PalmOne Releases 4GB PDA [updated]

davidconger writes "PalmOne has introduced the first device in their new line of Mobile Manager handheld devices. The LifeDrive includes an embedded 4GB Hitachi Microdrive and additional software for file/folder synchronization. The device includes both WiFi and Bluetooth. Price tag on the device $499. PocketFactory has done a complete review of the LifeDrive." Reader gandell adds a link to Brighthand's review. Update: 05/18 18:08 GMT by T : An anonymous reader corrects this story's original headline, writing "Despite rumors the LifeDrive would run Linux, it runs PalmOS 5 (Garnet). However, the device seems to have a Linux-friendly design, and is likely to run Linux soon, whether supplied by PalmOne's sister company PalmSource, or by Linux hobbyists. PalmSource is likely to offer a Linux OS upgrade for the LifeDrive, once it is ready to support the huge variety of legacy Palm apps under Linux." Update: 05/18 18:44 GMT by T : One more review, this one at MobileTechReview.

Comments

4gb internal microdrive?

[BluhDeBluh]

Is this much use for anybody, for anything other than a big MP3 player - for which, you could just buy a big MP3 player anyhow?

Is there any real advantage of a big memory card built in?

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[geeper]

Yea and 640K ought to be enough for anybody.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[Harbinjer]

Well, it can play movies and video clips. That might be useful.

I would be cool for things like wikipedia, I suppose. That's what one of the reviews mentioned.

Its not good enough to be a true portable video player though, unfortunately. On review said the battery life was too short.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[tezbobobo]

I completely agree. And to add, down with these generic products. I can get a digital camera the size of a credit card, a phone (those tiny ones) and an mp3 player and they'd all take up less rome than one-phone-does-all solution.

If people need a solution for carrying around files, buy one. If you want a personal digital organiser, buy a personal digital organiser. When will people learn that economy is lost in diversification?

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[Trigun]

Just paint "Don't Panic" on the back.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[fshalor]

Before or after you drop it?

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[rpdillon]

I completely agree. And to add, down with these generic products. I can get a set-top box the size of a small toaster, a gaming console(the PS2 slim) and webTV box and they'd all take up less room than a "personal computer" solution.

If people need a solution for recording TV shows, buy one. If you want to play games, buy a XBox, PlayStation or Gamecube. When will people learn that economy is lost in diversification?

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[callipygian-showsyst]

I can only hope that the Windows-Mobile based devices with 4GB or more will soon follow.

As a developer, Windows Mobile is a much easier platform to work with.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[jbplou]

If you move around between many different sites that have wifi access it makes a good email device as well.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[lowrydr310]

Where do you get a small set-top-box? I need one for an old TV that I have, but I can't find them ANYWHERE. I thought about using a VCR to accomplish the same task (tune my basic analog cable), but it's practically impossible to find a cheap VCR. I was in BestBuy and Circuit City and the cheapest VCR they had was $65 - most of their DVD players are the same price or less.

Back on topic, I wish manufacturers would offer a camera-less version of their products like cameraphones and all-in-one PDAs. I wouldn't mind having a Treo 650, however the camera prevents me from buying one. I'm unable to bring a camera into my workplace, and I assume many other people have the same restrictions.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, I'm sure the slashdot community is DYING for another Windows device. Seeing how most slashdot readers are avid lovers of Windows.

> As a developer, Windows Mobile is a much easier platform to work with.

As a virus programmer, Windows Mobile is a much easier platform to work with.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[SolusSD]

You make a good point. For a PDA, 4GB is insane. I cannot think of, besides music and video, any reason your average consumer would need so much storage space on a PDA. Consider what they are designed for- enlightened day planners and adress books.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[jacksonj04]

I've used both Palm and PocketPC (WinCE) devices for a while now, and I have to say that PocketPC wins hands down.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[Rob Simpson]

Well, the only reason I could see for having it is to combine a "big MP3 player" and a pda in a single small device... even with all the books and references I have on mine, I still have a little left on my 512 meg flash card.

Personally, I'd rather avoid having moving parts and get a bigger card if I needed one, unless this thing is substantially faster - and gets better battery life, which I find rather unlikely.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[ryusen]

for home use, i agree that diversifitcation is good, but when we are talking mobile, i was to carry as a few things as i can. it this means i don't need to cary a PDA and an image storage device, that works great for me.

i defiantely would not mind a palm solution that had a media manager type solution.. where this unit falls short is that it's not enough. needs bigger HD better battery life.. and a CF card slot. of course, i am a niche market... i doubt most PDA users might take a few GB worth of photos in one day.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[Anonymous Coward]

However, I'm not aware of any virus problem on a Windows Mobile device.

Then you don't seem to know jack shit...

http://www.informit.com/articles/article.asp?p=337 069

It's been known since last september.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[geoffspear]

No, that's not what they're designed for. That's what idiots use them for. There's a difference.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[MadChicken]

Funny, I see it completely the other way around. I just couldn't DO anything with the PPC. I really miss Pocket Informant though, the best PIM on both platforms...

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[Anonymous Coward]

Either, as it would be wrapped in a towel.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[notthe9]

The average consumer doesn't need a PDA at all.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[Zonnald]

Have you ever tried to write a business application using databases on a PALM? Guess not.

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[StormKrow]

two words:

Wal Mart

they've got VHS machines for as low as $35 if I remember right. Fairly decent too, 4-head stereo at that.

(yes, I know, WalMart is the devil, but sometimes you have to dance with the devil to get what you want.)

Re:4gb internal microdrive?

[LWATCDR]

There are other functions that you could use a PDA for. Navigation is one. Add a GPS and a full set of maps and you are using a chunk of 4gb. As someone pointed out video, and music are also options.
As far as it being over kill... How many people NEED 2.4Ghz P4s?
Frankly a 900Mhz PIII is good enough for most people do. I mean does a 2.4Ghz with an onboard video card make any sense at all? But tons get sold. A 4gb microdrive may be a lot cheaper 1Gb of flash and it is a bigger number.

Linux

[DrXym]

It runs PalmOS so where's the Linux part come in?

Re:Linux

[ssj_195]

I'm a little unclear on this also; I think what happened at Palm is that PalmOS became the Palm API built upon a Linux core, or somesuch. Anyone more knowledgeable than me care to chime in? :)

Re:Linux

[spotter]

future versions of Palm OS 6 (Cobalt) is supposed to be built around a linux core. Current versions of Cobalt aren't.

But that's totally a different point, as the life drive (According to the review) is built w/ Garnet (PalmOS 5.4) which has more in common w/ PalmOS 3/2/1 than Linux.

Re:Linux

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, it does run Linux but so far they sell it only with Palm OS of which I am not sure if it is based on Linux. The plan on selling it with Linux at some point so I might buy one.

Re:Linux

[tonyquan]

The LifeDrive runs PalmOS Garnet, which is not Linux based. Only PalmOS Cobalt is Linux based, and to my knowledge there are no PDAs currently available running Cobalt.

Re:Linux

[Timesprout]

You sir fail to respect the right of this PDA to run Linux if it wants to. Ya bloody splitter

Re:Linux

[jayhawk88]

The part where you have to mention Linux in the title to get your article posted to the front page.

Re:Linux

[ardiri]

It runs PalmOS so where's the Linux part come in?

this is where the article poster confused palmone's future plans with their existing plans. the lifedrive runs garnet, which is palmos 5.4. this is the palm proprietary format; no different to what is on the tungsten t5 and treo 650.

palmone has announced they will be providing an alternative kernel (linux based) in their future cobalt devices. currently, cobalt has a different kernal than the garnet devices; which has been headed up by a lot of old-beos developers. (remember, they purchased em).

its a nice device - i look forward to adding it to my museum :P

Re:Linux

[_ph1ux_]

does this have anything to do with Cobalt, like Cobalt Qube and Raq? That was a linux based NAS bought by Seagate in the past?

Re:Linux

[Locutus]

currently, cobalt has a different kernal than the garnet devices; which has been headed up by a lot of old-beos developers. (remember, they purchased em).

yes, I remember that it was ~2-3 years ago IIRC. I still can't believe they don't have a shipping product yet. When I talked with the Palm engineers working on the OS and bringing in BeOS, they said they were keeping the work they had already done and were bringing in pieces of BeOS. It was obvious that they thought their work was better than BeOS... NOW, they are attempting to do it right. This time, they are putting the PalmOS API ontop of the GNU/Linux kernel. Something they should have done with the BeOS kernel years ago.

This( Lin/Cobalt ) is probably their last chance. IMHO

LoB

Re:Linux

[ecloud]

Yeah I bet Familiar will get ported soon enough.

Re:Linux

[Leroy_Brown242]

Well, they had to use the magic 'L word' to get everyone to read. :)

Re:Linux

[Anonymous Coward]

It runs PalmOS so where's the Linux part come in?

I develop third-party apps for Palm OS, so let me explain this. It's a bit complicated.

Palm applications are built against a set of application level APIs. Through the history of Palm OS, they have changed the kernel underneath the APIs without changing the APIs appreciably. At first, they used a licensed kernel from a third party. Then, I believe they switched to their own kernel. I'm not sure, but I think this was at the time they switch from Motorola 68000 processors to ARM (RISC) processors, which was the time of the switch from OS 4.x to OS 5.x.

A few years ago, PalmSource (the software people -- PalmOne are the hardware people) decided the non-multitasking nature of the OS wasn't that hot, and it was time for an update. So, they wrote OS 6. OS 6 has, I believe, yet another completely new kernel. This makes sense because it has a much more complicated task: to provide preemptive multitasking and better security. To date, neither PalmOne nor any other hardware manufacturer has actually released a device that runs OS 6.

Now, the complicated part: Palm OS is an embedded OS, and they do a new build of it for each new type of hardware that is made. It is not an OS that you install from CD-ROM onto any old hardware. Unfortunately, the process of bringing it up on new hardware seems to be quite painful and difficult, probably involving writing new device drivers just about every time you make a new device.

Meanwhile, Linux has taken the embedded world by storm. Virtually any embedded device that comes out now comes "for free" with Linux drivers already available for it. So, why is PalmSource switching to Linux? Pretty simple: (1) they've already proven they can switch kernels and maintain application compatibility no problem in the past (two or three times, even), and (2) they want free drivers because that'll make bringing up new devices dramatically easier.

As you may have guessed by now, if they ever do release a Linux Palm OS device, it's probably going to be just the Linux kernel and not any of (or not much of) the Linux userland stuff. That is to say, it'll be Linux, but it won't be GNU/Linux. The user will probably be totally unaware that it has Linux behind the scenes, as will the application programmer as well (most likely).

Furthermore, it's my prediction that until this Linux-based Palm OS transition is complete, no hardware devices will be released that run OS 6. Since Linux promises to make it that much easier to bring up the hardware, and since OS 5.x is still selling fine, there isn't a big motivation to do the extra work if it's all about to become lots easier later on (in months or hopefully not a whole year) anyway.

PDA!

[Anonymous Coward]

But its only a PDA! Just a PDA!!!

Yet again...

[jav1231]

Yep! Linux has driven down the price of the PDA once again to a lowly $499! (smell the sarcasm?) I must say, though, in this case getting 4gb with it does make it more attractive.

Re:Yet again...

[jav1231]

Doh! There IS no Linux!? Makes sense, otherwise they'd up it to $599!

Re:Yet again...

[tomcio.s]

Nonono.. It's $499 + $699 for linux licence. get your numbers straight!

It's not a Linux PDA

[ArsEric]

It actually runs PalmOS 5.4, not Linux.

Re:It's not a Linux PDA

[sconest]

Indeed. I failed to see where it was said that it was a Linux PDA

Re:It's not a Linux PDA

[youknowmewell]

Egg, meet Face *splat*

Re:It's not a Linux PDA

[YU Nicks NE Way]

I failed to see where it was said that it was a Linux PDA

Look at the title on the front page. See those five letters, "LINUX" in the colored bar? That's where it says "Editors don't actually read the articles, and that's why I block their ads...err, I mean, Linux"

Re:It's not a Linux PDA

[niola]

Palm has been working on the PalmOS to make it more of a window manager/GUI than OS relying on a layer underneath it for process/memory/IO management etc.

If you search palminfocenter.com there are a few articles on this in their archive.

Re:It's not a Linux PDA

[niola]

Here is the palm infocener article: :inux is the future

Geeks

[COMON$]

So does this mean the geeks out there will hack it to put linux on it?

Re:Geeks

[Harbinjer]

I'm sure they will. They have with others. This is certainly powerful enough

Re:Geeks

[COMON$]

I mean hacking it to put windows on it.

Re:Geeks

[fshalor]

Yep! This is a post from an iPaq running linux.

Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[Anonymous Coward]

in this age where my celphone has as much capability as a PDA (including 4gb of storage)
why would anyone want a bulky pda anymore ?

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[Harbinjer]

Better input capabilities, and a much larger screen. So you can watch movies, and do some work perhaps?

I think Cell phones are too small for many pda-ish things, currently.

Unless someone comes up with a better display method, perhaps holographic, they are limited. Oh, and they need a better input interface

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[ylikone]

Because user input (typing) on a phone is a PITA. The screens are often too small to be usefull. And I don't want my phone battery to die because I've been busy doing something on the PDA portion of it. Keep um separated I say.

