An interesting thought - people are starting to get their 911 service through VoIP.
What if, god forbid, because of providers tinkering with QoS, someone needs to make an emergency 911 call and can't or results in a call thats utterly unable to be understood?
Wouldn't that make the ISP in question doing the tinkering liable for interfering with a life or death situation?
Those free CDs dont have the license/copyrights changed/stripped out, and nearly almost always have the manpages/doc files to go with the binaries they install, which detail who wrote the program, the copyright, etc. You may not be able to get the source on CD, but you can usually always get the source through the web.
On the other hand, CherryOS not only stripped out the license/copyright, but there is no source, and the author is claiming he wrote it all. He's also stealing code/binaries from HFV Explorer, Winrar, OpenVPN.
Honestly, there are still quite a few ISPs out there that DON'T do proper filtering on incoming packets, let alone outgoing packets.
The spammers are getting smart and using these tricks to get around port 25 blocks, for example. Use a dialup account, and route outbound traffic from the dialup IP via a company's T1/T3.
Ever wonder why DDoS attacks are hard to track proper at times? Well, now you know. Because of the lack of proper filtering on alot of networks, drones can easily spoof.
Re:Not everyone uses IRC for illegal things...
on
Is IRC All Bad?
·
· Score: 1
Noone is perfect. Perhaps your time would be better spent doing other things then correcting people's spelling mistakes on Slashdot...
Not everyone uses IRC for illegal things...
on
Is IRC All Bad?
·
· Score: 2, Insightful
Not everyone uses IRC for illegal things. Let me give some great examples of why I use IRC and the advantages I see:
1. FreeMatrix radio chat for the radio shows
2. No lame fonts and other stupid things like sound effects - easy to strip out the colors too from the AOL newbies who don't realize how rude it is
3. No bulky chat clients. Can IRC using only a text based interface if I want to, or even mIRC or the java chat client I have on my website
4. Ignore, kick, ban, kline, gline, need I say more?
5. Ability to communicate with alot of the people I work with who normally I can't get in touch with due to distance or expense.
Theres ALOT of good things going on IRC if you take the time and look. But of course, the GOOD things on IRC wouldn't make for a very interesting or popular story would it?
Here's a novel idea, that people with a clue would have figured out. Obviously, the guy who filed the lawsuit didn't realize this, nor did you:
Burn the music to CD
Rip the CD in whatever the hell program you want and copy to your *Generic MP3/WMA player here*.
Logic. Pure and simple logic, which obviously escaped you.
You don't see Apple users going around suing Microsoft for making their music only available in WMA format - though its not a bad idea if this bonehead goes through with his lawsuit.
What makes you think that even if they didn't spend all the money on the spectrum, that they would spend it on future investment? Most likely, instead the CEO or board director's pockets will be lined with quite a bit of it.
It costs that person distributing flyers - the paper, the toner/ink, etc. That comes out of their pocket, not yours. That is why I'm willing to tolerate junk mail - because I'm not footing the bill for it.
On the other hand, those of us who pay for bandwidth, servers, etc end up footing the bill for spam, because its our system that has to accept/store the crap.
Imagine if the junk mailers started sending their crap COD through the mail, and expected you to pay for it.
Now, if spammers want to pay me a monthly fee of around $10,000 to cover expenses associated with them using my resources, as well as make sure my users get paid for the time they spend reading the spam, I may let them in.
Just one problem - if your school is like the high schools around here, they are installing wi-fi 802.11b networks in the schools for the laptops that they just gave to all students (out of our tax dollars none the less. Considering I live in one of the richest areas of NJ, the parents can more then afford to get their kids laptops...)
But hey, wasting money is common these days. I could see them putting in wireless, then putting in the jammers thinking it will only block the DS.
No, MSN Premium is optional. I may not have their fiber service, but I have DSL through Verizon. MSN Premium is only required if you plan to take advantage of some of their extra features.
Yes, there are legit IRC users left. Its my primary method of communication with the people who host services on my equipment, or to coordinate upgrades, or whatever we need to do that requires real time communication.
To attack IRC servers just because thats the place where the bots go, is assanine and illegal. Some servers have 5000+ users on them, and the people who own/run those servers have enough problems as it is dealing with attacks from packet monkeys.
How would you like it if I DDoS'd your server because one of your users sent out spam? You'd probably be screaming bloody murder to the FBI about it.
Unless you are willing to allow other people to do the same things you want do to them at the exact same levels, don't even suggest that attacks are a way of dealing with a problem.
Just because someone does something illegal to you, does not mean you have a right to do something illegal to them.
