Perhaps these Peaceaholics need a 12 step program off an 11 step peer. I wouldn't worry too much about the effects they are having on Rockstar , unless of course your a member of the group as all they are doing is giving the game some wonderful publicity. Let them protest i say , its their right to do the work of Rockstar's PR department if they wish . they can make demand after demand after demand and get as much media attention as possible .
When they finally get to court and discover that it is protect free speech(as is my understanding , correct me if I'm wrong) they may actually realise how bloody stupid they were being. The game most likely deserves a 14+ rating , well i say 14 as I'm probably a lot more permissive than most,Well a mature rating indeed (decide amongst yourself what you think mature enough is) I have no problem with advisory censorship , It's fairly harmless so long as it stay advisory only and is never enforceable
Or to be less polite , these bar-stards need to go jump in a crocodile pit and stop telling me how to live my life
It does not seem that weird a decision to me (in the context of the Chinese government ). Games are a healthy distraction that can keep people from worrying about bigger problems,however they would most likely not want any minors to get any ideas about growing in power and violence . When they are past that age , things tend to have less influence on a persons character. I think they are more than likely not banning this type of game for the minors because of the violence, more the fact it could be used to subvert them (in the view of the Chinese officials) . Also I would imagine that if many in the west had their way , similar legislation would be past here.
First off , We don't want those Nuts in Europe (we already have a fair few),Second I don't believe Chairman Mao passed any Free speech legislation , nor have his successors
I thought that was a random troll , till i noticed it was a reply . Checked on the parent post and what do you know . Your 100% right , he is a bit ignorant indeed. Why do people continually think of Africa as a single nation , Its an entire continent with many wide and diverse cultures . Taking three extremes,Egypt , South Africa and Somalia . Its like saying the USA , Mexico and Lithuania and basically the same country.
Or are they working for Rockstar's PR department . What i find most amusing is that a large group of Anti-bullying advocates are joining together and putting pressure on Rockstar to not release a game with threats of "Think of the children" and legal action . Ah beautiful irony , unless i misunderstood what bullying is .
I have seen hundreds of home computers set up for multiple accounts. Mainly families with 2 or more accounts set up , either one for the parents and one for the children or a separate account for each person. Main reason People mention to me of why the use this set up is for personal files (work mainly and school) and for Desktop backgrounds. Many a family argument has occurred due to changed desktop images , very silly indeed. I wonder on the real percent of users who have this set up , My word is pure anecdotal .
This is South Africa were talking about http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Africa Its a well developed nation , all be it still suffering through a few problems after they finally got rid of apartheid .
GNU is not in the public domain. Everyone will be permitted to modify and redistribute GNU, but no distributor will be allowed to restrict its further redistribution. That is to say, proprietary modifications will not be allowed. I want to make sure that all versions of GNU remain free.
The official definition of "open source software," as published by the Open Source Initiative, is very close to our definition of free software; however, it is a little looser in some respects, and they have accepted a few licenses that we consider unacceptably restrictive of the users.
Looks like we need to standardise the classifications a bit , having read several articles last night on the topic its hard to find two groups which actually agree on the subject . Still a fascinating debate non the less . It would be easier if we settled on something like A planet is an Object orbiting a star with a diameter over 1800 KM A minor planet is an object orbiting a star with a Diameter 1800 KM or less and is not a comet A satellite is an object orbiting a planet or minor planet (naturally having a few sub classes on all) A KBO is an object in the KB which could be any of the above or something like that , obviously far more extensive
That's sun making a crappie installer though , So not a specific linux problem. They could make a far better installer or even a debian package available (I know they already have an RPM version , also they could make a.tgz for slackware etc. its not as if they are going to be that short on server space). Most of the crap installers out their tend to be due to complacence rather than a lack of opertunity
Thanks , Astronomy is something that fascinates me but i have never really had the time to get in-depth on the subject. Having a look around google , it is really hard to get any consensus on what a planet is.. a KBO was pretty easy , being that it defines an object in the belt.. Really fascinating though , i have for a long time enjoyed watching "the sky at night "(TV show , BBC) and own a couple of small telescopes. a place of dreams and science. Pigeon holing is a natural thing for us , helps us organising things in our minds . Unfortunately we just need to keep adding more and more sub holes
As I always understood it , a planet and a planet was an object in orbit of a sun. and a KBO was a large body in the Kuiper belt which may or may not be a planet. I do have limited knowledge of astronomy but Could something not be both a KBO and a planet .
