Slashdot Mirror

Actually, smartass, I DID test it thoroughly, and (in 2.6.11, and continuing to 2.6.12-rc2 - no other kernels tried) it consistently fails to connect the MSN protocol (any client) and POP3, and some HTTP seems to behave badly but mostly okay. It IS a bug in Linux because none of the BSDs exhibit this, and it is also a bug that isn't fixed in 2.6.12-rc2 despite numerous changes to IPSec (and related) components.

Well I use POP3 and HTTP over ipsec and it is fine. So it is likely that you are doing something wrong.

Where is your bug report?

When you show me a BSD exposing a significant security hole (like the Linux signal exploit) or breaking long-standing network functionality (IPSec, packet filtering, etc.), then I might consider them somewhere close to buggy, but flawed hardware support is nothing compared to the breakages Linux experiences.

You really have no idea about software development, do you? You honestly think BSDs have no bugs? You are a sad, stupid idiot.

I've looked up your posting history and you are a stupid trolling idiot who wouldn't know a kernel if it kicked him up the anus. You consistently say stupid and incorrect things and try to pass them off as fact. I'm having nothing more to do with the likes of you.

A Linux advocate I know said, and I quote directly, "I've had some corker problems on GNU/Linux-based systems that can only be attributed to poor development and testing, and implementing the same thing on OpenBSD had no issues at all. First thing that comes to mind as indicative of the difference in quality between the GNU/Linux and BSD's, is PAM vs BSDAuth.."

A BSD advocate I know recently said (quote) "First thing that comes to mind for me is that Linux happens to beat all the BSDs at their own game. It is faster and far more scalable than FreeBSD, it is more portable than NetBSD, and it has advanced security infrastructure that OpenBSD can't match."

Honestly, it's no mystery and nothing new at all. Linux does not get tested. Shit, are you even listening to kernel devs? They've decided NOT to do any quality assurance, leaving vendors up to the task of testing and bug fixing (hint: they don't do a good job either). Find THAT kind of philosophy in any BSD...

Err, actually if you had any idea you would know that they do plenty of quality assurance and follow a good release process. Just because it doesn't exactly match what you small minded BSD zealots are used to, doesn't mean it is wrong. The various BSDs are far more comparable to Linux distributions than the Linux kernel itself.

Actually, smartass, I DID test it thoroughly, and (in 2.6.11, and continuing to 2.6.12-rc2 - no other kernels tried) it consistently fails to connect the MSN protocol (any client) and POP3, and some HTTP seems to behave badly but mostly okay. It IS a bug in Linux because none of the BSDs exhibit this, and it is also a bug that isn't fixed in 2.6.12-rc2 despite numerous changes to IPSec (and related) components.

Well I use POP3 and HTTP over ipsec and it is fine. So it is likely that you are doing something wrong.

Where is your bug report?

When you show me a BSD exposing a significant security hole (like the Linux signal exploit) or breaking long-standing network functionality (IPSec, packet filtering, etc.), then I might consider them somewhere close to buggy, but flawed hardware support is nothing compared to the breakages Linux experiences.

You really have no idea about software development, do you? You honestly think BSDs have no bugs? You are a sad, stupid idiot.

I've looked up your posting history and you are a stupid trolling idiot who wouldn't know a kernel if it kicked him up the anus. You consistently say stupid and incorrect things and try to pass them off as fact. I'm having nothing more to do with the likes of you.

A Linux advocate I know said, and I quote directly, "I've had some corker problems on GNU/Linux-based systems that can only be attributed to poor development and testing, and implementing the same thing on OpenBSD had no issues at all. First thing that comes to mind as indicative of the difference in quality between the GNU/Linux and BSD's, is PAM vs BSDAuth.."

A BSD advocate I know recently said (quote) "First thing that comes to mind for me is that Linux happens to beat all the BSDs at their own game. It is faster and far more scalable than FreeBSD, it is more portable than NetBSD, and it has advanced security infrastructure that OpenBSD can't match."

Honestly, it's no mystery and nothing new at all. Linux does not get tested. Shit, are you even listening to kernel devs? They've decided NOT to do any quality assurance, leaving vendors up to the task of testing and bug fixing (hint: they don't do a good job either). Find THAT kind of philosophy in any BSD...