Lets take an example:
Doctor pirates your program because he wants to record something, but doesn't want to pay. He enters a pirated key, which then in turn rm -fr's ~ directory.
Now, ~ contains patient records and prescription information, which are now all gone. Because Doctor's records are gone, doctor does not know that Mrs Granny Smith is allergic to PCN, and he gives her a prescription to take it for an ear infection.
Mrs Granny Smith dies from a reaction.
You know what that means to you, the developer of the program, right?
You are guilty of causing her death indirectly. A jury would still most likely convict you, even though what the doctor did was wrong and illegal himself.
You could go to jail for a long time, all because you went overboard with your anti-piracy measures.
A far out possibility, but it could still happen. There are alot of things that could happen thanks to your program's actions.
You could destroy the work of someone with more money then you'd make in 100 lifetimes, and has the best lawyers on the planet, and find yourself on the receiving end of a lawsuit you can't possibly win, even if what he was doing was illegal.
Hopefully this will be a good lesson to all shareware developers who are considering this type of anti-piracy methods.
You'd be surprised at the amount of people who are involved with development, but you never hear about, or have their names in the documentation.
The SOSDG doesn't have any full coding projects of its own, however we do our own ports of applications to Windows, and provide hosting, programmers, and management support to dozens of projects.
Sometimes, its the little things that matter - the beta testing, the packaging, etc. I personally, while not a programmer anymore, do project management and beta testing on things. I find bugs, make sure that people have the server power they need for development, stuff like that.
Even the smallest thing in Open Source development can be rewarding.
Didn't people say the same thing when the iMac came out with no floppy drive? With a PC, sometimes the floppy drive is the only way to recover from serious disasters, thanks to the lack of a halfway decent recovery method in Windows.
I did not take into account the fact that the GPL states that the binary that the end user gets must be able to be redistributed to anyone else, fee or not, on their whim, without the restrictions.
This means, that according to the GPL, the shareware GPL'd XChat, you'd have to distribute the serial number that unlocks it as well in order to be fully compliant, or distribute the unlocked binary. You can not legally redistribute the locked binary without the serial number.
Once we have the site confirmed available again, and we can find out the exact details of what he changed, we should be able to approach him as necessary to fix the situation.
What we need to know is:
What has been added/changed with the Windows version exactly?
We know theres timebomb code in it, so where is this timebomb code exactly in the main tree, and if its not in the main tree, why is it not? What are the changes needed to build the Windows version, and if they are not in the main tree, why not?
I'm willing to give him a chance to correct his violation of the GPL, if he hasn't done it already.
I'm a reasonable person, as are many other people here, and I think it would be appropriate to let him fix his oversight/mistake within a decent time frame (possibly a few days?). I'd also like to know who he cleared this with legally, as this is one dangerous move on his part, especially with all the contributed code.
I could see him not getting legal advice if the code was all his, but since this project has code from possibly hundreds of other people, where were their voices when he decided to do this?
If he isn't providing the changes, then focus on that. Forget the fact he's charging for it, he's releasing modified GPL'd code in binary only form without providing the changes.
That is the key thing here.
The fact he's charging for the binary is moot if he is providing the code to everything he's done.
My take on this is that it is ok for him to charge for Windows binaries, provided that he makes the changes that he does to the Win version available to the world with the rest of XChat.
He also has to make available to the world the source code for every library he links with thats covered under the GPL.
This means that he can't build in hidden/extra features to the XChat for Windows client without giving them to everyone. That, would be a violation of the GPL.
Based on how I've read the GPL and how I've personally used it, he hasn't violated the license provided he compiles with the source requirements.
I'll also note that this does not stop anyone from building a completely free and uncrippled version for Windows and releasing it to the public (since you have the same code he used to build his version, this shouldn't be too hard for someone with experience building highly portable UNIX/Linux GUI apps under Windows).
If you don't like how XChat is being done, may I suggest using my port of ircII EPIC4 For Windows at http://www.sosdg.org/epic4-win32. Source is of course, available to anyone and everyone, and its completely uncrippled.
Slashdot Mirror
An interesting thought - people are starting to get their 911 service through VoIP.
What if, god forbid, because of providers tinkering with QoS, someone needs to make an emergency 911 call and can't or results in a call thats utterly unable to be understood?
Wouldn't that make the ISP in question doing the tinkering liable for interfering with a life or death situation?
Those free CDs dont have the license/copyrights changed/stripped out, and nearly almost always have the manpages/doc files to go with the binaries they install, which detail who wrote the program, the copyright, etc. You may not be able to get the source on CD, but you can usually always get the source through the web.
