And with all this expenditure, they now (within the economic crisis) are trying to make more money back by making all sorts of people swallow some unproven facts.... here http://it.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/02/11/007216
The problem comes from when M$ feels the crunch and has to resort to even more evil tactics then usual. Open source is actually safer, because the code is open for all to see, who in their right mind (expert opinion here) after finding a flaw, would not wake the community up to it, and help by fixing it, because if he doesn't someone else will, and get the credit for it.... so I don't agree with M$ on this one...they are just strapped for cash...maybe they should stop spending so much on crappy ideas, and more on reorganization of the company infrastructure.
And these are the same people claiming great security for my pc, because they know how to handle threats. If they can't even write good web code for their site, my guess is they don't for their products either.
This is a free site, to post freely anything you want, without paying anything, so if anything happens, you can not blame anyone. If you pay 30/month for a website, that has a posting blog forum on it, and you have backups, and something goes wrong, then you can call and say, please restore the backup.
If its free, then you can't complain, same as having a hotmail account without a backup system for your emails...what do you expect? You are not in control.
>Does this mean finally that we all approve that the carbon dating process they use to know how old things are, is greatly flawed, or are you telling me that when the earth was a mere gas ball, yes....there actually was humans using tools...?
No i think you understood properly, I tend to not believe that carbon dating is accurate enough to believe in. This was my first sentence, it was also my first thought....about the carbon dating process being flawed. Ok...maybe I will say it another unless this is unclear... I do not believe the carbon dating process is factual. Ok, wait in case you didn't get that.... carbon dating can be manipulated, so I can not put my faith in this....as I can religion. Did I say i did not believe in God, no.... I said I don't believe in religion (or is that confusing to you too?)
Well, now I guess you may think this will go on until you claim the last word, however I am pleased to remind you that although, you stimulate some points of interest for the uneducated, I might suggest this debate be taken on with a grain of salt, as I merely state my opinion, and distrust for most forms of brainwash that have you thinking a certain way because it is the only way they themselves can think.
Einstein was a genius, not for his ideas purely, but more so for his style of thinking, as many others that push the boundaries of cemented lame *ss scientific proofing. I can only state so many times, that it is my opinion, some of the techniques used to prove carbon dating works, are also the same techniques used to falsify those claims.
If i take a 13th century Japanese sword and age it with a few well know techniques, the carbon dating will show it was made 13th century even though I just bought it at Walmart 2 days ago (actually the process takes a few months..) my point remains...
HOW COULD I TRUST A LOCK THAT I KNOW 40% OF THE BURGLARS CAN PICK, SHOULD I FEEL HAPPY ABOUT THE 60% THAT CAN'T? A 12 YEAR OLD GIRL COULD BUST MY LOCK... I DON'T CARE, I OWN NOTHING, BUT IF I DID... I WOULD KEEP IT IN A PLACE WHERE SUCH A HIGH PERCENT EXISTS FOR BREAKING IN.
SO HOW CAN I FEEL SAFE WITH A PROCEDURE THAT TELLS ME CERTAIN ITEMS CAN BE MANIPULATED TO SHOW THEY COME FROM THE MOON 2 MILLION YEARS AGO, WHEN I DUG THEM UP LAST NIGHT IN MY BACKYARD. BUT THAT IS BECAUSE I AM ONE OF THE FEW THAT FALLS IN THE PERCENTILE THAT CAN MANIPULATE THIS RESULT. DO I TRUST THIS...HECK NO, I WILL TRUST WHEN SOMEONE SAYS THEY UNCOVERED A WHOLE CITY (WHICH WOULD PROVE TOO MUCH SIZE TO MANIPULATE ENTIRELY TO MAKE SUCH A CLAIM) Uncover 1000s of tools and bones and remains and what not, I will believe you, uncover one arrow head, I will laugh.... what a puny arrow head you have.
I wonder if that same script would come in handy, while your wife is leaving the shopping center, and arriving at my house, and stays over for about 2 hours, I could have her tracker going in circles around the parking lot making it look like she is really looking for parking, and then back home.
Yeah, please, when you are finished writing this script, mind sending it to me?
We can go to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth to get a history lesson, billions of years ago based on supposed evolution theory, but again I will state one final time my mere opinion.