Err, actually if you had any idea you would know that they do plenty of quality assurance and follow a good release process. Just because it doesn't exactly match what you small minded BSD zealots are used to, doesn't mean it is wrong. The various BSDs are far more comparable to Linux distributions than the Linux kernel itself.

... facts are facts. ;)

FreeBSD:
FreeBSD, Stealth-Growth Open Source Project (Jun 2004)
"FreeBSD has dramatically increased its market penetration over the last year."
Nearly 2.5 Million Active Sites running FreeBSD (Jun 2004)
"[FreeBSD] has secured a strong foothold with the hosting community and continues to grow, gaining over a million hostnames and half a million active sites since July 2003."
What's New in the FreeBSD Network Stack (Sep 2004)
"FreeBSD can now route 1Mpps on a 2.8GHz Xeon whilst Linux can't do much more than 100kpps."

NetBSD:
NetBSD, for When Portability and Stability Matter (Oct 2004)
NetBSD sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (May 2004)
NetBSD again sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (Sep 2004)

OpenBSD:
OpenBSD Widens Its Scope (Nov 2004)
Review: OpenBSD 3.6 shows steady improvement (Nov 2004)
OpenSSH (OpenBSD subproject) has become a de facto Internet standard.

*BSD in general:
Deep study: The world's safest computing environment (Nov 2004)
"The world's safest and most secure 24/7 online computing environment - operating system plus applications - is proving to be the Open Source platform of BSD (Berkeley Software Distribution) and the Mac OS X based on Darwin."
BSD Success Stories (O'Reilly, 2004) (pdf) ~ from Onlamp BSD DevCenter
"The BSDs - FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD, Darwin, and others - have earned a reputation for stability, security, performance, and ease of administration."
..and last but not least, we have the cutest mascot as well - undisputedly. ;)

--
Being able to read *other people's* source code is a nice thing, not a 'fundamental freedom'.

... facts are facts. ;)

FreeBSD:
FreeBSD, Stealth-Growth Open Source Project (Jun 2004)
"FreeBSD has dramatically increased its market penetration over the last year."
Nearly 2.5 Million Active Sites running FreeBSD (Jun 2004)
"[FreeBSD] has secured a strong foothold with the hosting community and continues to grow, gaining over a million hostnames and half a million active sites since July 2003."
What's New in the FreeBSD Network Stack (Sep 2004)
"FreeBSD can now route 1Mpps on a 2.8GHz Xeon whilst Linux can't do much more than 100kpps."

NetBSD:
NetBSD, for When Portability and Stability Matter (Oct 2004)
NetBSD sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (May 2004)
NetBSD again sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (Sep 2004)

OpenBSD:
OpenBSD Widens Its Scope (Nov 2004)
Review: OpenBSD 3.6 shows steady improvement (Nov 2004)
OpenSSH (OpenBSD subproject) has become a de facto Internet standard.

*BSD in general:
Deep study: The world's safest computing environment (Nov 2004)
"The world's safest and most secure 24/7 online computing environment - operating system plus applications - is proving to be the Open Source platform of BSD (Berkeley Software Distribution) and the Mac OS X based on Darwin."
BSD Success Stories (O'Reilly, 2004) (pdf) ~ from Onlamp BSD DevCenter
"The BSDs - FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD, Darwin, and others - have earned a reputation for stability, security, performance, and ease of administration."
..and last but not least, we have the cutest mascot as well - undisputedly. ;)

--
Being able to read *other people's* source code is a nice thing, not a 'fundamental freedom'. -- Requiem for the FUD

That's a 5 right there!
One of the best pieces of all.
Shameless plug: somewhere else here I've expressed my view that maybe the fundamental problem with Debian - possibly what originates all others - is their packaging technology. They treat it like a religion, even though it was written, IIRC, almost a decade ago.
You have achieved great insight with your piece. In fact, it's so obvious that one wonders why so many miss these simple facts.
Also read an AC post called "Metcalfe's law", which wasn't justly moderated, about the growth of Debian packages being N^2.

