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I could transcode video, compile a kernel, had an office suite, write code, etcetcet on 433MHz celeron with 128MB.

the functionality-to-specifications ratio is abysmal.

and don't get me started on what people pay for, today. A tea timer is an "app" ? I *pay* for that? For what i can do with my calculator and two lines of code? Or what my featurephone does on its own?

It's a fucking joke.

Install gcc toolchain on the iPhone
DocumentsToGo office suite for iPhone.
Nimbus source code editor for iOS.
ffmpeg for iPhone

You can do whatever you want on these phones. It's just that people haven't bothered writing polished applications to do most of the stuff you're suggesting can be done better, faster and easier on other platforms, for now at least.

You cannot run any "office" software

That is incorrect. It'll run all of the iPhone software right out of the gate. This includes an excellent implementation of Documents to Go. I won't bother with links, but there's also WriteRoom, TextGuru, QuickSheet, MarinerCalc, etc. FileAid is a Free reader program that also supports OpenOffice.

I just checked. Documents to go 10.001 is Vista compatible - kind of.
http://www.dataviz.com/products/documentstogo/premium/dxtg_vista_note.html
not enough to make me pay for v10 though. Still think Microsoft fucked up and Vista is a piece of shit.

Maybe.
Apple - iWork'08 under Tiger can import OOXML documents, but it does so in a roundabout way. It imports OOXML files into it's native format (.pages, etc), but it can't write OOXML. (Not to mention you have to export the document back to office format, rather than save as). TextEdit under Leopard is said to be able to read/write OOXML as well as ODF, but I can't confirm this. The iPhone is also said to be able to open OOXML as well.
Novell - Novell's OpenOffice is said to be able to handle OOXML (according to wikipedia), but I have not tried it myself. According to the same article, OO.o 2.3 (not Novell) is said to have an OOXML importer - so I guess that could cover Linux as well.
Palm - Datavitz DocumentsToGo
Java - No clue.
IP Issues - No clue
Easy to work with - Not my area of expertise. :-D

http://www.dataviz.com/products/maclinkplus/ Maclink Plus has always worked for us.

That's total FUD.

http://www.infoworld.com/article/06/12/04/HNnovell openxml_1.html
http://www.dataviz.com/

OpenXML has/is being implemented by 3rd parties.

So you're saying you know for a fact that there are no patents covering anything in the ODF standard? If so why did Sun produce a convenant not to sue ODF developers?

Well it seems like I'm answering my own question...

http://www.infoworld.com/article/06/12/04/HNnovell openxml_1.html

Novell is supplying openxml support for OpenOffice.

Datavis already seems to provide support for OpenXML

http://www.dataviz.com/

So I guess some people have managed to decipher Microsoft's documentation.

When it came to everything you did to deal with different MS Word formats, I notice you didn't mention MacLinkPlus Deluxe so maybe you should have given that a try. Also, if the recipient of your document doesn't need to be editing that document, perhaps you should consider sending that person a PDF instead. A PDF is even more likely to display what you intended.

Also, there might be some versions hidden in your .doc file that you might not want your recipient to see anyway. Hey, it happens. And it might have already happened to your wife. Oops! Personally, I think people should avoid passing around .doc files as much as possible for reasons too numerous to mention and too obvious to bother.

Then you never had Documents to Go. It is a 3rd party app bundled with many Palms & Treos (depending on carrier) that reads MSWord & Excel files no problem along with a couple of the palm DOC-type formats. The newer version which I don't have adds PDF, Powerpoint, and outlook support. It has a decent amount of wysiswyg graphics and is visually comparable to WinMobile versions of Office apps.

http://www.dataviz.com/products/documentstogo/inde x_palm.html

It's been out for many years and IMO Palm should use some of their cash reserve to buy DataViz flat out and bundle Docs2Go with everything they sell that is "prosumer" grade or better.

Linked version with condensed summary. I wanted to find out more about some of them. Others may benefit too.

Ecto a blogging client (but the site seems to be down: try this for more info). Shareware, $17.95.
Transmit an FTP client. Shareware, $17.95
Sync Services -- comes with 10.4
BBedit text/html editor. $125, but worth it.
Missing Synch for Windows Mobile - synchronize with PDA/smartphones. $49.95/$39.95
OmniGraffle - diagramming / flowchart program. $79.95 / $149.95
ConceptDraw - another diagramming / flowchart program. $299
IChat AV - built-in to 10.4
AppleScript, Scriptdebugger - also built-in. No link. I'm getting lazy.
Microsoft Entourage -- part of MS Office.
Sketchfigher 4000 Alpha -- a game from the great Ambrosia Software. $19.00
TypeIt4Me - keyboard macro expander. $27
NetworkLocation - automatically trigger configuration changes depending upon where you are on the network (e.g., at home, work, etc.). $15
Apple Remote Desktop 3 - control / configure Mac systems remotely. $499 / $299 (unlimited / 10 systems)
MacLinkPlus - file conversion software (e.g., from WordPerfect documents to/from Word, and many others). $79
Parallels Desktop for Mac - virtualization software (e.g., run Win XP simultaneously with OS X). $79.
Remote Desktop Connection - connect remotely to a Windows desktop. FREE
Snap X Pro - screen / movie capture. $29
Boot Camp - dual boot Windows. I'm lazy.
PDF - Portable Document Format from Adobe? What?
Lingon - tool for making launchd scripts for 10.4.
Workgroup Manager - manage local systems - part of 10.4 Server.