If we all think the theory of relativity is good enough to explain 100% of our problems... I say nay! Those are the 100% of the problems we know about, yet there are unknown problems we still know nothing about, so technically we can use e=mc2 100%-n% of the time to explain with accuracy what is happening.
The earth was considered flat by many societies, and as you clearly stated very intelligent men, like Aristotle figured out for themselves, before they could be proven right to the rest of the world...that this was so. The history lesson should you want to take it will happen here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth, where many people believed you would fall off the edge. Until someone just decided I am willing to make that sacrifice to find out.
Ok, now we know, the earth is round. what else do we NOT know, that we think we know? I hate absolutes, the only one I am willing to believe is that math or I should say numbers are the universal language. Everything else can fail at some point, even the theory of relativity (as WE know it) can fail...but numbers are constant.
So when someone says they figured out a way to date some tool back to before the dawn of time, I would ask, "DO YOU THINK SO, REALLY! I WOULD BELIEVE SOMEONE PLAYED THE SYSTEM FIRST, UNTIL MAYBE 10 YEARS HAVE GONE BY AND EVERYONE HAS HAD A CHANCE TO DEBUNK THAT DISCOVERY"
Ok, so either the brits are really dumb, as they didnt forsee this happening, the budget cuts to all police hqs means they can't afford one of these new machines, or it was the most brilliant scam, tally up all the loses over a period, tack it to a scapegoat of a project that you know will fail....voila, hands washed clean of any mess....7 billion huh....that's a pretty good cover up!
Don't bother reading any further, I went ahead and filed for patent on this while he was waiting for his. In Canada, you don't wait for patents, you get them as you file for them.....ok, let me see now, where did i place my bank book.
Well, it all boils down to the source of your information, there are many a great books with historians and scientists from the CHRISTIAN factions, that would suggest the earth is more like 100,000 years old only, and not millions...that the certain people feel the need to greatly exaggerate the time line, in order to not ensue a panic... and I am not saying this to be the full truth, because MY POINT is until we can ask someone that was ACTUALLY THERE AT THAT TIME, it is just speculation.
Why is it carbon dating has been thrown out of the courts for legal measure. Could it be because carbon dating is flawed and can be manipulated??? It is my opinion only, and no I don't have a phd in archeology, nor carbon dating for that matter, but I do know it would not be the first time some one lied about what they discovered. It surely would not be the first time the "scientific community" kept something covered up for the "betterment" of humankind.
How long did we have to live with the idea that the earth was flat and not round? Back then though, it was almost blasphemous to suggest otherwise.
I do not ignore the community, but do tend to the idea that change has to happen, the only thing that never changes, is that change will eventually come. This too shall pass....the time for a bazillion distros for linux has passed. The low end user as you describe that started off in his basement will always still be there, but for the ones that have adopted a following, and feel the strain of up keeping development, and support for their "hobby" I am sure would welcome such a move.
If you were to poll all those "crews" as some distros have multiple people helping, if you were to poll them and say hey, if add your team to my team, and merge our projects, yes it would be slightly different then what you were doing in the beginning, but will cost you 1/2 in maintenance...guess what the answer would be. Only the really hardcore would say no, for fear of having their linux removed from their hands, but the rest would welcome some additional help in maintaining up keep.
Should someone like foxlinux merge with turbo and also maybe yellowdog or even another one, I forget which one (jk)....I bet they would not only have better support for bugs, but more time to play WoW too!
> stave off Microsoft's dominance... I am sorry, everyone knows VMWare had dominance, and never lost it for visualization. M$ had to buy VirtualPC to compete, and even then could not make it work all that great. They now improved on the technology with HyperVM, but have yet to transfer any client base from VMWare's list of clients, and therefor still have not come close to dominance.
I hate articles that are clueless about what they write, the writer wants to write a story about VMWare, but should stick with the facts, when they know nothing about the market shares involved. This will just add to the great lead that VMWare has over any other in the field.
The size of the company dictates if it will raise a flag with M$. Everywhere i have went , all admins have said as a rule is dont break the 10pc policy. 10 pcs, does not raise the flag....and trust me, they have built in worms or trojans collecting all the info and sending it back to M$ hq, they know who uses all the pirated stuff. Why would Office be connectin to some server somewhere when I open powerpoint...because part of the office engine, sends info back home. This info includes software version and lets m$ know what is running on a network. If they see a network contains 100 pcs with about 5-10 diff. sofwtares including the OS, then they come knocking, if they see its a small company of 2-4 people, and they use a few lowly apps...they dont bother...the trip costs more then they could recuperate.