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[Quantum Fizz]

Why would anyone want a PDA?

• Can you input data into your cell phone as quickly as a screen keyboard or graffiti?
• Can you run word-processors and spreadsheets on your cell phone?
• Does your cell-phone have a decent-sized display?
• Is there a vast library of both free and commercial software for your cell phone? Including e-books and document readers, dictionaries, map software, etc?
• Can you connect to a GPS via bluetooth with your cellphone, have it display real-time maps, such that you can navigate your car with it?

I kind of agree with you that it's annoying having both PDA and Mobile Phone, but there are many reasons why I need a PDA and my phone just doesn't cut it. (I just bought my first PDA about 5 weeks ago, BTW, a Palm Zire 31).

I do hope that within the next few years we'll see a merging of phones and PDA's, like the Treo, but with a better design.

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[bill_mcgonigle]

a better display method, perhaps holographic

I'm still holding out for a Microvision PDA/cell phone. Alas, it may be a few years more.

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[Anti Frozt]

I do hope that within the next few years we'll see a merging of phones and PDA's

You mean like this

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[stratjakt]

* Can you input data into your cell phone as quickly as a screen keyboard or graffiti?

Yes, as a matter of fact, my phone runs PalmOS and has a graffiti pad and on screen keyboard.

* Can you run word-processors and spreadsheets on your cell phone?

It's basically a Palm m515 integrated, so if it runs there, it runs on my phone.

* Does your cell-phone have a decent-sized display?

As big as most PDA's I've seen.

* Is there a vast library of both free and commercial software for your cell phone? Including e-books and document readers, dictionaries, map software, etc?

Yep, I told you, it runs PalmOS. It has an SD slot.

* Can you connect to a GPS via bluetooth with your cellphone, have it display real-time maps, such that you can navigate your car with it?

Nope. But I can go straight to mapquest and get turn by turn directions if I need them. My "real time display" is called the windshield and rear view mirrors, and are much more useful to me when operating my horseless carraige.

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[e40]

I think Cell phones are too small for many pda-ish things, currently.

What about the Treo650? I used to have a Handspring. I carried it in my backpack and only ocassionally used it to retrieve an odd bit of information. I never used it for things like "todo" or calendar management, since I never carried it with me. However, with the Treo, I always have it. I can jot something down. I keep a full calendar. I immediately saw a spike in productivity and fewer missed appointments.

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[mcho]

why would anyone want a bulky pda anymore ?

Exactly. Although, most people don't even need a PDA phone either.

That's why I've started messagingreminder.com, which sends your calendar reminders (whether it's Outlook or Sunbird) to my service. And before your appointment, my service sends you a reminder to your cell phone -- even if your computer is off.

And now you can ask my service what appointments you have coming up. Just send a text message to my service and it'll reply with up to three (3) of you next upcoming appointments.

My service is very affordable (only $10.00 per year), easy to use and innovative!

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[PierceLabs]

* There are a growing number of phones that have full keyboard pads on them and that number looks only to increase.

* Why would you run a word processor or spreadsheet on your PDA, much less your phone. They are useful for showing things off to folks (at which point there are some J2ME midlets that can do this), but PDAs are VERY poor content creation devices.

* Depends on your definition of decent and what its being used for. Many cellphones have the same resolution of the Treo 600.

* Yes yes oh goodness yes - this is especially true if you run Symbian OS on your phone. J2ME adoption by phone folks has led to a HUGE assortment of freely (or cheaply) available wares for phones.

* Yes, depends on the phone. Some have GPS in them and others can use tower triangulation to provide driving directions.

Your views of cell phone technology is about 3-4 years old. Flash your brain with CTIA knowledge - STAT!

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[EiZei]

You really need new glasses if Nokia 9300s bigger screen is not good enough for you. http://www.nokia.co.uk/nokia/0,,63586,00.html

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, since all cell phones are banned from the building I work in, and non-wireless PDAs are allowed, I'll go with the PDA.

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[nine-times]

I think Cell phones are too small for many pda-ish things, currently.

Unless someone comes up with a better display method, perhaps holographic, they are limited. Oh, and they need a better input interface

Personally, since no one can make a good all-in-one device, I'd like to see a real separation into two devices-- one that does phone, calendar, address book, bluetooth, whatever. Make that your PDA/cell-phone/communications-device. Let that have the complicated interface and everything. Then, separately, have a portable multimedia device that plays music, video, games, has a built in camera, etc.

The reason I say this is, for most multimedia tasks, such as playing games, taking a picture, listening to music, you want something with simple controls (many times, controls with enough tactile feedback that you don't have to look a them). You don't usually need text-input for these things, but you might want really nice sound/video, a big hard drive, etc.

By contrast, for managing contacts, calendars, and calling people, you don't need a super-high-quality screen. Something that shows text clearly should be good enough. You don't need much memory either. Your interface needs to be more complex, allowing for text input, but doesn't need to be very tactile since you won't probably be adding text without looking at the device.

Now, I'm not saying that I wouldn't prefer to have a single device that does it all, but since nobody seems to be able to make a single device that does everything well, I think they should try breaking it down into two devices that each do half the things well.

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[owlstead]

Yup, true, and I would like one battery for each as well. One that has a long lifetime and one to deliver the power needed for a common PDA (especially with a hard drive embedded in it).

But this was already mentioned in an earlier post by someone else as well. Oh well, mod me redundant :)

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[pugnatious]

as a happy T3 owner, lemme give you the scoop:

a) it has something to do with the input method:
a sylus is much better than a thumb for entering data and palm's original graffity 1 leaves little room for error (grafity 2 sucks).

b) it has a much bigger screen than any telephone I've seen. and I've seen bulkier phones. The absense of a keyboard allows that.

c) it is far cheaper than a cell phone sporting similar fatures

d) It's NOT a fucking cellphone

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[nightfire-unique]

Who needs a bigger screen?

Just cram more pixels in there, and the image gets sharper. If you can't read tiny fonts, get glasses, or hold the display closer to your eyes. Or increase the font size.

Imagine 640x640 on a smartphone..

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[Kesh]

No, see, the Blackberries are deformed bastard hybrids of phones and PDA. They spend all their time hunched over in cramped cubicles ringing bells... er, answering pages.

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[Quantum Fizz]

what kind of phone do you have? sounds like a treo or blackberry, in which case IMHO it's basically a PDA anyway.

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[Quantum Fizz]

Why would you run a word processor or spreadsheet on your PDA, much less your phone.

For the same reason someone would want to use it on their laptop. except a PDA is far easier to carry around, I have mine always in my wallet for instance.

what kind of phones are you talking about anyway? if you are thinking of treo or blackberry, then they're basically pda anyway, which is my original point as to why i'd want a pda in the first place.

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[smartalix]

I love my Treo 650. It is a major improvement over the 600. I also think it is a better device for all-around smartphone use than the Blackberry, which is a very business-oriented device.

I've played with the new device, and I like it a lot. It fits into the hand surprisingly well, and the screen looks great. THe screen is also easy to change between portrait and landscape modes, useful when switching from data apps to pictures and video.

Re:Are PDA's even still relevant ?

[IHateEverybody]

I think Cell phones are too small for many pda-ish things, currently.

What about the Treo650? I used to have a Handspring. I carried it in my backpack and only ocassionally used it to retrieve an odd bit of information. I never used it for things like "todo" or calendar management, since I never carried it with me. However, with the Treo, I always have it. I can jot something down. I keep a full calendar. I immediately saw a spike in productivity and fewer missed appointments.

But there in lies the paraodox of the PDA vs cellphone argument. The Treo 650 runs the almost exact same OS that all Palm PDAs run, PalmOS 5.x. As cellphones become more powerful, they become full-fledged PDAs themselves. It's also the reason why PDA vs cellphone arguments tend to be shallow since the most powerful cellphones are essentially PDAs that happen to have a built in cellphone.

Linux?

[timdorr]

The LifeDrive runs Palm OS Garnet on a 416 MHz XScale processor.

Last I checked, Palm OS wasn't Linux...

Linux? PalmOne? wtf?

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't see anything about Linux on the PalmOne web site.

Rip off Britain

[Alibloke]

How come it costs $499 in the US, yet if you want to buy in Britain it's the equivelent of $600?

Re:Rip off Britain

[fatted]

It costs a lot of money to get everything tranlated into English!

Re:Rip off Britain

[bombadillo]

Brittain has a VAT. Legally all advertised prices must include VAT. US prices do not include tax. So add on State Sales tax to 499. State Sales is 7% in my state. So our total comes out to 533.93. I believe VAT is 17% which would put the price at $583.83. That's pretty close to $600.00. So... There is your explenation.

Re:Rip off Britain

[Anonymous Coward]

Because we secretly hate you. I guess it's not much of a secret anymore.

Re:Rip off Britain

[PseudononymousCoward]

Uhhhh, Britain's VAT?

Re:Rip off Britain

[Anonymous Coward]

Even better is that they won't let you import it either.

HEY! I thought this was a Free Market here!!!

Re:Rip off Britain

[Anonymous Coward]

So will they sue PalmOne like they sued Apple, re.: the iTMS pricing in UK?

Maybe people will clue in that in UK, a few things *do* cost more? ...or maybe not. Oh, well.

Re:Rip off Britain

[amacleod98]

Except it usually isn't. The majority of the time manufacturers don't bother and just provide an American version.

Pretty High Res Photos and Video, oooh, ahhhh

[Anonymous Coward]

http://www.prnewswire.com/mnr/palmone/21938

YES, BUT....

[ylikone]

Will it run Linux?

Re:YES, BUT....

[Drantin]

no

Re:YES, BUT....

[QuijiboIsAWord]

Apparently, the answer is no.

Specs

[CleverNickedName]

In case of Slashdotting, here are the LifeDrive's specs:

Dimensions: 4.76" x 2.87" x .74"
Weight: 6.8oz.
Battery: Rechargeable Lithium-Ion providing 2-2.5 days of battery use, 1660mAh capacity.
Expansion: SD, SDIO, MMC slot
Processor: Intel 416mhz "Bulverde" Xscale CPU
Screen: 320x480 Transflective TFT color display with 65,000 colors
Memory: 64MB Program Memory, 4GB Hard Drive (3.8 available to the user).
File management: LifeDrive smart file management
Wireless: Dual wireless connectivity; Bluetooth 1.1, WiFi (802.11b)


Also, here is a mirror.

Re:Specs

[TreeHugger04]

I will buy a PDA when it can do ALL of the following:

1) Replace a mid range laptop in features...including playing music, videos, email, word processing, etc.
2) At least have a 4 MP camera with flash and 3x optical zoom.
3) Built-in GPS with voice feedback navigation.
4) Built-in AM/FM radio
5) Voice Recorder
6) WiFi/Bluetooth
7) 40 GB HDD
8) Expandable or projection Keyboard
9) Cell phone with SIM card and supporting all phone networks (not locked into one provider)
10) Play video games with analog stick and cartridge drive.
11) Long battery life (maybe nu-cilar powered)
12) Light enough to not pull down pants!

ONE DEVICE TO RULE THEM ALL!

Re:Specs

[Shrike9]

It needs to have a user replaceable battery to make it just a little bit better. Now, the battery dies and you're SOL.

Missing a nice speaker.

[Eunuch]

One thing I found really interesting on my Treo 650 is a decent (but mono) loudspeaker built right in. May seem like a throwback to gathering around the AM radio, but it's a real hoot with other people.

Review repost - site already a bit slow

[Anonymous Coward]

(reposted anonymously - I'm not a karma whore)
I haven't reviewed a palmOne PDA in almost exactly a year. That last review was the Tungsten E. Today I'll be reviewing the Tungsten T5, which curiously enough looks almost identical to the TE at first glance. The T5 is palmOne's new top of the line model set to replace the popular T3. In the year since I posted that last palmOne device review, they have released 3 other PDAs (not including the T5). The Zire 21, 31 and 72. At the time of their releases, neither Judie or I felt these models were interesting enough to us to warrant reviews. To be truthful, palmOne has left me less than excited the past couple of years, and I'm pretty certain Judie feels similarly.

This time around, palmOne is only offering one new model to consumers. Is this just an interim device to compete against the latest Pocket PCs before the new OS 6 devices are ready? Or is the T5 a compelling new PDA that T3 owners should consider upgrading to? Read on to learn my opinion.

Hardware Specs

Processor: 416MHz Intel XScale Processor
Operating System: Palm OS software version v5.4
Memory: Total 256 MB (215MB actual storage capacity; 160MB internal flash drive, 55MB program memory)
Display: TFT color display with backlight, 320 x 480, 65,000 colors
Interface: USB (for HotSync® operation), Infrared, Bluetooth
Dimensions and Weight: 4.76 x 3.08 x 0.61in, 5.1 oz. (including stylus)
Power: 120VAC, 60Hz, 100mA
Battery: 1300mHa Lithium-ion polymer rechargeable battery (internal - non user removable)
Expansion: SD card slot (Secure Digital), supports MMC and SDIO cards

Package Contents

Tungsten T5 PDA
Stylus
Flip cover (wasn't included in my review sample)
USB cable with sync button
AC adapter
Graffiti 2 sticker
Read This First document
License Agreement
Accessories Catalog
Software Installation CD

I had a real sense of Deja Vu when I first opened the T5's box. This new PDA looks almost identical to the TE. Same color, same shape, same application buttons and same 5-way navigation pad. In reality, this PDA is actually about .25 inches longer, slightly thicker and heavier than the TE.