PS: You don't always install from source on BSDs, you can install packages (for things that are too big, like KDE, etc). Also, might wanna read up on how GoboLinux approaches these issue, and also the pkgsrc documentation (see here for some insights on installing "incompatible" stuff).

but it took them *this* long to get it to work on the Mac Mini

Just how long is "*this* long" ?

If you'd RTFA, you'd see a link to a mailing list message showing the boot output of a Mac Mini, posted two days before the machine shipped.

... facts are facts. ;)

FreeBSD:
FreeBSD, Stealth-Growth Open Source Project (Jun 2004)
"FreeBSD has dramatically increased its market penetration over the last year."
Nearly 2.5 Million Active Sites running FreeBSD (Jun 2004)
"[FreeBSD] has secured a strong foothold with the hosting community and continues to grow, gaining over a million hostnames and half a million active sites since July 2003."
What's New in the FreeBSD Network Stack (Sep 2004)
"FreeBSD can now route 1Mpps on a 2.8GHz Xeon whilst Linux can't do much more than 100kpps."

NetBSD:
NetBSD, for When Portability and Stability Matter (Oct 2004)
NetBSD sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (May 2004)
NetBSD again sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (Sep 2004)

OpenBSD:
OpenBSD Widens Its Scope (Nov 2004)
Review: OpenBSD 3.6 shows steady improvement (Nov 2004)
OpenSSH (OpenBSD subproject) has become a de facto Internet standard.

*BSD in general:
Deep study: The world's safest computing environment (Nov 2004)
"The world's safest and most secure 24/7 online computing environment - operating system plus applications - is proving to be the Open Source platform of BSD (Berkeley Software Distribution) and the Mac OS X based on Darwin."
BSD Success Stories (O'Reilly, 2004) (pdf) ~ from Onlamp BSD DevCenter
"The BSDs - FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD, Darwin, and others - have earned a reputation for stability, security, performance, and ease of administration."
..and last but not least, we have the cutest mascot as well - undisputedly. ;)

--
Being able to read *other people's* source code is a nice thing, not a 'fundamental freedom'.

Binary packages have been uploaded (so far) for:
NetBSD-2.0/amd64, NetBSD-2.0/i386, NetBSD-1.6.2/i386, NetBSD-2.0/sparc and IRIX64-6.5 (including PGP signed checksum files).

Binary packages have been uploaded (so far) for:
NetBSD-2.0/amd64, NetBSD-2.0/i386, NetBSD-1.6.2/i386, NetBSD-2.0/sparc and IRIX64-6.5 (including PGP signed checksum files).

Binary packages have been uploaded (so far) for:
NetBSD-2.0/amd64, NetBSD-2.0/i386, NetBSD-1.6.2/i386, NetBSD-2.0/sparc and IRIX64-6.5 (including PGP signed checksum files).

Binary packages have been uploaded (so far) for:
NetBSD-2.0/amd64, NetBSD-2.0/i386, NetBSD-1.6.2/i386, NetBSD-2.0/sparc and IRIX64-6.5 (including PGP signed checksum files).

Binary packages have been uploaded (so far) for:
NetBSD-2.0/amd64, NetBSD-2.0/i386, NetBSD-1.6.2/i386, NetBSD-2.0/sparc and IRIX64-6.5 (including PGP signed checksum files).

People were complaining one of the servers I run didn't have enough disk capcacity, so I promised them I'd upgrade it to larger hardware. Since the box is in the office with the users (not my choice), I borrowed an old VAXStation from a friend (it was a huge one on wheels, see here for an example. The real box was moved elsewhere for the day. The older folk found it extremely amusing, the younger folk were bewildered compltely by it.

So it is hardly impossible to make a common API which is cross platform. At least for certain types of devices.

Lots of nontrivial projects have made do with CVS, a source code control system with limitations is much better than nothing at all.

Booya!

... facts are facts. ;)

FreeBSD:
FreeBSD, Stealth-Growth Open Source Project (Jun 2004)
"FreeBSD has dramatically increased its market penetration over the last year."
Nearly 2.5 Million Active Sites running FreeBSD (Jun 2004)
"[FreeBSD] has secured a strong foothold with the hosting community and continues to grow, gaining over a million hostnames and half a million active sites since July 2003."
What's New in the FreeBSD Network Stack (Sep 2004)
"FreeBSD can now route 1Mpps on a 2.8GHz Xeon whilst Linux can't do much more than 100kpps."

