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They also built a tool

That's the problem. A lot of new programmers nowadays assume that if it's going to be a problem, some tool / IDE component / runtime checker / compiler error / etc. will catch it and not allow it to happen, or prevent the program from building at all automagicly.

Hell, I was in a Java II class about a year ago and one of the smartest students in the room asked about why their program was not working. (NULL pointer exception.) When I explained to him he needed to check for a NULL in an array (and allocate the object if found) before attempting to use it, he said: "Well if it's important, then the instructor will explain it." The only problem was that the instructor WAS trying to explain it, multiple times, and having no luck.

2) write document warning people, who ignored history..., of the dangers!!

Even worse is the fact that when the documentation DOES exist, it's rarely used. I remember a wine bug on Civilization 5 that turned out to be a bug in the game. Why? because the game was dependent on the fact that an NTFS filesystem would store it's directory listings alphabetically, without doing any checking to ensure the returned directory listing was alphabetized. The programmers assumed the OS was alphabetizing the list, but the TechNet docs say:

"The FindFirstFile function opens a search handle and returns information about the first file that the file system finds with a name that matches the specified pattern. This may or may not be the first file or directory that appears in a directory-listing application (such as the dir command) when given the same file name string pattern. This is because FindFirstFile does no sorting of the search results. For additional information, see FindNextFile."

Emphasis mine.

We don't even have the professionals reading the documentation of something so basic, and the tools are not going to detect this either. So that document warning of the dangers, is effectively useless. Like most history books :P
The reason I bring this up is to show it's not just a student problem, but rather a problem that affects the entire industry.

The takeaway? Having all of these tools is nice, but they should not be used as a crutch. Programmers should have enough knowledge about their chosen language to be able to use it relatively safely without being over-reliant on automated checking tools. Unfortunately, too many programmers nowadays out right depend on them being there, and have no idea what to do when they encounter something the automatic tools don't handle for them. Most of them barely know that the documentation even exists, and will only look at it as a last resort. Then you give them something that can be dangerous if misused, and you're surprised that shit hits the fan? You may as well give a three-year-old the keys to your car and let them out on the interstate, you'll get the same level of BS, and even worse consequences.

This problem can be fixed, but it requires that programmers take on MORE responsibility for their code. Not less by giving it to automagic tools that do things for them. (They need to be able to fail.)

If you check the file list on the update page you can see it's installing Flash player stuff without permission:

Cumulative Update for Windows 10: August 5, 2015
https://support.microsoft.com/...

There is one crucial feature that isn't covered perfectly: absolute compatibility with MS Office.

Even MS Office isn't absolutely compatible with MS Office.

Another big issue being talked over on Answer site, Gabe Aul and others have aknowledges it and working on it on their Triage teams. One Drive disables all being able to save to files, no permissions, all changed to read only. Cant open apps, says No permissions. http://answers.microsoft.com/e...

This is actually a mechanism called Windows Platform Binary Table (WPBT).

More information can be found in the Microsoft WPBT whitepaper:

"This paper describes the format of a Windows Platform Binary Table (WPBT). The WPBT is a fixed Advanced Configuration and Power Interface (ACPI) table that enables boot firmware to provide Windows with a platform binary that the operating system can execute. The binary handoff medium is physical memory, allowing the boot firmware to provide the platform binary without modifying the Windows image on disk. In the initial version, the WPBT simply contains a physical address pointer to a flat, Portable Executable (PE) image that has been copied to physical memory. The WPBT is extensible, allowing the layout of published platform binaries to be more complex in future versions and allowing the support of more than one binary type.

It is expected that the binary pointed to by the WPBT is part of the boot firmware ROM image. The binary can be shadowed to physical memory as part of the initial bootstrap of the boot firmware, or it can be loaded into physical memory by extensible boot firmware code prior to executing any operating system code. A boot firmware component would create the WPBT based on the location of the platform binary. During operating system initialization, Windows will read the WPBT to obtain the physical memory location of the platform binary. In the first version, the binary is required to be a native, user-mode application that is executed by the Windows Session Manager during operating system initialization. Windows will write the flat image to disk, and the Session Manager will launch the process. Windows may reclaim the physical memory described in the WPBT.

If Windows observes a WPBT during operating system initialization, it will attempt to use an ACPI control method to communicate binary execution status back to the platform."

http://answers.microsoft.com/e...

The problem was reported Aug 5, and it's gotten worse as on even date, with another patch creating more problems succeeding it.

Where did you get your 'fixed in 24 hours' story from, bro?

You mean the track record of not being significantly broken into since Windows 7?

Unless you count a remote code execution exploit that was patched last month. Seriously, if you think Windows is secure, you just haven't been paying attention to the vulnerabilities. They're doing better than the days of Nimda and Code Red, but that's not saying much.

The paper is a bit confusing at first, and the /. summary doesn't help. Basically, they developed a sorting criteria to reduce the amount of work for the editors. In an isolated comparison of two jokes, the funnier joke wins 64% of them on average; this is quite better than a coin!

To get a sorted list, they run a "comparison tournament" between the jokes. The 55.8% number means that the funniest joke is in the top 55.8% of the list on average; if we are willing to occasionally miss a brilliant joke, we can cut the list in a little more than half and still keep most of the great jokes.

The full paper is http://research.microsoft.com/...

I am not sure if this helps:
https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-...

Autoruns is the tool you need.

https://technet.microsoft.com/...