Although the T5 looks like it has a metal shell, it is only made of plastic. This was the first of several disappointments regarding this new model. As the T5 is set to replace the T3 which does have a metal shell, I was very surprised that the T5 was left lacking one. Even though the case is plastic, it does have a solid feel and did not creak, crack or flex when I performed the good ol' Gadgeteer creak test on it. That said, the case does show fingerprints and smudges. In hand, this PDA feels balanced and comfortable to hold and use. It might be a little too long to be considered a good candidate for a shirt pocket, but it does fit nicely in a side cargo pant or jacket pocket.

On the front of the PDA there are 4 application buttons, the 5-way navigation pad and the color display. The buttons have the same layout as the ones on the TE. They are small, flat and square with good tactile feedback. From left to right, the application buttons are assigned to the Home, Calendar, Contacts and File Manager applications. Like other models before this one, the buttons can be reassigned to launch other applications by modifying their preferences.

The 5-way navigation pad allows you to scroll up/down, left and right. Pressing in on the center button performs a select function. Using the nav pad, it is relatively easy to perform some tasks such as address look ups and application launches with just one hand. The nav pad also makes game play more enjoyable for certain types of action games.

Tungsten T5, Zire 31 and Tungsten T

One of the most exciting changes that the T5 has over the T3 is the lack of a slider. As a matter of fact, the T5 is palmOne's first PDA that has a 320 x 480 display that does not also include a slider. This is a big advantage in my opinion as I grew very tired of

Re:Review repost - site already a bit slow

[biglig2]

Mod parent down please, on the grounds that it is a review of the T5, not the LifeDrive.

Re:4GB?

[enigma48]

An XP Pro install comes in at 1.5GB, including a swap file. Even if you add another 1GB for Office 2003 and .5GB for a hibernation file, you still have room to play with.

meh...

[utexaspunk]

That thing is clunky! For a little bit more, I'd rather get one of these and put in one of these. It would be thinner, have 6gb (removable, too), a more powerful processor, and a VGA screen.

Re:meh...

[dr.badass]

For a little bit more, I'd rather get [an ASUS MyPal] and put in [a 6GB microdrive].

I just priced that out, and I have to say, $800 is not "a little bit more" than $500.

Re:meh...

[utexaspunk]

Ok, so it's a little more than just a little more expensive. But let's do it with the 65MB RAM model of the MyPal and the 4GB Microdrive:

ASUS MyPal A730 - $480.00
Hitachi 4GB Microdrive - $174.00

Having something way better than a "LifeDrive" (VGA, 1.3 MP camera, voice recording, CF slot)- Priceless

Re:meh...

[Anonymous Coward]

Having something way better than a "LifeDrive" (VGA, 1.3 MP camera, voice recording, CF slot)- Priceless

Running Windows Mobile: Worthless.

Re:meh...

[Cryptnotic]

But then it costs $150 more and doesn't have 802.11.

Re:meh...

[utexaspunk]

it does have 802.11

Bluetooth to mono earset rocks.

[Eunuch]

Best application--toss a huge text file into a text-to-speech app and have it spit up a low-quality mp3. One step closer to transhumanism (while looking a bit like the borg). Only problem is treo 650 only transmits phone audio. I'm assuming this one will use the bluetooth for this.

Is Linux involved or not?

[tbedolla]

If anyone out there knows anything about "Linux" being used on this device, please enlighten the rest of us...otherwise it seems like the term is being thrown in to cause interest from those of us who wouldn't even look at a PDA from Palm.

Re:Is Linux involved or not?

[Trillan]

It's because PalmSource announced a few months ago that some of the Cobalt (Palm OS 6) devices would be based on the Linux kernel instead of the traditional Palm OS one. Idiots assumed this meant that all Cobalt devices would be based on Linux, and then assumed all future devices (like this one) would be Cobalt. Except so far as I can tell, this is (yawn) just another Palm OS 5 "Garnet" device from PalmOne.

In short, it is entirely un-Linux related.

Re:Is Linux involved or not?

[tbedolla]

Thanks for the reply, and it seems that you are right...but it could make sense for Palm to go the Linux route.

Re:Is Linux involved or not?

[stonemirror]

In all fairness, palmOne has never claimed, anywhere, in even the slightest way, that Linux was involved in any way, shape or form with this product, so the inference that this was an attempt to somehow inveigle you into looking into the product seems unfair. The use of the word "Linux" in connection with this product seems to have been solely perpetrated by whoever posted the original story here.

PalmSource (separate company, but the supplier of "Palm OS" to palmOne and others) has announced that they are developing a version of Palm OS which uses Linux as a foundation; they will be providing more details at their developer conference next week--see http://www.palmsource.com/events/devcon2005/track_ technical.html...

Re:Is Linux involved or not?

[tbedolla]

Agreed, and thanks for the reply.

Re:4GB?

[brontus3927]

I must be doing something incredibly wrong then, because every time I've installed XP Pro with standard options, it took at least 4.5GB without Office or any other software

Best Device, Worst Demo. Ever!

[schestowitz]

When I saw their on-line demo/tour this morning, I was appalled to find a Flash clip that incorporates every possible usability flaw. 4 GB on a Palm-powered devices is useful for nothing apart from MP3. LifeDrive? I'll have four, please.

"Palm OS Cobalt as a software layer on Linux"

[free2]

http://palmsource.com/about/cms_linuxletter.html

Re:"Palm OS Cobalt as a software layer on Linux"

[CdBee]

Although, this runs Palmos 5.4 whic isn't based on Linux at all..

Re:4GB?

[Anonymous Coward]

I can confirm the GPs post. I've installed a fresh XP Pro on a 2.5gb partition recently and it had about 1 gb free afterwards.

You have done something horribly wrong...

[Anonymous Coward]

You have done something horribly wrong, or you are a horrible liar.

Fitting 4.5 GB of Data onto a single 650MB CD (and it's not full by any stretch, nor does that take into account all the drivers that don't get installed) would be fucking amazing. Microsoft could put PKWare and all the other compression authors out of business.

buzzwords

[ylikone]

Seems to me that LINUX use of buzzwords in SCO news stories these MICROSOFT days without even bothering to check if OPEN SOURCE it really makes any coherent sense.

Re:buzzwords

[tbedolla]

Clever, but true.

Might Be True...

[polyp2000]

Might be true
The original poster should have included a bit more info really

Nick ...

Re:4GB?

[Anonymous Coward]

How much Ram? The more Ram you have, the bigger the standard swap file will be.

Palm OS 6 Anyone?

[tillemetry]

Why aren't they running OS6? What are they waiting for?

Linux on a "PDA"

[RealProgrammer]

(This thing is more the size of an American football than a PDA). Now I can do all the usual PDA stuff, plus:

• keep my Unix environment with me all the time
• log in remotely and use it as a port scanner
• run GCC onboard, so theoretically any program can be ported to the football
• keep my documentation, utilities, and usual configuration files with me and access them with a web browser (web server running on the PDA)
  (But the biggest thing is:)
  
• it will never be orphaned

Even if PalmOne were to go belly up, a Linux-based machine will always be maintainable. It might be hard, but I'll never be forced to buy a new one because the OS on old one is no longer supported.

I dumped my PDA and don't miss it

[PenguinBoyDave]

I had a palm, a handspring and a Zarus. As I travel on business a lot I thought I would use it. What I discovered that that when I lost my palm, I didn't really loose anything...it was in my laptop. When my handspring got crushed by a taxi in New York, I didn't loose anything...it was in my laptop. When my Zarus was next to useless because it didn't really work all that well with my company-standard Windoze laptop, I sold it...and didn't miss anything because it never got off my laptop.

People I work with use their iPAQ's for watching movies ripped down to fit on their screens and listen to music. However, that is about it.

I don't miss my PDA, and I know more and more business travelers who have stopped carrying theirs as well.

Re:I dumped my PDA and don't miss it

[ylikone]

First they came for the Palm
and I did not care
because I had my handspring, zaurus and laptop.
Then they came for the Handspring
and I did not care
because I had my zaurus and my laptop.
Then they came for the zaurus
and I did not care
because I still had my laptop.
Then they came for my laptop
and there was nothing left
for me to use.

Re:I dumped my PDA and don't miss it

[utexaspunk]

I have an iPaq h6315 that I use all the time, and I don't think I'd find a Palm all that handy (I know, terrible pun). I think the PocketPC's more powerful processors make them a lot more useful- as you mentioned, they can be used for music and movies, but I also use mine for games (I'm addicted to snood), for checking the bus schedules (I've got the PDF's saved on my phone. They're not really very PDA-friendly, but they certainly suffice and are frequently useful), I keep mine synched with Money on my PC (which is great since I'm terrible about keeping a checkbook register), and I surf the web (and not just the limited stuff you get thru a cell phone) and check my e-mail with it as well.

Sure, some of those things I could do with a laptop, but a laptop has a shorter battery life, won't connect to GPRS by itself, doesn't fit in my pocket and I wouldn't want to carry one around all the time.

Re:I dumped my PDA and don't miss it

[Anonymous Coward]

Man you are too normal, I cant live without a PDA.
I've bought a bigger flash card and downloaded all possible reference texts, books and a dump of Wikipedia to it. I do not use network too much - I've got all my data offline - 100% guaranteed and faster.

With a microdrive and good reader software it will rule.

Re:I dumped my PDA and don't miss it

[Anonymous Coward]

If you have a laptop I ask "why do you need a PDA?".

I have a PDA and a flash drive and no laptop. I could not carry a laptop around. It just wouldn't work well for me but there are plenty of desktop PCs where I go. A PDA, however, with a belt wallet is the envy of my co-workers. I have Documents to Go so I can carry machine lists or whatever. Sure I could do this with paper. But I won't remember paper. I remember my Palm and so it works for me.

Re:I dumped my PDA and don't miss it

[sremick]

This is not a flame, but...

I do all that with my Palm. And you don't need a LifeDrive for it... I do it with my Tungsten T3, which has been around for a long time now.

So I don't get why you say you wouldn't find a Palm useful and then list all those things as reasons why...?

Re:I dumped my PDA and don't miss it

[Anonymous Coward]

Try a hipster PDA (http://www.43folders.com/2004/09/introducing_the. html)

Re:I dumped my PDA and don't miss it

[utexaspunk]

can you do all those things simultaneously? i've heard of issues with the palms being underpowered. but what do i know? perhaps you're right. I do like having the wifi built in, and having my phone integrated with it, though.

Re:I dumped my PDA and don't miss it

[fnord_uk]

I have a z600 mobile, a Toshiba e800 PDA, 12" iBook and an iPod mini. Oh, and a Linux desktop (late WinXP). The e800 gets little serious use now, primarily due to it's poor interoperability with the rest of the kit, but with its 480 by 640 screen courtesy of the MyVGA hack, and the PIEPlus add-on for Pocket IE, it makes a handy VGA browser to have around. My biggest gripe with the PocketPC/Windows Mobile platform is the lack of java. Anyone know if it is supported in WM2005?

Re:I dumped my PDA and don't miss it

[sremick]

Well you wouldn't logically be doing all those things simultaneously. Sort of like parachuting, reading a book, watching TV, and playing piano all the same time. Heh.

My T3 is something like 400MHz and seems wicked fast to me. I can quickly jump from one application to another and there are utilities (which I don't use) available to give you shortcuts to do so even faster. Apps, games, etc remain where I left them and those things that I DO want to multitask do so just fine. Granted it doesn't have built-in wifi but I have the wifi SD card for when I need it. I wouldn't want it integrated with my phone, but the Bluetooth allows it to link with one.

Re:I dumped my PDA and don't miss it

[Anonymous Coward]

Not trolling or baiting.

You need to realize that ESPECIALLY in the PDA marketplace, the speed of the processor means nothing if the platforms are different.

My all-time favorite PDA was an HP 200LX, which was basically an IBM PC, 4.77 MHz processor and all. Yes, 4.77 MHz. And it performs searches through my group of text files just as quickly as my HP/Compaq 2215 PDA, which has a 400 MHz processor. These are the EXACT files, just copied over to the new HP.

My understanding is that PalmOS is a LOT more efficient than PocketPC Windows, so even at half the clock speed, I can see it behaving much faster than Windows.

I did use a Palm III at one point, and it was pretty fast at searches, but I don't recall how fast its processor was.

Just my $0.02.

Re:I dumped my PDA and don't miss it

[GodfatherofSoul]

I've spent the last months evaluating PDAs for a migration project, and I'd have to say that Palms are superior simply because they're designed from the ground up to be handhelds. PPCs are mutations of the desktop. This results in all sorts of issues with efficiency and ergonomics.

PPCs tend to be initially favored because they resemble the desktop. But, after some real use of applications, you get to appreciate Palm's design choices. After a short acclimation period with Palm OS, you get used to the GUI metaphors and I think you'd find it to be the best option as well.