NetBSD:
NetBSD, for When Portability and Stability Matter (Oct 2004)
NetBSD sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (May 2004)
NetBSD again sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (Sep 2004)

OpenBSD:
OpenBSD Widens Its Scope (Nov 2004)
Review: OpenBSD 3.6 shows steady improvement (Nov 2004)
OpenSSH (OpenBSD subproject) has become a de facto Internet standard.

*BSD in general:
Deep study: The world's safest computing environment (Nov 2004)
"The world's safest and most secure 24/7 online computing environment - operating system plus applications - is proving to be the Open Source platform of BSD (Berkeley Software Distribution) and the Mac OS X based on Darwin."
BSD Success Stories (O'Reilly, 2004) (pdf) ~ from Onlamp BSD DevCenter
"The BSDs - FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD, Darwin, and others - have earned a reputation for stability, security, performance, and ease of administration."
..and last but not least, we have the cutest mascot as well - undisputedly. ;)

--
Being able to read *other people's* source code is a nice thing, not a 'fundamental freedom'.

... facts are facts. ;)

FreeBSD:
FreeBSD, Stealth-Growth Open Source Project (Jun 2004)
"FreeBSD has dramatically increased its market penetration over the last year."
Nearly 2.5 Million Active Sites running FreeBSD (Jun 2004)
"[FreeBSD] has secured a strong foothold with the hosting community and continues to grow, gaining over a million hostnames and half a million active sites since July 2003."
W hat's New in the FreeBSD Network Stack (Sep 2004)
"FreeBSD can now route 1Mpps on a 2.8GHz Xeon whilst Linux can't do much more than 100kpps."

NetBSD:
NetBSD, for When Portability and Stability Matter (Oct 2004)
NetBSD sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (May 2004)
NetBSD again sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (Sep 2004)

OpenBSD:
OpenBSD Widens Its Scope (Nov 2004)
Review: OpenBSD 3.6 shows steady improvement (Nov 2004)
OpenSSH (OpenBSD subproject) has become a de facto Internet standard.

*BSD in general:
Deep study: The world's safest computing environment (Nov 2004)
"The world's safest and most secure 24/7 online computing environment - operating system plus applications - is proving to be the Open Source platform of BSD (Berkeley Software Distribution) and the Mac OS X based on Darwin."
BSD Success Stories (O'Reilly, 2004) (pdf) ~ from Onlamp BSD DevCenter
"The BSDs - FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD, Darwin, and others - have earned a reputation for stability, security, performance, and ease of administration."
..and last but not least, we have the cutest mascot as well - undisputedly. ;)

--
Being able to read *other people's* source code is a nice thing, not a 'fundamental freedom'.

- Hubert

Mach RPC is built on top of Mach ports, but an RPC call is not a single kernel-level operation. So you have the scheduling problem.

Interestingly, although it's very obscure, the kernel call level below mach_msg_send actually does support a combined send/block/receive operation. As the MIT document points out, this "enables certain internal optimizations".

But when you read the GNU HURD tutorial on Mach IPC, you see the suggestion that a program intended to send an integer to another program and wait for a reply should do two separate operations. Somebody doesn't get this.

Also, for no particularly good reason, Mach usually uses the same buffer for both send and receive, so if you use the combined send/receive form, whatever you send gets clobbered by the reply. So using this tends to involve an extra copy.

Mach IPC is incredibly complicated, You have to fill in many data structures just to send something. The implementation is complicated, too. QNX has a nice, simple primitive:

int MsgSend(int connectionid,
const void* sendmsg,
int sendbytes,
void* rcvmsg,
int rcvbytes);

You can probably figure out how to use that just from the definition. Even the reply value is what you think it should be: the receive count if it worked, -1 if it failed, with an error code in errno.

The name of the game here is getting the primitives right.

Using hard coded spaces consumes more bytes and requires reformatting to change the indent. Use of Tabs is a no-brainer, but judging from the comments here and elsewhere people still don't understand the issue.

