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I've got the latest version of Opera [opera.com]
"latest version" is always a bit vague - when was the last time you checked for a new version? 6.05 has been released in the last few days. The changelog mentions fixes to OpenSSL issues and certificate autorities. I thought I had the "latest" version on Wednesday. If this information is helpful, then you're welcome. If it isn't, then it hasn't cost you anything so please don't complain about it.

Well, this is advocacy (no I don't work for them), but try Opera. It's blazing fast, has tabs too, and a menu (accessible by pressing F12) from which you can select to enable/disable features like popup windows, background music, cookies, and what user agent string the browser should send to servers (this feature doesn't work correctly though, it just adds "MSIE" to the end of the string, still identifying itself as Opera). To be more aggressive on ads, try Proxomitron

Or, gee whiz, you could just use a browser that lets you block popups easily without addons.

As far as I can tell from The Register's article, Mozilla was not effected. However, in saying that, Opera released a new Windows build to address an SSL problem. I don't know if its the same one that affected MSIE & Konq.

Oh, and IE 5.0 did complain about the certificate being invalid

Do I get to charge you for the stronger glasses prescription I'll need after reading the tiny tiny font on your web page?

That's one of the reasons why you should be using the Opera web browser. It has a little bar in the top right corner to turn up and down the magnification of the web page that you're viewing, from 20% to 1000%.

What else shatters windows? That's right, opera!

Okay, bad, bad, BAD pun. I just couldn't resist.

And pop-up ads are easy to ignore.. as soon a new small window appears while surfing, I close it.

Or use opera, press F12 and choose 'accept pop-ups' or 'refuse pop-ups'.

Any decent browser nowadays can block popups while keeping Javascript enabled. Go get Mozilla, Galeon, Opera, Konqueror... the list goes on and on.

In short: Don't use IE, and you won't get popups. Your browsing experience will also be faster and more intuitive.

MS has not been the only choice for some time.
A project called Skolelinux (Linux for schools) has been underway for some time. (based on Debian with KDE/Gnome). This project has been in the news on several occasions and has also received a grant from the Norwegian ministry for Research and Education (nov/2001)

Personally I think it will take some time before any changes are noticable.
Desktops will not change much, maybe a few new competing window apps.
(StarOffice or Opera maybe?)
Servers are the biggest bet, where you don't have to re-educate the entire staff.

mork
a .no /. reader

People are buying software like Opera for Linux, which is just a regular web browser, so why wouldn't they want to buy other Linux software as well?

It's very unlikely they could disable your "Save As" without disabling all of your web access. Could it just be that IE is retarded? Try another browser like Mozilla or Opera. You do have choices you know.

The Galeon folks should be proud.

What are websites for?

Websites are a means to get information to people. I think most website owners would like to get their information to as many people as possible. So why do site owners allow web designers to block out a significant percentage of potential readers?

Take a look at the following message I got from KFWB when attempting to view a story. I was using Opera, my preferred browser.

Note the final insultingly ironic sentence. If they respect my browser preference, why won't they allow my browser to view their pages?

Thanks for visiting WWW.KFWB.COM
Our site is best viewed with Netscape 6.2 and/or Internet Explorer 4.0 or greater.
It appears you are using a different version or a different browser that our site is not currently designed for. Please refer to the links below:
For a free download of Netscape 6.2, please click here.
For a free download of Internet Explorer, please click here.
We realize you may not choose to download or implement a new browser on your computer and we certainly respect that.

You may have a slow-ass computer, but there's simply no reason to continue using Netscape 4, no matter what you may say.

There are stripped-down versions of mozilla out there. You can use Opera or Internet Explorer 5, if you run Windows. You may even be able to stomach Mozilla or Netscape 6 if you've got a computer built this century.

The world does not owe you a favor for having a slow-ass computer, though. We're not about to sit idly by while your shitty 486 attempts to render our modern websites. Stop using NS4. Times are changing. Get with it, or give up. But, stop whining.

- A.P.

Oops, here's the link.

Not when you're using a browser that doesn't come with flash...

Opera Software today continued its Linux Bonanza Week with a public release of Opera 6.02 for Linux. The new version includes important fixes to the document and user interface, with special emphasis on the display of Asian characters, making this an important upgrade for Linux users all over the world.