Re:I dumped my PDA and don't miss it

[Anonymous Coward]

The iPAQ 6315 has a 168 MHz processor-- considerbly slower than the 416 MHz LifeDrive CPU.

When will Skype run on this

[Anonymous Coward]

Now that Palm is using some faster CPUs, when will we have skype on these. PocketPC is getting a lot of the cool applications right now. Of course, they cost a lot too.

Re:4GB?

[brontus3927]

Okay, I'm willing to admit that something is possibly terribly awry. I'll do a clean install on a fresh drive some point this week to test whether or not I am a moron.

Microdrive?????

[hughk]

Why the microdrive? Ok, I know that they are significantly cheaper than flash, but they are so much slower and they need much more power.

Re:4GB?

[enigma48]

I've got two XP partitions - one I use daily, one is on another partition as a "clean" copy (updates, virus scanner, not much else). According to Explorer, the drive has 1.35 GB (1,455,919,486 bytes) worth of files but occupies 1.50GB total space. Just FYI.

Yawn

[KFW]

I'm really disappointed by this. I've been holding off on a new PDA, but I don't think I'll be getting this one.

The good:

• Built-in WiFi (with web browser)
• Nice screen
• 4 GB drive
• Nice photo viewing
• Multimedia features (although I doubt I'll use them)

The bad:

• inadequate cache RAM (read the review that was linked to [and is probably now Slashdotted]). There is now a noticeable lag when starting applications. Thrashing the drive will probably impare battery life as well.
• Still running PalmOS 5. C'mon, where's the innovation? What did they do with BeOS?
• No camera

Personally, I'm glad it's not part of a phone. I want a seperate phone and PDA. I carry a thumbdrive in my pocket for toting files, which is very convenient because I don't have to mess with cables if I need to transfer files to another PC. If it's done well, I suppose the ability to carry along, edit, and then synch MS Word, etc., files could be handy. The music features aren't something I'll use. I'll stick with my iPod (which has way more than 4 GB of songs on it). Now an iPod with better PDA features--there's something I'd like to see.

/K

Re:Yawn

[utexaspunk]

sounds like you need what I posted earlier

Re:Yawn

[hey!]

I think it's better off without a camera. PDA and cell phone cameras don't have much practical value, and their novelty value is limited. Speaking from experience. Their optics are too crappy to provide much amusement.

If you read the article, the device does handle SD cards from digital cameras automatically. Combine this with a real digital camera, and it becomes a useful accessory.

Re:Yawn

[myowntrueself]

"I'm really disappointed by this. I've been holding off on a new PDA, but I don't think I'll be getting this one."

I'm holding off until I can get one with USB host.

I mean how freaking hard can it be? Am I missing something?

Example; the ipaq advertises as *having* USB. But the word from HP when I pressed them on the issue is that it cannot and will never be a USB host.

I would really appreciate some links, if anyone has any suggestions.

I just want to connect to USB hard drive or flash disk. Other gadgets would be nice.

Re:Yawn

[binarytoaster]

The Zaurus SL-C1000/3000 has USB host. The 3000 is identical to the 1000 except it has a 4gb microdrive internal (which you could replace with a regular flash card and make it run a bit faster)

It also, in fact, runs Linux, unlike any Palm.

Re:Yawn

[timeOday]

I think it's better off without a camera. PDA and cell phone cameras don't have much practical value, and their novelty value is limited.

I don't agree at all. PDAs are desparate for high-bandwidth input, and that's what a camera is.

No more copying down contact information from business cards with the stylus - just snap a quick shot of the business card and be done with it, with no transcription errors. I pull up the call numbers for books I want at the library before I go, and snap photos of the screen - why print out a scrap of paper and carry it around? I've also snapped a photo of a trailhead map for an unexpected hike, part numbers before going to the store, and whiteboards at work.

The image quality of the camera is bad, but that doesn't matter much for capturing information. I only wish the cameras had higher resolution... being able to pull in a whole page of text at once would *really* obsolete paper organizers.

Re:Yawn

[myowntrueself]

ah yes I didn't go into enough detail; I don't want a PDA with a hard drive. No moving parts. :)

Also, the zaurus isn't supported in my part of the world; I want a PDA that I can take back to the supplier if anything goes wrong.

Re:Yawn

[binarytoaster]

Well, the 1000 doesn't have a hard drive :) Just the 3000 (and again, you could take apart the 3000 and replace the microdrive with a 2gb CF card instead)

But the support factor is a limiter, yes. :)

Portable drive

[Reapman]

What I think is the most exciting feature of this is the ability to use it as a mobile hard drive (albeit a small one) but also have the ability to view the files i upload to it away from a computer. I've used mobile drives several times and the ability to view / change / delete the files on it away from a computer is pretty tempting.

I use a Palm Treo 600 ("Smartphone") however, so I'll wait if (when?) they release a Treo with a built in hard drive.

compatibility between Garnet and Cobalt ?

[free2]

Hopefully here is a compatibility at the software level. But is there somme hardware compatibility between these 2 versions of palmOS ?

Re:4GB?

[Baikala]

What the heck are you tlaking about? Only someone out of his/her mind would even fantom porting Longhorn.

Archos PMA400 runs Linux

[Vamphyri]

Here is a PDA that truly runs linux, you can shell out to a command prompt and run uname -a.

Archos PMA400

I thought you said it ran Linux?

[RealProgrammer]

Man, what a waste of my time the parent post was. Thanks, Slashdot. I guess I should RFTA next time.

GPS

[jargoone]

Please, please, someone come out with a Bluetooth GPS receiver and software for this. It's pretty much the only thing tying me to my Windows laptop.

Re:GPS

[Anonymous Coward]

http://www.mobileplanet.com/product.asp?dept_id=23 50&pf_id=MP731385&listing=1

Re:GPS

[jargoone]

I was about to say, "But this is for Palm OS, and this new device runs Linux." I didn't RTFA, but usually that just means you *lack* information not given in the title and summary. As pointed out in other comments, this time, the /. article is just plain fucking wrong: this thing doesn't run Linux at all.

Re:GPS

[MikeFM]

I've been looking for a good PDA that has a built-in GPS and allows users to write their own programs (without expensive tools) that can access the GPS. Sadly this PDA doesn't seem to work for that.

Re:GPS

[rice_web]

http://www.expansys-usa.com/product.asp?code=11554 0 There are other solutions as well, I just Googled the first thing that came to my head. One company that is actually a PalmSource licensee produces not only a handheld with a GPS device, but also separate Bluetooth-wireless, GPS solutions.

Re:GPS

[Russ Nelson]

Delorme's BlueLogger is a nifty Bluetooth GPS receiver. And if they can make Linux run on it, we can also make GPE run on it, which means Python can run on it, which means pygps will run on it. No, it doesn't do navigation, but it will give you aerial photos and topo maps, which nothing else will do.
-russ

Re:GPS

[darrylo]

What's wrong with the Garmin PDAs? They run PalmOS, have a free devkit, and free compilers are available for PalmOS.

Re:GPS

[MikeFM]

Other than costing as much as a laptop?

Huh? A linux Palm?

[filesiteguy]

So can I run TuxRacer on my new Palm?

How about Apache? Can I be a bluetooth enabled Apache server?

Does this mean I'll have to get rid of my Palm III?

Re:Huh? A linux Palm?

[Anonymous Coward]

This is not a linux Palm.

Linux PDA the way PocketPC runs Linux?

[dmccarty]

The LifeDrive runs Garnet, the latest multimedia SDK of Palm OS 5.

No GSM/GPRS/3G, no kybd or english HWR, no sale...

[otis wildflower]

... I mean c'mon. I would have a better device if I could slap a 4GB drive on my P800.

I think I'll hold out for the 3G P910 successor, perhaps it'll have a HDD, a phat TFT or OLED, and AD2P wireless stereo headphones.. I'd love to have a linux phone but FWIS all those Motorola phones have locked their Linux parts and only allow J2ME...

No CF?

[Anonymous Coward]

Bit of a bugger, really, since I don't have any other flash technology and already use CF.

New Tungsten E2 is cheaper and more interesting

[Anonymous Coward]

Not sure why the LifeDrive is getting all the press. Existing PDAs can get multi-GB HD using their SD cards.

The real news item is the huge number of improvements PalmOne made to their best-selling Tungsten E (top-selling PDA across all OS last year). Although the E2 has a slower cpu than T5, the E2 is reportedly even faster for many common tasks! Some changes from E to E2 include (cut/paste from palmone.com):

1. about 30% brighter than the Tungsten E display and with 40% better color saturation.

2. data is safe even when the battery is completely drained--if you recharge it a year later, all your data is still there.

3. built-in Bluetooth

4. Much better battery life. About 12 hours of continous MP3 playing according to one review.

5. compatible with wifi sd card.

6. Much-improved bundled software: NEW Documents To Go® 7.0 and VersaMail® 2.7.1 email client. The new versamail can finally be used with Google.

7. Improved processor. The faster Intel 200MHz XScale processor. Not the speediest but reviews indicate that for many common tasks, the E2 easily outperforms the T5 which has a much faster CPU.

8. Multi-connector port. I don't care about this feature but you might.

The E2 is about $100 cheaper than last year's average selling price of PDAs in the USA.

What is missing:

1. voice recorder. Sometimes, we don't want to pull out the pen and write. As a PDA targeting business users, the lack of voice recording is not good.

2. extra SD slot. Having only 1 SD slot and no built-in wifi means forcing the user to choose between extra storage and wifi. Not good. Provide at least 2 SD slots unless wifi is built-in.

3. >=64MB RAM. Since it only has 1 SD slot, it should provide at least 64MB RAM. At least provide a more expensive version of the PDA with this option. Yes, I know 64MB RAM in Palm device is more than 64MB RAM in PocketPC but still...

On the bright side, I've seen some multi-function SD cards hitting the market. Like wifi + storage combo SD card.

Re:New Tungsten E2 is cheaper and more interesting

[Bodhammer]

from the palm page:
http://www.palmone.com/us/products/mobilemanagers/ lifedrive/details.epl

"Built-in voice recorder.
Capture that big idea anywhere. Tape important lectures. Take notes hands-free. Or, record a slideshow narration to accompany your photos. It's all possible with this integrated, go-anywhere audio functionality."

Re:New Tungsten E2 is cheaper and more interesting

[owlstead]

Bodhammer already pointed out that it *does* have a voice recorder. Let me then point out that it has WiFi build in as well. So we are left with the 64 MB of RAM. Which I think might be plenty with the harddrive that comes with the package, although more might be better. Note that RAM likes to eat batteries for breakfast as well.

So, on the bright side, the things that are missing are mostly there.

Re:New Tungsten E2 is cheaper and more interesting

[rho]

The AC is talking about the E2, not the LifeDrive.

Re:New Tungsten E2 is cheaper and more interesting

[luisdom]

Yeah, but it still has that square screen with the writting zone which not only makes it look so 90's, but takes a good chunk from the screen... Which is corrected by the T5 for a merely $150 price

Portable wikipedia anyone?

[Anonymous Coward]

Linux PDA with a 4GB drive
mysql + apache
2GB en.wikipedia databse

Hello never being bored on the train again

Re:Portable wikipedia anyone?

[Anonymous Coward]

Linux PDA with a 4GB drive

This is not a Linux PDA.

Re:Portable wikipedia anyone?

[PeterBrett]

Funny, that's exactly what I've got on my Sharp Zaurus C-3000.

Which has a 4 GB hard drive, and *actually* runs Linux, unlike the unit under discussion.

Re:Portable wikipedia anyone?

[goonjm]

Who needs Apache and MySQL, this should do the job:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:TomeRaider_ database

And it's only 537Mb, but hey, gotta find a use/justification/excuse for a 1Gb SD card somehow. It's a Tomefile designed for the ebook reader TomeRaider (http://www.tomeraider.com/ ) and this reader works on PalmOS, PocketPC, EPOC and Windows.

g

Re:Portable wikipedia anyone?

[forkazoo]

Dag nabbit. I just got a 512 MB SD card for my PDA, under the assumption I'd never really need more on a Palm Pilot. (Enough for a few episodes of MPEG-1 TV shows, I don't need to carry a whole season with me at all times...)

Is there any way to squash it onto a 512 MB card? Can I get a slightly older version anywhere?

Re:Portable wikipedia anyone?

[goonjm]

Not that I know of, the TomeRaider files are already compressed and the Wikipedia seem to be automatically generated fairly frequently.

Now if only there was a PDA with 4Gb hard drive...

g

Maybe a slightly different take on convergence

[hey!]

The standard take on convergence is Phone + PDA.

Speaking as a Treo 600 user, the combination is pretty good, but there are compromises. Text input is OK, but a bit cramped. It is irritation to have the phone crash every so often. Likewise battery is overall good, but you're dead in the water if you run out, which you may if you will if use it much as an MP3 player or browser.

Now, suppose you are carrying a Treo and an iPod photo. Now you are no longer converged, but have two packages of functionalty: PDA/Phone/Network Access on one hand, Media Player/Mobile storage (like a USB key chain) and the other. Plus, you have a limited choice of phone carriers, and if Sprint is what's available for a Treo in your area, you might not like the way they package their services (sorry -- no voice dial on the treo, we sell that). Even worse, the excellent service policies you once enjoyed with Palm aren't there anymore. If you break your phone, you are S-O-L, unless you paid the exorbitant fees the provider wants for a "service plan".

