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Be your generations http://www.gnewsense.org/Projects/Lemote you don't have to 'trust' just understand and test.
Take your cash, skills and efforts away from the tame junk "compromised" brands and build with more interesting products, projects.

Looks pretty up to date to me, checking out their website. It is RMS' chosen distro, and that's saying something.

I think the best way to draw attention to hardware that doesn't function without non-free drivers and firmware is to have a distribution that will take a principled stand against including such software.

That distro is gNewSense.

I can think of at least two distros (gNewSense: http://www.gnewsense.org/ and Trisquel: http://trisquel.info/) that are the result of people working diligently to comb through the entire Ubuntu distro (not just the kernel) and checking modules/programs/packages for license compatibility. Binary blobs and other non-free kernel modules have always been a concern.

Bravo!

So, the computer that you're posting this from...

It doesn't have an HDCP-capable video card? Is it running FOSS all the way down? No it isn't, or are you actually running gNewSense?

And do you just not watch movies? Or do you make sure to only watch them in theaters? Only theaters which use analog reels, so you can be sure there's no DRM? And of course, your ticket price would be going to MPAA members...

Do you see where this is going? It's not impossible to avoid letting a single cent of your purchase end up with these asshats, but it's pretty damned hard.

The free (libre) derivative of Ubuntu should not be left unmentioned: gNewSense.

Even if you don't use gNewSense, their homepage can serve as a guide for hardware shopping. They only list devices that work without non-free firmware or drivers.

From their website:

gNewSense is derived from Ubuntu, and thus has most of the same functionality. There are a number of differences though.

• Non-free firmware removed from kernel in main*
• Non-free firmware removed from linux-ubuntu-modules**
• Builder, a tool to produce a distribution
• Restricted removed
• Multiverse removed
• Ubuntu logos replaced
• Universe enabled by default
• Emacs, bsdgames, nethack and build-essential part of the default install

The free (libre) derivative of Ubuntu should not be left unmentioned: gNewSense.

Even if you don't use gNewSense, their homepage can serve as a guide for hardware shopping. They only list devices that work without non-free firmware or drivers.

From their website:

gNewSense is derived from Ubuntu, and thus has most of the same functionality. There are a number of differences though.

• Non-free firmware removed from kernel in main*
• Non-free firmware removed from linux-ubuntu-modules**
• Builder, a tool to produce a distribution
• Restricted removed
• Multiverse removed
• Ubuntu logos replaced
• Universe enabled by default
• Emacs, bsdgames, nethack and build-essential part of the default install

introduce gNewSense as a fully free alternative to the NONSENSICAL non-free alternatives.

Yours In Novy Urengoy,
K. Trout

Bingo! That's why saying something like, "Their marketing is just not freetard centric like anything GNU or the FSF puts their name on" is absolutely moronic.

No, it's not. It's exactly my point. You are so goddamn dense. Red Hat is NOT MARKETING TO OPEN SOURCE ENTHUSIASTS. How much more clear can I make this? They are marketing their solution as a commercially supported professional enterprise platform. They mention Linux, but not GNU or the FSF. If you want to see freetard-centric marketing, look at this:

http://www.gnewsense.org/

Do you see a difference? Oh, all it seems to talk about is how "free" the software makes you. Try to find this on Red Hat's website.

Wait, here's another one:

http://www.myopenrouter.com/

What's this? Oh, it seems to be marketed as an OPEN SOURCE router My OPEN router. Now find an entity that markets to this segment and profits. Good luck!

Like so many geeks, I my fair share of time wondering why Windows has been so successful. My conclusion is that it boils down to satisfying individuals and organizations who placed no value on freedom.

The other reasons are auxiliary: timing, marketing, features, illegal monopoly practices. When it comes down to it, if people value their freedom, they'll run only free software. gNewSense is a great place to start: http://www.gnewsense.org/

It's not as bad as "gNewSense". On many levels...

