for the server software. Last I checked MSSQL was around $3200.00 with ONLY 10 client licenses. Lets say you have just 20 people in an office and they all need a connection the to DB well then there is more money invloved. My MySQL DB doesn't care how many connections and it is faster and more reliable. My files server doesn't care how many connections ti has either.
We are a mixed shop here. Both Windows and Linux servers. With the Windows servers getting less and less in here. Yes Linux and most of its is for the most part harder to set up. It takes about 2.5 hours to set up a W2K box. It takes me about 4 hours to set up a RedHat box. This means that I have spent 1.5 hours longer on the set up. now if I pay $1280.00 for W2K and either got Fedora for free or paid (I think) $150.00 for RedHat Enterprize. Haven't I saved money? Maybe took a bit longer. Then comes the license issue? RedHat doesn't care how many clients I have hanging on my server M$ does! Then we have the security issues (Oh yea I forgot my 34 item security check list for basic server configuration on W2K another 2 hours) A basic Rehat Load everything is turned off. Yes it takes longer to turn on what I need, but isn't this easier and better than with MS going and turning OFF everything I DON'T need or even want? Hell somethings you don't want that comes with M$ you CAN"T TURN OFF!
It isn't that I'm a zelot about any system. I am a Systems Engineer I use what works and is reliable, and cost isn't that big of a factor. If I could find a reason to pay M$ prices for a BETTER OS I would. The reason I don't pay and use Linux is that it is better, more reliable, and more secure. If Windows was better I would pay the price and run it. As an engineer what I know is I spend more time working on the M$ boxes that the Linux boxes. This is what my customers look at too. They like to pay me as little as possible. Time sheets don't lie. Some may say "Oh you spend more time on the Windows platform because you don't know it." WRONG!!!! I have work with NT since 3.51. I have that worthless piece of plastic too. I am the first to admit it that yes I do know Linux as well not near the knowledge that I have on Winders. Yes Linux does take me longer sometimes because of my lack of knowledge on it but this isn't the fault of the OS. It is a matter of my training. Once whatever it is to learn is learned it is simple the next time. I don't bloat the time sheet because of my lack of skill and blame it on the OS. Hey we can't know everything, but I can learn.
Yes single signon is "tightly intergrated" into the Windows OS, but it is right there in the Linux CD too! You just have to load it and turn it on! NIS works quiet well
Is Linux read for Joe User? NO! One day it will be.
Kind of sad when harvard.edu's network won't take a little traffic. 404 page article.pl not found
You are wrong. It is the author's lawyer doing this. When you hire a shark they become you "Acting Agent". Other words they are YOU, and acting on your desires and acting in your behalf. So Katie T. is the perp it this one.
To me it would seem that after being a victim herself it would give her some insite and wouldn't victimize others.
Does everyone else see a trend here? Just today all the articles on lawyers and the law suits. Like to one posted today about some lawyer getting his feelings hurt because someone called him a name on Yahoo. If we followed Shakesphere's advice and took all the lawyers out and shot them. I do think the world would be a better place. At least there wouldn't be all these suits.
This case is a case of site hijacking. If anyone should get anything out of the it should be Katie Jones. After all she was there first.
Try SmoothWall Firewall. A great open source and easy to set up and use firewall.
SmoothWall.Dear Towogbola,
Thank you for your email. Being a Vietnam Vet at one time I really enjoyed killing. Since then I haven't had the oppertunity to kill anyone legally in the last 30 years and I truly love a fire fight. I look forward to the arrival of your hench men and have left my front door unlocked for easy access. You will recieve their heads via Fedex next day air after feeding their bodies to my hounds to confirm the kills.
To keep your company from suffering the loss of capital covering the death of your employees please send $80,000.00 US DOLLARS to my paypal account.
HAVE A BLESSED DAY!
Kindest Regards,
Epod DelelosiBut it cost you 60% more to live here. Where is the savings?
Don't they call this "The New World Order"?
