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Ford's Astoundingly Better Idea
Here's of the most telling statistics ever offered about Microsoft: In l996, a New York City telecommunications consulting firm concluded that Bill Gates could buy a computer for every unwired kid in America for roughly $6 billion, a fraction of his total wealth. In fact, said the study on the uneven distribution of technology in American education, if Gates invested the interest on his wealth for a couple of years, he could buy those computers without even dipping into his principal.
The industry of which Gates has been the titular head of for years has historically exhibited scant generosity, empathy, or social vision, although recently having discovered the need for better public relations, has begun making some gestures towards charity. Bill Gates has personally given hundreds of millions to charitable causes, along with some Silicon Valley moguls, but bold and dramatic moves towards technological equality and empowerment are not in the nature of modern corporations.
In corporate America, it's practically illegal to do anything with money except distribute it to stockholders as quickly as possible. This is great for the stockholders, but is short-sighted, especially tough on the social fabric of a country in which politicians campaign for office mostly on vows to do little or nothing.
That's why Ford Motor's announcement last week was potentially the most significant technology news in years, vastly more important than the river of hype about mergers and IPOs. Ford will offer each of its 350,000 employees worldwide, from factory workers in India to designers in Michigan, a high-speed desktop computer, a color printer and unlimited Internet access for just $5 a month. This announcement was potentially the most significant technology news in years, vastly more important than the river of hype about mergers, IPOs and stock prices.
Company founder Henry Ford came from a different business era, a time when the individuals running companies could, and sometimes even did, make moral as well as financial decisions about the way their companies worked.
Although by all accounts, Ford was neither an admirable individual nor a likeable boss, his vision of technology had enormous impact on the world. He brought mobility to countless millions who never had it. He understood that workers who were treated well did better work than workers who weren't. He's the reason the automobile quickly became a universal work and recreational option for people of many income levels.
Presented with a number of ideas about how to sell automobiles, Ford became obsessed with the idea of the cheap car, a well-made technological product that almost everyone had a shot at buying. For better or worse, he changed the world, and made a ton of money in the process.
Modern corporations aren't run by individuals but by amalgams of lawyers, directors, stockholders, analysts. Companies aren't interested in bold visions, which is why Ford's computer initiative sent shock waves through the business world. Nobody could remember a move like it.
It's ironic that few computer companies are as visionary. Although several are scrambling to market cheap PC's, the industry for years has been marked by high costs, poor quality, confusing products and service, and endemic arrogance. The industry has always focused on hardware and software; technology's users and their needs are rarely in the forefront of design. Apple computers stunned the industry simply by making computers that were pleasant to look at.
Computing has spread throughout the U.S. and much of the world despite the people who sell and design computers, not because of them. If Ford's initiative spreads - it should - the Net would rise to a completely different level almost overnight. Technology would mean something radically different to many millions of people cut off from it now.
It was ironic how short-lived the publicity was over this astounding business move - especially when you compare the coverage of the cracking of Yahoo. Ford's move didn't get a fraction of the attention and discussion it deserved. It may - almost surely will - turn out to be a much-remembered turning point in the way corporations view technology and their own inter-actions with employees.
The computer give-away harks back to Henry Ford's genius. Companies like Microsoft, Intel, Hewlett-Packard, IBM and Apple ought to be particularly mortified that they didn't think of it first. So should schools, universities and governments.
Ford once enraged other fat cats when he doubled the wage for assembly-line workers to $5 per eight-hour day in 1913. The move reduced training costs at a time when laborers were so hard to find in Detroit that only one in 10 Ford employees stayed for more than a few months, a scenario familiar to contemporary tech workers and companies.
Now his company's trying something even more radical. Ford's new Web sites will link employees all over the world, and give the company new ways of communicating with its staff. It will affect the way the company does business and the personal lives of the people who work for it.
Ford says it will offer Internet home pages in 14 languages, and provide home page links to Ford Web sites, with UUNet as the ISP.
Ford thus not only makes its employees happy, but gives them a strong incentive to stay in their jobs. It gives employees' children the tools they need to compete in the 21st Century workforce. It helps develop a technologically-skilled labor pool that can communicate internally, and promotes interactivity (not readily available in most corporations) and promotes computer literacy abroad. As computing spreads overseas, it could also have broad social, cultural and political consequences. The Internet promotes freedom, education, democracy and prosperity.
If other American companies adopted Ford's model, the technological gap looming between the middle-class and underclass would begin to close. The United States workforce would become the most technologically sophisticated in the world. The high-tech workforce would expand dramatically, along with the educational, cultural, social and economic benefits of computing still unavailable to more than half the American population.
New kinds of programmers and computer users would surge online, perhaps bringing new ideas and approaches to programming, software and the nature of the Net and Web.
Ford's move could upend a few of the conventional stereotypes (many enthusiastically advanced by yours truly) about greedy corporatism. It hasn't yet, of course.
Bill Clinton and Al Gore talked incessantly about building bridges to the future in the last election, but their administration has done relatively little to wire up the country. It could be argued that this is a role for government, but Ford has challenged that notion. If corporations grasp the benefits for themselves and their employees, and take it upon themselves to provide their workers with computers and Internet access - increasingly, a necessity, not a privilege - they can begin rewriting their own sorry history.
Ford really did have a better idea this time. Perhaps even ground-breaking, if it catches on.
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The only problem with this is then Ford thugs will descend upon you and have a right (based on the ruling in the recent Northwest Airlines incident) to take THEIR computer back and go through it to see what you've been doing.
Let's not forget Henry Ford himself was famous for blatantly having thugs beat senseless employees who wanted to unionize. What do you think they'll want to do if you're emailing to incite sickouts?
"More organs means more human." - Zim
what do you mean, schools should have thought about this a long time ago? there arent colleges giing out laptops at very low prices?
It's also a cheap computer that's probably cheaper than paying them a cash bonus.
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you suck. Nuff said.
This really is too bad. There have been a lot of different business and charitable grass roots efforts to get a particular segment wired, etc. Most don't receive any press at all unless there is a bill in front of congress and some politician is pressing the flesh. Thiswas a real opportunity to show off the benefit of having a corporation commit to helping it's staff ramp up and become more technical. Way to go Ford! Hopefully when all the press from the recent DoS attacks fades away someone like 60 minutes will do a rah rah on the whole effort.
It's sad but because this wasn't a "sexy" story involiving violence, bad guys, scandle etc., the press will just do a quick fly by to do diligence and say we covered it and then move on to the next Lewinski type story.
More race stuff in one place,
than any one place on the net.
agreed completely. This was far more important for the community than the denial of service attacks. Delta nd Ford both took a very bold and major step. HP supplies the machines for Ford of course. I blv the internet access for the Ford machines will still need to be purchased, at a minimal amount of $5 a month. And Ford is not thrusting the machines down its employees gullet either. The employees can choose not to take the machines. ..and I guess they can choose not to take the Internet access either. For Delta, I blv the cost is a little higher - a $12 per month and the machines do not have all the paraphenalia as the machines given out by Ford do...
Ok, let's assume Ford is really doing the Right Thing and for the Right Reasons.
Suppose Northwest airlines had done this a while back. Would they have an easier time claiming they were really searching *their* own computers for whatever they wanted to troll for?
--
I don't subscribe to RMS's GNUtopian vision.
My AIBO is a better author. jeez.
Stop wasting precious bits on this crap.
Clarkson was the first in the nation ('85?) to give a computer to students as part of their tuition. Heck, I got a 286 SBC and passive backplane - little did I know that I'd be getting back into that technology 10 years later (a bit more advanced too).
Hartwick gave its students laptops starting in..'93? Maybe 92. My brother went there and got a 386 laptop. IIRC, this was also part of the tuition.
To say that schools aren't doing this is really silly, given that it's been going on for 15 years!
-- Ever notice that fast-burning fuse looks exactly the same as slow-burning fuse? I didn't... (Edgar Montrose)
Go ahead and "rate" my post, slashdot censors, I don't care. You're just as bad as the simpletons that frequent this waste of bandwidth.
GAH! Yahoo and AOL weren't cracked, they were DOSed. And that is not a splitting-hairs distinction either.
Media coverage of the "rash of internet vandalism" has been idiotic in the extreme, and by issuing silly characterizations of these events you're joining the crowd. I know it's a single word, but since you're trying to fit in you should know that precise usage is required. Buzzword dropping is for ZDNet and Wired.
As far as the Ford thing, yes, wow, golly, use of the internet is becoming just as ubiquitous as the television and the telephone. And that's the one place where the two stories meet in the middle -- on the one hand, a major corporation supplying internet access to its employers as it would any other commodity benefit, and on the other hand the mass media pushing the DOS story to the top of the headlines. Yet more proof that the internet is no longer a curiosity, but a part of our basic infrastructure.
We've come a long way from the days when a SLIP connection to a university was unheard of and the Morris Worm was a sidebar on Page 8 of the paper...
The main and primary outcome from this will not be an educated middle/lower class. Computers not put to actual productive use do not educate. Just the opposite.
The immediate and primary outcome will be the fact that the employer will have all the rights necessary to search and desist when it comes to all employee data, including personal. See the NW airlines case today on slashdot.
And offtopic to commander Taco. GET THE BLOODY JAVA BANNER OUT . I do understand that you worry about user security but increasing the security on most slashdot user machines by making sure that they have turned tha jabba off is deinitely not my idea of advertising.
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There's nothing "ground-breaking" at all about offering computers to your employees. It's no different than giving your employee voice mail or a pager. All Ford has done is effectively extended its employees' workplace into their homes. Ford will figure out a way to make their employees productive at home as well as at work, and they will know exactly who in their organization is equipped to work out of the house. This program should be setting alarm bells off, instead of being applauded as a breakthrough employee benefit.