Its all about the money....I know someone who has some graphic designers...they are trying to torrent a version of CS4 to use, and I told them, ok, but you might be taking a chance, he said he didn't care....as the penalty would be to buy a legal copy at that point. Maybe pay residuals, but for him, this would only happen if he got caught.
They don't want to let you know, they have been testing nuclear armaments underground for some time now, and the last one was a killer. Sorry for the pun.
I don't quite agree, I do believe there are just too many distros out there to make the uneducated feel comfortable delving into Linux. If i were a new Linux wannabe user, I want to go look up which is best if there are more then one.
If there are more then 100, then I feel so uneducated I leave it alone. This hurts linux in the end. I would rather that many of the smaller distors that vary by a few added softwares merge into 1.
So lets say you got 100, and of those 100 you have 50 closely similar buddies, you dropped the choices down by half. Yes yellowdog, is almost as good as turbo but does not come with the extra packaging for lets say wine or etc. So you just add a configuration issue at the beginning of the install (which could actually read Yellowdog install or Turbo install) give them a different menu based on more or less.
Everyone and their grandmother seems to be using linux to build their own OS, then when they become evolved enough to be listed as just another distro, you see there are so few changes, between them, that you take the stronger supported one, and add config parameters, to allow for the differences.
I am sure, if someone extremely linux savvy were to review all of them to find which could be plugged together, we would have maybe 20 or 30 REAL distros.
Nope sorry, I agree with the other admin, even though you have multiple admins here displaying the size of their "you-know-whats" it does not come down to who has the bigger size, it comes down to who has the bigger budget and the meaner boss.
If my boss asks me why I am wasting time learning about a new update he did not approve to send to all the machines to know what it does and how it will affect all my machines in my network, you better come up with a good excuses, and telling him, "its M$ fault, they forced this patch on us, and now we are stuck with this thing....I don't know what it is or what it does, I am reading up on it..."
Does he say...well that sounds like M$, or does he look at you like you are wasting time on something he didn't approve, or maybe you don't know what you are doing if you can answer him what this latest patch update does...
So...when it comes down to size, I win... ok , seriously though, if you cant prove to your boss you "were not responsible for this happening" and ALSO if you can't competently tell him what its for, you are at fault...and when it comes down to the dollar....I see this as M$ costing more money on their client's backs, then it could ever produce in their bank accounts.
There will only be so many times you can push this on M$ backs before the unacquainted think you are full of B$..... M$ IS THE WORST FOR THIS, HANDS DOWN. YOU WOULD NEVER SEE RED HAT PULL THIS SH*T. THEY WOULD BEND OVER BACKWARDS FOR YOU TO HOLD OFF UPDATES IF THEY KNEW THERE WAS ADMINS WHO DID NOT WANT IT.
Does this mean finally that we all approve that the carbon dating process they use to know how old things are, is greatly flawed, or are you telling me that when the earth was a mere gas ball, yes....there actually was humans using tools...?
I remember reading this book, about how certain evolutionary backers, would want you to believe the earth is really as old as they say, but what if instead of millions of years, it was more like tens of thousands...? Would we live differently, would we pay more attention to global events (warming ica age etc...)
I believe more so in evolution then I do Christianity, but like all religions, evolution has its flaws too, and instead of having people own up to say "between this time and this time, we are merely speculating...what happened as we don't know for sure"...they would rather use abstract thinking like, well because we were not there really to disprove what we say, we can pretty much say what we want....
Should any disaster strike, or shark bite the fin off, I wonder, if the sub, would plummet to the bottom of the ocean as a real fish would without its fin, did they think to come up with possible alternative plan in case, cuz' it ain't like stepping out and changing a flat tire!!!
Slashdot Mirror
And with all this expenditure, they now (within the economic crisis) are trying to make more money back by making all sorts of people swallow some unproven facts.... here
http://it.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/02/11/007216
The problem comes from when M$ feels the crunch and has to resort to even more evil tactics then usual. Open source is actually safer, because the code is open for all to see, who in their right mind (expert opinion here) after finding a flaw, would not wake the community up to it, and help by fixing it, because if he doesn't someone else will, and get the credit for it.... so I don't agree with M$ on this one...they are just strapped for cash...maybe they should stop spending so much on crappy ideas, and more on reorganization of the company infrastructure.