I always use TABS because I figure an editor can be configured to translated X TABS into Y spaces as prefered by the user. In other words, I agree.

However, every style guide I have seen tries to impress upon you the importance of using spaces and never TABS (including the open-source ones?). Why is this? Why is this encouraged as the best practice?

And this is even worse: the FreeBSD style guide prescribes a MIXTURE of tabs and spaces! The tabs are also twice as long as the spaces visually (8 vs. 4 characters). The NetBSD style guide has similar requirements.

Hmm, in that case, shouldn't NetApp donate their money to the NetBSD project instead of OpenBSD?
Since NetBSD's anonymous cvs server recently had some troubles in its hardware

Now maybe companies will realize that using GPL code is stupid, and start using free software instead.

Once free of such tyranny, the non-x86 ports can
fix things without concern for x86 releases.

You have a funny view of things, each architecture somehow "getting in the way" of others. If each architecture "fixes" things differently, where does that lead to? Clean code? Hardly. Look, it can be so easy. 48 architectures all off the same code base.

OpenBSD runs just fine on older sparc hardware. NetBSD too

...there goes my handy Sparc server...

Maybe you should run the OS your sparc was made for? Or if it really is that old ther's always NetBSD.

While Linux is well known for being exteremly cross-platform, 99.9% of installs will be on one of those four architectures. It would make sense to concentrate solely on those four rather than adding support for every Amiga and 68XXX setup out there. Especially now with Debian becoming a very strong player in the linux server community (now that RedHat is concentrating mainly on paid contracts and has allowed Fedora Core to become bulky and buggy.)

Besides, if you really want to run *nix on your Atari go download NetBSD.
- Cary
--Fairfax Underground: Where Fairfax County comes out to play

It's no real surprize that people want to get rid of it. If not for Linux we'd have a choice of two OS (Windows or OSX)

Really? What happened to all the other free alternatives?

I'm getting a bit tired of Linux fanatics who think the OS world is limited to Windows, OS X and Linux.

--
Glass, t0tal pwnag3

I would love to see a straitforward utility for installing the OS from the CD to the hard drive, not just copying the filesystem but automatically modifying the necessary config files.

As things are now, liveCDs let us test drive an OS/distro. If we like it then we need to download another CD(s) and go through a laborious install and configure process. This is fine with most setups, but is a nightmare for configuring non-standard hardware (namely PCMCIA wireless cards), especially when the liveCD works so well.

LiveCDs can be a better starting off point for installing OSs/distros than installer isos. So why not provide the option for the livecd to act as the installer?

... facts are facts. ;)

FreeBSD:
FreeBSD, Stealth-Growth Open Source Project (Jun 2004)
"FreeBSD has dramatically increased its market penetration over the last year."
Nearly 2.5 Million Active Sites running FreeBSD (Jun 2004)
"[FreeBSD] has secured a strong foothold with the hosting community and continues to grow, gaining over a million hostnames and half a million active sites since July 2003."
What's New in the FreeBSD Network Stack (Sep 2004)
"FreeBSD can now route 1Mpps on a 2.8GHz Xeon whilst Linux can't do much more than 100kpps."

NetBSD:
NetBSD, for When Portability and Stability Matter (Oct 2004)
NetBSD sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (May 2004)
NetBSD again sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (Sep 2004)

OpenBSD:
OpenBSD Widens Its Scope (Nov 2004)
Review: OpenBSD 3.6 shows steady improvement (Nov 2004)
OpenSSH (OpenBSD subproject) has become a de facto Internet standard.

*BSD in general:
Deep study: The world's safest computing environment (Nov 2004)
"The world's safest and most secure 24/7 online computing environment - operating system plus applications - is proving to be the Open Source platform of BSD (Berkeley Software Distribution) and the Mac OS X based on Darwin."
BSD Success Stories (O'Reilly, 2004) (pdf) ~ from Onlamp BSD DevCenter
"The BSDs - FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD, Darwin, and others - have earned a reputation for stability, security, performance, and ease of administration."
..and last but not least, we have the cutest mascot as well - undisputedly. ;)

--
Being able to read *other people's* source code is a nice thing, not a 'fundamental freedom'.

