Achtung Wolfenstein Screenshots

Thermodyne writes: "The sequel of the game that helped invent the fps is being developed and the first of the screenshots have been released here. The game is based on the Quake 3 engine, but seems to stray away from the original intent of the first game." I can't begin to count the number of hours I lost in wolf3d ... course, I hope it does stray from the original game: who wants to run around shooting dogs and finding hidden switches for 30 levels? The lighting in some of those screenshots is super impressive. (check out that flame thrower). Sadly, I think my fps days are past me. I played The Sims for the first time last week. What an amazing game.

Comments

It's sad, really

[Wind_Walker]

You know, like every geek out there, I drooled over Wolfenstein 3D. It was new, different, and you could actually kill people. If memory serves, that is the reason that I first bought a sound card, was to hear the screams of the dead soldiers.

But now, FPS has become a cliched genre. "Ooh, what do I do now? I search for a switch and it lets me exit the level! How original!" How many games have come out recently that are FPS? ALL OF THEM. The only exceptions are RTS games like Starcraft (itself only a new skin on top of Warcraft).

PC games have hit a rut, and developers have no good ideas anymore. It nearly makes me want to buy an old Nintendo and bust out Bubble Bobble. PC game (and console, anymore) developers have no creativity and can't find a good storyline with a map and a flashlight.

------
That's just the way it is

Re:It's sad, really

[Anonymous Coward]

Stange, I can think of only a few "real" fps (UT/Q3 not included because they're multi-only) games that i've seen/played the last 2 years... Daikatana and Mortyr...

There seemed to be more games like Deus Ex/System Shock 2 ,"thinking fps", and 3rd person games like DS9: the fallen, Alice and 3rd person melee games like Rune/Blade Of Darkness.

Infact, I'm DIEING to play a true Doom/Quake style FPS! Doom 3/Wolfenstein/DNF/Serious Sam are the only ones I know about, and most of them will prolly take more then a year to be released! :(

Re:It's sad, really

[ACK!!]

Wait a second what about Half-Life? Listen it is an old game but I am personally VERY disappointed that other game companies did not take the hint and start creating FPS games with more depth and storyline treatments. Come on the idea of looking through the eyes of a character in a game and running in first person through an action sceneriao is wonderful.

I think the industry has hit a rut and I agree with that but the possibilities are endless. I think the comparison is close to Sci-Fi literature which has the most possibility of brilliant ideas but constantly gets mired down in crappy output from publishers wanting to make another space opera and the quick buck.

Re:It's sad, really

[hooverdirt]

You're right. I'm going to buy a Sega Megadrive
and play myself a base of Zero Wing.





.My sig is a mig do you dig?

Re:It's sad, really

[ackthpt]

Sadly I think my fps days are past me. I played The Sims for the first time last week. What an amazing game.

But now, FPS has become a cliched genre.

Indeed. These games have bored me stiff, since completing the original W3D. Really, I have to drink 4 shots of espresso just to even read reviews of this stuff without drifting off into rapid eye movement.

Like Sims (which also bored me to tears after the first evening playing it, but I actually played it for 4 hours before dislodging my lower jaw with a large yawn.) But strategy, yeah!, get me screaming profanities at my computer when some 60K compiled C program (the old Conquest grid game) takes away my favorite planet and I'm fixated. I'll get even! Bits will be spilled! AAARRRGHHHH!!!!!!

I've loved reading books on tactics and strategy and playing games written by someone who relies more on recursive functions than collision detection. The journey, like the old saying, is the reward, not the destination (the last few turns are kinda dull as I mop up the enemy.) Need more of these games.

--

Re:It's sad, really

[nomadic]

How many games have come out recently that are FPS? ALL OF THEM.

What's worse than that is they're the same FPS! I'm not just talking about look and feel, I mean codebase. Are the Quake 3, UT, and Half-life engines so perfect that nobody is even trying to design new ones?

And don't get me started on RTSes. It's kind of sad, the computer game industry went from one where people designed games out of love to one where everyone's trying for the next blockbuster. Kind of like what the movie industry went through in the early 80's.
--

Re:It's sad, really

[treke]

Half Life is based on the Quake 1 engine, and no other games have been written on top of it(except the mods for Half Life. Of course there are other engines out there. Take Tribes 2's new engine for example.
treke

Re:It's sad, really

[nomadic]

Some of the mods are really new games in my opinion; even if you discount them, Gunman Chronicles is based on the Half-life engine, and I think it qualifies as a new game.
--

Re:It's sad, really

[platypus]

Infact, I'm DIEING to play a true Doom/Quake style FPS! Doom 3/Wolfenstein/DNF/Serious Sam are the only ones I know about, and most of them will prolly take more then a year to be released! :(

Try Soldiers of fortune.

Re:It's sad, really

[JMYoda]

If you want to see what FPS and PC games can be check out Deus Ex. It's the merging of FPS, RPGs and Action/Adventure. It ranks up with Half-Life and Metal Gear Solid on my all-time favorites list. Sadly it hasn't sold well despite being a major critical success. I will agree with the slashdot poster on The Sims... It's not in a genre that would normally appeal to me but it is as addictive (and fun) as hell. I will buy the new W3D if it's a solid RPG, I loved both SOF and NOLF this past year but nothing blew me away like Deus Ex did (and in a whole different way The Sims).

Re:It's sad, really

[JMYoda]

That should have read "it's a solid FPS" DOH

Re:It's sad, really

[Dick Richards]

Monolith's Lithtech engine (No One Lives Forever) is pretty good.

Re:It's sad, really

[greydmiyu]

The industry didn't take notice. You're right, Deus Ex (UT engine) was never made, nor was No One Lives Forever (Lith Engine). Silly industry. ;)

Site /.'ed

[big_groo]

http://www.3d-shooters.com/screenshots/return_to_c astle_wolfenstein/

Here's another site. Other server is too busy.

Re:Site /.'ed

[sleeper0]

The URL works, it just had an included HR that needs to be removed.

http://www.3d-shooters.com/screenshots/return_to_c astle_wolfenstein/

enjoy

Quake3 engine

[Beowulf_Boy]

I'm sorry to here its based on the Quake3 engine, and it seems to me it makes things look way to cartoonish, I like the Quake2 engine much better.
An Example being that StarTrek game based on Quake3, it looked terrible (atleast to me)

Re:Quake3 engine

[Aunt Mable]

Hell yes. A scene looking like this is just laughable.

-- Eat your greens or I'll hit you!

Re:Quake3 engine

[-Harlequin-]

The top three screenshots look pretty good - I don't think they look very cartoonish:

http://www.3dactionplanet.com/wolfenstein/images /p hoto/index.asp

The ones below with more cartoony subject matter look more cartoony, but that's the point - I think you're confusing the engine with the way the artists use it. The Quake2 engine rendering looks a lot more cartoony to me than Q3 does, though the art, design, lighting, etc, are more cartoony in Q3A.

