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Rumors of the Upcoming iPaq
Simon writes "Check out these new
iPaqs" Apparently some information leaked about the next generation: 64 megs of memory on board, expansion slots (and word of a wireless card too). I'm still hearing good word about Compaq continuing the fine Linux work they've been doing on these devices,
(stretching back to the now-legendary Itsy, first mentioned on Slashdot way back in May of 98.) Having now used one for a few
weeks I have to say its a solid little handheld (I don't like the WinCE GUI as much as the PalmOS GUI, but I like the apps better).
It is damn near impossible to get the 3650 currently. I've had mine on backorder for a month. Now vendors are hiking up the original price because of the demand...I saw them going for upward of $900 on streetprices.com.
-- Who is the bigger fool? The fool or the fool who follows him? --
The thing I really hope for is that the release will lower teh price of the current Ipaq, so I'll be able to buy that one.
Sig (appended to the end of comments I post, 54 chars)
I remember when the I-Opener, Websurfer, and others were the next big thing. What happened? Why is the iPaq the popular model suddenly? Is it purely the "Hack-a-bility" factor? If that's the case goto Linux-Hacker.net where they shows hacks and kits...
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Random, useless fact: I type in startx entirely with my left hand.
Directly comparing memory and storage available between CE and PALM OS based devices is very misleading. CE has a larger memory footprint and the files created in the Pocket Office applications consume a relatively large amount of storage.
Also, I find the vertical CE interface to be very difficult to get accustomed to. The only hands-down benefit of CE is that you do not need to learn Graffiti!
Lenny
ByteMyCode.com: A Web 2.0 code sharing community.
As a researcher working closely with the Compaq people I know there is even more to come. We are working on stuff that will be superior to the longrun technology of TransMeta and the SpeedStep technology of Intel. download research paper.
The iPAQ people are very Linux friendly, check out the website backed by several Compaq people. With a wireless link on the iPAQ such as GPRS (European GSM packet solution) it is possible to browse the Internet with your favorite browser.
With XScribble you can use it just like your PalmPilot. To only difference is the increased weight, better display and powerfull processor.
Johan (j@mp3.nl)
There were tons of the current Ipaqs running Linux
at Linux Expo, unfortunately there did not really
seem to be much in the way of real apps running on
them. What is the state of the Linux environment
for these things, is it fragmented by the distributions available or is there some common ground that people can start writing to?
I'll buy one of these things as soon as I can boot
Linux on it and run at least the same basic apps
that I can on my palm, ie. a datebook, addressbook
memos, etc.
The difference between Canada and the USA is that in Canada healthcare is a right and gun ownership is a privilege.
I really have to wonder why. Who are they targeting with these? I would buy one if it was priced at lt. $100 but otherwise I just don't get it. Not when I can buy a fast (low end) desktop for ~$500. Sure it's not mobile, but they need to look at the big picture when they price these things. I just can't see spending three or four hundred dollars to have a little tiny screen with limited functionality. I mean basically it's a mobile phone number and address book. At least that's what the majority of people who I know that carry them (actually palms but it's the same difference) use it for.
Now don't get me wrong, these are cool and I think they are great. In fact I would love to have one, but realistically I can't justify the money.
Yeah that must be it. Oh yeah your mom said hi.
hmm. iPaq. iMac. which is better for the everyday consumer? which is better for the everyday business user?
I have had the Ipaq for about a week and love it.
The PocketPC GUI isn't really that bad. Even tho it is fun to telnet to my Agenda linux based PDA in linux, I find the PocketPC apps a little more easy to use.
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Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
I love the smell of Karma in the morning
I've been trying to get an iPaq for a month now, and can't find them for less than $600 on eBay. How dare they talk about a new model when they can't even fill the orders on the current model? Apparently it's because of a shortage of the color screens (hence their release of a greyscale version), and they say they won't be caught up for another 4 months or so. How will this new model's production affect that?
-Mike
--- witty signature
here on gamedev.net. It is an interesting overview of the special characteristics and constraints of developing games for the PocketPC, making the case that PocketPCs are one of the best handheld game platforms currently extant.
Personally I think licensing debates are just about the most boring possible topics of discussion. Still, I think that in some cases they're warranted. In the article (on the last page), the author says something to the effect of the quake and doom engines are available for free under the GPL, so you can use them in your games. True, but he doesn't mention the source-release clause(s) of said license, which I doubt many game developers will want to abide by. OTOH, the author does provide a link to id's technology licensing page (interesting reading in of its own right), where it states that for $10,000 you can use a non-GPL (i.e. normal, closed-source) license. I'm not exactly sure from reading their page if you could use the engine unmodified along with your own non-engine code and content (maps, characters, et al.) and be abiding by the GPL while releasing a closed-source, commercial game (maybe if you said it uses the engine and where to get the source?). Maybe they mean the LGPL? Either way, $10,000 is a pittance compared to some other costs a (commercial) game developer faces.