Mozilla and Firefox should render pages identically (depending on the versions of course) since they both use the same rendering engine .
The only browser so far to pass the acid2 test is the newest version of safaris rendering engine and i believe The KDE team have managed to get the changes back into konquerors rendering engine as well. I'm not sure about Operas engine though .
I use Debian and ubuntu (knoppix also when needed) , I have always found them to be very accessible , ubuntu especially . What Xandros are selling is the boxed copy and the support contract , sure you can get all the apps free as in beer , but you are not going to find free professional level support , which is the key selling point for a distro like this . For us hackers , developers , sysmins(unless in the office) and power users though it is not really a great option.
I like ubuntus model( and a number of other distros out their) , the distro is totally free (even send out a free CD which is nice of them)but you can pay for a support contract if you wish. Best of both worlds really and things like Wine are available on the main repositories . Plus crossover office and cedega install with no problems on debian based distros.. I did try mandrake (not since its become medi-drival ) It is a good distro as well.
I use debian based distros , so this is the example i will use dpkg - i package.deb or apt-get install package (if its on a repository
Don't like the command line , then you have the choice of a GUI front end such as Synaptics for Apt-get , Im fairly sure there are also dpkg front ends , i have never looked though as I'm comfortable on the command line .
there you have a zero mouse click install;),or one if you want to use front end . If there are no click installers for Debian packages then I'm fairly sure it would be very little work to make a script for it.
Effortless painless installations all most all of the time , occasionally we get the odd dependancy screw up , But I'm fairly sure this would not happen with commercial games.
have you tried installing UT 2004 on linux , Its very easy . A nice front end installer similar in style to the windows one
These things are really easy to make with a little knowledge of scripting , and if you want a GUI you can easily make one, as QT and gtk i believe can both be used with scripting languages such as ruby or python
First off , This is great that they have had the fore sight to include the drivers to read and write NTFS.It is also very nice that they have included code weavers cross over office.This is great for getting some people to switch to linux , shame they didn't include cedega as well , which could of really completed the package , though this is a business edition.
But credit where credit is due , the article summary makes it seem like Xandros was responsible for these things.http://www.codeweavers.com/ code weaver site , responsible of Crossover office and naturally a link to wine on which Cross over office is based http://www.winehq.com/. A link to the linux NTFS project http://linux-ntfs.sourceforge.net/ (I assume this is the driver they are using , correct me if I'm wrong) (Cross over office is a great product , It also has a rather pleasant installer in my experience.So you don't need to switch distros.)
You slightly missed my point. My point is that i do not think these vendors should be the target of the lawsuit , Microsoft should be the target for using aggressive tactics to ensure exclusivity . If you stop microsoft from doing this then the vendors of the PC has a choice to offer the system with or without the OS .
Right now they are forced by a large gorilla to have all their products come with their OS , if we enact legislation like this they are forced to offer a system with or without it. If we stop MS using these tactics they then have a choice .
And choice is one of the main things I admire about OSS
Sure Dual core would speed them up , but not by anything close to justify paying twice the price for the processor . There in is my argument,The advantages do not out weigh the negatives. Sure you will have a more responsive system whilst doing multiple heavy duty tasks , but ordinary users do not do many heavy duty tasks at the same time . Background process such as AV programs whilst consuming a fair amount of resources during a scan are negligible during regular monitoring tasks. Sure if your an enthusiast or power user then I'm fairly sure you will benefit greatly from a dual core chip. however , your average user will likely not notice that much of a difference just yet.
it has called on the ACCC to require tier one and tier two PC vendors in Australia to offer desktop and laptop products without a pre-installed operating system, arguing that it will level they playing field for Microsoft's competitors and increase consumer choice.