Or maybe we just grew up watching different styles of cartoon :-)

For The Record ..

[citizenc]

.. this editorial was written as a response to Grey Loki's editorial entitled Are We Living In A Broadband World?.

For the goatse.cx weary, http://www.3dactionplanet.com/features/editorials/ broadband/

------------
CitizenC

Re:For The Record ..

[antdude]

Also, http://www.3dactionplanet.com/features/editorials/ modemusers/ is a good article about game developers and companies for analog modemers.

Re:For The Record ..

[grappler]

For the goatse.cx weary, http://www.3dactionplanet.com/features/editorials/ broadband/

I don't see what the big deal is - you move the mouse over a link and the url shows up in the status bar.

Re:For The Record ..

[lw54]

I don't see what the big deal is - you move the mouse over a link and the url shows up in the status bar.

Except when they use Javascript mouseovers.

Re:For The Record ..

[grappler]

you gotta point there. I have it turned off, but if someone didn't that could pose a problem.

I'd like to leave javascript on but disable any ability to write in the status bar (the status bar is MINE) or create any kind of popup window.

Re:For The Record ..

[Anthony Brundell]

That's not really the point (slashdot disables the onmouseover attributes). The recet trend is to make hyperlinks to http://innocent-site/%20%20%20@goatse.cx, where the chain of %20's is so long that the address you see in the status bar is just http://innocdent-site/. The meaning of the URL is to log in as user http://innocent-site/(then a load of spaces) at the site goatse.cx.

I

Re:For The Record ..

[Anthony Brundell]

No he doesn't have a point. Not on slashdot, at least, where javascript attributes are not allowed for any elements in the user comments.

Better luck next time, you ugly fuck of a karma whore.

Re:For The Record ..

[pod]

It's for the sheeple.

Re:For The Record ..

[Anthony Brundell]

I don't see what the big deal is - you move the mouse over a link and the url shows up in the status bar.

I don't wish to appear rude, but you are a fucking retard. Are you not aware of the latest craze for cleverly disguised goatse.cx links suck as this one? Look at your status bar now, you little nonce.

Re:For The Record ..

[ahaning]

I always wondered why it looked like "http://innocent-site/%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20% 20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20 %20%20%20%20%20%20" in my Netscape 4.76 status bar :). After a while, I just learned that the string of %20's meant it was a goatse.cx link.

What will they come up with next?


kickin' science like no one else can,
my dick is twice as long as my attention span.

Re:For The Record ..

[grappler]

Seeing as how my karma is over 50 and can only go down, I'd have to be pretty stupid to decide to go karma whoring.

Now, if you are the moron I think you are, you will respond to this saying something like "exactly, you _are_ stupid" so at least be original otherwise go fuck yourself.

Re:For The Record ..

[ahaning]

I'm glad you like my .sig. I wanted to put an actual link in it, but, unfortunately, the slashdot .sig char limit includes the html "code" and all the blah blah blah took up too many chars. So I had to get slightly creative.

Oh well...


kickin' science like no one else can,
my dick is twice as long as my attention span.

Re:For The Record ..

[ahaning]

Crap. That looks dumb, let me try that again...

I'm glad you like my .sig. I wanted to put an actual link in it, but, unfortunately, the slashdot .sig char limit includes the html "code" and all the <a href="http://www.mchawking.com"> blah blah blah took up too many chars. So I had to get slightly creative.

Oh well...


kickin' science like no one else can,
my dick is twice as long as my attention span.

Wolf3d 2?

[WickedClean]

Hopefully the game will be more than just another shooter. Will it's multiplayer ability be better than Unreal Tournament?

Rob Malda, always ahead of the curve:

[Wakko Warner]

I played The Sims for the first time last week. What an amazing game.

Yeah, that one's cool, but there's this new game coming out called "Chess" that I hear is *really* awesome. Anyone got a chance to play it yet?!

- A.P.

--
* CmdrTaco is an idiot.

Re:Rob Malda, always ahead of the curve:

[nEoN nOoDlE]

What is this game called Chess that you speak of? Will it run on my PII 400?

Re:Rob Malda, always ahead of the curve:

[jedwards]

No, you need one of these.

Re:Rob Malda, always ahead of the curve:

[Glytch]

>It's a shame. Great idea, marred by that one problem.

Well, that problem, and also the fact that the AI in the game is ROCK STUPID.

Re:Rob Malda, always ahead of the curve:

[SimHacker]

Originally, the "ai" in the game was smart enough that it would always figure out the best thing for the characters to do all of the time, but that meant that anything the poor player told them to do would just make their lives worse off. That resulted in bad game play. So Will Wright decided to tone down the ai and "blur" their motivation, so they choose randomly between several good actions to do, instead of always choosing the best. Good game play is much more important than having the best possible ai.

There's also a good reason for the way time is distorted: it amplifies the importance of building a house with "good feng shui". If your characters take 15 minutes to take out the garbage, you need to rearrange your furniture and add some doors and trash cans, so they can live more efficiently. That's the whole point of the game! It's about building an efficient household, and the family of Sims evaluates how good your design is, by living in it.

-Don

Re:Rob Malda, always ahead of the curve:

[kasparov]

Nope. Never heard of it.

kasparov

Re:Rob Malda, always ahead of the curve:

[SimHacker]

Put a mote around the front door, with only a one-way diving board, and your uninvited guests will die more quickly.

My suggestion for handling that situation of being trapped with no doors, was that the trapped characters would eventually start running a full tilt up against the walls, smashing into them again and again until they finally broke through a hole in the shape of their bodies, then they would run off into the distance, never to be seen again, leaving behind a new silhouette shaped door in the wall like a Roger Rabbit cartoon. But somehow that just didn't make it into the final design... But at least you can easily kill people by building walls around them.

My favortite stupid ai bug, that I wanted to leave in but unfortunately was fixed before shipping, was when a guy was sitting on the toilet taking a nice lesiurely poop, with the pixelated censorship around his crotch. The maid noticed that the toilet was clogged, but didn't care that it was in use, so she walked into the bathroom, whipped out a plunger, thrust it down through the guy's lap, and started vigorously jerking away with both hands on the erect plunger handle sticking up between the guys legs! The censorship effect didn't make it look any less obscene.

-Don

wolf

[philipm]

I remmber playing wolfenstein when it was still around. It seemed kind of convoluted, but a bit fun. I missed all the fps in between then and now.

I have no wish to kill imaginary people or real people. It probably would be safer if all you psychotics got guns and practiced at firing ranges, instead of internalizing your hate for your fellow humans.