--
"Overrated" is "overfuckingused".
News for Geeks in Austin, TX
BTW, that's a honkin big advertisement in the article, I think it covers as much acreage as the relevent text. Very nice touch, CNET.
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A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
Like you have so much money to waste, you insist on always buying the latest gadget of the day, why not spend that hard earned money for something more usefull (beer for instance).
Je t'aime Stéphanie
I have a Compaq Aero 2130 I upgraded to PocketPC. If I want contacts, I push the 'contacts' button and my contacts pop up.
It's the little button on the bottom that looks like a rolodex.
If you have trouble finding it, go ask your mother.
Granted, It would have to be a stripped down or older copy, but somehow I wonder if Win 3.11 would be better than WinCE. If nothing else, it would tweak appropriate noses in Redmond
And of course, the possibility of an X-windows setup on a palm is entertaining as well. (and probably well in hand)
"It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"
--Cycon
Your Brain + EEG + LEGO Robots = Brainstorms
1st Law Of Networking: Loose ends are bad, termination is good.
WWJD? JWRTFM!!!
As much as I don't like about MS, I've been quite happy with WinCE. If all you want is a planner/organizer a palm will do the job, but if you want multimedia capability the CE devices blow the Palms away hands down. Just to scratch the surface, CE/Pocket PC devices can play MP3 files, video, wav, doom, record audio, emulate a gameboy, etc. If you don't want those features, don't use 'em, but they're available. If you want to do any of those things with a Palm device, you're gonna have to shell out extra cash for an add on module, or you might just be completely out of luck. The Compaq devices all store the OS in Flash-ROM, so you can upgrade/change OS/whatev. I'm sure that you could even run the PalmOS on it if you wanted (I know for a fact that there are emulators for the PalmOS that run within CE but haven't heard about anyone re-flashing an I-paq with the PalmOS)... My only real complaint about CE is that it slows/locks at random times... I'm using an older version (2.11 on an HP Jornada 430se), and from what I've heard 3.0 is quite a bit better. Regardless, it doesn't matter much, as what you're really paying for is the hardware. Now, I'm not really a fan of Compaq for PCs, but their pocket-pc devices are by far the best out there. The vast majority of the complaints I've heard about 'em is that the paint rubs off (which is a valid complaint, but rather petty in the scheme of things). If you absolutley loathe MS, just re-flash the ROM with Pocket Linux...
You know what I would LOVE to see incorporated in every PDA? An automatic phone dialer. I assume that it would be simple to put into a PDA, and would take up very little space.
I (and most people, obviously), don't want my PDA to be a cell phone--it's wayyy too large for that. I would love, however, to click on a phone number, and then have the PDA dial it for me.
Concentrate on simple functionality first!
"Chill, Orrin!"---Trent Lott
I bought a higher end Compaq Win CE device and it sucked... Slow and promised nothing important and costs close to 600 dollars. If you wanted a cool mp3 and contact book, forget it.. When I played one mp3 the thing came to a crawl. Space disappears so quickly, before I knew it, I was trying to dig up another 4 megs more for system memory.. Then I wanted to get it on the network without having to use the cradle and it's lame software.. but then you have to buy a Network card for it, which is another 100+ dollars. I guess I was expecting too much from it, but for that price I didnt think I was expecting the world... My answer? Buy a cheap celeron/amd notebook for 700-800 and you'll be much happier... but if you want one expensive date and calendar Win CE unit, this might be for you...
Check out Qt/Embedded at Trolltech's home page.
:)
It's a version of Qt built to use the Linux framebuffer.
Anything that compiles on the normal Qt X11 will compile on this. Awhile back, someone even ported Konqueror to it. Qt is very much a standard in the Linux world, and this extreme portability to an embedded platform is amazing. Trolltech also has a window manager / environment program to launch and manage applications with. Looks a bit like WinCE, at least the coloring.
I don't know of any handhelds currently that are using this (or that might use it), but it seems like a very good choice for a standardized X-less handheld.
-Justin
check out the windows XP on handhelds
2 07
this is what would run on them out of the box and they would most likely use an Xscale CPU because of the mips
check out
http://www.infosync.no/en/news/visnyhet.asp?Link=
for more Stinger shots aka XP on low powered wince devices
regards
john jones
p.s. configure that wince kernel or lose all data protection (-;
Ok, right, simple functionality is there. Now lets add more good stuff. The IPAQ can be used as a phone, by using a service like dialpad, along with a Ricochet 128k dedicated wireless modem. Sure, most Palm (and clone) owners are quick to slam any PDA that has more functionality than their Palm Pilot... but I know many people who would love to be able to surf the REAL web (no wap crap) and talk on the phone with one hand held device.