1) Puns are not usually considered clever. A "gnu"-based pun is unlikely to be an exception.

2) It appears we are the target market: http://wiki.gnewsense.org/Main/HowToHelp

They want people to promote it on Wikipedia? (and Slashdot, of course) That is an express desire to be viewed favorably by a wider audience. Nice try in ducking the problem, but that kind of denial isn't helping anyone.

I also wondered about Debian when I first heard about the FSF distribution. When RMS was here recently I found his complaint that there are "no completely Free distributions" a little confusing. Debian does include non-free packages, but it separates them into the non-free and contrib sections exactly so that people who want a completely Free installation can easily filter out the non-free components... and this is why I was surprised that RMS didn't just use that formula for his laptop. Although knowing how he reasons, it'd probably be enough for him to argue that Debian even associates itself with non-free software and makes it easy for people to install it if they need to, which the FSF might believe is bad for Free Software in the long term.

Even if the FSF wanted a completely free GNU distribution of its own, however, wouldn't it be easier to simply take Debian and simply strip out the non-free and contrib sections? Ultimately it should be as simple as not providing access to those packages in the repositories, since Debian's already declared that those packages will never be required for a complete working distribution. Why take a distro based on Debian which makes it more convoluted, then reverse it back to what Debian probably was in the first place?

gNewSense claims in its FAQ that Debian/Ubuntu aren't really free, but apart from saying so the FAQ doesn't really address this. I know the two have had their disagreements on licenses (notably the Debian team deciding that the GFDL isn't really Free). Is it something to do with this?

I'm sure there would be good reasons for doing this, and to be honest I don't even think it's necessary to have reason that convinces everyone in Free Software. As long as people are motivated to do it, good for them (and perhaps for everyone). If anyone could comment on this, though, I'd be interested to know more about what the reason is.

Certainly any laptop with Atheros wireless, Intel graphics and sound is going to work nicely.

I run gNewSense 2.0 on a Thinkpad X61. Video (Intel GM965) is accelerated in 2D but don't expect any 3D since GLX is non-free. The buit-in Atheros (5424) works with open access points if I build the latest wireless compat release but I've had no luck with WEP and WPA. I use a Zydas USB dongle which works fine but won't come back from suspend. Otherwise, everything I can think of is fully functional.

That's a good point, one I hadn't thought about. But if licensing issues are a problem for pre-installed Linux, how have existing manufacturers coped? Note that this distro is just Ubuntu with all the "restricted" (closed-source, but freely redistributable) stuff removed. I see nothing in Ubuntu's licensing that would prevent somebody from selling a system with Ubuntu pre-installed.

In any case, GNewSense's mission statement has nothing to say about the legal hassles of people selling Linux-based PCs. It's all about the way they think software should and should not be licensed.

Remember, this is the Free Software Foundation, which doesn't do anything non-ideological. To them "non-free" software is evil, and practical considerations be damned. Everything they do is about that.

Given his strong opinion on the topic of non-Free software, I can't really understand this sentence: "Since the last release, more non-free binary blobs have been removed, ....". Does that mean GNewSense included and still includes non-Free blob's?

We keep finding more of them in odd places.

See http://bugs.gnewsense.org/Bugs/00164 for the background to that particular sentence. In Hardy, some non-free blobs moved from the kernel to a package we'd never heard about before. Once this was reported, they were removed within 5 hours.

I'm not currently aware of any non-free blobs in gNewSense. To ensure it stays that way, some time ago we kicked off an exhaustive check of the Kernel, which has already gone through all the "hotspots". We also did a check of all of 'main' for 1.1.