Trolls don't hate each other. Trolls have tough love for each other. And they at least, are a bit more creative than just shooting someone. After all, slashdot trolls started the whole "All your base are belong to us" thing. What have you ever done?

Fallout

[Wind_Walker]

Ok, the original Fallout might be a valid counter-agrument, I forgot about that one. So, I'll grant you. ONE game in the past 3 years (that's a conservative time estimate) has an original storyline and plot. Now if only they would port it to Linux... But there's really no hope in that, since the games that get ported are always old, poorly done, and require such horrible system requirements, you'd need a P4 just to run Wolfenstein, much less something new...

And you've given me 2 counter-examples for the future. Do you know that there will be more than 3,500 games released next year? I guarantee most of them will be FPS...

------
That's just the way it is

Re:Fallout

[Erasmus Darwin]

Ok, the original Fallout might be a valid counter-agrument, [...] has an original storyline and plot.

Was Fallout original, innovative, and an all-around great game? Hell, yes. Was the plot original? Not quite -- the whole "military base churning out bad guys in a post-apocalyptic future" storyline is nearly identical to that of its unofficial predecessor, Wasteland.

Inspiration?

[Lion-O]

Now why do I get this feeling that these people completely ran out of ideas and in order to get more money in start doing re-runs? The screenshots look nice, but are we really waiting for a game which basicly offers more of the same?

IMHO its a total shame that the whole game market seems to be totally out of inspiration these days. Sometimes you come across a title which offers a complete new setup (based on something allready these I guess) but in most cases its just more of the same. The last game I've bought (Oni) is IMO a good example; its a 3rd person 'fight / shoot 'm up' but offers quite some new options. Ever fought 3 man at the same time by disarming one poor bastard and shooting the rest with his weapon? I've never seen Lara Croft do that, to name just another 3rd person game and perfect example. IMO another game which just kept on going adding basicly nothing to gameplay, just nicer landscapes and some new moves, in order to get gain more money.

As I said; the screenshots looked nice. The game itself is a shame IMVHO. Why not put the effort and money into something new?

Re:Inspiration?

[sedawkgrep]

Actually, I am looking forward to this game more than I do most FPS (except HalfLife II) simply because it deals with a topic I find endlessly fascinating:

European (in this case Nazi) WWII history.

Granted, they will take many liberties with characters, environments, etc, but being able to run around as a 3rd-reich-0wn1ng-one-man-wrecking-crew-badass has me totally jazzed. I hope there is enough realism in the environments (rooms, uniforms, guns, buildings, architecture (Speer)) to add that extra spark to the game. Star Trek Elite Force was wonderful in that it was exactly like being in an episode of Voyager. (albeit with a lot more killing..heh)

I think that as more companies adopt using previously-developed engines we will find many games that are either sequels to much older games, or that are derived from historical references or legends. I have no problem with this, if the games are done well. I also think fewer next-generation game companies are going to have the time/talent/budget to build Oni-type games, opting instead for simpler designs with stronger stories. Look at Half-Life. Outstanding game - simple (almost comic) storyline, executed perfectly and captivating from beginning to end. Opposing Force was nearly as good!

There will always be game companies that do innovative things too, though. I just don't feel the need to spurn the ideas - only the finished products if they are poor.

sedawkgrep

Re:Inspiration?

[Metrol]

Why not put the effort and money into something new?

That's something like saying, "why do all these movies still have light projected through them to show on a screen". All the while ignoring the fantastic advances in the technology producing those images.

The original Wolfenstein wasn't the end of all fps games, it was merely the beginning. This techology is maturing before our eyes into a genre closer to interactive movies rather than simply just a game. A good case in point would be the first couple of levels of Unreal, and even more so with Half-Life. One of the most important aspects of each of these games is that they include characters that you should not just gun down, and in many cases are a part of the interactive story.

In my mind, it's not so much the notion of inventing something new, but rather to take these wonderful technologies to the realms of artists, writers, and designers to give them depth that goes WAY beyond the media constraints of TV or movies.

Reason we're not off on to completely new paradigms for this type of gaming is that we're really just getting out of it's infancy. There are still some really great problems to get through, like how to effectively interact with other computer characters beyond just shooting them.

On a side note, was reading an article recently in PC Gamer about a new game that hopes to recreate the entirety of WWII as a multi-player game. Bringing together all these different technologies to allow you to work on strategy, tactics, FPS involvement, flight sim, and all that. Forget the name of it as I lent the mag to a bud of mine who is a huge history nut. The great thing about all this, is that we're just now seeing this kind of depth of plot and gaming coming to together.

Re:Inspiration?

[Raven667]

In my mind, it's not so much the notion of inventing something new, but rather to take these wonderful technologies to the realms of artists, writers, and designers to give them depth that goes WAY beyond the media constraints of TV or movies.

My idea, games should be about fun, not technology. No, I don't run around with my DEC PDP-1 saying "Spacewar is it, all other games are just derivitave trash", but gameplay must come first. Look at the store shelves sometime, most games are "Foo II" or "Bar 3 Ultra" or some such jazz, same gameplay, rehashed graphics. The last new genre that I can remember is the real-time stragety, and it has been published to death.

Bagh! Enough ranting for now.

Re:Inspiration?

[RallyDriver]

The canonical, truly original game has to be "Lemmings" - I haven't seen anything so radically different be so successful before or since on any platform.

Re:Inspiration?

[-Harlequin-]

My idea, games should be about fun, not technology. No, I don't run around with my DEC PDP-1 saying "Spacewar is it, all other games are just derivitave trash", but gameplay must come first. Look at the store shelves sometime, most games are "Foo II" or "Bar 3 Ultra" or some such jazz, same gameplay, rehashed graphics. The last new genre that I can remember is the real-time stragety, and it has been published to death.

It sounds like you're talking about Hollywood movies, and in a sense you are because the problem is largely the same - There is no limit to the number of directors with clever, deep, new, experimental ideas for film, and with the talent to make them. But they'll never get the funding they need to make those films because Hollywood is not about entertainment, it's about money. And since cringe-comedy "there's something about Mary" films are cheap to make and earn lots at the box-office, that's the type of film that the corporations will fund.

In the game industry, it does not matter if your game is good if you can't get the shelf space to sell it, and getting that shelf space is a game of intrigue and back-room deals that usually requires millions in marketing just for the up-front entry fee - regardless of eventual success. That's assuming you've got a great game. Getting there itself requires that you find funding, and that usually means going to investors. And investors are not usually interested in trying out something new because something untried is likely to fail in this industry.

The solution? I don't know. Everyone thought that Doom was the solution - it was a bestseller that bypassed the shelves alltogether. A new era was dawning in which the games availible to buy would nolonger be limited to the shelf space (and associated politics) of retailers. But it seems Doom was a once-off and we're back to square one, despite the new ubiquity of the net.