More at: http://www.opera.com/pressreleases/en/2002/07/2002 0703_2.html

and...

Opera waves the red flag in China

In China, the government has moved to install the open-source Linux operating system provided by Red Flag in an attempt to avoid reliance on U.S. companies, particularly Microsoft. The successful RedFlag formula will now be replicated in the embedded market.

"After dominating the Chinese desktop market, RedFlag is now poised to move into the embeddded market," says Danny Huang, geveral manager embedded products, Redflag Software Technologies Co., Ltd. "With Opera on board as a partner, RedFlag now offers the very best in embedded systems solutions for the Chinese market."

Press release here: http://www.opera.com/pressreleases/en/2002/07/2002 0701_2.html

Opera Software today continued its Linux Bonanza Week with a public release of Opera 6.02 for Linux. The new version includes important fixes to the document and user interface, with special emphasis on the display of Asian characters, making this an important upgrade for Linux users all over the world.

More at: http://www.opera.com/pressreleases/en/2002/07/2002 0703_2.html

and...

Opera waves the red flag in China

In China, the government has moved to install the open-source Linux operating system provided by Red Flag in an attempt to avoid reliance on U.S. companies, particularly Microsoft. The successful RedFlag formula will now be replicated in the embedded market.

"After dominating the Chinese desktop market, RedFlag is now poised to move into the embeddded market," says Danny Huang, geveral manager embedded products, Redflag Software Technologies Co., Ltd. "With Opera on board as a partner, RedFlag now offers the very best in embedded systems solutions for the Chinese market."

Press release here: http://www.opera.com/pressreleases/en/2002/07/2002 0701_2.html

Opera Software today continued its Linux Bonanza Week with a public release of Opera 6.02 for Linux. The new version includes important fixes to the document and user interface, with special emphasis on the display of Asian characters, making this an important upgrade for Linux users all over the world.

More at: http://www.opera.com/pressreleases/en/2002/07/2002 0703_2.html

and...

Opera waves the red flag in China

In China, the government has moved to install the open-source Linux operating system provided by Red Flag in an attempt to avoid reliance on U.S. companies, particularly Microsoft. The successful RedFlag formula will now be replicated in the embedded market.

"After dominating the Chinese desktop market, RedFlag is now poised to move into the embeddded market," says Danny Huang, geveral manager embedded products, Redflag Software Technologies Co., Ltd. "With Opera on board as a partner, RedFlag now offers the very best in embedded systems solutions for the Chinese market."

Press release here: http://www.opera.com/pressreleases/en/2002/07/2002 0701_2.html

Opera Software today continued its Linux Bonanza Week with a public release of Opera 6.02 for Linux. The new version includes important fixes to the document and user interface, with special emphasis on the display of Asian characters, making this an important upgrade for Linux users all over the world.

More at: http://www.opera.com/pressreleases/en/2002/07/2002 0703_2.html

and...

Opera waves the red flag in China

In China, the government has moved to install the open-source Linux operating system provided by Red Flag in an attempt to avoid reliance on U.S. companies, particularly Microsoft. The successful RedFlag formula will now be replicated in the embedded market.

"After dominating the Chinese desktop market, RedFlag is now poised to move into the embeddded market," says Danny Huang, geveral manager embedded products, Redflag Software Technologies Co., Ltd. "With Opera on board as a partner, RedFlag now offers the very best in embedded systems solutions for the Chinese market."

Press release here: http://www.opera.com/pressreleases/en/2002/07/2002 0701_2.html

It does not spy on the user either, and plenty of information about this is available at their site and in their newsgroups, where independent individuals have analyzed Opera and found that it does not in fact spy on the user.

Besides, anti-spyware sites claim that Cydoor are no longer into spyware. Not that it matters, since Opera only uses Cydoor's servers to get ads, no software from Cydoor.

Or did everyone else really enjoy the opportunity to see the future of mouse gestures? Thank you, Opera and Mozilla!

The question as to whether we should migrate to distributions offering more sophisticated and trouble-free package management is presented. I have a solution.
I got tired of 'an RPM for Redhat. An RPM for other distros. Or even a tar.gz for REDHAT and a tar.gz for OTHER distros' (see opera's download page for an example of what I mean.
FreeBSD, baby.
I've never looked back and wished I'd stayed with Linux.