Now, reenvision a slight redistribution of the functions between the two packages: Phone/Network Access on one, Media Player/Mobile Storage/PDA/Wi-fi access on the other. Link the two packages by Bluetooth.

There are significant advantages. Here are a few I can think of:

(1) If one device is out of juice, you can still use the other; furthermore if you have wi-fi nearby you may still be able to communiate when your phone is down. Skype anyone?

(2) You have a choice of service providers. You can even switch without throwing your PDA away.

(3) You can get your PDA fixed. And you don't give up your phone. Switching phones is a snap too.

(4) You get a phone whose ergonomics are optimized for making calls, and (hopefully) a easier to use PDA.

(5) You don't have stupid hardware limitations the carrier builds into the phone. The Treo 600 has a header on the circuit board for Bluetooth, but no bluetooth headsets for you: Sprint doesn't want to cut into sales of their CF network card, which sucks in ways to numerous to count and only works on Windows.

Of course the alternative next step would be a converged PDA/phone with a hard disk.

I'm not too sure about that though. It will avoid the Batman utility belt look, but it may be too expensive, too inflexible, and too complicated. Converged phones have major screen size trade offs, after all; you may be able to store video on the thing, but would you want to?

Re:Maybe a slightly different take on convergence

[itchy92]

Thank you.

Every time a new product is released, people complain how impractical it is because it doesn't suit their needs. And every time there is someone who points out how arrogant/shortsighted this is, seemingly to no avail. People tend to state their opinions as matters-of-fact ("this is the most pointless thing ever to exist. ever." SHOULD read "I can't see where the market for this is").

Anyway, I think this is a great step to take, as it's exactly what I've been waiting for. I've been putting off buying a HD-based MP3 player, because it seems like too much money just to play music. Alternatively, I've been putting off buying a laptop, because I think it's too much money for something I won't use as often as I think I would. I figured a robust PDA with a hard drive would be my best bet. So I have been waiting for these to start popping up. Granted, I think this particular model is too expensive and has too little storage *for my particular needs*, but I'm sure within a few generations I'll find what I'm looking for.

Re:Maybe a slightly different take on convergence

[pknoll]

I like the way you're thinking. Personally I am a fan of keeping my PDA and my phone in seperate devices, since that makes it much easier to use both at once (jotting down notes while on a call, for example).

You make a great case for that type of physical seperation, and point out some advantages I wouldn't have thought of.

Re:Maybe a slightly different take on convergence

[amper]

If you break your phone, you are S-O-L, unless you paid the exorbitant fees the provider wants for a "service plan".

OK, for the most part, I agree with you...but I used to use a Kyocera 6035 Smartphone. I've always had the insurance plan with Sprint PCS, and when I dropped my first 6035, for a $35 deductible, they sent me a brand-new 6035.

Then, when the microphone went dead on that one, they sent me a brand-new Samsung SPH-i500 ($600 retail at the time).

Mind you, I spent all of $149 on the first Kyocera, plus $70 in insurance deductible, plus 48 months or so of insurance at $4-5 per month.

I really don't think you could describe my experience as having paid "exorbitant" fees for the insurance plan. In fact, I've been so pleased that I just bought my wife an SPH-i500 (now costing $300).

All things considered, though, I'd rather have a separate PDA and phone--but that's pointless until the service providers unleash Bluetooth.

Re:Maybe a slightly different take on convergence

[aaarrrgggh]

Excellent points! Who really trusts a phone company with a $500+ toy anymore?

Why not pay the phone companies for what they can do well... provide the uplink with a minimal device that is cheap and does not require a frigging 2-year contract. Let people accessorize if they want... offer great little tie-ins if you wish...

Don't call this a PDA

[gearmonger]

Just like you don't call your laptop a word processor, despite it being able to do word processing, or a gaming device (despite it being able to play games), the LifeDrive's PDA (addressbook, schedule, etc.) functionality is just one part of what it can do. Calling it a PDA just glosses over all its *other* capabilities (2X wireless, high-res screen, voice recording, A/V playback, camera buddy, etc.), the sum of which really haven't been seen before.

Re:Don't call this a PDA

[Anonymous Coward]

The problem with your argument is that aside from the 4GB HD, there are numerous PDA's from Toshiba, HP, Dell which do all of the rest. So if it looks like a PDA, walks like a PDA, ...

Re:Don't call this a PDA

[utexaspunk]

true, and most of those also have CF slots that you can get a 4 or even 6GB microdrive for, and many of them have VGA screens and cameras as well, so they're better. see my previous post

Re:Don't call this a PDA

[Erris]

Calling it a PDA just glosses over all its *other* capabilities (2X wireless, high-res screen, voice recording, A/V playback, camera buddy, etc.), the sum of which really haven't been seen before.

So my Personal Data Assistant can't help me organize my music, movies, bookmarks, email, voice recordings, notes and all that? OK, I'll just call it a computer.

Sucky Pix

[Anonymous Coward]

For a "Review" website, they sure have sucky pictures, out of focus in a lot of them. I would have liked to have gotten a better look at those things they were trying to point out.

Can a 1-box website be Slashdot-proof?

[Anonymous Coward]

This is off-topic, I know, but since the review site is currently Slashdotted and we have some time to wait for recovery, perhaps someone knows the key to avoiding huge interest bringing your site down?

Can any single-box website survive a Slashdotting? Or is this something that inherently requires massive back ends and fat pipes?

4GB ?

[Digital Warfare]

Wow, high quality pr0n on the go.

2 days of battery life? NO WAY

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe if you never turn it on the battery will stay charged for 2 days. No way if the drive is spinning and the LCD backlight is on.

I just don't get it

[el_womble]

I used to love the concept of PDAs. When I was at uni I used one to take notes and keep track of lectures, but I was fully aware that it was a toy more than a tool. As important as I like to think I am I don't need to put my shopping list, occasional creative thoughts on a PDA. I even sampled 'surfing' the web on it, but to be useful you had to do it through a mobile phone and that was less than useful. I still used it over my laptop because it was lighter and powered on imediately.

Then I bought a Powerbook and a T610 and most importantly of all - a pencil and notebook. I use my laptop for real computing and my phone holds and synchronises all of my PIM data so much more efficiently than my old PDA that I simply don't need a PDA, with one exception: taking notes. For that I find the notepad invaluable. The data is difficult to copy as I use a unique encryption system that only I can decipher (my handwriting), the power consumption is incredible, I haven't had to replace the battery once! It's instant on, the stylus can be replaced for pence and are universally availble and best of all you can use it to annotate the notes they give you when you go to meetings without any previous training. The price is good too, I'm not a rich man by any stretch of the imagination, but I can easily afford to have a notepad and pen in a selection of my pockets at all times, and if I want to share my data I can simply give the whole pad to that person! I've also noticed that I can freely mix drawings, and text in the same area and it doesn't constantly tell me how bad my handwriting is.

I'm sure there must be a situations where PDAs using current technology must be useful, I'll even hazard a guess: mobile, local database access for doctors, engineers and stock controllers, but really that's an industrial application for a consumer product.

Re:I just don't get it

[Anonymous Coward]

I've got a really nice and light laptop, and mobile phone, but recently purchased a PDA and have found it indispensible. If it's a toy as you describe, it's really no less of one than an iPod, except that I can do a lot more with it, including streaming music through the Wifi tuner.

Re:I just don't get it

[Absentminded-Artist]

Until last Fall, I used my PDAs for everything. I have been in love with the silly things since the early Palm days. I find my current Zire72 indispensible.

However, last Fall I purchased an iBook. It was my first laptop. My PDA use has changed. I no longer develop story ideas on my PDA. I no longer think I need WiFi on a PDA. Bluetooth hotsyncing has not proven to be as useful as I had hoped (it's so dang slow. Easier to just go to the computer and hotsync that way. Besides, my bedroom is too far away from the desktop to reach via Bluetooth) Because I sync my iBook and PDA addressbooks I often refer to my iBook first instead of the PDA when I need a number. I don't jot down as many notes as I used to on my PDA. I have stickies for that on my iBook.

What I do use my PDA for is voice memos and alarms. Both of those features are vital to my daily productivity, especially the alarms. I have ADD, so if that stupid PDA didn't beep at me all day long, I'd never remember what I was supposed to be doing! LOL My iBook doesn't turn back on and let me know when I have an appointment. However, my iPod *does* now that I sync my calendar with it. I sync my address book with my iPod as well, but don't use it to access people's data very often.

If there was a lores screen built into the lid of my iBook that stayed on when the iBook was asleep that gave me access to voice memos and calendars (basically a PDA that hotsynced with the iBook data whenever the iBook was running) I wouldn't need my PDA much anymore. But that sounds impractical.

I don't envy Palm's position. PDAs are still very useful to those that live and breath by them, but so much of the PDAs old functionality is being replaced with other devices like phones, laptops, iPods, etc. With the PDA market shrinking I worry what I'll do when businesses like Palm decide they can't afford to make PDAs anymore.

BTW, using marketspeak to call the Lifedrive a "Mobile Manager" instead of a PDA is just stupid. I am entirely skeptical that anybody will honestly think the Lifedrive isn't a PDA just because it plays movies and such. Sony's Clié's offered all these same features (minus the hard drive but with decent camera lenses) for years before Palm started updating their product line. At least the Lifedrive is priced more reasonably than the Clié's...

Re:I just don't get it

[johansalk]

Dear; there's nothing revolutionary about pen and paper; that's exactly how I had managed most of my life before I got a PDA last century! I think things such as "'surfing' the web" are, for the most part, far from useful as far as a PDA's primary functions originally were. I'd agree that would mostly be using it as a toy. I started using PDAs in their early days and then watched them in horror being morphed from what they were, personal digital assistants, to gimmicky toys thanks to the section of consumers who hammered palm with whines for not being able to watch "simpsons' episodes", "seinfeld episodes", or "movie trailers" on them!!!!

A PDA is only as useful as how you make use of it. And for me; it's been immensely, immensely useful, in fact, for a long, long time I had the conviction that I could easily live without my computer, in fact, even live better(!), but having had gotten used to my PDA, I could certainly not live without it.

Re:I just don't get it

[Tezkah]

I'm sure there must be a situations where PDAs using current technology must be useful, I'll even hazard a guess: mobile, local database access for doctors, engineers and stock controllers, but really that's an industrial application for a consumer product.

Interestingly enough, the LiveDrive was originally made for Pfitzer (makers of Viagra), and the name comes from their magazine, LifeDrive. Internally, it was referred to as the Tungsten T6, I don't know why they're using the name outside of the models made for Pfizer...

Hook... Line... and...

[soloport]

The new marketing strategy: Put "Linux" in the tag line to attract more attention.

Examples:
* "Now with more Linux!"

* "Ten percent real Linux!"

* "With multiple Linux kernels!"

* "With ten essential Linux distros!"

Or add "Linux" to the name:
* Instead of "Turbo", use "BMW Linux"

* Instead of "Luxury", use simply "Lexus LX" (ok, not much change, but it should work)

* Instead of "Professional", use "Linux Grade Drill Bits".

See?

Does/Will it run lnux or NetBSD?

[nurb432]

No, im serious. I have never been fond of palm OS, but they do normally make decent hardware.

Some of the older models do run other OS's, and putting something like opie on it would be nice.

Re:Does/Will it run lnux or NetBSD?

[Black Perl]

No, im serious. I have never been fond of palm OS, but they do normally make decent hardware.

PalmOS is made by PalmSource. They don't make hardware. Or were you unaware of the split?

Re:Does/Will it run lnux or NetBSD?

[Ulrich Hobelmann]

You should ask whoever created that "Linux PDA" headline. He sure can explain to you the relation between this new Palm and Linux...

Re:Does/Will it run lnux or NetBSD?

[nurb432]

Doesnt matter, i think you know what im talking about.

The OS that the PDA runs that comes from palm.

What ever you call it or where ever it comes from, i dont like it and want to know about the alternatives.

Re:Does/Will it run lnux or NetBSD?

[nurb432]

So many of stories around here are so flawed, i tend to ignore parts of them them with out facts.

If it realy is linux based, then yes, my question is answered.

When will Palm upgrade their mindset?

[PierceLabs]

Is this the best that Palm can do? The PDA market is going away and everyone knows it already except for Palm. Many players have been fleeing the PDA space in favor of the much more interesting (and useful) smartphone space. Only Palm would slap in additional storage in a device and assume that they had pushed the market forward. Its like they are stuck in 90's limbo world and can't get out of it.

Whatever happened to PDAs?

[rho]

This is a nice device, to be sure, but I'm not sure why I should be excited about it.

1) The main factor for making something "seem small" is to make it thin. The 15" Powerbook is actually quite large, but because it's thin it seems small. This thing is 3/4" thick.