The Multics approach wouldn't have worked in all the environments UNIX thrives (look at NetBSD!) It would be just as "accurate" to say that Plan 9 is a "slapdash clone" of UNIX.

... facts are facts. ;)

FreeBSD:
FreeBSD, Stealth-Growth Open Source Project (Jun 2004)
"FreeBSD has dramatically increased its market penetration over the last year."
Nearly 2.5 Million Active Sites running FreeBSD (Jun 2004)
"[FreeBSD] has secured a strong foothold with the hosting community and continues to grow, gaining over a million hostnames and half a million active sites since July 2003."
What's New in the FreeBSD Network Stack (Sep 2004)
"FreeBSD can now route 1Mpps on a 2.8GHz Xeon whilst Linux can't do much more than 100kpps."

NetBSD:
NetBSD sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (May 2004)
NetBSD again sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (30 Sep 2004)

OpenBSD:
OpenBSD Widens Its Scope (Nov 2004)
Review: OpenBSD 3.6 shows steady improvement (Nov 2004)
OpenSSH (OpenBSD subproject) has become a de facto Internet standard.

*BSD in general:
Deep study: The world's safest computing environment (Nov 2004)
"The world's safest and most secure 24/7 online computing environment - operating system plus applications - is proving to be the Open Source platform of BSD (Berkeley Software Distribution) and the Mac OS X based on Darwin."
..and last but not least, we have the cutest mascot as well - undisputedly. ;)

--
Being able to read *other people's* source code is a nice thing, not a 'fundamental freedom'.

I disagree. To me, NetBSD logo looks very clean, tasteful and appropriate - come on, it's a *logo* we're talkin about. It should be sthg like that, IMHO.

Given FreeBSD's much wider user base, the numbers will probably be higher - and making a choice will be even harder.

But will they be able to find a logo that's even blander?

.. it's a *logo contest*. Kinda difficult to submit a new logo 2 days after the official announcement, I think.. :)
Anyway, for NetBSD's logo contest over 400 logos were submitted. Given FreeBSD's much wider user base, the numbers will probably be higher - and making a choice will be even harder.
--
Requiem for the FUD

Mod me down if you like, but if an old rant from an ex developer is considered "interesting", whis should be as well.
Facts are facts. ;)

FreeBSD:
FreeBSD, Stealth-Growth Open Source Project (Jun 2004)
"FreeBSD has dramatically increased its market penetration over the last year."
Nearly 2.5 Million Active Sites running FreeBSD (Jun 2004)
"[FreeBSD] has secured a strong foothold with the hosting community and continues to grow, gaining over a million hostnames and half a million active sites since July 2003."
What's New in the FreeBSD Network Stack (Sep 2004)
"FreeBSD can now route 1Mpps on a 2.8GHz Xeon whilst Linux can't do much more than 100kpps."

NetBSD:
NetBSD sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (May 2004)
NetBSD again sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (30 Sep 2004)

OpenBSD:
OpenBSD Widens Its Scope (Nov 2004)
Review: OpenBSD 3.6 shows steady improvement (Nov 2004)

*BSD in general:
Deep study: The world's safest computing environment (Nov 2004)
"The world's safest and most secure 24/7 online computing environment - operating system plus applications - is proving to be the Open Source platform of BSD (Berkeley Software Distribution) and the Mac OS X based on Darwin."
..and last but not least, we have the cutest mascot as well - undisputedly. ;)

--
Being able to read *other people's* source code is a nice thing, not a 'fundamental freedom'.

... facts are facts. ;)

FreeBSD:
FreeBSD, Stealth-Growth Open Source Project (Jun 2004)
"FreeBSD has dramatically increased its market penetration over the last year."
Nearly 2.5 Million Active Sites running FreeBSD (Jun 2004)
"[FreeBSD] has secured a strong foothold with the hosting community and continues to grow, gaining over a million hostnames and half a million active sites since July 2003."
What's New in the FreeBSD Network Stack (Sep 2004)
"FreeBSD can now route 1Mpps on a 2.8GHz Xeon whilst Linux can't do much more than 100kpps."

