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When Good Ebay'ers Go Bad
An anonymous submitter sent in: "This guy "Stewart Richardson" had over 6000 positive feedbacks on eBay, held a fake estate sale, and scammed around $250,000 out of people before disappearing. 'There seems to be little doubt among his would-be customers that Stewart Richardson pulled off one of the most remarkable con jobs in the almost seven-year history of eBay, and U.S. federal investigators agree.' Some other links: a messageboard and ebay itself. I was scammed on eBay for $3600 a while back. I was able to get my money back because I had a bank issued cashier's check. I had written "For Deposit Only" on the back, and that was crossed out by the recipient. The bank teller should have been suspicious, but was not, and cashed the check. The idiot who had it cashed wrote his bank account number on the back of the cashier's check, and also wrote his Dad's business bank account number on the back and stamped it with his Dad's signature. In the end, the bank reversed the payment, and took the money out of his Dad's account. When his Dad found out, the idiot was in some serious trouble, but I got my money back. There were a few other's scammed in the same transaction, and they recieved about half of the money back after the police started to put the pressure on these guys. The story is much more involved, so I won't go into the rest of it."
I always wondered why anyone would trust EBay auctioneers with large amounts of money. I mean, it gets to a point where a few negative feedbacks aren't going to make up for loss of any serious dough. Anyone else have scam stories?
If you fall off a building, go real limp, because maybe you'll look like a dummy and people will be like hey, free dummy
...since I am not an ebay costumer: is it possible to create fake identities and buy stuff from yourself in order to pump up your approval rating? Does ebay have any safeguards against this? I could see this type of fraud as very detrimental for online auctions in general...
Reminder: find a new sig
Rather humorous, this feedback entry. I'll obscure the email just to limit spamharvesting on it, but you can see it at the EBay link.
:)
-------@aol.com (25)
Jan-22-02 12:48:53 PST
1055398606
S
Praise : Complete Fraud! Took all our money and never received any product
So evidently AOLers WANT to be defrauded?
If it's worth spending $40 for shipping, it's worth spending a little more to ensure you're getting what you're _expecting_!
If the seller won't use an online escrow service (www.tradenable.com has worked well for me in the past) then DON'T BUY THE PRODUCT!
"Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus."
It's a classic scam. Build up a rep for being honest, upright, soforth. Once everyone trusts you, you can strike it big with little difficulty. It requires a lot of patience, but police and government officials in Third World (and some first and second world) countries have been known to use it. Instead of taking measly little bribes all the time, make yourself out to be "incorruptible" and wait for the big one.
The big question is: Did this guy plan it from the beginning? If he did, I applaud his patience and cunning, while also disapproving of the result of his actions. If he decided on the spur of the moment to do this, i.e. let temptation get the better of him, I have nothing but contempt for him.
---- El diablo esta en mis pantalones! Mire, mire!
when you pay someone $700 for some porcelain mice, you're pretty much getting ripped off whether or not you actually get the goods.
I bought one very high ticket item on EBay once (admittedly this was a while ago), an expensive Sony video camera. Before I mailed off my $1900 cashier's check, I got the other person's phone number and actually spoke to them. In this way, I felt I had at least some recourse in case something went wrong. Fortunately nothing did, and I have happily used my TRV 900 for years now.
The point is that the more information you have about your seller, the easier it will be to go after them in case something goes wrong. People can hide via email, but by phone it's much harder.
-- What is this Earth thing you call "slow"?
Ya, how about Operation Bullpen, the sports memoribilia bust that took on a whole ton of fake signature dealers on Ebay...
Loneliness is a power that we possess to give or take away forever
IIRC, someone attempted to sell their kidney on ebay, that had past the $1million mark when ebay stopped the auction...
Good quote, too many chars. Seriously, the slashdot 120 char limit sucks!
Oh wait, checking email... .. WHAT? I paid $1000 for a figurine and didn't get it? DAMN!
-- Dan
Escrow, Escrow, Escrow.
From eBay's escrow information page (the last link):
What is Escrow?
Escrow is when a buyer places money in the custody of a trusted third party. The money is then paid to the seller once a specified set of conditions, that both parties have agreed to, are met.
How does it work?
Very simply. The Buyer pays into escrow. The Seller ships the item to the Buyer. The Buyer approves the item. Funds are paid to the Seller. It's that easy.
Is the service only available for items that close over $500?
Based upon historical data, eBay recommends that buyers and sellers use escrow services for transactions greater than $500.
So, if you buy something over $500, and pay for it using escrow, the seller does not receive payment until you have determined that the item was shipped and works properly.
