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Hollywood Says If You Support Open Source, You're ...
bwt writes: "It now seems that the DVD-CCA has insulted the entire open source movement. They have responded to LiViD leader Matt Pavlovich's attempt to tell California that he doesn't live there and isn't bound by their laws by asking that his motion to quash be denied. Their opposition brief starts out: Defendant Pavlovich is a leader in the so-called 'open source' movement, which is dedicated to the proposition that material, copyrighted or not, should be made available over the Internet for free. "
Who will shut down the other 97 channels? The people, that's who, insisting on conformity and singularity of thought.
Remember when all men wore hats - identical hats - to work? We are on the other end of that pendulum swing right now. Strauss and Howe argue that history is cyclic in nature and that we are inevitably going to see that pendulum swing back.
In the 30s, 100,000 school children gathered on Boston Commons to chant in unison that they would help President Roosevelt make the country better and stronger. Today we can't imagine that sort of conformist indoctrination, especially in support of a politician. But those children were in the midst of a crisis cycle.
That same generation produced survivor "Rudy" -- whose word is good no matter what, who would lay down and give his life for his fellow navy seals, but at the same time who is relentlessly bigoted and unaccepting of behavior one notch away from the norm.
We can only hope that crisis doesn't lead to his sort of shutdown of individual choice. We don't know what sort of common approach will be celebrated, though. Instead of insisting on the racial/sexual/etc bigotry of yesteryear, the new commonality might be the political correctness of today, or something we can't possibly anticipate.
In any case you can see the whole thing starting; today's kids are definitely more cared-for and thus more carefully indoctrinated than they were 20 years ago.
--
Um, I'd be happy to be corrected, but before I believe possession of DeCSS in source form is NOT a felony with the stated maximum penalties under DMCA, I'd want to hear a lawyer confirm it in his professional capacity. Your common sense opinion is regrettably not the final word on the matter: more's the pity. If it was that simple and sensible, a lot of people would have less to worry about. Where does the law stand NOW? Is it not the case that you can be charged with a felony crime for knowing possession of DeCSS (specifically) in source code form?
This is not a new strategy. The U.S. Government used this strategy for many years to slow the adoption of personal encryption products, and it worked. For example, the persecution of Phil Zimmerman was specifically designed to slow the adoption of his PGP software as the standard mechanism for private EMAIL, and it worked -- how many people today send private encrypted EMAIL? Almost nobody, outside of a few dozen subscribers to the Cypherpunks mailing list. Sure, you and I can send encrypted EMAIL between each other (or could if I'd ever bothered generating a key :-), but how many ordinary everyday people could do that using the ordinary software that came with their computer?
My feeling is that this case will be found in favor of the DVDCCA, because regardless of the Constitution of the United States, the next President will be as much a corporate puppet as the majority of congressmen are. People hold hope that the Supremes might rule different. They certainly may. And the horse could learn to talk too. Recent rulings by the Supremes show that anything you get out of them is a crapshoot, meaning that even if they accept a case such as MPAA vs. 2600, there's a good chance they will decide that the economic health of the United States is more important than the Constitution (after all, they've ruled that RICO is constitutional, even though it violates at least two of the Bill of Rights).
I have no solutions. I am not enamored of revolution. The so-called "leaders" of revolutions tend to be rather unsavory power-hungry types who are worse than the dictators that they replace, and besides, most people are affluent enough that they don't mind that they now live in a corporate dictatorship rather than in a free country (not that the United States has ever been particularly free -- just ask union organizers of the 1930's, or civil rights workers of the 1950's, about how "free" the United States ever was). After all, this corporate dictatorship has proven far better at providing mind-numbing entertainment and consumer goods than the earlier power cliques that ruled this country, such as, e.g., the military/industrial clique in the 1950's (thus the "Red Scare"). Certainly that messy thing called "democracy" is far inferior to this nice, safe corporate state? After all, the planes DO run on time, right? (okay, so that one went over your head, it was about Mussolini -- despite his boasting that fascism made the trains run on time, by all acounts Italian trains were off-schedule just as regularly during his fascist rule as they were before it... Italians have never been known for efficiency, fascist or not :-).
-E
Send mail here if you want to reach me.
Beg pardon?
Where?
I see plenty of articles about software patents. But I haven't seen a thing suggesting that copyright be removed.
That copyright not be extended to exclude fair use, and that it not permit the owner to control access to legally purchased media -- yup, I've seen plenty of that. But copyright itself? Without copyright, there would be no GPL, no Artistic License, no licenses at all -- everything would be public domain. And whether you're trying to make money by hiding your code, or keep people from stealing it and putting it into commercial software without giving you credit, everyone here sees that as A Bad Thing.
So don't make those accusations. They're simply untrue.
If it was that simple, we wouldn't have much of a problem. You can stick your head in the sand and keep thinking that the judicial system is not predjudice, but that just makes you willfully ignorant. Most judges are old white guys who have learned to be predjudice from their parents, who in turn learned it from their parents, etc. Yes, it's gotten better over time, but it is still very very real, and a lot more widespread than anyone would care to admit. The poster was right, black people usually do get a harsher sentence than a white person for committing the exact same crime. "You do the crime, you do the time" is not really the issue. The issue is that 2 people doing the same crime should do the same time, all other things being equal. Unfortunately, things often don't work that way.
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
Just to clarify, Apache itself is open source, regardless of what OS it's running on.
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
That's a terribly romantic notion you have, and you could probably even turn it into a movie plot if you wanted to. The problem is that geeks as a group are terribly outgunned in the sense that they cannot bring the kind of money, power, focus, and influence to bear on a problem that the big media industry can. Media has the ability to influence popular opinion. If open source software or free software can be turned into phrases that carry a negative cannotation, and the public can be made to think that they are bad things that hurt artists and hard-working Americans everywhere, then we are screwed. Don't go thinking that we hold all the cards. You're way off base.
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
Why? Because one of the strongest arguments MPAA and RIAA have is that file sharing and unlicensed DVD watching takes away their profit. If the statistics show that the sales have actually gone up instead of down, they can't use that argument anymore.
RIAAs profits ARE up, and it hasn't slowed them down one bit.
Open Source is a trademarked word, and there are a few people who stand behind the coined term in order to enhance their position is this meritocracy we have.
At what point is this assertion libelous? They didn't slander any human beings in particular, but people have associated themselves very closely with the "Open Source Movement". I'm fairly certain that Open Source is a registered trademark. I'm no lawyer, but i would be interested to know when there is a case.
This raises some interesting questions about the legality of the Free Film Project, which attempts to usurp the entire of Hollywood with Open Source alternatives.
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
I know every time I read slashdot there is some new article telling me how copyrights are evil and they should be abolished.
:)
And slashdot does claim to be part of this so-called "Open Source" movement.
No, there is no spoon... It's your mind that bends...
I am not merely a "consumer" or a "taxpayer". I am a Citizen of the State of Texas
I'm totally and utterly pissed at this. I suspect many others are too- but they cope with the situation a little differently. Me, I'm not sure what to make of this; I'm a member of both the Open Source community (as well as one of the Free Software community...) and I think they just defamed me. I wish, for one moment that I could kick-start a class action suit- but those jerks know they're immune and they're trying every dirty trick they think they can pull.
I'm furious that they had the unmitigated gall to tar all of us with that same brush.
I am not merely a "consumer" or a "taxpayer". I am a Citizen of the State of Texas
Yes, we could have some fun with publicity about this one.
Thanks
Bruce
Bruce Perens.
Tee hee. They don't even know where to find a leader of the Open Source movement :-)
Bruce Perens.
The part you missed was "misappropriated DVD CCA's trade secrets." Think about that a second. He took trade secrets? No - the trade secrets were reverse engineered by someone else. Therefore it isn't a trade secret any longer. He didn't steal it from anyone. This whole suit is built on a house of cards.
Now - obviously, if they were using the DMCA instead (which they can't cause that's federal law) then they would have something. This particular angle is falacious on it's face.
Have you compiled your kernel today??
But we do have a lot of common views and an emergent group identity, and we could easily move to a situation where a geek who worked for the Big Media was socially ostracised by other geeks
In my recent job search, I interviewed with and briefly considered working for a company that's involved in developing secure formats for digital content. I don't know very much about exactly where they fit into the picture with MP3 vs. SoDoMI, etc., but it seemed close enough to pose a moral conflict for me. I mentioned it to a few friends and they speculated (at least, I hope, part-jokingly) that they wouldn't be able to hang out with me anymore if accepted that job. I wouldn't say that that decided it for me, since I had just about reached the same decision on my own (namely, that I couldn't work there because I didn't agree morally with their goals), but I think the whole story is close enough to your suggestion to be relevant.
David Gould
David Gould
main(i){putchar(340056100>>(i-1)*5&31|!!(i<6)<< 6)&&main(++i);}
That is false. It does, however, mean that you get the shorter copyright term otherwise given to corporations, rather than the longer one for individuals. (they're both almost 100 years or more, so big whoop :P)
DNA just wants to be free...
A slightly toned down version of the troll's post (reproduced below, since the moderators did not recognize its value) could very easily be used as an argument in court by DVD-CCA lawyers (and in fact, this reasoning is most likely exactly where they came up with their comment in the first place). Worse, I can easkily see this being used later in news broadcasts (remember who owns the major news distributors) and PR campeigns...
The troll:
DNA just wants to be free...
It's tough with so many boycotts, but you have to stick to your guns to keep your credibility.
To make the analogy more appropriate it would have to be something like, "But Gorillas can't fly a Me 262!"
Heh. Now, aliens at ISO meetings--that I can understand.
*Of* *course* the whole thing was sophistry!
Ever try to get people to think? It's damn near impossible these days. There are terrible things being done by the American legal system and government. Absurd laws are being passed -- laws that give businesses more power than people; laws that give police more powers and reduce people's rights; laws that punish people who don't cause physical harm to property or people.
Why are these laws being made? Why isn't the general public up in arms and demanding that the government F.O.A.D.? Why is most everyone so sheeplike that they're going to let their every freedom and right be infringed on, to the point where they'll no longer have freedoms or rights?
The only way to kickstart some people's brains is through sophistry. And even then, it doesn't seem to always work -- *you* certainly don't seem to be giving your head a shake and thinking about the implications of what I've said, even if you were to slash the figures I posted to one-tenth their size.
The American Way is on the fast-track to becoming the same way as the dictatorships that have been mentioned.
Wake up, people. You gotta start figuring out that the government is becoming a police dictatorship. By the time it becomes as full-fledged as those in China, Burma and Africa, it'll be too damned late to change it.
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Don't like it? Respond with words, not karma.
The stat is from the New York Times, quoting the Bureau of Justice Statistics.
I believe the idea is that you take the incarceration rate of 647/100000, which would be an annual average, and multiply it out by a lifespan -- say fifty years (we'll give the kids a break). Of course this ignores recidivism and such...
...but the point is made: the incarceration rate is atrociously high. It *USED* to be around 313/100000 in 1985, and about 215/100000 in the seventies. Averaged through the first seventy-five years of the past century, it was around 110/100000.
Do take notice that the numbers are heading geometric, not linear.
Now ask yourself *WHY* so many people are being tossed into prison. Is the murder rate heading skyward? Is theft growing?
What sort of personal and/or property damages are being done that justify so many arrests? Or are the crimes victimless: the perps being self-abusive drug users?
And follow the money. Who benefits by a large prison population? Who's getting paid? Who makes a profit? Who gains an advantage by removing people's voting privileges?
There are connections and ideas that have to come to mind. If you're reasonably intelligent, I believe you'll start to suspect that the system is loaded, that someone's making big money, and that the whole prison situation would be a farcical obscenity if it weren't so destructive to fellow citizens.
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Don't like it? Respond with words, not karma.
http://www.freedomforum.org/news/2000/08/2000-08-2 4-05.htm
A small taste of being black in America.
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Don't like it? Respond with words, not karma.
Seriously, I've just read not one, but THREE stories on Slashdot that indicate to me that the US Government is DANGEROUSLY OUT OF CONTROL.
Is there a full moon out tonight?
I, for one, am fed up with lawyers, corporations and unelected beaurocrats running the government that supposedly belongs to the people. I'm tired of seeing court rulings and laws slanting towards the MONEY, and away from the people. I'm tired of the Republicans, and I'm especially tired of the Democrats. There's not a bit of difference between them anymore. Both parties feel they know better how to run my life, and take 35% of my weekly paycheck to do so.