This is what i have a problem with , what they should be doing is calling on the ACCC to force Microsoft to stop using exclusivity deals and the like.This is a clear case of antitrust . If companies wish to not sell systems without OSs then that is their right , forcing them to is not something i can support. however i can easily support slapping MS with an Anti-trust suit and having them face stiff penalties if the practice continues. I would love to see all the vendors offer alternatives such as linux or no OS , I just want to see it happen another way
That is one of the key issues here as i see it . If MS are giving these companies incentives to stifle the opposition it needs addressed.I honestly do not have any problem with them selling only one make of OS , so long as the choice is made without pressure tactics.
OSS is about choice and freedom , forcing companies to offer alternatives is removing their choice. If people want OSS on their PC or no software at all (and i know for a fact there is a lot of people who do) then there is a market open and waiting to be jumped upon by an adventurous entrepreneur .
Not offering It reminds me of an old joke/parable which i will paraphrase Man walks into a store and asks for product X , the store owner says "Jeesh , your the 100th person to come in these week looking for that , as i told the others we don't sell it "
The average consumer basically uses the computer to perhaps write school/uni/office work , check e-mails,maybe copy/burn a CD, browse the internet , maybe listen to music now and then and perhaps play the odd game. For almost all of those things a Dual core system is over kill . As part of my work I do on occasion advise companies and private individuals on systems . I do not make money on selling the systems , I make money on the consultancy .
I have spoken to managers who spout to me a bunch of computer jargon they have no idea the meaning of , explaining to me how a sales man had told them that their office computers will need 3Ghz processors with 1GB of ram for simple office work. totally prepared to throw out their old systems and upgrade. Same for many of the normal folks i speak to , They have walked into some PC shop and been advised that their 1Ghz pentium 3 is far too slow for modern e-mail browsing and using an office program. There are only a few reasons i will advise people to upgrade. 1:) If someone comes to me wanting a games/video editing/multi media hub system to do all the latest and greatest I will be all to happy to help them set it up(advising a suitable set up , OSS if i can). If their system is on its last legs i will also advise an upgrade or if considerable gains can be made from power saving or work efficiency Right now i just don't see any reason to advise a dual core chip , bar of course for audio video work , development and certain types of servers.
Sure many people have multiple tasks running in the background , my first job would be to advise them what they really need , If they run windows i normally advise a anti-virus program , they normally take up a tiny amount of resources and you would hardly notice the absence and a firewall on many occasions. but honestly for most people burning a CD and ripping a movie is something they hardly ever do(in the case of a movie , if ever) so you can't justify the extra cash for an activity like this.even a virus scan is something done about once a month. For your average windows gamer , your far better off getting a faster single core chip as well .
As much as i dislike the practice it should not up to the government to decide what companies sell. That is the decision of company. I find it as silly as forcing restaurants to provide a vegetarian alternative (I am a vegetarian btw). If these companies can see profit in doing it they will , or they don't they will lose business , Simple as that.
What the government should focus on however is making sure that Microsoft are not using exclusivity deals that would harm the company if they did sell computers without MS windows . This is key in a free market , making sure its fair. make sure large companies are not abusing their power, do Not in forcing smaller companies to stock what is deemed acceptable and to hell with their profits .
I do not want to buy a system with MS windows and I will choose a vendor who sells systems without it , I don't want to force a vendor into my way of thinking though .
The problem right now is there is just not enough of a gain to justify buying a dual core chip for the average consumer . They are generally outperformed by chips which cost a lot less (except in programs which can make use of the SMP set up).SMP will start to take hold in the future and more and more programs will be optimised for an SMP set up but this leaves us with a catch
People won't make user level programs optimised for SMP till SMP systems have a sizeable market share. People won't buy dual core chips till there are programs which can use them .
they see no reason to spend the money on this when an ordinary chip they can buy now will perform better and a SMP processor they can buy when SMP is common will be faster and cheaper.
Bringing the price of these chips down should help a lot . If AMD and Intel are betting their future lines on dual core they will need to take a load of risks on pricing to get the idea out.
but why would any normal consumer want this chip when they can have a similarly clocked Athlon 64 for about half the price though. This although a really great cheap dual core chip is not cheap enough to win mind share IMHO . It will get the enthusiast market I'm sure but until Dual core chips cost around 200(or less) that is where they will stay(consumer level i mean , server and workstation is another debate).