Use escrow for any serious purchases. Don't rely on eBay's fraud program -- it takes months to get them to do anything and they often want ridiculous amounts of documents "proving" that the item was faulty.
Informed consumers make these issues moot. Don't buy from a seller who won't use escrow, and add in the extra fees as a cost to doing business via eBay. If you don't use escrow, you assume the risk if the product isn't what you wanted (or doesn't arrive at all!)
Simpli - Your source for San Jose dedicated servers and colocation!
I used to leave positive feedback for strangers as a joke - "Cuba makes the best! thanks!!!" for a cigar seller, "you're right! your bowling pin trophy looks great on my headboard - thanks!" for a stylish furniture seller, "hang in there! FUNNY poster! poor kitten!" for a guy selling skulls and such, etc., etc.
Around that time, other people were too busy for such fun and nonsense, creating networks of accounts, all of which were leaving each other positive feedback. It was possible to have an account with a lengthy history of perfect feedback, even though a transaction had never been completed.
Many of these accounts were weeded out, some because they were used for fraud, others because people spotted ones with all the feedback happening in a couple days' time and asked questions.
But the requirement for an auction existing to match positive feedback left was only added about two years ago. I'm betting hundreds more bogus positive accounts exist and are sitting idle, waiting to be used...
It has happenned to me a couple of times - in all instances though, the "top place" buyer either had a zero feedback rating (ie, possibly never intended to buy the product to begin with), or was booted off eBay soon after the auction ended.
In all cases, the seller contacted me a week or two after the auction ended, and asked if I still wanted it for my bid price. Sometimes I declined, having bought the item through another auction, or locally. Other times I accepted, and got the item a couple of weeks later.
I personally have no problem with this - if the seller seems sincere and has a good track record, and the product warrants it (by either being some kind of "dutch" auction, or by being a unique item - not liable to be seen again for many years), I will go for it.
But, as this story illustrates, sometimes good sellers (or what appear to be good sellers) "go bad" (sounds like a bad Fox show - heh).
The one thing I always keep in mind (since I learned about it) is to use an escrow service for pricey items - it is the safest method...
Reason is the Path to God - Anon
#define USEPAYPAL 0x01
#define USEESCROW 0x02
#define GOINPERSON 0x04
int whattodo(long price);
int whattodo(long price) {
if (price <= 60) return USEPAYPAL;
else if (price <= 10000) return USEESCROW;
else if (price > 10000) return GOINPERSON;
}
/* Code is protected free speech! Don't think otherwise */
Linux: Because a PC is a terrible thing to waste.
James Brents
I beleive that eBay has bid bots that work in the same way that the sellers do in an effort to pump the bids up to the max bid without going over. I will tell you why?
Several months ago a friend got suspicious when he won an auction for a no-name retro video game. He was suspicious because someone had bid against him with an "updated or changes username" and always bid some strange amounts at varying time intervals. The stranger would come on, bid, and then wait for some period of time to up the bid a little more. Then in a last two days the stranger bid exactly one dollar below my friends max bid, triggering it and getting all the money out of my buddy.
Most people would say coincidence. I thought so too, so we made another experiment with another seller. Another video game and we put $100 as the max bid on the game. This game wasn't rare or collectible in the slightest. As the auction went on, a similar activity occured. This time in the last hours of the auction the bid got bumped in the same way. The user knew that the game wasn't worth more that 10-15 bucks and probably wouldn't want to overbid and lose all the money,so it's unlikely in my opinion that it was the seller.
The auction ended and a $15 product was sold for $96 with this strange business described earlier.
My question? Who knows what the max bid is? eBay.
Who gains when the max bid is retrieved as the selling price? The seller and eBay.
So it's in thier interest that any max bid be reached, by hook or by crook. I don't trust them, so I bid at the last minute and get things at the price I want to pay for them.
Spongebob
Here's some things you can do to make your ebay purchase a safer experience.
1. Involve the United States Post Office. Once you involve them, you have them on your side becaues they really hate mail fraud. You can contact your postmaster and he can usually start the investiation rolling. Remember, mail fraud is a federal offence.
2. Contact the seller. If the person is not willing to talk to you directly on the phone about a high ticket item you are buying, do you really want to do business with him?
3. Not to be redundant, but ESCROW ESCROW ESCROW. If you are spending over $50, isn't the extra $5 or $10 worth it?
4. Use a real credit card and not a debit card that withdraws from you bank account. Discover is probably one of the best I've used. Any problems I've had, they have immediately put a hold on the money, and credit my account with the money in question, until they can get it sorted out.