The film industry has been around longer than the game industry. How have they solved the problem?
Well OK, they haven't, but they seem to have made a little more progress towards alternative systems. Unfortunately, I suspect some of this is due to film being considered "culture" and thus more ameniable to things like government aid, while games are "youth timewasters" and thus entirely at the mercy of the largest/lowest-common-denominator tendancies of unfettered capitalism.

It's so stupid - we have a huge alternative distribution channel sitting unused, but the whole games market is locked into a vicious cycle that doesn't look like it can be broken any time soon.

Re:Inspiration?

[Raven667]

Damn good point, you know there is still a small underground industry for things like hardcore wargames that only sell a few thousand or tens of thousands of copies. Going back to shareware would definitely be an improvement.

Re:Inspiration?

[greydmiyu]

Too bad the controls are a pain in the ass to manipulate, huh? Even the most basic movement is difficult because of the constant camera shifting. Might be nice for those who played the PS games that the same crappy camera style but, please, not here too!

Sega

[Wind_Walker]

Too bad their marketing sucks and they can't get any good hardware out there. I mean, they drop support of the Dreamcast just when people are starting to talk about it?!?!?!? WTF is up with that?

Shenmue is a great game, but I was talking about the stagnation of PC games. Good luck ever getting SEGA to port something to a PC. They can't even program for their own hardware...

------
That's just the way it is

The forgotten original

[Faust7]

Is "the first game" supposed to mean Wolfenstein 3-D? There were two Wolfenstein games before that, Castle Wolfenstein and Beyond Castle Wolfenstein. I don't know what system they were originally designed for, but I think they were made by Muse Software--at least, that's what I remember seeing on the title screens of the Apple II versions (along with some copy-protection cracker handles, heh).

Original Wolfenstein Games

[Roogna]

Am I the only person left who remembers playing Wolfenstein games, well before Wolf3d even existed, back on the C64? It's amazing how far the games have come, but even then, I remember those original top down Wolf games to be more fun than Wolf3d ever ended up being to me. Ahh well...

Re:Original Wolfenstein Games

[Abstract]

Wasn't that one called: return to the eagle's nest or something? My favorite C64 game.

Re:Original Wolfenstein Games

[Gordan1]

I remember eatin bratwurst and wienershnitzel out of German tresure chests. Games have come a long way. Wolfenstien in particular, but at least in the past they had substance. Now there are all the same. No real plotline.

Re:Original Wolfenstein Games

[Yortook]

I remember playing that game on an Apple II AND the C64. Remember the soldiers used to yell stuff in German? What a cool game! Go grab yourself a C64 emulator + the Castle Wolfenstein disk image and play it again. I did this a while ago and it was a real blast...

wolfenstein?

[Pheersum]

When will it be ported to Linux? Everyone knows that Linux is a superior gaming platform. It could sell a million copies.

Linux

[Wind_Walker]

The best part about Wolfenstein being ported to Linux is that now, anybody with an old computer sitting in the corner can play it again. I mean, without paying $100 for an extra copy of Windows 9x to play it on (cause you have to have a separate license for every computer, you know).

Anybody with a x86 could play games! Now how much more great could it get?!?!?! We need more games ported. I agree with you; when will developers start to take Linux seriously as a gaming OS?

------
That's just the way it is

Where are the nazis???!!!

[phaze3000]

The screen shots show all these weird alien looking guys - where are the nazis? They look more like the goombas from the Super Mario Bros film than anything (except for the swastikas of course). I was looking forward to kicking some far-right butt...

--

Re:Where are the nazis???!!!

[nachoworld]

The Nazis are all too busy for the screen shots because someone set up us the bomb and they are trying to sweep them out. I think that we'll be seeing more pics of them soon however, as this guy here has stated that 'all the base are belong to us.' As you can see from the background, he's right.

---

Re:Where are the nazis???!!!

[oddrune]

You missed the "Pictures" part of the site -- featuring nazi-dressed models with a whip.

How can anyone resist these two nazi's?

:-)

Re:Where are the nazis???!!!

[analyst99]

Yeah! Bring on the nazi's and let's kick some butt!!! DW

Re:Where are the nazis???!!!

[Erasmus Darwin]

The screen shots show all these weird alien looking guys

While looking through the screen shots, I couldn't help but imagine someone like Jeff K. suggesting that the new Wolf3D game should have killer robots and zombies and flamethrowers and ninjas and tanks and mummies and...

hey taco

[flynt]

. I played The Sims for the first time last week. What an amazing game.

I got that game last Christmas, I would have said the same thing a week after Christmas. Since New Year's, I haven't played it. I'm sure you'll be doing the same in about 1 or 2 more weeks. It is a good idea and a fun game, but after the initial wow factor, it is very very boring. You'll see.

Give the guy a break

[jawtheshark]

You should really give the guy a break! Even if "The Sims" is quite old, some people (like me) do not have the time to play a lot of games.
I have holiday the next week and I hope to check out some games lying around for ages...for once that I have time (For example I have Age of Empires 2 lying around which is very old: Never played it...no time...will check it out this week)

Hehe, your sig matches well with your comment, by the way.

What's everyone waiting for?

[xFoz]

Load up an Apple II emulator.
Play the original Escape From Castle Wolfenstien.
The classic that started it all.
Bribe guards, kill guards, and talk to guards!
All in glorious 1D!

Re:What's everyone waiting for?

[Aelfinn]

I remember playing that on my older brother's Apple IIE. I loved that game. Thanks for the link.

Re:What's everyone waiting for?

[Asparfame]

Yeah... isn't it hilarious when people correct other people and are still fundamentally wrong?

The Original Wolfenstein

[call -151]

The original Wolfenstein was from Muse software in 1981 for the Apple II, and was one of the first with (almost recognizable) speech- "Achtung!"

Check out this page for a screenshot from the Apple II if you want a little memory trip. The page also has info about running it under emulation on a PC.

The first of the screenshots?!?

[James Foster]

Uhm... The first screenshots were released over a year ago.

Re:The first of the screenshots?!?

[dbug78]

not only that, but i saw most of these "new" shots a couple months ago.

Right here.

[jetpack]

Well, there's this one at least.

Castle Smurfenstein!!

[ehintz]

When I was young and foolish I wasted many an hour blowing Smurfs to hell... The game was called Castle Smurfenstein, and was basically ripped off from Wolfenstein. They claimed that SMURF stood for Secret Military Undergound Resistance Force, and that the smurfs were actually Hitler's last chance at revenge. They would make all the worlds children peace loving and docile, then the smurfs would pop up with submachine guns and blow 'em all away, thereby reviving the third reich...