The IPAQ has that functionality, and the upcoming version of the IPAQ will do it even better. If all you want is simple functionality, then get yourself a piece of notebook paper and a pencil. Both together are small and lighter than any PDA. They can both be used to obtain simple useful functionality.
I guess that would give us something like Windows CEMENT - Hard as a rock, dumb as a brick.
Well, the Newton used to generate touchtone sounds when you double-tapped a phone number, if that's what you're thinking of.
www.lucernesys.comHorizon: Calendar-based personal finance
You can write in a smallish input area, around the same size as the graffiti area... in that area you can use graffiti or something similiar but slightly different.
Or you use transcriber which lets you write anywhere you want on the screen. You can adjust the angle you write at with it. With transcriber you can write a single word per line, multiple words per line or entire phrases spread out across multiple lines. You can write in print or in cursive with it. With a little tuning it can recogonize even some of the worst handwriting you can throw at it.
The fact is WinCE 2.0 was atrocious. WinCE 3.0 is actually pretty decent... and transcriber is by far the best handwriting package ever put into a small portable device. As long as Palm continues to win the war, WinCE will grow by leaps and bounds to try and catch up.
--- I do not moderate.
The current iPAQs have a PCMCIA sleeve as an option, and it works well with the Lucent or Cisco 802.11 cards.
Was the Contacts button on the WinCE device broken? The iPaq and the Jornada both have one, I'm not sure about the Casio.
Motten Ar Din!!
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For a stable IMAP e-mail client for X check out http://althea.sourceforge.net
I think C|Net's looking for a few bucks to be dropped into their virtual tip jar (ala Amazon). ;-D
If you celebrate Xmas, befriend me (538
That is so 5 minutes ago
http://www.geocities.com/rcwoolley/
People are already hacking the existing iPaq by adding another DRAM and flash chip, effectively doubling their RAM and flash storage. They had all 64MB RAM working fine under Linux, but WinCE would not recognize anything past 32MB. Check it out http://www.handhelds.org/z/wiki/UpgradingDRAM
I really dont get the hype over the Ipaq. I had one for around 2 months. After problems with dust getting behind the screen I sent it back for repair 2 weeks after the ipaq was returned the screen flipped out on me and I had to send it back again. The second time it was returned to me I ebay'ed it. Bought a casio 125, 64 compact flash, a serial keyboard and still had enough cash left for dinner. So far I have had no problems with the Casio no dust, 16bit color vs 12bit, 8 way direction pad vs 4 way, multiple button press vs single button press, etc.... Plus the casio turned out to be highly overclockable so now it runs at 200mhz too. Everyone told me that it was unusable outdoors, thats simply not true..sure you may need to adjust the contrast but its plenty readable. Maybe im missing something but I just dont see whats so great about the Ipaq anymore. Granted it looked cool, but i dont see asthetics outweighing functionality.
I wouldn't mind having some of those extra features, but even if I don't use them the fact they are there does cost me something - battery life. I can use my Palm V for up to a month before I need to recharge it.
Also, what's the form factor? I had an old Palm Pro (similar to a Palm III in form factor) and I didn't really use it much because I didn't have it with me all the time. I can keep a steel-case enclosed Palm V in the pocket of my jeans or slacks comfortably and so I actually use it all the time now, and not just for the organizer features.
If you want a toy these things are fine, but if you want something useful I still haven't seen anything that equals a Palm (though they're getting a lot closer!).
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
The "Fat and Ugly Sleeves" are actually a minor benefit. The PCCard sleeve has an additional battery, allowing the iPAQ to last longer.
A lot of people want that extra functionality. If you offer up a device and tell me that it's a contact database or time scheduler I'd laugh and point out the $30 Casio's that you can buy that achieve the same purpose and have for many years. If I am going to carry this thing it'd better be pretty full featured: Possibly an MP3 player, DEFINITELY capable of holding good maps (see PocketStreets and such. I can get a section of map in MapPoint and download it to a CE PDA), and preferably robust enough that it can be expanded to allow for versatile other functionality.
The Palm's-are-fast argument usually revolves around a Palm doing very little versus a CE device doing a lot. i.e a tiny grayscale screen versus a larger full-color display (obviously the latter represents enormously more data that has to be moved around). Simply comparing could be apples to oranges. Like the old saying about which is faster : A sports car or a dump truck. Then measure with 50 tonnes on each.
yafla!
After several intense multi-million dollar months of market research they chose the name "iPaq". The revolutionary use of the letter "i" before the word "Paq" (spelled with a delicious Q instead of CK) gives this device the necessary punch to compete in today's wired world. Kudos! discarded names were as follows: iPalm Pilet iDe-Vice iThing
Psion handhelds also generate DTMF tones when you hit a key combo. It works really well, but I find that I tend to forget people's phone numbers if I use it too much, so I use it sparingly.