5. Use your head. If something seems to good to be true, then it is, especially on the internet.
I just don't understand why people are having this many problems with online purchases. If you follow these simple steps you will not come accross any problems that you can't get resolved. Are you guys really this trusting? Come on now, it's the internet, don't trust anyone. If you're getting ripped off like this, to be honest, you probably deserve it. Maybe you should rethink this internet purchasing thing, it might not be for you.
SIG - I love you guys, mod me to +5 then bash me back down to +2.
This is exactly why you should always use your credit card for payment. And I don't mean through PayPal or BillPoint. If the seller has that high a feedback, and a legitimate business, he should have his own merchant account to process the credit card payment. If you haven't received your goods within the 60 days after your statement arrives, simply dispute the charges, and you won't lose anything.
At the bottom of the article, his wife mentions that she found evidence that he had been gambling over the Internet, and may have gone into debt as a result.
What's funny is that when I closed the window to the story, there was one of those ubiquitous popup-adds for an on-line casino.
I find it amusing is that people shell out good money for those tacky little figurines. I find it not so amusing that some people may have lost upwards of $20,000.
You should use Winning Bid Pro to do the last minute bidding for you. I use it all the time. Just set up the bid you are willing to make and have it send it in 10 seconds before the auction ends. That way you don't drive the price up ahead of time. Sometimes someone has a max bid higher than yours, or is using a bidding program the same as you and you get beat. But, you put in the max amount you were willing to pay, right? You win some, you lose some. With Winning Bid Pro, you'll win more.
By the way, the program is free, I didn't write it, and get no money for praising it.
Fool me twice, shame on me.
Pay 700 bucks for four glass mice, kill me now and spare the gene pool.
You know what?
In my experience, the 0.01% fraud rating claimed by the eBay rep is probably about right. I've only had one or two people who seemed out and out determined to screw me. That tiny number doesn't take into account the much higher clueless/careless seller factor, however.
More than 1 transaction in 10 has had a problem for me. The most common problem is bad packaging. I've received computers in boxes with no padding whatsoever. I've gotten CDs in half-opened cases with a scratch raked across the surface. I've even received cards in nothing but bubble wrap and a flexible mailer.
eBay, PayPal and the likes are absolutely worthless about helping in cases where something arrives, but doesn't work. Sellers who promise to ship with insurance usually don't, or aren't helpful about your filing a claim. They have their money, and so they want to be done with you.
You just have to figure out what the failure rate is, and be sure you're bidding low enough to compensate. Me, I won't bid more than 90% of what I think something is worth, and I won't bid on something I absolutely need soon.
The feedback system also isn't nearly as valuable as it seems. People are afraid to give bad feedback unless the other person has already left their feedback, otherwise, they're guaranteed to get negative feedback in turn. It's actually in a person's personal best interest to leave no feedback at all when a transaction has gone bad, and I suspect the scammers know this, and don't leave the initial feedback accordingly.
"I don't think there is anything else on this Earth that would turn a normally law abiding citizen into a criminal any faster then a desire for money. "
Revenge.
-Adam
...I kinda like this guy.
:)
Not because he's a thief. That's despicable.
But to know that a person has it in him to act one, predictable way for years and fool even those closest to him, then instantly change into a completely different persona restores some of my faith in human nature.
He's not a robot. He's not a brick in the wall. He's a free thinker, even though this particular manifestation was lowly.
We read stories about Blackbeard, Jack the Ripper and The Great Train Robber. They make for some of the best stories. But we rarely consider what type of people these characters are.
Stewart Richardson was one of those guys, merely under different circumstances.
Best of luck to those that were taken at recovering your booty. And luck to Mr. Richardson, wherever he may be running, because the only stories as interesting as criminals pulling off the big one, are criminals getting nabbed by The Good Guys.
Admit it. Elliot Ness in The Untouchables was a bad ass
Knunov
Why do users with IDs under 100,000 or over 700,000 usually have the most worthwhile comments?
Sorry but you get positive feedback very very easily. you just email the customers saying if you give me positive feedback I'll give you some.. well there it goes, you are guarenteed 1 feedback point on EVERY sale.