On the other hand, CherryOS not only stripped out the license/copyright, but there is no source, and the author is claiming he wrote it all. He's also stealing code/binaries from HFV Explorer, Winrar, OpenVPN.
There is a huge difference.
Hah, yeah right.
Honestly, there are still quite a few ISPs out there that DON'T do proper filtering on incoming packets, let alone outgoing packets.
The spammers are getting smart and using these tricks to get around port 25 blocks, for example. Use a dialup account, and route outbound traffic from the dialup IP via a company's T1/T3.
Ever wonder why DDoS attacks are hard to track proper at times? Well, now you know. Because of the lack of proper filtering on alot of networks, drones can easily spoof.
Well, we at the AHBL have dealt with this bastard of a program before, and here is our results of our interactions with it:
http://www.ahbl.org/notices/isearch.php
Noone is perfect. Perhaps your time would be better spent doing other things then correcting people's spelling mistakes on Slashdot...
Not everyone uses IRC for illegal things. Let me give some great examples of why I use IRC and the advantages I see:
1. FreeMatrix radio chat for the radio shows
2. No lame fonts and other stupid things like sound effects - easy to strip out the colors too from the AOL newbies who don't realize how rude it is
3. No bulky chat clients. Can IRC using only a text based interface if I want to, or even mIRC or the java chat client I have on my website
4. Ignore, kick, ban, kline, gline, need I say more?
5. Ability to communicate with alot of the people I work with who normally I can't get in touch with due to distance or expense.
Theres ALOT of good things going on IRC if you take the time and look. But of course, the GOOD things on IRC wouldn't make for a very interesting or popular story would it?
Here's a novel idea, that people with a clue would have figured out. Obviously, the guy who filed the lawsuit didn't realize this, nor did you:
Burn the music to CD
Rip the CD in whatever the hell program you want and copy to your *Generic MP3/WMA player here*.
Logic. Pure and simple logic, which obviously escaped you.
You don't see Apple users going around suing Microsoft for making their music only available in WMA format - though its not a bad idea if this bonehead goes through with his lawsuit.
This sounds an awful lot like what the mob does.
"Pay us protection money, and we'll make sure you no unfortunate accidents happen."
What makes you think that even if they didn't spend all the money on the spectrum, that they would spend it on future investment? Most likely, instead the CEO or board director's pockets will be lined with quite a bit of it.
Theft of service.
It costs that person distributing flyers - the paper, the toner/ink, etc. That comes out of their pocket, not yours. That is why I'm willing to tolerate junk mail - because I'm not footing the bill for it.
On the other hand, those of us who pay for bandwidth, servers, etc end up footing the bill for spam, because its our system that has to accept/store the crap.
Imagine if the junk mailers started sending their crap COD through the mail, and expected you to pay for it.
Now, if spammers want to pay me a monthly fee of around $10,000 to cover expenses associated with them using my resources, as well as make sure my users get paid for the time they spend reading the spam, I may let them in.
Ahh, one can dream...
No, but one can hope. :)
Just one problem - if your school is like the high schools around here, they are installing wi-fi 802.11b networks in the schools for the laptops that they just gave to all students (out of our tax dollars none the less. Considering I live in one of the richest areas of NJ, the parents can more then afford to get their kids laptops...)
But hey, wasting money is common these days. I could see them putting in wireless, then putting in the jammers thinking it will only block the DS.
"640kb should be enough for anyone"
Need I say anything more?
Got any other predictions Billy Boy?
Probably another Laura DiDidiot quote, cause after all, us Linux users are all suicide car bombers, right? :)
No, MSN Premium is optional. I may not have their fiber service, but I have DSL through Verizon. MSN Premium is only required if you plan to take advantage of some of their extra features.
Yes, there are legit IRC users left. Its my primary method of communication with the people who host services on my equipment, or to coordinate upgrades, or whatever we need to do that requires real time communication.
To attack IRC servers just because thats the place where the bots go, is assanine and illegal. Some servers have 5000+ users on them, and the people who own/run those servers have enough problems as it is dealing with attacks from packet monkeys.
How would you like it if I DDoS'd your server because one of your users sent out spam? You'd probably be screaming bloody murder to the FBI about it.
Unless you are willing to allow other people to do the same things you want do to them at the exact same levels, don't even suggest that attacks are a way of dealing with a problem.
Just because someone does something illegal to you, does not mean you have a right to do something illegal to them.