From what I've been reading lately, things aren't much better in Canada, Great Britain or Australia. And forget about Singapore!
It's time for a GLOBAL tea party... a tea party that will make the WTO protests look like a stroll in the park.
For those of you in the US, I urge you to not walk, but RUN to the Libertarian Party's site and Harry Browne's site. Please DON'T opt for the lesser of two evils in this election; we're at a crossroads here, and whoever is elected next will have a lot of influence on which of the roads we travel down.
If you don't believe in either of the two major candidates, send them a message this November. Vote for a third party candidate. Even if your candidate doesn't win, you're sending the winner a message that you're not happy with the status quo!
Folks, the articles I've read here tonight tell me that this is WAY beyond Open Source vs. Microsoft or KDE vs. Gnome. This is about rights (for those of us in the US) being trampled on that our founding fathers saw were basic for human beings. Don't let the corporations strip us of these basic rights!!
Dave Walker
Dunno, but last time I masturbated, I certainly didn't give it out, much less for free...
Duh ? Crime against the nation??? Alleged copyright infringement a "crime against the nation"??? Gee, Hollywood must have been smoking some really good shit!!!
anonymous
coward
if you don't believe what you say, why say it?
This is especially ironic from someone posting, as most of us do, under a pseudonym.
How does the fact that one is posting anonymously equate to not believing what one says?
Has it never occurred to you that someone might post anonymously so that he won't get fired? Perhaps because he believes very strongly in what he's saying, but feels that his duty to feed his children overrides your curiousity over his identity?
-
Unfortunately, it isn't a trademark of the OSI. Their application was turned down on the grounds that the term "Open Source" is too broad.
I created a GPL-like Free Media License in order to release my amatuer film work, as well as a novel (Warning - incomplete 1st draft, very rough!) and screenplay I am writing that dramatizes the conflict between the Copyright Cartels and the proponents of the free exchange of information.
I am of course an amateur, and no direct threat to Hollywood, but the license is available for anyone to use. A few people with more talent[1] than I making use of it could become a real reason for Hollywood to fear.
[1]Fortunately, my mediocre talent still far surpasses that of much of Hollywood's writers, though that isn't saying much I'm afraid.
The Future of Human Evolution: Autonomy
What country do you live in? I refer you to the case where the United States invaded Panama, apprehended Manuel Noriega, and brought him back to the US where he was convicted of crimes against US law while leading Panama, a sovereign nation.
Way, offtopic but since I'm a Panamenian I have to clarify this. Since when was Noriega (Pineapple face) "the leader of Panama". He was not an elected leader, but a dictator, that had many puppet presidents. This is a known fact !
There are arguments about the invasion, and about Noriega being in a US jail (he should be in a real jail, in Panama), but don't make it sound like the bastard was some kind of good leader. For goodness sake, he declared war on the US !!!
Most of the people in Panama wanted him out.
- sigs are for wimps.
No. My comment was not moderated up. In fact, it appears to have been moderated down one. The reason why it was a "2" when you first read it was because I have enough karma to generate an automatic "2" for everything that I post. In fact, if I were to post a "First Post" it would how up as a "2" until someone moderated me down. What I want to know is why my post was moderated down. It was neither a troll nor flamebait... interesting.
Brought to you by Frobozz Magic Penguin Fodder.
Wow! you nailed my whole life right on the head! Good work. Are you following me? Seriously though... you as what does this have to do with me? Well, I'll tell you: I am a user of open source software and an advocate of open source software. Therefore, the comments made by the plaintiff are aimed at me. Or didn't you read the article before deciding to flame me?
Brought to you by Frobozz Magic Penguin Fodder.
If you look at the list of companies that will match the donations to the EFF made by their employees, you will find Sony Pictures Entertainment, Walt Disney and Twentieth Century Fox for example (all members of the MPAA. See About the MPAA).
With big corporations like these behind us, finding funds to help win the DeCSS should be easy...
If I read this correctly.. This is Open source like hackers are crackers...
The key figure is the bad guy who is using the term Open Source for his own agenda.
But the objective of open source isn't to forcably rip peoples copyrights from them but to prevent them from putting copyrights on otherwise free (as in speach) software.
It is also to bring out awareness of todays busnesses (the Hollywood film industry is no exeption) is abusing IP laws by clamming IP rights to everything from trivial ideas to coffy cup stains on the table and enforcing those rights in an outragous manner.
But it is not about violating the law. It is not about taking a persons hard work away from them.
Today an executive gets premoted becouse he bumpped his head had a strange dream and patented it.
I'm all for copyrights on films that cost $1milion to film. I'm all for copyrighting the script that some writer (hack or not) sat down and wrote over 6 months to 4 years (With breaks for bathroom, food, sex, life, etc).
And I'm all for copyrights on even the most trival of code. I'm also for not buying it and leaving him poor for his efforts.
But this isn't open souce... this is a theaf...
To highlight just how little reguard he has for other people...
He calls his effort.. "Open source"
and to show how much Hollywood cares... they never bothered to seperate him from us...
Instead this theaf and our work are lumpped together...
I say we go out and interview Hollywood... no not the industry... the street gang... (there should be at least one named something like "The Hollywood thugs").
I don't actually exist.
You look at it the wrong way. A US court has 'jurisdiction' over someone not on US soil only in theri own is. The court believes it has the power to rule on what goes on. There is a difference between what a given legal system/district/whatever feels it has the right to do, and what the law can actually enforce. Remember.. they can rule all they want.. but foreign law enforcement would have to deal with it. And the odds of extraditing based on somethign that is legal where the person is doing it are astronomical.
THe case is not about 'reverse engineering'.
/mechanism to circumvent a technological copy control mechanism'.
THe case is about DMCA and 'distributing information / device
THe case is not about how they arrived with DECSS.. everyone, even the lawyers, like to try to bringn up the outside issues.
THe case is about decss, period, as a violation of the DMCA.
This may be an unpopular opinion, but we may have won the battle with DVD's but may still loose the war over time.
In the sense that the DeCSS cat is out of the bag and cannot be put back in, we may have won the battle, and many people seem more than happy to flaunt this by being in the faces of Hollywood and the MPAA, but it will be difficult to win the war in the long run.
The real enemy is the DMCA, not the MPAA, but even if the DMCA is overturned, it may not matter. You can bet the next technology after DVD will use much stronger encryption, and with decryption keys that can be changed over time or are customized to each individual user, not to mention digital watermarks, etc. - they've learned their lesson and the next system will be much harder to crack, or if it proves crackable, much harder to make a mass distributable circumvention tool. If it can't be cracked, then presence or lack of the DMCA won't really matter.
The reality is that pay-per-view is coming whether we like it or not. The problem is that we have a legal system that allows us to enter into legally binding contracts. I would also bet that the next form of mass media distribution may involve signed contracts between producers and consumers, similar to satellite TV contracts. Once you have a signed contract, fair use issues are pretty much moot - you are bound by whatever is in the contract. Correct me if I'm wrong, but a signed contract of the form "I'll produce entertainment content for you if you agree not to do such-and-such with it" is probably perfectly legal. They're not stupid, they proably won't make the same mistake again.
You might say "well, content providers will pop up that won't do things this way, and we'll support them". The problem is we're so dependent on Hollywood for our entertainment that it won't work - how many of us will give up seeing the next Star Wars movie? Really, how many?
In a sense, the mass movie market is already pay-per-view. Most of the huddled masses these days rent their movies, they're already used to it, so a small boycot on the fringes will probably be unlikely to change things much. As a result, we're ultimately going to have to accept closed-source viewing software.
Kind of pessimistic, but that's the way I see it anyway.
Hollywood is full of liberals?? True in a moral sense, maybe.
Hollywood people, the big money people, are conservative to the bone. They tolerate most liberals because their $7.50 plus popcorn is as good as anyone else's. Directors are liberal, producers are liberal, actors are liberal, backers and distributors are conservative as hell.
~Jason
Indoctrination? So, how bout we lose the uniforms, and have schools where the divide between rich kid (wearing his latest Tommy jacket) versus poor kid is exaggerated. The world is not a conspiracy.
Open Source. Closed Minds. We are Slashdot.
anonymous
coward
if you don't believe what you say, why say it?
two more pairs of words
nothing ventured
nothing gained
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+&x
I must disagree with your assumption that the only way we can find commonality in a society is to have some inane TV series that we all watch. Having any TV channels at all is only a recent experience as far as history is concerned and societies before ours had no problems finding commonalities. With an increasingly wide variety of entertainment choices, people will (and are) discovering other things that they share in common.
The next question is how long society will tolerate this before reverting back to conformity and three "channels" again.
How will that happen? Who is going to shut down the other 97 channels? Who is going to decide which three channels to keep? I doubt you will find any consensus among the populace about which channels they are willing to give up to achieve their desired commonality. And what about the Internet with its millions of channels? That also pulls people away from their precious 3-channel television commonality. Will everyone willingly give up their Internet connections?
If our only common experience is that we were lied to by the same politicians and corporations, then when a real crisis occurs...
Actually, when people finally realize that that is their most common experience, there will be a real crisis -- for the politicians and corporations. I predict that there will be a new popular shared entertainment: tar and feather parades. People will gather around the water cooler on Mondays and discuss whether Joe Congressman or Jane CEO really got the treatment they deserved or whether they should be run through the gauntlet again next Saturday.
Trickster Coyote
Please ignore the man behind the curtain.
Ideology is for ideots.
Hmmm, shame we can't make a new version of the GPL lincence that says that the US movie studios and companies doing contract work for them can't use GPL software.
IIRC you can do this kind of thing with UCITA.
They'll be subpeona-ing Major Domo first thing tommorrow
Maybe their CO (General Public) needs to come and sort matters out.
What country do you live in? I refer you to the case where the United States invaded Panama, apprehended Manuel Noriega, and brought him back to the US where he was convicted of crimes against US law while leading Panama, a sovereign nation.
This case is notable because the US actaully pulled it off. If things are so easy why has the same stunt not been pulled with Serbia, Iraq and Cuba?
The USA showing contempt for international law is hardly news.
Panama is also a third world country. A relative push-over. Try the same technique with a first or second world country and all hell would break loose.
Plenty of 3rd world countries you wouldn't want to fool with. The most amazing thing is how few US cites have been subjected to bombings.
Did you know that Americans stand a 1/5 chance of going to jail at some point in their lives? If your so unfortunate as to be a black American, you're closer to a 1/3 chance of incarceration
The effects of sexist outweigh those of racism in American incarceration. Even though the rates are very high the group of people affected are a minority
Who is gonna bomb the US when they can be sure of the fact that thier entire nation is goong to be wiped out as a result.
A Kamakazi organisation maybe. Someone who can do so without getting caught. Anyway how much damage would be needed to disrupt the US drastically.
Not that I can talk, been watching TV all day, even when I was reduced to watching 80's feel good comedys...
~ppppppppö
Been quite a while (10 years + even) since I've read the whole series anyway.
~ppppppppö
Swedloff, sowwy got carried away, pls ignore the please ignore rest of comment after 8th word.
If you do, then we're in trouble when a more repressive regime than the US attempts to indict us in the US for crimes against their nation elsewhere.
Umm yeah and that's really likely to happen, face it, you have won, whatever happens to the world is entirely on your shoulders now, you asked for it, you got it.
Who is gonna bomb the US when they can be sure of the fact that thier entire nation is goong to be wiped out as a result.
Oh darn, straying back on topic, these terrorists in the good old moving pictures, they are fighting for a cause, they are very rarely going to waste their own country in the process, no matter what Hollywood tells you.
That is why we aren't all deaded, you need to push harder, never know what might happen.
~ppppppppö
's what I love about The Reg BBS (my more normal haunt), even though it is slow as driving a transit thru mud, you can delete your comments after the fact.
PS, (re the sig thing) I also wrote this great scipt (read IRL crap hack) to convert the 2600 page to links, anybody have any idea as to the legality of the whole thing if I was to bung it up on say linux.net.uk (if they exist, if they are an isp, if I have an account with them, if I didn't care about their common carrier status, down to one eye now (left) If I seemed tostop making sense about 4 hours ago, then I did), but anyway even in the US, the script could convert and display any page, if people choose to paste the 2600 URL, well it is up to them..))