---
Okay, a mildly interesting list. Here's a few more suggestions:

Cyberduck - FTP and SFTP client. Donationware.
VLC - cross-platform video viewer / transcoder.
Blender 3D - cross-platform 3D modelling / rendering.
Bookends - excellent bibliography software. $99
Celestia - cross-platform real-time 3D astronomy simulator.
Plot - a, uh, plotting / graphing program.
proFit - another plotting / graphing program, non-free. $95
WordService - adds a bunch of text reformatting tools to the Services menu, making them accessible in any program. The same page has a bunch of other useful and free services.

The original article lists PDF, but no tools. While its true OS X native support makes PDF pretty easy to use, there's still some tasks that are awkward and some useful tools out there to do t

If Apple had been secretly developing a serious office suite (as opposed to iWork) for years, having learned from mistakes made in MS Office, I doubt very much Microsoft could do anything to blow it away in an instant. These things take time to design and develop, no matter how many or how good your ``A-players''. And Apple doesn't have to reverse engineer doodly-squat when they can work (and are already working) with DataViz who is licensed to work with MS document formats. So what I mentioned is indeed possible.

Or you could use XPlay from MediaFour (the folks that brought you MacDrive forever and three days ago) to do the same thing three years ago when the 2G was hot shit. Seriously, did you ever even bother to look? Did you know MacDrive or MacOpener existed? I kid you not, sir, you can read and write Mac formatted disks on your PC TODAY, right this very instant in fact. I have done these magiks myself. This would not be new technology, just a possibly free incarnation of it.

... like Passwords Plus, which is available for Windows, Mac, & Palm; you can read its specs here. It's like a database program where you define the fields, though some predefined templates are included.

... like Passwords Plus, which is available for Windows, Mac, & Palm; you can read its specs here. It's like a database program where you define the fields, though some predefined templates are included.

If you have a laptop I ask "why do you need a PDA?".

I have a PDA and a flash drive and no laptop. I could not carry a laptop around. It just wouldn't work well for me but there are plenty of desktop PCs where I go. A PDA, however, with a belt wallet is the envy of my co-workers. I have Documents to Go so I can carry machine lists or whatever. Sure I could do this with paper. But I won't remember paper. I remember my Palm and so it works for me.

There are a few utilities that do that: MacOpener, MacDrive, TransMac, and (also for *n*x) TransferPro

This happened again when I went out and got a job. The company was all Windows based, but we were still using NT in 2001, and we would frequently be emailed Office attachments in newer versions of Office we couldn't use. I'd have to forward the attachment to myself at home, go home for lunch and translate it on my Mac, then email it back to myself at work.

Palm really

My main problem with Palm platforms is that out-of-the-box, they are inherently limited in function. They are quite powerfull, don't get me wrong, but they just lack what power users need. Enter the third-party market. After years of using PalmOS devices, I've had a lot of experience trying out the myriad of applications, and after all these years and applications, i came to the conclusion that you really just need some basic add-ons to really make your PalmOS device powerful.

First, purchase and install ZLauncher as an Application Launcher replacement. Yes, it's full of more features than you could possibly need, and its default configuration, in my opinion, is not ideal, but it's a very powerful launcher. Spend some time getting to know it and tweak it to your preferences, and you end up with an environment that is top-notch. And it sports an integrated file manager that is almost second to none.

Next, purchase and install CardExport. When you connect your Palm via USB cable to your PC and run this program, your WIndows XP PC sees the SD card as an external drive with no additional drivers needed--truely plug-and-play. You can now copy files to and from your PC to your heart's content and manage the directory structure to your needs.

Third, purchase and install the latest version of your choice of Documents To Go to manage Word, Excel, and optionally PowerPoint presentations. The latest versions work with native Word and Excel files. This is an excellent tool, and combined with CardExport, you can move files in and out in a heartbeat.

OK, so you have to spend some money, but you end up with a system that is very flexible and very powerful.

And yes, Palm shoule include these features by default, but since they don't, your best bet si to turn to third party apps.