Andreessen: (Pause). I don't think so. For mass market adoption (open source) is clearly not compelling yet or (Opera) would have more adoption than it does.

Dynamic HTML support.

Mozilla and IE offer a reasonably full DOM model of every loaded page. Every tag is represented in there, and essentially all atributes are categorised and changeable. Done in realtime, too -- have a look at the JavaScript Object Browser script on my homepage.

Opera's JS documentation, meanwhile, can be browsed in about 10 minutes. It has light JS 1.1 support -- not all properties implemented, compared to Mozilla's full JS 1.5. Its DOM is inferior in places to Netscape 4 -- as of v6, you cannot yet dynamically create positioned elements, clip content, or replace content of elements. It can't even run the above script I linked -- it doesn't even index its DOM properties correctly, so you can't say "tell me all properties of the 'window' object" like you can in every other browser.

Don't even get me started on how Opera Lies, pretending to be IE and making it an incredible pain to code in workarounds for its shortcomings.

So yes, Opera has blazingly fast HTML+CSS support, but it has sacrified good JavaScript and DHTML abilities to get it -- it's about 5 years behind the 8-ball, depending on how you want to count it.

I'd recommend Mozilla for the moment for most sites, hopefully Opera 7 will improve on this situation sometime -- the Opera developers have said DOM support is part of their eventual plans.

OK, fine, I can do the same with my remote control, but Rube Goldberg would be so proud!

-Ray

Absolutely LOVE the tabs.

Er, uh, have you tried Opera yet?
They practically invented tabbed browsing.
Not that I don't like Moz, I've had rc3 since its release and I'll download next week when the pipes have cooled.
I've just always thought Opera was a little better than Netscape 4.7. (And hell, at least you had the good sense to stay away from 6.)

Because. And to be specific, MDI, keyboard shortcuts, mouse gestures, disable images with a single keypress, apply user CSS with a single keypress, disable annoying JavaScript popups, size, speed, security, etc. etc. etc. I could go on forever.

http://www.opera.com/support/supsearch/supsearch.c gi?options=index&name=570

It has links to Opera's privacy policy and a detailed technical description of the ad module.

As for the unique ID, it would naturally keep track of which ads have been downloaded already to avoid too many duplicates.

If Doubleclick didn't spy on their users but were labeled as "bad" by "privacy advocates", it would seem that these "privacy advocates" aren't trustworthy, and that facts don't matter to them.

Several people have also actually taken the time to check their facts before spreading FUD and lies. Independent people have analyzed the ad traffic, and Opera is not spyware. Check their newsgroups.

http://www.opera.com/support/supsearch/supsearch.c gi?options=index&name=570

Not only that, but anyone with a brain (and a packet sniffer) can analyze the traffic and see that they are telling the truth.

And the code in Opera which handles ads is 100% written by Opera's own people. It uses no external code.

And while they are partnered with Cydoor, that's no problem since Cydoor has "cleaned up its act considerably", according to this site:

http://www.cexx.org/cydoor.htm

So get your facts straight please.

I try to do cross-browser pages but Opera falls short of Mozilla, NS6, or even IE5. By default it lies and identifies itself as IE in the user agent field. DOM2 support is almost totally missing although some functions seem to be there but are non-functional stubs. Arrrrgh! Here's a list of documented Opera annoyances.

Opera is infested with their own implementation of Cydoor tracking technologies, sure they claim it isnt spyware and is Adware and go to great lengths to say otherwise, but then they would wouldnt they ? then end result is the same the users privacy is at risk!, their info page does say , and i quote....

"Once the browser has connected, it receives a unique user code back from the registration server. This is a unique ID which will be used in all subsequent communication with these particular servers" (emphasis mine)

also

"Without being able to set a unique ID to your browser, it would not have been possible to sell ads in Opera"

hmm i wonder why ?

of note is the "Unique ID" that Cydoor assign to you, tie this to your IP and/or a cookie and they can basically monitor the adverts shown to you and your response specifically to your machine , sure they havent got my name but then they have the next best thing, a supercookie, and we all know how much power doubleclick have/had by just using a simple cookie, it doesnt take a rocket scientist to imagine the data mining possible by using unique id's and a relational database

Spychecker list it as Adware

Spywareinfo do not reccomend it either and have a forum thread here and here where again Opera try to dispell concerns about Cydoor saying "cydoor used to spy on their customers" things get a little heated as workers/advocates clammer to defend their business relationship with Cydoor, but the fact remains that Opera "sponsors" Cydoor for want of a better word in their business practices however un-ethical, by continuing to use them.