Actualy it is all just silly, silly I tell you, I really hope you 'Merkins aren't wasting your votes, cos well hey, what you vote for we have to live with, and we DO bear grudges.
~ppppppppö
But you get the coconut, banana, [fruit of your choice].
Congrats, we HAVE a winner!!!!
And for all the people itching to reply that either a coconut || banana isn't a fruit, please provide links, I like to learn. :)
~ppppppppö
Could be they work for software companies, or distribution or something by day. Getting caught would be a very bad idea for them.
Have to admit though the warez fraternity does have privacy pretty well sussed. except of course for the ones that provide links to their homepages and pics of them with thier friends.
*online equivalent of a speakeasy* - kinda like that 'bar' Tad Williams otherland books? :)
~ppppppppö
The 1st,2nd,3rd foundation stuff is actually from Asimov's (or was it Clark? always get the 2 mixed up) books, not secret all powerful cabals :)
In it this guy developed a kind of math that allowed him to predict the future of people, on the basis that you can predict the movement of lots of people, even though you can't predict just one.
And the point was that hollywood/MPAA/RIAA/etc. probably will be able to get away with pretty much anything they want as a lot of people they can fool with their arguments, and even more people don't really care.
Just a thought really.
~ppppppppö
Bugger, I had a punchline, and it was good, and slightly surreal (only slighly cos I know we have Americans in the audience :P [yeah I know cheap jab and all that, hmm and on third thoughts, I am not meaning to give offence to anyone from the US, it was meant as humour based on commonly understood stereotypes, and in no way representative of the readership of SlashingDot. Therefore you do NOT need to lecture me endlessly about how only you have freedom cos you have the old pointing killing things, the war of indepance is a closed book to me, I prefer it that way, Do you get my train of thought here?, if not check below].
Unfortunately I was disrtacted as all the kittens woke up, bastards that they are, umm although kinda cute.
IF you are willing to assert your rights, so are they, are you making your views known to the right people? (As with all my comments, except the ones about FTL travel, why oh Why, won't you read between the lines....)
Or something.... (Sorry Rotoplooker, but when you have the world's greatest sig you have to expect it's gonna be nicked, and for future refence don't leave the doors unlocked)
~ppppppppö
So where the hell is the $4 billion dollars of loss (or whatever they're claiming) coming from?
:)
Simple. Lawyer fees for all the times they sue us
I wasn't lost... I was only momentaraly confused of my spacial orientation relative to my prime destination.
Just buying my fall semester books, and I was forced to pickup one book through our Barnes & Noble operated campus bookstore. Graphic design book, no supplements, CDs, etc---but it's shrink wrapped. I want to thrumb through the book to see if it's moot to me, but I can't, because it's shrink wrapped. And I can't return it after its opened becuase... it's shrinkwrapped. Going to complain to the president's office.
----
----
Am I the only one who thinks Microsoft is a misnomer? Perhaps Macrosoft would be a better fit?
When Judge Kaplan took the mantra 'information wants to be free' (as in free-dom) and turned it into 'information should be available without charge' (as in free aol CD's) he took a step that, carried to it's logical conclusion, 'free software movement' would be categorized as the 'without charge software movement'.
The meanings of free (liberty) and freedom are being marginalized all the time by corporate interests. It's a common theme in adds nowadays.. the idea that consumer goods give you 'freedom' (i.e. cars); that you have a 'right to free checking'. I don't like 'the freedom to choose which cola to drink' when it is marginalizing my freedoms to speak my mind, carry a gun, and worship in any or no manner.
This sort of thing is to categorize people looking for free-dom as looking for free-ride, and that translates from someone seeking liberty to someone seeking to steal just by using the word out of context.
It's fast approaching what was described in 1984; 'free' will no longer carry both it's meanings. It'll be free beer and nothing else.
-- Greg
Slashdot, would a spell-checker for posting be too much to ask? It's not rocket science!
The fact there is a qtr million people in the open/free source arena doesn't mean squat. The fact that it honestly matters little what the courts do as we can always find ways around it doesn't mean squat. The fact that we have "reality" behind us doesn't mean squat.
This is about a select few that have long standing credibility in the business/political arenas... it's about what you can sell. The truth doesn't mean anything... all the facts in the world don't mean anything. We are all about of individuals that have been framed in a poor light frequently and unfortunately sometimes we assist that portrayl... why should anyone listen?
Until... you get a judge who can cut through the crap to the core issues defeats are inevitable.
Brian Macy
I know I am late on this thread, but I just sent in $65.00. I wish I had the funds to donate a lot more. I had to donate something - this is what I donated.
Let it be known that I will personally fight this MPAA/DVD and RIAA/MP3 thing, along with any other affronts to my rights, until the day I die.
Corporate America - you are wronging me - bad thing...
I support the EFF - do you?
Reason is the Path to God - Anon
What makes me disappointed is that no matter what we do, I doubt we even have a chance against hollywood. They are too powerful!
Bullshit! We do so have the power - more than most would believe:
They are producers - we are consumers.
How about we go somewhere else for our lunch, or better yet - perhaps we should make our own sandwiches ourselves, like good adults?
I support the EFF - do you?
Reason is the Path to God - Anon
In any case you can see the whole thing starting; today's kids are definitely more cared-for and thus more carefully indoctrinated than they were 20 years ago.
I got a little more scared this past weekend.
My girlfriend and I had a family party - a gathering of family and friends, eating ice cream, cake, chips and dip - talking and such.
I got on the topic of the whole DVD thing, and I spoke of how I watched George Carlin on TV, talking about school uniforms today.
One of my GF's nieces was at the table, and said she liked the school uniforms - her dad was there as well (my GF's brother-in-law), and said he liked the idea of the uniforms because it cost him less as a parent.
You should have seen the look on their faces as I asked how the rest of the indoctrination program was coming along...
Actually, I will tell you: It was BLANK. Utterly and totally BLANK. Almost like I had said nothing (more likely I had said something that didn't fit into their internal worldview model). It disturbed me. Conversation hurridly switched to another topic - my GF told me to be quiet about the whole thing (DVD, MPAA, 2600, etc).
I steadfastly told her and those assembled I would not be quiet on such a topic - because the outcome of everything surrounding it would determine the way our lives would be lived in the near future.
I don't think I made any friends that day.
I support the EFF - do you?
Reason is the Path to God - Anon
Look, I don't want to sound arrogant but I think you may have the boot on the wrong foot. Try looking at it this way. Every newspaper the media produce, every television channel, and certainly every Website, depends on a great deal of electronic technology and computer systems. If there were an Amagamated Union of Geeks which could call all the geeks who look after those systems out, the all-powerful media would just stop.
Of course we don't and won't have an Amalgamated Union, because geeks just aren't like that -- we're too individualistic. But we do have a lot of common views and an emergent group identity, and we could easily move to a situation where a geek who worked for the Big Media was socially ostracised by other geeks; while the comparison with old-style labour organisation doesn't fit exactly, they could become the equivalent of 'black-legs'. And then you would move to a situation where Big Media just could not hire and retain the geek labour it needs in order to operate. Given the full employment and high labour mobility in the geek labour market, if geeks as a community came to see working for Big Media as uncool and morally repugnant, they could in practice all vote with their feet remarkably quickly - the geek economy is so strong it could quickly absorb all that labour.
I've often seen us geeks as the modern equivalent of the medieval masons - people with actually immense power - power to topple governments - if we choose to use it, because no large organisation, be it a movie company or a television channel or a government - can operate at all if we choose to boycott it.
So I would rephrase your quote: Unfortunately, when you're dealing with geeks, you are at an incredible disadvantage, as they hold almost all of the cards in the deck when it comes to dissemination of information to the populace.
I'm old enough to remember when discussions on Slashdot were well informed.
Good point. Personally, I've been thinking of using some free tools (POVray and the mpeg_movie suite) to try and create a short (<2 min) video clip that shows Linux and open-source software in a positive light. This clip could be broadcast on Public Access TV, various websites, and possibly major networks if someone fronts the cash. (*cough* RedHat, SuSE) Is anyone working on a project like this, and could they use some help? I'm willing to contribute.
This is probably necessary, because people in general pay more attention to pretty pictures than to well-thought-out arguments. Sad but true; propaganda for the masses is one of the areas where Linux/BSD/Plan 9 have not concentrated their efforts, and it's showing. Let's see if we can change that.
Disclaimer: I'm slightly drunk, but I'll stand by this post, as it's an important issue and one that needs to be addressed.
Give a monkey a brain and he'll swear he's the center of the universe.
--
--
"I personal[ly] think Unix is "superior" because on LSD it tastes like Blue." -- jbarnett
And I quote:
"Basically any 3D rendering was quite likely to have been done on the FreeBSD machines (we can't say exactly what because CPUs are allocated automatically from a pool via a queuing system). This includes things like the big completely CG view of the foetus fields or the shots of the Nebuchadnezzar and its environment."
(in classic reference to The Matrix, of course.)
Also notable: the single BIGGEST movie in Hollywood, ever, as much as we hate to admit it...
When "Titanic" opened on Dec. 19, 1997, Linux developers rejoiced. Not because the movie proved how bad an actor Leonardo Di Caprio was but because the Titanic owed its existence to the Linux operating system -- specifically, the 105 Linux servers that crunched numbers in the backroom of the offices of special-effects company Digital Domain.
In reference to Titanic, which, IIRC, was the single most-money-grossing movie in Hollywood's history ever. Thanks in no small part to Open Source.
The left doesn't know what's right anymore.
I have come to disbelieve that anyone with any significant political power actually holds any measureable political beliefs. "Left vs Right" or "Conservative vs Liberal" doesn't exist anymore (if it ever did); at least now, it is only a facade to serve as entertainment for those unable or unwilling to think for themselves. The 'two sides' are one group comprised of individuals concerned, first and foremost by a vast margin, with their own personal success. Politics and representation of those who (often-ignorantly) put and keep them in power be damned; a comfortable life and a secure, fat paycheck are the only real goals.
We may be witnessing them being torn between their liberalism and their desire to make a buck.
I doubt that their claimed liberalism exists, and this issue is simply further evidence to support my belief.
Perhaps it is because I do have strong political beliefs that I tend toward being a Libertarian rather than supporting the Republicrats. But I do not belong to any political party at the moment, and I am not yet prepared to believe that a Libertarian in power would hold true to the party's political ideals any more than a Republicrat in power.
The real question is, when will those in the Open Source (and/or Free Software) movement(s) learn to take the new power in their hands, given freely by the masses pouring themselves onto the Internet, to wrest the court of public opinion in line with their position?
Ah well... ''
No Laughing Allowed!
Nope.
They tried to trademark "Open Source" so they could ensure it was only used when approprite, but they couldn't - it was already in too widespread use.
:-(
How about:
"The MPAA is dedicated to the idea that all intelectual property should be under their control, even if that means stealing and hiding the protected intellectual property of others."
Sounds much more accurate to me.
What we really need is for some enterprising cracker to stealthily implant the decss code into some covert channel in the video stream of major motion pictures prior to their release on DVD. Then all we would need to crack DVDs would be a some form of stenography tool. The irony would kill me.
Note: If somebody actually does this, it wasn't me!
Article about personal jurisdiction on the internet. Pretty balanced.
I assume that this document is supposed to convince someone(a judge?) that these claims are true.
They are either truely ignorant in their own right or they are know what they are saying and are assuming that it would be too complicated for anyone to easily explain why they are wrong.
Given that open source has been trendy for a year or two now, every major computer company has jumped in front of the parade. If the DVD CAA want to make open source sound like a fringe movement the solution would be to show the judge a pile of press releases from companies like Microsoft,IBM,Corel etc. saying how they are at the forefront of the open source movement
These press releases always say that [company name] has always considered [trendy thing] to be an intergral part of the future of the computer industy. As such [company name] has played an active role in the development of [trendy thing]
blahblahblah, etc, etc.
Lets face it. There has to be some use for these press releases.
-- That which does not kill us has made its last mistake.
We all feel that the MPAA is evil, yet how many of us put the money in thier lawyers pockets when we go to the movies? $8 you're other vote
It's the 21st Century Do you know what your government is doing
Actually I used to think this too... Until I saw an SGI machine running a data mining (I think that what they called it) tool. Guess what, the interface was exactly like that one on Jurassic Park. Technically it was an IRIX system, but I digress.