You're right, for setting environment variables permanently you use setx instead. http://ss64.com/nt/setx.html

I learned the DOS command line well in the early nineties, and a surprising amount has stuck with me. I use Windows 10 at work, admin Hyper-V and Linux servers there and run Linux at home 99% of the time. This kind of review looks exactly what I'm looking for but really, since I do much of my work from the command line in both environments, I'm surprised the GUI gets so much focus. It just seems like the hard way most of the time to me.

The first thing I usually do on a Windows machine is pin cmd to the task bar, and from there, right click and run as administrator. I have a c:\bin folder where I stick all the PsTools, Sysinternals, putty/kitty and unix utils tools I need, so I usually

setx PATH "%PATH%;C:\bin\;C:\bin\usr\local\wbin\"

and then custom create a bat file or two to point to my cloud stored resources. All that works on Windows XP - Windows 10 without any special effort.

I started using Windows 10 shortly after it first came out for Windows Insiders. I noticed that some of our proprietary business software doesn't work, but it still doesn't work on Windows 8 either, so that's hardly a surprise. All my command line stuff seems to work without any effort and nearly all my normal software works, the exception being Outlook's search which seems to have been broken in 8 too. (My setup is abnormal enough that I'm not really surprised, just frustrated.) The RSAT took a couple tries to get running, but was working.... until I did a clean install of Win 10 with the official release and now can't get it to work for love or money. (Apparently that's coming out in the next couple weeks and the stuff I was using in Beta won't install in the released version.) Also the Hyper-V manager seems to have a problem with one of our servers now, but I suspect that's a problem on that server rather than with the tool. We don't reboot those things very often, so I'm optimistic the next reboot of that server will resolve the issue.

What I do like in Windows 10 is the improved command line defaults. I didn't really need it, but I like the color options making it easier to spot which command line I'm after and default equivalent to Quick Edit settings so I don't have to remember to do it myself. I'm still getting used to being able to use Ctrl+C on it. I also like the improved snap window (Windows + arrow key) settings, being able to use quarter screens easily and the prompts to choose second windows is quite nice.

I enabled Cortana and the search function improved. I expected to hate it since I only use the search for finding things already on my local computer, but that improved too. I'm not sure I like sharing everything with Microsoft but I share so much already, I'm willing to live with it in exchange for better search responses for now.

You're right, for setting environment variables permanently you use setx instead. http://ss64.com/nt/setx.html

I learned the DOS command line well in the early nineties, and a surprising amount has stuck with me. I use Windows 10 at work, admin Hyper-V and Linux servers there and run Linux at home 99% of the time. This kind of review looks exactly what I'm looking for but really, since I do much of my work from the command line in both environments, I'm surprised the GUI gets so much focus. It just seems like the hard way most of the time to me.

The first thing I usually do on a Windows machine is pin cmd to the task bar, and from there, right click and run as administrator. I have a c:\bin folder where I stick all the PsTools, Sysinternals, putty/kitty and unix utils tools I need, so I usually

setx PATH "%PATH%;C:\bin\;C:\bin\usr\local\wbin\"

and then custom create a bat file or two to point to my cloud stored resources. All that works on Windows XP - Windows 10 without any special effort.

I started using Windows 10 shortly after it first came out for Windows Insiders. I noticed that some of our proprietary business software doesn't work, but it still doesn't work on Windows 8 either, so that's hardly a surprise. All my command line stuff seems to work without any effort and nearly all my normal software works, the exception being Outlook's search which seems to have been broken in 8 too. (My setup is abnormal enough that I'm not really surprised, just frustrated.) The RSAT took a couple tries to get running, but was working.... until I did a clean install of Win 10 with the official release and now can't get it to work for love or money. (Apparently that's coming out in the next couple weeks and the stuff I was using in Beta won't install in the released version.) Also the Hyper-V manager seems to have a problem with one of our servers now, but I suspect that's a problem on that server rather than with the tool. We don't reboot those things very often, so I'm optimistic the next reboot of that server will resolve the issue.

What I do like in Windows 10 is the improved command line defaults. I didn't really need it, but I like the color options making it easier to spot which command line I'm after and default equivalent to Quick Edit settings so I don't have to remember to do it myself. I'm still getting used to being able to use Ctrl+C on it. I also like the improved snap window (Windows + arrow key) settings, being able to use quarter screens easily and the prompts to choose second windows is quite nice.

I enabled Cortana and the search function improved. I expected to hate it since I only use the search for finding things already on my local computer, but that improved too. I'm not sure I like sharing everything with Microsoft but I share so much already, I'm willing to live with it in exchange for better search responses for now.

Microsoft is using its own version of P2P that is much like bittorrent, but apparently not actually bittorent. I am quite interested in learning more about it, but all I've been able to find so far is that it is likely based on Avalanche.

MS already did. https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-...

Stand up 2 WSUS servers, one on a connected network, one on the disconnected network. Download all products and classifications that you need on the connected one, sneakernet them over to the disconnected one and import them. https://technet.microsoft.com/... If you're going to need to patch custom applications, then you're going to need to look into something like Configuration Manager with SCUP if you want to have compliance data for the installation, otherwise you can just create a software distribution package.

Windows XP without UDF write support was still in "extended support" (that is, eligible for security updates).

Note security updates, not feature updates, yet it got the exFAT feature update anyway. It could have just as easily got write support for UDF as for exFAT.

In addition, operating systems still disagreed on whether or not UDF on a non-optical storage medium required a partition table.

Yes, but ultimately that doesn't matter, because you can set up a disk that works on OSX and Windows (naturally Linux supports every conceivable variant already):

http://answers.microsoft.com/e...

