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Another Class Action Over Crippled Music Disks
pulaski writes "Here's a link to an interesting Baltimore Sun story. It's about the case of two Californians trying to take some major record companies to task for selling copy protected CDs. It's got the classic Cary Sherman whine but the plaintiffs apparently have some legal muscle." A similar suit was settled with the defendants agreeing to make changes in their practices.
hubba hubba!
and I think she codes freebsd kernel stuff too!! =)
"...If you use an Apple computer, you can't even get the disc out of the tray. It requires the time and cost of taking the computer into a repair shop and having it removed that way..."
Or you could just hold the mouse button down whilst rebooting...
Apple really needs to provide an obvious external means of ejecting CDs.
(tig)
Ignorance and prejudice and fear
Walk hand in hand
Somebody said one of the bigger players had decided to abandon the crippeling game. Who might that be? What will other companies do?
(I have to admit I bought a crippeled disc the other day. Now I'll have to find the receipt somwhere...)
Thugs sue house owners over use of locks.
"Making breaking in impossible."
"Restriction of constitutional rights of liberty of action."
"High costs and substantial effort needed in breaking open doors."
Owner of a Mensa membership card.
From the article (the "Cary Sherman whine" referred to in the posting):
... Cary, mi amigo: The copy protections on video tapes and computer games don't cause your VCR or computer to become unusable. If they did, those industries would have exactly the same problem you're currently having. Putting a warning label saying "Be careful, this apparently innocent disc may eat your computer" isn't sufficient: it would be better to, oh, I don't know, maybe use a method that works without breaking things?
"Music creators have the right to protect their property from theft, just like owners of any other property," Sherman said. "Motion picture studios, and software and video game publishers have protected their works for years, and no one has even thought to claim that doing so was inappropriate, let alone unlawful." [said Cary Sherman, president of the Recording Industry Assn. of America]
Umm
It's a small point but I'd like to see people start using a phrase like copy crippled instead of copy protected as protected has a positive connotation.
The RIAA President quoted in the article implies that what they're doing to copy protect disks is some kind of encryption. My understanding is that this is not the case. They're basically messing with the directory structure of the disk in such a way that computers will misunderstand what's going on and will, at minimum, be unable to play or read the music. Isn't he being somewhat misleading by calling this encryption when in fact its an issue of deliberately failing to follow the CD standard? Is this distinction going to play a significant role in the class action?
do you know where i can find some naked pictures of her? because she looks like a hot babe, i must say. thanks.
"...If you use an Apple computer, you can't even get the disc out of the tray. It requires the time and cost of taking the computer into a repair shop and having it removed..." Sounds more like a problem with the Macintosh than with the disk... ....Silly Macintosh, playing CDs is for real computers.
I hope they're successful. It could be the deciding case on whether or not our fair use rights will be upheld.
Would it really be that hard to put a label on the disk saying that its copy protected? If they can do it with the explicit lyrics label, they can do it with this. Although, I can see it now where the artists will start suing because they can't get their cover art on the discs because there will be so many labels on the front. Back to the longbox! :-)
quod me nutrit me destruit
In the article about Sony and Universal's liquid audio releases recently, there was an interesting section which gave hope about the situation. When it came to copy protection, which whether or not people can burn CDs, someone was quoted as saying the reality of the situation is music is being pirated now, so not allowing songs to be made doesn't really add any value. Obviosly, that is not an exact, quote, but it close and shows some people in these companies are starting to "get it."
The barn door is open, and has been for years now. They are bickering over how the close the barn now. Needless to say, the horses got out years ago, and already have children and grandchildren.
I may be sick in the head, but I will be very interested to watch the moves these companies make over the next couple of years.
-Pete
Soccer Goal Plans
Well there is a distinction that needs to be made. Copy Protection is OK (witness: video games). Protection from theft is OK. Crippling a product and calling it either Copy Protection or Protection from Theft is not.
There's a line between trying to stop people from copying/stealing and selling things that don't work in equipment that should be compatible.
Do Macs not provide the little bitty hole for manual release of the CD tray? Or does this not work? Just curious...
Leveling up builds character.
I for one am hoping this case either ends in a positive settlement for the lawfirms involved, akin to the way Charley Pride's label caved in over his CD when a California woman sued them for deceptive trade practices and other goodies.
I run FatChucks.com and get a ton of e-mail over the Corrupt CDs issue every week. It would be nice if this case makes my site obsolete because big, fat warnings would have to appear on the CDs themselves (rather than Joe Public having to know about my site).