Fighting "fire with fire" seems to have resulted in a measure of success for the PLO and the IRA. History is replete with those who took the "moral high ground," yet were unwilling to take a stand and fight the opressors. Most of them aren't with us any more. The United States didn't get where it is because the Founding Fathers passed out leaflets and held rallys. When English oppression became untenable they picked up guns and shot the fuckers through the head. If you think situations where a powerful minority dictates the status quo to a passive minority can be rectified through education and raising awareness, you're deluding yourself.
-Vercingetorix
-Vercingetorix
"Necessitas non habet legem." -St. Augustine
JARED BOBROW (Bar No. 133712)
CHRISTOPHER J. COX (Bar No. 151650)
WEIL, GOTSHAL & MANGES LLP
Silicon Valley Office
2882 Sand Hill Road, Suite 280
Menlo Park, CA 94025-7022
Telephone: (650) 926-6200
Facsimile: (650) 854-3713
ROBERT G. SUGARMAN
JEFFREY L. KESSLER
EDWARD J. BURKE (Bar No. 103414)
JONATHAN S. SHAPIRO
WEIL, GOTSHAL & MANGES LLP
767 Fifth Avenue
NewYork,NY 10153
Telephone: (212) 310-8000
Facsimile: (212) 310-8007
Drop 'em a line why don't you. The country code for the US is 1.
-- Could you use my software consulting serv
I wanted to take it one step further though. I have open source software on my site. (Heck, on of them is even an educational kids game, how evil of me, eh?) And I honestly take this personally offensive. I'm not one of the people that frequent here that think anything that can be copied should be given away free, heck, I'm not even an "Open Source" zealot, much less a Piracy-Zealot. But the fact of the matter is I support open source software, I write open source code, this was obviously an attack that effects me. If I were to tell someone now that I am a big supporter of Open Source, thanks to the DVD guys that is going to have negative connotation. Remember "Open Source" isn't a term that has made it into the mainstream yet, and this DVD Slander isn't they way we want it to get there.
My point is that anyone who has ever written a piece of Open Source code (and maybe even those who have downloaded it) should be able to file a gigantic class action suit against the DVD people. With big companies like Red Hat and Corel that could very will be a very large lawsuit. One that would get alot of publicity for Open Source, setting the record straight, and maybe even putting the DVD guys in their place once and for all.
www.dvdcca.org is running Apache/1.3.3 (Unix) PHP/3.0.5
So these guys are using a pirated web server and scripting language... We should sue them over this.
This message is provided under the terms outlined at http://www.bero.org/terms.html
A traditionally decentralized group, computer geeks, have a modus operandi of operating under the radar screens of people like this.
Not all of us. I, for example, am completely invisible to radar altogether, and can therefor operate at any altitude I like with impunity...
What, he wasn't literally talking about a radar? Oh, never mind then. (Now, you laugh)
Seriously, you do make a good point. I'm betting that almost every geek's view on what they persist in incorrectly referring to as IP is different, but I'm also betting you'd be hard-pressed to find one with a decent knowledge of copyright law who says what they're doing is right or legal. They really do have no idea whatsoever what they're doing, and I'm getting an impression that they're very desperate.
-RickHunter
Is it just me or has our whole legal system gone completly nuts? Last time a checked, a trade secret is only legally protected until it is revealed to the public, at which time, it does fall under the protection of a "trade secert." As for reverse engineer, I don't think we have a law preventing that either. I've read through some DeCSS things and I don't understand how any of the accusations made can hold in court at all, but somehow, they are. Maybe there is some unwritten rule that if judge don't understand the case they are supposed to make stupid rulings. - Preston
For instance, suppose I was Tony Blair. I could say that Prince Charles is the biggest fucking dick in the world and that he is incompetent of representing England as her Head of State.
However, since these statements (while inflammatory) do not in any way ruin Chuck's chances of being King, he has no case against me.
Turn it around however, if Charlie said the same of Tony, the Rt.Hon. Mr. Blair would indeed have a very serious chance of success in a libel suit against the Prince (assuming that there isn't some royal exemption or something). The reason here is that Prince Charles' comments bear weight in the eyes of the public and they influence opinion. That opinion is later a factor in determining whether or not Mr. Blair gets to be PM or not.
So, in a nutshell, unless you can prove that the DVD-CCA's comments are specifically targeted at you, unfounded and have caused irreparable harm to your career, then you'll have to continue sailing about in your rubber dinghy. =)
--
I seem to remember somewhere that you can be held accountable to claims made during a trial. IANAL, but I remember that you can sue for false accusations and the like made during a case once the case has finished. I also believe the extent to which you can claim depends on the outcome of the initial trial.
No, not everyone is going to rise up and over through the corporate rule, but Sigsnal 11 has a point there...exagerated as it may be.
Look at the state of our country (I'm refering to the US, I can't speak for others). Could this country become anymore ignorant. There are many intelligent people in this country, but, well, "never underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers". Personally I feel that the general population can only stay 'dummbed-down' for so long before something happens. Something big. Not nessecarily a revolution (at least not in a violent sense), but at least in an "intellectual awakening" for lack of a better term.
OK, I'm done babbaling. Gotta remember to drink *LESS* before posting on /.
I'm really REALLY dissapointed in the big business these days. Before, at least big business had the balls to play by the rules. Sure, it's fucked that 2600 gets found guilty of even linking to DeCSS, but at least everyone was playing fair.
This is bogus, and it makes the open-source movement look like a bunch of criminals. While not libelous, i have to say that i am severely perturbed at their notion of economics.
FluX
After 16 years, MTV has finally completed its deevolution into the shiny things network
"It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once." -David Hume
The real question is, when will those in the Open Source (and/or Free Software) movement(s) learn to take the new power in their hands,
Ummm... when they become as Machiavellian as the other guys?
I was just itching for an excuse to say "Machiavellian". I hope I spelled it right.
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
Suggestion: stop writing posts about how this is wrong. Everyone on slashdot knows this. All you're doing is preaching to the converted.
Anyway, this is a motion filed by a plaintiff, and was never meant to be construed as objective fact. Judges know to look at these things very, very carefully. Besides which, if you read the actual brief it's mostly about whether the court has jurisdiction over the defendant. It really doesn't have much to do with their factual error regarding the nature of the "Open Source" movement.
--
Makes me pretty sure that they simply do not understand the meaning of the term "open source".
Trying to pin a label on a segment of the populace that think everything on the internet should be had for free must be really hard for these lawyers without clue-one.
"What are we going to say, 'Hackers'? No, that doesn't sound right."
"Oh, I know... what is that group that thinks everything should be free, even Microsoft Windows? Oh yeah, 'Open Source'. Use that."
"Good thinking. See, this is why we make the *big* bucks!"
There is much cruelty in the universe, John.
Yeah, we seem to have the tour map.
Maybe this way Iran can finally hang all of the Hollywood moguls for violating their laws on propiety and morality. After all, Hollywood is making their material available over the 'net ...
+--------------------- You idiot! I told you we were facing the wrong way!
Of course, the MPAA have bought as many senators as they have local politicians, so it might not help. But on the whole, federal appeals courts have been stronger defenders of the Net than others.
The Mongrel Dogs Who Teach
Also, court filings are usually made under the penalty of perjury. Submitting deliberately false filings to the effect that I'm a goatfucker when they know I'm not could land them with fines or jail.
:)
True. However, the burden of proof beyond a reasonable doubt that the filing was deliberately malicious lies on you, and that's pretty damned difficult to prove for anything less blatant than "goatfucker"
You do _NOT_ get jurisdiction over every single human being in the entire world merely because they post something on the 'net.
Well, they're not arguing that, they're arguing that a CA court has jurisdiction over another US resident. Things like RICO set a fairly strong legal standard in support of their argument, so I won't be surprised in the slightest if the court upholds this.
Now, what you bring up is the next logical step. Copyright violation of a U.S. held copyright is not a crime in any country which has not signed the Berne Convention. So posting DeCSS code, or the movies themselves straight from Hollywood, is 100% legal in, say, Kyrgyzstan.
What's going to be interesting is to see what the movie industry does when pissed off people start putting up sites like www.getyourdecsscodehere.kg, www.firstrunmoviesforfree.kg, etc. etc...
Hell, if *I* ran Napster, and *I* had that $15 mil they got, www.napster.kg would be running now...
I completely agree - getting the companies that supply the big studios to write letters of "concern" regarding "innacurate and degrading comments about us" could have a fantasic effect.
I only hope that said companies would not be put off by the comments (ie not wish the negative publicity of drawing attention to the fact that they are part of a community that the public is increasingly viewing as bad and wrong.)
As some bright spark pointed out (#443), the people that should really be taking our message to the MPAA are the big open-source baddies, like SGI, VA Linux, Penguin Computing, IBM etc. that Hollywood actually depends on to some extent. :-)
I've made a start by finding SGI's feedback section, and have posted to both their open source and community areas. Might I humbly suggest that others also write to this and the other companies. As he pointed out, just a few letters from these companies may have significantly more effect than hundreds written by us.
And to those who work at these companies - if you can get away with writing to the MPAA on company letterhead, please do so!
If anyone is interested, my letter went something like this:
As a highly-regarded company and a leader in Open Source software, I thought SGI might be concerned (as I am) at recent claims that tar SGI and others, made by the MPAA in their recent opposition brief in one of the DVD cases.
An example is the opening sentence of the brief: "Defendant Pavlovich is a leader in the so-called "open source" movement, which is dedicated to the proposition that material, copyrighted or not, should be made available over the Internet for free."
As SGI is not, in fact, dedicated to piracy - indeed is highly esteemed in Hollywood - I feel that a simple letter of concern from your company to the MPAA would be an enormous (and greatly appreciated) contribution to our efforts to maintain the reputation of "open source" as a commercially acceptable practise.
A copy of the brief is at http://cryptome.org/dvd-v-521-opq.htm
Sincerely,
J. Fisher
Lead Designer
eCOSM Ltd.
For those interested, here's a related story in Business Week: Hollywood vs. the Hackers vs. Free Speech.
This opening sentence doesn't look like it has much to do with the case in question, or the arguments presented. From my understanding, LiViD uses no copyrighted source code, the only questionable material would be any lines related to DeCSS.
Correct me if I'm wrong - but CSS isn't copyrighted is it? It's a trade secret, right?
So, the purpose of this opening statement IMHO is to do nothing more than 'plant the seeds' as it were - laying down in the legal community that "open source" is wrong, and something to be fought.
This could definitely be a bad thing.
-Medgur
If you remember the news stories from the last time congress pandered to the corps and extended copyright laws another 20 years, I think you will catch my drift.
Marxism is the opiate of dumbasses
The phone numbers are there for the lawyers. Call them.
- I don't care if they globalize against free speech. All my best free thoughts are done in my head.
Britney could put a penguin hat on..no wait, dress up like the BSD devil, that would be hot. I would watch, then i would swiftly delete all linux stuff i have and install freeBSD!!
...what does Hollywood know about the computer industry?
Martee
~~~~~~~~~~
Martee
Slander n 1. law: The utterance of defamatory statements injurious to the reputation or well-being of a person. 2 A malicious statement or report...
It appears to me that by issuing a false legal brief about the open source movement that this lawyer has left himself wide open to being sued for slander.
Of course I am also sure that lawyers have exempted themselves from that sort of thing; after all prosecutors do it all the time.
Comments?
--
The law, 100's of millions of lines of code - not one line of which has ever been tested to see if it works
..and they have no clue that they're opening the pandora's box of copyright issues...
You know, this is one of the most interesting things I've observed. Cases Like Napster vs. Metallica, Napster vs. RIAA, MPAA arresting Jon Johanson, MPAA sueing 2600, etc....
When Metallica sued Napster they metaphorically shot themselves in the foot. I know so many people who found out what napster was due to publicity. Suddenly, people say "I can get music off the net???" Then of course with the threat of Napster being shutdown, I hear Peter Jennings come on ABC News telling one and all about Napster. Metallica gave more credibility and more publicity to Napster than they probably intended.... Now they are dealing with the aftermath.
As far as DeCSS goes... well the same is true. If the MPAA had not jumped the gun they would not have brought so much attention to DeCSS. Hell, I didn't learn what DeCSS even was until I read articles about Johansons arrest. The 2600 case is no different as it is mentioned on the news as well. Now people can go to their web site and look at plain text hyperlinks to DeCSS source.