There is something rather pleasing about sticking a virtual gun in a Smurf's chest, hearing it beg for it's little blue life, and then blowing it to hell... ;-) I may have to go find myself an Apple II emulator and relive my glory days as Smurfbutcher Bob...
Regards,

Re:Castle Smurfenstein!!

[Judas96']

I didn't have a computer during the wolfenstien era, but I sure did spend too much time gibbing everybody's favorite purple dinosaur with the the BarnyDoom mod :).

Here we go again

[screwballicus]

Somehow I think what we're looking at here is the gaming equivalent of the new Gallactica series. An old concept, grown cheesy with age, given bright shiny new packaging. Besides &ltvalley girl impression&gtohmygosh, WWII games are like sooo 20th century&lt/valley girl impression&gt

More details about the game...

[Cyrix Haldir]

I run an italian gaming site, and some time ago we interviewed Jonathan Knight from Return to casle wolfenstein dev. team... he gave us some details, maybe you are interested in them :)

The interview is available in english and italian.

Hope you enjoy it...

Mirror

[Anonymous Coward]

That page has been slashdotted, Shack has all those screenshots too though:

Wolf2K Shots

Crap, WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY off topic. =)

[citizenc]

Woops, wrong thread. Wrong post. Oh hell, this is even on the wrong FORUM! Feel free to mod me down to the netherreigons of Slashdot. =)

------------
CitizenC

Giant Robots?

[derf77]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but there were no giant robots in the original.

Re:Giant Robots?

[jaysones]

Didn't Hitler turn into a giant robot on the last boss fight?

The Wolf3D sequel has been out for many years...

[pergamon]

...and it is called Rise of the Triad

Doom3

[Anonymous Coward]

excites me much more than this. I have the MPG of the (engine) demo at MacWorld Japan, and the graphics are so FAR beyond this Wolf3D remake, its rediculous.

Spear of destiny

[ZiGGyKAoS]

Wasnt spear of destiny the sequel to Wolfenstein?
Billions of hours of my youth consisted of both of these games.. I think I still have the first 5 or so levels memorised of Wolfenstein.. :]

I don't like those mutants and monsters...

[antdude]

[begin rant] I like realistic characters like in the original Wolfenstein 3D, Spear of Destiny, and the 2D versions. The game doesn't feel like Wolfenstein without those infamous Nazi soldiers, commanders, etc. Do we really needs mutants, zombies, robots, monsters, etc.? To think about that, I think this game will have strange weapons as well. :(

I don't think I will want this game. [end of rant]

Re:I don't like those mutants and monsters...

[Cuthalion]

What? Wolfenstiein3d had zombies! Those were those guys that waved their arms around while the shotguns in their chest fired. Dr. Schabb would turn you into one if you weren't careful! (I believe that was Episode 2).

Did you play beyond the free downloads ever?

Re:I don't like those mutants and monsters...

[Datafage]

Most people didn't, I know I at least didn't until the full version was a free download...

-----------------------

Re:I don't like those mutants and monsters...

[antdude]

Oh yeah. Those enemies were annoying. I liked the other human enemies. Yes, I played the whole game.

Re:I don't like those mutants and monsters...

[Bungie]

You think that was bad, try playing against the Pacman ghosts in the bonus levels of the Mac version!

Re:I don't like those mutants and monsters...

[antdude]

You meant Xen levels (alien worlds). Ugh!

Re:I don't like those mutants and monsters...

[antdude]

That was in the PC version as well. It's secret levels so... :)

that is NOT the engine's fault...

[Forrestina]

ok, so, there's an engine. it controls the framework of the game, rendering things, etc etc....

that engine can handle pretty much any texturing and modeling that you want to throw at it (within reason of course, it is only a game). but, it could be used to make things look like anything.

if things are cartoonish, that was a choice of the developers of the game, not the developers of the engine itself.

-------

Re:that is NOT the engine's fault...

[pod]

I myself and getting pretty tired of all these 'insightful' posts to any story remotely related to Q3. The way the game looks does not have much to do with the engine. Q# was meant to look cartoonish, and I think it has suceeded pretty well. But this result comes from the textures used (and dynamic lighting to some extent), not the game engine. You don't have to use lightly shaded pastel colours on your models.

Medal of Honor

[jrs]

I think ID needs to play the Medal of Honor games on the PSX to see how to do another nazi game again. Mutants, Monsters? Yeah, the nazi's did experiments but nothing like this. Doom 3, Wolf 3, Quake 3... Running out of ideas ID?

Re:Medal of Honor

[demon]

Well, id Software isn't doing "Return to Castle Wolfenstein", just so you know. I don't know offhand what the name of the company is that's doing the game, but I do know that id isn't.
_____

Wolf 3D

[WildBeast]

And they said nothing good came out of Hitler :)

A really old classic

[Fervent]

I had to check the date on this story, just to make sure Slash wasn't fucking up. Weren't these screenshots out a *while* ago (like 3-4 months). I certainly remember seeing that flamethrower.

Re:CmdrTaco loves a Windows game?

[AFCArchvile]

But he LIKES Windows. Isn't that a mortal sin for all Linux users?

Revival of old games

[smoondog]

I remember in the mid-late 80's there was a revival of old games with upped graphics. Super Mario Bros, Pacman land (or world or something) and other games. I would love to see a new revival of modern fps games and the end of the side shooter era....

-Moondog

Re:This simply glorifies Naziism and Violence.

[WildBeast]

But I didn't think that killing Nazis was bad, didn't we kill a few of them in WWII ?

Games developers need to grow up and develop a sence of social responsibility. These games are turning normally reasonable folk into deranged psycho killers. Have we learned NOTHING from Columbing and Waco ?
I really don't see the connection. But hey if you really think that violent games are turning us into killers and knowing the fact that most of us slashdotters play those games, how come you're not afraid of posting here?

Mein Leben

[aprentic]

My favorit part was always the fscked up German that the guards would babble out as they shot at you or died.

Re:Mein Leben

[aprentic]

It is German for "My life!" but it's not something you would ever say. Someone who's just been shot doesn't say "My life." Neither in German nor in English. Besides the pronunciation doesn't exactly make them sound like native German speakers.

Re:Stupid American Title

[Carlos Laviola]

Are you on crack? Achtung Wolfenstein means Attention wolf stone. Is there anything violent about that, mister AC?

You're tired of Slashdot ads? Get junkbuster now!

Nice try....

[Symbiosis]

but your Zero Wing refrences seem a bit forced. I've no problem with you trying to spice up your post a bit, but next time let's try and incorporate it a little better and make flow a bit more nicely, k? ;-)>

Thanx :-)>

The Sims on Linux

[SimHacker]

I ported The Sims to Linux months ago, at the beginning of last summer, but Loki took ages to answer my email, and just didn't seem to be interested... Go figure. Anybody know what's up with them these days?