John Katz, you are a master of stating the obvious in a way that manages to offend people.
Yes, it is wonderful that Ford is giving away computers to it's employees. But that doesn't require some fruity "industry analyst" who styles himself as the next John Dvorak to tell me that it's wonderful.
I'm sure you think your opinions are -so important- that they must be shared, that it's your duty to share them. I'm also sure you think that a good percentage of the population just wouldn't be able to cope with all the exciting developments such as this without you holding their hand and telling them what you think.
Your hellmouth stories were great, not because of your writing, but because of the writings of others. Almost everthing else you've written should be marked (-1 redundant), in my opinion.
--Robert
Well, Ford's giving a computer out is nice I'm sure, and expected from the sub-$1000 boom, but I know the government Labs, or at least LLNL, has been loaning out computers/equipment for home use for ages. My father, in the 80s to early 90s, used to just loan out all of our computers (except my brothers TRS80/Tandy1000) from the lab, which included a full 287 and 486DX-50.
:-)
:-)
Back in about '93 he tried to return some of the parts, which they then accused him of stealing. Of course, it was simply that they depreciated it to zero, deleted the records, etc. So now.. he doesn't take out hardware, but does have 3 PCs for work in his office.
And for the 'net.. you simply called them. A machine would pick up, take your ID, call back from the records, take a passcode, and log you ont a VAX/VMS system. From there, rlogin to your own machine (an HP Unix workstation), and off you go. Yeah, secure, and just like now, your employer would watch everything you do. So, no difference except they provided the firewall, and paid the telephone charges. Oh... the days of the 300 baud modem.
"Open Source?" - Press any key to continue
Somebody has to ask the question:
How much of me does my employer own?
Disney makes its animators sign statements that the company owns everything--every sketch, every thought, every image--on or off duty, at home, on vacation...
It's arguable that Disney contractually owns the dreams of its animators.
I'm excited to hear that Ford is creating a "minimum level of computing" for its employees, taking advantages of the tremendous network effects of having a totally wired workforce. They will benefit.
But will there be an acceptable barrier between work related and non work related reporting of computer resources? Will people unintentionally donate the fruits of their free time--hammered out on company resources--to their employers? More importantly, will we finally see a standard of privacy explictly formed for non-realtime(logged by protocol necessity, like email or ICQ) yet highly informal conversation? Or will all mutterings and water cooler talk end up the domain of the corporate censor?
I've *had* a coworker lose her job over a minorly snide comment on a discussion forum. When the lines of communication are owned by the corporation, are the dangers and rights violations posited by the Founding Fathers merely executed by the Corporate rather than the Governmental? Or is Ford explicitly delineating what it can and cannot monitor?
Yours Truly,
Dan Kaminsky
DoxPara Research
http://www.doxpara.com
So with Gate's worth around $100B, I guess it seems quite reasonable to you that he should give away $6B (" a fraction of his wealth") to buy computers for all the kids who don't have them. How generous of you.
So what are *YOU* worth Katz? Middle age, reasonably successful... I'd guess you're worth at least $250K, probablt more... So 6/100 of your wealth would be a measly $15,000. How much do you give to charity, I wonder....
Last time I read anything about Gates, his charitable contributions were in the Billions, not 100's of Millions. He seems to prefer humanitarian causes than getting America wired. More power to him. He's still runs a company that produces shit, but at least give him some credit where due.
The swedish goverment gave extreme tax reductions to all companies (private and the states) who sold computers to their employees. The computers were extremly cheap, good ones with good backup and warrants. Almost all swedish companies jumped on the bandwagon, pressing the computersales in sweden at a new all high. This singlehandedly spread computers into a lot of homes, that didn't have one before. So Ford was in no way revolutionary with this.
If I missed the elimination of privacy element in what Jon wrote, I apologize, but my rants will continue until morale improves.
Already, we have a case where Northwest Airlines now has court decried permission to search the private computers of it's employees in their own homes. They are not yet exercising that power, but they do have it. If that is not yet enough of an outrage, now we have this...
Ford, instead of supplying home computers free (like every other firm with that need does), is offering computers AND internet connection at a discount. If Ford was giving the employees equipment and bandwidth they would have an obvious right to monitor everything. Under this scheme, Ford will not need to get a court order to snoop on the employees that thake up the offer, they will just be able to do it through the normal and accepted (though widly stretched, if they wish) powers of an ISP on traffic monitoring. All under the guise of being "nice" through a "great deal". All the while the employees pay for the potential of privacy invasion.
I really don't give a whit about what they "say" they will do, they will have the ability to monitor everything their employees do.
Wow, I just noticed that I am the hysterical one in this discussion, it seems so alien. With good reason! Friends don't let friends drive Fords.
Eve Fairbanks says I drive a hybrid!LOL
MS should include the pleb version of Visual C++ with every copy of their O/S's they sell.
That way MS would win friends and influence ppl, and there would be many more WinAPI programmers.
We'd have winners all round! Woohoo!
I'm not sure that this is entirely original, though. I seem to recall from History class that the Soviet Union gave away free television sets. Hell of a difference, though, from giving away propaganda devices to giving away the most possibly empowering machines known to man!
Clarkson College (now University) was the first college to give computers to all its students. The first year to have computers was the 1983 incoming freshman class. They got Zenith Z-100 computers with a 5 Mhz processor, 192K of memory, a 320K floppy, and 96K of 3bpp video memory.
-russ
Don't piss off The Angry Economist
In corporate America, it's practically illegal to do anything with money except distribute it to stockholders as quickly as possible.
Which is a damn good thing really. When I invest in a company I want a return on my money, not it going to whatever touchy feely charity some higher up in the company thinks it should go to. If I want to give money to charity I am more than capable of deciding which ones to give it to, I don't need a company to make a donation by proxy for me.
I don't really object to this Ford thing though becuase as I understand it, this was part of the UAW's renegotion of their contract with Ford, so really its a cost of compensation....
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Jon's statement here is reaching:
<i>If other American companies adopted Ford's model, the technological gap looming between the middle-class and underclass would begin to close. The United States workforce would become the most technologically sophisticated in the world. The high-tech workforce would expand dramatically, along with the educational, cultural, social and economic benefits of computing still unavailable to more than half the American population.
New kinds of programmers and computer users would surge online, perhaps bringing new ideas and approaches to programming, software and the nature of the Net and Web.</i>
Examining it further will truly show that he failed to consider a few things. A factory worker or any other worker who receives a shiny new PC from his corporation is not going to magically transform into a superflying, hotshot programming ace. This move is not going to spur bouts of creativity, other than that of the innovative ways that MSMoney lets you manage your checkbook.
However, Jon's statement also holds truth. For many of us who ended up in IT/Dev positions, it's because we had access to computers as children. But back then it was different. MS BSOD didn't pop up every time we tried to push harder on the computer, and many of us probably ignored the limits that were "imposed". But windows, the glut of computer games, and the lack of tools to muck with the interior stuff changed that. It is a sad state of affairs when the kids today don't have even an introductory programming language like BASIC on their home PCs because I believe learning the logic required for good programming helps skills all around.
Yes and no, the move by Ford was good. But the past errors (like removing BASIC programming tools) won't help make up for crafty programmers anytime in the near future.
ALL HAIL BRAK!!!
Ford's announcement last week that it was giving away computers, color monitors and Net access to each of its 350,000 world-wide employees and their families didn't make as much news as the cracking of Yahoo and AOL. But it deserves more attention. [fragment] It was ground-breaking, technological history in the making. If this idea spreads, it could take the Net and the Web to completely new levels, and upend stereotypes (many advanced by yours truly) about greedy corporatism. Computer companies, schools and governments ought to be mortified that they didn't think of it first. Read more. Here's [one?] of the most telling statistics ever offered about Microsoft: In l996, a New York City telecommunications consulting firm concluded that Bill Gates could buy a computer for every unwired kid [children without wires?] in America for roughly $6 billion, a fraction of his total wealth. In fact, said the study on the uneven distribution of technology in American education, if Gates invested the interest on his wealth for a couple of years, he could buy those computers without even dipping into his principal. The industry of which Gates has been the titular head of [redundant] for years has historically exhibited scant generosity, empathy, or social vision, although recently having discovered the need for better public relations, has begun making some gestures towards charity. [run-on] Bill Gates has personally given hundreds of millions to charitable causes, along with some Silicon Valley moguls, but bold and dramatic moves towards technological equality and empowerment are not in the nature of modern corporations.
I can't take anymore.
> potentially the most significant technology news in years,
Yes, that's what he said. Stop and think for a second, people. Now: yes, you're right, this is absurd.
How many years, Jon? 5? 10? More important than, say, news about the first Linux kernel? The first ISP in the UK (or wherever)? The list of technology news which is more significant than this squib could be extended almost indefinitely -- but fuck that; if you want an education, go back to college (or try reading /. -- better than nothing).
Companies setting up home offices for their employees is NOT fucking news, which you'd know if you lived on Planet Earth (how are things on Zorg these days, by the way?) The only unique thing about this is the scale, which is interesting enough to warrant a mention in a "Quickie" posting, nothing more.
I would not call DDoS cracking.
Microsoft aggravates my tourettes syndrome.
(read with sarcastic tone)
Wow, these companies are soooo nice. I'm sure they're only giving out top-'o-the line stuff, a nice PIII-500mhz w/ 21" monitor, 25 gig of disk space and at least 128 meg of ram! Man, i should go work for Ford, or Northwest Airlines! Yep, I think 25 Gig of disk space will be a lot of room to store all those emails regarding sick-outs and stuff. What a nice company Ford is...
Jon, the odds some high ranking Ford executive's kid is into computers and so they did this deal just so the higher ups can get some free computers for their family, in exchange for the company buying lots of them for the workers.