And these are the same people claiming great security for my pc, because they know how to handle threats. If they can't even write good web code for their site, my guess is they don't for their products either.
Thanks for letting me know about this, it says alot about a company when they use tactics like these, I will be careful to avoid them in the future
This is a free site, to post freely anything you want, without paying anything, so if anything happens, you can not blame anyone. If you pay 30/month for a website, that has a posting blog forum on it, and you have backups, and something goes wrong, then you can call and say, please restore the backup.
If its free, then you can't complain, same as having a hotmail account without a backup system for your emails...what do you expect? You are not in control.
I haven't used this but interested, yet I do hibernate a lot, so does this mean I would have problems with TrueCrypt, bugging???
>Does this mean finally that we all approve that the carbon dating process they use to know how old things are, is greatly flawed, or are you telling me that when the earth was a mere gas ball, yes....there actually was humans using tools...?
No i think you understood properly, I tend to not believe ...maybe I will say it another unless this is unclear... I do not believe the carbon dating process is factual. Ok, wait in case you didn't get that. ... carbon dating can be manipulated, so I can not put my faith in this....as I can religion. Did I say i did not believe in God, no.... I said I don't believe in religion (or is that confusing to you too?)
that carbon dating is accurate enough to believe in. This was my first sentence, it was also my first thought....about the carbon dating process being flawed. Ok
To this I agree, the effort and time and even money (in a virtual sense of the word)
could be better used to make the garage a little more organized.
Well, now I guess you may think this will go on until you claim the last word,
however I am pleased to remind you that although, you stimulate some points
of interest for the uneducated, I might suggest this debate be taken on with
a grain of salt, as I merely state my opinion, and distrust for most forms
of brainwash that have you thinking a certain way because it is the only way they
themselves can think.
Einstein was a genius, not for his ideas purely, but more so for his style of thinking,
as many others that push the boundaries of cemented lame *ss scientific proofing.
I can only state so many times, that it is my opinion, some of the techniques used
to prove carbon dating works, are also the same techniques used to falsify those claims.
If i take a 13th century Japanese sword and age it with a few well know techniques,
the carbon dating will show it was made 13th century even though I just bought it at Walmart
2 days ago (actually the process takes a few months..) my point remains...
HOW COULD I TRUST A LOCK THAT I KNOW 40% OF THE BURGLARS CAN PICK,
SHOULD I FEEL HAPPY ABOUT THE 60% THAT CAN'T? A 12 YEAR OLD GIRL COULD BUST MY LOCK...
I DON'T CARE, I OWN NOTHING, BUT IF I DID... I WOULD KEEP IT IN A PLACE WHERE SUCH A HIGH PERCENT
EXISTS FOR BREAKING IN.
SO HOW CAN I FEEL SAFE WITH A PROCEDURE THAT TELLS ME CERTAIN ITEMS CAN BE MANIPULATED TO SHOW
THEY COME FROM THE MOON 2 MILLION YEARS AGO, WHEN I DUG THEM UP LAST NIGHT IN MY BACKYARD.
BUT THAT IS BECAUSE I AM ONE OF THE FEW THAT FALLS IN THE PERCENTILE THAT CAN MANIPULATE
THIS RESULT. DO I TRUST THIS...HECK NO, I WILL TRUST WHEN SOMEONE SAYS THEY UNCOVERED
A WHOLE CITY (WHICH WOULD PROVE TOO MUCH SIZE TO MANIPULATE ENTIRELY TO MAKE SUCH A CLAIM)
Uncover 1000s of tools and bones and remains and what not, I will believe you,
uncover one arrow head, I will laugh.... what a puny arrow head you have.
I wonder if that same script would come in handy, while your wife is leaving the shopping center, and arriving at my house, and stays over for about 2 hours, I could have her tracker going in circles around the parking lot making it look like she is really looking for parking, and then back home.
Yeah, please, when you are finished writing this script, mind sending it to me?
We can go to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth to get a history lesson,
billions of years ago based on supposed evolution theory, but again I will state one final time my mere opinion.