NetBSD:
NetBSD sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (May 2004)
NetBSD again sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (30 Sep 2004)

OpenBSD:
OpenBSD Widens Its Scope (Nov 2004)
Review: OpenBSD 3.6 shows steady improvement (Nov 2004)

*BSD in general:
Deep study: The world's safest computing environment (Nov 2004)
"The world's safest and most secure 24/7 online computing environment - operating system plus applications - is proving to be the Open Source platform of BSD (Berkeley Software Distribution) and the Mac OS X based on Darwin."
..and last but not least, we have the cutest mascot as well - undisputedly. ;)

--
Being able to read *other people's* source code is a nice thing, not a 'fundamental freedom'.

Why is OpenBSD called OpenBSD ? because it was the first BSD to make its CVS tree accessible for everyone. That's right, anyone can subscribe to source-changes and see the commit messages. And anyone can get the sources.

Hopefully, this will mean a lot more people buying one of these and using something like this, this, this, this or this!

Seriously. Why on Earth are people still putting up with these MS fuckers when Mac OSX and Apple hardware is so damn nice? I like a mix of Sun and Apple gear. The thought of actually deciding on MS just makes me shudder. And MS just keeps giving me more and more reason to hate them and the shit they peddle.

You know what. I agree. This is dumb.

No way man! This guy is a pioneer! I plan to replace my 4.4kWatt CPU and 4.9kWatt I/O in my Vax9000 with one of these bad boys! Hell the Mac mini can take double the RAM that my beloved 9000 can take! And what's more, the electricity that I will save in one week, will pay for the top spec Mac mini outright!

Vax9000

IMPORTANT UPDATE: Please show your support for Ceren in this poll of Geek Babes!

Is it any wonder people think Linux users are a bunch of flaming homosexuals when its fronted by obviously gay losers like these?! BSD has a mascot who leaves us in no doubt that this is the OS for real men! If Linux had more hot chicks and gorgeous babes then maybe it would be able to compete with BSD! Hell this girl should be a model!

Linux is a joke as long as it continues to lack sexy girls like her! I mean just look at this girl! Doesn't she excite you? I know this little hottie puts me in need of a cold shower! This guy looks like he is about to cream his pants standing next to such a fox. As you can see, no man can resist this sexy little minx. Don't you wish the guy in this pic was you? Are you telling me you wouldn't like to get your hands on this ass?! Wouldn't this just make your Christmas?! Yes doctor, this uber babe definitely gets my pulse racing! Oh how I envy the lucky girl in this shot! Linux has nothing that can possibly compete. Come on, you must admit she is better than an overweight penguin or a gay looking goat! Wouldn't this be more liklely to influence your choice of OS?

With sexy chicks like the lovely Ceren you could have people queuing up to buy open source products. Could you really refuse to buy a copy of BSD if she told you to? Personally I know I would give my right arm to get this close to such a divine beauty!

Don't be a fag! Join the campaign for more cute open source babes today!

$Id: ceren.html,v 9.0 2004/08/01 16:01:34 ceren_rocks Exp $

... facts are facts. ;)

FreeBSD:
FreeBSD, Stealth-Growth Open Source Project (Jun 2004)
"FreeBSD has dramatically increased its market penetration over the last year."
Nearly 2.5 Million Active Sites running FreeBSD (Jun 2004)
"[FreeBSD] has secured a strong foothold with the hosting community and continues to grow, gaining over a million hostnames and half a million active sites since July 2003."
What's New in the FreeBSD Network Stack (Sep 2004)
"FreeBSD can now route 1Mpps on a 2.8GHz Xeon whilst Linux can't do much more than 100kpps."

NetBSD:
NetBSD sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (May 2004)
NetBSD again sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (30 Sep 2004)

OpenBSD:
OpenBSD Widens Its Scope (Nov 2004)
Review: OpenBSD 3.6 shows steady improvement (Nov 2004)

*BSD in general:
Deep study: The world's safest computing environment (Nov 2004)
"The world's safest and most secure 24/7 online computing environment - operating system plus applications - is proving to be the Open Source platform of BSD (Berkeley Software Distribution) and the Mac OS X based on Darwin."
..and last but not least, we have the cutest mascot as well - undisputedly. ;)

--
Being able to read *other people's* source code is a nice thing, not a 'fundamental freedom'.