C'mon, doesn't anyone actually READ this before it gets posted?
-pf
Make affiliate bucks
That's nice of Ford, are they going to put controls on the browsers to keep them from looking at competitors web pages?
George
Just because Ford hands out computers to its employees? The people employed by Ford are already the "middle-class" - the real poor in this country are a lot worse off than those "lucky" enough to work for Ford
Yet in the same article he says that Ford realized that a happy worker is a productive worker and that workers get pay raises when there's a labour shortage...hmm, let's connect the dots for him - at the moment there's a shortage of labour ( in the US at least) and this is a cheap way to make workers happy and get them to rely on the company for their personal communication more. Nope, definitely not greedy corporatism there.
Yes, there are potential privacy problems here, at least in the US. (the privacy ruling with NW has no bearing on Ford's computers in other countries, so far as I know) There are other issues as well, such as Ford's choice of OS, ISP, manufacturer. I think that Jon would agree, though, that these things are minor, if it boils down to "Having a computer" vs. "Not having a computer".
Privacy issues will at one point have to be resolved, yes. As will things such as use of the machines by family members (I, for instance, am not permitted to drive my father's company car), the use of the computers to access pr0n or other politically sensitive content, etc. etc.
But pessimism now might turn out to be a very bad thing, if focus on these issues prevents other companies from doing the same as Ford.
This initiative will do several things:
1)it will provide technology to many people who might otherwise not have access to it. in doing so, it has the potential to increase wide-spread levels of education. there are a lot of bright young children out there who could make a lot of themselves if they had better education. even if they cannot afford a good "traditional" eduucation, having access to the internet provieds them with infinite knowldegde *if they desire to partake of it*. Those that are motivated to learn, are now given the chance.
2)This has the potential to cause a huge boom in the technology field in the next few years. Again, by giving computers to people who otherwise might not have them, it brings more people *into* computer-related areas. The best and brightest students who before never had teh *chance* to become interested in technology have teh opertunity, adn if they are truly interested they will take advantage of what they've got. This could bring a whole new collection of people into computing areas, enriching it greatly. not only will it bring more diversity (perhaps?) into the field, but it will be attracting potentially large quantities of intellegent, interested people. Think of how thish could effect teh tech industry...
i'd be tempted to say that, if initiatives like this catch on, this could completely revolutionize society. think about it... the implications are stunning...
Computer-related benefits have been around in the high-tech world for a while. When I worked at Trusted Information Systems from 1993 to 1996, they had a matching-funds program for computer purchases, and employees could get dial-up shell access to e-mail, USENET, and ftp. When Digex made me a job offer a few years back, one of their benefits was an ISDN connection (this was pre-DSL) to my house.
So this isn't quite as new or radical as Katz makes it out to be.
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You cannot wash away blood with blood
Ford's contribution to the Nazi effort
Didn't we just read something like this...
/. reader, knows that they'll wind up confiscating it in the long run to read your files on bringing down robotic car builders. If you decline the PC, you'll probably be shunned.
I'll bet Ford reserves the right to seize the free computers of it's employees if the higher powers suspect employees of sabotage.
Just because something is free, doesn't mean it's better. Take free web hosting, for example. If you sign yourself up, you are at the mercy of your host. You can't post anything they deem objectionable (although they are quite lienent! and they inseminate your pretty site with pop up windows and ad frames.
So I guess when Ford hires you they hand you a new PC. Great! But you, the
----
(Your mother's sig here)
Hmm.
A big company gives away computers.
Katz: Yeah, company!
What happened to Katz, fearless crusader against globalization?
Ford is one of the biggest globalized, untouchable companies in the world.
What happened to Katz the privacy hysteric?
Companies supplying computers to employees is the worst thing to happen to employee privacy ever.
The union wanted it - and in the big picture, its a relatively cheap benefit. People PC normally charges $25 a month - you've got to figure Ford negotiated that down quite a bit. So for say, $18 a month per person (tax deductable for ford), they buy union goodwill, a boatload of good press, and the undying devotion of Jon Katz, who I'm sure will be rushing out to buy a Ford vehicle now :)
Also- remember that most major benefits (paid for by somebody else) that are now increasingly viewed as rights (ie. health care, retirement benefits, and now computers) started as union negotiated benefits. Its only a matter of time before somebody is pushing a bill through congress mandating that all employers buy computers for their employees.
Ok, Ford descides to give all of its employees a computer and internet access. How is this a new inovative idea? If you work for an airline company you can get free flights to anypart of the world. If you're a CEO of a Fortune 500 company you get access to the executive brothel. These things are called Perks and that's all it is. Ford now has a new tool to use in recruting new employees while keeping an eye on the current ones. To say this a major turning point in everyday life is nothing but pure bull.
Many companies (especially banks) have given free PC's to all their employees the last couple of years. The idea is
1) To give them something they don't have to pay tax off.
2) A vague hope that they will be better at using computers (which is why the Danish politicians doesn't tax these gifts, liuke they tax everything else).
I don't think there are anything signficant about it, like the US (and unlike the rest of EU) Denmark has had a booming economy and low unemployment the last few years. In such a situation, companies will do their best to make themselves an attractive place to work. Tax-free gifts are one way, especially since the strong unions prevents raising the pay.
I think if slippy Bill did give out a free PC to every unwired kid in America, the investment would fuel back up to MS in big bucks. Increase the user base and eventually they are going to want to buy software from somebody. Sure, they may get the next version of Windows.. or Office. Or if they are kids, then the'll get some educational software, which was probably developed on MS tools.
And, if it's done as a "charity", I'm sure there are huge tax breaks.
Even at the expense of Gates getting richer, I would like to see unwired kids getting hooked up. It helps.. helps a lot, but that's another topic all together.
Organized charities are filled with socialists, who work to undermine the social and economic structure within which I make my living.
Should I ever get rich, I will never give a cent to any foundation, charity, university,
I do charity on a personal basis. More work, but at least the mistakes are mine.
Oh, yes. Almost forgot the obligatory "Katz is an idiot" statemet.
"The Constitution, the WHOLE Constitution, and nothing but the CONSTITUTION."
A few things to say: Katz says that billg can donate $6 billion without even dipping into his net worth. Six billion is nearly 10% of his wealth today, and was even a more significant percentage in 1996, when that statistic was made. While he could easily afford it, Katz severely exaggerates how much he could afford it. Second, Katz lauds Ford for doing a big thing for each and every one of his workers. Would he be saying the same if they took the exact same $$$ and made it a one time bonus in cash? Third, Katz believes that corps have obligations in their own right to be charitable. Personally, I don't think that this should be the case - corporations have shareholders, and if anyone has that obligation, it should be the shareholders. It seems quite silly to view a corp to have this burden. There are exceptions, but people generally agree that it is good for haves to be charitable to havenots. If a company makes a charitable donation, that is money that would otherwise have gone to shareholders. That shareholder could be a factory worker that doesn't make much, or it could be a very rich person awash in riches. My point is that the rich person, not the collective corp, should be the one doing the giving. Some might say that often these rich people do not give charitably. I won't deny that. But it is these individuals that Katz should be railing against. But then again, "Corporatism" is a more evil sounding word than "Individualism"
I read today (I'm looking for it again but I can't find it), that Northwest airlines were going through employees computers (through court action) to find out whether they took part in a planned "sick out" back in december. Pretty scary stuff. I do not know whether Northwest has a similar computer program but it would seem to be even easier for company's to appropriate data on a machine that was "given" to an employee.
One of the things we are missing in this whole discussion is that this giveaway was a result of a collective bargaining agreement between Ford and the UAW. For those of us who no longer remember the phrase "collective bargaining" it means Union Negotiation.
I do not know who came up with the idea first, Ford or the UAW, but the fact that they were in contract negotiations at all is because there is a union at Ford. Also, as happens when a union negotiates a strong contract, non-union employees get the benefits as well. A lot of people think unions are on their way out, but this indicates that they may still have a place in the modern workforce.
"this post paid for with union dollars"
"The conduct of neither [party], if strictly examined, will be irreproachable." -Elizabeth Bennet
As I understand it, the UAW was insturmental in getting Ford to dish out the computers. I wouldn't be so quick to chalk up this move to corporate generosity or vision. I think keeping the union happy with a non-monetary benefit to workers is more like it. Would Ford rather give $1000 raises or go out an buy 300,000 PCs at a volume discount for its employees?
What do people think the motivations of the Ford motor company is?
I was reading ~2 months ago about a union talking about supplying thier members with computers and internet service so as to provide online union information and voting. In the hopes that they could influence more involvement and education of the workers.
Maybe Ford would prefer to give them a TV, or at least a head off the unions from supplying a tool that could be used to organize workers.
Yes, Yes I know that they could access a union page from the Ford computer but is it as likely when it is not thier ISPs homepage?
an_Allegory
after reading the piece, I still don't understand why giving computers away is a good idea, especially for a car company. I'm not sufficiently enlightened to understand how have thousands of bolt-turners on line does anything for Ford. The arguments presented are long on feel-good blather, and short on specifics. I imagine that if I were a Ford investor/owner, I'd be skeptical of this.
Seriously though, people can just use Cygwin if they want a free compiler. The VC++ IDE is exceptional though, and I have yet to see a free IDE as good as it (although KDevelop could very well get there soon).
-----------
"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
I think it's simple why they're doing it...
From the Evil Overlord list:
100. Finally, to keep my subjects permanently locked in a mindless trance, I will provide each of them with free unlimited Internet access.
Simple, really...
--
The Future: Some assembly required; batteries not included.