The thing is:
1. UDF already existed.
2. UDF is standardised.
3. UDF support was better than exFAT at the time exFAT was chosen
4. It's basically impossible to find a PC in any kind of use that wasn't at least able to support UDF reading.
5. UDF has better features than exFAT
5. Microsoft doesn't get to cream off money due to dubious patents while making life hard for open source operating systems.

Spot the odd one out.

But seriously, UDF already fills the role perfectly.

Except for lack of support on devices other than desktop and laptop computers. If it is mandatory for SDXC certified devices to use exFAT, a lot of lazy device makers won't test anything else. Besides, some operating systems recognize UDF only on a drive that has a partition table, others only without a partition table. (Source)

there is simply no excuse for an arbitrary limit on the number of items in your start menu

Back in the day, the start menu was just a "blessed" folder structure under your user account folder, merged with a similar "blessed" folder hierarchy under the public folder.

NTFS limits folders to 2^32-1 items.
FAT32 limits folders to 64k items.
FAT16 (a.k.a. "FAT") limits folders to 512 items.

So you've always had some kind of limit on what your start menu would show, it just depended on your file system. (To be fair, 2^32-1 barely qualifies as a limit in this context.)

Now, the user-customizable parts of the start menu are probably stored in the registry. The registry has its own limits, outlined here. That MSDN page doesn't say if there's a limit to the number of keys in a single registry node, but it wouldn't surprise me if it's 512. If that's the case, the "simple fix" you speak of is probably something along the lines of adding sibling nodes to the parent node, each with an additional 512 keys, then merging them all into the menu at presentation time. That's not simple.

What sort of morons put an arbitrary limit on the number of items your menu has?

Apparently there is a fix in the pipeline, but it's a bit stupid to have released this with a known issue that should be a simple fix. In this day and age, there is simply no excuse for an arbitrary limit on the number of items in your start menu. I easily have 1500 unique items (Microsoft being one of the worst offenders of dumping lots of useless entries into my start menu) in my Start Menu->Programs folders, so it's likely something important will be displaced by some application's web URL or an uninstall link.

All-in-all, a good day for free software, and a bad day for Microsoft.

Not to rain on your parade.

But LibreOffice remains nothing more than the generic stand-alone office suite of the nineties --- and conspicuously absent is a credible, full-featured, open source alternative to Outlook.

Microsoft positions MS Office ---- very successfully ---- as simply one component of an integrated office system that scales to an enterprise of any size.

Office 365 for Healthcare

Not to rain on your parade, but LibreOffice/OpenOffice can do everything that MS Office does and more.

For instance, with scripting - MS Office is limited to VBScript; sure you can extend with custom libraries but that's really about it. LibreOffice/OpenOffice support many scripting languages (Python, JavaScript, BasicScript - derived from VBScript - just to name a few) in addition to adding custom libraries that any of those languages can load.

Document support? LibreOffice/OpenOffice supports Microsoft's formats typically better than Microsoft does, especially with respect to compatibility with older versions of MS Office. Not to mention the multitude of productivity suites that use the ODF format (AOO, LO, Calligra, GNOME Office products (AbiWord, et al, Google Docs, etc).

All-in-all, a good day for free software, and a bad day for Microsoft.

Not to rain on your parade.

But LibreOffice remains nothing more than the generic stand-alone office suite of the nineties --- and conspicuously absent is a credible, full-featured, open source alternative to Outlook.

Microsoft positions MS Office ---- very successfully ---- as simply one component of an integrated office system that scales to an enterprise of any size.

Office 365 for Healthcare

Good morning, and thank you for the advertisement. LibreOffice does not need its own email server because there's already free software that accomplishes that perfectly fine. As an office suite, LO is a perfectly suitable replacement for MS Office. If you think otherwise, then tell me about how all of these organizations are getting along: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... (N.B. the Chinese government is on this list, although they use WPS Office instead of LibreOffice. But none of them use MS Office!)

All-in-all, a good day for free software, and a bad day for Microsoft.

Not to rain on your parade.

But LibreOffice remains nothing more than the generic stand-alone office suite of the nineties --- and conspicuously absent is a credible, full-featured, open source alternative to Outlook.

Microsoft positions MS Office ---- very successfully ---- as simply one component of an integrated office system that scales to an enterprise of any size.

Office 365 for Healthcare

I think this is the actual publication.

They're using ring learning with errors.

Are they going with something lattice based?

Hm.. An internet search finds this one: http://research.microsoft.com/...
The headline is "Post-quantum key exchange for the TLS protocol from the ring learning with errors problem", so it doesn't seem to have strictly to do with a lattice-based problem if it's the algorithm that was meant in the article above.
And this is an explanation: http://csrc.nist.gov/groups/ST...

I haven't understood the problem that deeply but when I do I will post it here.

Of course this may not really be a Windows 10-specific issue since they slipped a "Diagnostic Tracking Service" into previous versions (such as Win7) through Windows Update earlier this year.

According to this, that particular update was 3068708, which is "recommended" and thus (as far as I can tell) not automatically installed under default settings.

(Note: please correct me if I'm wrong! Also, feel free to list any other malicious updates which should be avoided, or other strategies to harden Windows 7 against Microsoft snooping. I just reinstalled and would like to make sure I get all that stuff right before I start using sensitive data.)

Of course this may not really be a Windows 10-specific issue since they slipped a "Diagnostic Tracking Service" into previous versions (such as Win7) through Windows Update earlier this year.