Having said that , I am tempted to get one of these , I use linux as one of my main OS(that OS X and Solaris sparc) So I'm fairly sure i could see instant benefits with an SMP kernel and some tweaking . Th
Obviously, he's a time traveller from the year 1996, so the whole concept of "Slashdot" confuses him. He seems to understand Karma Whoring pretty well, though.
I think he may need a few more lessons
nome vs. KDE (Score:-1, Troll) by John Seminal (698722) on 31-07-05 12:42 (#13206787) (Last Journal: 22-02-04 3:07)
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Perhaps these Peaceaholics need a 12 step program off an 11 step peer.
,Well a mature rating indeed (decide amongst yourself what you think mature enough is)
I wouldn't worry too much about the effects they are having on Rockstar , unless of course your a member of the group as all they are doing is giving the game some wonderful publicity.
Let them protest i say , its their right to do the work of Rockstar's PR department if they wish .
they can make demand after demand after demand and get as much media attention as possible .
When they finally get to court and discover that it is protect free speech(as is my understanding , correct me if I'm wrong) they may actually realise how bloody stupid they were being.
The game most likely deserves a 14+ rating , well i say 14 as I'm probably a lot more permissive than most
I have no problem with advisory censorship , It's fairly harmless so long as it stay advisory only and is never enforceable
Or to be less polite ,
these bar-stards need to go jump in a crocodile pit and stop telling me how to live my life
It does not seem that weird a decision to me (in the context of the Chinese government ). ,however they would most likely not want any minors to get any ideas about growing in power and violence .
Games are a healthy distraction that can keep people from worrying about bigger problems
When they are past that age , things tend to have less influence on a persons character.
I think they are more than likely not banning this type of game for the minors because of the violence, more the fact it could be used to subvert them (in the view of the Chinese officials) .
Also I would imagine that if many in the west had their way , similar legislation would be past here.
First off , We don't want those Nuts in Europe (we already have a fair few) ,Second I don't believe Chairman Mao passed any Free speech legislation , nor have his successors
I thought that was a random troll , till i noticed it was a reply . ,Egypt , South Africa and Somalia .
Checked on the parent post and what do you know .
Your 100% right , he is a bit ignorant indeed.
Why do people continually think of Africa as a single nation , Its an entire continent with many wide and diverse cultures . Taking three extremes
Its like saying the USA , Mexico and Lithuania and basically the same country.
Or are they working for Rockstar's PR department .
What i find most amusing is that a large group of Anti-bullying advocates are joining together and putting pressure on Rockstar to not release a game with threats of "Think of the children" and legal action .
Ah beautiful irony , unless i misunderstood what bullying is .
I have seen hundreds of home computers set up for multiple accounts. Mainly families with 2 or more accounts set up , either one for the parents and one for the children or a separate account for each person.
Main reason People mention to me of why the use this set up is for personal files (work mainly and school) and for Desktop backgrounds.
Many a family argument has occurred due to changed desktop images , very silly indeed.
I wonder on the real percent of users who have this set up , My word is pure anecdotal .
This is South Africa were talking about
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Africa
Its a well developed nation , all be it still suffering through a few problems after they finally got rid of apartheid .
Its all a case of semantics
Looks like we need to standardise the classifications a bit , having read several articles last night on the topic its hard to find two groups which actually agree on the subject .
Still a fascinating debate non the less .
It would be easier if we settled on something like
A planet is an Object orbiting a star with a diameter over 1800 KM
A minor planet is an object orbiting a star with a Diameter 1800 KM or less and is not a comet
A satellite is an object orbiting a planet or minor planet (naturally having a few sub classes on all)
A KBO is an object in the KB which could be any of the above
or something like that , obviously far more extensive
That's sun making a crappie installer though , So not a specific linux problem. .tgz for slackware etc. its not as if they are going to be that short on server space).
They could make a far better installer or even a debian package available (I know they already have an RPM version , also they could make a
Most of the crap installers out their tend to be due to complacence rather than a lack of opertunity
Thanks , Astronomy is something that fascinates me but i have never really had the time to get in-depth on the subject. .. a KBO was pretty easy , being that it defines an object in the belt ..
Having a look around google , it is really hard to get any consensus on what a planet is
Really fascinating though , i have for a long time enjoyed watching "the sky at night "(TV show , BBC) and own a couple of small telescopes. a place of dreams and science.