Last, the warnings you see on corrupt CDs are so far *not adequate.* They need to warn the potential buyer of the following:
1. Will not play on your computer.
2. Will not play on your DVD player, Discman, CD-Duplicator (like the kind put out by Sony, Harmon-Kardon, Pioneer, etc), high-end stereo CD player, car CD player, game console (PS, PS2, XBox, etc) or MP3-CD player.
3. Using this CD in any of the devices above may damage that equipment.
To see this in action, check out this image for the Rosa CD in Europe:
The Image
In Spanish, it translates to this:
"This disc is equipped with a device to prevent digital copying, which could impede the playback of the recording in personal computers and/or harm such devices, in videogame consoles, in automobile CD and DVD players and multi-changers, as well as other CD-ROM and DVD-ROM players."
The record labels probably have a legal right to corrupt their CDs, but they need to *fully* warn consumers about what they are buying.
Peace,
Chuck
here's one
Dave,
You're right. It isn't encryption *at all*, it is simply messing around with the Audio CD standard so that computer-based CD players get confused or reject the corrupt CD. In short, they look like CDs, but they really aren't. They're just shiny music platters that we mistakenly assume are CDs based on our previous experiences with these things.
Peace,
Chuck
Better yet, the manufacturers should be permanently enjoined from using the term "Compact Disc", the familiar logo form of those words, or the abbreviation "CD" anywhere on the disc or packaging, because they deliberately violate the standards specified by the owner of those Distinctive Marks ... Phillips, the only big company in a position to use IP law to protect dilution of its work to fight this crap. I don't believe they have tried to do that just yet, but the company has at least made public statements that sound promising.
[100% ISO 646 Compliant]
SVM, ERGO MONSTRO.
Clearly we use the term CD because it looks like a CD, it feels like a CD, and all our previous experiences indicate that this is, yes, a CD.
Call it a shiny music platter, a music coaster, a corrupt round of sound, an audio ache, a Hilary's Horror, what? Ideas are welcomed...
:-),
Chuck
Now you play mp3's on your Sony walkman :
"Playback MP3 music files recorded onto CD-R and CD-RW CDs, and create your own music compilations from a CD recorder deck or PC with our CD Walkman® Compact Disc/MP3 Players."
Bzzt. Celine Dion?
And if played on proper equipment such a device would sound better than a CD.
And the big offenders will be the pirates who don't care that DMCA or whatever has made the reverse engineering illegal. It's not like they are paying attention to the law anyway.
Might as well save everyone a lot of time and effort and just piss right into a fan.
Doubtful. Doesn't Phillips own the patents and/or copyrights on CD formats and licensing? I'd say if you deliberately corrupted the format away from the standard, you couldn't call it a CD, and you might not even be allowed to sell it because of the potential harm and confusion that could cause legitimate CDs.
Afterall theyre the ones that made the faulty computers that cant eject unreadable cds.
no, i'm serious. i've been looking for such pictures for quite some time now — the "geek girl" kind of nude and erotic pictures — but still with no results. please point me to some sources if you know any. it's actually very important, a friend of mine once told me that there are no sexy girls among geek girls, and i want to prove him wrong. thanks.
Most DVD players can also play mp3 CDs, VCDs, And Windows Media CDs. So the DVD player would try to search those extra sessions. And many high-end CD players can read second sessions and possibly mp3 CDs too.
This case is simple and I'm glad a huge law firm finally saw the opening to cause the RIAA and assc. companies some major pain.
Deal with facts people, this case is not going to deal with Fair-Use Rights. This case will likely be based on the simply premise that the recording companies are mislabeling the things they sell and furthurmore being secretive about it from the public.
Copy-Crippled PCC's (Polycarbonate Coated Circles.. note I didn't call them CD's) are not CD's, they will not work in a large array of CD capable player devices, and might actually harm some of those devices. This case will likely set out to prove that the Recording Industry did not make a good faith effort to explain the limitations and possible dangers of their product, which misleadingly looks like all of their older, but different products. The RIAA will likely loose this lawsuit. All that remains to be seen is how much the law firm makes them pay.
Somedays I wish this country wasn't so litigious in nature, but others I figure out that its the only thing holding back huge mega-corporations from totally screwing us.
Also, let's please be careful to never, ever refer to a crippled disk as a "CD", because (by the Red Book standard) it isn't.
To me, CD stands for one of two things. For Red Book conforming discs, it stands for "Compact Disc". For discs that deviate far enough from the Red Book standard that they become unplayable, CD stands for Completely Disabled. (Such discs are even more disabled than this little fellow.)