According to this, that particular update was 3068708, which is "recommended" and thus (as far as I can tell) not automatically installed under default settings.

(Note: please correct me if I'm wrong! Also, feel free to list any other malicious updates which should be avoided, or other strategies to harden Windows 7 against Microsoft snooping. I just reinstalled and would like to make sure I get all that stuff right before I start using sensitive data.)

I know that adding the system tray ad was KB3035583, was this the KB which added the extra new services? If not, could you post the KB or KB's which you found were not desirable.

Not original poster but:

"After you uninstall KB3021917 [microsoft.com], KB3035583 [microsoft.com] and KB3022345 [microsoft.com], you also need to disable two tasks in Task Scheduler.

There are two tasks under TaskScheduler > Task Scheduler Library > Microsoft > Windows > Application Experience, "Microsoft Compatibility Appraiser" and "ProgramDataUpdater", that will continue to contact telemetry servers even if telemetry is disabled. These tasks run and phone home even if CEIP is opted-out of. Reproduce (on Win7 Pro) by:

1) Opt out of CEIP.
2) Remove patches 3021917, 3035583, and 3022345.
3) Set up your IDS to block/report rundll32.exe overnight, and observe logs.
4) Wait a day or two. You will see (failed, if you've blocked rundll32.exe from talking to the interwebs) DNS lookups to settings.data.microsoft.com and telecommand.telemetry.microsoft.com in both the IDS and in the Event Log.

The two scheduled tasks will continue phone home even if the above mentioned patches are uninstalled. You must manually disable the tasks "Microsoft Compatibility Appraiser" and "ProgramDataUpdater" in order to stop the phoning-home behavior."

Source: http://tech.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=7491583&cid=49814749

I know that adding the system tray ad was KB3035583, was this the KB which added the extra new services? If not, could you post the KB or KB's which you found were not desirable.

Not original poster but:

"After you uninstall KB3021917 [microsoft.com], KB3035583 [microsoft.com] and KB3022345 [microsoft.com], you also need to disable two tasks in Task Scheduler.

There are two tasks under TaskScheduler > Task Scheduler Library > Microsoft > Windows > Application Experience, "Microsoft Compatibility Appraiser" and "ProgramDataUpdater", that will continue to contact telemetry servers even if telemetry is disabled. These tasks run and phone home even if CEIP is opted-out of. Reproduce (on Win7 Pro) by:

1) Opt out of CEIP.
2) Remove patches 3021917, 3035583, and 3022345.
3) Set up your IDS to block/report rundll32.exe overnight, and observe logs.
4) Wait a day or two. You will see (failed, if you've blocked rundll32.exe from talking to the interwebs) DNS lookups to settings.data.microsoft.com and telecommand.telemetry.microsoft.com in both the IDS and in the Event Log.

The two scheduled tasks will continue phone home even if the above mentioned patches are uninstalled. You must manually disable the tasks "Microsoft Compatibility Appraiser" and "ProgramDataUpdater" in order to stop the phoning-home behavior."

Source: http://tech.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=7491583&cid=49814749

I know that adding the system tray ad was KB3035583, was this the KB which added the extra new services? If not, could you post the KB or KB's which you found were not desirable.

Not original poster but:

"After you uninstall KB3021917 [microsoft.com], KB3035583 [microsoft.com] and KB3022345 [microsoft.com], you also need to disable two tasks in Task Scheduler.

There are two tasks under TaskScheduler > Task Scheduler Library > Microsoft > Windows > Application Experience, "Microsoft Compatibility Appraiser" and "ProgramDataUpdater", that will continue to contact telemetry servers even if telemetry is disabled. These tasks run and phone home even if CEIP is opted-out of. Reproduce (on Win7 Pro) by:

1) Opt out of CEIP.
2) Remove patches 3021917, 3035583, and 3022345.
3) Set up your IDS to block/report rundll32.exe overnight, and observe logs.
4) Wait a day or two. You will see (failed, if you've blocked rundll32.exe from talking to the interwebs) DNS lookups to settings.data.microsoft.com and telecommand.telemetry.microsoft.com in both the IDS and in the Event Log.

The two scheduled tasks will continue phone home even if the above mentioned patches are uninstalled. You must manually disable the tasks "Microsoft Compatibility Appraiser" and "ProgramDataUpdater" in order to stop the phoning-home behavior."

Source: http://tech.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=7491583&cid=49814749

I hope that what you're missing is the businesses that supply professional laptops will continue to offer them with Windows 7 and no junkware for the foreseeable future.

I don't see how they can continue to do that lawfully. From Windows lifecycle fact sheet: "End of sales for PCs with Windows preinstalled [...] Windows 7 [...] October 31, 2014"

Check here: http://www.microsoft.com/en-us...

This means you can use older AMD but not old Intel 64-bit CPUs.

There could be less demand, If we really had a good handle on the limited time to upgrade for free window.

We have a good handle, it's one year. From their webpage

Is the upgrade really free?
Yes, it’s free. This is a full version of Windows, not a trial or introductory version. It is available for a limited time: you have until July 29, 2016 to take advantage of this offer. Once you upgrade, you’ll have Windows 10 for free on that device.

I think Microsoft is trying to drum up business by pushing it through WU, have the concept of "reserving" your free upgrade that you have a year to claim.

Just like they did when Windows 7 came out, they want to be able to have numbers that say "Look at how many people upgraded in the first 2 months. This is the most of any version of Windows ever!"

Myself I'm playing with it in a VM, but will probably wait a couple months before upgrading my main OS.