If this is something that some people want, then that's great, more power to them. But I'm left with a lot of misgivings:

1. If I was really serious about running a system with no binary blobs, I think I'd probably run OpenBSD. The level of hassles you encounter with an OS basically depends on how big its audience is and how many resources it has available. When it comes to something that's even more obscure than OpenBSD, I'm chicken. And I'm not clear on what advantages GNewSense would have over OpenBSD.
2. If you have hardware whose only linux support is via binary blobs, then you can't use GNewSense, because your hardware won't work. If you have hardware that has linux support via OSS drivers, then you don't need GNewSense, you can just install ubuntu and select OSS drivers rather than any binary drivers that are also available.
3. All other things being equal, I'd love to buy only hardware that's got good OSS support, and run only OSS drivers. Unfortunately, doing that is much, much harder than it should be. For example, I bought my kids $200 Linux boxes to put in their rooms, and we don't want to drill holes and run cables, so we're using wifi for those machines. The wifi cards I bought had Rt61 and Rt2500 chipsets. The FSF says that the Rt2500 has support from open-source drivers, whereas the Rt61 doesn't. But actually, the OSS drivers for the Rt2500 don't really work in my experience. That is, if you install the Linksys binary-blob drivers via ndiswrapper, and you start Gnome, you get a little logo that shows you you've automatically established an internet connection, it shows you the power level, everything works. If you install the OSS driver, then apparently none of that works. No, my kids are not going to open a terminal window every time they want internet access and type cryptic commands. If you search on ubuntuforums.org, you'll find dozens of threads about getting Rt2500 wifi to work using ndiswrapper, with lots of discussion of the various pitfalls, etc. Why would people be putting that amount of effort into installing the binary blobs if the OSS support actually worked well, as the FSF claims?
4. Their faq sort of makes it sound like other distros are toilet seats in public restrooms; they have lots of invisible germs that you'll get on you, and you won't know it. Realistically, I think Ubuntu and Debian make it reasonably clear when you're installing closed-source software. The faq mentions GLX as an example where you can inadvertently installed non-OSS software on Debian or Ubuntu. Rather than installing a very obscure distro, wouldn't it be easier just to install something like Ubuntu, do the research to find out that GLX isn't free (by someone's definition of free, which may or may not agree with yours), and then make a choice not to install it?

Who is this supposed to be a nuisance to?

It's a reference to RMS (or his PGP^H^H^HGPG key):

"The name originated as Gnusiance as a reference to RMS's GPG key, but was later changed to gNewSense by bbrazil and ompaul to also capture the New Sense of the distribution and as a pun on GNU."

http://www.gnewsense.org/index.php?n=FAQ.FAQ#toc4

furthermore, both KDE and XFCE are both available as meta packages in the synaptic package manager, oh and then there is http://www.gnewsense.org/ originally, shuttleworth launched gobuntu to take all the non free software out of ubuntu, but then gnewsense took over, because richard stallman and the FSF liked it better, or something.

but that is based on gnome, but i'm sure switching it to kde or xfce is easy...

Fatal error: Allowed memory size of 8388608 bytes exhausted (tried to allocate 4097 bytes) in /var/www/pmwiki-2.1.27/scripts/pagelist.php on line 455

From http://www.gnewsense.org/Main/Features

Actually, that's not quite true. The default install contains some non-free, look-but-don't-touch binary blobs, which is why gNewSense was created, which is Ubuntu with those non-free components removed.

I suspect he'll run on it.

Wait, last I checked, you merely had to tell people where to get the source. As all (x|edu|k)ubuntu distros have that built into the package manager, they -had- told people how to get the source.

I don't see the standard package manager anywhere in the MPAA UT Admin Guide (PDF). It appears to go straight from the splash screen to the "Peerwatch" configuration.

Besides, the GPL section 3 is pretty clear on this: if you're not distributing source code yourself (option a), or a written offer to sell it (option b), then you must "Accompany [the program] with the information you received as to the offer to distribute corresponding source code". Unless you count disassembling the install CD, they haven't met this at all.

Or are you suggesting that each distro made from Ubuntu must have its own separate repository for the source? That clearly flies in the face of what already exists.