Pigeon holing is a natural thing for us , helps us organising things in our minds . Unfortunately we just need to keep adding more and more sub holes
As I always understood it , a planet and a planet was an object in orbit of a sun. and a KBO was a large body in the Kuiper belt which may or may not be a planet.
I do have limited knowledge of astronomy but Could something not be both a KBO and a planet .
Mozilla and Firefox should render pages identically (depending on the versions of course) since they both use the same rendering engine .
The only browser so far to pass the acid2 test is the newest version of safaris rendering engine and i believe The KDE team have managed to get the changes back into konquerors rendering engine as well.
I'm not sure about Operas engine though .
Yeah , he should of asked to keep the Millennium falcon . he could of made a good living doing the kessel run
I use Debian and ubuntu (knoppix also when needed) , I have always found them to be very accessible , ubuntu especially .
..
What Xandros are selling is the boxed copy and the support contract , sure you can get all the apps free as in beer , but you are not going to find free professional level support , which is the key selling point for a distro like this .
For us hackers , developers , sysmins(unless in the office) and power users though it is not really a great option.
I like ubuntus model( and a number of other distros out their) , the distro is totally free (even send out a free CD which is nice of them)but you can pay for a support contract if you wish.
Best of both worlds really and things like Wine are available on the main repositories . Plus crossover office and cedega install with no problems on debian based distros
I did try mandrake (not since its become medi-drival ) It is a good distro as well.
I use debian based distros , so this is the example i will use
;) ,or one if you want to use front end . If there are no click installers for Debian packages then I'm fairly sure it would be very little work to make a script for it.
dpkg - i package.deb
or apt-get install package (if its on a repository
Don't like the command line , then you have the choice of a GUI front end such as Synaptics for Apt-get , Im fairly sure there are also dpkg front ends , i have never looked though as I'm comfortable on the command line .
there you have a zero mouse click install
Effortless painless installations all most all of the time , occasionally we get the odd dependancy screw up , But I'm fairly sure this would not happen with commercial games.
have you tried installing UT 2004 on linux , Its very easy . A nice front end installer similar in style to the windows one
These things are really easy to make with a little knowledge of scripting , and if you want a GUI you can easily make one, as QT and gtk i believe can both be used with scripting languages such as ruby or python
First off , This is great that they have had the fore sight to include the drivers to read and write NTFS .It is also very nice that they have included code weavers cross over office.This is great for getting some people to switch to linux , shame they didn't include cedega as well , which could of really completed the package , though this is a business edition.
.)
But credit where credit is due , the article summary makes it seem like Xandros was responsible for these things.http://www.codeweavers.com/ code weaver site , responsible of Crossover office and naturally a link to wine on which Cross over office is based http://www.winehq.com/.
A link to the linux NTFS project http://linux-ntfs.sourceforge.net/ (I assume this is the driver they are using , correct me if I'm wrong)
(Cross over office is a great product , It also has a rather pleasant installer in my experience.So you don't need to switch distros
You slightly missed my point.
My point is that i do not think these vendors should be the target of the lawsuit , Microsoft should be the target for using aggressive tactics to ensure exclusivity . If you stop microsoft from doing this then the vendors of the PC has a choice to offer the system with or without the OS .
Right now they are forced by a large gorilla to have all their products come with their OS , if we enact legislation like this they are forced to offer a system with or without it.
If we stop MS using these tactics they then have a choice .
And choice is one of the main things I admire about OSS
Sure Dual core would speed them up , but not by anything close to justify paying twice the price for the processor . There in is my argument ,The advantages do not out weigh the negatives.
Sure you will have a more responsive system whilst doing multiple heavy duty tasks , but ordinary users do not do many heavy duty tasks at the same time .
Background process such as AV programs whilst consuming a fair amount of resources during a scan are negligible during regular monitoring tasks.
Sure if your an enthusiast or power user then I'm fairly sure you will benefit greatly from a dual core chip.
however , your average user will likely not notice that much of a difference just yet.
If companies wish to not sell systems without OSs then that is their right , forcing them to is not something i can support.
however i can easily support slapping MS with an Anti-trust suit and having them face stiff penalties if the practice continues.