I'd go as far as saying it was KB3035583.

Just looked at the update description, it's since changed; it used to read "it was to allow for an easier upgrade to windows 10" nothing else just that.
Updated update https://support.microsoft.com/...

You can download it here whenever you like.

Good analysis yodleboy. I did an install last night as well. (Just grabbed the install tool (U.S.) - https://www.microsoft.com/en-u... and kicked the process off immediately...hadn't signed up for the upgrade...did have to right click and run the tool as Administrator - was getting the "Something Happened error..which is classic)

If you go with the defaults on install it seems like everything you do on your machine goes to Microsoft for various purposes (the NSA after loosing the always on audio/video recording by default from the Xbone) must be licking their chops - but, (they still have this at this point) if you change the install defaults you can opt out of virtually all the garbage going to Microsoft / NSA's logging service. Doesn't seem any slower than 7. Frankly I find the UI design to be awful (just pull that calculator up as an example), its still 8's UI design but you don't have two different schizophrenic desktops / settings etc. - but that's a personal preference. I'll play with it for a while, then image it and store it if I ever want to use it again. Not an improvement over 7 at all (you have significantly less freedom as a user over updates etc. and of course its ugly, IMHO) but better than 8 / 8.1 if you're stuck with those and don't like tile world.

Here we go:

http://windows.microsoft.com/e...

Lets do a little walking here:

----
Data We Collect

Microsoft collects many kinds of information in a variety of ways to operate effectively and provide you the best products, services and experiences. We may combine this data with information that is linked to your user ID, such as information associated with your Microsoft account.

When you acquire, install and use the Program software and services, Microsoft collects information about your use of the software and services as well as about the devices and networks on which they operate. Examples of data we may collect include your name, email address, preferences and interests; location, browsing, search and file history; phone call and SMS data; device configuration and sensor data; voice, text and writing input; and application usage.
----

Is literally anyone here ok with this? "name, location, every file you access, every search you do, every call you make, every text you send, everything you say, anything you type into any application, and every executable you run, correlated with your MAC address, IP address, and timestamp".

That's LUDICROUS. Am I missing something here? Who cares about a wifi password that you have to opt into, when sharing EVERYTHING YOU EVER DO AT ANY TIME IN MELEE OR DETECTION RANGE OF YOUR COMPUTER, is something you just legally agreed to share with Microsoft?

It then gives examples, right below, that make it sound like this is about performance monitoring. But those are examples, not what you just agreed to share.

Am I missing something? Shouldn't this be the story?

You mean Ballmer? I doubt he would understand. And someone who writes letters like this certainly wouldn't.

Thanks for posting a link to that barf bag inducing ramble of corporate speak spew. It was a revelation considering it came just before the big ax in Redmond last year! These guys just don't get it, if you are going to get out the knife and do major cutting then tell the employees the friggin' truth you jack ass. As you can see from the latest bottom line figures the temporary boost in revenue created by the ax job was considerable and I am sure Elop is getting his blood money as is the entire crowd that Ballmer brought in to do the dirty work.

The Walmart Nation inspired corporate greed of these so called execs is astounding. They won't be satisfied until they can use slave labor to produce products. The down side is even though the economy looks like it is rebounding because of corporate cuts the actual level of poverty in cities is increasing. Real inflation has again started to run amok because of these assholes and the average wage slave is much worse off. The plastic debt load and rabid consumerism which these people pander to and rely upon is going to kill us. We are living in a false economy and the next crash is going to be a doozy to say the least it will make 2008 look like the good times. China is just figuring this problem out and within a year it is going to be in free fall.

I fully understand why Windows 10 is free, even if only 20% of the suckers that "upgrade" for free use the new "Microsoft Store" and actually use the Microsoft cloud to sync devices, the coding labor force and salaries can be cut even more in Redmond. All this while Microsoft tries to pull a Walmart style race to the bottom by cutting labor costs at the same time that they claim that there is a shortage of trained workers. It is about the same as New York dumping garbage in the sea or like in Canada where we now export raw logs more than we produce product. Sooner or later taking the easy way out will come back to bite corporate America and Microsoft is now as caught up in the race to the bottom as is the auto industry!

We are going to pay heavily for the throw away society we are creating and the first casualty is going to be the work force.[crystal_balls] Windows and Microsoft will eventually fail because it is rapidly beginning to fail at creating equitable employment the same as what is happening with many over blown major corporations[/crystal_balls]

to the update not being required to install right at this instant and they need the bandwidth for something else (hello 300mb "ms word 2010 help file" update) due to being in a low connectivity area.

Then you should let Windows know that a particular SSID is "a low connectivity area". See Microsoft's page about Windows 8 and metered connections. The page states that when only a metered connection is available, "Windows Update will only download priority updates."

I don't have Windows 8 or 10 in front of me as I type this, but the steps to mark a connection as metered in Android 5 are as follows: In Settings > Wireless & networks > Data usage, open the overflow menu and choose Network restrictions. It gives you a list of all the SSIDs you've seen, with a checkbox to mark each as metered. The notice at the bottom states: "Metered networks are treated like cellular when background data is restricted. Apps may warn before using these networks for large downloads."

Don't try to upgrade from Windows Update. Just don't. It'll fail. Something is borked with the download process. It'll probably be fixed in a week (or even today, maybe), but for now, to be on the safe side,

...don't bother, unless your time is worthless to you.

just go to this link - https://www.microsoft.com/en-u... [microsoft.com] and download the ISO. Then burn it to a DVD or install it onto a USB drive of sufficient capacity, and away you go. Not sure if it would work if you mounted it to a virtual drive, but worth a try.