You're going to have to be more specific. I tried a random sampling of a few Ubuntu-derived distro, and I couldn't find one that didn't meet at least one of the GPL's 3 options:
- Xubuntu's download page has a "source" folder along with all the torrents
- MEPIS's store page has a "Need GPL source code but don't have an Internet connection?" link
- gNewSense seems to have *only* source code (SVN, etc.) on their software page
- Ichthux's download page says "1. Download Kubuntu" -- they're *just* a meta-package you install later

I've never used 'em, but gNewSense is based on some scripts that are supposed to let you roll your own Ubuntu Dapper variant. See: http://www.gnewsense.org/Builder/HowToCreateYourOw nGNULinuxDistribution

I've never used 'em, but gNewSense is based on some scripts that are supposed to let you roll your own Ubuntu Dapper variant. See: http://www.gnewsense.org/Builder/HowToCreateYourOw nGNULinuxDistribution

Not always with open source drivers, but it will be able to be Linux-compatible.

While the Dell/Ubuntu deal is definitely a major victory in the name of “Linux” and Open Source, the inclusion of proprietary drivers will still prevent many people who value freedom--including me--from purchasing one of these machines. I run gNewSense, which is a distribution of GNU+Linux based on Ubuntu, minus the proprietary components (drivers, firmware, etc.) When I can purchase a machine that doesn't force me to use proprietary software in order to use any piece of its hardware, then I'll make a purchase. Until then, as some may say, “Close, but no cigar.”

From yesterday's direct2dell blog post on the topic:

For device types where a choice exists between a component with a non-Free driver and one with Free driver availability, in our Linux offering we'll opt to bundle the component with the Free driver. Wireless network adapters is one such example; Printers are another. We recommend Linux users buy our printers which have PostScript engines in them, as opposed to those which don't and for which no Linux drivers are yet available. The Tech Specs tab for each printer on dell.com show if it has PostScript or not.

Some components, particularly some video cards, have working 2-D open source drivers, open source 3-D drivers actively being clean-room written by the community, and closed-source 3-D drivers available from the video card manufacturer. In these instances, while we continue to encourage the development (by all parties) towards open source drivers, we will provide the closed-source drivers for people who wish to use them.

The last category is devices for which no open source drivers are available at all, such as software-based modems. In our desktops these are add-in cards, so you can substitute a hardware-based modem available from your local electronics store quite easliy. However, we can't substitute hardware-based modems in our notebooks without redesigning and significantly increasing the price of the system. If it's important to you to have a hardware-based modem, you would add one into your PC Card or ExpressCard slot.

My bone of contention comes from several decisions Dell has made:

• Opting to go with ATI and NVIDIA instead of Intel for 3D graphics.
• Using softmodems that don't have free drivers in these machines. There are softmodems available that have free drivers. For the desktops, hardware modems could've been used “out of the box”. Dell still chose the proprietary softmodem route across the board. While it is true that I could purchase one of their desktops and replace the modem, I would still be giving my money to the manufacturer of the proprietary hardware. I simply won't do that.

On the bright side, however, Dell did state the following directly after explaining the three “categories” of drivers (emphasis mine):

Dell recognizes the importance of open source, GPL-licensed drivers which are maintained upstream in kernel.org. They allow users the widest choice of Linux distributions, effectively taking the specific hardware and distribution out of the decision-making process and let you focus on solving your business problems. We will work with our hardware partners to develop, test, and maintain Free drivers, and continue to make progress towards that goal for all drivers. Most drivers are in good shape now, but there's clearly longer-term work to be done. Work that we're doing now at the driver level will pave the way for more Linux offerings in the future. There's no way to please everyone, but I'll continue to shar

Personally, I'd rather have gNewSense pre-installed than Ubuntu. It has the benefits of Ubuntu (being derived from it) but it also has the benefit of being 100% free. Having gNewSense installed on Dell machines straight from Dell would show us that Dell is truly committed to our freedom. If gNewSense were the/a Dell-supported distribution, then that would ensure all of the drivers for any given installation would be free.