Sorry but praise is for when they went above and beyond... did an excellent job and made you orgasmatically happy. otherwist it's nutral.
this is why I put ZERO value on ebay ratings except for negative feedback. someone with 90,000 positive and 20 negative is a shady character to me compared to the guy with 20 good and no negative.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
(it also recursivly checks any patterns of individuals found by examining their feedback ratings for patterns)
this is what i found on his last 4 auctions: all of these bids were placed on the last day of the auction
edster007 (19) $20.00 Nov-30-01 07:46:45 PST
tennisdoc (416) $21.06 Nov-30-01 12:55:09 PST
edster007 (19) $30.00 Nov-30-01 07:46:07 PST
tennisdoc (416) $32.99 Nov-30-01 12:53:48 PST
edster007 (19) $30.00 Nov-30-01 14:00:09 PST
tennisdoc (416) $31.99 Nov-30-01 12:52:38 PST
edster007 (19) $25.00 Nov-30-01 07:44:09 PST
tennisdoc (416) $31.52 Nov-30-01 12:56:20 PST
while this doesn't mean this guy (whos account im not posting
before people shout 'thats not what the article is talking about' let me point out .. that if this guy (who had over a 90 rating on ebay) WAS doing this .. he has been doing it for at least 6 months. its relativly cheap to win your own e-bay auction .. like 1% or so .. and build up false creadibilty.
--Ne auderis delere orbem rigidum meum, non erravi pernicose!
> Why would I buy something from somebody I don't know, and can't get *real* info on.
Because you can't get it anywhere else, that's why. Ebay has a TON of stuff you can't find anywhere for great prices. It all depends on how averse to risk you are. Some people play the lottery, some people use Ebay. Personally, I've had much better luck with Ebay than the lottery.
From my understanding of banking rules, the only reason the original poster was able to get the cheque reversed was that the scammer had crossed out 'for deposit only'.
Had he simply deposited it to his bank account, it would have been possible to track the b*st*rd down and harass him like the other victims did, but the bank would have probably been unable/unwilling to reverse the charges.
Consider it a combination of forsight and luck.
I can definitely see the value of putting 'for deposit only' on the back of any cheque going for an ebay purchase. Anybody who refuses that should be immediately considered suspect.
Sometimes boldness is in fashion. Sometimes only the brave will be bold.
It's easy to get scammed on ebay. This happened to a friend of mine.
A seller put a brand new digital camcorder on ebay. After winning the auction the seller said he wanted cash (cashiers check) but would take a credit card number for deposit and ship the camcoder for him to look at.
The seller orders a camcorder using my friends credit card from a online shop and has it shipped to him. The shipping information and the credit card billing information match so the online shop had no problem shipping it.
He got the the camcorder and was happy so he sent the cashiers check.
Imagine his surprize when he got his credit card statement. He could have returned the camcorder (it came from a legit business and it was what he wanted so he kept it.)
He lost the money he sent (~$800.00).
Be Careful
AdFuel
So this will only get worse when an ebay merchant dies and the heirs realize that his 9000 positive feedback is worth a quick 20grand on the black market. What's to stop that? Or a merchant themselves realize they can get a little extra retirement juice by selling their account to the mob.
I've hit Karma 50 and gotten a Score:5, Troll... I win!
You've had good experiences with Discover when dealing with fraud charges and other problems? Hmm.
Discover is my primary credit card. But I didn't really think of them as a company that had really strong fraud protections. I've put some decidedly odd things on my Discover card over the years, way outside my "normal buying patterns" both in type and cost of stuff, and never had Discover show any wish for ID verification or anything like that.
Now, I've never had any fraud problems with my Discover card, so I haven't had to deal with their customer service people on that subject, but the lack of hassle in putting odd things on the card has made me think they wouldn't be as useful as other cards might be in case of fraud or other problems.
Of course, on the flip side, I had a problem with that on a VISA card, recurring fraudulent charges over several months, and that took *way* too much effort to resolve. (Is it so complicated to "cancel this account number, issue a new card on a new account number and DON'T ACCEPT NEW CHARGES ON THE OLD NUMBER" ??? They linked the old acct # to the new acct, and passed new fraudulent charges right along to the new account.)
This is my sig. There are many like it but this one is... Oops. Frank, I've got your sig again! Where's mine?
Scenario 1: Even if he's dead, he had employees who should've been able to continue the business without him. He kept them out of the loop on these auctions, so they can't.
Scenario 2: His wife is his next of kin, and she doesn't know where he is (or so she claims).
Scenario 3: Again, his wife should know where he is, and if he just had to "step out" for a bit, his employees would be able to fulfill the orders if they were real.
If he had just disappeared, it would be one thing. But he apparently set this up with a lot of planning, so this isn't just an accident.
God invented whiskey so the Irish would not rule the world.
You can get to the max bid by bidding up the minimum increment over and over.