2) Brighthand seemed to indicate that it would make a good portable storage device for your digital camera. I don't get that either. The casual photographer who might want to offload vacation pictures isn't likely to buy a $500 device to do so. You can buy a lot of huge SD cards for $500. The professional photographer, who WOULD find this device useful, all use cameras that use CompactFlash. If this USB-thing Brighthand mentions actually works, then maybe--but the idea of having a seperate device is to pull out the card, put it in the device, replace the card with another card, and keep shooting. Also less than 4GB isn't much when you're dealing with 4-7MB RAW files (which I guarantee the LifeDrive app won't be able to read, although it may be able to pull out the JPEG preview). This may be quite the swell device for a Brighthand reviewer, but that's a terribly small niche market.

3) What is the deal with WiFi on PDAs? People are obsessive about this, just as they all clamor for megapixel cameras on their cell phones. WiFi is a power hog. If I wanted to use WiFi on a Palm, I'd go for one of the Enfora portfolios where I don't have to use my Palm's battery. Battery life is king on a PDA. At some point you would do better to simply go with a 12" Powerbook or iBook, and a 3/4" thick device with WiFi but no keyboard is probably that point. (And getting a megapixel camera on your phone is stupid so long as the image is taken through a shitty, fixed focus plastic lens. You get more blurry pixels--that's a Big Win there, chief.)

4) Too expensive. I understand that in order to offer all these goodies, you have to charge for them, but if you drop this thing on the ground, or into the toilet, you've just ruined a $500 device. Everybody's tolerance is different, but for me, $200-ish dollars is that cutoff where I feel like I can replace 2 or 3 devices a year and not feel royally screwed. If I have a $500 device, I'm less likely to take it somewhere out of fear of busting it.

5) Related to 4), but unrelated to the LifeDrive; professional reviewers suck for this reason: they didn't have to buy the damn thing with their money, so they aren't interacting with the device like other people would. If a professional reviewer accidentally sits on the fucking thing, they just phone up Palm and say, "Oopsie, send me another please." They also tend to parrot specs and press release material, and are pathologically uncritical. I've hardly ever seen a review where the reviewer revisits the device after using it for a few months--mostly because after the initial review, the reviewer has moved on to using whatever the next latest-and-greatest toy is, because, you know, everybody has endless time and money to constantly upgrade. Jesus Christ, I'm still using a IIIxe because it works, it's reliable, and I'm not swimming in free time and cash. (The best reviewer in the world is probably Dan even though he does have goodies provided to him on occasion.)

6) No poofters.

Re:Whatever happened to PDAs?

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't own one of these, but as a typical PDA user, I can probably address some of the questions here.

1) "small" and thickness - This is true not just for PDA's. Suffice to say that most PDA's aren't so thick.

2) a good storage device for digital camera. - This is one of those secondary features. It's like how they say they will use iPods for storing and displaying photos, and distributing music videos.

3) What is the deal with WiFi on PDAs? - What's not to like about Wifi on PDA's? It allows you to check for email whenever you're at a hotspot, you can stream music to your PDA, you can use it to test your network, or your friends, or your parent's network... how many reasons do you need?

4) Too expensive. - Millions of iPod users would disagree.

5) Professional Reviewer skew - Not sure why this isn't related to the Lifedrive, since I'm sure that reviewers also didn't purchase it. Still, you're talking about a much larger issue here, and if you want an answer, then pick up some McCluhan. The business of media is a dirty one. Essentially, it's just a big advertising platform. This is true for everything, TV, News, Movies, Radio, and Newspaper and Magazines.

Re:Whatever happened to PDAs?

[rho]

My quick estimation based on shit I have on my desk right now shows that the LifeDrive is about as thick as a tin of Altoids. So I may back off a bit on the thickness as being an issue: it's thick, but not horribly thick. The latest Palms are pretty thin as a rule, but a lot of the PocketPC devices I've seen are pretty unwieldy. By default I would keep the LifeDrive in a protective case, which potentially adds way too much thickness for it to be convenient.

If WiFi was as power-stingy as Bluetooth (which isn't really all that stingy), I'd have no issue. The few tests I've seen of WiFi on Palms shows a battery life of only a few hours--often worse for PocketPC devices. The Tungsten C seems to be one of the best performers here, but it has a 1500 mah battery and a clever WiFi implementation. I'm not saying that WiFi isn't nifty or useful, but I am saying that obsessing over the need for it in a PDA misses the point of a PDA. For email, a Palm + GPRS phone is an adequate solution: email, especially if you use IMAP, is lightweight. I've done it a few times on my IIIxe with the 14.4 Palm modem. Not something I relish doing, but adequte. Web browsing on a Palm of all flavors is best limited to emergencies only. For testing WiFi availability, a smaller, cheaper device may be more useful. Streaming music? No thanks. I don't even do that on my desktop.

I'm not opposed to having WiFi as an option, which is why I mention the Enfora. I'm looking to upgrade my Palm now, probably to the Tungsten E2, and I'll likely pick up an Enfora at some point, so I'm not a purist. But the lack of WiFi is constantly listed as a "Con". Might as well tick it for not including a laser pointer--it's useful on some level, sure, but not if it makes the device more than a couple hundred bucks. I have no doubt that I can come up with gobs of Neat Things To Do With WiFi, but the fact is I'm very unlikely to do any of them with any regularity, and I think I'm closer to the average consumer in this matter.

Well, you have me there on the iPod issue--of course, I don't own an iPod for the same reason. Perhaps I am simply a marketeer's worst nightmare.

I'm not unaware of the purpose of reviews as a vehicle for advertising, but I am really puzzled by the dearth of honest and reliable reviewers. Especially in the Internet age. I'm a bit sensitive to this as I've been searching hard for a replacement cell phone, and cell phone reviews are particularly lame and worthless.

I guess I complain mostly because I think the PalmOS is so incredibly nifty, and that Palm is shooting itself in the foot by not: a) focussing on their developers, which in the end make their platform useful; and b) forgoing the Mac and Linux/BSD/Free Unix market altogether. If anybody is going to appreciate a useful, clever device, it's Mac users. Windows users are going to default to the PocketPC devices, simply because there are so damn many of them, and they'll likely get one from Dell when they buy their new desktop. Palm would do well to satisfy these markets rather than chase after PocketPC.

Re:Whatever happened to PDAs?

[nightfire-unique]

I'm with you for almost all your points. But, wifi is a godsend.

Yes it's a power hog, but 2 hours of 802.11 on a PDA at a hotspot is better than 2 hours of GPRS (especially for those who must pay per byte). It's infinitely faster and more reliable. And nothing says you can't suspend your radio while you work.

And in terms of cost.. sure, it's expensive. But if your reasoning is that you're likely to break and drop it... well, be careful! :) Buy a leather case or rubber skin to protect it. It's a delicate piece of technology; there's no getting around it (lightweight, cheap, durable.. pick two).

Myself, I've got a Treo 650, I love it. I think this LifeDrive is a huge waste of time and money, especially considering it doesn't run Cobalt. I don't get PDAs, though (anymore); I've owned a few in my lifetime (BOSS organizer, Palm III, V, Zaurus C760 (running debian :)), but ever since I got my Treo I could never go back. There is just nothing like having one device to carry around, with everything - MP3s (2gb SD), movies for flights, schedule, accounts and passwords, web browser, phone, email, MSN, IRC, SSH, photoblogging... the list goes on and on. Paired with an unlimited GPRS account it's unstoppable.. EXCEPT.. no WIFI! :)

And with regards to the camera, the megapixel+ cameras on phones these days use higher quality lenses and CCDs than their 640x480 (and lower) counterparts. They're still crap, but at least they're better crap.

APPLE, Where are you when we need you?

[milimetric]

I'm reading through this review, and I'm like... hm, that's kind of cool... yeah, more of the same there... more of the same... slow processor... etc. And then it hits me like two and a half bricks. Don't you think Apple is working on something like this? Take the 20GB iPod, awesome touch wheel and everything, make Mac OS X Mobile and add a few other PDA things, it wouldn't be much bigger than this beast and it would be like: Thanks for playing iPaq and PalmOne, good game, good bye.

Re:APPLE, Where are you when we need you?

[iainl]

I'd settle for something substantially simpler. My wife is considering a new PDA, and wants to continue to run PalmOS for all the software she already has. But I've just spent quite a bit of time ripping our CDs to Apple's AAC format, as I've got an iPod.

If this thing had an AAC player, and not just an mp3 one, then it would be brilliant.

Wrong Review

[rice_web]

That's not a review for the new Palm LifeDrive.

Sooner or later...

[grumpyman]

there will be fewer and fewer distinctions between: - cellphone - PDA - MP3/JPG/Video player I'm waiting for that day. Now it's achievable but it's expensive and somehow, software/usability/size are not great.

"Linux"?

[rfernand79]

"Linux PDA"? Is PalmOS 5.4 based on Linux? (I don't know, I'm still a happy m515 user :D)...

Re:"Linux"?

[Anonymous Coward]

Is PalmOS 5.4 based on Linux?

No. This is not a Linux PDA.

"Linux PDA" - Why pick this submission?

[Anonymous Coward]

Why pick this submission? There must have been many people who submitted this story in one form or another. Myself included.

When I submitted this story, I didn't link to those reviews, but at least I didn't have a major factual error in the title. Surely someone else submitted a better version than either of us? Can editors combine the best of several submissions, or would that be asking them to ... you know ... edit?

This PDA runs Garnet (PalmOS 5.4) which is not Linux. There is no Linux here. Editorial standards? This is slashdot, not journalism and we don't need no steenking standards.

Mod parent up, please (nt)...

[Ulrich Hobelmann]

(no text in here)

Photography

[odaiwai]

The photography on that review is appalling. Images are out of focus and too much flash is used.

Did the guy even look at the images he was putting in the article?

why is this special

[sucati]

can't one attach a micro drive to most pdas e.g. dell axim? I remember my boss had a microdrive on his hp jornada (?).. this was about 5 years ago and it was only 350mb, but same idea.

Sony PSP

[frankmu]

i'm waiting for my cellphone attachment/todo list/calender upgrade for my PSP

Apple Ripoff ... Why?!?

[pestilence669]

I've owned 10 or so Palm & Handspring units, a few PocketPC PDAs, and I also own an Apple Newton. I don't like the PocketPC platform, but I have to give Microsoft credit for going their own way in the PDA market... popular or not. If anyone remembers, Palm Software started out offering a pen input program called Grafitti for the Apple Newton. The Palm Pilot is little more than a Newton clone with Grafitti. It's not strayed too far from the Apple roots over the years. The user experience is the same. The applictions, from the way that they work to the features they offer, are modeled after the ancient PDA. I think that they do this, not because it's best, but because they haven't had an original idea to begin with. Just look at the bundled PocketTunes media player. The buttons look like iTunes. The brushed aluminum skin, is identical to the metal look of iTunes. Even the icons are like iTunes. At least the media player on the PocketPC looks like Windows Media Player - not iTunes. Why can't "innovators" like Palm, find their own way? I find it hard to believe that Apple does music the best, right, and only way... or that the way to success is imitation.

LifeDrive sounds like medical device

[coughman]

Am I the only one who thinks so? Maybe a life supporting device for PalmOne?

What About Battery Life

[buddhaunderthetree]

Battery life is what makes or breaks a PDA. I've got a Sony in my pocket that I haven't recharged in days. It still has 40%, despite wi-fi at the pool yesterday and watching Office Space this morning. If the Palm has a decent battery I'll buy it, if not it's history.

Re:4GB?

[canofbutter]

I have a fairly clean install of XP Pro that is using 4.75GB of my disk. The machine has 1.5GB of RAM and C:\pagefile.sys and C:\hiberfil.sys (yes I enabled hibernation support) each take about 1.5GB; if you have a similar situation, that may account for it.

Could be used as Wireless Portable Storage?

[dotc]

I wonder - can this thing be accessed on your home wireless network without physically manipulating the device itself (ie. like a wake-on-LAN computer)?

To me it seems that a good use of this thing would be to just leave it constantly in your briefcase/sack/backpack/car, and push stuff(files, media, podcast, etc) to it from your home wireless network automatically. Then you just pick up your briefcase/sack/backpack/car on your way out the door...

A modern newton

[nurb432]

Apple pioneered the PDA market. What we need is a modernized Newt.

If they produced one today, and didn't price it out of the range of the mortal man like last time, it could take the market.

Re:A modern newton

[Mike Buddha]

They never will, because Steve Jobs is a petty and vindictive a-hole. Newton was Gilbert Amelio's baby and Steve's pogrom to purge Amelio from the collective memory will prevent any resurgence. Hell, the first thing he did when he made his re-appearance was to pull the Newton group back in to Apple (after it had been spun off into its own company) just to kill it.

Re:A modern newton

[dfghjk]

If Apple pioneered the PDA then why is it that no PDA today (or ever) looks anything like Apple's dismal PDA failure? The Newton was a piece of crap that got what it deserved and Apple deserves no credit for the success of the PDA (which is dying now anyway)

Small, handheld tablet PC have existed for a long time. The Newton was too big and worked too poorly. Palm's were what people wanted at the time. Increasingly, no one wants any of them anymore.

Re:A modern newton

[nurb432]

The Newton failed due to 2 reasons:

1 - was over priced.
2 - was poorly marketed.

Neither of these were technology related.

And just as the price was about to be dropped and the market that they created was about to explode, Steve Jobs came back and killed the project.