Will I retire or break 10K?
It's the only sensical explanation of this entire problem I've seen so far.
Thanks, man. I've seen plenty of cd-roms on PC's and elsewhere that don't have eject holes. The fact that some iMacs don't have them explains a lot in terms of this problem.
(And the entire boot thing.)
Can you see why people would take their machine to be serviced? It sounds like the only way to get the disc out would be to remove and open the drive, or forcibly yank the tray out (Bad idea, eh?)
Lose all hope.
What time is it/will be over there? Check with my iPhone app!
Doesn't Phillips own the patents
Philips's CD patents have probably expired by now. A patent lasts only 20 years after filing (it used to be 17 years after grant, which was the same in most situations, but that had loopholes). A trademark on "COMPACT DISC", on the other hand, can last forever.
Will I retire or break 10K?
These xxAA punks are going to screw up the computer and home electronics industry. The whole idea of buying a stereo/music/computer for my personal enjoyment makes me shiver, because it might not be usable for a long time, and it might not play nice with other stuff. It's this big maze of incompatabilities that will scare people away from buying consumer electronics. Once those shiny discs stop working in one device, only working part of the time, the average consumer is going to be pissed. All they'll say is that these "things used to work fine, now I've got to get a new key or something." Suddenly my out-of-date electronics are looking really cool!
Shit, the RIAA bought and renamed the country already??
Sorry to nit-pick, but why did you say this lawsuite died? It was just filed and hasn't even got srarted. We all (or most of us) hope it does not die and costs records companies zillions of dollars for stupidity.
it says right on the cd's jacket that "This disc is not intended for use in computer CD-ROM drives" If they put them in thier cd-rom drive it is thier own fault they fucked up thier ability to eject.
It may have been mentioned already, but in the OSX instances, at least, is it not possible for Apple to update firmware to verify if a disk is a DATA or AUDIO CD? Perhaps there could be a preference panel that lets the user specify how an inserted disk is treated.
As far as I understand, the basic problem is that the data stripe that is dropped at the end of the audio disk confuses the machine and won't give access to the audio tracks. Would it be illegal for Apple to simply allow a preference panel to either (a) look for data information or (b) look for audio cd information? Since the protection scheme is not encryption, how could a solution like this violate the reverse engineering law? What is there to reverse engineer?
i can see your point — if the sexiest geek alive contest is not the best place to look for sexy geek girls, then i really don't know what is. yes, it's cute that this look of 2001 sexiest geek was inspired by this sandra bullock's look, but was it the most sexy clothing on the contest? i mean, it's a contest for the sexiest geek, right? so it's supposed to show some sexy bikini or lingerie, right? do i not get something here? that's not that i don't like her, the photo from the article could be better (in fact, i was wondering if it's not one of those onion kind of articles when i saw it — you know, like the linux developer gets laid), but i guess she looks kinda cool here and here (a little makeup and she could be quite sexy i guess) — however i'm looking for pictures in somehow more erotic clothes and poses. do you know any place where i could find some?
Sorry to nitpick, but your use of "Music DisK" in the title is incorrect, as it is a music disC.
Disk is short for diskette and is also used in "hard disK."
Disc is used like "discus" and is what's used when referring to CDs, or "compact disCs."
1) Fair use means just that--you have the right to reproduce copyrighted works in a "fair" manner as prescribed by law. That doesn't mean that the publishers have to facilitate such reproduction--just that if you are able to reproduce the work, you have the right to do so for certain "fair" uses as prescribed law.
2) Even if these CDs do damage or destroy hardware--so what? It's your own fault for using them in there. No one forced you to buy them, and no one forced you to put them in your computer's CD-ROM drive. But then again, what do you expect from California, the state that has effectively done away with the concept of "individual responsibility".
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
But to continue my curmudgeonly morning...
Linux sucks!
You are entitled to your opinion, however unfounded, foolish, inflammatory, or indefensible it may be.
They say its uncrashable! THEY ARE LYING!
Who is this infamouus they?
Nothing is uncrashable. Perhaps this is merely a small hyperbole about the comparison to certain OS that crash so often that crashing is considered normal and acceptable.
They say its unhackable! THEY ARE LYING.
Again. Who's they?
Linux isn't unhackable, just much harder to hack when properly configured than any of the Micro$oft OSes, which are riddled with security problems.
Security patches are also available within a few hours or days for linux, instead of having to wait weeks or months for Windows...
(If you really want an 'unhackable' system, use any pre-OS X Macintosh OS. They don't natively support the IP port structure, so they simply don't have the associated vulnerabilities. OS X (based-on FreeBSD) is now succeptible to similar attacks as BSD itself, however.)
