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Perhaps for New York, New Jersey, much of Florida and California there's not much excuse. Anywhere else in the USA and it's not so clear to me.

• 56% of the US population lived in the 50 largest metropolitan areas (for 2006 this roughly translates into population over 1,000,000)
• 67% - in 100 largest metro areas(population over 500,000)
• 78% - in 200 largest metro areas (population over 200,000)
• 85% - in metro areas with population over 100,000

Because they're running out of numbers, and need to use every one they can.

According to this German site, Toledo is the 4th largest city in Ohio. Columbus being the first, with Cleveland and Cincinnatti bringing up 2nd and 3rd. Toledo is actually the 57th biggest city in the US. more info

On the other hand, it is Ohio. It's all just one big small town. BTW, I've been living the past 15 years in Columbus so I can speak from experience. :)

The difference between PEI and Mars is that Mars might someday support the life of more than one human.

PEI recent population: 135,294

*looks puzzled*

If you only take the 5 boroughs of New York, then yes there is 8,085,742 people.

Columbus, OH = 728,432 people.

Source http://www.citypopulation.de/USA.html

But if you look at the metropolitan population, ie local area but spread beyond the city limits, then the figures are

NYC = 18,640,775 people

Colombus, OH = 1,674,589 people.

Source http://www.citypopulation.de/USA-Metro.html

Then the rest of New York State outside of the New York City Metro area makes up less than 1 million people.

If you only take the 5 boroughs of New York, then yes there is 8,085,742 people.

Columbus, OH = 728,432 people.

Source http://www.citypopulation.de/USA.html

But if you look at the metropolitan population, ie local area but spread beyond the city limits, then the figures are

NYC = 18,640,775 people

Colombus, OH = 1,674,589 people.

Source http://www.citypopulation.de/USA-Metro.html

Then the rest of New York State outside of the New York City Metro area makes up less than 1 million people.

There are 428 cities with more than a million people, and 59 with more than five million. A mere half-million isn't even worth listing; there are thousands.

http://www.citypopulation.de/World.html

From http://www.citypopulation.de/China.html , here are the estimated populations of the five largest cities in China as of 12-31-2001:
Shanghai: 9,838,400
Beijing: 7,441,000
Tianjin: 5,095,900
Wuhan: 4,488,900
Guangzhou: 4,154,800
Total of these five cities: 36,173,000.

Even if the population of these five cities had doubled in the past four years to 72 million, that would still be less than a quarter of the estimated 295.7 million people in the United States.

From http://www.citypopulation.de/China.html , here are the estimated populations of the five largest cities in China as of 12-31-2001:
Shanghai: 9,838,400
Beijing: 7,441,000
Tianjin: 5,095,900
Wuhan: 4,488,900
Guangzhou: 4,154,800
Total of these five cities: 36,173,000.

Even if the population of these five cities had doubled in the past four years to 72 million, that would still be less than a quarter of the estimated 295.7 million people in the United States.

Newcastle is the 8th largest city with approx 300 000 people or probably much more, around 400 000 - the latest census was four years ago.

It'd most definitely have quite a few linux admins, especially attending the uni of Newcastle.

source

Oh, so you now say that some (in fact, the wealthiest) states of the U.S. are richer than most European countries. That's quite different than your previous assumption of *many*.

Let's look at it the other way:

-Four European countries are wealthier than *any* of the states (yes, including California): Germany, France, U.K. and Italy.
-Slovakia, being a former comunist country (and one of the poorest and smallest) has bigger economy than 15(+2 ?) states (Alaska,-perhaps- Arkansas, Delaware, Hawaii, Idaho, Maine, -perhaps- Mississippi, Montana, Nebraska, New Hampshire, New Mexico, North Dakota, Rhode Island, South Dakota, Vermont, West Virginia and Wyoming). Poland economy (another ex-communist country) has more GDP than 44(!!) U.S. states.
-14 countries of the EEC (56%) rank above 150.000 MD, for only 24 of the U.S. states (48%). The thirteenth economy in the EEC (Denkmark) is bigger than each of 27 states.

Let's not talk about population, for being the totals in Europe around 453 million people. Ireland, for example, being roughly 4 million people (not three), has more than anyone of 25 U.S. States. The only countries with less population than any of the states are Malta and Luxembourg, being both tiny ones. Cyprus, the next, ranks above AK,ND, VT, WY (I'm getting tired of copying statistics, sorry). There are 16 (32%) states under 2 million people, for only 5 (20%) EEC countries.