For instance, Pocket Word tends to screw up formatted tables, inline images, formatting, the like, while Docs to Go has repeatably demonstrated in the past that their product does not. Sames goes for things like Pocket Excel, Powerpoint, etc. Walt Mossberg had a great article on this a while ago. What's more, DTG practically comes with every Palm product nowadays.

While this may have changed in the most recent future (last I heard "Windows Mobile Pocket PC 2003" still had this problem), I doubt 2005 greatly changed it. Now of course, perception is everything, and one might *think* PocketPCs would be better with office, but as we know perception is not always in line with reality.

Sadly, OpenOffice is not supported using Documents to Go for palmOS. Even when I save the document as an excel spreadsheet and try to transfer it over, Documents to Go throws a hissy fit and spits out an error. Documents to Go claims no plans to support native OO format, either.

If this company utilizes pda's, then OO is not the way to go.

I think the way around this is to use Documents to Go v6, which has native support for MS Office files. That is, it doesn't need the translation by the conduit. Office documents can be emailed, put onto an expansion card, etc. and will be usable on the handheld. More info at http://www.dataviz.com/products/documentstogo/dxtg _features.html.

Unfortunately, I don't have first-hand experience with the new version (v5 came w/ my T|C and I've not bothered to upgrade yet) but I'm assuming that one could export a document in a Microsoft format using OOo, copy it to the Palm, and use it w/ Documents to Go.

I'd be curious to know if anyone has tried this, and to know what the results were.

waiting for it to become so standard

You're forgetting one very big abuse I think microsoft has committed here... they didn't just wait around for FAT to become standard - their monopoly position allowed them to refuse to support any other standard. Being able to read mac disks would be a sellable feature and they should include in the operating system, but they don't have to because they've got a monopoly. So, they've bullied their way into forcing everyone else to support FAT (even solaris!) as a least-common-denominator.

My guess is, you'd still need MacOpener for that. But if it does, it'd be excellent.

Have you heard of Documents To Go? Word To Go works prety well.

interoperability. I agree with Knife_Edge that Apple is encouraging cross-platform interoperability.

• Apple includes a notable Java environment.
• Apple promotes (see the "Use the best tool for the job" heading) Virtual PC.
  
• fink
• Appleworks provides file-format interoperability with common Microsoft Office applications through the use of MacLinkPlus tools.

Yes, you can. It's called "Documents to Go", by Dataviz. It'll let you create and synchronize Word and Excel files..as well as several other formats if you buy the more expensive versions. Very handy... I use it to keep my class gradebooks on my PDA, and it works fine for all the formulas and formatting that I use.

yrs,
Ephemeriis

I have to second that notion. I had trouble getting xPlay to work consistantly on Windows XP, with "Write behind..." errors, and corrupted iPod... After updating the software on the iPod, I tried out the EphPod and MacOpener 2000 combo, and all works well... After 2 weeks of use, no problems that I cannot ascribe to other issues: UE, badly formed MP3 filenames, etc.

That being said, when I tried it 1 rev ago, xPlay was a pretty stable product, that initially convinced me to buy the iPod despite my non-ownership of a Mac. In the middle term, it's probably going to be better software for the power-user, however, I am supporting EphPod.

• iPoding.com
• iPodlounge.com

The product is called Documents To Go.

".doc is NOT a standard. It is a format that is determined by one group with no regard for compatibility or interoperability. Standards exist to INCREASE interoperability."

So if I my new Windows 3D rendering package used the .DOC extension for its Direct Optical Correlation files, this wouldn't cause confusion, because .DOC isn't really a standard?

And if Microsoft issued an 'update' that changed the format of files created by Word 6.0+ in such a way that StarOffice could no longer read or write them, it wouldn't be a problem because .DOC isn't really a standard?

And if for the same reason, I suddenly can't use Documents To Go on my Palm OS device, I shouldn't be inconvenienced because .DOC isn't really a standard?

I think you're referring to industry standards, and not to de facto standards. The moment other companies began writing software which was dependent on the structure of a Microsoft Word document (.DOC) file in order to operate correctly, that structure became a de facto standard.

I'm not saying you have to like it. I'm just saying that it's the way things are.

Macs have FOR MORE THAN A DECADE read DOS formatted disks. My macs can read FAT formatted zip disks. [Luckily, I had SCSI in my pc, so I didn't have to wait for the IDE Zip drives].

I've now had one of the 80G Maxtor drives since about April/May, and it's worked fine for me, moving files between a G3 portable, G4 desktop, win98 desktop, win2k desktop, and a winME desktop.

On the windows side, you have to go down to the lower right corner, and tell it to unmount the disk before you pull it. With the Mac, you just handle it as you would normally unmount a disk (drag to the trash).