I must say though, I own the iPaq - and it's a great product. But this new iPaq seems to only differ in the base size of RAM. mine has 32 megs, the new one is 64 megs. Every other feature listed, wireless, expansions etc... all are already available for the original iPaq pocket pc, including dual pc card expansion sleeves.
So basically they're upgrading the onboard RAM from 32 megs to 64. Remember that the OS is on a seperate flashable drive. that 32/64 number is the total free RAM when you get the device, although you'll use up a big chunk installing software - 10megs for quake. ;)
By the way, the ipaq is a nice size until you put a expansion sleeve on it - like the popular compact flash sleeve so you can have more storage space. Once you add the sleeve the iPaq won't fit nicely in your pocket, unless you've got cargo pants. So you'll need a bag for it - so you might as well be carrying a laptop, that'll have about the same battery life. ;)
Joseph Elwell.
Why is this offtopic? I'd think that the fact that Macromedia Flash runs on the PocketPC would be clearly on-topic for a discussion of iPaq's...
Ummm, I think you may be overreacting there, there is probably no way it would be cost effective to deploy and support linux based pda's. I mean the difficulty in just making you ipaq into a linux one pretty much removes a lot of the idgits from doing it. But if compaq were to market a linux one they would be swamped with support calls if it even took off. I mean look how bad wince is doing because it has less apps, now the linux one will have even less apps that were desgined for it.
Oops....you'll know what I'm talkin about in a bit.
iPaq wins, of course, clearly with about everything except battery time. I'm not sure about exactly how long the iPaq batteries last (they don't mention it anywhere), but I think it's something like 3-4 hours of active use. In deep sleep mode the batteries last a few days (?), I think, except with Linux they last only about 8 hours because of problems with the sleep mode.
It that's true, it effectively makes iPaq at least very troublesome, or actually useless. No taking iPaq to work without the cradle, or to long lectures, or even to a local LUG or PUG meeting. No thanks, I need a real PDA, not a toy. Palms last for weeks (or at least days).
After that, the 32 MB DRAM, where your DOOM port and other cool stuff were installed, goes empty, right? Useful, eh?
The important stuff can, of course, be stored in the Flash ROM. But, you have to store the damn operating system there too! Thus, with 32+16MB memory, you end up with maybe a few MBs of permanent user memory.
Of course, if you fail the bootloader installation (for Linux), you have a nice new $500 paperweight (well, ok, I think Compaq will fix it, but I guess that takes weeks if not months?).
Besides, it's (1) immoral to buy Microsoft garbage, (2) insane to buy it when you don't even want it, and actually throw it away permanently in the first day (after using it to load Linux). Well, I guess it has to be done first by those who develop it, but it feels so damn bad...
The sensible, non-developer solution would thus be to get a Palm (or whatever) first, and play with that until Compaq sells iPaqs with preloaded Linux (or something like that). The difficult decision is: To be or not to be an active developer?
I'm quite annoyed at the current handheld situation. I want to buy a handheld computer, rather than a palm. But there's no way i'll buy a WinCE machine because wince is yuck, microsoft is evil, and I want a machine I can do some real development on.
Compaq - I know for a fact that QNX has been successfully run on your machine. I think I remember someone saying that BeIA could as well. So why can't we have options to buy units with these OSs on them? You're crazy. You've got a good unit that appeals almost exclusively to the geek market. Except that it runs wince, and geeks (I hope I can speak for people here) generally *hate* wince and everything associated with it.
If you were to get something - anything - else, you'll sell more units and encourage more of a developer community for the unit. Think about being able to just telnet into the thing from your workstation and type away. And having good *free* tools. Without awful windows API cludge ribbish (ugh). What's more, you (still speaking to Compaq, 'ere) already have an association with Be which you're using to develop machines for parts of the rest of your iPaq range.
If you were to release a BeIA or QNX option instead of wince, I'd go out and buy a unit tomorrow.
Believe with me, my saplings.
> I was in a meeting with Compaq sales reps
Here's the problem - these are sales reps. Sales reps are scum. They eat, sleep, live, and dream about Sales. Linux is free, hence it fails to register with them.
While the sales reps are laughing about these commie hippies and their "free" operating system, Compaq also employs several Ph.D's and other brilliant folk who work on just that - Linux on the iPAQ.
Maybe it won't be sold with Linux and a cute little penguin sticker on it, but there are plenty of people working very hard to make sure that it will be able to run Linux just fine.
You know what I would LOVE to see incorporated in every PDA? An automatic phone dialer.
Excellent idea!
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what do you think is the best handheld PDA ? I'm thinkin' bout' getting one at the end of this summer and i don't know which to get
We seldom regret saying too little but often regret saying too much.