They say its FREE. They are lying. The Mandrake linux prostitute will set you back $179.99 the same as windows does!
Again, they? In this case, they are completely correct.
If you want to buy Mandrake off the shelf (which includes manuals, media, and actual human tech support) you can choose to spend money on it. Tech support for Windows, incidently, starts at $35 per incident for XP if you want to talk to a generic drone, or $245 if you want to talk to an actual professional who might be able to help you resolve something more complicated than adding paper for your printer...
BUT, alternatively, you can download the .iso images of the CDs for Mandrake or virtually any other flavour of Linux from the internet for free.
Get over yourself. It is free...
WELL NOW YOU can fuck it up with these techniques! Just type these commands into your terminal emulator. Commands with a * need root access.
Yes. It will allow you to shoot yourself in the foot. But you have to actively attempt to. Let's take a look at what your examples really do...
To crash it /dev/mem
yes >
This attempts to pipe 'yes' directly into core memory dump file.
If you're a normal user, nothing happens except that you generate a 'permission denied' error. If you are root, not surprisingly, this initiates a kernel panic because you've used /dev/mem incorrectly. If you deliberately write garbage to core memory on ANY system it will croak. Linux, like unix, presumes if you're root that you really WANT to shoot yourself.
To rape it* /
chmod -R 000
Chmod changes security permissions for files. 000 removes all access, which brings things pretty much to a halt. Again, you have to be root before you can chmod things you don't own. And again, if you really want to shoot yourself, if you're root you can. This is a feature, not a bug. Children shouldn't play with root, any more than they should with matches...
To delete* /
yes|rm -R
This pipes 'yes' as a reponse to the query confirming that you really want to erase files. Not a very elegant way to delete [remove eg. rm] everything, but is effective. Again, you have to have root privileges, and you have to be a moron.
A somewhat more elegant way to do it would be to use:
Ironically, this is actually yet another diplay of superior efficiency for linux. Why? Because it is more efficient than Micro$oft's: because rm will completely erase files on all connected mountpoints, whereas 'del' can only erase one logical disk at a time.To hack it
su -c command
su is the superuser command. The -c switch passes a single command using different security credentials than those of the current user. (The default user for su is root, but it can be used for any account.) Since you must have the password of the user you want to issue the command as, this isn't really a hack at all. Again, it's a feature. In actuality, having the su command allows the system to be better secured because normal users are given only limited access so they can't easily cause problems.
Even MicroSoft has acknowledged it's a superior model and has now implemented a limited form of su on NT4 (as a supplemental utility), on Win2K, and on XP.
To use your system PROPERLY insert windows XP setup disk and reboot your system.
Let's look at what that accomplishes. But first, learn to punctuate.
Without a comma after 'PROPERLY', I could ask how you think you properly insert a disk...
If you want your computer to have training wheels, by all means, spend a lot of money on XP. It just makes it all that much more useful to the script kiddies who want to take advantage of all of the available exploits.
Nope; that's not a sufficient disclaimer. A reasonable person would interpret that to mean "if you put this disc in a computer CD-ROM drive, it won't play the music", not "if you put this disc in a computer CD-ROM drive, it will break your computer".
Next time you're in the store, look at the warning labels on any poisonous substance. They go well beyond "hey, don't drink this stuff". If anything, the warnings on these faux-CD discs need to be even stronger than those labels, because they address a danger that is completely unknown to the average consumer (as opposed to the danger of drinking something that everybody already knows is poison).
/. If the government wants us to respect the law, it should set a better example.
2)On at least my toshiba laptop with PCMCIA slot loaded CD tray aren't playable in windows by any practical method.
Ifthis keaps up Apple has been heavly rumoured to take the RIAA to court over phiscal damages, infringements on NDA information to get the firmware to play the embeded CD in sound mode
Not being a lawyer I personally don't see any ethical ground they have to stand on, something to be noted though is that Sony Corps is threatening to send down a writ of mandata to sony music over the horrible PR this has caused wich in essence would most likely read to stop or they'll revoke some independance
Frivalas or not the perpetual suit counter suits are just not good for Public Relations on anyones part
Who honestly in our society wants to go down in the anals of history as being a legal ass and winy
I thought as much very few people
It seems to me that the ultimate way to stop this is for the big three to form a coalition requesting or mandating a cease fire on the RIAA's part
Print new music on the new cd thick DVD's that are in readbook format on one layer of low enough quality that playing them legaly on a DVD players makes it more interesting to own than to steal making it win win. Music pirates gain the ability to have all the shity sounding music the desire the RIAA has a sense of controll and don't have to "go their" with the computer conglomerates. They'd have: No support as firmware level hacks are almost always stoped in courts (thus far as an outside sentlement)woudn't be in the bad position to potentially be purchased by MS Corporations and turned into MSNB's hoe
Btw anyone that works in the Arts and Research division of Sony Music Enterprises care to comment on the validity of Sony Corporporations threat to tell them to stop the bad PR?