When I saw the headline, the first thing that popped into my head is that Ford has implemented an interesting solution to increase productivity. Give them a PC and internet line at home, and then disallow all personal web surfing from the desk at work. Lost revenues verses cost of a PC. This must be the CFO's idea.
The only thing worse than a Democrat is a Republican.
As opposed to those black'n'white monitors that most companies give to their employees.
Hmmmm... wonder if you can even get a black'n'white VGA monitor, anyway.
RP
If this idea spreads, it could take the Net and the Web to completely new levels
:/
That's true... in the US, where the local phone calls are free.
Here in Europe, an Internet connexion is still very expensive, much more than the computer itself. *DSL and cable are only experimental technologies and the good old PSTN modem is still the only way to surf the net for most of us.
What I wanted to point out is the fact that here, the Internet will make a giant leap when the connexion costs will be affordable by everybody... and not before!
Stéphane
Instant Karma's gonna get you, Gonna knock you right on the head (John Lennon, 1970)
Just for the record Henry Ford was a huge anti-Semite. Let's not paint him to be an angel. pooploop who forgot his password
"That's why Ford Motor's announcement announcement last week was potentially the most significant technology news in years, vastly more important than the river of hype about mergers and IPOs. Ford will offer each of its 350,000 employees worldwide, from factory workers in India to designers in Michigan, a high-speed desktop computer, a color printer and unlimited Internet access for just $5 a month. This announcement was potentially the most significant technology news in years, vastly more important than the river of hype about mergers, IPOs and stock prices."
We have to preview before submitting. If you are trying to be a professional writer, act like one.
This is a commentary based off of a Ford press release that I spammed to this board a few days ago. Is this a coincidence? I think not
People this is proof that spamming slashdot gets things done, and gets them done quickly. Now let us spam for all our favorite causes and make slashdot truly perfect!!!
If greedy corporatism is what Katz was protesting before, isn't this just an example of a greedy corporation attempting to co-op its employees into mindless submission?
Eh, if there was some way to make absolutely sure that the company couldn't infringe on the privacy of its employees, and that the company couldn't own your ideas/creations, Ford's idea would be friggin awesome. But it's meaningless without it. I think.
--
Peace,
Lord Omlette
AOL IM: jeanlucpikachu
[o]_O
...as long as it's beige and runs Windows.
Sorry to spew Anti-MS rhetoric out on this, but you CAN'T tell me this doesn't have anything to do with Microsoft & Ford getting in bed together. Didn't anyone see Captain Bill's Comdex keynote where he was showing off his new Windows based computer in the dashboard of that ugly Focus or whatever it's called? It was real clear that there was some kind of FordMS cooperation going on there.
Of course, Fords suck anyhow (*duck*) now I've got an even better reason.
New for 2001!
The New Ford Internet Explorer!!
Blech. Signatures.
Henry Ford once developed his car parts from soy beans in order that farmers would make higher profits and in turn buy his automobile...
By handing out computers, Ford is transforming the fear of new technology among its workers to familiarity, and encouraging employees to find a technological edge in thier jobs as well as thier lives.
The impact will be great, as each employe becomes more technologically minded...
either that, or the next car will be made out of silicon...
I need a TiVo for my car. Pause live traffic now.
In corporate America, it's practically illegal to do anything with money except distribute it to stockholders as quickly as possible. Very few companies still offer dividends - shareholders would generally rather have the money spent on improving the business, driving the share price up. But you'd rather badmouth corportations, despite your statement to the contrary in your opening paragraph.
--
http://gammatron.weblogger.com
The unions asked for the computers. It's to their advantage to use the web to help them organize workers. Katz doesn't have a clue about the real motives here.
Today, with a very tight labor market, companies have to find creative ways to keep employees. Ford offers computers rather than stock options. Out of the goodness of their heart? Are workers who e-mail relatives at home more productive when they come in to work on an assembly line? Does Ford's "generosity" really deserve our praise?
How long before owning a computer and having an ISP become rights? Are we looking at creation of Compuaid/Compucare entitlement programs? Will the government soon be talking about taking over the computer/software/telecommunications industries to lower e-mail costs? Will AOL become a federal program? Will the next president nominate Steve Case as Secretary of ISP?
Well...color me confused...but I really don't get it. Sure this is nice of Ford...thet get tons of great PR to go along with a nice tax write-off, but how is this "ground-breaking, technological history in the making" I really don't get it.
Maybe I'm different but I would rather have them give me an extra $1000 in stock perks than a new computer that will be obsolete in 3-4 years.
If Ford wants to make a difference why don't they institue programs to give computers/internet access to the lower class families who can't afford them. THAT might help make a difference.
Or maybe go to inner city schools and give them computers and pay for some quality technology proffessionals to go in and help the kids learn how to use them. THAT might make a difference.
Color me cynical but I really don't see this as anything special or groudbreaking.
Maybe a linux start-up should mail free cds of linux to all of the ford employees....
I need a TiVo for my car. Pause live traffic now.
If other American companies adopted Ford's model, the technological gap looming between the middle-class and underclass would begin to close.
I'm not convinced. If you can get a job at Ford, or GM, you're probably not part of the underclass. Factory workers may be blue collar, but I think the jobs are relatively well paying, with the occasional worker with lots of overtime getting the high 5 figures.
I thought part of the problem of the "underclass" was that there weren't as many blue collar, factory type jobs any more.
Now, if McDonalds were to make this kind of announcement, and apply to all their part time help, then some of the "underclass" might benefit.
George
As a (paid) editor, I disagree with the comments you've made about Jon Katz's piece.
Are you really so concerned about grammar that you'd let it override meaning? Is "unwired kid" in the context of this article truly confusing or ambiguous? It wasn't for me. The run-on sentence you identify isn't. The fragment you point out is a fragment, but so what? Persuasive writing is about more than formalisms; short connectors are useful. Can you name a political columnist, for instance, who never uses sentence fragments?
Are there a few typos, the occasional misplaced or missing word? Sure. Are they worse than ones that regularly appear in other news services? Not by a long shot. Slashdot is growing (in readership and staff), and it's coped well so far.
Cheers,
timothy
p.s. Full-time editorship is less than a month away, so relax.
jrnl: http://tinyurl.com/c2l8yr / foes: http://tinyurl.com/ckjno5
my mother used to work for a salt company in PA. During the winter months it was sometimes too hard (or even against the law) to travel in the snow, so her company gave her a PC+modem to do her work from home...
.02
it was in our house for probably about two years. during those two years I don't believe that they once checked what was on the machine, or if she used it for any personal use.
I think that most people are paranoid about that sort of thing, but to be honest, do you think that Ford really thinks that an employee is going to start an email about a "sickout" on a company computer? I would think that the safest method to plan one of those ordeals would be word-of-mouth...
Let's stop worrying about the fact that your company may be able to track your Internet usage, emails, etc, and look at the bright side... They will be opening up possibilities for families of young children that normally would not have had access to have access to the Internet...
Just my
Jon... you have a /. E-Mail address. I assume you have a /. login. Use it! Also, on the topic of Linux worshipping... If you would just start being more technology savvy then people would call you a technology mogul instead of some guy who reads the first 3 sentences of some NYT.com, writes a way too long article about it that is stating the obvious, then claiming that you are shaping the views of society. Jon, start writing about interesting things in an interesting manner, not just fluff. Everything I have read by you from this to your movie reviews just seems like the fluff you would see on the back of a VHS tape (you know... where they try to sum up the movie in 2 paragraphs).
... it has been said that the government which can give you everything, can also take everything away from you. Now, s/government/company/g. Your book-length tirades about "corporatism" prove that you know that government and business are equal rivals for the title of most untrustworthy institution. As was illustrated in another Slashdot story, companies are now claiming the right to order searches of home computers. This will be made easier if the computer is a company-supplied one. I don't know if this Ford-giving-away-computers thing is such a good idea. Geez, Katz, you have all the facts right there before you. Why not try synthesizing them together before sitting down to write?
WOOHOO!!!
My friend Spankey asked his a simple question about Geos. Mr. Katz then proceeded to tell my friend Spankey that Geos was nothing compared to the tragedies befalling this countries youth!!! He then bit my friend Spankey's shoulder. I don't know why he did this to my friend Spankey, but I saw the marks: it was a very nasty bite, indeed. My friend Spankey now spends most of his time sitting in a corner eating rice pudding and chanting "Jon Katz John Katz John Katz bit me". It is kind of freaky. Now I really think my friend Spankey is strange. -A Friend of Spankey
How interesting in light of the Northwest airlines post earlier this morning.... Honestly, I've been a vendor to FoMoCo in the past, and I am not impressed.
It is an interesting move by Ford. Will these computers run the GNU system?
I am aware of at least one college in Pennsylvania that has provided a brand new notebook computer to each freshman every september.
They don't, however, upgrade the computers for students, which means that after 4 years you have a paper weight...but it still remains to be seen how Ford will deal with the implications of Moore's Law.
(NOTE: In order to keep the computer, you must graduate. If you leave early, you gotta give it back)
-FP
In corporate America, it's practically illegal to do anything with money except distribute it to stockholders as quickly as possible. This is great for the stockholders, but is short-sighted, especially tough on the social fabric of a country in which politicians campaign for office mostly on vows to do little or nothing.
Politicians should be doing little or nothing. Everytime a politician does anyting in this country, it costs taxpayers more money. The less they do the better. To say that it is wrong that companies give back the best possible return to their stockholders shows a complete lack of compassion towards the people who pay for this country to operate. The top 15% of income earners in the US shoulder more that 50% of the tax burden (source: Congressional Budget Office - stats from 1995) To say that a company is being greedy when it wants to keep the money that's left over after the government gets done taking its increasingly larger share is just insulting.