Let's say somebody's max is $50 and the current is $20. The increment is $1. If you bid $21 it will say you have been outbid and the current bid is $22. When you get to $50 it will still tell you that you have been outbid because bids are first come, first serve but it will then say that the current bid is $50 and not $51. You know right them what the other person's maximum is.
Actually, I hesitate to call these scams - but more on the level of "selling an article to a person that could be had cheaper somewhere else". Let me show you a perfect example:
Look up electric bicycle motor on Ebay. Now, I am going to pick an auction that doesn't "die" until the 28th so that others can see what I mean - I am picking the last one on that list - click here.
Now, look at that picture of the "dual motor" at the bottom - seems pretty cool, huh? Pretty professional, get a little kit and convert your bike to electric. Cost doesn't seem too bad (if you have priced EV bikes before) - heck, "Buy It Now" is only $1.00 over starting bid - so this motor combo, a cheap bike from WalMart or a garage sale, and a cheap gel-cel battery - and I can have my own electric bike for under $200.00!
The motor only cost $93.00...
Now - go here, and on the left hand side select Battlebot Parts - or click here to see them. Now, go down to the fourth item on that page - look familiar?
MECI sells the exact same thing for $40.00! Just above it is the battery you need (actually, you will need two of them for enough amps to go far enough - and really, this isn't the best motor system to use, but might be fun to play around with).
So, here is an example of an eBay seller using their own ignorance against them.
Unfortunately, this seems to be the "way" of our capitalistic society - middlemen, etc everywhere always scamming for a buck. You see this on Ebay a lot - cheesy CDs of "info found no where else" (yeah right, just everywhere on the internet) - these I would take more seriously if they were selling the CDs as "fruits of labor for scouring the Net" - at least then it could be seen as an internet information gathering service thing. You also see it in the multitude of "plans" showing how to build a 100" projection TV with a special lens (but, you do get the lens - nevermind the fact that plans are everywhere to do this, it uses nothing new, and the lens can be had cheaper at the local Walmart).
These guys aren't typically shut down because they do offer a real product, and actually sell it - and people love it!
Another "scam" - I have seen sellers of SDRAM bidding for memory on other auctions - sometimes within hours of their own auctions - for the same type of RAM - they buy the RAM cheap from another auction, then resell it the same day for a profit to other bidders (and typically, for much more money than they could find it for on Pricewatch).
Many times I have wondered if I could pull these same kind of "deals" off - and each time I stop thinking about it, because it just isn't in my "moral fabric" to rip people off - I would rather tell them where to get it cheaper.
I guess that is one reason why I will never own a business - I am too honest for my own "good"...
bleh.
Reason is the Path to God - Anon
I've been an eBay seller for 3 years. I started off selling stupid things like Apple IIe manuals. I've gotten pretty good at it too an in my 3 years I've probably sold about 1000+ items. Not bad for an 18 year old (yea technically I should only have had an account for like 2 months now). Well anyways in those 3 years I've learned 3 things: Ebay buyers are stupid Ebay buyers are stupid Ebay buyers are stupid Why? I have a form for people to fill out and return if they use a money order. 1 out of 10 of my money order based transcations come without that form and I'd say probably 1 in 20 of those come without an address on the money order or the envelope. Now lets think about this. No mention of what item you bid on, what your ebay ID is or what your address is. How do these people think I figure out what they're paying for. Worse than getting ripped off buy a seller is ripping yourself off on ebay. I try to figure them out, but most of the $$$ I just keep since I dont have a clue what it goes to. -Tim
Tim Smith - Ramblings from Nerd Land
Check it out.
eBay View User Feedback for rfenetquest
You should use Winning Bid Pro [umklaydet.com] to do the last minute bidding for you. I use it all the time. Just set up the bid you are willing to make and have it send it in 10 seconds before the auction ends. That way you don't drive the price up ahead of time. Sometimes someone has a max bid higher than yours, or is using a bidding program the same as you and you get beat.
Thanks for the tip! Nine seconds it is!
"And like that
A few months back, I was watching auctions for Dreamcast broadband adaptors. One auction caught my eye because the seller was in the same city as I was. I thought it was great, because I could potentially save shipping.
Then I watched the people who bid on it. Some guy bid the BBA up to 400$ USD. There are many actions where the BBA is 120$ or so... and the original winner who had it for 120$ dutifully followed that account in up-bidding it. The end result? A very suspicious transaction which I reported.
eBay downplayed it.
--
Internet Explorer (n): Another bug -- that is, a feature that can't be turned off -- in Windows.
If you think this is happening, how about withdrawing your bid near the end so that the shill EBay account ends up having to buy the item?