Now, as for this 'doesn't read others' crap, let's look at the whole details -- As HFS uses two forks (data, resource), if you attempt to write a Mac file in anything other than 'raw data' mode, it'll create a directory 'resourcefolder' or something of that sort, and store the resource fork there. If you then use a non-mac to move the file, you'll lose the resource fork. This isn't an issue for many types of data files, as may have comments (like where a JPEG was downloaded from), or some minor save state information (BBEdit save state). This is an issue for applications, however. If you're going to need to move files around on the non-mac system, it's best to save them as some sort of an archive, or write 'em out to MacBinary.

There is, however, one additional issue. UNIX, DOS and Mac all use different line endings on text files. Normally, files are transfered between different systems using 'FTP', and you'd just force it to acsii mode to deal with this problem. If you're writing to a local disk, you'll have to know what line endings the recipient will need. WordPad (PC) or BBEdit (Mac) will handle foreign line endings. Not being a Linux user, I don't know if there are editors that handle this issue. [there's 'dos2unix' and the like, or you can just do some simple subsitutions on the file].

Macs for a damned long time even shipped with 'MacLink', a program which would let you convert different DOS/Mac/whatever files from different applications, so that you could open a Word5DOS file in WP3.5Mac without losing formatting. DataViz also makes a program for the PC, but well, PCs can't read Mac disks, like Macs can read PC disks, so I don't know how useful it'd be.

http://www.dataviz.com/products/conversionsplus/in dex.html

Personally, these days, I use my PCs, and my Solaris box at work more than my mac (until I need BBEdit), however, I'm surpised to see this sort of completely unsupported mac-bashing on a website that always bitches about the 'FUD' from Microsoft.

Apple used to bundle MacLinkPlus with MacOS, so any Mac user could open any file from any program -- PC or Mac. (I used to annoy PC users by using my Mac PowerBook to translate files for them that they couldn't open, from programs that they didn't have and that weren't even available for the Mac, e.g., Lotus AmiPro. The stuff works.) Apple doesn't bundle it any more (?!) for their own inscrutable reasons.

There is no Linux version (yet) of DataViz's translator package, but they do offer translation packages for Palm users, so there's some indication that they're open to addressing "non-traditional" platforms if they see a market. I have hope.

Apple used to bundle MacLinkPlus with MacOS, so any Mac user could open any file from any program -- PC or Mac. (I used to annoy PC users by using my Mac PowerBook to translate files for them that they couldn't open, from programs that they didn't have and that weren't even available for the Mac, e.g., Lotus AmiPro. The stuff works.) Apple doesn't bundle it any more (?!) for their own inscrutable reasons.

There is no Linux version (yet) of DataViz's translator package, but they do offer translation packages for Palm users, so there's some indication that they're open to addressing "non-traditional" platforms if they see a market. I have hope.

Apple used to bundle MacLinkPlus with MacOS, so any Mac user could open any file from any program -- PC or Mac. (I used to annoy PC users by using my Mac PowerBook to translate files for them that they couldn't open, from programs that they didn't have and that weren't even available for the Mac, e.g., Lotus AmiPro. The stuff works.) Apple doesn't bundle it any more (?!) for their own inscrutable reasons.

There is no Linux version (yet) of DataViz's translator package, but they do offer translation packages for Palm users, so there's some indication that they're open to addressing "non-traditional" platforms if they see a market. I have hope.

Both of which failed utterly to promote technological progress or a competitive marketplace. It's not the first time, either, and it's certainly not the first time in the infotech sector. AT&T ring any Bells? (nyuck!)

Unlike the AT&T trial, Pennfield-Jackson clearly has a clue, immersing himself in the culture, technology and market realities surrounding the case. The findings of fact and findings of law are rock solid, and have enough precedent backing them up to make M$'s appeals team weep.

In the MS case, the government is stepping in to preserve technological progress and an open market. Exactly the role the government -should- fill. I'd rather they expend all their effort tackling anti-competitive and cartel behavior in the multi-nats than figure out ways to limit freee speech.

Just remember folks once upon a time IBM was the Big Evil Corporation (tm) that was choking the life out of the computer industry, today we sing their praises as cool and hip for understanding and embracing our beloved Linux better and faster than any other established company.

This is because IBM, unlike Microsoft, decided to adhere to -their- consent decree. Or did you forget that Big Bad Big Blue was once up against the Sherman Acts in court? Microsoft had a way out, but they decided they were above the law and their bottom line was more important than the democratic rule of law. Too bad, so sad, time to go.

The market is voracious: no one company is indispensable, and players strapped down by a fat and iron-fisted Microsoft would rise and shine to make the market bloom. If Bill Gates folded MS tomorrow in a fit of piqué, Sun, Apple, Corel and Red hat would take off like a shot, and companies like Data-Viz would fill the compatibility gaps.

So, yeah, put me in the "Very Good Thing" camp.

SoupIsGood Food