Political commentary aside, if you think that this computer giveaway isn't a calculated business descision, you need to re-think. If Ford had said, "Everyone get's $1500 dollars more in matching 401K funds this year," how would this be any different? Would you have even bothered with a story about it? Would it have been the "the most significant technology news in years"? It's a business descision, that is all.
Uhm...maybe it's just my silly imagination, but didn't I hear that the computers were agreed to by Ford earlier in negotiations with their workers? I wouldn't sing the praises of large altruistic corporation just yet.
Ever notice how, from a customer standpoint, a car is a good analogy for a computer. Both are complex systems marketed as a black box, to people who don't understand the product, by arrogant salespeople. Both are hyped to the max.
These days, both can be instruments in violent acts, either intentionally or through neglect.
An exception: no one is giving away cars, and the price isn't crashing.
The overall program will be coordinated by PeoplePC, Inc. of San Francisco. The computers and printers will be provided by Hewlett-Packard Company of Palo Alto, Calif. UUNET, an MCI WorldCom company based in Fairfax, Va., will provide the Internet service.
The base computer will have a 500-Mhz Celeron chip, 64 MB of RAM, a 4.3GB hard disk for storage, a CD-ROM, software, a 15-inch monitor, speakers and a modem. The printer will be a color inkjet. Employees can upgrade to three more powerful computers at their expense and the monthly fee will cover incidental personal use.
I believe that the program would be much more useful if the employees were allowed to choose from a wider range of hardware & software. These systems seem to be little more than cheap Wintel boxes. Buying 350,000+ of them ought to get a bit of a discount, so on the scale of corporate employee benefits, "this ain't that big."
It seems that Ford is attempting to create a corporate culture here; unfortunately, this culture looks to have all the variety and creativity of the model T. ("Any color they want, so long as its black." paraphrase attributed to H. Ford)
The Internet has no garbage collection
Tech-savvy netizens disenfranchied blah blah blah
Nothing companies do is free, whether that be giving its employers computers or paying corporate taxes. Ford shareholders may be swell people, but they have limits on how low their returns may go. this may be a minor expense in the big picture, but the price of your next Explorer or Escort will ever-so-slightly reflect the increased expense.
But the biggest economic falsehood that Katz furthers is that money not "given away" is idle. While we shudder at the thought of people being able to tell us what do do with our "excess wealth" or "free time" (anyone experienced the wonderful 'compulsory volunteerism'?), it is a basically wrong assumption to think that money can only be used for socially good purposes ONLY if it is given away.
So Gates or whoever has this huge pot. He could donate it, sure. He could also buy a yacht. Awful corporate greed, right? Well, maybe, unless you happen to be a yacht dealer or builder who relies on that purchase for your living. OK, so he could add on to that monstrous house of his. What narcissism, right? Sure, unless you happen to be one of the technicians or architects or builders who will do business with him.
Even if all Gates does is slap his fortune in the bank, it is still being used to make loans for someone's first home or seeding the next great startup. The only way anyone's money goes unused is if it sits under your mattress, and in Gates's case, that would have to be one honking big mattress.
I feel pretty confident that Katz would consider it a proper use of Gates's money to buy Katz's book. Any of us who have money to spend have earned it, and whether it is spent buying Katz's book, buying a yummy Publix sub, or given to the guy on 34th Street, it benefits someone, and it is none of your damned business how it is spent. That we derive some sort of return (be it physical
This ignorance is amazing, and people keep falling for it. Now, all we have is Katz making value judgements on how money we earn should be spent. Just be thankful he has no power to act on those judgements.
If MS did so, that would be the same kind of "bundling" software like they did with IE. This would be the ideal move to press C++ Builder and Watcom out of the market. Microsoft is already involved in a monopoly lawsuit, so I suppose they won't even face the risk of another huge one. By the way, MS really can't complain about the number of WinAPI coders. It is amazing that the software industry picked it up - the WinAPI is continuously changing and a real chaos. Ask the Wine developers..
So this may not be as altruistic as it initially sounded. As for me, call me jaded and selfish, but I'll take the cash, please.
...Open Source isn't the only answer -- but it's almost always a better value than the alternatives...
ford's best idea is a drivers-seat grits-pump that will issue a steady stream of hot grits into the driver's pants while driving. thank you.
... please try to keep in mind that no company as large as Ford will do anything that they don't think will ultimately benefit their stockholders. It just won't happen. Period.
There's no mention anywhere about what sort of agreement the employees have to sign to get the computer, and whether they allow Ford to monitor their email, etc.
as someone who worked at ford for years, i can assure you that as a company, it is nowhere near organized enough to be using this in a sinister way. i've seen engineers and developers sleeping under their desks, in cubicles, not just offices... where anyone could see them.
it really is a laid-back place (for the most part) and after this recent announcement i almost regret not being there anymore
it's too bad the main coverage of it here on
If Ford's initiative spreads - it should - the Net would rise to a completely different level..clip
i wouldn't point that out except that every single one of katz' features on
please, i'm begging you, get some writers that can actually fucking write,..
...dave
Think different? I'd be happy if most people would just think...
First off let me say this:
/. thank god).
the JOB of a journalist, IMHO, is to make you think. IF your idea of thinking is a gut reaction to "I hate you" then great, if it means looking deeper into what someone said to find flaws, or find backing, then even BETTER
everytime something from Katz comes up, we get a gazillion posts saying nothing more than "I hate katz I hate katz".. fine.. dont read it then, and PLEASE dont consider yourself forced to give us your opinion.. after all.. *(most)* of the flames are people saying "katz's opinion is wrong" when in fact the same ruler could be layed against the poster.. *YOUR* opinion is wrong to ME.. so if you have nothing to add, please go post about Natalie somewhere else, okay? PLEASE?
Now.. onto the article.. Im not sure what this bodes for the net.. (do we REALLY want that many people suddenly dumped on it? *sigh*) But I think this is a GOOD thing in the long term. IF you are all worried about Ford finding something illegal on your machine, umm, well, dont d/l illegal stuff.. that's pretty cut and dried. Anyone who would accept this sort of thing without it VERY clearly spelled out in writing what is acceptable terms of use, and what is not needs to have their head examined, I suspect.
I know what "acceptable use" at my company constitutes, so Im just very careful about where I go (so far, no flack about
But this is good.. it brings computers into the home, it gives us Linux junkies a chance to bring over more millions to the dark side.. and it gives a LOT of small children access to something they critically NEED in this day and age.. a computer, so they can LEARN how to use one. NOt the 'net' as much as just the box itself.. all the training in the world wont help you if you are alien to the equipment.
Just my ton of comment.
Maeryk
Feminine Protection? What is that? A chartreuse flame thrower?
IBM gave its employees PC's at a 40% discount almost 20 years ago. My first PC was an 8088 with green screen and graphics printer for around a $2000 discount, in 1983 dollars.
Nowadays a PC costs $500; the whole package maybe $1000. What kind of a "revolution" are we talking about here?
---- "If we have to go on with these damned quantum jumps, then I'm sorry that I ever got involved" - Erwin Schrodinger
There are some obvious reasons that Fnord did this, and not just for altruism alone.
The first is obvious: people in the offices can be required to take work home with them. Heck, they have a computer, why not?
The system can check to see if an employee is really at his (fith or 6th) granmother's funeral, or if he's on the web.
UUNET can spike their email to Fnord Motor Company as official communication. This is unlikely, but possible since they still OWN the computers.
The Fnord connected websites can easily coerce employees into doing extra work, like commenting on conditions on their own time. I see nothing wrong with this, but it raises the possibility.
I just can't personally see a company computer. It reminds me too much of the "company store"
whatddya get? another day over and you're deeper in debt.
Lowmag.net
The computer is an information and communication tool. There has been a long history of information and communication tools that have been invented in the past like printing presses, libraries, mail, telephones, radio, etc. All of these technologies were expensive at first, therefore many could not afford them, and now even the poor have many of these technologies available to them.
Before the printing press, books were very expensive and only a few people could afford them. Katz could be writing this same essay, but substitue computer with "book" and change the timeframe back a few hundred years and the arguments and hopes would be the same.
I don't believe computers are the one great breakthrough that will bring us closer to a perfect world. It will have effects on society, but is the world significantly better off now with all our technology than it was 1000 years ago? We still struggle with the same issues of rich/poor/love/hate/law/crime/war/peace/freedom/et c that have always been there. We haven't solved them through technology yet, and we never will.
It is interesting that Ford is giving away compters, but a few years down the road, we will have the same reaction as if a company passed out free radios to their employees today.
Your password has expired, please login to change it.
No Jon, The Internet does not promote any agenda. Witness the large amount of porn and hate sites online. If anything the Internet promotes fringe viewpoints which would otherwise stay in the shadows where they belong.
Its hard to see how neo-nazi sites promote democracy.
It would help us if in future you were to proof read your ramblings, and remove all the assertions which you cannot back up with FACTS.
dmg
Well, Mr. Smith your performance at Ford has been excellent, your perfect attendance, your teamwork and leadership skills etc. etc.... looks like your in for a big raise, and we should keep an eye on you for promotion.... Oh wait, almost forgot, lets take a quick look at your logs on the Corporate ISP. Oh my, you sure must enjoy reading alt.sex.hamsters.duct-tape, and related web sites....
This signature used to contain a cute kitty virus with ansii art. Please set the slashdot editors on fire. Thank you
Their Halewood Plant in Liverpool England, is being refitted this summer, ford have committed their shop floor workers to help maintain the local schools whilst the factory is being done. They've committed either £10,000 or £20,000 to raw materials, I cant remember which.
Several hundred million? Try nearly twenty billion dollars.
-------- "All I want in life's a little bit of love to take the pain away" --Spiritualized
I'm most definitely not a fan of Microsoft, but he has done more for people by creating a company that employs and enriches thousands than most charities ever do.