If we all think the theory of relativity is good enough to explain 100% of our problems...
I say nay! Those are the 100% of the problems we know about, yet there are unknown problems
we still know nothing about, so technically we can use e=mc2 100%-n% of the time to explain with accuracy what is happening.
The earth was considered flat by many societies, and as you clearly stated very intelligent men, like Aristotle figured out for themselves, before they could be proven right to the rest of the world...that this was so. The history lesson should you want to take it will happen here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth, where many people believed you would fall off the edge.
Until someone just decided I am willing to make that sacrifice to find out.
Ok, now we know, the earth is round. what else do we NOT know, that we think we know?
I hate absolutes, the only one I am willing to believe is that math or I should say numbers
are the universal language. Everything else can fail at some point, even the theory of relativity
(as WE know it) can fail...but numbers are constant.
So when someone says they figured out a way to date some tool back to before the dawn of time, I would ask, "DO YOU THINK SO, REALLY! I WOULD BELIEVE SOMEONE PLAYED THE SYSTEM FIRST, UNTIL MAYBE 10 YEARS HAVE GONE BY AND EVERYONE HAS HAD A CHANCE TO DEBUNK THAT DISCOVERY"
Ok, so either the brits are really dumb, as they didnt forsee this happening, the budget cuts to all police hqs means they can't afford one of these new machines, or it was the most brilliant scam, tally up all the loses over a period, tack it to a scapegoat of a project that you know will fail. ...voila, hands washed clean of any mess....7 billion huh....that's a pretty good cover up!
Don't bother reading any further, I went ahead and filed for patent on this while he was waiting for his. In Canada, you don't wait for patents, you get them as you file for them.....ok, let me see now, where did i place my bank book.
Well, it all boils down to the source of your information, there are many a great books with historians and scientists from the CHRISTIAN factions, that would suggest the earth is more like
100,000 years old only, and not millions...that the certain people feel the need to greatly exaggerate the time line, in order to not ensue a panic... and I am not saying this to be the full truth, because MY POINT is until we can ask someone that was ACTUALLY THERE AT THAT TIME, it is just speculation.
Why is it carbon dating has been thrown out of the courts for legal measure. Could it be because carbon dating is flawed and can be manipulated???
It is my opinion only, and no I don't have a phd in archeology, nor carbon dating for that matter,
but I do know it would not be the first time some one lied about what they discovered.
It surely would not be the first time the "scientific community" kept something covered up for
the "betterment" of humankind.
How long did we have to live with the idea that the earth was flat and not round?
Back then though, it was almost blasphemous to suggest otherwise.
I do not ignore the community, but do tend to the idea that change has to happen,
the only thing that never changes, is that change will eventually come.
This too shall pass....the time for a bazillion distros for linux has passed.
The low end user as you describe that started off in his basement will always still be there, but for the ones that have adopted a following, and feel the strain of up keeping development, and support for their "hobby" I am sure would welcome such a move.
If you were to poll all those "crews" as some distros have multiple people helping, if you were to poll them and say hey, if add your team to my team, and merge our projects, yes it would be slightly different then what you were doing in the beginning, but will cost you 1/2 in maintenance...guess what the answer would be. Only the really hardcore would say no, for fear of having their linux removed from their hands, but the rest would welcome some additional help in
maintaining up keep.
Should someone like foxlinux merge with turbo and also maybe yellowdog or even another one, I forget which one (jk)....I bet they would not only have better support for bugs, but more time to
play WoW too!
> stave off Microsoft's dominance...
I am sorry, everyone knows VMWare had dominance, and never lost it for visualization.
M$ had to buy VirtualPC to compete, and even then could not make it work all that great.
They now improved on the technology with HyperVM, but have yet to transfer any client base from VMWare's list of clients, and therefor still have not come close to dominance.
I hate articles that are clueless about what they write, the writer wants to write a story about VMWare, but should stick with the facts, when they know nothing about the market shares involved.
This will just add to the great lead that VMWare has over any other in the field.
The size of the company dictates if it will raise a flag with M$. Everywhere i have went , all admins have said as a rule is dont break the 10pc policy. 10 pcs, does not raise the flag....and trust me, they have built in worms or trojans collecting all the info and sending it back to M$ hq, they know who uses all the pirated stuff. Why would Office be connectin to some server somewhere when I open powerpoint...because part of the office engine, sends info back home. This info includes software version and lets m$ know what is running on a network. If they see a network contains 100 pcs
with about 5-10 diff. sofwtares including the OS, then they come knocking, if they see its a small company of 2-4 people, and they use a few lowly apps...they dont bother...the trip costs more then they could recuperate.