The suits still don't get it... They are trying to fight their battles the old-fashioned way and now with the advent of the net, it's just not working. The more something is attacked, the more publicity it is given. The more publicity something is given, the more people will know about it... Now, the more people know about something the more they will want it and continue to want to know more.
Well suits... now you are digging your own grave. You are fighting something that is finally bigger than you and you don't know how to handle it. Just think how fast information travels in today's wired world. Nothing can be kept a secret anymore. MPAA, if you want to sue anybody at all sue the US govt. Yes, thats right... If it weren't for stupid encryption laws restricting strong export grade crypto, your 40bit encryption could have bit 128bit encryption and thus harder to crack.
A perfect way to copy digital movies to prevent use of the evil foolish system. At some fundamental level output has to work on an analog basis right? Well simply create a monitor to take account of what pixels are created when and at what position. Then correlate this information into a decoded presentation. Same for any program. Get a logic analyzer to work on it. Eventually success.
Respond to s
Speaking of high-profile open source advocates, anyone remember that Al Gore's web site contained an HTML comment supporting Open Source (along with a traditional copyright notice -- go figure). This could become a campaign issue, or just more proof that the only difference between the brains of politicians and of movie stars is the time zone.
That the MPAA can afford really good crack. `AC
I am going to try fiddling with the code to see if I can get it to print attractively on one sheet of paper. I figure I can do a certain amount of this without going to jail, as long as _I_ don't stand in front of Blockbuster handing them out.
How about mailing copies to your Senators and representatives, asking if they would be good enough to simply keep the copy despite the fact that keeping that information is a felony crime? Might make for good sound bites, politicians like to be seen doing dramatic stuff like holding a press conference to say,
Now, how would that be? We need some politicians to recognize how media-friendly this situation can be to them.Do you really think there's a more repressive regime than the US?
Did you know that Americans stand a 1/5 chance of going to jail at some point in their lives? If your so unfortunate as to be a black American, you're closer to a 1/3 chance of incarceration.
America has an incarceration rate of over 645/100000 annually. That's atrociously high.
Of course, the reason so many Americans are in jail is because the US government is running an ever-losing "war on drugs," mainly because it's highly profitable to a few people in power.
Alcohol kills six times more people than illegal drugs do, and smoking kills 30 times as many. But both remain legal. Speaking of pot, didja know that if you're a whiteboy caught with an ounce, you'll probably get nailed for possession; whereas if you're black, you're inevitably going to get charged with dealing. Blacks are fucked whenever they encounter the law.
But, let's not talk drugs: it's too controversial. Let's talk politics -- or, rather, not being allowed to be political.
Did you know that a third of the US population can't name a single first-amendment right? That'd include some biggies, like "freedom of speech" and
"freedom to peaceably assemble."
Certainly the LA and Philadelphia police don't know about those rights. There are people still in jail, nearly a month after the the GOP convention in Philly (http://www.phillyimc.org/) and the LA police beat the living shit out of folk who were protesting at the Democrat's convention.
Oh, this is just too depressing. I've got to stop writing about it... other than China, it could be difficult to find a more repressive regime than America.
--
--
Don't like it? Respond with words, not karma.
And they are deeply threatened by Silicon Valley. Not so much economically - there's money is crap film and bad music that will never go away - but from the fact that silicon has become sexy in a way that celluloid used to be. (I know that's catch-phrasey, but hey.)
Don't expect them to get it. They never will, because if they did, their fragile ego-structures would crumble into dust.
I haven't been to see a major, Hollywood film since November of last year.
I won't ever see their dreck again.
I also do not own, nor ever will own a DVD player. Perhaps, a DVD-RAM someday, but only if it works with OpenBSD and Linux and only if I get source to the drivers! Hell, I might write the drivers myself.
I'm sick of these corporate bastards and their lawyers. They try to make up for their own mediocrity by suing everything in sight.
But, this does prove one thing: the Internet truly is an amazing and unprecedented invention. It will wreak havoc with the law because of questions like this one, here: who has jurisdiction when some country's laws are broken.
I don't know that any laws were broken in this case. Why must they always parrot the "this software aids copying line" when it's clear that all we want is software to play their stinking movies? They're just pissed the software was written without using their reference implementation and therefore without a license fee having been paid. All I can say is, get used to it, boys! The world as you knew it is coming to an end.
Just be sure to wear the gold uniform when you beam down -- you know what happens when you wear the red one.
That should be
Just Another Illegal Link
g htrider/DVDEncrypt.html
- screw_the_feds
/ myhomepage
m l
h tm
t ml
h tm
e akingnews.html
s s.html
e rs_are_scum-sucking_pigs
C SS.html
1 415/decss.htm
5 /DVD
r ibute.html
S S
o n/2819
/ 6188
9 2
2 7/2600/dvd.htm
/ 3971
/ 8762
s
d /3587/dvd
d vd.html
r or.html
/ 2303/DVD.html
S
s .html
s .html
i sh/jurisdiction/otherstuff.htm
ftp://ftp.u.washington.edu/public/arobs/css
ftp://sun.rl.odessa.ua/pub/decss
http://130.111.75.63:142
http://216.35.100.9/ma/kdawson/deecessess
http://24.114.168.235/public/css.htm
http://24.15.107.67/DeCSS
http://24.6.244.114/DeCSS
http://2600.dk/mirrors/css
http://334.se2600.org
http://DVDoutrage.Tripod.com
http://MSD.dyndns.org
http://alcor.concordia.ca/~sd_fort
http://amergeisaphreak.netfirms.com
http://andrewstern.freeservers.com/decss
http://artun.ee/~rommi/css
http://benyossef.com/freedom
http://bigpoppa.adsl.alpha1.net/decss
http://briefcase.yahoo.com/clcktwr
http://briefcase.yahoo.com/klflatt
http://budice.ancients.net/decss
http://budsmoker.com/sites/decss
http://bur-jud-118-039.rh.uchicago.edu/dvd
http://cant-stop-us-all.freehosting.net
http://chaz.fsgs.com/misc/DvD
http://chemlab.org/~dvd
http://cherryville.org/dvd
http://come.to/intelex
http://cs.unca.edu/~dillzc/decss
http://css.choppy.com/data
http://cssalgorithm.8m.com
http://cybertrippin.net
http://cymorg.bizland.com/index2.html
http://dB.org/dvd
http://dandruff.cs.unm.edu/~bap/DeCSS
http://darklord.darkthrone.com/users/smith/dvd
http://darkwing.uoregon.edu/~homeyd/DVD
http://dcwi.com/~wench/decss
http://debian.mps.krakow.pl/mirror/css
http://decss.8m.com
http://decss.cx
http://decss.cyvoid.net
http://decss.fall0ut.com
http://decss.freeservers.com
http://decss.freeshell.org
http://decss.fzylogic.net
http://decss.htmlplanet.com
http://decss.netfirms.com
http://decss.z-man.org
http://decss_files.tripod.com
http://decssmirror.homestead.com
http://deelbeson.detour.net
http://dephile.hypermart.net
http://dephile.hypermart.net/dvdinfo.html
http://developer.dnepr.net/dvdcss
http://dialug.org/html/decss.html
http://dirtass.beyatch.net
http://dlsf.org
http://doghousepages.lycos.com/collecting/midni
http://donotsueme.freeservers.com
http://donotsueme.homepage.com
http://dosdemon.yi.org/decss
http://dsl129.drizzle.com:2001/downloads/DVD
http://dvd.coolpeople.dhs.org
http://dvd.k4dwi.net/dvd
http://dvd.loathe.com
http://dvdcopy.cjb.net
http://dvdcrack.homepage.com
http://dvdcss.newmail.ru
http://earendel.gt.ed.net/dvd
http://ebmedia.net/dvd
http://elknews.netpedia.net/dvd
http://fairuse.freeservers.com
http://freedecss.50megs.com
http://freemymind.homepage.com
http://freeshell.org/~simm
http://friko6.onet.pl/war/mkochano
http://ftp.yodanet.schwaebischhall.de/pub/DeCSS
http://ftso.org/decss
http://geocities.com/donquix0te
http://geocities.com/dontquit222
http://go.to/decss
http://go.to/nairos_dvd
http://hammer.prohosting.com/~deepbleu
http://heavymusic.8m.com
http://heky.org/dc
http://home.att.net/~phreakonaleash/ccs_mirror-
http://home.clara.net/bangor/DeCSS
http://home.cyberarmy.com/drj/DeCSS
http://home.cyberarmy.com/enac/dvdencrypt.html
http://home.earthlink.net/~kaos_inc
http://home.earthlink.net/~rocketrob
http://home.earthlink.net/~snagnbytz
http://home.monet.no/~christel/dvd.html
http://home.onestop.net/lakitu/mirror
http://home.pacbell.net/pfconces
http://home.postnet.com/~wsl3/DeCSS
http://home.primus.com.au/ratzmilk
http://home.rmci.net/bert/dvd
http://home.rmci.net/bert/fuckthelawyers
http://home.sol.no/~craphead/DVD
http://home.worldonline.dk/~loadfree/CSS
http://homepage.dtn.ntl.com/paul.chan
http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~cbunton
http://imezok.tripod.com/Untitled.txt
http://imprint.uwaterloo.ca/dvd
http://inferno.tusculum.edu/~neil/decss
http://internettrash.com/users/linuxdvd
http://intfreedom.homepage.com
http://io.spaceports.com/~decss
http://isupport2600.8m.com
http://jackvalenti-ismyhoe.tripod.com
http://jadin.virtualave.net
http://jump.to/decss
http://jupiter.spaceports.com/~decss
http://kb5kjn.karco.org/~alpine/DVD
http://kesagatame.tripod.com
http://kevins.ne.mediaone.net/~kevins/dvd
http://killer.radom.net/~shoggoth/dvd.html
http://linux.uci.agh.edu.pl/~outlaw/decss.html
http://loogham.2y.net/decss
http://magic.hurrah.com/~fireball/dvd
http://mail.sirak.org
http://matt.frogspace.net/css
http://members.aol.com/_ht_a/jwhite8055/DeCSS
http://members.home.net/dgweb
http://members.hometown.aol.com/_ht_a/MysticJTY
http://members.theglobe.com/GreedyMan/greedy.ht
http://members.tripod.co.uk/SneakyBat
http://members.tripod.com/donotsueme
http://members.tripod.com/donquix0te
http://members.tripod.com/ny2600
http://members.tripod.com/r-sobin/dvd
http://members.tripod.com/~Denney/DeCSS
http://members.tripod.com/~baloney97/dvd
http://members.tripod.com/~lucvdb/decss.html
http://members.tripod.com/~sk8or311
http://members.xoom.com/CaitSith16/DeCSS.htm
http://members.xoom.com/LinuxDVD
http://members.xoom.com/NiKeX
http://members.xoom.com/amateursoft
http://members.xoom.com/arjicle
http://members.xoom.com/chapter3/MammaNo.htm
http://members.xoom.com/freedvdinfo
http://members.xoom.com/get_decss
http://members.xoom.com/iamkeenan/master
http://members.xoom.com/iox
http://members.xoom.com/maud123/Home/CSS.htm
http://members.xoom.com/mogreen/decss
http://members.xoom.com/nyc2600
http://members.xoom.com/phireproof
http://members.xoom.com/s_o_sam/help.html
http://members1.chello.nl/~o.seibert/DeCSS
http://merlinjim.freeservers.com/dvd
http://mikedotd.penguinpowered.com/deccs
http://mikedotd.penguinpowered.com/decss
http://mikepark.org
http://mpaasucks.homepage.com
http://natara.freeservers.com/decss/decss.html
http://ndez.bizland.com/css-auth
http://neil.gotlinux.org
http://netmanor.iboost.com/zachgoss/simm.html
http://nomoredvd.tripod.com
http://ny2600.iwarp.com
http://nycsoftware.com/MirrorList.asp
http://osiris.978.org/~brianr/css
http://pages.hotbot.com/arts/weknow
http://pages.hotbot.com/edu/silex/mirror.html
http://pcmania.bg/9-99/mortyr/_vti_cnf/_vti_pvt
http://people.mn.mediaone.net/bojay/slashdot
http://people.mn.mediaone.net/simulacrum/decss.