If you do that, the first thing it does is ask for an activation key. Your windows activation key from your original Windows media is likely to not be accepted. My 8.0 key wasn't.

Although, there is one really interesting thing you can do. Instead of creating an install ISO, take the option to just upgrade straight. Do this from a non-admin account (you know, the way you are supposed to run things for system safety). This will produce what is being argued to be the most amusing error dialog in human history, which reads in big letters "Something Happened", and then under that in smaller letters the clarification: "Something Happened". Years from now, you can tell your grandchildren you personally got this dialog.

But if you aren't aching to participate in the meme, save yourself some aggravation and wait until MS gets their act together.

You mean Ballmer? I doubt he would understand. And someone who writes letters like this certainly wouldn't.

Don't try to upgrade from Windows Update. Just don't. It'll fail. Something is borked with the download process. It'll probably be fixed in a week (or even today, maybe), but for now, to be on the safe side, just go to this link - https://www.microsoft.com/en-u... and download the ISO. Then burn it to a DVD or install it onto a USB drive of sufficient capacity, and away you go. Not sure if it would work if you mounted it to a virtual drive, but worth a try.

I updated 3 systems (a 3 year old desktop, a 2 year old laptop with hybrid graphics, and a virtual machine in VMware on a 4 year old craptop) and did not have any upgrade issues. The only problem I had was on my desktop, where I would occasionally get a MEMORY_MANAGEMENT BSOD when viewing the start menu, until I updated my AMD Catalyst drivers to the latest on the AMD site.

Some more pitfalls:

  - If you have exotic or rare network cards, graphics cards or printers, you may want to hold off to see if people with your hardware have similar problems.

  - Is your GPU (graphics card, whether it's on the CPU, on the motherboard, or an expansion card) *more than* 4 years old? If so, you may have some problems, especially if it's by Intel.

  - Do you have any programs installed which install custom software into the OS kernel ("kernel modules" / "drivers")? Things like: virtualization software (VMware, Virtual Box), VPN software (OpenVPN, SSL VPN clients, etc.), certain audio / video production software, etc? If you see anything in Device Manager that isn't actually a piece of hardware and sounds like it's associated with a program you have, chances are good that the answer is "yes". You should really consider uninstalling these programs before you upgrade to reduce the potential for incompatibility in the kernel. Then you can try to install them after the upgrade is complete, where the driver will hopefully fail to load "gracefully" and error out of the installer if it turns out to be incompatible.

  - Is your system *extremely* "hacked up", with extensive deep-running customizations to the UI, .NET framework, kernel, or other things like that? You should probably not attempt an upgrade, especially if the vendor/developer of these changes is not a well-known commercial entity with an established footprint.

Summary: If you have a computer that was purchased new with current-gen hardware within the past 4 years, and you don't have anything more than web browsers, office programs, and games installed, you should have no problems upgrading. If you have a much older computer, your risk of breakage is higher. If you have deep customizations to the OS, your risk of breakage is higher. If you're in doubt, hold off until others with similar configurations try it first and report their results. But for the love of God, use the ISO, not Windows Update, to upgrade.

This scares the shit out of me, a guy with almost 30 years of programming experience. What the hell is Grampa supposed to do?

Well, not me, I mean my grandpa. My proverbial grandpa, my real ones died before I was born. My in-law, let's say, or dad. Ok most of them are dead, too, and I guess I am the patriarch of my family now.

Ok, grampa and expert computer programmer are merged now. I do not want to burn CDs, or type on command lines, or go get drivers myself for freaking major party 3d cards. If I don't wanna deal, what is grandp...nevermind.

Don't try to upgrade from Windows Update. Just don't. It'll fail. Something is borked with the download process. It'll probably be fixed in a week (or even today, maybe), but for now, to be on the safe side, just go to this link - https://www.microsoft.com/en-u... and download the ISO. Then burn it to a DVD or install it onto a USB drive of sufficient capacity, and away you go. Not sure if it would work if you mounted it to a virtual drive, but worth a try.

I updated 3 systems (a 3 year old desktop, a 2 year old laptop with hybrid graphics, and a virtual machine in VMware on a 4 year old craptop) and did not have any upgrade issues. The only problem I had was on my desktop, where I would occasionally get a MEMORY_MANAGEMENT BSOD when viewing the start menu, until I updated my AMD Catalyst drivers to the latest on the AMD site.

Some more pitfalls:

  - If you have exotic or rare network cards, graphics cards or printers, you may want to hold off to see if people with your hardware have similar problems.
  - Is your GPU (graphics card, whether it's on the CPU, on the motherboard, or an expansion card) *more than* 4 years old? If so, you may have some problems, especially if it's by Intel.
  - Do you have any programs installed which install custom software into the OS kernel ("kernel modules" / "drivers")? Things like: virtualization software (VMware, Virtual Box), VPN software (OpenVPN, SSL VPN clients, etc.), certain audio / video production software, etc? If you see anything in Device Manager that isn't actually a piece of hardware and sounds like it's associated with a program you have, chances are good that the answer is "yes". You should really consider uninstalling these programs before you upgrade to reduce the potential for incompatibility in the kernel. Then you can try to install them after the upgrade is complete, where the driver will hopefully fail to load "gracefully" and error out of the installer if it turns out to be incompatible.
  - Is your system *extremely* "hacked up", with extensive deep-running customizations to the UI, .NET framework, kernel, or other things like that? You should probably not attempt an upgrade, especially if the vendor/developer of these changes is not a well-known commercial entity with an established footprint.