... facts are facts. ;)

FreeBSD:
FreeBSD, Stealth-Growth Open Source Project (Jun 2004)
"FreeBSD has dramatically increased its market penetration over the last year."
Nearly 2.5 Million Active Sites running FreeBSD (Jun 2004)
"[FreeBSD] has secured a strong foothold with the hosting community and continues to grow, gaining over a million hostnames and half a million active sites since July 2003."
What's New in the FreeBSD Network Stack (Sep 2004)
"FreeBSD can now route 1Mpps on a 2.8GHz Xeon whilst Linux can't do much more than 100kpps."

NetBSD:
NetBSD sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (May 2004)
NetBSD again sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (30 Sep 2004)

OpenBSD:
OpenBSD Widens Its Scope (Nov 2004)
Review: OpenBSD 3.6 shows steady improvement (Nov 2004)

*BSD in general:
Deep study: The world's safest computing environment (Nov 2004)
"The world's safest and most secure 24/7 online computing environment - operating system plus applications - is proving to be the Open Source platform of BSD (Berkeley Software Distribution) and the Mac OS X based on Darwin."
..and last but not least, we have the cutest mascot as well - undisputedly. ;)

--
Being able to read *other people's* source code is a nice thing, not a 'fundamental freedom'.

1) In english, well is an adverb, good is an adjective. If u aint gonna right good than nobody gonna tihnk u no nohting
2) MP support was officially added in 1.6.1 or 1.6.2 and was available in CVS prior to those releases
3) U1's are sparc64, not sparc, so it's no brainteaser that the sparc port doesn't support them.
4) U1's are supported by sparc64 - If you can read

Check these out: one, two. The hardware is a TS-7200.

- Hubert

I've never installed an X system on a NetBSD host - I use them as servers or other network appliances. I've got friends running KDE on x86 notebooks, but I'm sure they all build from source - as do I. On the third hand, though, the PPC port of NetBSD is very mature, and the NetBSD driver system is binary-compatible across all architectures. I suggest you find the NetBSD PPC maillist, and ask someone there who's already done it.

... facts are facts. ;)

FreeBSD:
FreeBSD, Stealth-Growth Open Source Project (Jun 2004)
"FreeBSD has dramatically increased its market penetration over the last year."
Nearly 2.5 Million Active Sites running FreeBSD (Jun 2004)
"[FreeBSD] has secured a strong foothold with the hosting community and continues to grow, gaining over a million hostnames and half a million active sites since July 2003."
What's New in the FreeBSD Network Stack (Sep 2004)
"FreeBSD can now route 1Mpps on a 2.8GHz Xeon whilst Linux can't do much more than 100kpps."

NetBSD:
NetBSD sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (May 2004)
NetBSD again sets Internet2 Land Speed World Record (30 Sep 2004)

OpenBSD:
OpenBSD Widens Its Scope (Nov 2004)
Review: OpenBSD 3.6 shows steady improvement (Nov 2004)

*BSD in general:
Deep study: The world's safest computing environment (Nov 2004)
"The world's safest and most secure 24/7 online computing environment - operating system plus applications - is proving to be the Open Source platform of BSD (Berkeley Software Distribution) and the Mac OS X based on Darwin."
..and last but not least, we have the cutest mascot as well - undisputedly. ;)

--
Being able to read *other people's* source code is a nice thing, not a 'fundamental freedom'.

Sorry, it was not kern/26007, but port-i386/26007; though it's a show-stopper nonetheless.

I welcome everyone to actually try NetBSD!

I tried NetBSD 2.0 on my EPIA 5000 Eden board, but was promptly bitten by kern/26007, so no luck here :-(. FreeBSD 5.3 worked like a charm; with disks and later even in a complete diskless setup. So NetBSD doesn't run everywhere, despite the hype.

NetBSD isn't as feature rich as more modern kernels such as Linux, or even Free/OpenBSD. Its IP stack is way out of date;

its filesystem is way out of date

its hardware support is out of date

It's not easy to get security updatesWhich is better, having to patch or use cvs a few times a year, or having to download every week new security fixes to keep from getting rooted? You decide.