http://people.ne.mediaone.net/cyberwave/DeCSS.h
http://people.ne.mediaone.net/dantepsn
http://personalweb.smcvt.edu/wtaylor/decss.html
http://planeta.clix.pt/DJ_AmAzInG/DVD
http://primate.net/DVD
http://pyrrhic.8m.com/DeCSS
http://quintessenz.at/q
http://rha.housing.niu.edu/~davebb/css-auth
http://rlk.ch.utoledo.edu/DVD
http://sadennes.is.dreaming.org/hanadu
http://saturate.org/decss.asp
http://saturn.spaceports.com/~brainz/DVD
http://screw_MPAA.tripod.com
http://sektor1.dhs.org/decss.html
http://sites.onlinemac.com/beback
http://sites.uol.com.br/decss
http://smokering.org
http://st-bart.net
http://strange.8k.com
http://stunman.iwarp.com
http://stuweb.ee.mtu.edu/~krcalhoo/DeCSS/DeCSS.
http://sweet.as/decss
http://tatooine.fortunecity.com/moorcock/337
http://telnet.stealth.kirenet.com/~star/dvd
http://the.wiretapped.net/wt/dvd
http://theannux.homestead.com/decss.html
http://thesanitarium.n3.net
http://ts1.online.fr/dvd
http://underground.pl/dvd
http://users.1st.net/roundhere/decss
http://users.1st.net/roundhere/decss/index.htm
http://users.bigpond.net.au/nf/dvd
http://users.pandora.be/glenn.plas/dvd
http://vandenborre.org
http://vedaa.tripod.com/decss.html
http://w1.1634.telia.com/~u163400190
http://wakeupthe.net/dvd
http://warpedreality.members.easyspace.com
http://website.lineone.net/~kellypink/DeCSS
http://werewolf12.cjb.net
http://wildsurge.a2000.nu/decss
http://wiw.org/~drz/css
http://wusn-members.xoom.com/ambisagrus
http://www.19f.org/dvd.html
http://www.2600.org.au/dvd.html
http://www.UnderTheStairs.com
http://www.adulation.net/css
http://www.agybby.com/dvd
http://www.algonet.se/~skeleton/other.html
http://www.alltel.net/~ledwards/css.htm
http://www.amerisuk.com/~carbon/css.html
http://www.angelfire.com/biz5/revblack
http://www.angelfire.com/electronic/drugme
http://www.angelfire.com/ga3/acidlocke
http://www.angelfire.com/hiphop/rawkus
http://www.angelfire.com/in/sight
http://www.angelfire.com/mb/DVDoutrage
http://www.angelfire.com/movies/DeCss
http://www.angelfire.com/movies/dvdiss
http://www.angelfire.com/movies/mpaasucks
http://www.angelfire.com/nh/panzah
http://www.angelfire.com/ny3/ny2600
http://www.angelfire.com/or2/buzzkill
http://www.angelfire.com/pe/sh3/deccs
http://www.angelfire.com/pokemon/decss
http://www.angelfire.com/punk/DeCSS/DeCSS
http://www.angelfire.com/punk/freedom
http://www.angelfire.com/scifi/dblagbro
http://www.angelfire.com/sk2/braindamage
http://www.angelfire.com/tx3/wingers/decss.html
http://www.angelfire.com/vt/bigbrother
http://www.angelfire.com/wa2/phederalphelony/br
http://www.angelfire.com/wy/leggosfun/dvd.htm
http://www.angelfire.com/yt/mpaasucks
http://www.angelfire.com/zine/DeCSS
http://www.artnotart.com/anne/decss.html
http://www.asleep.net/dvd
http://www.asylum.webprovider.com
http://www.auntfloyd.com/DeCSS
http://www.auracom.com/~rhomac/dvd
http://www.azillionmonkeys.com/qed/recess_for_c
http://www.best.com/~drumz/decss
http://www.bugbbq.org/decss
http://www.capital.net/~mazzic
http://www.charm.net/~dutch
http://www.chello.nl/~f.vanwaveren
http://www.cognitronics-tech.com
http://www.conspiracynow.com/theories/decss
http://www.constant.demon.co.uk
http://www.copkiller.org
http://www.corecomm.net/~davebb/css-auth
http://www.corova.com/dvd
http://www.cpinternet.com/~jhanson
http://www.crosswinds.net/oakland/~ahrendt/Lawy
[...]
http://www.crosswinds.net/~dvdcrack
http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/DeCSS
http://www.cs.tu-berlin.de/~feise/DeCSS
http://www.csd.net/~cgadd/dvd.htm
http://www.csl.mtu.edu/~pdlathro/filez/DeCSS/De
http://www.ct2600.org/2600-DVD.html
http://www.cybertrippin.net
http://www.cyperspace.org/~multicom
http://www.december.ndo.co.uk
http://www.deforest.org/CSS
http://www.deprecated.org
http://www.dgw3.com/dvd
http://www.discountwebhost.com/decss
http://www.divisionbyzero.com/decss
http://www.dodgenet.com/~nickz/decss
http://www.ductape.net/~alpha/decss
http://www.duffbrew.com/decss
http://www.execpc.com/~unicorn/dvdmirror.htm
http://www.firstlight.net/~clarka/decss
http://www.flypop.com
http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/coax/1107
http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/motorola/
http://www.fortunecity.com/victorian/parkwood/9
http://www.frankw.net/decss
http://www.free-dvd.org.lu
http://www.freebox.com/zcedri
http://www.freeyellow.com/members8/mpaaidiot
http://www.fsp.com
http://www.futureone.com/~damaged
http://www.geekbits.com/decss
http://www.geocities.com/CollegePark/3807/2600T
http://www.geocities.com/Ongakka/rebel.html
http://www.geocities.com/Pipeline/Curb/1232/DeC
http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Stati
http://www.geocities.com/Shapierian
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Hardware
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Modem/41
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Ridge/37
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Software
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Software
http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/5258/decss.html
http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Exhibit/5771/decs
http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Undergroun
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dome/4021/
http://www.geocities.com/cold_dvd
http://www.geocities.com/corporatemindcontrol
http://www.geocities.com/dba3297
http://www.geocities.com/decss2
http://www.geocities.com/decss_2000
http://www.geocities.com/decss_forever
http://www.geocities.com/decss_mirror
http://www.geocities.com/djph3ad/decss
http://www.geocities.com/donquix0te
http://www.geocities.com/duck_ohm
http://www.geocities.com/dvdcracked
http://www.geocities.com/dvdfightback
http://www.geocities.com/dvdrevolution
http://www.geocities.com/dvdsuit/dvd
http://www.geocities.com/dvdthings
http://www.geocities.com/epoxy_css
http://www.geocities.com/fairusedecss
http://www.geocities.com/fr33dvd
http://www.geocities.com/getyourdvd
http://www.geocities.com/ghaniali
http://www.geocities.com/iwantdvd
http://www.geocities.com/k4dwi/dvd
http://www.geocities.com/k4wi/dvd
http://www.geocities.com/madasian2000/decss_mir
http://www.geocities.com/mastaflame
http://www.geocities.com/meluchwj
http://www.geocities.com/mydefiance
http://www.geocities.com/necready433
http://www.geocities.com/necready433/dvd
http://www.geocities.com/neurosis_dvd
http://www.geocities.com/opendvdecss
http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/computer
http://www.geocities.com/soho/studios/6752
http://www.geocities.com/solidex
http://www.geocities.com/verruktesten
http://www.geocities.com/warrdragon_2000
http://www.geocities.com/watice2
http://www.geocities.com/whackmol
http://www.geocities.com/xtridzz
http://www.gl.umbc.edu/~awirth1/decss
http://www.glue.umd.edu/~castongj
http://www.hackunlimited.com/dvd
http://www.hakor.com/DVD
http://www.hellnet.org.uk/decss.htm
http://www.hobbiton.org/~tpm
http://www.hote.qc.ca/dvd
http://www.hotsoupmedia.com/decss
http://www.idrive.com/decss/web
http://www.iinet.net.au/~matlhdam/DeCSS
http://www.image.dk/~mbp
http://www.imsoelite.com/dvd
http://www.infa.abo.fi/~raine/pub/software/DeCS
http://www.ironbrick.com/decss
http://www.ismokecrack.com
http://www.jabberwocky.eyep.net/decss.html
http://www.k4dwi.net/dvd
http://www.kentroad.demon.co.uk/decss
http://www.kiss.uni-lj.si/~k4ef1890/css
http://www.kki.net.pl/~rsr66/css
http://www.koek.net/dvd
http://www.krackdown.com/decss
http://www.lemuria.org/DeCSS
http://www.lifesolo.com/bin
http://www.linuxnerd.net/decss
http://www.linuxstart.com/~kvance/projects/decs
http://www.linuxstart.com/~sys_admin
http://www.lockpicking.nl/decss
http://www.mafkees.com/dvd
http://www.mayday2000.org.uk/decss.htm
http://www.members.tripod.com/dkdecss
http://www.mindspring.com/~coueys
http://www.mindspring.com/~stonethrower
http://www.multimania.com/sxpert/decss
http://www.mykle.com/DVD
http://www.myshed.net/dvd
http://www.nacs.net/~vodak/dvd
http://www.netby.net/Oest/Hvalfiskegade/jana/cs
http://www.netspace.net.au/~gromit
http://www.networksplus.net/blogg
http://www.neurosis.org/dvd
http://www.nsnva.pvt.k12.va.us/~abc
http://www.ntsmedia.com/decss
http://www.nvhs.nl/decss
http://www.nwu.edu/people/ldb/decss.html
http://www.oblivion.net/~amar/css
http://www.oksanen.net/ville/this_is/under/Finn
http://www.olen.net/deCSS
http://www.oz.net/~tvaughan
http://www.pages.drexel.edu/~jer24
http://www.penismightier.com/weishaupt/dvd.html
http://www.pepper-land.net
http://www.philter.com/DVD
http://www.pippy.itgo.com
http://www.posexperts.com.pl/people/wrobell/css
http://www.projectbullshit.com/decss.html
http://www.projectgamma.com/deccs
http://www.qix.net/~pheonix/decss.html
http://www.ratol.fi/~asiipola
http://www.reapers.org
http://www.redgnatt.homestead.com
http://www.redrival.com/chimx/computers.html
http://www.robotslave.net
http://www.rpi.edu/~jettea/dvd.html
http://www.rz.uni-frankfurt.de/~marsie
http://www.scwc.net/DeCSS
http://www.sealteamsix.com/phagan
http://www.sk3tch.com/freedecss
http://www.smackfu.com/decss
http://www.spin.ch/~rca/decss
http://www.stanford.edu/~drumz/decss
http://www.stupendous.org
http://www.subcor.com
http://www.swcp.com/~ampere
http://www.tar.hu/decss
http://www.teamnismo.com/2600
http://www.underwhelm.org/decss
http://www.users.on.net/johnm/DeCSS
http://www.uwm.edu/~zachkarp
http://www.vent-soft.com/dvd
http://www.vexed.net/CSS
http://www.visi.com/~adept/liberty
http://www.vulgar.net/dvd
http://www.warren-wilson.edu/~echerry/dvd
http://www.webnx.com/tuna
http://www.webzsite.com/decss
http://www.wizardworkshop.com
http://www.wolfpaw.net/~decss
http://www.worldcity.nl/~frank/dvd
http://www.wwcn.org/~grit/free
http://www.xs4all.nl/~oracle/dvd
http://www.xs4all.nl/~rasch/dvd
http://www.zeal.net/~pyro/DeCSS
http://www.zip.com.au/~zzz/dvd
http://www.zone.ee/DeCSS
http://www3.50megs.com/dvd4free
Go not unto/. for advice, for you will be told both yea and nay (but have nothing to do with the question)
Let me see if I follow this logic:
/etc/shadow file on my computer.
By providing a link to this, this, or even this, I'm committing an injurious act to interests in the state of California.
Never mind that I legally purchased every single one of my DVDs. Never mind that I legally purchased the necessary hardware to play those DVDs, and that the DVD CCA got their cut from my purchases. Never mind that DeCSS "circumvents" CSS the same way entering my password "circumvents" the
By aiding and abetting an open source programmer, I'm working to steal the intellectual property of Hollywood? I injured consumer electronics and computer manufacturers in California (whose products I legally purchased in order to be able to use the software player LiVid and the CSS decrypter DeCSS)?
If I have, then come get me .
Someday, you're going to die. Get over it.