Maxis was interested though, because the next vewrsion of The Sims Online will run on a Linux server. So now I'm working on optimizing it to run the multi player server side of the game on Linux without any graphics.

If Loki had ever gotten their act together, then The Sims for Linux could have been published a while ago. I busted my ass and did a lot of work on my own time to try to make it happen, but Maxis isn't interested in publishing games on Linux, and I can't publish it all by myself. Are there any companies out there besides Loki who are interested in porting The Sims Online client to Linux? Does anyone want to start a new Linux game company?

I've already done most of the hard work (it takes 2 hours to compile), and it'll be a slam dunk top seller. I hope to publish it soon after the Windows version is released, but I've totally given up on Loki.

Back in 1992, I ported SimCity Classic to Unix, and added multi player capability, multiple views, chat, shared whiteboard, pie menus, and a bunch of other features. A year or so ago, I ported it to Linux and optimized it so it runs at least 17 years a second on my 500 mhz laptop, or more than a million years in less than a day. SimCity Classic runs so fast, it's a twitch game! And only on Linux. I hope to publish that as soon as I can hammer out a new contract with Maxis.

-Don

Re:The Sims on Linux

[Anonymous Coward]

Nope, this guy posts here whenever Sims or NeWS comes up...

Re:The Sims on Linux

[SimHacker]

Or pie menus, but that's not very often. ;-)

-Don

Re:This simply glorifies Naziism and Violence.

[Yngwar]

Nah, they haven't figured out that Vietnam was really caused by John Wayne movies and that WWII was really caused by TS Eliot's The Wasteland; why would people suddenly be able to string together logical thoughts any faster now, and link Waco and Columbine to the extraordinarily obvious causal source video games?

After all, it's obvious that being a heroic Britsh marine sneaking into a Nazi base to defeat the forces of evil promotes Nazism. Sometimes, I just don't get the stupidity of the American people.

Next thing you know, people won't be able to figure out the Wayne Newton -> George Bush -> Barbara Streisand -> mind control with microwave beams connection. Just remember to wear your tin foil hat!

Oh yeah, for readers other the poster, you'll gain a great deal of understanding of trolls if you read books on the symptoms of paranoid schizophrenia. Maybe these connections will make sense to you too then.

Re:This simply glorifies Naziism and Violence.

[Symbiosis]

Hmm... Columbing doesn't seem to ring a bell... I'll do a search online and get back to you on that one ;-)

Now, Waco, I remember that one... just one thing... this faulty memory of mine... I don't remember anyone placing the blame for Waco on the video game industry of that time... rather than Wolfenstein, I'd say part of the violence at Waco was learned through, oh, I dunno, military/SWAT/etc. training... just a guess.... ;-)

/me sits back and waits for cynicism levels to subside...

Ok, sorry about that, just had to get that out of my system... :-)

Re:CmdrTaco loves a Windows game?

[Symbiosis]

I missed that memo... where does it say that using windows and/or playing a game on windows == liking windows? Maybe it's in that Trolling for Dummies book... it was all checked out of the library, so I haven't got a chance to read it, sorry ;-)

yay

[phoebe]

Another feeble excuse to plug my site - a Win32 conversion of the old Wolfenstein 3D code:

http://www.phoebe.co.uk/glwolf/

:)

Violence turns people into assholes, not killers.

[SimHacker]

Violent games do worse things than turn people into killers. If only they really did turn people into killers, more kids would murder their families and friends, and maybe it would clean up the gene pool a bit. But even worse, violent games turn people into ASSHOLES, who we now have to put up with, day in and day out, because murdering them is illegal! For this legacy, we have Doom and Quake to thank.

-Don

Why so dark?

[ruck]

In my opinion, first person shooters have been going downhill since the original Wolfenstein, mainly due to the lighting in the games. I'm obviously in the minority, but will someone please explain to me why gameplayers enjoy running around in the dark so much? Ever since doom, the trend has been towards using lack of light as a complicating factor.

These games are obviously meant to simulate reality, and although cool lighting effects help in this respect, I always find myself thinking, "This isn't realistic. If this was real life, I'd be able to see the damn door on the opposite wall." I personally wouldn't mind it at all if someone released a new fps with the bright no-lighting-effects (and admittedly somewhat cartoonish) feel of the original Wolfenstein.

Re:Why so dark?

[demon]

I suppose because it's a whole lot more eerie when the environment is dark - and it gives you an excuse for pulling the shades and turning out the lights... :)
_____

Re:Why so dark?

[caffeinated_bunsen]

First, game designers seem to think that dark environments create an eerie, menacing atmosphere, thereby saving them the trouble of creating that atmosphere through good writing. Second, less light means shorter visual range, which means less load on the video system. With a lot of large, open areas, making them fade into blackness allows you to get more frames per second, or do more cool stuff in the area you can see.

The same thing seems to happen a lot with mist and fog. Not every piece of the outdoors is perpetually immersed in fog, though you might think so if you play too many FPS's. I haven't quite figured out the reasoning behind that, though.

Not made by id

[cacktrot]

>> ACTIVISION LICENSES CLASSIC ID SHOOTER, WOLFENSTEIN 3-D® Gray Matter Interactive Studios Set to Develop New Wolfenstein Game Using QUAKE III Arena(TM) Engine Activision Acquires 40% Equity in Newly Formed Gray Matter Interactive Studios

NOLF - Doom 3 - Sims???

[Bpr]

If you think there haven't been good story lines in FPS then you missed NOLF. If you think you think the technology is stagnet, look @ the Doom3 engine footage - it will get better. As for the Sims, since when does it take you 10 minutes to pee?

Actually I saw....

[aztektum]

Screenshots of W3D last summer on IGN. I can't find a preview or the article there now, but they looked just as good then. Scooped!


aztek: the ultimate man

Re:This simply glorifies Naziism and Violence.

[demon]

Yet again id software show that they have no concern for the moral welfare of children. But this time they have sunk to previously uncharted depths. The subject matter is too serious to feature in a 'game' (if you can call graphic portrayal of extreme violence a game).

What makes you say this? "[M]oral welfare of children"? How is that their responsibility? They make games, and those games are not for kids. What do you want, for Carmack to go around to your local computer software store, and stand in front of all of id's titles on the shelves, checking the age of everyone who looks at 'em? C'mon, give me a break. One word - parents. But then, that'd be too big an imposition on them - they can't actually be expected to RAISE the snot-nosed brats they bring into this world?

(Note, I don't think all kids are snot-nosed brats, but they're getting more and more common.)

It's time slashdotters voted with their wallets. There are plenty of games out there which do not encourage Naziism or Violent behaviour, and which are equally entertaining. Games like The Sims, Myst, Riven, etc I could go on.