Lets take an example:
Doctor pirates your program because he wants to record something, but doesn't want to pay. He enters a pirated key, which then in turn rm -fr's ~ directory.
Now, ~ contains patient records and prescription information, which are now all gone. Because Doctor's records are gone, doctor does not know that Mrs Granny Smith is allergic to PCN, and he gives her a prescription to take it for an ear infection.
Mrs Granny Smith dies from a reaction.
You know what that means to you, the developer of the program, right?
You are guilty of causing her death indirectly. A jury would still most likely convict you, even though what the doctor did was wrong and illegal himself.
You could go to jail for a long time, all because you went overboard with your anti-piracy measures.
A far out possibility, but it could still happen. There are alot of things that could happen thanks to your program's actions.
You could destroy the work of someone with more money then you'd make in 100 lifetimes, and has the best lawyers on the planet, and find yourself on the receiving end of a lawsuit you can't possibly win, even if what he was doing was illegal.
Hopefully this will be a good lesson to all shareware developers who are considering this type of anti-piracy methods.
You'd be surprised at the amount of people who are involved with development, but you never hear about, or have their names in the documentation.
The SOSDG doesn't have any full coding projects of its own, however we do our own ports of applications to Windows, and provide hosting, programmers, and management support to dozens of projects.
Sometimes, its the little things that matter - the beta testing, the packaging, etc. I personally, while not a programmer anymore, do project management and beta testing on things. I find bugs, make sure that people have the server power they need for development, stuff like that.
Even the smallest thing in Open Source development can be rewarding.
Didn't people say the same thing when the iMac came out with no floppy drive? With a PC, sometimes the floppy drive is the only way to recover from serious disasters, thanks to the lack of a halfway decent recovery method in Windows.
Hmm, interesting quandry we have here.
I did not take into account the fact that the GPL states that the binary that the end user gets must be able to be redistributed to anyone else, fee or not, on their whim, without the restrictions.
This means, that according to the GPL, the shareware GPL'd XChat, you'd have to distribute the serial number that unlocks it as well in order to be fully compliant, or distribute the unlocked binary. You can not legally redistribute the locked binary without the serial number.
This could get very interesting.
Once we have the site confirmed available again, and we can find out the exact details of what he changed, we should be able to approach him as necessary to fix the situation.
What we need to know is:
What has been added/changed with the Windows version exactly?
We know theres timebomb code in it, so where is this timebomb code exactly in the main tree, and if its not in the main tree, why is it not? What are the changes needed to build the Windows version, and if they are not in the main tree, why not?
I'm willing to give him a chance to correct his violation of the GPL, if he hasn't done it already.
I'm a reasonable person, as are many other people here, and I think it would be appropriate to let him fix his oversight/mistake within a decent time frame (possibly a few days?). I'd also like to know who he cleared this with legally, as this is one dangerous move on his part, especially with all the contributed code.
I could see him not getting legal advice if the code was all his, but since this project has code from possibly hundreds of other people, where were their voices when he decided to do this?
If he isn't providing the changes, then focus on that. Forget the fact he's charging for it, he's releasing modified GPL'd code in binary only form without providing the changes.
That is the key thing here.
The fact he's charging for the binary is moot if he is providing the code to everything he's done.
My take on this is that it is ok for him to charge for Windows binaries, provided that he makes the changes that he does to the Win version available to the world with the rest of XChat.
He also has to make available to the world the source code for every library he links with thats covered under the GPL.
This means that he can't build in hidden/extra features to the XChat for Windows client without giving them to everyone. That, would be a violation of the GPL.
Based on how I've read the GPL and how I've personally used it, he hasn't violated the license provided he compiles with the source requirements.
I'll also note that this does not stop anyone from building a completely free and uncrippled version for Windows and releasing it to the public (since you have the same code he used to build his version, this shouldn't be too hard for someone with experience building highly portable UNIX/Linux GUI apps under Windows).
If you don't like how XChat is being done, may I suggest using my port of ircII EPIC4 For Windows at http://www.sosdg.org/epic4-win32. Source is of course, available to anyone and everyone, and its completely uncrippled.
Given the recent way Microsoft is naming their products (ME, MOM, HIM, etc), It could be Windows XP YOU, or Windows XP HER.
:-)
Anyone want to come up with what the letters stand for?
I love the older Intellimouse with the scrollwheel. Very solid, very reliable.
However, I can't say the same for many of their more current mice. They just feel... Weird.
I'd venture to say that Darl shared some of his special stash with Microsoft again.
Either that, or mad spammer disease is starting to mutate...