Why pick on Bill Gates to give PCs to kids? Why not Warren Buffet? Eric Raymond (he's flush at the moment)?
In the real world, people don't get rich to give money away, they get rich to enjoy the proceeds that it brings. In creating a company, they enrich other people (employees, customers, suppliers etc) in the process.
You seem to mis-understand why companies exist. You seem to think they are there to swan about the world doing good deeds, and giving people jobs. They're not. They are there to enrich their owners by providing a good or service that people want. That's all they are there to do, and that's all they owe anybody.
If Ford are giving PCs to employees cheap, then good luck to them. But I hope they are doing it for sensible financial or business reasons, not to impress the gullible.
And honestly, Jon, you really are a hack. Your stories are all written to a formula.
- Take a big event in the news
- Tie it into how it proves that the internet is great
- Bend your logic to show that it proves open source is the way of the future
- Mention Linux
- Mention Microsoft and how it proves that they are evil.
The irony is you are writing these stories for the most die-hard bunch of Linux loving, Microsoft-hating open source evangelists ever gathered together in one place, and you still get no respect. It is a tribute to their discernment that sucking-up gets you nowhere.
Try leaving the odd band wagon un-jumped upon. Your writing might improve.
You pay to go there, you also pay for that laptop.
I have to return some videotapes...
Many ppl who would be interested in coding as a hobby probably don't know about Cygwin.
Bundling a cut-down version of something is not anti-competitive, remember turbo-basic and gwbasic
co-existed at one time.
Nice to see you two responding without the typical MSSux mentality.
I
So if I work for a PC manufacturer, will we get free cars and air travel miles??
Well not too fast!
If and when you have a computer at home, you'll have to train during your free time, and no any more during work hours.
Go and browse some of the Corporate World Think Tank, and check that. I know that Bosch in Germany at least, made huge saving by having people using their familly computer at home and their free time for a training that, in a decent world, should have occured during work hours, in the company buildings, on the company's computers.
Corporations are greedy, for sure !
And I'm not talking about the loss of privacy..FCh.
There are other things to consider in the Northwest Airlines case. The company has accused the employees of illegal strike activity. At the time, IIRC, a court said that they couldn't strike and they did this "sick-out" which is illegal. The searching of the employee and union leaders' computer is just a type of discovery in their lawsuit. That article also said they have yet to excercise those rights (most of the case has been settled.)
If this is as someone posted earlier, part of a collective bargaining agreement, there may be protections set out as to whether these computers are Ford assetts in their entirity or whether they are renting/buying them. If they, the employees, are renting/buying them then I would assume that Ford probably would have less rights to access them.
With regard to the web sites, I have a feeling that these sites are probably more intranet type of things that would have information for employess like, office parties, what plant put out the most vehicles, and that type of stuff, not personal home pages for the employees.
While I don't disagree with Jon Katz' post, I do think it is important to take care in realizing just how truly malevalent Henry Ford himself was when talking about his "positive accomplishments".
As well as the extremely violent strike-breakers he regularly employed, who murdered and mutilated a large number of his employees, Henry Ford was certainly the most infamous and most prominent anti-semite of his time. He was an extremely enthusiastic supporter of Adolf Hitler's rise (this is not Goodwin's Law in this context)... going as far as direct monetary support of that regime. As well, Henry Ford republicized and brought to prominence the hate tract _Protocols of the Elders of Zion_. Probably worst of all, Ford himself was author of the millions-selling _International Jew: The World's Foremost Problem_.
Just something to keep in mind when thinking of the basis of Fordism.
Buy Text Processing in Python
THe year after my freshman year, they discontinued that program, and offered packages students could buy with a few options. Zeniths and NECs were the 2 brands. You paid for the computer in June, and got it in August. Yeah, that's nice. They realized that was a failure and dropped it altogether - now they "very strongly recommend" that you come with your own PC, and if you can get a NIC installed before you arrive, they're even happier.
Liverpool, NY's high school proposed last week that all incoming 10th graders be required to own and bring a laptop. 10th graders!. And last I heard, no subsidies from the gummint or the school. Those machines would get destroyed in a matter of days. Or stolen. Or you'd have kids sitting in the library/class playing games instead of doing what they're supposed to be doing.
That program was discontinued in '97. Students were bringing better computers than Clarkson could offer at the same price.
To whom should government be giving away computers, and why should they be doing it? To just their employees? I think they get enough perks as is. To all Americans? In either case, does Mr. Katz think the money will just appear from the ether? Does he understand that all government moneys started out as taxpayer moneys? I must wonder at the color of the sky in the world Mr. Katz inhabits.
now i've realized you have no particular ideological stance. let me take you back to your "old" ideas about corporatism (last week's ideas)....maybe ford is acting in their own self interest, just maybe?!??
did you read yesterday's post on northwest, or about clinton's digital divide initiative. now companies like aol/tw will be giving free set tops to those poor little people who need to "get on the internet".......PPPPLEEEEEAAAASE!! Cut the altruistic crap! these companies will now have a captive audience to SELL SELL SELL. the network HAD potential to be a liberating force, but everyday the idea seems more like a dream. can anyone disagree with that? maybe the problem is just us, the humans, and no amount of tech is going to fix our greed or lack of concern for other beings. when did greed become society's guiding hand? thankfully nature is a self correcting system......i'm with george carlin...EVOLVE OR FUCK US ALL!!!
Probably not, but it's dead simple to monitor where the users go, and who's going to argue that the company shouldn't monitor the usage of these computers that they themselves supplied? Then it's simply a matter of the 'chilling effect' of wondering whether you can be fired from Ford because they know you read slashdot and fear you are a hacker :)
Have any of you tried to get health insurance without going through your employer? Maybe you are self-employed or out of work and need insurance. It is almost impossible to purchase anything at a reasonable price. It makes it just that much harder to change jobs because many health plans don't cover pre-existing conditions until you've paid in a year's worth of premiums.
Why is it in this country that the only cost effective way to get health insurance in through your employer? Because it benefits the employers, it keeps us in our place as good little employees. It makes it just that much harder to strike out on your own and be an independant, or even just to seek out a better job.
If net access becomes a similarly restricted "benefit" (read as "leash") then it is just one more tool that the big corps will have to keep the common man down. When you've had an email address for a couple of years and the same for your website, it is a pain to change, but just imagine if net access outside an employer "benefit" plan cost $100/month instead of the $5/month you pay through your employer, that can be a significant hurt on anyone trying to start their own business.
It is no wonder the union was all for it, they have a vested interest in keeping people employees (and thus union members) too.
I think that all "benefit" plans should be tax-free payouts that the individual employees can apply to things like retirement, health insurance, disability insurance, and what-have-you. Make the basics for a stable life and successfull life MORE portable, not less.
blah blah blah
/already/ had a computer and internet access? I sure would rather get a raise or better health coverage. This is just a ploy. Sort of like how dumping tons of money into computers for public schools was supposed to be some sort of panacea that would magically make everything better.
Ford gives computers to employees...
How is this an "astounding better idea"? Better than what? How is it even relevant to the business they're in? It's nice and all, but wouldn't raises accross the board be a better idea? I mean, it's not going to be some great boon to internet society that an extra few thousand or hundred thousand come online. If I were a Ford employee I'd feel screwed. What if I
Jazilla.org - the Java Mozilla
It's 10 PM. Do you know if you're un-American?
YEAH, Kick that shithole of a mother fuck Jon katz in the shithole. WEEE DOGGY
Does anyone edit your writing? While the ideas behind the article are worthwhile, you fail to evaluate any of the ideas critically. Admittedly, you have a forum full of critical thinkers to do that for you. Still, the sheer redundancy of phrases and the disconnected paragraphs of your post indicates that you write to impress us rather than express to us.
You've got decent ideas, but their unrefined, redundant presentation gets in the way. You waste 1140 words on what could have been luxuriantly expressed in under 500.
We aren't paying you by the word. In fact, quite the opposite. As technical professionals, we prefer clean, thorough text to self-aggrandizing redundancy. Please consider this when submitting your next piece.
Never send anything unencrypted that you don't want to have appear in court.
Hate to be the one to break it to you, but giving away computers and Internet access is not a government responsibility. A car is much more useful to most, but the government does not give those away. I don't work for the government. If my employer wants to add something to the deal we made when I agreed to work for him, fine, so long as he does not implement this deal unilaterally at the expense of that to which we agreed. If a government does this, it does it by using force to take the money away from someone else. And while you praise this for what it could do to the net, there could be a dark side. When AOL dumped thousands of clueless people on the net, it was a tremendous pain in the rear. Now, we are talking about a bunch of people who didn't even want the Internet in the first place being given it. (These people have good jobs, and you can get access for free and computers for pittance.) What will be the result of all these people jumping aboard the latest fad? I agree that this is a good thing, but I don't think it should be expected, nor do I think it is an appropriate program for a government to implement.
"Logic . . . merely enables one to be wrong with authority"
Logic ... merely enables one to be wrong with authority. -- Doctor Who
Or are you saying jimmy hoffa is living in brazil?
Just because we are in the computer age does not mean everything is nice and clean, you know.
The computers taken from Northwest employees were the employees PERSONAL computers. These computers were not provided by Northwest.
NW just got a court order to seize employees personal computers, and have some consulting group (earnest & young? I forget..) copy all the hard drives.
I'm sure they will treat all personal info with due respect and discretion... *snork*
How? Once someone becomes savvy, the knowledge they have becomes their own. I doubt if they would have much trouble going to another ISP after a while on the net. Just because I picked up a lot of my Linux and NT knowledge on a job, and received a great benefit from it, does not mean that I can't transfer the skills I have developed elsewhere. Similarly go the skills required to use the Internet. Just because they developed them from using a benefit provided by Ford does not mean that they can't go elsewhere. I think that the computers will help job satisfaction.