In any event, if Dell cooperates with the free software community by providing free drivers for all of the hardware for these "Linux" machines, then I will definitely be buying Dell in the future.

Except Debian has binary blobs by default too :)

gNewSense is a good example of a free GNU/Linux distro.

I use as few as possible (wifi and 3d accel is all). To the folks of ubuntu who are sad about their distro embracing the 3v1l, I'd like to point out that GNU/Linux is an open system. Go ahead and limit yourself. Please don't presume to limit others. However, IMO, ubuntu did break an implicit promise to its users. Gladly, I've always run Debian.

If anyone is interested in a distro that actively excludes proprietary stuff *for real*, have a look at http://www.gnewsense.org/. It's sponsored by the FSF. I haven't tried it, mind you, as it's (drumroll please)....based on ubuntu.

I sincerely wish for open spec 3d hardware and wifi drivers. I just don't have time to wait around for them (nor the ability to "support" their development).

FSF probably uses "gNewSense". It's posted all over their badvista.org site. According to it's site it's based on Ubuntu but has everything non-free removed.

I can understand your concern of running only Free software. But most people want to use software based on its utility rather for principles. If you want to use only free software then you may not be use official Firefox binary package which is non-free. You may have to use IceWeasel instead.

Ubuntu separates the components based on the repository they are stored. The main repository which is the core of Ubuntu used to contain only free software. Unfortunately now the main repository also contains packages that are not free. So it is difficult to segregate between free and non free softwares based on the repository. For those who like Ubuntu and want to use only free software gNewSense is the only choice available for them.

Pretty much. If you want a totally free (as in freedom) variation of Ubuntu, there's gNewSense.

Keep in mind that it does come with a price, though, since open-source GPU drivers are still lightyears behind IHV solutions, and limiting yourself to only Ogg media is also a pretty lofty prospect.

I have, and it was relatively easy. Of course, that's probably because I had a slipstreamed Windows CD (which isn't owned "out of the box"), and everything else on hand that I needed to install on CDs (programs) and a USB flash drive (drivers, downloadable programs, important documents).

On the flip side, what happens in Linux if the driver for my wireless card isn't in the distribution?

Maybe the ASUS WL-107g CardBus card will work for your needs. Newegg carries it for about $30 or so. I got one of these running on gNewSense GNU/Linux, a GNU/Linux distribution that places software freedom as a higher priority than trying to work with every device out there (and the concomitant need for distributing non-free software). To this end, they strip out non-free firmware and non-free drivers from their distribution. So, I can try running any device with that OS and know that if it works there it ought to work anywhere in freedom.

I've heard the D-Link DWL G122 USB wireless network adapter works with free software drivers and without any firmware, but I don't have one of them to test first hand.

I agree with you that we need an actively maintained list of makes and models of things to buy, not just chipset lists. Makes and models are what people can ask for by name in stores.

The campaign will organize supporters into effective and unusual actions drawing attention to this daylight theft of computer users' rights, aggregate news stories cutting through the Vista marketing propaganda, and provide a user-friendly gateway to the adoption of free software operating systems like gNewSense (http://www.gnewsense.org).

gNewSense is derived from Ubuntu, and thus has most of the same functionality. There are a number of differences though.
* Firmware removed from kernel in main*
* Restricted removed
* Ubuntu logos replaced
* Universe enabled by default
* emacs, bsdgames, nethack and build-essential part of the default install

The campaign will organize supporters into effective and unusual actions drawing attention to this daylight theft of computer users' rights, aggregate news stories cutting through the Vista marketing propaganda, and provide a user-friendly gateway to the adoption of free software operating systems like gNewSense (http://www.gnewsense.org).

gNewSense is derived from Ubuntu, and thus has most of the same functionality. There are a number of differences though.
* Firmware removed from kernel in main*
* Restricted removed
* Ubuntu logos replaced
* Universe enabled by default
* emacs, bsdgames, nethack and build-essential part of the default install

Tell that to gNewSense.