Sources:

Population U.S.A.
Iowa Economy
European Union

Note that venice is not even considered a major city by North American standards (a city in the US requires a population of over 1 million to be considered a metropolis -- while cities of the size of Venice are common, few to none are popularly known oustside of their respective states). Further note that disqualifies it as useful in your argument. Also note, that while I live in a town tiny enough few people know about it outside of my province (not to mention that few know of it INSIDE my province), it has a larger population than venice.

For your reference.

Population of venice, italy: 275,368

Population of NY, NY: 8,084,316

Notice the difference. See what I'm getting at? If not, perhaps you should ask the residents of Italy, why, if Venice is such a panacea, that the vast majority of them live in Rome instead?

But hey, try and troll me again, I feel like arguing tonight.

I continue to present your idea of making cities like venice as unworkable until it is proven to work with a population of 1 million+, which would be a sizeable city in North America, and not just an extremely tiny suburb, such as Venice would be here.

So the thing that city folk always forget, is that most folk aren't city folk.

That is just wrong. Most people *are* city folk.

The US population has been predominantly metropolitan since 1950 and the 2000 census reports that 80% live in a metropolitan area. 60% of the US population are accounted for in urban agglomerations over 1 million people. (177m out of 290m total.)

I'm guessing that your figures (I don't know where they come from) are probably for the narrowly defined 'city' (e.g. just the centre) and do not take into account the urban area which is a more reasonable definition when considering whether a population is urban or rural.

Europe probably has even greater urbanisation and even relatively small cities (under 1 million people) such as Bibao or Salzburg have good public transportation. I know it's not so good in the US for a variety of reasons (lack of government subsidies, more suburban sprawl, cultural attachment to cars, etc.)

Cars aren't such a problem in rural areas, where they are necessary; they only become a problem through congestion in cities. (Compare rural/urban MPG figures.)

My point was not to argue any of this but just to point out that even in cities where there *are* alternatives - good public transportation, or where people are within a cycling distance (note cities in Europe have higher densities) people will *still* drive to work.

50 largest cities (2002) (from New York to Wichita)
276 Metropolitan Areas (2000) (from New York--Northern New Jersey--Long Island, NY--NJ--CT--PA CMSA to Enid, OK MSA).

Where did you get that?

But the population of Pusan is roughly the same as chicago. Seoul's population is usually enough to place it in the top 5 most populous urban centers in the world.

Look here

See Seoul at number 3, and pusan and 78?

Microsoft has spent over $500 million on advertising for Xbox in the United States alone. The United States has an estimated population of 278,058,900. Which means Microsoft is spending about $1.80 per citizen to promote the Xbox.

Microsoft plans on spending $750 million on advertising for Microsoft in China. China has an estimated population of 1,273,111,300. Microsoft therefore is spending about $0.59 per citizen on advertising in China.

Granted, the demographics for each group are vastly smaller than the overall population, and the dollar, in spite of its recent downturn, still can buy a lot more in China than it can in the US. But this still seems disproportionate, especially considering China has the potential to become the world's largest technology market.

Note: All currency was figured using US dollars. Population statistics gathered from City Population.

The poster never said that the events at the World Trade Center weren't important, or that 6000 deaths weren't important. They are, but he's right that people need some perspective. Every year in the US approx 2.4 million people die. That's approx 6500 a day. Since 9/11, about 80,000 people have died across the US. Every year, 20,000 people die of AIDS in the US. In New York, approx 2500 people have died since the attack in completely unrelated ways. Since you mention murder, almost 20,000 people have been murdered in the US since 9/11.

A lot of people died, and it is sad. A lot of property was destroyed, and that's sad too. A well known landmark of NYC was levelled and that's sad. But more than sad, most of these things are scary to people who didn't see it coming. But the world is fundamentally the same as it was 2 weeks ago before everything happened. Air travel is far less convenient, Manhattan is drastically changed, but the US has barely changed at all.

I think the map CNN made to show the damage to NYC is neat. It does a good job of showing the scale of the damage. The fact I think the map is neat doesn't mean I don't think the damage is horrible, but I am able to differentiate between the map and the damage itself. I also think SmartMoney's map of the market is neat (http://www.smartmoney.com/marketmap/index.cfm?sho wWeekStats=true). It shows graphically what the market has been doing in the last week. This doesn't mean I think it's neat that the market lost 15% in 1 week, or that the weapons contractors are up; Lockheed Martin is up 10%, General Dynamics is up 10% and Northrop Grumman is up 20%.

Don't confuse the messenger with the message.

Sources: http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/, http://www.citypopulation.de/ http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/keytabs.htm

Obligatory on-topic comment: Maybe I should change my signature. Of course, that would imply I didn't agree with what Metallica said...
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