In such a forum, your opponents do you a favor each and every time they overreach. When they misstate the facts, particularly in so relevant and material a manner, they discredit themselves.
And in such a scenario, credibility is EVERYTHING.
When my opponents misstate the truth, they open avenues I never had before, and give me ways to win even when I have lost. Indeed, when you have a strong case, this is the greatest risk: learning to constrain yourself from overreaching.
This is cause for cheer. Relax, and look forward to reading the reply brief.
If you can't provide a mirror for DeCSS yourself, perhaps you could at least show your support by displaying or linking to the DeCSS Support Ribbon. You can display it on your page, served by my server, with the following line of HTML:
<img src="http://goingware.com/decss/DVDRibbon.gif" alt="DeCSS Support Ribbon" width="85" height="138">
Remember folks, this isn't just about being able to watch movies anywhere you want on any OS you want. It's about being free from official government repression for speaking your mind, and if this case stands our precious freedom will suffer greatly for it - not freedom to consume products, but freedom to live as people with human rights, safe from official retribution for holding an opinion.
While Jack Valenti and the MPAA may be violating antitrust law and established Supreme Court precedents of Fair Use, Judge Kaplan is the far worse offender for having violated his oath to uphold the Constitution of the United States of America.
-- Could you use my software consulting serv
Personally, I really don't care to have my work go to support these assholes. I might have to roll my own version of the GPL which specifically disallows anyone directly working for an MPAA related studio from using my code. It might even stand up in court if the UCITA catches on in more places.
Now I'm off to see if I can find someone who has access to the Lexus Nexus to dig up some background dirt on some Hollywood lawyers...
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
I mean honestly it's the middle of the night and I was able to come up with those just off the top of my head. I get the feeling I am feeding a troll here but I just can't stop myself. Must be a good troll...
Anyway about this part: But, let's not talk drugs: it's too controversial. Let's talk politics -- or, rather, not being allowed to be political. Did you know that a third of the US population can't name a single first-amendment right? That'd include some biggies, like "freedom of speech" and "freedom to peaceably assemble."
That is indeed sad but it doesn't mean we are not being allowed to be political, it means we are generally stupid and poorly informed. You are drawing the wrong conclusion. The government is not engaged in a campaign to hide the constitution or anything like that, it's just that no one cares anymore...
Never.
That's why that law is such a joke.
--
-- My comment is above.
No, "malicious prosecution" applies in a civil proceeding, too. It refers to the case being prosecuted maliciously, not the defendant. What you are thinking of, by the way, is "abuse of process."
I agree with your legal analysis of the jurisdiction question, but this is certainly not malicious prosecution. There is a huge difference in collecting for a tort from someone who knows he is wrong as distinct from someone who merely happens to be wrong.
The pleading on Cryptome (opposing the motion to quash for lack of jurisdiction) is quite strange. One of the issues here is not simply multiplicity of proceedings, but an actual multiplicity of laws. This goes to the heart of the Interstate Commerce Clause. That is, suppose someone in Texas takes an action which is legal in Texas and illegal in California? The pleading essentially asserts that an aggrieved party in California would have the right to call the party in Texas into the state courts of California to answer for the action. That would be very, very dangerous. Insterstate commerce would grind to an abrupt halt if such a practice were to be allowed.
Because people with money are somehow more believable, more respectable, more legit that the rest of us.
We need some established, filthy rich, vocal support to counter this crap. That, and perjury charges...
My mom is not a Karma whore!
Yes, there are a lot of countries more oppresive than America. China, Afghanistan, sure. But even Great Britain is worse... if you don't think constant video surveillance on all of its citizens counts, then I don't think I understand your use of the word.
The "abuse" at the hands of the Philidelphia police on the GOP protestors is a notorious hoax. A horde of reporters at the convention interviewed people in the jail and couldn't find anything worse than "I bumped my head entering the jail wagon"
Your whole post reeks of sophistry... You say "1/3 of Americans can't name a single 1st amendment right" -- I'll put 20$ on it that the question was "Name the 1st Amendment." instead of "Have you ever heard of Freedom of Speech?" Typical way to influence statistics.
As is the 1/5th incarceration rate, and 1/3 for black. Bull-fucking-shit. I think the arrest rate for blacks is 1/10, and for whites quite a bit lower than that. Not considering recalcitrant offenders is a complelety blockheaded way of saying 1/5th of Americans will be behind bars. And you know what? A number of people get arrested that don't get imprisoned. My roommate was arrested and fingerprinted for being drunk in public, but was not even brought before a judge.
The rising incarceration rate, at least in California, is the three strikes law, which imprisons those who would normally walk. This points to more enforcement than more crime.
I think all my sophistry alerts went off on your post... even saying that "Alchohol kills 6x as many people as illegal drugs" is complete bullshit, since you aren't considering the facts that more people drink than use drugs. Thats like me saying that there is discrimination of people with grey hair because more of them die of heart attacks than people with dark hair...
Pfft.
Obviously, a perjury case (won or lost) would be a huge slap in the credibility of the MPAA, and perhaps even dent the "We're the Good Guys!" lie.
Reading all the comments, a defamation case faces some pretty fatal problems. I think we should turn our attention to perjury - also difficult, but plausible. Garbus and co (working on another case) have screeds and screeds of documents from the MPAA, which include selected "incriminating" logs of the community which (despite the bias) almost certainly include enough information about the community to be good evidence. The question is - can those documents be accessed for such purposes? (My suspicion is no).
The MPAA has clearly done enough (one-sided) research into open-source that they do know better, and there will be documentation to that effect somewhere. How can we go about finding it? Is anyone with access to MPAA documentation (or working for the MPAA) able and willing to "leak" such a document?
They boasted of the thousands of pages of information they had that was written by the community. That almost certainly means we're talking perjury, if we can only get our hands on their documents.
Jared Bobrow
Robert G. Sugarman
Jeffrey L. Kessler (there are a couple of others whose emails are not listed - I'd guess they are:
Christopher Cox
Edward Burke
Jonathan Shapiro
Why not write to them and let them know what you think their slander?. Or you could fax 'em on (650) 854-3713 or (212) 310-8007.
What you're saying only holds water if the US states are sovereign nations rather than local government. The sovereignty of the states has never been more than a polite legal fiction, a fortiori since 'prox 1865.
Panama, mentioned elsewhere in this thread, is similarly not genuinely sovereign - it, and assorted other post-colonial flyspecks, are as sovereign as their former rulers and/or powerful neighbours let them be and not a whit more.
Now, if someone wanted to sue me, British Citizen, in California, the most they'd get out of me is a polite letter to the judge pointing out that I ain't submitting to the jurisdiction.
-- AndrewD
A Maze of Twisty Little Laws, All Different.
Linux was used for rendering 3-D for the movie titanic, and most likely in other movies.
I wonder if Hollywood realises that they're accessories after the fact.
So you have this MASSIVE decentralized movement consisting of between 80 and 300 thousand people, depending on who's figures you go by, and they keep a low profile. Sure, you get a few lawsuits here, alittle press there, but considering the magnitude of what we are doing, it's suprising this hasn't been making the headlines for weeks on end - it's far bigger than the OJ Simpson trial, the Year 2000 New Year's Bash, or, well.. any event since the start of the millenium.
No, I think they're strutting around, being the pompous asses that they are, and they have no clue that they're opening the pandora's box of copyright issues - if there has ever been an organized attempt to take down corporations, this is it. Demonstrations in Seattle and the NAFTA protests before that pale in comparison to the damage a successful attack on IP would do in this country. And rather than taking us seriously, they're calling us a bunch of immature punk kids with a bent on going against the grain and who have a keyboard. That is not at all who they are dealing with. They are dealing with the Borg - a decentralized movement with no leaders, and a common cause. How the hell are they going to combat an idea? Imprison every developer in the world? Who will keep the e-commerce infrastructure going, or the "dot commies"?
Heh, it's the other way around guys, you're being a bunch of arrogant suits and you're about to get your ass handed back to you by a bunch of hippies who do nothing but convert caffeine into code all day. I'm going to love watching this..
Defendant Pavlovich is a leader in the so-called 'open source' movement, which is dedicated to the proposition that material, copyrighted or not, should be made available over the Internet for free."
Open Source/Free Software nitpicking aside, Open Source -- ahem -- Open Source(tm) is a trademark of the Open Source(tm) Initiative. To say that the Open Source(tm) movement actively encourages criminal activity is defamatory and actionable and demonstrably does harm to the Open Source(tm) trademark and the interests of the businesses that endorse it.
At least, I know if a bunch of Hollywood lawyers called a press conference to accuse freakin' IBM of actively encouraging criminal activity, seismographs on the other side of the planet would be able to detect the rumbling herd of bulk-cloned attorneys pouring from the sluice gates of the vast monolith that is Big Blue.
So maybe the OSI can get their lawyers -- uh, lawyer -- to get off his duff and act like a real corporate attorney.
--
Proud member of the Weirdo-American community.
BTW, Im wearing my illegal copyleft T-Shirt right now.
The quote in the article sounds more like a description of the warez community.
When I hear people say "all software should be free" I think of the Free Software movement.
When I hear people say "free sofware can sometimes be a lot better than commercial sofware" I think of the Open Source movement.
Of these three movements, it's rather ironic that they should choose to slam Open Source, since it's the most conservative of the three. One is apt to believe that businessmen protecting their commercial interests are conservatives. OTOH, Hollywood is actually full of liberals.
We may be witnessing them being torn between their liberalism and their desire to make a buck.
Actually, this falls in line with something I've been saying for a while: "The left doesn't know what's right anymore".
For example, you used to be able to count on the left supporting labor. But now you've got Bill Clinton and Al Gore supporting trade with China. That's certainly confused a lot of trade unionists.
Now we've got the Free Software movement, certainly a creature of the left, being opposed by Hollywood liberals. Conservatives, take note. Here is an opportunity to divide and conquer.
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
I really think some high profile people should sue the MPAA over this particular piece of fiction. It's incredibly insulting.
... and there's nothing you can do.
Legal filings are specifically exempted from liability of allegation in virtually all jurisdictions inheriting from British common law. The theory is that this prevents the target of a lawsuit crushing the plaintiff with their greater legal resources and so forth.
In practice, this means they can say Open Source advocates are crooks and goatfuckers if they feel like it
As we know, the USA, or more precisely, Hollywood, always needs a Bad Guy.
:)
1970's - The Red Commie Threat.
1980's - Those evil arab nations that sell us our oil and have corrupt military leaders.
1990's - Drug runners (with links to evil S. American nations with corrupt military leaders).
Late 90's - Those terrible two-dimensional Terrorists whose sole purpose in life is to kill as many Americans as possible. Why this is, we're not told (perhaps we might sympathise with them?). They're just born that way apparently.
Coming up next - those evil computer thieves and hackers who wield greater threat to your lives than all the above combined.
In most movies to date, hackers have usually been the good guys, and bad hackers are usually just opposition for the good hackers to defeat. Movies in which a Joe Average hero is besieged on all sides by a foe with unlimited resources have usually had the foe played by things like intelligence services, corrupt institutions and the like.
I suspect that as Hollywood execs in their isolated circles hear more and more about how great a threat is posed by these computer people, and as the net remains a sexy background for movies, but familiar to more people, we may start to see more movies in which we get to play the archvillain, whether we want to or not. And we'll have powers we never dreamed of (like hacking Russian spy satellites in order to take telephoto pictures of your credit card number as you pay for something, or your wife undressing*. Actually, they would have to be US satellites because Hollywood is currently dedicated to the idea that all Russian technology is stuck in the 50's)
Hmmm, writing this incredibly 2d summary of Hollywood movies yet having it so aptly sum up so many movies sorta rams home how numbingly stupid the films are.
Harlequin - Archvillain for hire...
hire details
(And offended at the idea of working for hollywood against my will
*Telephoto pictures of your wife undressing, not pictures of you paying your wife to undress...
Totally correct. The Internet is a dangerous resource, because you cannot control it. Someone in another country has rights that you don't have control over, because they have different laws.
The result? They sue, to try to regain control because big business sees people's speech as damaging their profits.
Just out of curiosity, does anyone know any sites that provide movies copied from DVDs using DeCSS? I've seen a lot of avi's and mpgs copied from VHS, and a few copied from DVDs using the older copiers, but I've never seen anyone post or provide (IRC, Gnutella, etc) a _good_ copy of a DVD. They're just too big!