How does this game, or the original Wolf3D, encourage Naziism? You're KILLING the Nazis. :P And Myst and Riven - all I have to say is yawn.

Games developers need to grow up and develop a sence of social responsibility. These games are turning normally reasonable folk into deranged psycho killers. Have we learned NOTHING from Columbing and Waco ?

Umm. You watch too much TV, methinks. It's been proved that there is no substantial connection between youth violence and video games - in fact, how about RESEARCHING it. You'll find that since the gaming industry has gotten big, school shooting incidents have gotten LESS common. The media just gives them more coverage.

And how does it have anything to do with Waco? That was a cult, plain and simple. Don't go dragging in completely unrelated issues!
_____

Re:This simply glorifies Naziism and Violence.

[grahams]

It's not an id software game.

Re:no kidding!

[Frizzle Fry]

Sims is fine until you discover that 99.9% of your time is spent cooking, doing the dishes, showering, going to the bathroom, cleaning up the kitchen, driving to work, etc.

Or maybe that's the point. It would have much "sim" aspect if it wasn't like most people's lives.

Care about freedom?

First Screens?

[Kenzo]

Strange I saw these screens last year at E3 in LA. Is this really news?

Here's why spend the money and effort....

[Lottaguns]

As with movie sequels to big hits, there is a "guaranteed return on a sequel" formula at work here. Basically it is counted upon that with name recognition you will make X amount of money no matter what sort of turd you squeeze onto the market. If it's not a turd, so much the better, and so much more money.

Re:Violence turns people into assholes, not killer

[OpenGL]

This is true.

What about System Shock 2

[AudioCraZ]

Ok, I do believe there is a rut, but there have been a few games that make an attept to pull out of those ruts. Half-Life started to work out of the rut, but they dove head first into it when all they cared about was the mods. Now they are working on TF2 (multiplayer only!) which is going to be yet another Counter Strike clone. How original! My personal favorite was System Shock 2. Granted it had a few bugs, but I think it blew away any game when it hit. It is one of the only games that I still play, and have to play with the lights out. I think the gaming rut as a whole is the "multiplayer only" fase the gaming industry is going through. They are doing less production on games, and selling them for more (Diablo 2 anybody?). Hopefully we will se some more quality coming out soon.

The Sims

[noz]

Wow, does that mean Taco uses Windows?? :)

The forgotten sequel

[Bungie]

It also seems to be forgotten that there already was a sequel to Wolfenstein 3D, titled "Spear of Destiny".

Those are too far fetched?

[Rix]

What about the zombies with chainguns implanted in their abdomens from the original?

Or was that the expansion/sequel?
Cheers,

Rick Kirkland

All your base

[The Original Bobski]

Somebody set us up the website

Anyone using GOOBERS ?

[nspitze]

So the windows shortcut to wolf3d should be... wolf3d -goobers ?

How about an updated Beyond Castle Wolfenstein?

[GregGardner]

Forget Wolfenstein 3D, I want to see an updated (FPS? Third person perspective ala Tomb raider?) version of Beyond Castle Wolfenstein. That game ruled. Running around with the alarm going off and soldiers yelling at you in German, dragging dead bodies across the room to help map the levels. That's the kind of fun, exciting stuff I want to see in modern games.

Re:This simply glorifies OSI and Hacking.

[dr.g]

As long, as people are, trolled, I would like this opportunity to assume to answer to a AutoComplaint. But, you, this say waiting period are obviously faux a AutoComplaint. Thus, leave you see to us I react to a copied autocomplaint, which is communicated to a response to one sarcastic response to one troll. Don't I receive some somehow minus the points? What, if I let it run by something permutations Babelfish?

Nail without heading

Re:Castle Smurfenstein!! Wow Dr. Andrew Johnson!

[Anonymous Coward]

I rememeber in Michigan in 1983 when Andrew and his pals made Castle Smurfenstien. I hung around with one of them a bunch ("HP" as in the nick "HPLovecraft"). "HP" wnated to be a psychologist or psychiatrist on day, and I knew Andy wanted to be "a programmer". Who would ever guess that most all of us became professional programmers, but above all else, that Andy would get a PHD in a field related to computer graphics!!! I loooooved smurfenstein. I loved it so much I made a derivitive named after myself and I owned "the voice" from muse so I rerecorded the sound too. But the real fun was in the magic of Castle Smurfenstein and the detroit area hackers that first thought of that hack or changing the sprites (hard) and the startup screen (easy), and the digital sound (semi easy). What a joy. I also remember fondly when Carmack used to beg people on the San Fransisco Dr Dobbs BBS for helkp learning how to program graphics on his NeXT, in 1991 1992 and I dismissed it as him being a newbie and that pleading to find other programmers to work on startup projects was a waste. Eventually he kept asking who owned the Copyright to the title "Castle Wolfenstein". I thought he was so green I dismissed him as not having a chance in hell selling that commercially. He didn't, he gave it away free until compuserve pulled it off its networks due to nazi symbols. Eventually they just blocked it in germany. The rest is history... he created DOOM, QUAKE, an empire!

All due to people enjoying Smurfenstein, Caste Wolfenstein, and Beyond Castle Wolfenstein so much on the Apple II. Who would have though the original Apple II hardware of 1978 could play digital audio? Color hi-rez animation? Copy and format a floppy in 18.33 seconds? People really worked hard in those days.

I love Bungie products and love Unreal Tourament more than the cartoony engines in Quake, but I disagree with people saying a remake of wolfenstein would not make money. IT WILL MAKE A KILLING! True there are games like Hidden & Dangerous and other Special Ops games nowadays, but shooting guard dogs, bribing guards, shooting guards, and finding switches is just fine for mass market appeal.

Wolfenstein in Germany

[DarkDust]

As a german I find Wolfenstein very amusing, especially 'cause I'm politically more on the left-wing, but I wonder how long it will take here in Germany until this game is forbidden :-)=) It is illegal in Germany to possess a copy of Wolfenstein3D, because of all the Nazis in it and because you kill people :-) And BTW: I've seen the screenshots on 3dactionplanet, and I have to say that the first do impress me much more than the rest because their really realistic

Not Vaporware thankfully

[Apreche]

I heard about this game in Video Game mags and from some sites quite a while back. Then a few weeks ago I realized there was no news of the game since, and it had been months. I'm glad it didn't turn out to be vaporware. I need to kill more nazi scum.

Re:The Wolf3D sequel has been out for many years..

[pergamon]

Read the article I linked to. It started out as "Wolfenstein 3D: Part II" though yes, it didn't end up as exactly a sequel...