Opera should revise their business relationship with Cydoor if they don't want their name dragged through the mud, there are hundreds of ways of generating revenue without resorting to "unique id's" being used

fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me

Opera is infested with their own implementation of Cydoor tracking technologies, sure they claim it isnt spyware and is Adware and go to great lengths to say otherwise, but then they would wouldnt they ? then end result is the same the users privacy is at risk!, their info page does say , and i quote....

"Once the browser has connected, it receives a unique user code back from the registration server. This is a unique ID which will be used in all subsequent communication with these particular servers" (emphasis mine)

also

"Without being able to set a unique ID to your browser, it would not have been possible to sell ads in Opera"

hmm i wonder why ?

of note is the "Unique ID" that Cydoor assign to you, tie this to your IP and/or a cookie and they can basically monitor the adverts shown to you and your response specifically to your machine , sure they havent got my name but then they have the next best thing, a supercookie, and we all know how much power doubleclick have/had by just using a simple cookie, it doesnt take a rocket scientist to imagine the data mining possible by using unique id's and a relational database

Spychecker list it as Adware

Spywareinfo do not reccomend it either and have a forum thread here and here where again Opera try to dispell concerns about Cydoor saying "cydoor used to spy on their customers" things get a little heated as workers/advocates clammer to defend their business relationship with Cydoor, but the fact remains that Opera "sponsors" Cydoor for want of a better word in their business practices however un-ethical, by continuing to use them.

Opera should revise their business relationship with Cydoor if they don't want their name dragged through the mud, there are hundreds of ways of generating revenue without resorting to "unique id's" being used

fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me

Tabbed (or windowed) browsing, a search box (deafulted to google, but you can change that,) in every window, skinnable, a hotlinks/bookmarks folder with stuff that's actually usefull and gestures; in addition to that you can magnify or resize the entire page...not just pictures or text, but the entire page (sometimes it looks like ass, true, but it comes in usefull when you're tired of looking at really small letters...can't tell you the amount of times I've set /. to 140% and sat a few feet further away from the old 19" monitor.

Opera has definitely made my browsing a much better experience. I happily shelled out 40$ today (even though I've been using the free version for like four months or so, I have been too broke to consider paying real $$ for software that is *quite* functional even with the ads....and a note about that: none of the ads were annoying blinking neon sex ads, either. In fact, if i recall correctly the last ad i saw before I payed up was an ad for User Friendly.

I can see how a user of Moz (and I have all 3 browsers on my machine, and I use all 3 regularly (although I really only use IE for windows update and on the rare occasions in which Opera does not render a page well. So far, this is the only page i've come across that doesn't render well.

Give it a try for a week before you knock it, it's way better than IE and at least as good as Moz (although I like it tons more than Mozilla, personally.)

* climbs into asbestos suit

Were your parents retarded? Because you're special!

Perhaps you need to learn how to use that "one browser" to look for the many other browsers and mail clients available for Windows?

Shit, more than one browser? Surely you jest! I guess I'm imagining these copies of Netscape, Opera, and even Lynx?

Maybe you need to think before you go on your stupid little open source crusades next time?
The world isn't made of fairy floss and candy canes. Do you see Epson packaging third party ink cartridges with their printers, you know, just in case you don't want to give money to them?
Will Toyota ever tell you to buy some third party spare parts instead of genuine Toyota?
Apple telling you not to use AirPort on that expensive TiBook you just bought, but instead buy one of the numerous cheaper PCMCIA wireless cards?

You sir, are one of the many reasons open source can sicken me sometimes.

# these property/value combination: 'display: marker', 'text-align: ', 'visibility: collapse', 'content: ', 'overflow: scroll', 'overflow:auto'

1. It is the *one* browser that is nearly 100% standards compliant.

And even then it's as quick as anything else on your PC? You gotta be using slow software.
Opera [opera.com] has -great- rendering speed. And tabbed browsing which I love :)

The Opera browser has, as many have said, had Multi Document Interface since... long ago (I didn't have version before 3.6 ready for checking :). There is, however, a difference between MDI and so-called "tabbed browsing".