Its all about the money....I know someone who has some graphic designers...they are trying to torrent a version of CS4 to use, and I told them, ok, but you might be taking a chance, he said
he didn't care....as the penalty would be to buy a legal copy at that point. Maybe pay residuals, but for him, this would only happen if he got caught.
They don't want to let you know, they have been testing nuclear armaments underground for some time now, and the last one was a killer. Sorry for the pun.
Cuz we all know the size of his neck might be a reminder of what else might be large.
Women would loooooooooove him!
I don't quite agree, I do believe there are just too many distros out there to make the uneducated feel comfortable delving into Linux. If i were a new Linux wannabe user, I want to go look up which is best if there are more then one.
If there are more then 100, then I feel so uneducated I leave it alone. This hurts linux in the end.
I would rather that many of the smaller distors that vary by a few added softwares merge into 1.
So lets say you got 100, and of those 100 you have 50 closely similar buddies, you dropped the choices down by half. Yes yellowdog, is almost as good as turbo but does not come with the extra packaging for lets say wine or etc. So you just add a configuration issue at the beginning of the install (which could actually read Yellowdog install or Turbo install) give them a different menu based on more or less.
Everyone and their grandmother seems to be using linux to build their own OS, then when they become evolved enough to be listed as just another distro, you see there are so few changes, between them, that you take the stronger supported one, and add config parameters, to allow for the differences.
I am sure, if someone extremely linux savvy were to review all of them to find which could be plugged together, we would have maybe 20 or 30 REAL distros.
I concur!
Wait, Ill go check my crystal ball, another form of testing that lets me know the :P
length of time something has been around for.
It all depends who you work for, and how much they respect "non management" opinions,
no matter how informed
Nope sorry, I agree with the other admin, even though you have multiple admins here displaying the size of their "you-know-whats" it does not come down to who has the bigger size, it comes down to who has the bigger budget and the meaner boss.
If my boss asks me why I am wasting time learning about a new update he did not approve to send to all the machines to know what it does and how it will affect all my machines in my network, you better come up with a good excuses, and telling him, "its M$ fault, they forced this patch on us, and now we are stuck with this thing....I don't know what it is or what it does, I am reading up on it..."
Does he say...well that sounds like M$, or does he look at you like you are wasting time on something he didn't approve, or maybe you don't know what you are doing if you can answer him what this latest patch update does...
So...when it comes down to size, I win... ok , seriously though, if you cant prove to your boss you "were not responsible for this happening" and ALSO if you can't competently tell him what its for, you are at fault...and when it comes down to the dollar....I see this as M$
costing more money on their client's backs, then it could ever produce in their bank accounts.
There will only be so many times you can push this on M$ backs before the unacquainted think you are full of B$..... M$ IS THE WORST FOR THIS, HANDS DOWN. YOU WOULD NEVER SEE RED HAT PULL THIS SH*T. THEY WOULD BEND OVER BACKWARDS FOR YOU TO HOLD OFF UPDATES IF THEY KNEW THERE WAS ADMINS WHO DID NOT WANT IT.
Does this mean finally that we all approve that the carbon dating process they use to know how old things are, is greatly flawed, or are you telling me that when the earth was a mere gas ball, yes....there actually was humans using tools...?
I remember reading this book, about how certain evolutionary backers, would want you to believe the earth is really as old as they say, but what if instead of millions of years, it was more like tens of thousands...? Would we live differently, would we pay more attention to global events (warming ica age etc...)
I believe more so in evolution then I do Christianity, but like all religions, evolution has its flaws too, and instead of having people own up to say "between this time and this time, we are merely speculating...what happened as we don't know for sure"...they would rather use abstract thinking like, well because we were not there really to disprove what we say, we can pretty much say what we want....
Should any disaster strike, or shark bite the fin off, I wonder, if the sub, would plummet to the bottom of the ocean as a real fish would without its fin, did they think to come up with possible alternative plan in case, cuz' it ain't like stepping out and changing a flat tire!!!