My Perfect Game

[N8F8]

I'm pretty much a 3D junkie. Each year I buy the latest video card and the lated First Person Games. I install the video card, reinstall the drivers a bazillion times along with game patches hoping to get the thing to run. Every time I am disappointed. The moment of disappointment comes when I sense the futility of walking down 3D hallways mindlessly shooting seemingly endless supplies of uglies and bad guys. Pointless. A taste of what I really want and a feast of mindless violence.

What do I want? I want a sense of wonder and exploration. Danger, surely. But not mindless killing. I want a challenge. A challenge to think and learn. Myst was a start, but instead of treading down that path, all the game developers are marching lockstep down a dead-end path of designing stupid games. Until they figure out their mistake I am resigned. Resigned to the only game that comes close. Its called life. Not always as pretty or mysterious as a CGI Generated-3D world, but , at the end of the day it's the only other game available.

You'll want to Check out 'Serious Sam' (no body)

[Szplug]

Mixed acronyms

[geekplus]

Anyone else ever notice that the acronym for First Person Shooter is the same acronym for frames/second?

Things that make you go "Hmmmmm"....

I wonder...

[Calamere]

if the same codes will apply? Like holding down the keys "MIL" will still get you stuff. It's suprising I still remember that and the code to walk through walls in Doom. Ah. The good ol days. Can you remember the codes for Doom without looking in a book?

Re:I wonder...

[omega9]

IDSPISPOPD

Re:I wonder...

[Calamere]

Atta boy. I think I'll probably remember that for a long long time. It's ingrained into my head. Man, it was fun popping out of walls with the misile launcher and taking shots at guys... ah the good ol days........

Re:This simply glorifies Naziism and Violence.

[3-Demon]

Typical left wing anti-establishment hysteria. "Hating Microsoft since 1987". Nice sign off. Nothing personal of course, it's witty. I digress. Doing research on linking violence in the media to real life violence is tough since all the numbers have been designed to support a particular philosophical ideology. I believe that violence glorified in the media does affect or perspective on death and dismemberment. I don't need numbers to tell me that my addiction to Counter-Strike has desensitized me to the idea of unloading a full MP5 clip into someone's head. Go ahead, join a server and watch the plethora of anti-social behavior exhibited by what seems to be a bunch of children playing on-line. What's scary is that some of them are 20 something's and older. Violent on-line games a riddled with immature people who will slash you with a knife just because they know they can slash a teammate without consequence because the server admin disabled team killing. At the same time I don't believe that it is powerful enough for the average human being to overcome if that person is surrounded by moral support. The problem with violence can be linked to many things, not just media. I believe that the break-up of the modern family is partly to blame for anti-social behavior. What with single parenthood becoming more popular these days, and children being raised by television, it's no wonder things in the media seem to lack depth and social responsibility. I think the argument that parents should be responsible is valid, but I would not stop there. It is idealistic at best. Parents should be responsible for raising their kids and teaching them the difference between right and wrong, BUT, this is not happening in some cases. As a society we do have to assume some responsibility. This cannot be legislated though, this has to be something that each individual does to improve the overall product. Positive reinforcement of ideas by people in positions of power would help. A lot of game companies, and I work for one, are run by kids. I don't mean kids in the sense that they are under 18, but rather that they haven't matured much since. I hope to change that in the course of my career. Although it's going to be hard to compete with these laid back kids. Let's face it, the product sells because people like it. Eminem sells records because people like his unrestricted yells for hate and ignorance. Some even call him a genius. A genius for what, his contribution to music? He hasn't done anything new, and neither has the majority of the music industry for over 30 years. Why do does the street thug mentality sell so well? When you look back at the last 10 years of the 21st century, is it the music you'll remember the most. In fact the more people object to socially irresponsible behavior in the media, the more it sells. Proud to be a nerd. Using Microsoft products since I can remember, and not being dissatisfied because they make huge gobs of money. "It also annoys lots of insecure ordinary people, who don't like the idea of anybody making as much money as Gates because it makes them feel like such losers by comparison. But what really twists the knife in the wound for all these Gates-haters is that Microsoft has made all that money fair and square -- by selling what buyers want." - Lisa Ronthal www.worldnetdaily.com

Re:This simply glorifies Naziism and Violence.

[3-Demon]

Typical left wing anti-establishment hysteria. "Hating Microsoft since 1987". Nice sign off. Nothing personal of course, it's witty. I digress.

Doing research on linking violence in the media to real life violence is tough since all the numbers have been designed to support a particular philosophical ideology.

I believe that violence glorified in the media does affect or perspective on death and dismemberment. I don't need numbers to tell me that my addiction to Counter-Strike has desensitized me to the idea of unloading a full MP5 clip into someone's head. Go ahead, join a server and watch the plethora of anti-social behavior exhibited by what seems to be a bunch of children playing on-line. What's scary is that some of them are 20 something's and older. Violent on-line games a riddled with immature people who will slash you with a knife just because they know they can slash a teammate without consequence because the server admin disabled team killing. At the same time I don't believe that it is powerful enough for the average human being to overcome if that person is surrounded by moral support. The problem with violence can be linked to many things, not just media. I believe that the break-up of the modern family is partly to blame for anti-social behavior. What with single parenthood becoming more popular these days, and children being raised by television, it's no wonder things in the media seem to lack depth and social responsibility.

I think the argument that parents should be responsible is valid, but I would not stop there. It is idealistic at best. Parents should be responsible for raising their kids and teaching them the difference between right and wrong, BUT, this is not happening in some cases. As a society we do have to assume some responsibility. This cannot be legislated though, this has to be something that each individual does to improve the overall product. Positive reinforcement of ideas by people in positions of power would help. A lot of game companies, and I work for one, are run by kids. I don't mean kids in the sense that they are under 18, but rather that they haven't matured much since.

I hope to change that in the course of my career. Although it's going to be hard to compete with these laid back kids. Let's face it, the product sells because people like it. Eminem sells records because people like his unrestricted yells for hate and ignorance. Some even call him a genius. A genius for what, his contribution to music? He hasn't done anything new, and neither has the majority of the music industry for over 30 years. Why do does the street thug mentality sell so well? When you look back at the last 10 years of the 21st century, is it the music you'll remember the most. In fact the more people object to socially irresponsible behavior in the media, the more it sells.

Proud to be a nerd. Using Microsoft products since I can remember, and not being dissatisfied because they make huge gobs of money.

"It also annoys lots of insecure ordinary people, who don't like the idea of anybody making as much money as Gates because it makes them feel like such losers by comparison. But what really twists the knife in the wound for all these Gates-haters is that Microsoft has made all that money fair and square -- by selling what buyers want." - Lisa Ronthal http://www.worldnetdaily.com

Re:This simply glorifies Naziism and Violence.

[3-Demon]

I screwed that post up, not only did I post it in the wrong section, but I posted it in HTML format and there are no break tags to seperate the paragraphs. I've reposted it in the proper section.