"Logic . . . merely enables one to be wrong with authority"
Logic ... merely enables one to be wrong with authority. -- Doctor Who
Although nearly every sentence of this article should be rebuked for various reasons, I will try to confine my outrage to addressing what I consider the worst of Katz's rhetoric. In the typically opportunistic style of the radical, Katz can't resist rounding up the "usual suspects" in an article, ostensibly written to praise Ford (that was the point, right). By taking aim at everyone's favorite corporate punching bag, emboddied in persona non grata Bill Gates, the tone is set for the rest of the post. Turning a pat on the head for Ford into a flak cannon attack on capitalism would actually be a neat trick if it wasn't such and old and tired one. Do we have to relive *everythng* about the sixties and seventies?? Redistribution of wealth sure has worked well for all of those communist nations... Woven throughout this propaganda piece is the idea that companies are only "good" to the degree that they give stuff away. More to the core, there is an underlying suggestion that *people* are only "good" to the extent that they want to give stuff away. Doing Good(tm) is the mantra of the left -- its a smoke screen, catch all justification for fucking you and me up the ass with slave like taxation and authoritarian controls on our behavior. Its a classic case of "not my ox being gored" that so many people get on the anti-corporation bandwagon. Corporations make nice targets -- they seem like impenetrable fortesses of untold weath and power. Why not try to shake that money tree with a lawsuit to see what falls out? Why not let the government screw with them? They are just the Big Bad Coroporations, right? While were at it, why not add a few "killing words" to the discussion like "corporatism." Does that scare you? Why? Corporations have no *real* control over you that you can't overturn by choice. The government is another story. Charity is only charity when it is volantary. When it is forced (i.e., when the government redistributes wealth) it is *slavery*. Ford's giving stuff away is interesting but hardly, as Katz states, "the most significant technology news in years" and definitely not a model for how the government should be behaving. The government *is* force. That it is all it is, and we should be especially careful about how it is applied in a free society.
Still, you raise an important question. Who owns the data on the hard drives of the computers Ford is giving to its employees? Is Ford reserving the right to examine that data at any time just as they would any computer located on company premises? Do they claim copyright on all original material stored on those machines?
I don't think it's fair to bust this particular gift horse in the mouth until we know those answers.
Who is to say just because all these people have computers that they will then be able to make "New kinds of programmers and computer users [that] would surge online, perhaps bringing new ideas and approaches to programming, software and the nature of the Net and Web."
Now think about this for second. I don't have actual facts but just how big a portion of Ford are made up of actual engineers? or people with college degrees for that matter? Most likely a large portion of Ford's work force consists of people suited for just what they are doing... mechanical production.
If anything I see this as a way for Ford to gain relativly *cheap* publicity. Can these computers really be "high-speed?" i think at most they will probably be striped down celeron systems. Add to that Ford can now demand a higher level of increased productivity without having to pay a large force of tech guys to oversee these computers.
But most important of all Ford now has the right to look into the lives of its employees like they have never been able to do before as evident in the recent airlines incident.
I just think that if the majority of people in this technological gap that you describe, don't have computers because they do not see an immidiate need for them. Their lives are no worse without them. If they had a need they would have purchased a computer long time ago. This isn't 1996 anymore Katz.
Back in 1996, the company I worked for (UUNET)had told all it's employees "buy computer stuff. Whatever you want, up to $1000, we'll reimburse."
Most of us did (I bought a cheap pentium system & installed Linux on it, several others bought SUN boxes, routers, printers, good monitors, etc.)
This sort of thing was a better deal for a geek than just getting handed a computer -- it lets them decide what to get, and if they already have decent computers, they can get other computer-related stuff to build the system up.
So, if your company is thinking about getting everyone computers, you might want to see if they're willing to let their more technical people pick what they want and reimburse them.
--doug
It seems to me that Ford shareholders have the grounds for a class-action suit, as this action, although of benefit to the employees (and therefore highly taxable in many countries), would seem to offer little or no benefit to the shareholders who own the business.
On the technology side, I applaud any initiative that helps to develop infrastructure in developing countries, but wonder if Ford will exercise a chilling effect over free speech if its Acceptable Usage Policy is mandated over the PCs it provides. Also, I wonder if Linux is an option? ;-)
--
Paul Gillingwater
Paul Gillingwater
MBA, CISSP, CISM
Isn't this just slightly redundant? Mr. Katz, the net and the web are the SAME THING!!!
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Used in this fashion computers are same as TV - opium for the masses. A distractive factor so the people do not read and think.
Do you really think that Ford is giving (well, subsidizing) computers to employees so that they'll be used in this way? In my more cynical moments I might think so, as television is indeed an opium for the masses, and one that indoctrinates and sells things to them too. But in my more logical moments I know better. If distraction and indoctrination were the real motive behind this apparent act of generosity, why wouldn't Ford just hand out televisions? Or subsidize cable for those employees who can't afford it?
Computers can be used like television, i.e a mindnumbing distraction. I've used them that way myself. But they can also be used like books or telephones, i.e. a stimulant to the mind. I use them for that even more. Watching television is not a valuable workplace skill, but literacy definitely is. Ditto for the ability to use a telephone. I think Ford - and the other, unsung corporations and individuals who are contributing computers to those who would not otherwise have them - are doing this out of a mix of generosity and enlightened self-interest, not mere greed.
Thursday is troll day! GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESEGUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE GUV'MINT CHEESE
I've got no feelings towards Ford one way or the other, but this is a company that is *giving away* 350,000 PCs and Internet connections. ($5/month is a pittance, so yes, I consider it to be "free".) I know of no other Fortune 500 company that has offered anything vaguely similar to this (the subsequent Delta offer notwithstanding). My father worked for IBM for 20+ years, and his employee discount didn't come *close* to free.
Something about "gift horses" and "mouths" comes to mind as I read post after post complaining about the choice of OS (or lack thereof), the modest hardware specs, the ISP, the Draconian Conspiracy Theories, the impact on stock/auto prices, wanting the money instead, etc. etc. etc. This is a free PC and Internet connection.
If you already have a better rig at home, consider yourself fortunate. If you don't want to accept the gift, then don't. (Would you honestly turn down a free PC? In all actuality, I might -- I'm pretty comfortable with my setup. I can't imagine that all 350,000 Ford employees share my circumstances.)
Does Ford have ulterior motives? Absolutely. Is their intent malicious? No one can answer that definitively. But at the end of the day, it is still a *free PC and Internet connection*.
I grew up with PCs in the house, so I've always taken them for granted. 98% of all houses in the US have a phone. 54% of all houses have a PC. (Stats half-remembered from Wired a couple of months back...) Half the country doesn't share my sense of entitlement. Ford and Delta are chipping away at this disparity.
Am I alarmed about the Northwest Airlines travesty? Absolutely. But let's not lose site of what Ford is offering. At this point the two are completely unrelated. I'll be just as outraged as many of you are *if* Ford decides to abuse this.
In the meantime, I'm having a hard time seeing how this could be anything but a Good Thing(tm). Would you be here now without a computer?
~Exaggeration is a billion times worse than understatement.
Okay, seeing as nobody actually knows what's going on with how the computers are going to be purchased, I thought I would enlighten people.
My Girlfriend's dad works for Ford in KC and was telling me about all of this over Christmas break. Its been in the works (at least in KC) for a couple of years and this is what is going to happen: Every year, each Ford employee due to union contracts get a certain amount of money to be spent upon educational persuits. Most of the time this lets employees to go to a local community college and get a few classes in each year. The money that would be used this year (and I think next year too) will instead be spent on the computers and the associated internet access. The only thing that Ford is actually going to own here is the contract that is getting the employee's computers at the incredibly massive discount. At no point will Ford or the union is going own the computers! This is money that has already been set aside for the empolyees that is being spent by the employees.
Okay, hope the clears up a few things.
Rather than just highlight PC's I think it's important that companies do their best to push their employees (and families) educations in all areas. IMO an intelligent company will see that they can create a thriving culture where they educate and build trust with the public and that public will have more money to spend and be more likely to buy from that company. Currently most companies (and governments) try to keep control by playing off poor education and marketing hype and while this does work it slowly shrinks the possible income whereas the education way will build it. I see Linux companies playing in this feild though perhaps they don't fully see it. Because they educate their customers they raise the general level of education which in turn will create both more free software developers and consumers with more money to spend thus creating a rising tide of income. People who think tech stocks are overpriced only look at them in dollars and forget that good tech companies will seemingly cause money to grow on trees because they educate and when they educate the world has more resources. The day of counting raw materials as out most precious asset are past, information and knowledge is what will make our society strong and wealthy. If I were Bill Gates or someone else with money to burn I'd move into very poor regions with low education and provide adequate housing and food and education. Sure the initial investment is high but the growth would be exponential and would benefit not only that community and that company but the world in general. Want to make the world a better place? Take some children and teach them.
At what price learning? At what cost wisdom? The price is a man's peace of mind, and the cost is his life.
Not sure if I'm the first to point this out, and I think it's great that employees are getting computers and net access, but we should not loose sight of the fact that Ford did not do this out of the kindness of it's heart - it was part of their latest negotiation with the United Auto Workers!
I think it's great that employees are getting computers and net access, but we should not loose sight of the fact that Ford did not do this out of the kindness of it's heart - it was part of their latest negotiation with the United Auto Workers!