Apparently you have never owned a Newt and are either an idiot or just don't like apple in general.

The last true PDA user?

[singularity]

I cling to my Sony Clie T665C. I keep thinking about going with one of the current Palms, but they offer so little beyond what my Sony does that there seems to be no reason to pay money for basically the same device.

What do I use my Clie for?
1) Keeping my calendar on me at all times. I do find that I am using it less now that I also have my iPod set up to keep sync'd with iCal. It is nice to be able to add appointments while on the go, though.

2) Keeping the local bus schedules on me at all times. Without a car in a major metropolitan area, the ability to see when the next bus is coming is extremely handy.

3) Being able to read the New York Times and Rueters on the bus on the way to work.

4) Being able to get maps, walking directions, and local restaurants/bars/shops when I go out.

My friends used to laugh at me when I would stick my Sony in my jacket pocket before we would go out for a night on the town. The first few times I pulled it out and said "ok, there is an all-night eatery with good reviews about six blocks from here. Go three blocks in this direction and then turn left", though, they stopped making fun of it.

In addition to everything listed above, I keep a few photos on it, a couple hundred addresses, and a couple thousand datebook entries. Even with this, I am barely breaking 8 megabytes of the 16 megabytes storage on the device.

Sure, my 12" PowerBook could do most of what I have listed above. When I go out for a night, though, I cannot slip my laptop into my jacket pocket.

All this desire for gigabytes of storage, hundreds of megahertz of performance, and wireless make little sense to me.

This entire idea of convergence, with PDA/game device/cell phone/MP3 player/camera seems to be getting ridiculous. Palm seems to have completely ignored innovation on the low end of their devices.

What ever happened to the idea of a simple device that did its job and did it well?

Not What I Was Hoping For

[foo fighter]

I have a Tungsten T3 that I really love and that is practically glued to my back pocket.

I love having a PDA for several reasons.
* I have a complicated schedule that often changes and a poor memory. The Calendar on the T3 is great and a real life saver for me. Color-labeled calendars are awesome. Vibrating alarms are a must have feature for me. I hate cell phone rings, I hate pda alarm rings, I hate any stupid noise like that. Plus it's fun to legitemately have buzzing things in your pants pocket.
* Having my next-tasks list on the same screen as that day's appointments - on the Agenda view - is great, a real productivity boost for me.
* Having my entire address book in the T3 is also fantastic. My wife keeps her addresses in a traditional paper book and it is a mess of crossed out entries, personal contacts next to business contacts, etc. With the T3 I can easily enter, edit, categorize, and look up phone numbers and addresses (real and e).
* I have a ton of lists: next actions, projects, waiting for, follow ups, someday, DVDs/Books/CDs/Websites to buy/rent/borrow/bookmark, Wine & Beer I like, etc. Between Tasks (which should be called Lists), Notes, and Memos it's easy to keep these things always at hand, categorized and easily editable. I could keep these in a paper notebook, but I again run into the problem of the notebook becoming a mess of crossed out items where I can't easily find what I'm looking for and that has to be manually copied when I fill up one book and get another.

Bluetooth is nice to wirelessly sync the T3 to my PowerBook. It's cool to have family pictures and a pr0n stash readily viewable on a very nice display. The slider keeps the T3 nice and small in my pocket and nice and big in my hand.

The lack of wi-fi isn't too big of a deal. It would be nice for email, but web surfing on that tiny screen is a bit masochistic. Also, the pathetic battery life would be worse with wi-fi. That's the biggest problem with the T3. A hard day's use makes it worthless that evening until you've charged it up again.

Yes, my cell phone (Motorola V265) can do most of that stuff, but entering and editing the information is a *huge* pain in the ass. The tiny screen is also annoying and I basically just use the thing to hold other people's phone numbers, which aren't too bad to enter.

I was looking to the Lifedrive to be a replacement for my aging T3. What I really want from my next PDA is a T3 with better battery life, a more modern operating system (ie Palm OS 6) for better multitasking and network connectivity, and wi-fi.

OK, I got the wi-fi. But battery life doesn't look to be any better even though the Lifedrive has a bigger battery than the T3. Also, the included web browser looks to be almost useless to actually surf the web.

I guess the brilliant slider is gone forever, which is really a crying shame. The Lifedrive is huge and heavy and not suitable for back pocket glueing. And no vibrating alarms! Ack! It still uses OS 5. Blech!

I have no idea why anyone wants 4GB of storage in their PDA. From the reviews it seems all it does is slow down app loading times and suck battery life. I have a 1GB iPod flash that I use to listen to music and carry files. I have several .5GB SD cards scattered around for carrying files.

I guess the "killer feature" of 4GB of storage is handheld video. Personally I think handheld video is completely braindead, as is anyone who seriously thinks it is a good idea. The Lifedrive can't even play standard TV resolution without dropping tons of frames. Why would you want to look at that? I doubt you could watch a feature length movie before the battery died. If I had very long commutes on public transportation I'd pull out my Powerbook or just a book.

Oh, and having to pay extra for decent Mac connectivity is just assinine. (Palm Desktop is a dead horse. The Missing Sync from Markspace is necessary for proper T3-OS X interaction and costs $40.) I think the people who actually like

Re:Not What I Was Hoping For

[MikeBabcock]

I've been ranting for a few years about making a wireless storage device just for storing my data. That said, I'd envisioned something more like "hang around your neck" wireless ... maybe with a memory stick option.

I just want to be able to store more data arbitrarily from any of my other devices to a standard central device.

Convergence

[Doc Ruby]

Big MP3 players don't run the thousands of popular PalmOS apps this one does. Or sync with popular desktop PIM apps, or other popular Palm-compatible handhelds. But Palm devices like this one are also big MP3 players, with hifi stereo headsets. So you can keep your life together, and your toes tapping, without carrying lots of devices. FWIW, 4GB microdrive is bigger (and cheaper per MB) than the Flash alternatives. And I expect that it's built-in (not removable) to keep size and weight down.

Useless, no keyboard

[exp(pi*sqrt(163))]

When are PDA manufacturers going to stop making gimmicks for playing games and videos and start making PDAs that you can actually use for work again? I must be really weird. Am I the only person in the world who misses the old clamshell design? I'd still be using my Psion 3 if it hadn't been stolen. Hell, I'm thinking of getting my Psion II back out in protest against he toys that PDA manufacturers are currently releasing. In fact, I would if I could get hold of a serial cable for it at a reasonable price. Or maybe I'll try to get hold of one of those pocket size PC compatible HPs.

Yes, I've seen Treos. That's not a keyboard unless you're from Lilliput. Yes, I know you can buy an external keyboard, but just try using one anywhere other than at a desk where you might as well be using a laptop anyway. The Clie wasn't bad but Sony have stopped producing those. That leaves the clamshell Zaurus which is horribly expensive.

Multitasking

[certel]

You know, unless Palm starts adding multitasking capabilities to there devices, I just don't see a need. I *LOVE* the Treo 650, but with no multitasking, I find it rather annoying.

Try to keep a straight face!

[exp(pi*sqrt(163))]

From the Palmone web site:

With new LifeDrive(TM) technology, you can quickly drag and drop thousands of files from your PC onto your LifeDrive mobile manager with the folder structure intact.

It's called LifeDrive(TM) technology? I call that "having a file system". Have I accidentally fallen through a time warp. I mean we are half a decade into the 21st century aren't we?

Of course what that paragraph reveals is that file support on the Palm has always been dreadful. The Palm has always had a flat file system in RAM making it a terrible place to store files. So the marketing folks at Palm are deluded into thinking that a directory structure is actually a significant advance.

Nice device ... no Linux

[Spooker]

When the article first appeared I had to go check it out ... the specs read basically the same as my T5 but with WiFi and the 4GB HDD ...

It runs Garnet which is the same PalmOS as the other PalmOne devices just a later version ... it's not Linux and there are no plans to port Cobalt to run on these devices ... Colbalt (future being Linux) is targeted at the Smart Phone devices ... no where has it been said that we will get a flavor of Linux to run on our regular run-o-the-mill PDAs (shame shame)

I like my T5 but I can't see the benefit of the harddrive when all I need to do is carry a few 1GB SD cards and my device is half the thickness ... am I missing something?

Not to knock Palm (I have owned one since the original Pilot 1000) ... <rant>I want more freedom in my OS! Let me run MythTV on my PDA! Let me port NetStumbler so that I can wardrive just like my friends with their iPaqs! Give me a Linux kernel!</rant>

yes...

[mbaudis]

...but does it run linux? (actually this may not be such a dumb question in this case ...)

Bad photography.

[Anonymous Coward]

Why is it that so many otherwise informative reviews contain the most unimaginably bad photographs of the device in question? I hardly know what this thing looks like because all of the pictures are out of focus, and the idiot forgot to turn the flash off when appropriate.

Re:4GB?

[weekendgeek]

Turn off System Restore or limit the amount of disk space it can use.

By default it uses a percentage of disk space so the smaller the drive it's installed on the less space allocated.

Stay focused...

[vettemph]

It would be nice if this dickbag at PocketFactory could focus his camera on the device he is reviewing instead of the INTEL and WINDOWS logos of his PC. WTF?

PS- While I'm ranting, why isn't this [dick|ass|doosh][bag|head|hole] who did the review for a Linux PDA running Linux???

PSPS- ass-bag may cause errors.

Sound and Sync speed

[owlstead]

What I need to know from the reviews:

- How much noise can it make? It lacks a vibration mode, ok, but my current PDA (Zire 31) never has a chance to wake me up.

- How fast is the synchronization mode? It hurts when you have to install an application to use it as a drive. But if I can live with that (can I?) then how fast will it synchronize. Again, with the Zire31 this is a pain, especially if you see the speed difference with just putting something on an SD card.

I cannot see how I could use it to play movies if the transfer takes ages.

Now the big guestion: shall I buy it or shall I wait until Hitachi has these drives with 10x the amount of space (perpendicular hard disks) and PalmOne finally delivers something that does multitasking?

Re:Sound and Sync speed

[Mike Buddha]

It's a USB 2.0 device. Fast enough for you?

Re:Sound and Sync speed

[owlstead]

USB 2.0 fast enough? Depends on the *actual* speed. My Zire 31 is USB 1.1, but it is much slower than the 1 MB/second that is possible with USB 1.1. This is like saying that a S-ATA - 2 drive communicates at 300 MB/second.

PalmOne and Linux - feh

[Dorsai65]

Even if the device was running Linux (it doesn't), PalmOne buggered the potential user base by continuing to tie it to Windows.

Is Palm ever going to get a clue that they might actually improve their user base if they'd offer Linux (or even platform-independent, i.e. Java) variants of their desktop apps? Yeah, I know, there's KPilot and JPilot (I use KPilot with my Tungsten E), but it's not the same, by a long shot. If/when somebody comes up with a PDA-like device that I can plug "natively" into my Linux box, I'll be on it in a heartbeat.

more review

[Anonymous Coward]

here's an in-depth review

http://www.mobiletechreview.com/palmone-LifeDrive. htm

Sun bought them.

[itomato]

They are Sun Cobalts now. No relation.

[Updated]

[tepples]

It was just changed minutes ago: "PalmOne Releases 4GB PDA [Updated]".

Palm still good, Linux becoming better.

[Erris]

I'm sure there must be a situations where PDAs using current technology must be useful, I'll even hazard a guess: mobile, local database access for doctors, engineers and stock controllers, but really that's an industrial application for a consumer product.

OK fine, it's best for business. A PDA replaces slips of paper that get lost, is much easier to search than a spiral notepad, and peeps to remind you things. The average person does not need one. A music player that is also a PDA is a better deal than a music player that is not a PDA if the price and performance are equal.

I know one person who runs their business off an old Palm device. He's a contractor of sorts and contact information, scheduling and project notes are his bread and butter. He's got it glued to the dashboard of his truck and has a spare. It's so good at what it does that between it and a cell phone he does not need email or bother syncing it with a desktop computer.

I use my Palm much the same way and so can any professional. It peeps to remind you to go to that dull meeting, that's important. It syncs with Windoze, KDE and Gnome. It still runs for a month or more off a pair of AAAs. Cell phone interfaces still don't match the ease of lookup and information contained in the average Palm.

Newer devices running Familiar offer some improvements. Wifi does indeed make such devices close to a laptop replacement. With Dillo or Minimo, surfing works. Email also works just fine, as it did with Palm to begin with. Familiar and Opie also sync with most platforms, though it may be tricky. Using OpenSSH, syncs will get much better than they are today. Having a nice picture viewer is a plus for the wife and very very useful to other people like me who are challenged by name face recognition. Music is a nice addition as is voice recording.

Ummm...

[johansalk]

I really think it would've been better had palm fitted this with a microdrive-compatible flashcard reader than an internal microdrive. I got an iPaq last year when I switched from Palm that had dual card readers, SD and Flash, and I got a 2gb microdrive in the very first days that merely sat idle till I took it and put it in the drawer, only to sell on ebay a little later on. If I want a microdrive I'd buy a PDA with a flashcard reader so I can use the microdrive in my other devices, such as a digicam, or use the flashcard reader for other uses. In my experience microdrives consume too much power and are FAR from reliable with data.