Summary: If you have a computer that was purchased new with current-gen hardware within the past 4 years, and you don't have anything more than web browsers, office programs, and games installed, you should have no problems upgrading. If you have a much older computer, your risk of breakage is higher. If you have deep customizations to the OS, your risk of breakage is higher. If you're in doubt, hold off until others with similar configurations try it first and report their results. But for the love of God, use the ISO, not Windows Update, to upgrade.

Where do you get this information. If you install it within the first year it's free for the life of the device:
http://www.microsoft.com/en-US...

According to https://www.microsoft.com/en-u... which is on Microsoft's site,

Can I go back to my previous version of Windows if I don't like Windows 10?

Yes, while we think you will love all the features of Windows 10, you will have one month after upgrading to revert back to the previous version of Windows on your device.

Back in the real world, this is probably the first time Microsoft released a new version of Windows and no-one really cared. All the interesting new technology is elsewhere.

Of course, if (and that's a big if) Microsoft can get Hololens to work well, they pretty much have a killer application at their hands. Imagine mechanics seeing the schematics projected into whatever they're maintaining, builders seeing the outline of whatever they're building, maintenance workers seeing the outline of wires inside the wall, industrial workers seeing nearby pipes color-coded for the substance flowing through them, drivers seeing cars with high collision probability highlighted...

The real money is not in shiny desktop OS's, or even mobile, but in making a million everyday tasks slightly more efficient - injecting just the right amount of information at the right time and the right place to eliminate the stall as people check things out.

A friend of mine said that W10 will remove apps that are not "W10 compatible". I thought this was an exaggeration but according to http://www.microsoft.com/en-us... it may:

If your antimalware subscription is not current (expired), Windows will uninstall your application and enable Windows Defender.

Some applications that came from your OEM may be removed prior to upgrade.

For certain third party applications, the Get Windows 10 app will scan for application compatibility. If there is a known issue that will prevent the upgrade, you will be notified of the list of applications with known issues. You can choose to accept and the applications will be removed from the system prior to upgrade. Please be sure to copy the list before you accept the removal of the application.

Normally, I'm not overly paranoid, but that last paragraph is a bit troublesome. Is there a list of such incompatible apps? Even though the get W10 app is supposed to flag them ahead of time, I'd be more comforted if there was also a list [that also explained why], in addition to [and before] having to run the probe app.

For example, I've got 5+ years of TurboTax. Each [year's] version does its own update when you invoke it. You need to keep all versions around [just in case you need to look at an older tax form you filed]. If the oldest version was not W10 compatible, would you need to invoke it (under Win7/Win8) to get it to update/upgrade before installing W10?

What about self updating apps in general? Adobe Acrobat Reader and Flash, as well as [yecch] Java come to mind. Or, Firefox, cygwin, vlc, handbrake?

The Windows key is pretty damned useful in day-to-day activities: (Not sure which are Windows 8 or newer, but many were in 7 as well )
I for one make use of:

Windows - LEFT, Windows - RIGHT : Snap half-screen left / Move to next Monitor;
Windows - UP, Windows DOWN : Maximize, Minimize
Windows SHIFT UP, Win-Shift-Down : Maximize/Restore Vertical only. (Width stays the same, only window height maximizes/restores)
Windows - Print Screen: Screenshot and save to file
Windows - X : Power Menu (Admin Command Promt, Control Panel, Shutdown/Hibernate/Sleep, etc)
Windows : Windows 8 Screen (Start typing to search for application to run)
Windows - L : Lock Screen (I use this at work, not at home)
Windows - P : Second Monitor Mode (Duplicate, Mirror, Laptop Only, Second Monitor Only)
Windows - D : Show Desktop (Minimize All) / If you don't need to open a new app, a second press will undo the minimize all
Windows - SPACE : Keyboard Language Selector (Probably not useful for americans); I use it for Intl Dvorak, US English, JP IME
    Windows - / : IME Recovert (Good for ZH, JP, KR)
Windows - E : New File Explorer Window
Windows - R : [ No longer useful - Open RUN box; Windows-SPACE has fully replaced this by allowing full text-search of all installed applications]
Windows - PAUSE : Bring up System Properties Screen (usually for debugging hardware issues, or seeing stats)
Windows - 1, 2, 3, 4 : (effectively click) Open/Switch to application pinned on task bar at position 1, 2, 3, 4...
Windows Shift - 1, 2, 3, 4: (effective shift-click) New instance of pinned task-bar application at specificed location
          [ These two I only use Windows 2, to open my IDE; pretty much everything else I just use Windows + (start typing app name) ]
Windows - Alt - Enter : Open Windows Media Center

Alt-Tab : Cycle through open windows
AltGr-Tab : Use keyboard to cycle through all windows in pop-up window; enter to actually switch. (Apparently, americans can use Ctrl-Alt-Tab for this)

  And there are many more Windows-Key shortcuts that I don't use; or probably don't even know about.

Full list of short-cuts apparently at : http://windows.microsoft.com/e...

In my opinion, Microsoft is an extremely badly managed and abusive company. I see these issues as supporting that widely shared opinion:

One effect of "upgrading" to Windows 10: Windows Media Center will be deleted. Microsoft is also apparently trying to kill Windows Media Center software in other versions of Windows, without notice, by stopping providing the TV program schedule (EPG, Electronic Program Guide). That affects hundreds of thousands of users. The issue is not who uses Windows Media Center. The issue is that apparently Microsoft is operating in a sneaky fashion that is extremely anti-customer, and that shows Microsoft is trying to take even more control over its users.