I would love to see all the vendors offer alternatives such as linux or no OS , I just want to see it happen another way
That is one of the key issues here as i see it . .I honestly do not have any problem with them selling only one make of OS , so long as the choice is made without pressure tactics.
If MS are giving these companies incentives to stifle the opposition it needs addressed
OSS is about choice and freedom , forcing companies to offer alternatives is removing their choice.
If people want OSS on their PC or no software at all (and i know for a fact there is a lot of people who do) then there is a market open and waiting to be jumped upon by an adventurous entrepreneur .
Not offering It reminds me of an old joke/parable which i will paraphrase
Man walks into a store and asks for product X , the store owner says "Jeesh , your the 100th person to come in these week looking for that , as i told the others we don't sell it "
The average consumer basically uses the computer to perhaps write school/uni/office work , check e-mails ,maybe copy/burn a CD, browse the internet , maybe listen to music now and then and perhaps play the odd game. For almost all of those things a Dual core system is over kill .
As part of my work I do on occasion advise companies and private individuals on systems .
I do not make money on selling the systems , I make money on the consultancy .
I have spoken to managers who spout to me a bunch of computer jargon they have no idea the meaning of , explaining to me how a sales man had told them that their office computers will need 3Ghz processors with 1GB of ram for simple office work. totally prepared to throw out their old systems and upgrade. Same for many of the normal folks i speak to , They have walked into some PC shop and been advised that their 1Ghz pentium 3 is far too slow for modern e-mail browsing and using an office program.
There are only a few reasons i will advise people to upgrade.
1:) If someone comes to me wanting a games/video editing/multi media hub system to do all the latest and greatest I will be all to happy to help them set it up(advising a suitable set up , OSS if i can).
If their system is on its last legs i will also advise an upgrade
or if considerable gains can be made from power saving or work efficiency
Right now i just don't see any reason to advise a dual core chip , bar of course for audio video work , development and certain types of servers.
Sure many people have multiple tasks running in the background , my first job would be to advise them what they really need , If they run windows i normally advise a anti-virus program , they normally take up a tiny amount of resources and you would hardly notice the absence and a firewall on many occasions. but honestly for most people burning a CD and ripping a movie is something they hardly ever do(in the case of a movie , if ever) so you can't justify the extra cash for an activity like this.even a virus scan is something done about once a month.
For your average windows gamer , your far better off getting a faster single core chip as well .
As much as i dislike the practice it should not up to the government to decide what companies sell.
That is the decision of company.
I find it as silly as forcing restaurants to provide a vegetarian alternative (I am a vegetarian btw). If these companies can see profit in doing it they will , or they don't they will lose business , Simple as that.
What the government should focus on however is making sure that Microsoft are not using exclusivity deals that would harm the company if they did sell computers without MS windows .
This is key in a free market , making sure its fair.
make sure large companies are not abusing their power, do Not in forcing smaller companies to stock what is deemed acceptable and to hell with their profits .
I do not want to buy a system with MS windows and I will choose a vendor who sells systems without it , I don't want to force a vendor into my way of thinking though .
The problem right now is there is just not enough of a gain to justify buying a dual core chip for the average consumer . .SMP will start to take hold in the future and more and more programs will be optimised for an SMP set up but this leaves us with a catch
They are generally outperformed by chips which cost a lot less (except in programs which can make use of the SMP set up)
People won't make user level programs optimised for SMP till SMP systems have a sizeable market share.
People won't buy dual core chips till there are programs which can use them .
they see no reason to spend the money on this when an ordinary chip they can buy now will perform better and a SMP processor they can buy when SMP is common will be faster and cheaper.
Bringing the price of these chips down should help a lot . If AMD and Intel are betting their future lines on dual core they will need to take a load of risks on pricing to get the idea out.
but why would any normal consumer want this chip when they can have a similarly clocked Athlon 64 for about half the price though. This although a really great cheap dual core chip is not cheap enough to win mind share IMHO . It will get the enthusiast market I'm sure but until Dual core chips cost around 200(or less) that is where they will stay(consumer level i mean , server and workstation is another debate).
Having said that , I am tempted to get one of these , I use linux as one of my main OS(that OS X and Solaris sparc) So I'm fairly sure i could see instant benefits with an SMP kernel and some tweaking .
Th