MDI supports non-maximized windows inside the MDI frame. Tabbed browsing only supports switching between entire documents, so you cannot chose to have more than one window visible at the same time.

While I rarely use the MDI of Opera for anything except maximized windows, it does show its strength when handling windows opened dynamically by java-/ecma-script on the page, and with sizes not matching the browser's display area. All such windows are still subsumed by the MDI interface, whereas a tabbed interface would have to open windows outside of the tabbed area.

Everything new and exciting that gets done in the new releases of IE, Netscape and (yeeeeach) Mozilla has been done for longer and done better in Opera. Why can't you little slash gay idiot wanna be linux leprechauns get this? It's not hard, just check out the Opera site. The ads get you down? Keys are posted here every time a Browser War inducing post is written. Or hit up Altavista. Easiest place to find cracks for the noob. Simply put, Opera paves the way and the rest just ride the coatails. Wake up to that fact and you'll see. Just check it out and you won't go back.

I've made two changes to my Windows UI that makes the flaws apparent. First, I moved my taskbar up to the top of the screen. Second, I doubled its width. (And I got rid of that silly Quick Launch toolbar, too.) The net effect is that I can more easily see which applications are open and fit twice as many items in the taskbar before they become unreadable.

Now I'm not trying to start a Win vs. Mac war and say that the top or bottom is correct, but from a bottom-taskbar-user switching to a top-taskbar-user I find it more intuitive to keep the taskbar on top.

On to the problems with the MDI interface:

Most programs handle the MDI interface poorly. MS Word is one of them. Having to cycle through open documents with Ctrl + F6 or using the Window...[# of document] menu isn't an easy way to do it. Illustrator is another example of terrible document switching--AFAIK there's not even a keyboard shortcut.

Other programs, like MS Excel, UltraEdit and Opera do this well, listing a strip at the top or bottom of the screen with open documents. However, they still fail in two important aspects:

1. There isn't a way to quickly switch from one document to another that aren't next to each other in the document list. With applications, Windows allows quick switching with Alt + Tab. There is no MDI equivalent. (Ctrl + Tab, Ctrl + PgUp/Dn, Ctrl + F6 are all vain attempts.)
2. Most document list strips are very small, disobeying Fitt's Law, and are thus painful to try to use quickly.

There are examples of this idea that are poorly implemented, like MS Project. It correctly places a button on the taskbar for each open document, but incorrectly (and frustratingly) adds an unnecessary icon to the Alt + Tab list. And there are other problems with this approach, like too many icons cluttering the taskbar.

But I believe that this is the better way to work with documents and applications. If the Windows taskbar can't handle N icons it's not the fault of the model, but the fault of the taskbar. Perhaps a scaling taskbar a la OS X is a better solution. But in my opinion either solution is a better solution than MDI.

Hear ye...I've been using Oprah for 6 months now, and everytime I'm at a window$ box w/out it, I'm stuck gesturing futilely in Internet Exfuckinplorer.

A browser with an MDI interface is nothing new. Mozilla has had it for what seems like years, as has Opera. I don't use Mozilla much (read:ever) but I'm a big fan of Opera. It has a raft of nice touches besides the MDI interface, such as Mouse Gestures, a saved window setup (loads the pages you want on startup), popup blocking, browser impersonation, privacy options, etc. Not to mention web sites actually look identical to IE in most cases as opposed to Netscape's we-screwed-it-up-in-version-4-and-are-too-lazy-to- fix-it-now CSS implementation.

A browser with an MDI interface is nothing new. Mozilla has had it for what seems like years, as has Opera. I don't use Mozilla much (read:ever) but I'm a big fan of Opera. It has a raft of nice touches besides the MDI interface, such as Mouse Gestures, a saved window setup (loads the pages you want on startup), popup blocking, browser impersonation, privacy options, etc. Not to mention web sites actually look identical to IE in most cases as opposed to Netscape's we-screwed-it-up-in-version-4-and-are-too-lazy-to- fix-it-now CSS implementation.

I've never seen that before

How does the tab-thing differ from Opera's similiar function?

And more important question, will they patent this idea, like one graphics-software company did?

Person writing has obviously been using Netscape (and/or IE) a bit too long. Opera is born with it.