First, this IS a great story. Companies, looking out for their own best interest (educated workers = better workers) are doing things much more effeciantly and postively than the government every could. The best part of the deal, (Which Katz did not mention) is that Ford is NOT giving them away for free, but is holding each employee acountable for how they use that PC, and expect the level of computer use at work to grow in size and sophistication. Anyway, obvious fallacies in Katz's anti-corporate rant: 1. Bill Gates and giving. Bill is giving BILLIONS of dollar to help people. Not to give them computers, but to SAVE THEIR LIVES. I would rather see him wipe out malaria and aids than give people computers that not be replaced when they are obsolete. 2. Corporatations not spending money on anything but stockholder. BS. Any corporation that does not reinvest their profits into their own infrastructure (capital and labor) are asking for death. This is still a free market, and only those that are looking ahead will survive. Hell, the internet companies, that is what they are doing with ALL of their revenue. 3. Ability of Ford Employees to buy computers. I thought Ford was a union shop? If so, then the workers sure as hell can afford computers. They are choosing to NOT buy them, and if they are, they are not using them in ways that will benifit Ford. Ford is not giving computers to poor welfare people, but unionized middle Americans. God bless America. God bless Adam Smith.
Ehh, who'd want a Ford computer?
You know what they say:
Fix Or Repair Daily
Well, it seemed funny at first anyway. Laugh.
I would so moderate this up if I had some moderation points. :)
Just thought I would add: there's mention of Bill Gates' donations to charity. But remember that it wasn't until three or four years ago that he started being charitable. And where do most of his charity bux go? The Bill and Melinda Gates Library Foundation. They donate computers and Microsoft software to libraries. Sounds great? It's not.
The maintenance of library computers is not cheap. Nor is training library staff to use the systems. And there's no guarantee that MS is going to help upgrade the hardware or software when it becomes obsolete or no longer supported.
And the computers apparently have the tendency to show up in the richer neighborhoods' rather than in the inner-city type places where they're really needed.
So! Your public library becomes a MS cash cow, and your library system gets lousier. Yay Bill! I can't help but wonder, then, if Ford has some kind of partnership-software/upgrade selling deal through which the Ford employees get fleeced over the long term.
(Most of this I picked up from my class with Donald Gutstein. he's got an excellent book on these types of issues called e.con)
What it costs them is ~$1000 for a computer; what they get is an improved level of computer literacy (in general) without the costs of structured training, without the non-productive time involved in training, and without the ongoings required to monitor and follow up the training.
In fact, I'm surprised they haven't found a way of making their employees pay for the honour of being trained in this way! (Or am I mistaken, and the PCs are not 'free', but bought as part of a bargaining agreement?)
Oh yeah : I always read Katz. I don't often agree with his thinking, I do often think he's a pretentious prat, but his storys always provoke thought. If I didn't want to think, I'd go and read a Win98 manual...
What part of "a well regulated militia" do you not understand?
To all those complaining about the lack of media covergage regarding the Ford PC giveaway, i just have to ask, what media are you watching? You are not still relying on a commercial media company owned by an evil multinational, now are you? The News Hour on PBS spent 10-15 minutes on a comprehensive interview with the CEO of Ford on this subject earlier this week. -troy
Of course, this comes on the back of the Northwest scandal. I'm excited by the trend this may set, but only from an intellectual, idealistic point of view. If I put my pragmatic hat on I can't help thinking that Ford (and other companies who follow suit) will have an alterior motive. Why would they spend so much money on their employees when a much more cost effective way to make them happy would be to give them a $1000 bonus or pay rise or something traditional?
Anyway, here's hoping that Fords moves are simply a new employee loyalty / morale scheme and not something more nefarious.
email me or not.
email me or not.
Obvious monitoring concerns aside [this could reek of Big Brother, if Ford tracks its families, their usage, and hires/fires based on random criteria like... oh... writing your resume...] a quick historical note.
Ford himself was sued by his shareholders. For making the price of cars too cheap. This was in a time, much like our age right now, when the newly introduced and soon to be dominating technology was rolling out and the cars were too expensive.
Instead of handing out dividends like a shortsighted corporate creature [dividends are important, don't get me wrong] every time there was an improvement in some aspect of production, Hank passed those savings on to the consumer.
During cross examination [paraphrased here] Ford explained to the court hearing the case that he would go right on dropping the price of his cars, and that he wanted to see every man in the country have a car. After all, it was the industrial age.
There were several obvious benefits to that move, echoed in this one - if everyone has a car, they'll want new cars eventually, and you've got a market. The parallel here is slightly different, but if everyone in the company has computers, they've all got access to one another, the company intranet and can brag about their new perk.
The next benefit was that the brand name FORD was suddenly linked to affordable cars - now working for Ford is linked to getting a computer and net access, the coin of the realm in this generation.
Lastly, it's easy to plow your competition underground if you can offer more value for someone than they do - there the same cars at lower costs, here, free computers to induce workers to stay.
A good move that looks altruistic on the surface, but is _very_ sound business.
The other was merely an unjustifed attack with no useful comment on the topic.
Of course Katz is quoting a statistic. The question is, what is he implying by doing so ?
Life is just a bowl of All Bran - Small Faces
Concordia University @ Austin distributes laptops to any full time student that wants one. They are nice enough systems (466 celeron dell cpt's) for most student's purposes. Students do have to return them every spring (100 dollars rent for summertime) but get their use when they really need 'em. This is a phenomenal deal for students. They get a nice laptop when they need it and don't have to eat Ramen like I did (I'm craving a dry brick of the stuff now . . .) I personally like the trend.
I found your analysis to be naive. While many of your rosy predictions of the benefits to the auto worker may turn out to be true. There is no doubt in my mind that Ford acted in its own self interest with respect to union politics. Management can always use leverage at the bargaining table. Of course, this may backfire on them as the connectivity is the lifeblood of organized labor as well.
IT'S VERY VERY FUNNY! +6!
It has nothing to do whatsoever with what is good for Ford employees. This is what is good for Ford motor, and the sweetheart deal that HP gave them.
Think about it, Ford is not supplying computers to 350k employees. They are supplying HP computers to 350k employees.
Why is this more right than Bill Gates supplying WinNT for low cost to vast numbers of people, in order that they be guaranteed to use it (and therefore they can inflate their installed base).
This has nothing to do with what is good for Ford employees. It has everything to do with what is good for HP. It is about removal of options. Why would you select another vendors machines when the Ford supplied HP machine is $5/month?
It is about removal of choice and options. Ford would do better to actually subsidize by supplying a check or a reimbursement. But HP cut them this killer deal....
Choice? We don't need no freaking choice...
Yes!!!! That would rule. If anything makes me drop Windows as a development platform, it will be the cost of the compiler. I have already stuck with 4.0, and have decided that I'm going to try and hold off until they start supporting 64-bit processors. The latest version is sweet but I just can't afford it.
To the guy who suggested Cygwin, I have two words: Cygwin blows. The fully integrated debugging and visual development you get with MS development tools can't be beat. The thought of running a "let's pretend we're Unix" thingy on top of Win32 is just very unsatisfying. If I'm going to run *NIX, I'm going to run *NIX, and if I'm going to run Win*, I'm running Win*. I want none of this half-n-half crap.
Now, if there were an IDE for *NIX that was considerably cheaper than MS's, I'd be a lot more eager to spend more time with *NIX.
The guy who said that MS might get charged with bundling again had an interesting point, but doesn't Sun already bundle a compiler with Solaris? In doing this, MS would just be bringing itself into line with what is common practice in the *NIX world.
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
Read Ludwig Von Misses' "Socialism" and DROP your nutty ideas about public intervention. You should be mortified that you are worrying about government worrying about political wheeling and dealing.
Nead I say more?
ThadThad
It seems that the prevailing thought in the states
is that every thing that hasn't been done in the US before, is new. Hardly the case as Computers have been given away by a large number of companies in Europe already.
Guys, you're not the only true way forward
Better idea? This is a giant multi-national corporation we're discussing here. OK: They give their employees home computers.. then own everything that is on the computeer. If workers come up with a better idea? It's now Ford's idea. What about personal e-mail? If it's written on a Ford-owned computer they have the right to read it. What if you spend too much time online at the UAW site? Or on a Porn site? What if you keep accessing info on a particular disease? Such as cancer? Would that info go to the health insurance company? Get real folks. For a group of people concerned over losing personal freedoms, we seem to be overlooking the obvious.
There are many things that are considered a commodity-- a 'must have' item.
Let's assume the following numbers (which are completely fabricated, as I have no knowledge of the Ford company):
Company 'X' has 300,000 employees, making an average of $50k/year. Those people might each pay an average of 35% in state and federal taxes. They give each employee a $2k computer. It's like giving each employee a $3k raise, as that's what it'd have cost them to get that computer.
You wonder 'but didn't it just cost them $600k to do it?' Probably not. When you're buying in bulk like that, people cut you deals. On the order of 30-40%, but we'll be conservative, and say 25%.
So it only costs them $450k [$1.5k per machine].
[I'd have looked at the possibility of taking it as an operating expense for the company, but salary qualifies, I think, so they'd have saved that money either way]
So, anyway, you've just made a person happy, without paying $3k/person, but only spending $1.5k/person. It makes sense to me.
Also quite possible, is that they're using the purchase of the computers as some sort of a bargaining chip, too: 'If we agree to buy X units from you, will you agree to buy Y units from us?', which results in big sales for them, and drives their stock price up while they're at it.
Build it, and they will come^Hplain.
Could someone tell Jon that today's keyboards all have 1's on them, and he doesn't have to hit L anymore?
(yes, some old [analog typewriter] keyboards didn't have 1's on them.)
TIA.
Terrorists can attack freedom, but only Congress can destroy it.
I'm not sure on this, but wasn't Ford's decision to give semi-free computers to their employees prompted by the unions? If so, is not the praise being lavished on Ford's "vision" and "generosity" a little excessive?