Even admitting that I don't search really hard for .vob files, how many can there be? They're too big to download easily, too big to keep many, and too rare to show up in the many places I visit.
So where the hell is the $4 billion dollars of loss (or whatever they're claiming) coming from?
Jeff
Fact: Some Open Source Advocates post copyrighted materials on the internet without permission or compensation to the author.
Conclusion: Open Source is about publishing other peoples copyrighted materials on the internet without permission or compensation to the author.
Isn't this like saying....
Fact: Some filmmakers use narcotics in violation of US law.
Conclusion: Filmmaking is about advocating and using illegal narcotics.
Which would continue what has been a generational shift away from group-think, when three channels were enough for anyone, towards individuality where 100 channels are no longer enough. The Internet clearly has the capability to increase the number of channels, to the point where if I don't like YOUR reality-based show I'll just produce my own.
The next question is how long society will tolerate this before reverting back to conformity and three "channels" again. If our only common experience is that we were lied to by the same politicians and corporations, then when a real crisis occurs, our fractured society will urgently look to find commonality wherever it can, including in its entertainment.
For more on this topic, please see The Fourth Turning by Strauss and Howe.
--
Legal filings are specifically exempted from liability of allegation in virtually all jurisdictions inheriting from British common law. The theory is that this prevents the target of a lawsuit crushing the plaintiff with their greater legal resources and so forth.
Let's not forget that malicious prosecution is still illegal. If their lawsuit is baseless and the entire intent is to harass or defame me, then it's unlikely this exemption will apply. Also, court filings are usually made under the penalty of perjury. Submitting deliberately false filings to the effect that I'm a goatfucker when they know I'm not could land them with fines or jail. Again, for the protection of the little guy.
--
Does narcissism count as a hobby? --Shawn Latimer
That would make crooks out of IBM, RedHat, Dell, Sun... oh wow... lots of major corporations. Thousands of people. God no. Quickly, lock 'em all up and throw away the key before this gets out of hand!
;)
*sarcasm mode off*
I wonder if Hollywood realizes that this is bigger than they think.
------------------
... I've got a good target to whack.
I'm going to leave the Open Source slurs aside, since they're not really relevant (though, as one previous poster pointed out, they hurt the MPAA since it's a direct loss of credibility).
They're misquoting (or should I say, misusing) the case law precedent. The case laws covers only:
Also, I'd like to point out one further thing that I find unusual of this whole thing:
This is a civil case about trade secrets. In order to prove a trade secret case, you have to show proof that the accused gained information about the secret through unlawful means. As of right now, reverse engineering is not an illegal means, no matter what the shrink-wrap says on a product. Right now, shrink-wrap licenses are unenforcable and invalid, period.
Also, the DCMA doesn't apply to this case. Now, depending on the rulings about the DCMA, making LiViD might be illegal, but the methods of discovering how to make LiViD (that is, discovering how CSS worked) are not illegal, even under a strict DCMA ruling.
This case is strictly about reverse-engineering a trade secret, and the MPAA has absolutely no leg to stand on, other than perhaps having more money to blow on lawyers.
Fundamentally, I'd counter-sue for malicious prosecution (that's the criminal law term, there's a civil law equivalent, but I can't remember the phrase), since the suit is prima facia invalid.
Fuck them with a red hot poker.
-Erik
There are always four sides to every story: your side, their side, the truth, and what really happened.
But this time, this is just plain stupid.
You do _NOT_ get jurisdiction over every single human being in the entire world merely because they post something on the 'net.
If you do, then we're in trouble when a more repressive regime than the US attempts to indict us in the US for crimes against their nation elsewhere.
This is seeing the trees but not the forest, people. You get jurisdiction over someone by _actively_ doing something involving the forum state. This could be something as simple as putting your information into interstate commerce - but the idea that putting something on the net, for free, is in interstate commerce probably violates a half dozen treaties, not to mention the entire concept of jurisdiction.
(IANAL, usual rules of don't bother fact checking this because I haven't either. And don't rely on this for anything - consult a real lawyer before fighting a megacorporation with tentacles all over the world just like HYDRA)
This would be unbelievable if we hadn't already seen just how mindless the MPAA and CCA have been in the past.
I just skimmed the brief, and it could probably be considered defamation on the FSF, lots of people like Linus, ESR, various people like Bob Young, even Tim O'Reilly . . . Basically, it accuses anyone who claims to be involved with the `open source' movement of supporting theft of intellectual property. This might be my non-legal mind misunderstanding what they were saying, but it's pretty damned blatant, as far as I'm concerned.
I really think some high profile people should sue the MPAA over this particular piece of fiction. It's incredibly insulting.
On another note, if they really do think this about the open source world, it would explain why they're being so paranoid about us - they seem to think we really are out to get them, however we can.
Personally I'm not, and I don't think you could say that this particular group of people really agrees on anything enough to say that we're out to get someone . . .
In any case, this is an incredibly dumb document, put out by a group that, it is becoming increasingly clear, is completely disconnected from anythin that remotely resembles the real world. I think the MPAA should be taken out the back and shot (metaphorically speaking, of course . . . ;-) They're becoming more dangerous than useful, IMHO.
himi
--
My very own DeCSS mirror.
Kind of like before the invention of the radio .....
Some people, like Eric Corley, are acting by defying the MPAA and risking financial ruin if they lose the DeCSS case.
Some, like the Electronic Frontier Foundation are working to preserve our rights in the networked era by defending brave folks like Corley.
Even with attorneys working pro-bono, mounting a legal defense is terribly expensive (just think of the cost of long-distance calls and plane fare for the participants). One way you can make a difference is by joining the EFF, which you can do with a credit card at the following link:
https://www.eff.org/support/joineff.html
(You can also mail in a check.)
If you do nothing else to work for the cause of justice in the DeCSS case, at least join the EFF. It will only take a few minutes, and you can give what you're comfortable with.
-- Could you use my software consulting serv
https://www.eff.org/support/joineff.html
And if you want to read about why this matters, click here:
http://www.goingware.com/decss
It's not about watching movies on Linux anymore.
It's about your right to say what you want in a free society. Eric Corley is a member of the press, and 2600's web site is his publication. Judge Kaplan has just permanently enjoined Corley from practicing unrestrained journalism.
-- Could you use my software consulting serv
...at least do it right. Free Software is a "movement". Open Source is just a study in economics.
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
Well, with the case against 2600 surely going to appeal, and now this, I'm sure the EFF will have it's hands full.
I sent them $100 a while ago in a fit of temporary wealth. Maybe it's time to do it again. Yeah, I also bought Copyleft's anti-DVDCCA shirt (someone at work actually thought my posession of it was illegal without even caring whether such a law was just -- scary. Since I'm not in Judge Kaplan's judisdiction, I'm sure this isn't the case.)
Better yet, perhaps it's time to send, oh, I don't know $20 or $30 a month to the EFF on a regular basis. Anyone know if they accept ongoing contributions via credit card?
FWIF, I don't own a DVD player (and won't buy one unless I can view movies with free software), don't collect MP3s of copyright works, and will actually purchase a CD for one song, if I like it (though I'd prefer if the artist got more of my money for it.) Heck, I've purchased some CDs because I liked the cover art! (And have usually liked the music to boot.) I've boycotted movies (and amazon.com because of their stupid patent) for about six months now (not perfectly -- it's hard with a 7 year old, but cutting consumption is the important thing).
The frightening thing about this is that MPJDGI (Most People Just Don't Get It). They equate the internet as some kind of "interactive TV" in terms of "serving content", instead of a place where you get and share what you wish. An ignorant mob is a dangerous mob.
Also, the issues are so obvbious to "us" that often we don't even realize that "they" don't get it. Ever explain something to a wanna-be code jockey, only to have them program some real garbage? That's how dealing with "the masses" on these issues is.
While the DVD CCA, and MPAA have legitimate beefs against copyright violation, I fear that a great deal of baby is going to get thrown out with that particular brand of bathwater before this issue settles down.
Rene S. Hollan
You could've hired me.
Interesting that the DVDCCA is bashing open source (ok, they make some very negative deragatory comments about "open source" which seemed to mock it.), when they use it. I did an HTTP request to dvdcca.org, and they apparently use Apache 1.3.3 on Unix. Try it yourself, if you'd like. Funny, considering the hypocrisy post earlier today.
"The universe seems neither benign nor hostile, merely indifferent." --Carl Sagan
MPAA is missing something: the California Trade Secrets Act provides a complete defense:
They say:
And here is the defense, at eff.org:
CALIFORNIA CIVIL CODE : SECTION 3426.1
3426. This title may be cited as the Uniform Trade Secrets Act.
3426.1. As used in this title, unless the context requires otherwise:
(a) "Improper means" includes theft, bribery, misrepresentation, breach or inducement of a breach of a duty to maintain secrecy, or espionage through electronic or other means. Reverse engineering or independent derivation alone shall not be considered improper means.
(b) "Misappropriation" means:
(1) Acquisition of a trade secret of another by a person who knows or has reason to know that the trade secret was acquired by improper means; or
(2) Disclosure or use of a trade secret of another without express or implied consent by a person who:
(A) Used improper means to acquire knowledge of the trade secret; or
(B) At the time of disclosure or use, knew or had reason to know that his or her knowledge of the trade secret was:
(i) Derived from or through a person who had utilized improper means to acquire it;
(ii) Acquired under circumstances giving rise to a duty to maintain its secrecy or limit its use; or
(iii) Derived from or through a person who owed a duty to the person seeking relief to maintain its secrecy or limit its use; or
(C) Before a material change of his or her position, knew or had reason to know that it was a trade secret and that knowledge of it had been acquired by accident or mistake.
(c) "Person" means a natural person, corporation, business trust, estate, trust, partnership, limited liability company, association, joint venture, government, governmental subdivision or agency, or any other legal or commercial entity.
(d) "Trade secret" means information, including a formula, pattern, compilation, program, device, method, technique, or process, that:
(1) Derives independent economic value, actual or potential, from not being generally known to the public or to other persons who can obtain economic value from its disclosure or use; and
(2) Is the subject of efforts that are reasonable under the circumstances to maintain its secrecy.
[Emphasis added. So not only is reverse engineering perfectly legal under California trade secret law, it is also perfectly legal under the DMCA right now, and in Norway, where the reverse engineering took place. Send check to EFF.org now!]
As is often noted, "one who intentionally shoots a bullet into a state is as subject to the judicial jurisdiction of [that] state ... as if he had actually fired the bullet in the state."
What's so stupid about them providing examples like this is that it ignores one of the most basic principles of the Internet - that it is an individual user that "pulls" information to himself. The publisher of information doesn't distribute to *anywhere* in the world except the server on which he or she places it.
I'm getting kind of tired of this.
The Entertainment industry wants us to consume but they want to control how and where we do this consumption. I keep thinking of the money fleeced from consumers by the invention of the CD - it was supposed to cut costs of album production, and it did, from ~$10 per to ~$1 per - but did the recording industry reduce prices to consumers?
Even now, the sludge-brains at the record companies are offering music on the internet for - surprise - the same price you'd pay for the CD at Wal-Mart. Gee - I have to sit through a download and then burn a CD and I get no cover art, no liner notes, no CD case, shit, I even have to provide the blank CD and I still have to pay $15 for an album?!
Gnrow!
Yah.
Somehow or another the giants must fall. The gigantic, monolithic, blood-sucking industry that surrounds all popular culture must fall. If it doesn't, freedom will. They can't ever be allowed to tell us what protocols we can use, what software we aren't allowed to own on the assumption that we might put it to illegal use. This cannot be allowed to happen!
There's no need anymore for NBC, Sony Records, United Artists as they stand. The status quo is gone. The future of artistic endeavor has to be: you put it up, you're honest and good, people visit your site and pull it down. No record companies, only music reviewers. No movie industry, just reviewers, etc. Artists and the trusted portals will be the champions, dissemination will be ubiquitous.
What this really means, of course, is that your Monday morning chat around the water-cooler will be highly eclectic, because there won't be any "Friends" or "Seinfelds" - we'll move in different circles.
I'm getting tired.
That is all.
MjM
XKCD:Xeric Knowledge Comically Dispen
The guy's still an idiot, of course, but at least we can understand why.
--
--
The New World Order is upon us, and it's about damned time.