Microsoft and thousands of customers are blaming Rovi. Notice, for example, how many times Rovi is mentioned on this Microsoft web page:
https://connect.microsoft.com/site1145/Feedback

This Microsoft web pages says the TV Guide has been "Updated":
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/3078428,
but many Windows Media Center users no longer have a TV schedule, making Windows Media Center worthless because it is very difficult to record without the schedule.

Microsoft is apparently deliberately destroying Windows Media Center, and letting Rovi take the blame. For example, a new installation of Windows Media Center on a fully updated Windows 7 Ultimate computer has several flaws, not just the lack of a TV program guide.

Another loss in Windows 10: Windows Updates will be forced, in some versions. Will there be other lost features, now or later? Will Microsoft extend its control over Windows in other hidden or complicated ways? Online comments say that Microsoft will try to move Windows to a model that requires monthly payments. The issue is not whether technically-knowledgeable users will be able to stop forced updates; the issue is that most people won't know how to regain control over their systems. That control is important because often Microsoft has issued poorly designed updates that have caused problems on user's systems. See this Slashdot story, for example, Windows 10's Automatic Updates For NVidia Drivers Causing Trouble.

More about Microsoft releasing buggy software: The Slashdot story, Windows 10 Launches, says Windows 10 is "buggier than Windows 8.1, 8, 7, or Vista were on their respective launch days" and "During my testing on a variety of hardware, I've run into a lot of bugs and issues -- even with the version that will be released to consumers on launch day".

(At present, the best way to update Windows 7 is to use Autopatcher, because Microsoft's anti-customer "updates" are avoided.)

Firefox: Embraced, "Extended", soon to be Extinguished? Mozilla Foundation now gets most of its money from Microsoft. Microsoft pays Yahoo. Yahoo pays Mozilla Foundation to make "Yahoo search" (actually Microsoft Bing search) the default search engine in Firefox. Most people don't have the technical knowledge to know how they've been manipulated, or how to restore the default search engine to Google search.

Thunderbird and SeaMonkey Composer GUIs: Damaged, apparently deliberately. Every time you do a file save, the newer versions of both ask for a new file name, and don't suggest the last one chosen. The damage was reported several months ago, but has not been fixed. Is t

In my opinion, Microsoft is an extremely badly managed and abusive company. I see these issues as supporting that widely shared opinion:

One effect of "upgrading" to Windows 10: Windows Media Center will be deleted. Microsoft is also apparently trying to kill Windows Media Center software in other versions of Windows, without notice, by stopping providing the TV program schedule (EPG, Electronic Program Guide). That affects hundreds of thousands of users. The issue is not who uses Windows Media Center. The issue is that apparently Microsoft is operating in a sneaky fashion that is extremely anti-customer, and that shows Microsoft is trying to take even more control over its users.

Microsoft and thousands of customers are blaming Rovi. Notice, for example, how many times Rovi is mentioned on this Microsoft web page:
https://connect.microsoft.com/site1145/Feedback

This Microsoft web pages says the TV Guide has been "Updated":
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/3078428,
but many Windows Media Center users no longer have a TV schedule, making Windows Media Center worthless because it is very difficult to record without the schedule.

Microsoft is apparently deliberately destroying Windows Media Center, and letting Rovi take the blame. For example, a new installation of Windows Media Center on a fully updated Windows 7 Ultimate computer has several flaws, not just the lack of a TV program guide.

Another loss in Windows 10: Windows Updates will be forced, in some versions. Will there be other lost features, now or later? Will Microsoft extend its control over Windows in other hidden or complicated ways? Online comments say that Microsoft will try to move Windows to a model that requires monthly payments. The issue is not whether technically-knowledgeable users will be able to stop forced updates; the issue is that most people won't know how to regain control over their systems. That control is important because often Microsoft has issued poorly designed updates that have caused problems on user's systems. See this Slashdot story, for example, Windows 10's Automatic Updates For NVidia Drivers Causing Trouble.

More about Microsoft releasing buggy software: The Slashdot story, Windows 10 Launches, says Windows 10 is "buggier than Windows 8.1, 8, 7, or Vista were on their respective launch days" and "During my testing on a variety of hardware, I've run into a lot of bugs and issues -- even with the version that will be released to consumers on launch day".

(At present, the best way to update Windows 7 is to use Autopatcher, because Microsoft's anti-customer "updates" are avoided.)

Firefox: Embraced, "Extended", soon to be Extinguished? Mozilla Foundation now gets most of its money from Microsoft. Microsoft pays Yahoo. Yahoo pays Mozilla Foundation to make "Yahoo search" (actually Microsoft Bing search) the default search engine in Firefox. Most people don't have the technical knowledge to know how they've been manipulated, or how to restore the default search engine to Google search.

Thunderbird and SeaMonkey Composer GUIs: Damaged, apparently deliberately. Every time you do a file save, the newer versions of both ask for a new file name, and don't suggest the last one chosen. The damage was reported several months ago, but has not been fixed. Is t

I find it amusing what I am seeing right now - I have multiple machines in multiple environments. I'm using the the tools downloaded from here: https://www.microsoft.com/en-u... On some of different IP's and network connections I am downloading Windows 10 Pro - and the speed seems consistent from MS servers at 5MB/s. On other IP's, I am downloading Windows 10 Pro N (without the Edge browser). Speeds are less than 1MB/s. This is either popularity or favouritism...yikes.