I need my PDA

[ratboy666]

Currently, a Palm m505. The biggest feature that wins it for me over a laptop is that the Palm DOES go everywhere with me.

Uses:

1 - Graphing scientific calculator. And, yes, I need one.

2 - Calendar. Very important to me.

3 - Address book, phone numbers.

4 - Project Planning and tracking

5 - Note taking in meetings.

6 - Laying out simple circuits. Simple C and Scheme code (it is remarkably useful for that)

7 - Some recreational - dive planning/logging. Grocery lists, shopping lists, reminders.

It is really my little digital assistant. No, I DON'T have a laptop computer, and really have no need. The Palms battery life is much better, and it is small enough to go with me.

I back data up to a 512MB SD card (that in turn is backed up on my desktop computer). I use a wireless 802.11b sled for synching, and have an "emergency" USB charging/sync cable that cost me $2 (which means that if I know I am going somewhere on a trip where a computer is available, I can leave the charger at home.)

Since I need a calculator with graphing anyway, I find the m505 to be smaller, and comparable, and it does much more besides.

With doubled screen resolution and built-in WiFi, I could almost replace most desktop use with the device as well. So I *am* interested in the newest offerings (note that the Zaurus was just too large! Although it CAN replace desktop use for me -- I tried it).

Most desired missing feature (of the m505) -- MP3 playback.

I don't like the idea of a hard drive in the unit though... I would rather carry a couple of SD sticks.

Laptops? In my opinion, generally a waste of time. You can't take them with you all the time, so they cannot be a ubiquitous information appliance. Plus, the battery life is rarely good enough to get you coast-to-coast. And, its one more bulky item to carry.

Ratboy.

pda market being a headless chicken

[the SLM]

BEGIN RANT

I just can't believe the way the pda market is so messed up.

How can you bring out a device like this so long after sony's th-55 ?

Repeat after me : it's not the specs, it's the performance.

With a properly configured th-55 and a reasonably large memory stick, you can watch full screen 22fps video with no dropped frames (hours of it) take pics, take mpeg videos, you have bluetooth for web connection through your phone, connection to your computer, gps whatever, wifi, voice recorder, mp3 playback, single-handed operation, tons of buttons, jog-dial and the machine's small and looks good.

So how can palmone be coming out with a device that's bulkier, heavier, apparently lags because of the hard drive, has no camera, has to have holes in it or it overheats, and costs $100 more ?

I don't even understand how this can happen ! /END RANT

Re:pda market being a headless chicken

[SomeOtherGuy]

The answer is simple. The PDA market does not really move forward in the traditional sense of how most electronics move forward. For every step that is taken forward in the PDA market -- they take 2 steps back.

If PDA's were TV's -- the next generation would not have remote controls and their replacements would go back to black and white.

Anyone who had a HP 200 LX or Psion back in the day that had a wide screen, CF slot AND/OR PCMCIA slot, nice keyboard, and great battery life powered by a pair cheap off the shelf AA's has been wondering for quite a few years now what happened to all of the features.

Re:pda market being a headless chicken

[the SLM]

well at least I'm not the only one who feels this way.

what I was wondering was if there could be an actual explanation for this sad state of affairs.

I can understand that sony might feel that its clie line takes away from some of its other products, but shouldn't palmone be striving to make products that you actually want to buy ?

Does anybody understand why the pda market moves sideways while others move forward ?

I'll Keep my Axim

[MBCook]

4 Gigs of storage, that's all this thing has.

It costs $500. For that (or a little more) I could get my Dell Axim x50v. What would that get me. Let's see...

• Better screen. 480x640 as opposed to 320x480.
• Faster processor. Intel X-Scale at 624 MHz, not 450.
• Better graphics. You get Intel 2700 something-or-other embeded 3D graphics (pretty neat)
• Better OS. Windows Mobile 2k3 has it's problems, but it is LIGHTYEARS ahead of the PalmOS.
• More expansion. The Axim has a CF slot and an SD slot. You could stick a microdrive in it and get your 4GB that way.

You still get the other things like Bluetooth and WiFi too. It looks great, runs great, etc. If you can do without the 4GB of storage (do you really need it?) then the Axim is a MUCH better deal. And if you go with the QVGA screen it's even cheaper.

When Palm puts a real OS on this thing (Linux, as mentioned) it could be a very interesting PDA. But for now, it is unimpressive in many areas (screen and OS to name two big ones). I've watched DiVX movies on my Axim and they are AMAZING. I can stick the memory card out of my digicam in it and look at the pictures and they look beautiful. I can surf the web and things look great.

Palm was nice, but they need that OS update.

Re:I'll Keep my Axim

[klubar]

I have to agree on the Axim... For nearly the same price you can buy a Axim + 1 GB SD and 2 GB CF cards giving you 3 GB of storage...with the flexibilty to swap another card in and out as needed. The cards don't suffer the data loss risk of a hard drive and can be expanded as needed. Also, for transferring big files to the device, it's handy to be able to plug the cards into a PC card reader and go.

Re:I'll Keep my Axim

[arodland]

I've got to disagree with you on the topic of the OS. PalmOS was a beautiful system on a par with Mac OS classic, nicely adapted to the hardware requirements. Sure, the cruft accumulated as they added features that were never thought of originally, but it's still not bad. And I'm allowed to hope that PalmOS => PalmOS 6 will do something like Mac OS => OS X :)

Re:I'll Keep my Axim

[MBCook]

Yes, it was simple and well designed for it's time. The problem is that it is now in OS 9's territory. It has been stretched, and added too, and asked to do things it was never origionally designed to do (like networking). It is simply time for a new OS, but they can (and quite possibly should) keep the interface the same. It's the guts that need updating.

Steve Jobs

[nurb432]

Oh, i know it wont happen while SJ is running the show .. But we can still dream ..

Re:Steve Jobs

[Mike Buddha]

But we can still dream ..

That jackhole Jobs wouldn't even Open Source parts of the OS so that current Newton developers could continue their work. Steve Jobs is the death of dreams...

[fade to black]

Eh, not again...

[ppp]

Slashdot has become very predictable when it comse to PDA news: "We just don't get it". Well fine, you don't like PDAs. I personally find my PDA indispensible. I don't, however, scratch my head in bewilderment when I find out that someone has a different method for staying organized than I do. I also prefer Palm OS to anything out there at the moment.

I could explain the myriad of ways that a PDA makes my life easier, but then that's been discussed extensively in the *many* previous Slashdot PDA threads started by people who "just don't get it." Of course, if Apple ever releases one, I suppose a lot people around here will suddenly discover the PDA to be indispensible as well.

PalmOS

[p0rnking]

Whatever happened to Be's OS (not BeOS) that Palm bought a few years ago for $5 mill?

Sound Quality?

[bombadier_beetle]

One thing that bugs me about discussions regarding MP3-enabled devices is that few reviewers discuss sounds quality. For the most part, sound quality is adequate if you use cheap earbuds, but if you're an audiophile and use something better, this is something you'd care about.

One of the main reasons I bought a Rio Karma as opposed to an iPod or something else was the high-quality sound board. Something tells me that a PDA that just happens to have a headphone jack and an MP3 decoder isn't going to have high sound quality as one of its selling points (although the HP Jornada 560 series actually excelled at this compared to toher PDAs). Until I can find an all-in-one PDA with decent sound, I'll be toting multiple devices.

Tungsten E2

[ppp]

The E2 can do everything you mentioned, and is *only* $250, which I believe is less than your Clie cost when it was new. It also has excellent battery life, and a much nicer screen than the Clie. Take a look at one, you might actually like it.

All I needed to know

[SomeOtherGuy]

"Battery isn't user replaceable so you can't swap in a spare on the road."

This may be ok for IPOD users to have "battery lock in" -- but I would not feel very comfortable with a device that uses WIFI, and has no way to swap out or expand the battery.

Wonderful...

[absurdist]

However, the device seems to have a Linux-friendly design, and is likely to run Linux soon, whether supplied by PalmOne's sister company PalmSource, or by Linux hobbyists.

Oh, goody.

You mean like Open Zaurus? Which after HOW many years of development is still worthless as a PDA and somewhat less useless, but still extremely marginal as a Linux system? This isn't a flame, but a statement from someone who tried to get several revisions crufted into a working system on a SL-5500, and eventually gave up and went back to a Palm in frustration.

If Palm actually comes out with a reasonably debugged, usable version of Linux running their existing UI, I'm all over it. Clean, simple, and elegant. If I have to wait for what passes for the Linux PDA community to come up with something usable, I might as well get a paper notebook and pencil.

It won't be running Linux "applications"

[hacker]

Palmsource's migration to using the Linux kernel does NOT mean it will be running a Linux userland. They are replacing the legacy kernels they currently maintain (replete with all of their various bugs), with a Linux kernel.

They've said time and time again that they aren't migrating to Linux for the userland, they're leveraging the architecture and platform and driver support that the Linux kernel provides.

That being said, if they get the Linux kernel running on it, any enterprising young hackers can certainly turn it into a Linux-based PDA, complete with Linux userland applications as well, like Opie and the other original CRL iPAQ handhelds have been doing for close to 6 years.

But don't expect Palm applications to run in the context of a Linux userland (i.e. bash, ash, etc.), and don't expect PalmOS to be running Linux applications anytime soon...

HEY MODERATORS!

[kelzer]

Who's the bonehead that modded parent down as redundant? For crying out loud, the guy posted 4 minutes after the article appeared!

If you're going to moderate, read the freakin' moderation guidelines. Try to focus on positive moderation of good posts.

NO. and they will offer an upgrade later

[CarrionBird]

This comes with OS 5.x. And Palm DOES NOT do OS upgrades. They stopped such things after OS4. Even small upgrades to the builtin apps can only be obtained by getting the next model Palm.

SE S710a + Dell Axim X50V

[cve]

By pairing (via bluetooth) a Sony Ericsson S710a with a Dell Axim X50V you get:
Compact Flash Storage (4 Gigs)
SD Storage (2 Gigs)
Memory Stick Storage (1 Gig)
802.11b Wifi
Edge data transfer
Megapixel Digital Camera
640X480 Resolution

Capsule review:

[mblase]

No iTMS support. Less space than an iPod. Lame.

Cut the Microdrive and I am sold

[EvlG]

I don't want the Microdrive or any of the complications that come with it (most notably, the speed hit mentioned by the reviews).

If Palm were to cut the Microdrive but keep the Wifi, I would buy this for sure.

;-) CoreCodec on Palm

[kabz]

Hehehe, here you go: http://www.corecodec.com/TCMP Player

This player has codecs for AAC which hopefully will do the job. This is the player I use for playing Seinfeld episodes on my Clie TJ37.

Re:;-) CoreCodec on Palm

[iainl]

Thanks, you're an absolute star. Except that now I've got to stop my wife in her attempts to deliberately destroy her Clie, so she's got an excuse to get one of these things.

I'm still on a Handspring Visor...

[interactive_civilian]

I'm still using one of the older (non-color, but color case) Handspring Visors and it suits my needs very well, with two exceptions, which I will get to in a moment.

My main uses for it are for my schedule (synced with iCal on my Mac with a redundant backup to my iPod), a nice, free Japanese-English dictionary (Dokusha - very nice but very slow for E-J lookups), reading eBooks, and jotting down the occasional memo. I also have some software loaded in for music stuff (fretboard, IIRC), dark room timing stuff (which I don't use much anymore since I no longer have a darkroom), and that is about it.

My only problems with it are speed (16MHz processor doesn't do somethings at all...like I said, E-J lookups take a couple of minutes...however J-E lookups are pretty much instantaneous) and storage space (only 8MB, which means I am severely limited to the number of books I can have loaded), but otherwise it functions well and I usually get about a month or two using 2 AAA batteries.

Not a bad little device...maybe I'll upgrade someday.

Re:4GB?

[brontus3927]

Not definative by any means, but when I checked last night, the c:\Windows directory of my P4 2.2GHz with 1.5GB RAM was ~2GB

Re:Whatever happened to PDAs? (behold, the PMSD*)

[Veccio]

Frankly, I'm a bit excited about this one!

I'm thinking about it in terms of putting the music-sharing ability of iTunes/Rendezvous (not the crippled version on 4.6+, but the early versions) on a mobile device that has much storage and connectivity.

Wouldn't it be nice to set up in a coffeeshop (ah, good ol cliches) and discover other people's playlists in range? Then, depending on how scrupulous the software used is, you can either stream new stuff, or *ahem* download shared tracks?

I've been looking for something like that for a long time. If they make it easy and popular to use, I think that it can revolutionise how I hear media. It almost reminds me of how I used to share files over IrDA with my PowerBook G3 back in the day.

*Personal Mass Storage Devices

Keep your blood/brain barrier

[UpnAtom]

Since I don't trust a mobile anywhere near my head, I'd suggest a Bluetooth headset and combine everything else on the phone/PDA.

I had this discussion with my boss a while back...

[DivideByZero]

...And when he was done extolling the virtues of his letter-size day planner, I said:

"May I see your planner?" - He handed it over.

I held it up by a corner of the spine and held out my other hand "Now, can I borrow your lighter for a minute?"

He didn't give me his lighter, but he DID get the point. He's mostly migrated over to a Zire72.