We block IP ranges we don't really look or care what country. We block troublemmakers. Yes we have blocked alomost whole countries but it is not the country but the ISP we are blocking. Yes we block American networks too. Mostly likely most of our block are on US IP ranges.
No goverment can do anything about this really but cutting off an ISP and having their customers called them and complain or take their money somewhere else WILL make a change. It all about profit.
I is not my job to police the network in Spain, but it is my job to protect my customers. Spain doesn't pay me my customers do and they want this. I am the police here on this network and the ONLY recourse I have to stop these crimes is to cut them off at the firewall. IF Spain or Telefónica' want to pay us to police and clean up their network we will be happy to do this. Again the Internet is made of privately owned networks that must get paid to pay their employees to do this work. The Internet is not FREE! It is not paid for by countries but by private compaines like us. We ALLOW you to connect.
You as the comsumer have the tools to fight this. QUIT PAYING THEM MONEY!!! Sooner or later they will go broke and be replaced by another ISP or will figure out they are losing money and stop allow spammers and scammers to use their network. It a matter of policeing the networks which is the ISPs job. Do bad things on this network and you WILL get cut off.
I am doing what I can to stop these crimes against MY customers who PAY ME! It called the blacklist. Sorry but this is a job that pays for me to live and the ONLY responsibility I have is to my paying customers and they LIKE my blacklist. Get Telefónica' to pay us $2,000.00US per month for spam processing and we will lift the ban. Until then I am truly sorry for cutting you off but it is really up to me to only do something about it for my customers and to protect them. Its really up to YOU. You pay for the network your on. Think about it with your connection you are indirectly promoting spam and scams. Get another provider. Or CALL YOUR PROVIDER and complain.
ISPs like are the cause of you getting turned off. There is only one recourse. Find another one and quit paying money to the ones that allow such traffic to flow out of their network. The only way to stop this is the hit the ISP in the pocket book. This is the reason they allow spamming is they are making money off of the spammers.
Hey I too am sorry about that and if Telefónica' will send me a check for $2000.00US a month for spam processing I will turn them and you back on. I do understand its not you but somebody needs to pay for my bandwidth. Right now people pay me to turn Telefónica' off!
The government said an overhaul of the system should be finished by December and copies should be available then.
Yes! Right after the Elections!
Funny how that works
You are right. This is FUD. You don't have to use a tookit. Just use any handy text editor! Toolkits just speed up the process of writing code.
You forgot Student Loan Payments
If they sue me for downloading music maybe I can give them my dirty socks as payment.
How do I know this? I have work on jobs like this and have seen it time and time again. You see this is what the war is all about $$$$$ in the right peoples pocket.
Blow it all up your friends that make the bombs and the planes make BILLIONS. Then you frineds in the construction business (some are the same that helped you blow it up in the first palce) come along and rebuild it for BILLIONS. You and your friends get rich. People die and our counrty goes broke, but they get the cash!
Sounds like a winning plan if you are on the right side of the fence.
Same song and dance they did to the Indians here so long ago and the music keeps playing. Only the name of the people that we refer to as "Savages" changes.
REMEMBER IT MIGHT BE YOU NEXT!
I wish it was open relays that was the problem they are easy to fix by blocking the IP subnet. You can't do this really unless you block Commcast althogether, and this doesn't work. These spammers have 1000's of zombie machines so they use one and then move to another. They do this hourly.
I do think that the owner of the machine should to something to cover the cost of the problem BUT I think the orginators are the ones that should be strung up by the balls. Personally I see this as a hack and hacking now comes under the homeland security act and carries a 10 year sentence. I think 10 years in jail rooming with one of the users of their penis enlargment formuals would be fine!
I really don't see why the laws are the way they are. They can hijack a machine and all is well. I hack their network and I go to jail for 10 years. They say the scales of justice are balanced. I think somebody needs to check the bitch's scale and her blindfold.
computers are secure. People are unsecure.
Linksys doesn't make drivers for their PMICA wireless cards and aren't intrested in making any either. I have talked with them. Isn't it weird that a company whose OS for all their hardware is UNIX based doesn't make UNIX drivers for their cards.