"I'm a proud owner of a Mensa membership card. "
I've found people who join Mensa to be retarded.
Isn't that really, like ironic?
I mean think about it... a bunch of people get together to tell each other how smart they are. That's retarded inherently.
Sort of like that Marilyn Vos Savant in Parade magazine. If she didn't have female genetalia, she'd be picking beans somewhere in argentina.
Back to my point. Dude, you're stupid for joining mensa, and retarded for bragging about it. Get with it.
I'll bet you smell simultaneously of root beer and cheese.
I prefer ??.
it's not the disc breaking the computer. it is the poor handling of corrupted data files in the mac that is breaking the computer.
"Music creators have the right to protect their property from theft, just like owners of any other property,"
Yeah, and I have the right to put up a fence around my house to protect myself. But if I decide to cement broken glass along the top, and someone tries to get in and inevitably cuts themselves, they can sue me.
Taking into account what the result of other class-action lawsuits will be, I'm afraid that if this one is successful, the result will be that I'll get a coupon for a free Magic Marker (to modify my affected "music discs," of course).
Get off my launchpad!
A) The case gets dismissed after a bunch of FUD from the record companies
B) They settle out of court for what is a large sum of money for these two people but a very small sum for the RIAA.
the sad truth is, it's just like the tobacco companies: they're just too big and no _real_ change will happen until some major players (i.e. states) become involved.
here. There's a form for your email address that will let you join the suit (but only if you are an injured party). Though, everydaybucks.com seems a little crass and overconfident.
search for "Mae Ling Mak"
This just occured to me. I do not see the word "CD-ROM" on the faceplate of my DVD drive. Since the label only says "no CD-ROM's", isn't it implied that it will work fine on my drive? Wouldn't the same go for my CD-RW?
Dyolf Knip
Isn't it really a corruption of the blue book standard? And that technically the CD's conform to the blue book standard just because no one ever thought of the case where someone would seek to purposefully cripple a computer?
--Jimmy has fancy plans; and pants to match.
If this lawsuit gets anywhere the RIAA will settle out of court and continue to Copy-protect discs so that i won't be able to take my CDs copy them to mp3, burn them off and play them in my $600 Alpine mp3 player. sux
Copy-Crippled PCC's (Polycarbonate Coated Circles.. note I didn't call them CD's)
I agree that we need new terminology, but this will never catch on. We need something a bit easier. How about "pseudo-CDs"? And "copy-prevention" instead of "copy-protection".
Next time you're in the store, look at the warning labels on any poisonous substance. They go well beyond "hey, don't drink this stuff". If anything, the warnings on these faux-CD discs need to be even stronger than those labels, because they address a danger that is completely unknown to the average consumer (as opposed to the danger of drinking something that everybody already knows is poison).
Typically such warnings are "warnings for dummies", including warnings against things no one in their right mind would do. These psudo-CDs need to carry warnings with the same kind of pitch, including a large "no computer" logo on both the packaging and the disc itself.
Hey, man, I thought that it's some kind of joke, but there are 1000s of photos! THANKS! Where did you get this script from? Do you have more of them? TIA!!!
Since when did stupidity/ignorance get in the way of a good lawsuit? ;-)
it's not the disc breaking the computer. it is the poor handling of corrupted data files in the mac that is breaking the computer.
And it's the recording industry that created the corrupted data that triggers the poor handling of corrupted data files in the Mac that is breaking the computer. Even if the labels could convince the court that they hadn't known about this problem when they came up with their scheme, they'd get hit with gross negligence for failing to recall the products once the problem became known.
Here's one:
#!/bin/sh
wget -m http://www.mchenrybbs.com/al4a/
(sorry that without this whole gzip and uuencode BS...)
—.
very nice geek girl:
#!/bin/bash
for i in `seq 1 18`; do wget -c http://www.sexy-tina.com/adultdream/s$i.jpg; done
Remeber all the open file formats that don't work anymore becouse Microsoft created forked versions?
Same diffrence..
I don't actually exist.
Red Book. And no, they don't conform to the standard.